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Tuesday: Can We have Hillary back now???

Hi, guys, I have to make this short today so I can schlepp Brook to camp in Princeton.  But I did want to address something that came up a couple of times in last night’s thread about whether Hillary was still mad at us because we went PUMA.

I don’t know how she feels about that and I won’t begin to speculate.  All I know is that when the DNC and the RBC took the actions they did, they didn’t act against just one person.  They acted against 18,200,000+ of us. That is why many of us haven’t been able to get behind Obama and why the PUMA movement is ultimately not about Hillary.  Yes, she was our candidate but in this case, she is a symbol.  The DNC coup was intended to level OUR power.

Now, we all have theories as to why this is and by what means this was accomplished.  But one thing is certain: we shouldn’t feel the least bit guilty for sticking up for ourselves.  We’re not pushovers and we’re not stepping to the back of the bus so the young, deluded, affluent liberal or moderate Republicans can take over.  The Democratic party isn’t going to become the Country Club party if we have anything to say about it.  And if that means Obama loses in November don’t blame us.  We’re only asserting our right to have representation in the political sphere.  The split in the party wasn’t engineered by us and it sure as hell isn’t Hillary’s fault.

It’s time the Dean Democrats started to take responsibility for the fatigue, irritation and righteous indignation of the rest of us.  We are losing patience with them.

In the meantime, tune in tomorrow to NO WE WON’T on blogtalkradio for a different kind of show.  We’re going to shake things up a bit and take everyone back to the golden days of yesteryear with one of Madamab’s one act plays.  Oh, heck, we might even do two. Gary and Mawm will be guests to tell us about their experiences on the road.  And Darragh Murphy will be on to talk about the bus caravans to Denver.  You won’t want to miss it.  Check it out at 8:00pm EST Wednesday.

On Thursday, we’ll be having a multi-blog edition of the Scratching Post Cocktail party with JustSayNoDeal and PUMApac.  The cover charge is $10.00 for a Causmo to go towards retiring Hillary’s debt.  The festivities start at 7:00pm EST.  Be there!

151 Responses

  1. Riverdaughter,

    I hope Brook has a great day at camp. And I can’t wait to hear the live production of Madamab’s work!

    You’re right that it’s not really about Hillary. I am just curious about what she is really thinking about this whole fiasco. Maybe she’ll write a book about it someday and we’ll find out.

  2. BB: I just wanted to assuage some of the guilt that some Conflucians feel because they didn’t do what she asked. There are definitely some mixed emotions but I think you and I both know that no one should feel badly about not tolerating an abusive relationship. None of us should feel guilty about THAT. Ultimately, I think Hillary understands that even if it results in her party losing in the fall.

  3. RD,

    I’ve been catching up on some of my blog reading over the past few days. It’s shocking how much hatred is still out there against us for just standing up for our rights to be treated like human beings and make our own choices–whether it’s about our votes or our bodies. I’m still in shock over this post by Frenchdoc:


    and I’m amazed to be reading so many reports of actual violence against people who won’t be coerced into supporting Obama. Our party has truly been taken over by hostile forces.

  4. Hey, I will gladly have my head shaved. Ain’t nothing going to stop me from asserting my rights.

  5. Me neither. I won’t back down in the face of threats. I’m too old to care what happens to me. What I care about is standing up for what’s right and making this country a safe place for my neices and nephews to live in. I truly believe that Obama’s authoritarian, my way or the highway operation is dangerous–worse in many ways than Bush/Cheney. He will enjoy the powers they have won for the executive. We can’t let him win. I’d like to block his nomination, but keeping him from being president is paramount.

  6. With all due respect and love to HRC, I’m a Proud Puma because I am no longer a disrespected Democrat.

    It was this primary that woke me up and I am thankful that I could do so honestly because I found a really terrific candidate…but I would be a Puma today if a rock as smart and experienced and as qualified as HRC had been running against the most empty of empty suits I have ever seen as a “candidate”.

    PUMA POWER is not about HRC. It’s about ME!

  7. I think Hillary understands us PUMAs. She herself kept fighting, even though the party asked her to step down.

    I really think this is what she would want us to do since she herself has fought her whole life against injustices and that’s what we are fighting for.

  8. “RD”
    Good luck today with your daughter. She sounds like my daughter & sadly we could’nt find that “place”
    where she “fit”.
    She is a “gifted” writer & can read a full page novel in
    less that 1 hour with total re-call. Autistic “spectrum”
    disorder has been suggested; but no-one wants to
    “put their name on it”. She “seems regular” at 1st;
    until you see how her life “doesn’t work”. We thought we “found it “; but it did’nt work out. Now she just completed HS & does not have the confidence to take
    advantage of a great opportunity of a scholarship to a well respected state University for their journalism program.
    I will NEVER GIVE UP; but every year it gets harder &
    harder for her!

  9. What blog does Will Bower hang out on.

  10. remember that spy for Iran that started the war with Iraq? Chalabi? helping Obama in Iraq behind the curtains now

  11. Ouch! I just went over to TaylorMarsh and there’s a bunch of pieces attacking PUMAs, especially Will.

    I guess when you become an Obama supporter the only way you know how to deal with people is to attack.

  12. Don’t give Taylor the traffic. She’s a hack.

  13. Hillary is on our side. At anytime she could come out and say directly to us, “Hey guys, PUMAs, I get what you are doing, but knock it off already”. She hasn’t done that.
    It is not like she doesn’t know we exist. Ed Rendell released the HOUNDS on us, they used to link to us on HillaryHub, and now we know the NYTs reads us too.

    The eyes are on us and Hillary has not said a peep.

  14. masslib, you are right. Don’t give TM the time of day. She is just mad, because she realizes she sold out.

  15. I agree with Mawm. I’m sure Hillary knows what’s going on with the Denver Group, Just Say No Deal, etc. She doesn’t live in a vacuum. That she hasn’t told us to back down or pipe down is, to me, significant.

  16. I definitely feel Hillary is on our side. She just can’t say anything. She needs to play nice with the party.

  17. Mawm,

    That’s my take too. We know Hillary (or at least Peter Daou) knows about The Confluence, because several of our posts were linked on Hillary’s website, we were included in conference calls, and generally kept in the loop. Not once did Hillary, Peter, or anyone else in the campaign suggest that we do anything but keep on with what are are doing.

    I wish Hillary had plans to fight it out at the Convention. I do believe that she is ready to step in if Obama flames out. Otherwise she would have released her delegates.

  18. I’ll bet anything that Bill is on our side.

  19. I just don’t think Hillary is angry at PUMAS. I don’t understand why she would be angry.

    There cannot be true democracy unless women’s voices are heard. There cannot be true democracy unless women are given the opportunity to take responsibility for their own lives. There cannot be true democracy unless all citizens are able to participate fully in the lives of their country. [July 11, 1997]

    The challenges of change are always hard. It is important that we begin to unpack those challenges that confront this nation and realize that we each have a role that requires us to change and become more responsible for shaping our own future.

    I think this is what is happening at the moment with the PUMA movement. Team Clinton: Everyone has a role(anyone get one of those shirts;)

    I’m sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and disagree with this administration, somehow you’re not patriotic. We need to stand up and say we’re Americans, and we have the right to debate and disagree with any administration.

    I know this was referring to the Bush Administration but I think it can be said about the Democratic Party at the moment as anyone who dares to disagree with BO is either a racist or not a real Democrat.

    I don’t believe that people vote for President based on spouses. I don’t even think they vote much based on vice presidents or any other factor. I think they choose between the two people who are running.

    “Voting is the most precious right of every citizen, and we have a moral obligation to ensure the integrity of our voting process.”

    I will fight against the division politics of revenge and retribution. If you put me to work for you, I will work to lift people up, not put them down.

    Someone needs to read this quote to BO. JJ is still apologizing to him.

    God bless the America we are trying to create.

  20. Whoa, I love the multi-Blog scratching post… This is getting better!

  21. I agree with Mawm. We are doing what Hillary can not. Much as I love Hillary, democracy is bigger than her and the rest of us. We must remember that we are patriots– just like all the rest of the American’s that took ‘unpopular’ positions because it was the right thing to do. I know so many Democrats that really do not want to vote for o, but have bought into the false dicotomy (created by the DNC and the media) that they have no other choice. We must continue to speak the truth. Hillary would be doing the same thing, if she were in our position.

  22. I was (belatedly, I must admit) a supporter of Hillary Clinton. Bur the idea of PUMA attracts me no less for its support of Senator Clinton than its repudiation of Obama.

    You need nothing less than to witness the hypnotic “aura” of his supporters to realize that something is dreadfully wrong. That, coupled with his non-existant “resume” tells me that I’m on the right side here.

    I still have not given up on the chance for a Hillary nomination, and I still tell all the idiot Obama supporters I know (all too many, alas) that Bill Clinton was the best president of my 57 year lifetime. They have such short memories…


  23. Sorry, AM a supporter of Hillary…


  24. OK, I had to go look at TM for the first time in a couple of months. She has adtleft posting on the front page now? What a comedown from writers like Marc Rubin who used to post there! And that other anti-puma post from “Christina Cendeno.” Seriously, Christina, I have no idea who you are, but please learn to spell and write a little more coherently before you post again.

  25. Could someone post a link to the NYTimes story? Thanks in advance.

  26. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathleen-reardon/what-pelosi-doest-get-abo_b_114129.html

    Kathleen Reardon at Huffypuff lectures Pelosi, Brazile, Fowler, Germond and Taylor Marsh:

    “[P]arty unity is a matter of persuasion, not accusations of insubordination. Berating women who are still supporting for vice president a candidate who won half the Democratic presidential nominee votes and, as Barack Obama says, took us all another step further in breaking through the political glass ceiling, is not the way to persuade them or anyone to vote for Obama. It’s counterproductive.


    Pelosi should be saying, “Of course supporters of Clinton still hope she’ll be chosen. And why wouldn’t they given the race she ran?” Complimenting those who still harbor this hope and are doing what they can to make it a reality is a more astute step toward Democratic Party unity than spiteful detractions in the form of stereotypes — girls who can’t take the rough and tumble of the big leagues and let their feelings get in the way.


    If you want to persuade people, you don’t belittle them or their concerns. You don’t lecture them about what they should rather than do think. That’s part of Persuasion 101. If you want to persuade, you don’t tell people that how they feel is ridiculous. Invalidation is not an effective persuasion strategy. Linking what they care about to a preferred course of action is more productive. And most of all, you don’t tell everyone else what they’re doing wrong when your record is less than stellar.”

    “Always aim high, work hard, and care deeply about what you believe in. When you stumble, keep faith. When you’re knocked down, get right back up. And NEVER listen to anyone who says you can’t or shouldn’t go on.” — Hillary Clinton

  27. “To those who are disappointed that we couldn’t go all the way – especially the young people who put so much into this campaign – it would break my heart if, in falling short of my goal, I in any way discouraged any of you from pursuing yours. Always aim high, work hard, and care deeply about what you believe in. When you stumble, keep faith. When you’re knocked down, get right back up. And never listen to anyone who says you can’t or shouldn’t go on.”

    From Hillary’s speech – she was advising the future PUMAs, I believe. Particularly the last sentence.

  28. Ha, bmc – we’re on the same wavelength!

  29. Park Slope- I grew up on Carroll St between 7th and 8th, where are you? We moved in the 70’s when it started to become ‘cool’, you must be surrounded by obamamania.

  30. Honora,

    I now live on Windsor Place between 8th and PPW. Moved to the slope in ’94 and lived on 1st St for 9 years (then 2nd, then 13th). But, I was around from ’80 to ’84 as I had a girfriend on – wait for it – Carroll (tho’ between 8th and PPW).

    Where are you now?

    P.S. Yes, Obamamania is in full flower here in the slope – absolutely disgusting!


  31. I just sent $100 to retire Hillary’s debt. Please consider sending if you are able.

    I don’t want her beholden to anyone.

    Also, Obama is pissing me off daily. A speech at the Brandenburg Gate…disgusting. Accepting the nomination at a stadium in front of throngs of admirers…

    The man is a dangerous,narcissistic, arrogant, demagogue (is there any other kind…) He must be stopped.

  32. I firmly believe Hillary is supportive of PUMA, silently. As hard as she tries, she just does not sound sincere when she asks us to vote for Obama. I am just not buying it. She is in an impossible situation. I have to think she is relieved we are still here fighting for her and our rights.

  33. Park Slope- I am in Baltimore now, just as crazy for o I am afraid. I still have family in Brooklyn and am thinking of a road trip up there since my kids are in sleep away camp and I am a free woman for the first time in 15 years.

  34. abycat said:

    “I have to think she is relieved we are still here fighting for her and our rights.”

    abycat, I believe you are right. Which, as noted above, is a reason we MUST not give up!


  35. bmc, on July 22nd, 2008 at 8:38 am Said:

    Where are they getting the idea that PUMAs are about wanting Hillary to be VP? No no no. That is not it. Hillary can’t buy BO accomplishments or experience. He is a fraud and Hillary can’t erase that.

  36. Honora,

    If you get up here, stop by – 119 Windsor – we’d love to see you.


  37. As a PUMA member, I am not too concerned whether or not Hillary supports the movement herself. Hillary fought hard to gain our respect and our votes; she never asked us to park our brains at the door and worship mindlessly at her feet. Hillary has never asked us to blindly follow–she has always stated her positions clearly and logically. I can totally support Hillary without having to agree with 100% of her positions 100% of the time. That is the difference between Hillary’s base and Obama’s base. Obama seems to demand total loyalty–both to himself AND his positions, no matter where on the spectrum he has flipped or flopped.

    I wish I could drop by for the cocktail party, but there’s a hurricane coming, and I’m going to be busy tying down loose ends today–literally! It’s coming in south of us. Maybe we won’t have to board up the windows–I hate boarded windows, it’s like living in a cave. Keep us all in your thoughts–Dolly is more water than wind, so the forecasters say–some flooding is likely, especially in the heart of the Rio Grande Valley. No place like Texas–severe drought to flood conditions in less than 12 hours! Off to fight the mob at the grocery store–have a great day!

  38. Hi, Delphine! Great minds….and all that? :o}

    I sent that to Taylor Marsh as well, who is now posting truly inflammatory remarks that the Clinton campaign says they haven’t seen any money from PUMA….it is really hateful, spiteful, vengeful work from Taylor Marsh.

    Reardon’s “persuasion 101” lesson is a good one, but of course, authoritarian personality types just don’t have the tolerance for dissent. They cannot comprehend that just by demanding it, it doesn’t naturally just happen! So, they keep doing the only thing they know: They just keep on demanding it–in more mean-spirited, spiteful, and vengeful ways. It’s all they know. Taylor Marsh is a perfect example.

  39. oh yeah another thing….

    my local paper had an article by donna brazile yesterday asking for paty unity.

    She writes about Obama being the nominee, and the fight being over, “How many ways do these Hillary delegates, voters, and supporters need to hear it before they get it? Sen Barack Obama is the party’s nominee.”

    Donna, when you put it like that, I say “Kiss my ass, baby. I don’t ‘get it’, and I won’t ‘get it” either.
    I’m not voting for your unaccomplished, inqualified twit no matter what. Get it?

  40. sarah,

    eloquently put, fer’ sure!


  41. stxabuela – Good luck to you today! Batten down those hatches!

    Everyone – I absolutely agree that Hillary is on our side, or she would have published a statement to tell us to vote for Obama. But indeed, we would not be obliged to listen. As wonderful as she is, she works for us, not the other way around.

    I have my own version of Kathleen Reardon’s admonition this morning. I may post it later if RD is amenable.

    But seriously, Obama and his cohorts will never admit that we have legitimate grievances, because that would mean admitting they f&cked up big-time by a) putting Obama forward in the first place when he is inexperienced and unqualified; and b) putting their thumbs on the scales in an obvious and corrupt manner in order to kick Hillary to the curb.

    I hope we are not looking for the DNC to get a clue any time soon. Nagahapin.

  42. Ohferchrissake, steveeboy, give it up.

    Can you offer us one good reason to vote for Obama other than “he’s not McCain?”

    [cricket cricket cricket]

    Don’t you get that Obama is a liar? We don’t trust him to keep his promises, and he’s certainly not fit to lead this country.

    We don’t care that McCain sucks, because Obama sucks too. Either the Party nominates Hillary or I’m staying home in November.

  43. sarah, on July 22nd, 2008 at 8:59 am Said:
    what’s your local paper? I think I read this article in an online magazine…

  44. Obama doesn’t want you to control your body either, especially when you are feeling “blue”.

  45. Calling people insane is a great way to persuade them too. I think anyone who believes anything Obama says is insane.

    Obama is a liar, so it doesn’t matter what positions he says he will take. You can’t trust him.

  46. BO was about to vote for Roberts himself and then an aide with two brain cells told him not to. I don’t remember a spirited opposition to Alito from the Dem congress . I remember them doing kabuki for half a day and rolling over…as usual. The augment we must vote Dem would hold some water IF they had stood up to Bush once. They haven’t. And there is nothing that indicates they ever would . Part of PUMA is the refusal to fall in line because of future fights with the GOP that somehow never happen. See, we snapped. It had to happen, but the future fight for current votes scam for the Dems is over . The only Dem I see actually fighting Bush is Hillary Clinton .

  47. Actions, not words.

    Hillary. There is no substitute.


  48. Yes, she is passionate in that video below.

    Cheers, Hillary.

  49. I haven’t visited TM’s site since she went over to the dark side, and don’t intend to give her a click now. But I do wonder if “Scan” is still her weekend headliner, anybody know? He was so totally devoted to Hillary during the primaries (and a very good writer, too), and I would be very sad if he had joined TM at the kool-aid spigot.

  50. If Bush had won fair and square back in 2000 he would still be a horrible President.

    It’s not just about how Obama “won” or who he pushed aside to get there.

    He’s unqualified.

  51. Saying “Obama’s better than McCain” is like saying “This piece of shit is better than that piece of shit.”

    They’re both still pieces of shit

  52. If Democratic leaders are so very opposed to McCain, they would have supported the stronger candidate…Senator Clinton. Because of spitefulness, jerry-rigging and idiotic power plays, they are now stuck with Obama. Very stuck. He has alienated half the Democratic base and cannot win the GE.

    It’s easy to ignore the shrill directives of Pelosi, Brazile, Fowler, et al, because these nitwits have wrecked the Democratic party.

    PUMA has been created to restore accountability in politics. PUMA is the change Obama has been trumpeting, but incapable of effecting. He should be the first to embrace this very powerful protest against politics-as-usual, although he is much too self-serving, too impotent, and too hypocritical to acknowledge it, as are his surrogates.

  53. The Democrat’s definition of a level playing field:

    We were told that most people are not against a woman becoming president – just not “that” woman, Clinton and this is seen as OK – a choice.

    Yet when many people express the opinion that they are not against a black becoming president – just not “that” black, Obama, this is pounced on – as racist.

    Obama and most Democrats/Liberals used to be very critical of Bush’s throwing out any part of the Constitution he wanted to that did not serve his political purposes.

    Yet BO had no problem with throwing the FOURTH AMENDMENT under the bus, and except for a few strong, intelligent supporters most swallowed hard and found excuse after excuse for his treating the Constitution just like Bush – especially the MSM.

    The unpledged super delegates were trashed by Obama and supporters who called them undemocratic autocrats when it looked as though they might put Clinton over the top. They cried it would cause riots if Clinton won because of super delegates votes.

    Yet, as Craig Crawford observed: “With the dust settled on the primary season, one thing is clear: Obama is the presumed nominee thanks only to superdelegates. He never did win enough pledged delegates to reach the winning number, falling about 350 votes short. His expected victory stems from beating Clinton among superdelegates 463-257, according to a tally on Real Clear Politics.”

  54. steveboy without the e – you are pissing in the wind!

    Go away. No one here cares about your reproductive rights issues argument.

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  55. We’re NOT going to cost Obama the election. I firmly believe that even if McCain takes a power nap from now until Nov 4 he’s still going to win the election by a landslide.

    Who’s the writer on this site who occasionally does the fictional posts here? I’d LOVE to read her satirical take on election night. I’m picturing Dean & Pelosi being mowed down by the Straight Talk Express with a rabid Michelle Obama behind the wheel! Beep beep!

  56. And Kool-Aid doesn’t wash away the taste of shit.

  57. My husband had a business meeting with some very republican lobbyists yesterday. He told me that they are hoping that o wins because they figure he will be such a disaster that the Reps will win back the Congress in 20210. They are worried that if McCain wins, he will work with the Dems in Congress and will be successful. If McCain wins they figure the Dems will hold onto Congress in 2010. Since they are Rep. lobbyists they see an o administration as a way back to control in 2 years.

  58. SherryNC, where in NC are you? I wanted to protest Dean’s bus trip through NC on Friday, but I won’t be able to. I’m trying to find NC people would like to go give him a piece of their mind.

  59. […] I’m no longer a Democrat, so I won’t be signing this petition I found while reading this post at The Confluence. However, I really like its concluding paragraph: I own my vote. It does not […]

  60. Michelle Marshall showed her true colors this campaign season. She never was for Clinton; she thought if she’d peddle herself as a Clinton supporter, she’d get lots of hits, money, and recognition, and thus the job she’s been craving to have but not really work for.

    People should simply boycott her site. Clinton supporters especially shouldn’t even comment in her comments. I notice some of the posts can still have 200 or 300 comments. Believe me, she needs to go back into obscurity where she belongs.

  61. Annie Em, Democrats legitimately cannot say one word about McCain. They were ready and willing to see him as Kerry’s VP in 2004. Hell, Kerry even asked him to do it.
    Now, their tired mantra is McSame, McSame. Democrats right now are trying to be Republicans. They think they have to stoop to smear tactics to win. Except McSame is a really ineffective smear and nobody will believe it. McCain is a moderate. It is the reason half of his party hate him. He has stood up for the environment, Campaign finance re-form, immigration reform.
    Democrats used to hold the moral high ground. Not anymore. And to see them peddle this crap is really laughable. If they are going to smear, couldn’t they come up with something better than McSame.

    Republicans nominated the best candidate they could this year. He beats Obozo by a mile.

  62. I will never feel guilty for owning my vote.

    I will never feel guilty for refusing, ever again, to support a candidate who is not a partisan Democrat.

    I will never feel guilty for speaking out against any Democrat–or Republican–who feels that keeping his or her job is more important than representing me.

    I will never feel guilty for withholding my vote from an unqualified candidate.

    I will never feel guilty about refusing to vote for any candidate who makes a mockery of real issues of racial and gender inequality.

    This whole election has gone way beyond Hillary. It has become a turning point in the course that we, as a nation, choose to follow.

  63. My objection to Barack Obama–and why I will not vote for him as president–has to do with my firm conviction that he is NPD–Narcissistic Personality Disorder. It’s beginning to become a prominent feature in press coverage of him, too. People are hesitant to actually define it concretely, but I continue to do so, because it is a real threat. There is something wrong with Obama, and many of us recognize it, even if we cannot identify it on a personal level.

    Shelby Steele in the WSJ–Why Jesse Jackson Hates Obama–identifies Obama’s central character issue:

    His campaign is more cultural than political. He sells himself more as a cultural breakthrough than as a candidate for office. To be a projection screen for the cultural aspirations of both blacks and whites one must be an invisible man politically. Real world politics, in their mundanity, interrupt cultural projections. And so Mr. Obama’s political invisibility — a charm that can only derive from a lack of deep political convictions — may well serve his cultural appeal, but it also makes him something of a political mess.

    Already he has flip-flopped on campaign financing, wire-tapping, gun control, faith-based initiatives, and the terms of withdrawal from Iraq. Those enamored of his cultural potential may say these reversals are an indication of thoughtfulness, or even open-mindedness. But could it be that this is a man who trusted so much in his cultural appeal that the struggles of principle and conscience never seemed quite real to him? His flip-flops belie an almost existential callowness toward principle, as if the very idea of permanent truth is passé, a form of bad taste.


    Obama is an NPD, there is no doubt about it:


  64. Mawm – correction – He “will beat” Obozo by a mile if Hillary is not the nominee!

  65. Mawm – my reply to you didn’t post. Is it because I included a url for my local PUMA/JSND website? hmmm

    I’m in Charlotte. Dean is expected here on the 25th but I don’t have a time yet. An action is being planned at charlottefrontandcenter.com

  66. Mawm, on July 22nd, 2008 at 10:06 am Said:

    I believe the folks from charlottefrontandcenter.com are protesting…

  67. grayslady

    my sentiments exactly and eloquently put. these are the exact feelings/thoughts i had when i left the d party in ’96

  68. hi luckyann! are you in Clt?

  69. But I did want to address something that came up a couple of times in last night’s thread about whether Hillary was still mad at us because we went PUMA.

    We went PUMA? I like the sound of that. Going PUMA is like going AWOL, only we were never under any obligation to support the presumptuous nominee. The party only thought we were. Now they’re realizing that our votes belong to us, to their everlasting dismay.

    We’re driving the bots and the corrupt party apparatchiks batshit crazy, and I couldn’t be happier. The empty suit should be up by 20 on McCain at this point in the game, yet he’s barely ahead by a couple of points. The reason barky can’t escape the margin of error is that he and his cronies have split the party with their despicable behavior. Now there’s a whole new crop of anti-obama independents out here who may never return to the dem side of the equation. (I know I never will.) And, contrary to Brazilenut’s delusional ravings, we haven’t been replaced by hordes of fresh, new voters. As long as they are determined to continue on the path to party (self) destruction, barky’s fortunes will keep plummeting and take a whole lot of other dems along with him.

    Go PUMA! 😉

  70. I know we are not supposed to ever invoke Hitler, but Obama seems like a “Sieg Heil” type to me. He just doesn’t care about anything but power and having people tell him how awesome he is.

    Did you all see this over at Corrente? Elections are so yesterday. Let’s just hand Obama the presidency now.

    [How does this terrifying person have a commenting ID and I don’t? Go back to Germany, bringiton! Jeebus H. Christmas!!!)

  71. Oh and grayslady – BRAVA. My thoughts exactly.

  72. Trotting out the argument that John McCain is so much worse than Barack Obama, therefore Obama must be your choice for president overlooks the obvious in so many ways. McCain never presented himself as new, improved, different, transcendent, inspirational, etc.etc. as has Obama. No one expects liberal opinions on …well, anything from a Republican candidate. His less than far-right opinions are therefore a pleasant surprise, considering the source. On the other hand, Obama has flown in the face of reasonable expectations of any Democratic candidate and has done an about-face so often he must be permanently dizzy. His far-right opinions on FISA and abortion are betrayals of core Democratic values. If this can be stated any more simply, please, someone, give it a try. My first grade primer began with the words “Look. Look. Look, look, look”. Dick and Jane were taught to make observations…what happened to the next generation is beyond me.

  73. NPR just reported that taxpayers have paid for Obama’s trip through the middle-east because he is part of a congressional delegation to the area.

    Really, are any other members of this “delegation” demanding press coverage and photo-ops to “prove” their foreign relations credentials?

    I find it extremely offensive that the Obama campaign is using MY tax dollars to enhance his skinny sorry ass credentials.

    And his statement to troops while shaking their hands “this is my favorite thing to do” is pathetic. He cared about troops ONLY when it became politically expedient to have a “photo op” with them. If he is so concerned for the troops why hasn’t he as Hillary and McCain have done, already made many trips to the war zone???

    50 years a democrat and so angry I will not vote downticket or work for the party. Downticket is going along with this sham Obama campaign and the disrespect his campaign is showing voters by manipulating a photo-op trip into proving Obama has foreign relations experience. Why should I vote for them??

  74. Andrea Mitchell: Obama gave fake interviews in the Middle East

  75. Absolutely no VP. That is a slap in the face for all of us with its latent cultural stereotype. I think some of those Together4us people are championing that. I say absolutely no. I think we are all PUMA because we recognize Obama is not qualified — their purported nominee is flawed and they picked him over another well qualified candidate using nefarious means. Anyway, they can’t use the guilt “you’re a democrat and therefore, you have to vote for the dem nominee,” on me anymore — I switched to unaffiliated on May 31.

  76. I can’t get out of my head a brief , side comment Hannity made recently.
    He was as usual putting down Obama’s “flip-flops”.
    Then he went off to he ” ASSOCIATIONS” & said:
    something like, “there will be MORE ON THAT in the
    That made me realize “WE” the Hillsters are showing,
    I really feeling just like Hillary was; “PUMA” has so many sides to WORK @ THE SAME TIME!!

  77. So Katha Pollitt thinks it’s “insane” for us to vote McCain?

    Respectfully, Ms. Pollitt, yes we PUMAs are crazy….like the fox.

    Pumas, too, live by their wit and stealth. The fox doesn’t run in packs, nor will PUMAs fall in line.

  78. Hi all. I just got back from cleaning out my desk. I am not sorry to be leaving that job behind. I appreciate the moral support you guys are giving me. bmc, thanks a lot for posting these words:

    “Always aim high, work hard, and care deeply about what you believe in. When you stumble, keep faith. When you’re knocked down, get right back up. And NEVER listen to anyone who says you can’t or shouldn’t go on.” — Hillary Clinton

    I will do my best to follow Hillary’s advice. Today I’m seeing my shrink (bad anxiety attack last night!) and going over my sverence package with my husband.

    Maybe now is the time to start my own blog! It interesting how just typing these words is giving me a psychic boost. PUMA has taught me to leave “learned helplessness” behind.


  79. madamab, that place makes me sick. I never like it. It reminds me of firedoglake in its pretention. Gary used to frequent it, so I would hear of things written there, but I can count on two hands the number of clicks I have given it.

  80. Arabella, can you go to Denver now?

  81. Bravo Ms. Marple, nicely put.

    Here’s my stab at brevity:

    Obama is just like a fart in a whirlwind, you can’t pin it down, but you know it’s there and it stinks. McCain is McCain, he’s got a record and experience, we know what we like and what we don’t, but at least we know where he stands.

  82. Mawm – I can’t believe I applied for a commenter ID three months ago and they still won’t give it to me. WTF???

    Arabella – Start your own blog! I would definitely visit. 🙂

  83. Madamab, you too, I applied for one at least that long ago and I thought it was just me. I feel better, I’m in good company knowing that you too have not yet been annointed.

  84. Kathleen Reardon’s post is simply a more effective way of minimizing the PUMA movement. Hillary as VP to Obama is something I definitely do not want. Her argument that the VP position is the crux of our battle ignores the caucus fraud, the DNC corruption, sexism in the media & Democratic Party, and mostly, it ignores our issues with Obama as a no-nothing candidate that we’d be ashamed to support.

    I can’t emphasize that enough, I would absolutely be ashamed to support Obama as a Democratic candidate, and I won’t do it.

  85. Good morning everyone!!!

    WOO-HOO!!! The Infantry Co-Commanders of the Rebel Alliance!!!! I’ll definitely be listening!!!

    And AWESOME idea Ms. Riverdaughter with the cross-blog Scratching Post. I mentioned that on Sunday when I called in toask a question to Texas Darlin’ on No We Won’t Radio (I mentioned Scratching Post fundraising, shout out to Carol Diamonds, etc.,)

    REBEL ALLIANCE, onward!!!

  86. Prolix – Likewise, I’m sure! 🙂

    Parentofed – NO Hillary for VP. What would be the point, since Obama would surely ignore anything she would have to say, policy-wise?

    Oh yes, I know. Helping Obama win.

    Why would I want to do that?! Obama would be a worse President than Bush.


  87. Mawm – Denver? Hahaha. With my anxiety disorder acting up like this I don’t know if I could get on airplane.

    I am so relieved to be out of that job. I think what I need to do is take a couple of weeks off. My husband is already antsy because I don’t have interviews lined up.

    I know that I’ll be fine. I just need some rest.

    I am thrilled to death that now that I have some time free, I can do more for PUMA. That’s where my heart is right now.


  88. a PUMAiku:

    Hillary enslaved
    PUMAs remove her bindings
    Freeing her to fight

  89. Hillary for VP? Don’t insult me. Is it true that Flip Flop Obama said that he “hasn’t ruled Hillary out” as VP? This is not about Hillary. This is about Obama’s hijacking of the Democratic Party.

    I’m not feeling blue, I’m not sulking, and I’m not stupid.

    PUMAs: Strong, yet graceful in repose.

  90. Troll MART is just trying to recover her fading number of hits … it’s the only way to get her back where she thinks she’ll be taken seriously again … i agree, don’t even lurk there because she doesn’t deserve the numbers.. she IS a hack

  91. I am on strike against several blogs, and TM is one of them.

  92. Any self respecting Democrat would respect the PUMA concept. Even Al Gore admitted that it is Country before Party when he conceeded in 2000.
    This is about the DNC hand picking the Dem Nominee and then rigging the primary. We must fight against this or our votes are illusory. I personally didn’t hear anyone complain, when Donna and other AA threatened to take their marbles and go home if the SD tried to throw the race to Clinton. Hypocrites.

    I applaud what Puma and Denver group is doing, but I personally don’t believe that the SD will vote for her, or that Hillary will accept. The party and the press have too much invested in Obama. They are not going to admit they made a mistake. We must defeat him in November. On Wedn night at 7 (eastern) the Link Tv is doing a documentary on the 2000, 2004 elections re: voter fraud. I believe with Press and Corp america supporting Obama that the Democrats will commit fraud this year.

  93. Andrea Mitchell: Obama gave fake interviews in the Middle East

    Andrea Mitchell might be a doyenne of the liberal media, but she has her reporter’s pride and principles, both of which have been trampled by the way the Obama campaign has managed the media during the candidate’s current trip to Afghanistan and Iraq. Mitchell let loose on this evening’s Hardball, video here.http://countusout.wordpress.com

  94. Any move to have Hill take the VP is at best, a mistake meant to soften PUMA. Any promise made by BO is a lie. In some ways Hill is setting the table for 2012. The Dem elite must have, and go down their toy if they are to be exited off the stage. Much as I’d love it, if Hill got it now, this same crew would sandbag her every step of the way while in office and she would even be required to take BO as VP….and really that’s even worse than Hill being VP. Because BO is a cancer whose scandals, the MSM would suddenly discover and make POTUS Hill responsible for and/or Barry would set up another DC court to under mine her . Hillary is always motivated by what’s best for the adverage voter ( which makes her a mystery to others in her class) and what is possible . Sometimes a cancer must run its course . I thank God for Hillary Clinton.

  95. Quick post before work. Re: FrenchDoc’s post at Corrente: I have thought about the PUMA movement like the French Resistance during WWII, and I’m also frequently reminded of the Founding Fathers who demanded equal and fair representation. We are fighting for the absolute core principles of democracy, and any distortion of that is just a lie.

    I, personally, could care less what anyone on the web or elsewhere thinks of what we/I am doing in this regard. My brother recently told me I would be responsible if we went to war with Iran. After he insisted that Iraq was “Hillary’s fault because she voted for it,” and that Barack “did not vote for the war,” (if I hear this one more time my head is going to explode: HE DID NOT VOTE AT ALL!) I threw my keys on the table and walked out of the restaurant and home in the rain. I felt completely clear about my position, my core convictions, and I will not be bullied by my family, the Dem Party, the media or anyone else. Last time I checked, this was still a free country, though with Obama and his supporters, that is becoming more dubious by the day.

    And as far as Hillary is concerned. She has spent her entire life fighting for what she believes in. We are a chip off the not-so-old block 🙂

  96. Annetoo – I second that emotion. What would we do without Hillary? She is a reminder that there is a better way. Things are never helpless as long as you don’t let them be.

  97. Andrea Mitchell might be a doyenne of the liberal media, but she has her reporter’s pride and principles,

    No offense Fred. I’m glad Mitchell pointed this out, but she has been absolutely repellent toward Hillary and sucking up to Obama all spring so I do not agree that she has pride and principles. As a matter of fact, she has been one of the worst women-haters of the bunch.

  98. And his statement to troops while shaking their hands “this is my favorite thing to do” is pathetic. He cared about troops ONLY when it became politically expedient to have a “photo op” with them.

    If it’s his favorite thing to do, why is this only his second trip to Iraq? He is so full of sh*t, I cannot STAND THIS GUY!!!!! Go play basketball Barry.

  99. NH – I agree that Hillary would have a hard time if she won the Presidency, but you know what? The next four years are going to suck no matter what.

    She can handle whatever those weak Vichy Dems throw at her. We can’t afford not to have her as President. We need big changes and we need them now. This country is going down the toilet and all anyone wants to talk about is patriotism and abortion. Gas prices? The economy? Homelessness? Healthcare? Anyone? Bueller?

    Somebody wake me up from this nightmare. The Dems are about to throw this election to McCain. Where did my Party go? I want it back!

  100. This is all because Howard Dean needs a red sportscar.

  101. Everytime i turn on the news these days I feel like I’m watching some kind of choreographed broadway show …

    i think it’s telling that obama wouldn’t let the foreign press traipse along … they’d do their jobs and not fall into line …

    i keep seeing reporters with notepads dancing like a chorus … not one reporter who has seriously questioned Obambi got an invite to tag along and keep track of him like an independent minded reporter should

  102. The Dallas Morning News blog is questioning the polls and why Obama isn’t cleaning McCain’s clock. The head editor was at a party and said this:

    I(((I was at a dinner party this past weekend and the talk inevitably turned to the presidential campaign. Opinions around the table varied – some preferring Obama, some still nursing their Clinton wounds, others intrigued by McCain. But on one thing everybody agreed: The buzz everywhere is about Obama and yet national polls show him neck-and-neck with McCain – what gives?))

    I thought it was interesting that at this elite get-together “some were still nursing their Clinton wounds.” I think PUMAs are underestimated and are definitely keeping the polls tight. Just because the “buzz” in the newspaper business is Obama 24/7 doesn’t mean it will translate into votes at the polls.

  103. Arabella T,

    Doors close, windows open. Take a few days before you even think about looking for a new job. This might be the perfect opportunity to think about what you would actually like to be doing. I worked for a small company that folded. That gave me an opportunity to do a little soul searching and launched another whole career for me. If that company still existed, I would probably still be there 20 years later. Unhappy, but too afraid to take the risk of leaving a good job. The Rx is deep breaths, soothing tea, a good book, and good friends – both online and off. A better job is just down the road apiece.

  104. So many weak men are living through Obama. Howard Dean is but one of them. I wish Carol would fund raise so that we could buy Dean that mid-life crisis red convertable. It would be cheaper that getting rid of Obama. Let Obama go back to the Senate and earn his stripes. He has a lot of time to run for president.

  105. What samanthasmom said!

    Howard Dean – Sorry about your penis. Now, please bring Hillary back.


  106. fred, on July 22nd, 2008 at 11:04 am Said:
    Andrea Mitchell: Obama gave fake interviews in the Middle East

    Andrea Mitchell might be a doyenne of the liberal media, but she has her reporter’s pride and principles

    …..Ha ha! Here’s alot funny in that…starting with the idea there is liberal media …and then going on to
    Andrea Mitchell’s ” pride and principle$”

    However I will say , Mitchell was the only one who reported BO bused people in to the rallies in TX. Now we know they bused people everywhere for everything. She quickly went back to the Hillary bashing, but It means something when Mitchell actually reports news ( ie what happened) but what, lord knows. The Press’s owners think they run Bambie.
    Perhaps they had Mitchell send a shot over Barry’s bow to reign him in? Everyone who thinks they run Barry , from the AA community , the latte followers who are DEMANDING BO change on FISA ( lol!) the Press and its owners, are in for a surprise …and not a pleasant one. IMO.

  107. Thanks, samanthasmom! I needed to hear that. The them of 2008 seems to be “Learned Helplessness – Unlearn it, fast.”

  108. my local paper had an article by donna brazile yesterday asking for paty unity.

    She writes about Obama being the nominee, and the fight being over, “How many ways do these Hillary delegates, voters, and supporters need to hear it before they get it? Sen Barack Obama is the party’s nominee.”

    How many ways can I despise Donna B? Reading this, I get a clear image of her at the RBC meeting and in ONE SENTENCE she called Hillary and her campaign “cheaters” and in the next breath, called for party unity. She is a complete and utter ass.

    Here’s a tip Donna you gum-chewing ninny: we don’t need to hear it anymore, because we are NEVER GOING TO GET IT. He is illegitimate. I watched you pander for him for months, and then manipulate delegates to favor him. Just like Bush was never my president–I never felt that way in 8 years–I will never acknowledge BO. YOU get over it.

  109. Hi Folks,

    “Long time” lurker checking in and speaking of checking in, today’s Ras tracking poll has Obama and McCain TIED.

  110. Tied? Why isn’t Obama losing yet?

    Seriously, where should Obama’s numbers be right now, assuming that this was a regular election cycle (which it isn’t.)

  111. Everytime i turn on the news these days I feel like I’m watching some kind of choreographed broadway show …

    That’s why I never watch it. I started the boycott in February and would only watch Hillary events. Stopped NY Times, NPR, all MSM. I am much more peaceful, except when I read about it online, and then my blood still boils! It is really frightening watching what is happening to our “news” sources. More Orwellian than even Orwell could have imagined. I am truly worried for this country.

  112. ks – So, with the most sycophantic press imaginable and a massive push to make him acceptable to the American people, he and McCain are tied?!

    Why is the Democratic Party backing this loser?

  113. Mawm, just noticed I have this email from CFAC:

    Hey Everyone. This is to update everyone on the Protest of Howard Dean on Friday, July 27th. [should be 25th] As of this moment we are still working on finding out the time and place for Howard the Coward’s arrival in Charlotte. We do have someone working on it for us and the nanosecond we get the information it will be sent out to you and posted on our website

    http://www.charlottefrontandcenter.com . The Democratic Party has been very, very secretive about the particulars. They are scared and it has already been reported that he has chosen to bypass certain scheduled stops in Texas and Mississippi, only to show up three days later unannounced (under cover). We should keep this in mind and be prepared to move suddenly if need be.

    We have some folks coming in all the way from Asheville for this. We are counting on the support of our former fellow Hillary supporters from Charlotte4Hillary to participate. Let’s show Hillary that we still have her back! Come out and let Howard and the DNC know that suspending the rules at convention is not an option. Hillary’s name must be put in nomination and a roll call must take place! She deserves this at the very least. We can do this much of the fight to see her elected president.

    Charlotte Front and Center

  114. To clarify, here’s the Ras info but Real Clear Politics is listing it as a tie.

    “The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Tuesday shows Barack Obama attracting 43% of the vote while John McCain earns 42%. When “leaners” are included, it’s Obama 46% and McCain 46% .”

  115. Prolix said: Obama is just like a fart in a whirlwind, you can’t pin it down, but you know it’s there and it stinks.

    Okay, I love that line, I intend to use, and will try to remember to give you credit

  116. I am psyched knowing that gary and Mawm will be on with taggles tomorrow night. And that one of madamab’s fabulous plays will be presented! This makes my day!

  117. PJ – So glad you’re here! I think it’s time to post my latest play, for which you were the inspiration. 🙂

  118. Pat – where is this event taking place?

  119. Just watched a few minutes of the “press conference” from Jordan. That halting and stuttering just got on my last nerve. Bush is bad enough in his delivery but Obama’s is no improvement. Four years of that and I will go batshit in no time.

  120. Arabella: On the radio at 8pm tomorrow night. Blog radio. There will be a link provided.

  121. madamab: I have found my true calling: I am now a “muse”.

  122. PJ – Well, you “amuse” me! LOL And you certainly inspired this one.

    It’s up now. 🙂

  123. Obama has seemed like a walking Narcissistic Personality Disorder and a walking Sociological Experiment to me, forever. GREAT! A mental disorder and an unknown set of mental/emotional challenges ready to rule the world. Feeling entitled to do so, and planning to let his sick internal compass (????) be his leader and adviser.

    Sadly, he is a pathetic, unwell being IMO, but, more importantly, frighteningly he is as dangerous as Hitler and Stalin if handed unlimited power. And, Hitler was just that kind of personality, which was what the people who were trying to instigate WWll for their own economic reasons went out looking for and financed and put into power in Germany. See any parallels here?

  124. Sorry, I’m a bit late. Should have been here a couple of hours ago.

  125. Are those Europeans going to have time to send their absentee ballots in by November?

  126. SherryNC, on July 22nd, 2008 at 10:24 am Said:
    no, I just heart about their group on the NO WE WON’T radio 🙂

  127. Thanks “fred” for the Andrea Mitchell, “clip”!
    Maybe someone should talk about how Obama ,not
    only would’nt debate Hillary in a”Town-Hall” format; but
    also “BLEW-OFF”, McCain & the US Military!!
    “AT”- Best-Wishes upon you new “journey”!

  128. And whatever happened to the “poverty tour” with Edwards. Promises, promises, add up to so much dead air.

  129. I agree with you, Pat. I tried to listen to Obama answer questions the other day and had to give up – the umming and ahhing just got to me.

  130. bostonboomer,

    Just thought I’d give you the information that Christina Cedeno is the “proud owner” of “http://yestodemocracy.com/” an Anti-Puma blog.

    She is also, according to information she has about herself a preschool or kindergarten teacher… and we wonder why there is such a problem with children not learning in our school systems…

  131. Pat – I hope you saw Eddy on Joe this morning. He looked really tired. I must let him get some sleep occassionally.

    I miss regencyg. I hope she is having fun and setting Magic straight as to what he needs to communicate to Hillary and Bill.

  132. madamab, I wasnt’ referring to whether Hillary could handle the Presidency over the next 4 years. I agree with you that she could. No, I don’t think she would accept allow her name to go to roll call unless she has big name SD who have publically or privately changed their minds.

    There is no point in her going to fight that she will lose when she has already suspended her campaign and told her supporter to contribute to Obama. People don’t have infinite sums of money so unless the party begs her to run Denver is not the time to start raising $$ for November. She has 20million and thats not enough.

  133. Obama and his advisors are suffering from some rather serious delusions. From the Politico piece dakinikat linked to above:

    At a morning background briefing, reporters parried with senior advisers on the characterization of Obama’s speech Thursday in Berlin as a campaign rally. The outdoor speech at the Victory Column could draw thousands of people, similar to the size of Obama events in the United States.

    “It is not going to be a political speech,” said a senior foreign policy adviser, who spoke to reporters on background. “When the president of the United States goes and gives a speech, it is not a political speech or a political rally.”

    “But he is not president of the United States,” a reporter reminded the adviser.

    So, they’re acting as if he is already president. Talk about malignant narcissism. That explains why they arrogantly assumed it would be fine for him to hold a massive rally at the Brandenburg Gate. It’s a president’s prerogative to do so, and BO is already president in his own mind. They must see the actual campaign and the election — the part where AMERICANS vote — as a mere formality, a foregone conclusion. We’re just extras in the glorious film of barky’s triumph. (And there will be a film (or films), just you wait.)

    I cannot wait for this presumptuous fool to come crashing back to earth. The best thing that could ever happen for this country is for BO to lose and have to go crawling back into obscurity.

  134. Annabelle T-you blog-I’ll be happy to read 😉

    Murphy on No Quarter radio had a phone-in from the Texan lady who grabbed Dean’s arm in Austin and demanded Hill’s name on the nomination. She was amazing, an old time Union member and (now ex-Dem )Texan delegate who definitely knew what she was about. Listen at:

  135. Pop star George Michael chucking in his two cents:

    “NEW YORK (Reuters) – British pop star George Michael has a tip for U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama — team up with former rival Hillary Clinton.

    Michael, 45, touring North America for the first time in 17 years, told fans during a concert at New York City’s Madison Square Garden that “I know you guys all need a change.”

    He admitted he doesn’t know what kind of change Obama would bring if elected, saying that after “months of watching CNN” he still does not know what Obama or Clinton stand for. But he went on to say that the Illinois and New York senators would make “the strongest team” for the Democratic ticket.”


    Clearly George hasn’t been following Hillary AT ALL if he still walks away without a clear understanding of where she stands on the issues. BO, OTOH …

  136. Regarding Hillary’s thoughts about PUMA – I believe she is neutral about the movement. She is not going to overtly (or even covertly) support it, but I know for a fact that she’s not mad about it. How do I know – I used to work for Hillary and some of my dearest and closest friends were senior members of her campaign. They are all now, personally, PUMAs themselves – so, no – I don’t think she’s mad about the movement at all.

  137. Wow, love, love, love the video and that is awesome news run_dmc.

    Riverdaughter is my Home Girl.

  138. My first grade primer began with the words “Look. Look. Look, look, look.”

    Mine too, Ms. Marple. But now all those primers have to be rewritten:

    Look. Look. Look, look, look. Dick. Dick. Dick, dick, dick.

  139. Hey the PUMA action center and blog seems to be down. I have tried to get on several times and just get the “fatal error” notice. I hope someone can let them know.

  140. Seattlegirl-
    I sent an email to Murphy. I think we were hacked.

  141. I also do not think Hillary wants PUMA to go away. She knows that PUMA is kicking up dust. She needs us to do just that if she is to win in 2012.
    However, I probably would not have gone PUMA if Obama hadn’t inappropriately played the race card. I will now not support him due to his campaign and groups that support him who think they own my neighborhood. They have paid children to call me names and to pick fights with my kids. They came on my property and took my sign down. I made the woman put my sign back on my door. I have had to deal with death threats and even arson. I am not voting for Obama because he doesn’t know how to control his message or he is allowing the terrorist actions to continue. I am not going to allow this man take over our Country.

  142. Ah Thank You! This was my point at my first and only 18 million voices Seattle meeting. This is about much more than the treatment of Hillary. I am angry about the theft of the nomination itself not WHO they stole from. It could have been John Edwards or Joe Biden. It’s the fact that they had pre ordained Obama and were not going to be dissuaded from that notion. I support PUMA AND I support Hillary. If she doesn’t like it that’s okay. She’s still my girl even thought the DNC may not be my party……..

  143. To all PUMAs: check out the London Times online for an interesting discussion by Europeans on Obama.


  144. kiddo, on July 22nd, 2008 at 4:39 pm Said

    No, that makes her someone who supports free speech and respects other people’s rights to their votes.

    Voting is the most precious right of every citizen, and we have a moral obligation to ensure the integrity of our voting process. – Hillary Rodham Clinton

    There cannot be true democracy unless women’s voices are heard. There cannot be true democracy unless women are given the opportunity to take responsibility for their own lives. There cannot be true democracy unless all citizens are able to participate fully in the lives of their country.

    Hillary believes in Democracy while BO doesn’t.

  145. I don’t think it’s any coincidence that not only has my PC been wiped out, but now my husband’s is too. Anybody else having problems with this stuff? I hope I’m not sounding paranoid. Even my stuff over at the DNC site was messed with. I am now sitting at my local library, typing away. Can’t shut me up over there now, can they? RD, you’re right–it isn’t about Hillary anymore, is it? I’ll be damned if I’ll have ANYTHING shoved down my throat and be told what to do. Hillary gets it–even if she did acknowledge us and tell us to quit, even she knows it’s not about her anymore, and I would most respectfully ignore her request and go on about my PUMA business.

  146. Hey Carrie–get lost. We don’t go posting our 2 cents over in BOWorld, so don’t come and dump your unwanted comments over here.

  147. madamab, your plays are awesome! I have this dream of the protester’s corral in Denver outside the convention. In its center, a raised platform with mikes, and speakers all around the perimeter. The crowd mills around, then most stand still because calm voices boom across the space announcing your play and actors move up to the mike. And people clap, shout , and laugh, your words defusing their anger with satire–and truth–even as they support the mood. My favorite daydream! I’ll be tuned in tomorrow night. Just like old, old times, sitting by the radio, hearing good stuff.

  148. “It is not going to be a political speech,” said a senior foreign policy adviser, who spoke to reporters on background. “When the president of the United States goes and gives a speech, it is not a political speech or a political rally.”

    Is there a name for this sort of mass delusion? These people are rapidly moving beyond Bush into Jim jones territory.

  149. Seriously: If it is Jim Jones territory or maybe Heaven’s Gate… maybe they will be done with it before the convention and then they can join the aliens behind the comet and we can have Hillary back!

  150. I am envisioning Obama’s concession, when he screams that he gave us all a chance and now his father is going to smite us. Raises arm. Waits for smiting. gets upset, tries to summon tidal wave. Fails.

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