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      I used to get paid to watch these things. I don’t any more.  So… I’m going to go read a nice novel in a coffee shop.  Please feel free to talk about the debate in comments.  I will, actually, be curious to hear what people have to say, just not willing to sit thru so […]
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Insulting the Wimmin Brains on Hillary vs Obama

Obama backers promise to bring back the Christmas Tree in 2016

Obama backers promise to bring back the Christmas Tree in 2016

I have the day off so I’m going to the Three Rivers Arts Festival and you can’t stop me.  Will take pictures.

Yesterday, I saw that Digby had a brief flash of insight into the mind of a post-PUMA Hillary supporter.  Referring to Noam Scheiber’s incredibly insulting proposal that Hillary Clinton was stupid enough to believe that the Democrats and the undemocratic Obama patrons of 2008 would let her run in 2016, Digby writes:

I’ve come to think of this in a slightly different way. I think this was decided back in Denver in 2008. The primary campaign was a near tie with Clinton continuing to win races all the way up to the end. (In any previous presidential campaign there would have definitely been a convention challenge to such a tight outcome.) It featured two important “firsts” with an African American and a woman competing for the same prize. It was very emotional. The political arguments among the two camps were fierce but they were both coming from the same center-left policywing of the party, which means there was an agreement, somewhat by default, that this agenda was the preferred agenda of the voters. Both sides fought tooth and nail for the same policies.

In essence, the result of that 2008 near tie vote was that Obama got to go first with the understanding that Clinton would automatically get the nomination 8 years later. What this means is that (barring unforeseen circumstances)there will have been no left wing challenge in presidential races for 16 years and I think that suits the Party and its rich donors just fine. They hate primaries. And since they will have had 16 uninterrupted years of preferred policy, even as the voters get to feel the inspiration of the two historic firsts, why would anyone rock the boat?

Progressives might have been able to leverage that fierce competition in 2008 but they got caught up in the emotion just like everyone else so there wasn’t any real ideological challenge. Unfortunately, it probably ended up being the last primary in which they could have had a voice for a very long time. Too bad.

Savor that for a moment.  Just an instant and no more.  What Digby is saying is what all of us Clintonistas have known for 6 years: the primary was a virtual dead heat and at any other convention, there would have been a floor fight.  But *someone(s)* didn’t want a real primary.  Those someones found it more expedient to ram Obama down our throats whether or not the country wanted it or not and they were willing to rig the nomination to get it.  I suspect those someones were the same people who looked a bit further into the future and didn’t want any cramdowns on securitized mortgages or policies that would force the medical/insurance business to negotiate on costs.

Ok, the moment has passed.  Digby will never admit to being one of us because she is a chickenshit. This is as close as we’ll ever get to the notion that Digby and the rest of them were perfectly aware of what was going on with the primary.  They’re no different than we are except they said nothing.  I think there is a Edmund Burke quote about that.  Come to think of it, how do we know that Digby isn’t just messing with our heads?  Maybe the slight acknowledgement that the Clintonistas were right is meant to soften us up to whatever happens in 2014-2016?  I don’t trust anyone who didn’t pipe up in 2008 or 2012.

But I do not think that anyone offered Hillary a deal.  Ok, maybe someone in the Obama campaign floated it at one time but Hillary is not stupid.  I’ll go to the grave believing that it was Hillary who asked for State before someone locked her into a political grave as VP.  (Biden who??)  If my hypothesis is correct, she was smart enough to know that she didn’t want to become permanently associated with Obama’s domestic policies on the financial crisis and health care.  That would mean she was shrewd and also not totally onboard with what she saw coming.

No, the reason why Hillary’s name has been floated for the last 6 years as Obama’s successor is because that’s what Obama’s backers want everyone to focus on. (You read it here first, folks.) The push to defer everyone’s gratification is not for Hillary’s sake.  It’s so that we will placidly go along with every banker and medical/insurer friendly policy they cook up.  We are lead to think that when Hillary is in office, it will all be ok.  It’s merely a formality.  We had to let the African American go before the woman, that’s all, as if we were all so shallow and simple-minded and easily lead to believe that being the first something is more important than being good at your job. (Insert picture of the Grinch lying to Cindi-Lou Who who is no more than two) Just wait until 2016 and there will be another historic victory for the Democrats, as if competence and good policies have no place in this strategy.  We will finally get the Democrat we wanted in the first place in 2008, instead of the guy who is in the White House now who ramped up the exploitation of everyone not making a living off their investments.

And if my “Promote Deferred Gratification- Pull the Rug Out From Under Everyone Who Waited for 2016 Strategy” (Let’s call it the Cindi Lou Who Strategy for short) is correct, then maybe Obama and Clinton were not as close in policy as everyone was initially lead to believe, right?  Because if they were as identical as the Obama contingent says they were, it wouldn’t have mattered which one was nominated in 2008.  But we know intuitively that this isn’t true because rigging the nomination in Obama’s favor in 2008 was maniacally important to someone(s).  We saw it happen.  And those people knew what was coming in 2008 (read Michael Lewis’s book, The Big Short) which suggests that it wasn’t a matter of electability.  Anyone who lived through September 2008 was going to prefer the Democrat to the Republican and, Clinton, had she been nominated, would have won in a landslide.  She would have been the most visible reminder of the last prosperous economic times  and good government that we had.  Given the series of events in 2008, one might almost be tempted to believe that the nomination of Obama was to ensure that a real Democrat would *not* become president.  So, who’s zooming who?

I have no illusions as to whether these Obama backers want Hillary to run in 2016.  If they feel that their new policies are concretized and their ability to harvest money from us has no chance of being deterred, they probably won’t care who gets into the White House.  It won’t matter if it’s a Democrat, Republican or The Rent Is Too Damn High candidate.

This is Hillary Clinton’s reality and the reality by which the left should judge her fitness to run in 2016.  If she is just going to be a placeholder, why vote for her?  On the other hand, if she is going to represent real change, isn’t it likely that the Obama backers are going to try to bring her down again?  If she’s silenced her critical voice for 6 years in the hopes that she’ll get the nod to run again, she hasn’t done us any favors.  A politician who cares about the fate of the middle class and the loss of policies that made us a great nation shouldn’t have gone along with the campaign to defer our gratification for her run 8 long suffering and destructive years down the line.  Or maybe she’s going to be a stealth candidate, in which case, no one should or would trust her.  The powers that be can’t take that risk and how would the rest of us know  for sure what she was up to?

So, there you go, folks.  I have no idea what’s in her head and no one else does either, except Bill, I suspect.  But the one thing I don’t want in 2016 is to have to vote for a person who said and did nothing to rock the boat for 8 years because she was promised another shot at the nomination.

I am not a stupid woman.

**********************************

One final thing: Obama didn’t run against McCain in 2008.  His campaign had him running against Sarah Palin, a pretty low bar, when you think about it, considering that his campaign had already softened up the media and American public to accept playing to overt sexism a part of Obama’s rite of passage.

Just something to chew on.  Carry on.

22 Responses

  1. If my hypothesis is correct, she was smart enough to know that she didn’t want to become permanently associated with Obama’s domestic policies on the financial crisis and health care. That would mean she was shrewd and also not totally onboard with what she saw coming.

    If only she’d quit the Administration to run for Governor of New York halfway through the first term. I think she’d be in a much better position now if she had.

  2. Yep, yep and yep.

  3. I think this was decided back in Denver in 2008.

    Digby

    I’m thinking it was waaaay earlier than that …years earlier..say 2004 at least ? Anyone remember the 2004 Dem convention?It was all about Mr. O and it kicked off a 4 year press campaign telling us how fabulous he was

    And Digby knows that

    imo Hill was running for SOS from Spring 2008 on …once it was plain the entire upper crust of all stripes , their lackey press and her own lackey party wanted BO . And all would do whatever it took to push him into the White House…which they did .

    But imo Hillary was also running to see if Democracy and rule of law perhaps still worked. She found out they didn’t

    The powers that be can’t take that risk and how would the rest of us know for sure what she was up to?

    Exactly

    If she ran and there was no repeat of the 2008 Hill bashing, than a deal would have been struck .

    In 2016 Hillary cannot run a successful campaign without the powers that be say so. No one can. Only Hill could have done what she did 2008 and get as far as she did while bucking the powers that be …and she was beat by them then …

    There’s 8 more years of the system collapsing since then. Today, on her own , Hillary could not even repeat what she accomplished in 08 , must less win …Today there are no actually Dems in governorships etc. and no political friendships of 20 plus years to help her out for a time .

    However even if Hillary swore on a stack of Bibles to the powers that be that she would be the out and out war criminal / drone target picker the position requires…I don’t think TPTB will trust her with the White House.

    She might sneak in some actually governance in there . She’s prone to help non billionaires and also she ‘s smart , which they gravely mistrust as well.

    • Real sham Obama’s teleprompter didn’t break during his 2004 convention speech, might have save us eight more years of Bush the Lesser.

  4. Yeah, but who else is there? Warren will only run if Hillary doesn’t. Sanders – he’s got my vote in a D primary, but can we little guys pay for a 57-state campaign?

    • Not our problem.
      Winning isn’t everything if you get stuck with a patsy.

  5. But the one thing I don’t want in 2016 is to have to vote for a person who said and did nothing to rock the boat for 8 years because she was promised another shot at the nomination.
    I am not a stupid woman.

    Exactly this.

  6. If Hillary had somehow secured the nomination in ’08 again Obie’s coronation, she would’ve won with the support of “bitter clingers” – the losers who don’t want Goldman Sachs controlling mandatory private-public “partnership” retirement accounts and who would’ve been on board with a massive (permanent) WPA-style program to guarantee full employment. Not that she would support those programs of her own volition; rather; her supporters would’ve held her accountable. With Obie, we got a coalition that hides their Wall Street association behind progressive(TM) views on same-sex marriage and pot. Hillary’s 2016 coalition will be a carryover of the ascendant coalition(TM); not her ’08 coalition of “racists.”

    And i would caution anyone about anyone affiliated with the Dembot party as a challenge, including “independent” Sanders or progressive(TM) Warren. How did they really challenge Obie and his Wall Street bros besides viral youtube clips and sternly-worded letters? The day i’ll pull the lever for a Dem is when they propose a full-employment jobs guarantee, banksters doing the perp walk, and single-payer. [clings to Bible and gun]

  7. I’d still crawl over glass to vote for Hillary Clinton.

  8. Beware of Andrew Cuomo!!!

  9. It’s interesting that your post appeared on the publication date of Hillary’s new book.

    My husband and I supported her in 2008. We are going to support her in 2016 and I believe that she will run. (I even bought a “Ready for Hillary” tool bag that I bought for my knitting.😉 Weren’t we called “bitter dead enders in 2008? )

    Perhaps with Obama’s foreign policy failing, the computer programming problems with ACA, and the stories of problems of coverage vs. cost, buyer’s remorse with Obama is building.

    Yesterday morning my husband pointed out to me a blog post by Ron Fournier that was dated June 9, 2014. The link to the full post is:

    http://www.nationaljournal.com/white-house/i-ve-had-enough-when-democrats-quit-on-obama-20140609

    Here is an excerpt that speaks to the concerns that we had back in 2008.

    I share this email to make the broader point and to offer a disclosure: In the 18 months since I began writing columns focused on the presidency, virtually every post critical of Obama has originated from conversations with Democrats. Members of Congress, consultants, pollsters, lobbyists, and executives at think tanks, these Democrats are my Obama-whispers. They respect and admire Obama but believe that his presidency has been damaged by his shortcomings as a leader; his inattention to details of governing; his disengagement from the political process and from the public; his unwillingness to learn on the job; and his failure to surround himself with top-shelf advisers who are willing to challenge their boss as well as their own preconceived notions.

    For me, as the crisis in Ukraine unfolded (and as the mother of a child adopted from Ukraine) I was appalled that Obama’s initial response was to take military action off the table in the face of Putin’s aggression and to offer MRE in terms of non-lethal assistance.

      • I respectfully disagree with Cannonfire. The circle of advisers that Putin has include Aleksandr Dugin who once said that Russia needs a “authentic, real, radically revolutionary and consistent facism” and who is promoting the idea of Eurasianism.

        Cannonfire is posting his opinion. The protests that led to Yanukovych’s fleeing Ukraine were initiated by the people in the country who see themselves as European and want the economic opportunities that Poland has achieved.

        The following link is to an op-ed is from the Boston Globe. If you google Aleksandr Dugan, you should be able to find more about him.

        http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/03/09/putin-long-game-meet-eurasian-union/1eKLXEC3TJfzqK54elX5fL/story.html

        • The protests that led to Yanukovych’s fleeing Ukraine were initiated by the people in the country who see themselves as European and want the economic opportunities that Poland has achieved.

          This cracks me up…

          oh it was they the people right? with a little help from us and the Ukraine Nazis ( such as “Svoboda”, “Udar”, “Right Sector”, “Fatherland”. and other openly fascist parties ) we used to get the job done and keep the lid on our new puppet…

          The leader of the Ukraine has to be a puppet. Yanukovych forgot himself. He forgot he was our color revolution oligarchy puppet and took a better loan deal from Putrin… opps! no can do. ….sent in operatives during the Russian Olympics games to clean up that mess. Now we have a more western friendly oligarchy puppet, the Chocolate king …who was part of Yanukovych ‘s regime .. let freedom ring!

          Puntin is, of course, no prize …but please…like we give a damn about anyone’s self determination? Does that sound likely? …It’s rather the other way… We care about our interests

          We want Europe to stop using Russian gas . ( the point of the sanctions ) to both to Europe’s and Russia’s detriment . We want The Ukraine reamed out via EU and IMF ” loans” . We want Russia to crease standing in our way in Syria and therefore on our way to Iran…that’s what this is about .

          War with Russia is the upper crust’s current war De-jour… and there always has to be one .

          • I agree, absolutely.

          • The Empire of Capital has spent the past 25 or so years attempting to absorb the former Warsaw Pact countries into the Imperial sphere of influence, as well as any part of the former USSR they can get their trotters into (I apologize to any pigs reading The Confluence for the comparison). 😉

            I say “the Empire of Capital”, not the “American Empire”, because Uncle Sam is not Sauron.

            Capital is Sauron.

            Uncle Sam is merely the Lord of the Nazgul.

            Putin, and others like him in other countries? They’re so many Sarumans (Sarumen?). They’re not nice guys, either–they just insist on being independently evil, rather than serving the most powerful evil.

            Selah.

    • Given that list of Obama’s shortcomings, why do “[t]hey respect and admire Obama”?

      It seems to me the description characterizes a person unworthy of anyone’s respect or admiration (and certainly someone who should never have been placed in a position of responsibility). But then we’ve all known that for quite some time, haven’t we?

      • Thank you . The ” respect and admire ” part is put in imo so the same BushObama——–( fill in the blank) policies can be taken forward ….before , during , and after 2016

  10. When asked by other democrats if I’ll support Hillary I reply that posters at Dailykos wrote that she and Bill are racists and I don’t vote for racists. their looks are priceless.

  11. Great post RD. It’s so wonderful to see you are your best, telling it as it is…
    We won’t forget!

  12. Great RD post.

    And yes, Putin is the bad guy in Ukraine. And in general: read The Man Without A Face-Putin is a KGB thug, nothing more. The ability of certain people on the Left to ignore every bad actor in the world in order to blame the US for everything is really quite amazing. And disheartening.

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