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    • That Poisoned Land
      Mary Stewart was a best-selling author for much of the 20th century. I first stumbled across her as a child, reading the “The Hollow Hills” and the “Crystal Cave”, two of her books about Merlin, but most of what she wrote were adventurous romances, often described as “Nancy Drew for adults.” Recently I read her book “Airs Above The Ground”, written in 1965. […]
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Can this party be saved?

I’ve been cruising the web, checking out the blind men groping different parts of the elephant and trying to make sense of it all. None of them are seeing the big picture though, with the exeception of Ian Welsh and he’s even more pessimistic than I am. So, I thought I’d throw my own uninformed opinion into the mix. Here it is.

The Tea Party should give the Democrats the willies but not for the reason they think. It’s not the Koch brothers who are the big problem here. Oh, sure, the crazy idiot libertarians of the Republican party are about to get their wet dream fulfilled. But if they didn’t exist to fund the Tea Party, the voters might have invented it themselves. See, a lot of the people voting for Tea Party candidates are voters the Democrats might easily have claimed as their own two years ago.

If the blogger boyz could actually bother to get to know them, they’d understand what kind of pressure the working class is under. They work long years for stagnant pay while their under water houses take up more and more of their income. They can’t send their kids to college without saddling them with crippling debt. Their employment prospects are dim. And someone’s always got their hands out. Sometimes it’s teachers. Sometimes it’s bankers. Sometimes it’s their unemployed neighbors. To top it all off, the businesses that became cozy with both parties are ripping them off in every transaction from the ATM to the airlines to the gas station. And no matter how desperate they are for relief, the government only subsidizes the most destitute. In other words, you have to lose absolutely everything you have ever worked for before you get a boot with which you can pull yourself up.

Now, two years ago, those people had a choice. Or they THOUGHT they had a choice. They could have hit the reset button and gone back eight years or they could take a risk with Barack Obama. The choice was made for them by blogger boyz who felt they couldn’t leave this monumental moment of transcendent, orgasmic change in the hands of stupid working class people. So, we got change.

But while the blogger boyz were basking in the afterglow, life went on for the working class. And life has gotten significantly worse. The Democrats have given them nothing. The health care reform act was less than nothing. TARP was a disaster. HAMP is a disgrace. And as Peter Daou pointed out today, more people were killed in (non combat) operations in (not) Iraq, or something like that.

Believe it or not, guys, the working class can read.

They are not amused. At this point, the lives of the working class of the Tea Party have become like a sinking liferaft. They are throwing everyone else over to save themselves. Well, who can blame them? The Democrats gave them nothing in the past 6 years. At least the Tea Party Republicans offer them tax cuts. If that’s all they can get, they’ll take it.

And don’t blame them for this choice. It’s not because they’re stupid. It isn’t that they don’t understand that they are only hurting themselves. It’s that the Democrats give them no alternatives. And they’re pissed off. They could have had another Clinton.

Now, the lefty bloggers can continue to make fun of them and pile on Sarah Palin but that only going to make the former Democrats in the Tea Party even madder and more committed to getting rid of Democrats. They are tired of being mocked and treated like suckers.

The Democrats appear to be headed for political impotence. If they lose Congress, it’s back to the hinterlands, with no committee chairmanships and less seniority and meager campaign contributions. Obama will have to carry the ball for the whole party. Let me repeat that. OBAMA will have to carry the ball for the entire party.

Can this party be saved? I dunno. Depends on how badly it wants to save itself. Is it ready to make peace with the people it stupidly threw away in 2008? I’d like to think so but the Catfood Commission is still in business. That’s a bad sign. Oh, and Elizabeth Warren’s appointment would signify that the days of a free ride for bankers and credit card companies are coming to an end but that doesn’t look very promising at the moment.

It would be helpful to bring in another quarterback for 2012 but the blogger boyz are sneering at that idea.

I guess the answer is, No, unfortunately. Too bad really. Because unless the voting machines are already rigged, a party still needs voters to remain viable. And the Democrats got rid of a good chunk of them in 2008.

Pass the crumpets.

186 Responses

  1. Fuck ’em all and let God sort ’em out.

  2. I don’t get why the talking heads are saying how “relieved” the Dems are that so many Tea Party candidates are winning. They say that since Tea Partiers are crazy it makes it possible for some Dems to retain their seats or something, but how does it help Democrats that conservative Tea Partiers are beating moderate Establishment Republicans when the conservative base is so energized and working class voters (ie: the majority) are livid?

    • It moves the curve right which is what corporate media wants-that’s why they are cheering it.

      Of course the difference between the two parties is how quickly we wish to accelerate our leap off the cliff IMO at this point. Neither party has solutions.

      • The tea partiers being the loudest voice in the room gives O more cover to move things even more to the right.

        • The same people who couldn’t predict 9-11 even with a memo, or giving a for profit banking system a blank check resulting in looting, or a host of other things aren’t predicting that the electorates anger at what is occurring having a very negative consequence. Color me surprised- or not.

          I feel like I’ve been watching the world’s longest train wreck since at least 2000.

          • I feel like I’ve been watching the world’s longest train wreck since at least 2000.



          • You ain’t seen nothing yet.
            You’ve only seen the machines breaking down. What you’re about to see is the train hitting everything, except the military.

          • It’s already been hitting everything except the military. Places like Tennessee cut their Medicaid rolls even when a Democratic governor was in charge. Schools holding bake sales to cover book costs. First Responders money cut.

            This might accelerate things but it’s the same darn path we’ve been on since Bush was elected/selected in 2000.

          • Honk Honk!

      • It moves the curve right which is what corporate media wants-that’s why they are cheering it.


        • I don’t believe that. The Tea Party is too unpredictable. Businesses hate unpredictability and most important, the consequences of the government shutting down. Because that’s what I see. Businesses may not like the “entitlement”, but mark my word, they won’t like it when and if congress takes away the life support from the patient (the economy).

          • The tea party wants tax cuts. The tea party is anti choice. They are for legislating personal moral choices. They are anti government interference in commerce like banking, health care, auto industry. They are pro military industrial complex

            In short, they are businesses dream come true. Exactly what the GOP agenda was before Bush derailed it. They are GOP 2.0 without the taint of establishment GOP.

          • It’s not about the tea partiers though–it’s about the noise the tea partiers make giving cover to O and the DINOS as they keep moving to the right, while still faking that they are some kind of moderate by virtue of their not being as loop-de-loop as the Tea Party. Meanwhile the O machine wrings its hands, blames obstructionists, turns to its Sucker-Born-a-Minute Coalition and tells them that they have to hang on until 2012 whereafter O will reveal his true liberal trojan pony self and make all their dreams come true. And the TP won’t go at this level forever, eventually it will collapse like MoveOn did and sell out its base and then they’ll realize it was an arm of the party apparatus they thought they were challenging in the first place.

          • Well said, Wonk.

          • There are two Tea Parties just there are two Dem Parties…in each, there are the peons ( formally known as the base) and the elite…it’s pointless to talk as if either of these parties were unified. They aren’t . It’s pointless to excuse the elite excess of each with stories about the base.. Because.they are two different species with little to do with each other. Also there is no reason why the tea party can’t be both astroturf AND grass roots…again it depends on which part of the party you are speaking of….peon or elite

          • Exactly. The Tea Party candidates aren’t unpredictable at all. They’re the Kucinichs of the right. They may talk, and talk, and talk, and talk, and talk, but when they get to DC they’re not going to get any further freakier right than they’re allowed. Or than any Of the “mainstream.” The only way they really make the Establishment uncomfortable is culturally, like getting too loud and wearing synthetic fabric blends, and while they don’t like it, they’ll adapt.

      • It moves the curve right which is what corporate media wants-that’s why they are cheering it.

        Bingo! I don’t mind centrism on principle, but Obama didn’t even run as a liberal. He ran as a “centrist” and he loves that the Tea Party is going to win seats in congress, because it gives him a scapegoat for his conservative policies.

        • Double Bingo! It’s all about the big O. Obama can still claim to be liberal and the others claim its socialism. Keep the public distracted by the one liar said v. the other liar said battle, and Big Business wins.

    • As I touched on in my post this morning, the Dems think they have a better chance at defeating the loony toons. They are still unwilling to appreciate how far they themselves have sunk that loony toons can even compete with them. Reid seems to have yet to pull ahead of Angle in the polling, for instance.

      • Voting for loony toons doesn’t seem as nearly insane as voting for the same people and expecting different results.

        They are severely underestimating the anger.

        • I think a lot of people probably think, how bad can they be? If you’re representative or senator is doing a sh*tty job, how much different will it be with a tea party person? A lot of Dems have this snotty attitude towards them as well by calling them names, etc. All that does is make people rally to them all the more. Christine, the woman in Delaware, really how bad can she be? She may be everything that has been said about her. She’s one vote. She can always be voted out if the people don’t like her. What kills me is how the Repubs and the Dems hate her and think she is insane. I love it. I don’t know much of anything about her but I really don’t care. On Morning Joe they were playing a video from many years back where she was talking about masturbation. I knew both parties were upset when they brought that one out. Sarah has all these politicians really ticked off by her endorsements. The only one that is happy is Pat Buchanan. I’m laughing the whole time I’m typing this.

          • Exactly.
            I am interested in how they vote in congress when it comes to corporate vs populist interests.

          • It wasn’t just some offhand comment Christine O’Donnell made in that MTV video from the 90s… she was deeply involved with religious right nuttery.

    • Because the democratic party strategy has gotten to be vote for us because they’re scary! When you have no ideals or values and the things you promise never come true, all you can fall back on is at least we’re not THEM.

      So pick your poison, death by corporate blackmail or bat shit crazy theists. Either way, we’re fucked.

      • We probably ought to restart looking at creating an underground railroad for women and children. Things are gonna get real ugly.

      • I think it’s interesting how many women are running for the Repubs, Tea party or not….The Dems still haven’t gotten the freak’in massage! They keep sending the same old politicians, mostly white males that say they are for black and women issues. Yeah!

        • Oh, I think Democratic women did get the message. If I were a female politician, I would think twice before I threw my hat in the ring at a national level. Dems excoriate their own and won’t defend their own. I see much less of that on the right. They defend Sarah and other Republican women. I don’t see any really ugly Repub. sexism in their primaries toward their own women.
          I saw worse CDS on the left than I remember from the right.
          Or maybe it just cut deeper to see my own party pillory Hillary.

          • The Dem establishment and the activist left are anti-women. The activist right does a better job shoring up their Mama Grizzlies, but a lot of them are anti-liberal women (just three days after the 2008 election, on C-span I saw a conservative women’s panel declaring that Sarah Palin had eclipsed Hillary Clinton as the most important woman in politics and on and on). And, the GOP establishment is actually pretty sexist… and so are the Limbaughs and Becks…

            So it’s us liberal women who had Hillary, but they took her away from us, so we’re left with no one really–who is willing to step in Hillary’s place and take that abuse?

            Meanwhile the right has Sarah and Sarah has the right.

            The career liberal feminists think they’re so smart and the Mama Grizzlies are the one being controlled by the patriarchy, but really it’s not quite so. If anything, the Mama Grizzlies are getting their foot in the door while the feminist authorities on the left are unable to accept what they had in Hillary while searching for their own Palin. If only the liberal women with the platforms to reach other liberal women en masse would galvanize around Hillary and create the conditions in which she would be the nominee in 2012… but alas, that’s not what feminism or liberalism looks like today. We’re nowhere near it. The reality of the situation is the activist left is actively working against Hillary ever running again until it is too fucking late (2016) and then they expect her to be willing to go through all this shit again at age 70 to save their ungrateful asses? Why should she?

  3. I think readers here might enjoy this little piece of snark. Haw.

    NOTE RD, RL is getting under control for me now. I have not forgotten.

    • I liked this part best:

      Obama resigned, effective immediately, to become “Goodwill Ambassador” for Goldman Sachs, after turning down Oprah Winfrey’s offer to become her co-host. “Let me be clear,” said Obama in his Pay-Per-View farewell speech to a divided electorate. “My good friend Lloyd made me an offer I couldn’t refuse: A big chunk of change. And I hope someday you all get to cash in your chips just like me. Good luck, America!”

  4. No crumpets left-can’t afford them. Saltines anyone?

  5. I couldn’t agree more. The basic point that none of them seem to get is that the people are very angry…and getting very desperate. There never seems to be any viable option anymore. I hope we are not cutting off our noses to spite our face, but the message needs to be clear. We are not stupid; we are not illiterate; and we have had enough. Many of them will soon find themselves in the metaphorical unemployment line because they have completely forgotten who their employer is…

    • Yup. People are starving for populism.
      Since the Dems cut down Hillary at the knees, Tea Party populism is the only kind available.

      In my old country we have a saying that roughly translated goes: “The desperate will cling to the blade’s edge.”

      • That hurt to just read and think about! So true, and, again, so true.

        Just got a chill thinking about holding on to a blade’s edge.

    • They know the angry and they’ve said so, but they have once again failed to deliver.

    • I think people have found a channel to express anger and gum up the works. If they can’t get what they need from the ruling parties because it’s all going to corporations, then at least they can cause federal government to become dysfunctional.

      • Humans have a need to effect the world around them as Maslow talked about. If nothing they do with the Dem (or Repub) party effects their circumstances, they’ll find some other way. And negatively effecting things at some psychological level is just as good as positively effecting things.

        • And then there’s the revenge factor. You didn’t count my votes. Or you promised me the oceans would magically get lower. Well, let’s see if I can fuck you over just like you did to me. Karma baby.

  6. Watched a video at RCP of the MSNBC “boys” (Tweety, Olbermann, O’Donnell) discussing the excitement at post-election rallies: they noticed it was a lot of —oh-my-God—-WOMEN.

    Probably disappointed Hillary supporters, said Mr. Tweety. Nods from others, then even Rachel chimes in with qualified sneering.

    Jaysus, these people are daft. They do not get it at all. (Shaking head in disgust).

  7. In B0botland, a cheerleader uses yesterday’s results as a cautionary tale and asks B0bots if they envy the Republicans. It’s a push poll with 2 options

    Yes, I wish real Democrats could actually use primaries to push the party their way as well as Repukes do with their primaries –


    No, I’m willing to suck it up and accept the Ben Nelsons and other blue dogs of this world.

  8. Me, no way, never would I come back!

  9. The question I’m asking is whether the party is worth saving?

    They are supposedly for equality and yet there is majority opinion within the ranks that marriage is solely between man and a woman with nary a person standing for equality. They are supposedly for women’s choice and yet the party leadership allowed the anti choice crowd to hi jack health care. Additionally, they made it harder for low income women to have access to reproductive choice like birth control pills. They are supposedly for labor and yet they have let card check stagnate, made UAW retirees eat an awful deal to get a snippet of what they gave the banking industry no questions asked, and the list goes on and on.

    Frankly, I’m ready to let the party go the way of the dodo. If they can’t stand for their party plank then I see no reason for their existence.

    • My point being the cancer is much, much larger then Barack Obama.

      The LEADERSHIP within the party chose the guy. The same people who refuse to fight on issues like equality, choice, labor, etc,etc.

      • Yup. I don’t see either part as being worth much. They’d sell their grandmother for a better shot at reelection.

      • Obama was picked by Big Money to President because he is apolitical, amoral, and utterly corrupt. Perhaps they realized that under his superficial charm was a empty suit with a severe case of anti-social personality disorder….a one termer who would severely damage the Democratic Darty Brand.

        Obama is just the symptom of the rot and corruption that infests the Dem party leadership. He is the minor stomach ache when it’s really the cancer that will kill you.

        • He wasn’t just picked by big money. He was picked by Pelosi(who allowed women’s reproduction to be stripped from stimulus and Stupak to control debate) and by Reid(who has been hunky dory with stalling card check and allowing the Nelsons of the party to dictate what is and isn’t done in the Senate).

          The party has only a handful of people who dare to even utter that marriage is a civil institution and it is between whoever the state allows it to be between and only after you’ve paid the fees. The party has over 60 anti choice zealots in the House. Someone has already taken up Stupak’s cause. The list goes on and on.

          • Honk, honk!
            Both parties need to dissolve into nothingness. I don’t see anyone who stands up for anything. The two years of Obama and the D congress has demonstrated that it doesn’t matter which party is in charge.

  10. Could it be that the Big Money, Wall Street, Banksters, et al funded a large part of the nearly $1 billion to elect this narcissistic stooge for just this very result. The few liberal Dems were bought off/threatened and now with the once dead Rethug party revived by the messiah will accelerate the big money agenda.

    • The pockets they have been picking are getting awful empty.

      I shudder to think of the stupidity of the ruling class if they think they can continue to accelerate everything to the upper 5% forever without consequences.

      • The elites seem to operate on the idea that “there is a lot of ruin in a nation.” This is a game to them. They are like compulsive gamblers.

      • Indeed. But if one looks to history, the elite can’t help themselves…they could know absolutely it would lead to a crumbling of the system they completely rely on and they would STILL do it . This is boiler plate End of Empire stuff we are seeing….they can pliage else where, so they pillage at home

        • dang it

          I meant they ” can’t ” pillage else where, so they pillage at home. The wars are really about pillaging the treasury here as much as stealing the oil

          • I don’t know about that … ever seen a NIKE factory in China or Vietnam?

          • Yes, it’s true that Asian workers get starvation wages, but that’s not where the money is made. It’s selling those products to developed countries at regular price. Maybe a little lower, but not much. Here is the thing. When all those products are brought to a developed nation, the same elite who own everything make money in each portion of the “cost”, the raw materials, the finished product, the shipping and the selling.

      • Pre-Tax income to the upper 1% peaked in 1928 and is at about the same % now with the upper 1% having 24%. The lowest was 1976 at 8.9%. What we are seeing now is the result of “Reagan economics”. The only major reversal in the trend was during the Clinton years.

        In 2007 (much worse now), the 1% had 42.7% of the financial wealth, the top 20% had 93% and the “bottom” 80% had the remaining 7%. Just like the Republican age from 1874 to 1933…and now 1980 to 201?, the big money parasites ultimately debilitate or kill the host.

        • I don’t believe that 24% is right. Most income is shelved (deferred income) and is never reported. The 24% is only for the income that’s on paper.

          • income and wealth are 2 different animals.

            Wealth includes the value of everything. Houses, stocks, income, personal property of value.

            Income, is, well, income alone. Usually derived from labor. A good portion of the ruling class probably don’t technically even need an income at this point. They certainly seem to think labor is icky and undeserving and ungrateful.

            I swear if I hear the meme again that poor people don’t create jobs as a reason to support the upper 5% continuing to sop us dry I’ll scream. The rich don’t create jobs out of the goodness of their hearts, they do it to generate profit.

  11. HST:

    “Fear and Loathing at the Super Bowl”

    “When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.”

  12. The Democratic leadership made their choice when they installed Obama as their savior. They made their choice when a Donna Brazilla said on CNN that they no longer needed the traditonal base [working class Americans], that this was the “New” Demicratic Party of the urbane, cosmopolitan voter.

    How’s that working out, Donna?

    Of course, the working class is steamed. They were one of the first groups thrown under the bus. And what does that say for the Dems? Traditonally, the Democratic Party stood shoulder-to-shoulder with the working man and woman.

    Now, they’re with the fat cats and their Republican colleagues. The Dems sold their souls, and that’s why they’re failing. And frankly, I have no pity for them.

  13. As long as people call themselves Democrats and talk about non-Democrats as “loony tunes,” this problem will continue.

    As long as Democrats think there is a qualitative and meaningful difference among the various Democrat politicians (Obama, HR Clinton, Kucinich, etc) and that what matters is choosing the “right Democrat,” this problem will continue.

    It’s high time for Dem-faithful Americans to realize they’ve been conned, on a long con and on a short grift, by their “team”. However, it seems most can’t bother considering that their partisan allegiance has been a mistake. After all, it’s America, where the Super Bowl is worshiped, and Dem vs Repub is the Super Bowl of politics.

    Why not have a little self-respect, instead of fabricating a hollow, fraudulent pretense at self-respect courtesy of denigrating the non-Democrats of America?

    If you want things to change, then try to understand what drives people to be partisan rather than allowing them to see what they have in common with the “other team.” If you don’t know why YOU are partisan, you’ll never understand why the “other team” is made up of opposite partisans.

    Society isn’t Us vs Them, it’s We Together.

    Sadly, Democrat-loyalists can’t grasp this fact. Too much of their identity is tied up in being allied with the Best Boys of Brilliance, the meritocratic morons of the Democratic party.

    • I don’t call myself a Democrat.

      However, I do believe in calling things as I see them

      When you consider masturbation a PUBLIC platform, your position is loony tunes. What’s next? Sharia law?

      When you call someone who gives public money to private entities a socialist- you’re looney tunes, or at the very least ill informed on what socialism is.

      When you call a government run health care system a death panel but fail to recognize that a system that makes its profit off denying care repeatedly out of hopes you won’t appeal- yep, looney tunes.

      When you fail to point out to the electorate that cutting taxes means cutting services and allow them to believe they can have their cake and eat it too-you are either dishonest or looney tunes.

      Sorry gotta call em’ like I see em’

      • On the other hand, it wasn’t the Tea Partiers who Stupak’d you. It was your own Dems.

        • If I wouldn’t vote for Stupak then why in the world would I vote for someone who shares his philosophical viewpoint? I wouldn’t(and his philosophy is what the tea party appears to stand for)

          They aren’t MY Dems, haven’t been for a long while, if ever.

      • Excellent points,cwaltz. The fact that I’m mad as hell with the current Democratic leadership doesn’t mean I’m suddenly a conservative Republican or Tea Party cheerleader. I am a liberal who, because of the current direction of my traditional party, is wandering the wilderness.

        The Republicans have no new ideas beyond they’re not Obamacrats. And the Tea Party? I’m not sure what they’re for except lower taxes, prayer groups and being angry. I have yet to hear any real policy ideas coming from any of these people. Lots of complaints. cliches and patriotic postering. Sorry, but that will not improve the economy or produce jobs. And if all social services are eliminated that means they’ll be eliminated for everyone, even the Tea Party folks.

        Be careful what you wish for.

        Particularly, when a humongous amount of the Nation’s wealth is being used to fight useless wars, prop up corrupt governments and continue an Imperial presence around the world. Not to mention the corporate welfare, bailouts and wooing our politicians are invested in.

        And yes, the socialist meme is getting old. I’d suggest people check out the definition of fascism. It’s a much better fit to what we’re seeing right now, from both sides of the aisle: government, industry and the media, destructive triplets joined at the hip.

        I hate to say it, but I suspect Chris Hedges may be right: the deed is already done and there will be no cure coming from DC.

        • “I’d suggest people check out the definition of fascism. It’s a much better fit to what we’re seeing right now, from both sides of the aisle: government, industry and the media, destructive triplets joined at the hip.”

    • Oh please. I’m not a Democrat, and I’ve rejected the current Democratic party under this leadership. Angle and O’Donnell aren’t just “non-Democrats” (and that’s not even a bad thing to be), they say nutty things about turning a pregnancy that results from rape into lemonade and jerking off is a sin.

      They aren’t my primary concern anyway. If you had noticed, the point about using the term loony toons was to mock the Democrats for having to compete with people they consider loony toons, rather than mocking the right. But, you’re so busy trying to look for a fair and balanced point of view from someone who IS a liberal, that you don’t even notice when a liberal is criticizing a Democrat.

    • Democratic loyalists?

      You’re kidding right?

      About half this site voted for a Republican in 2008 because ideologically they saw Obama as a conservative and they preferred the real conservative to one who’d enact a conservative agenda while parading as a liberal.

      You’re preaching to the choir.

      • Er, I did it as a protest vote. Otherwise, I’d never voluntarily vote Republican. Altho, I did hope that having McCain in th WH and a Democratic Congress would make Democrats more resistant to Republican craziness.

        • The point is that you didn’t choose party loyalty.

          Many of us chose to vote for McCain instead of the Democrat.(In my case as above noted because I preferred conservative policy be enacted by conservative rather than taint liberalism)

          The idea that because you call people behaving like looney tunes that it must be because you are a loyalist is as fake as the idea that there are only two choices when there are many more than two.

        • That was exactly my reasoning, as well.

      • I think that number might be low. I still can’t believe I didn’t vote for the Dem, oh that’s right, there wasn’t one on the ticket!

  14. OT a bit: here’s Bill Clinton in Cleveland yesterday:
    “The Republican argument is this stimulus was obviously a failure because we’re not out of the woods. To believe that, you’ve got to be so mad you can’t think.”


    Note that they didn’t have to grab people off the streets to fill the room.

    • That article is full of chewy goodness. A zillion messages fir the discerning reader.

    • Dear Bill:

      I’m mad as hell but I can think just fine.

      It’s not only Republicans who are calling the stimulus a failure. Obama’s stimulus didn’t work; everybody down here in the trenches can see that.

      I trust you’re enjoying your new mansion.


      A Former Democrat

      • Zal, did you read the entire article? Just wondering.

        I think Bill is just trying to work in an anti-government to keep people from going off the anti-government deepend. We’ve gone back to square zero, before where we were when Bill had gotten people to see that good Democratic policy and good governance are not mutually exclusive at all, in fact, the success of both is mutually dependent on each other.

        And, here is the fuller context of that stimulus quote:

        “The Democrats are saying something like this: ‘We found a big hole that we did not dig. We didn’t get it filled in 21 months, but at least we quit digging,” Mr. Clinton said. “Give us two more years. If it doesn’t work, vote us out.’•”

        Mr. Clinton said two-thirds of the 2009 $787 billion stimulus plan was spent just “to help you tread water and not drown in that big hole you were in.”

        “It did work. It just wasn’t enough to dig us out of the hole ,” Mr. Clinton said. “The Republican argument is this stimulus was obviously a failure because we’re not out of the woods. To believe that, you’ve got to be so mad you can’t think.”

        And remember:
        In the 2008 Democratic presidential primary, Mr. Strickland was a strong supporter of Mr. Clinton’s wife, Hillary Clinton, in her presidential bid.

        Mr. Clinton alluded to that support, but said his wife, as secretary of state, is barred from political activity.

        • Mr. Clinton alluded to that support, but said his wife, as secretary of state, is barred from political activity

          Thank God…because other wise she would be run ragged all over the country trying to save Dem numb nuts who cheerfully stabbed her in the back two years ago…I’m spared that sight in any case

        • It did work. It just wasn’t enough to dig us out of the hole ,” Mr. Clinton said.

          If Clinton really believes this I say he’s wrong.

          The evidence I’ve seen indicates it did NOT work. And I am not pleased that either he doesn’t know that or that he’ll lie about it.

          IMO if Clinton wants to protect against anti-Democratic and anti-government sentiment he would do well to tell the truth about the economy.

          • CBO, iirc, among others who’ve analyzed the numbers, say the unemployment rate would have remained high or gotten higher without the stimulus.

            Now, Obama et al could have done the stimulus in such as way that more jobs were created, but they wanted to be bipartisan and also cater to the ConservaDems, Wall Street, and Blue Dogs. Thus, the stimulus was too small and aimed too much at long term projects in roads, etc.

            They sucked at the stimulus, but it did keep some people in jobs and did get some people into jobs.

            Just not enough.

            And, now, both Obama and the Congressional Dems are cowed.

          • I think he’s right. Without the stimulus, we might have had a full on Great Depression of a very serious nature. It’s like they stopped the bleeding of a critically I’ll person in the emergency room. The guy didn’t die, but he’s going to be on life support for a long time unless they can cure him.

          • Clinton said, “It did work,” so in order to assess if it “worked,” I’m considering the problem that the stimulus was intended to address.

            If all the popular Dem President and supermajority Dem Congress, with the wind and the media at their back, intended with their slim window of near-absolute power was to keep the economy on life support, I say that’s a monumental failure of intent. If they intended to take action to at least BEGIN to address the severe structural deterioriation and set our economy in a healthier direction I say the evidence is it did not work.

            If Clinton wants to combat the notion that voters can’t trust Dems to use government to help solve problems, IMO insisting that Obama’s stimulus “worked” is a bad strategy — except for go-alongs who’ll believe what he says, regardless of what they see around them, just because it’s him saying it. The stimulus made or kept some jobs temporarily, and, at that, only in a very narrow part of the overall employment picture. And this temporary narrow fix cost a trillion dollars of more debt. That’s like a big tree falling on your deterioriating office building, ripping through the roof and you pulling out your credit card to fix it with fantastically expensive tarp and masking tape. I say that doesn’t deserve to be defended as having worked.

            As for what the CBO or anybody else says would have happened without the stimulus, that’s nothing but fantasy, and there is insufficient data about what did happen as a direct result of the stimulus to come up with even a decently informed guess.

            If Obama’s stimulus “worked,” if Clinton is telling Americans that Obama’s stimulus is an example of how Dems can use government to help solve big problems, I say smart Americans will determine Dems deserve a big no-confidence vote. I know that’s what I’ve decided.

        • Appears to me that Jerry Brown was right after all, with his last quotes anyway. Bill can be full of it. Cause, can we just fact it, a load of old Democratic pork that they had wanted to earmark for years and some tax cuts didn’t solve a damn thing.

          What it may have succeeded in doing is convince a lot more people that stimulus in general won’t work and that it false. It’s also a shame but making a silk purse out of that sow’s ear will not fly.

          • Bill’s obviously doing some partisan stumping here for a guy who backed Hillary and he’s making the point that the stimulus wasn’t big enough. If people want to focus on his saying two words (“it worked” ) as part of a statement where he qualified it to mean that it didn’t work *enough*, I can understand disagreement, but what’s the point at directing anger toward Bill at this point? It’s not like most Americans are going to change their opinion anyway just because he says it, it’s too late for him to convince people that their own eyes are lying to them, and it’s not like Bill Clinton can leverage much power without playing a grandfather role to the party in the time being.

            The Clintons are smart and they will not give Obama and the Dems one inch to blame Hillary or Bill for Obama and the Dems’ own mess that they created. Bill and Hillary are making the best case that they can as loyal Democrats. So if/when the voters reject it anyway, it’s not the Clintons’ fault. This is much more handy to us than Bill (and Hill) squandering their power base to oppose O just for the immediate satisfaction of it. The Clintons are Democrats and their power base is tied to the Democratic party. They aren’t going to break free from the party. That is not who the Clintons are. If they were ever going to break from the party, May 31, 2008 would have been the day for them to do it. They didn’t.

          • Nobody is suggesting the Clintons break with the Democratic Party or say anything at this point that criticizes Obama.

            Bill Clinton is a consummate politician and ought to be able to spin the last two years in a positive light for Democrats without lying or appearing to be deluded about whether or not the stimulus “worked.”

            You say I’m focusing on “his saying two words,” as if they’re throw-away words but those three words, “It did work,” are very specific and directly to the point; they’re substantive, not incidental. And I not only disagree with it, as a long-time and continuing Clinton supporter and Democrat (ok I lied – I’m not a “former” Democrat … yet) and American voter he’s insulting my intelligence by saying it.

          • Well, he’s an amazingly gifted politician, but he’s not a miracle worker. The past two years aren’t exactly easy to spin.

          • He can hardly say, “It didn’t work at all and it was ill-conceived from the start,” because he doesn’t believe that, plus he’d be stepping all over his message. You can bet that The fact that he flat out stated it wasn’t enough didn’t go unnoticed and a fair segment of the political establishment isn’t happy about it. He’s addressing the monumental failure of intent, and in a way most Democrats are afraid to. Really, what could he say?

          • Really, what could he say?

            If he can’t find something positive to say about the stimulus that’s truthful then he could say nothing at all about the stimulus.

            Good politicians are expert at answering direct questions without ever addressing what the question asked. Clinton wasn’t even asked a question. He doesn’t have to say anything about the stimulus legislation.

            Maybe I’ve been misreading posts here but over the past many months I was under the impression that most here agree with me that Obama’s stimulus was a very expensive failure.

            2008 was a steep learning curve for me, and in recognizing the dangerousness of it in Obamabots I recognized that I myself sometimes defend those I care about when they don’t deserve it, and as best as I’ve been able gave up supporting personality- or party-politics. I’m a big supporter of both Clintons, and I wish more than anything that Hillary were President right now. And if she ever runs again for anything I’ll give the maximum I can give in every way. But I’m not going to excuse either of them lying, or defend any delusions they express about the effectiveness of certain legislation. I believe my principles and the Clintons themselves deserve better from me, and I believe my criticism of Obama would be weakened to the point of hypocrisy if I give the Clintons a pass for the same kind of stuff I criticize Obama for.

          • But his basic point was that the stimulus did not go far enough. He really couldn’t make that point without addressing the stimulus.

            Look, I’m sorry, but we have an honest disagreement here. You’re entitled to think that we’re going “My Clinton, Right or Wrong,” but we’re not. The story in my opinion is “Bill Clinton says stimulus did not go far enough,” and the fact that he didn’t include some kind of dissertation on what he would have done, what else Obama should have done, how the stimulus didn’t work even a little bit ever is unrealistic to expect and a distraction from the actual point he was trying to make. We may be wrong, but we do believe it. To you it’s not a throwaway build up to the main point, and
            you’re entitled to that opinion, but to me, it is. I believe he probably believes it’s true to an extent and he couldn’t have made his point
            without putting it out there. He didn’t say the stimulus worked better than any program ever instituted, he said it worked, but.

          • Well either we disagree that it worked –I adamantly believe it did not but maybe you believe it did– or you’re defending Clinton for lying or delusion about the stimulus working. Qualifying with a “but” doesn’t change his forthright assertion: “It did work.”

            I never said he should provide a dissertation or any kind of explanation, I only said he shouldn’t say something worked if it didn’t. I’ve said the same about Obama and nobody here disputed it.

  15. And don’t blame them for this choice. It’s not because they’re stupid. It isn’t that they don’t understand that they are only hurting themselves. It’s that the Democrats give them no alternatives

    The plan all a long. Whoever is in, it’s a win/win for the elite…and when they have finally turned the US into Mad Max Thunder Dome,then they get to call marshall law on us…sweet

    Everyone has their hand out

    Lord..I’m so tired of this “do you want fries with that ” market place. I avoid buying at times because at the check out , I can’t face the gauntlet of being interrogated about a saving card, email crap, contest slickers on and on…can I just pay for my freaking item and leave ??? Noooo and then out side the store more shilling…LORD, my last nerve has teeth marks.

    • You are so right, Paper Doll. I feel sorry for the check out clerks, who are given no choice but to harass people, but one would think the corporations would figure out that the stressful shopping experience will only drive more people to the internet. The pharmacy chains are the worst I think, and it’s hard to avoid them if you need something immediately….which is probably why they keep doing it…they know we have to keep going to them.

      Yet another example of our exhausting corporatist environment.

      • The corporations will be very happy if you shop internet. Lower cost flows to the bottom line dollar for dollar. A simple “no” works every time because the employees are simply doing their job. They don’t care and they don’t push.

        • Buy local, and buy only what you need. No hassles that way.

          • I’m talking about my local…which is chains stores like much of the US . Mom amdf Pop took a powder awhile ago…sadly.

          • I agree. The big stores close to home are better than the internet. Force the corporations to keep a mall location to sell and employ local people.

        • They don’t push? Where do you shop? I want to go there! lol!

          • Regular places. I don’t need to name them because they are well known. It’s true that every time I buy something they ask me if I want their credit card or give them my email, etc. I say no thanks. I don’t want another credit card and I don’t like spam. That’s the end of it.

          • Some are nice and don’t push, but others can’t stop talking about the rewards and this and that and it’s really frustrating. I’m just like okay thanks for the infomercial in person, but no thanks…

      • I do feel sorry for the check out clerks Lord knows…

        The pharmacy chains are the worst I think, and it’s hard to avoid them if you need something immediately

        You have ESP. It was a pharmacy chain this morning that pushed me into rant….email sign up , a super saver card and a freaking contest….all at once For the love of God , just take my money!! lol!

      • Yep, the corporatist culture, in all its manifestations, is the #1 reason this country is going straight to Hell. 👿

  16. “If the blogger boyz could actually bother to get to know them, they’d understand what kind of pressure the working class is under….”


    This “fringe” is messy & well very American….

    thoughtful essay…Well Done

  17. Spammy is holding me hostage again

  18. “The Democrats appear to be headed for political impotence.”

    So interesting to do a review…



    Hillary Clinton was a Democrat. I mean, I knew that. She still is.
    So interesting to see how things have played out in terms of the above three.
    Ummm, hmmmm.

  19. Over at Corrente, PA_Lady has a dynamite catch about Pennsylvania’s Office of Homeland Security monitoring the activities of anti-fracking activists and sending notices of their meetings and even a showing of the documentary film, Gasland, to…get this,, BP…the gas companies!!

    Gov. Ed Rendell said that he did not know about this on the part of PA’s Homeland Security Office and says he ordered it stopped. Oh, and guess what, those monitoring the anti-fracking folks were private contractors.

    Wonder what other states’ arms of government security are doing….

    Wonder who’s being watching down along the Gulf Coast. Surely, BP had to have been given heads up and information, given how closely they work with the Coast Guard and state and local authorities.

    Has fascism, the combined rule of corporations and the state, arrived…and we just weren’t sent an announcement?

    • Has fascism, the combined rule of corporations and the state, arrived…and we just weren’t sent an announcement?

      yeah, pretty much

    • Thanks for the heads up. That’s worth looking into.

    • “Has fascism, the combined rule of corporations and the state, arrived…and we just weren’t sent an announcement?”

      Sadly, I think the answer is “yes.” It didn’t start with Obama or even GW. I think it’s been creeping in on cat’s feet for the last 30-40 years. The Obamacrats have merely brought the idea out of the shadows, given it flesh and blood.

      The “New” Democratic Party. Who would have thunk it?

  20. I’m liberal so I hope the Democratic party dies and stays dead. I want a political party with liberal values and policies and fights tooth and nail for them. Instead we have an alliterative pro monopoly corporatist party that makes noises like they’re liberal on occasion, but never push for liberal polices. Real fiscal conservatives likely feel the same about the other pro monopoly corporatist party. Neither party is on anyone’s side that isn’t a millionaire.

    Rocking the cart via protest votes, third party votes, or similar is about all we have right now. If we fuck with them enough, maybe things will change.

    • Choosing between the two parties in power is like being asked to choose between death by lethal injection or firing squad.

      No thanks, Democratic and Republican party. I’m choosing to live.

  21. Kelly Ayotte certified as winner in New Hampshire GOP Senate primary, narrowly defeating Ovide Lamontagne.

  22. And who are we going to vote for then later on? We only have a 2 party system to choose from and so if we become disappointed w/ one party, the only alternative we have is to vote the opposite party. That is why it is imperative for the Tea Party movement to become a viable third party, not a rebel party w/in the Republican Party.

    If they(the Tea Party) matures into a separate party after its troubled adolescence, then we as the voters would have a 3rd choice.The only problem is it will take years for them to mature and there would be a lot of obstacles to hurdle. And with the involvement of a small? percentage of the American People(who makes noises to be recognized, one of the signs of a budding adolescence) and a person who has the guts to direct the Party(Sarah Palin), mark my word, the Tea Party could become a viable 3rd party later

    • and as long as they are funded by John Birchers, count me out. I may be angry but I haven’t gone mad.

      • count me out too. If others want to join a big Tea Partier tee pee, that’s up to them. Where the TP’s funding comes from shows through in how far their rhetoric is allowed to veer off into hatewing rhteoric. They showed their true colors over the Park 51 debate by ginning up a volatile controversy over a Muslim version of a YMCA a couple blocks from GZ. Some defenders of the Constitution they are.

        • yup, and small government doesn’t include an obsession with what goes on between people legs and in their bodies.

          • It’s GOP 2.0

            No government regulation of anything that generates a profit for the upper class but plenty of flag burning amendments. No money for social programs but plenty to bomb the scary brown people. No money for infrastructure needs to lower taxes.

            It’s gonna be a disaster AGAIN. It was bad policy before, it’s bad policy now.

          • I think what the tea party has turned out to be is the really angry, right wing, theocratic side of the party who don’t think the GOP has done enough to send Mexicans back to Mexico, persecuted any one who isn’t Christian and straight, and basically turn this country into the Christian version of taliban afghanistan including measures to put women in those home made frumpy dresses and braids instead of burqas. oh, and they’re greedy as hell. They want their money and their good roads and police and social security and medicare too. And, they want us to fund their wacky religious schools with taxpayer dollars. You notice they’re removing establishment and moderate republicans, not the wack jobs.

          • “You notice they’re removing establishment and moderate republicans, not the wack jobs.”
            The political cleansing of the Rethug party began after the Goldwater defeat. The few remaining old GOP who “play the game” but don’t believe the nonsense can now be counted on one hand. That is major reason why the Democratic Party is now much more corrupt than the Rethugs. Few, is any House Dems stood by their beliefs and no Dem Senator did

            The GOP is now the Theocratic party and they believe their un-American nonsense.

        • via TPM:

          O’Donnell In 1996: ‘Just As Much, If Not More’ Proof For Creationism Than Evolution

          As Dan Amira at New York magazine dug up, O’Donnell appeared in March 1996 on a CNN panel discussion with Dr. Michael McKinney, a professor of evolutionary biology from the University of Tennessee-Chattanooga.

          At one point, O’Donnell provided this definition: “Well, creationism, in essence, is believing that the world began as the Bible in Genesis says, that God created the Earth in six days, six 24-hour periods. And there is just as much, if not more, evidence supporting that.”

          O’Donnell opened the discussion saying: “Well, as the senator from Tennessee mentioned [Note: it is not clear from the Nexis transcript who is being referred to here], evolution is a theory and it’s exactly that. There is not enough evidence, consistent evidence to make it as fact, and I say that because for theory to become a fact, it needs to consistently have the same results after it goes through a series of tests. The tests that they put- that they use to support evolution do not have consistent results. Now too many people are blindly accepting evolution as fact. But when you get down to the hard evidence, it’s merely a theory.”

          Obviously, she doesn’t understand the difference between a theory and a hypothesis that can never be proven. She should probably spend some time with scientists for a change.

          • Creationists drive me crazy.

            Even if you disprove evolution, it doesn’t by default prove creationism. There’s a reason it’s called FAITH.

          • I’d vote for her because she’s cute, and her views on sexuality are precious. Most politicians bore me, but she’d keep me awake if she keeps her campaign speeches are about her views on sexuality. It’s precious.

          • “Here’s a 90s video where she is talking about her major concern at that time: she opposed masturbation.”

            I really like that last line of hers. This is why she doesn’t like masturbation.

            “If he already knows what pleases him and can please himself, then why am I in the picture?”

            Because, apparently, her only purpose in the relationship is to provide a little friction, and the only way she can improve on her man’s experience is by keeping him ignorant. So yes, why is she in the picture?


      • I agree. Ian Welsh has an interesting take on the primary results here, but especially check the comments.

        • Yes, look who is commenting there, one of your old faves, Lambert.


          Yes, yes you do. A president appropriating the ability to kill particular individuals is still not fascism. It may be utterly reprehensible, dangerous, and counter to the ostensible principles of the country’s governing system, but it’s hardly the bottom of the barrel.

          Big influence on Anglachel too….

          • Since when is sending a drone to kill a US citizen without due process not fascism?

          • Since when is sending a drone to kill a US citizen without due process not fascism?
            In the same way that there really wasn’t any difference between Hitler, Stalin, Mao or Idi Amin.

          • A nice one from Avedon…


            “One member of the DLC’s executive council is none other than Koch Industries…”

            The Koch’s have both parties locked up.

          • To be fair, on this one mandos is right. Trolling for learned helplessness isn’t my thing, but that’s not to say that they aren’t right twice a day….

        • Reply to Lambert,

          What do you mean? I can’t believe you agree with Mandos that the President claiming the right to target and assassinate U.S. citizens isn’t fascism. I guess there must be some technicality you’re basing that on. But it sounds like you’re justifying what Obama has done. I can hardly believe it!

  23. Another good tweet from Daou


    Dems shouldn’t be laughing at the Tea Party’s extremism, they should be laboring to figure out how to change voters’ beliefs #p2 #tcot

    • Honk. That’s much more like it from Daou. Way better than his “low-info” labeling the other day.

      • Wasn’t “low-info, low class” one of the claims Obots made to describe the working class they didn’t need anymore?

        Try to remember how offensive that was, and how WMCB explained how it DROVE the very voters the Bots needed, away.

        They’re screwed, now. Oh well.

        • Mary, it wasn’t just WMCB who explained it, though yes she does a fine job at it. I have been commenting and posting about the “low info” meme’s destructiveness for a very long time. That’s why I’ve been criticizing Daos’s use of it. He’s one of the good ones and he’s better than that. His point is actually the opposite of the “low info” label anyway. So he shouldn’t use it.

          • So have I, Wonk, even while posters here have called them bigots, raycists, Astroturf, ignorant , wackos, religious nuts.

            WMCB nailed it, over and over. That namecalling has driven the voters away, and if Tea Partiers et al win in November, whether ya like em or not, the cause was always easy to see, and warnings went unheeded. Too late now.

            Glad to see Peter Dau coming around, finally.

          • I have warned about this from the beginning, Mary. The tea party’s ideas and ideology and rhetoric are anathema to me, but I have stood up here on this blog time and time again and said that labeling an entire swath of people a raycist mob simply for exercising their right to dissent is not going to cut it, it will only make some of the stragglers amongs the disaffected Dem lot more sympathetic to the tea partier message. I have argued again and again that we need to counter the tea parties’ ideas with BETTER ideas from our side instead of getting caught up in bogus socialist/teabagger culture wars that are utterly meaningless, semantic messaging war BS and only help the oligarchy distract from what they are doing while the grassroots are being pit against each other.

  24. Has Tim Kaine made his big announcement that is going to fire up the Democrats yet? Is he waiting for the nightly news, or did I miss something?

  25. PPP says:


    The good news for Ayotte is that Hodes isn’t particularly popular either. His favorability numbers are nearly identical to hers with 35% of voters seeing him positively to 46% with a negative opinion.

    Looking at their head to head match up both candidates pretty much have their party base locked up and Ayotte’s breaking the tie with a strong advantage among independents. Hodes is getting 85% of Democrats while Ayotte’s getting 83% of Republicans. She’s up 51-37 with those independents.

  26. most on this site saw all this coming when BO came into office. We said he has a two year window to get it done…he then took over a year of that time just to deliver us to the insurance companies in chains….( seems it should not have taken that long! ) the rest of the time has been shoring up and pushing forward Bush 2 policies . Now the window has closed and Dems can go back to doing what they do best: caving to a GOP house and Senate while telling us the great things they will do when in office. It’s so compleat a failure, I cannot say it wasn’t planned to work out this way .

    • *dons freshly folded, outrageously stylish chapeau de Reynolds Wrap*

      Doll–I often suspect it was planned to work out that way. The Malefactors Of Great Wealth realized they could not install another Elephascist (aka GOP) Prez without rigging the elections past the limits of plausible deniability. They needed a pliable,corporate-lackey DINOcrat to throw the game after s/he won the White House–and if s/he could wreck SS in the process, bonus!

      I expect since Hillary was the frontrunner at the time, the MOGW went to her with this devil’s bargain first, and she told them to go Cheney themselves. 😉

      That’s when “Hillary The Inevitable” became “Hillary The Impossible”.

      Alas, Obummer WAS willing to sell his soul, and so here we are. 👿

      At least since the “election” of 2000, if you’re not paranoid, you’re not paying attention.

      • tinfoil on:

        I wonder if they gave Hillary the green light to run knowing they would run O against her. A smart populist woman is the perfect scapegoat to push a historic male empty suit through… and they needed “O defeats the Clinton machine” talking point to prop him up.

        tinfoil off.

      • Hey, I can out chapeau de Reynolds Wrap ya…I think it was always going to be Obama and he has been groomed for this since at least 2004. Too many things were in place years ahead for him in ’08 for it to be otherwise .

        The “Hillary The Inevitable” became “Hillary The Impossible” idea took off, imo, when they saw how easily they could make her AA voters leave her in the rear view mirror …who’s ever actually running the show knows people…that’s the extra scary part

        Because The “Hillary The Inevitable” was always gonna be turned into “Hillary The Impossible” …no matter how

        • But if Rove was behind the scenes chatting up with this BFF Donna B. during the election, what better way to get the disputed Republican Party (not an outsider like McCain who would even take public financing to show his independence), back in power than to alienate many of the real Dems (including backbone women in the Party) and to have an oversold unqualified take the prize. How else to get back than to have the booby-prize candidate thrown the prize. The Nobel Peach Prize was just icing on the cake.

  27. Is that circle D for desperate? WOWSERS! It reminds me of a dude ranch. But then again, I need a vacation.

  28. The Oborg thought they were electing Benjamin Sisko, when they were actually electing Wesley Crusher. 😉

    Yeah, I’m flogging this meme. :mrgreen:

    • Kind of a bad analogy. Let’s check, the Wesley Crusher character was the smartest person in the room, regardless of age, and it turns out had god like powers and could time travel with his mind. I think if that’s how you’re characterizing Obama, you might not be hitting the mark.

      • I was going for the “callow youth” angle, plus the “Everybody Hates Wesley” angle, but yeah, you make sense.

        Hmmm…how about Obummer as Harry Mudd, for the “con artist” angle? 😉

  29. Since, the Dems have had the circular firing squad in place for a while. It is nice to have the logo to prove it….eh….Brazile?

    Edgeoforever…….That D’oh comment was priceless. You really find the gems over there….Thanks.

  30. OMG! Roland the idiot just said on CNN that it’s not the job of the president to change things. Priceless.

  31. Wow, what a day. I just came back from the funeral of one of my daughter’s friends…the boy was only 11(killed in a car accident) and I have to say that it was very difficult to see all those young kids (about 90 of them) following that casket up the hill to be buried. But it really made me think…what sort of future do these kids have going for them? What kind of prosperity can they look forward to?

    I live in a North Georgia town that was hit extremely bad by the housing bust. Everyone was employed in one way or another in the housing industry. There are a lot of Tea Party people in my area…they are pissed off. This is the real point to all this is simple. People… the working class people….(or as W.R.Hearst used to say “the people who’s mouths move when they read”) are not the only ones who find themselves so angry and disgusted with the current political and economic situation. There are a bunch of educated and underemployed people that make up a big portion of the Tea Party. To think that the results of this primary are a sign of something “good” for the Democrats is ridiculous. (I don’t care how “snazzy” that new logo is for Democrats…snark big time.) RD is right…I don’t think the party can be saved. Too much water under the bridge. And it seems to me that the descent that is building away from both parties, the Dems and GOP (from Tea Partiers to any other political party out there now) People are mad as hell and they aren’t going to take it anymore. Both parties should wake up…cause it looks like the population is getting restless.

    • Sorry to hear about your daughter’s friend.

      I agree with your assessment. I think the anger is very high, and the demographic of that is completely misunderstood by the prog talking heads.

      Tweetie just said he thought the anger of the people was going to burn out by the election. Really tweetie? People without jobs and health care and loosing their homes are going to get less mad?

      Saying they are clueless is an insult to the clueless.

      • The anger I see is wide and deep, and I live in an area that has thus far largely escaped the recession. But, one thing everyone knows is we won’t escape for that much longer.

    • And not just water under the bridge, nowhere to turn. Looking around, no one in the party who isn’t a member of the Clinton family gets it. There’s no trust, no one with a clue, and little hope. The Democrats fell all over themselves to create a situation that can’t be undone very easily or very quickly. A John Edwards style epiphany didn’t work out very well for him the first time, even. Sorry for your loss.

    • Anyone who receives a paycheck is working class.
      Doesn’t matter how much education you have or how many degrees.

      • I like Barbara Ehrenreich’s definition: if you are paid wages rather than a salary, you belong to the working class.

        Yeah, Babs was assimilated into the Oborg Collective, but she said this before that happened.

  32. There are no good alternatives, but at least the Tea Party candidates are so unfit for office that they too will be swept out in a few election cycles. But in the meantime we need a massive purge of the Democratic Party of a sort that’s sweeping the GOP. So Rove is a persona non-grata? Can’t wait until the same thing happens to Rahm and the guy with the moustache.

    I have no fear of fascism in this country. It is far too diverse ethnically, its women are well educated and heavily engaged politically, for any fascist movement to gain traction. Tea Party? Flash in a pan. Already this morning a theocrat and a tax-cutter were having a tiff on NPR over what the tea party stands for.

    So the next few election cycles will be rocky, hopefully rocky enough to unsettle both political establishments and allow some genuine people’s representatives to take office and set things back on track once again.

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