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I got your three percent right here


Greg Sargent:

The latest from Public Policy Polling illustrates this as dramatically as you could want:

Dennis Kucinich’s flip on the health care vote this morning is symbolic of a broader shift among liberals. Last month 73% said they supported the plan with 19% opposed. Now 89% say they support the plan with only 3% opposed. Whether it’s because of the President’s increasing visibility on the issue or because liberals finally decided the current bill is as good as they’re going to get and better than nothing, there’s been a big rise in support since early February.

The shift has come completely with Democratic voters. A month ago 39% of independents said they supported it, now 40% do. A month ago 10% of Republicans said the supported it, and that’s now actually down to 8%. But Democratic support has risen from 63% to 76% in the last month. Obama seems to have succeeded in better unifying the party around his goals.

Only three percent of liberals oppose passing the plan — down 16 points. That illustrates pretty clearly that those arguing that the bill shouldn’t be passed because it’s irrevocably flawed have lost the argument.)emphasis added)

Three percent? Are you fucking shitting me? They’re either asking the wrong questions or asking the wrong people.

I’m a liberal. I would love to see genuine health care reform get enacted before I die.

But the Obamanation Abomination isn’t health care reform. It’s the health insurance company protection act.


Obamacare

187 Responses

  1. For a moment I thought the title was “I got your three thousand percent right here”

  2. From that same survey that Sargent quotes, only 18% of the respondents classified themselves as Liberal, while 47% self-identified as Moderate, and 35% as Conservative. Only goes to show that you can interpret numbers any ridiculous way you want.

    • Thank you! I was just going to say, even if that’s true, how has anyone lost the argument? Even with those numbers, the vast majority is opposed.

  3. I’m with you, myiq. I’m a liberal, too, and while I’m sometimes willing to vote against my best interests for the greater good, I’m sure not willing to go against my own interests for the benefit of the management and shareholders (in that order) of a shrinking number of big insurance companies. I started a small business three years ago, and have been uninsured since I left my former profession. I pay for my annual checkup, and have been in good health, fortunately. My husband has insurance, but for both of us to be insured would make it the number one expense in our household, exceeding our mortgage payment. Now, we will be forced to pay for insurance for me also. I don’t know what we will be able to do — it will kill my business, but I don’t think I can get a job at this point, certainly not one where the employer will kick in for insurance. So the person I employ will also be out of work.

    I never understand the objections to single-payer, except that a sizable portion of the public is conditioned to howl at the moon every time they hear the dog whistle “socialism!”
    Apparently, they are happy to pay what amounts to a privatized tax. As long as someone is making a profit from the money being extorted, it’s the American way and all is good.

    As for asking the wrong people — I have never in my life been witness to such a disconnect between what is being reported and what real people are saying. It’s as though the news media has been transplanted whole from an alternate universe.

    • tle, as a liberal female Democrat, I spent years voting for the greater good too, but to paraphrase Al Sharpton, I rode that donkey as far as it could go and damn if it didn’t turn around and fuck me.

  4. I am twenty three, graduated last May, unemployed for a couple more weeks. Unfortunately, those numbers might have a tiny bit of accuracy to them: That is, plenty of my friends (and I) don’t or didn’t have health care, let alone good long term jobs. We’re all bred out of middle/upper middle class, went mostly to top tier 4 yr schools. And though I am with The Confluence on this one, I can tell you there are plenty of us 20-somethings not paying attention at all. Without knowing what is really going down, some among my friends are just disgusted that they won’t pass a healthcare bill already.

    Maybe people are getting fed up, without getting much information, and shifting toward support for Just Pass A Healthcare Plan Already.

    • I agree with you… the Obots in my family are woefully misinformed on this travesty…and yes, are looking at this as a “win”:

    • I think you have to be at least 40 years old to be a liberal. All the kids these days are “progressives”

      • Well, and aging indie hipster douches who wish they were 25. Them too.

        • I’m telling ya, ug, it’s the Botox that’s getting them all dumb with that stupified look on their face. Botox eats their brains.

        • You’ve just described every single one of my ex-boyfriends circa 2001-04 (the “LA,” pre-married years). The 40-year-old teenagers. If “progressive” still meant Fighting Bob LaFollette, I would totally be onboard. Sadly no. : (

      • Just because something is called a “healthcare bill” doesn’t mean it is good for everyone. Reform is all about making choices, and the choices in this bill help the investor class more than the working working. That’s a fact. It’s however being sold by the Dems as something that will improve the cost and care situation for most individuals. That’s not true. But most people just believe whatever they hear on Fox or MSBNC.

        That’s the essence of toxic koolaid. Don’t ask what’s in it. He says it’s good for us, so it must be true. Glug glug glug.

        • Well, I’m no Democrat, just an Independent trying to pay attention and vote sometimes. But I think claiming the kids are brainwashed by FOX and MSNBC is oversimplifying stuff. No twenty yr old I know watches tv news, and if they’re going to then tv won’t be their only source.

          Speaking of hipster douchebags though, it is far more fashionable to be jaded and skeptical about everything–especially politics–than to have an informed opinion. (Funny, how skepticism once involved inquiry… Now it’s a cop out) Heaven fordbid they get schooled and actually have to consider the implications. Even at that, these hip kids all know everything requires compromise. If it’s not tainted and perverted, no legislation or issue is worth their time because it can’t possibly exist.

          • I think it’s important for millenials to know about and undertand the implications of legislation that helps those with wealth and income now at the expense of the well being and living standards of future generations. Young people ought not be skeptical OR hopeful. They should hold the government’s feet to the fire so that tough choices are made with long term goals in mind for the benefit of people beyond the lobbying class.

            This bill is primarily an insurance industry jobs and financial bailout bill. Most everything else is window dressing and kicking the can down the road.

      • Whew! I just made it barely. (wipes brow)

    • On this day this is the perfect song

      WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS

      PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE

    • So, against my better judgement I went to my Democratic caucus last night. Damned if some idiot didn’t get up and talk about how important it was to pass this turkey. Damned if the same idiot didn’t mention a “robust public option” and how this was really going to show those bad ol’ insurance companies a thing or two. Can’t these people effing *READ*?????

      The metabolic half-life of kool-aid must be measured in decades.

    • Thanks for your insight.

      It seems that young people in their 20’s now are so woefully misinformed about how even the process works or what our rights entail. And don’t want to know despite the access to the internet, etc. My friends and I went to Madison and we were dying to know how we could get involved with politics and learn the system. The activism on the campus where I’m employed now is mostly of the New SDS variety … went from uninformed to ignorant and thuggish. Strange.

      • ‘ow awful. Fortunately the only issue that anybody at the school where I work cares about is the environment. (Ask me how much fun it was waddling my third-trimester ass past the guy tabling for “voluntary extinction” at their Big Fancy Environmental Law conference last week!) Well, that and sniggering every time they hear the phrase “Sarah Palin.” Meanwhile they are all graduating with 100K in non-dischargeable loans, no prospects for gainful employment, and mostly too old to stay on mommy and daddy’s health insurance plans. I probably should have more sympathy for them than I do, but just can’t muster it up somehow.

  5. What a bunch of freakin’ idiots. Even the CNN poll which usually skews pro-Zero has the majority (42%) agin it. The Dems are going to be obliterated in November. We are so screwed.

    • I no longer care… because if the dems don’t act like dems, who needs them. I’m starting to think this was the plan all along…its not like this piece of shit isn’t exactly what the republicans would have wanted passed anyway

      • I’m with you indigogrrl. I’m still sticking to my story that 2008 was just the start of a masterful con which will end in 2012 with Jeb installed in the WH. It’s going to take a miracle to save our country. And it really pains me that my grandkids are being left with such a dismal national inheritance. I worry about their future.

      • Exactly. It is more of a Republican plan than a Democratic one. The Repugs aren’t voting on it, because they don’t what to give any power to the dimocrats. What is progressive or liberal about this bill? Increasing Medicaid, maybe. But what else?

      • It’s like we’re alone here on an island at TC.

        • Pardon me but I have never heard a Republican argue for a law mandating an individual to purchase anything from a private company. Not ever and I’ve been listening for some time.

          The argument that this is a Republican bill won’t fly. This is pure corporate fascism and nothing but.

          • Totally WRONG! It’s all about accountability, baby, and this was the Republican alternative to Clinton’s initiative in the 1990’s.

            “But Hatch’s opposition is ironic, or some would say, politically motivated. The last time Congress debated a health overhaul, when Bill Clinton was president, Hatch and several other senators who now oppose the so-called individual mandate actually supported a bill that would have required it.

            In fact, says Len Nichols of the New America Foundation, the individual mandate was originally a Republican idea. “It was invented by Mark Pauly to give to George Bush Sr. back in the day, as a competition to the employer mandate focus of the Democrats at the time.”

            http://www.wbur.org/npr/123670612

          • I think of it as a traditionally GOP aim (Wall Street; destroy FDR/LBJ) through Democratic mechanism (mandate) and Democratic pretense (as if it is extending FDR/LBJ tradition).It’s that murky place in the venn diagram where the two parties become the same thing, just different rhetorical flavors at the corporatocracy’s disposal to get things done.

          • Not to mention you clearly missed Mitt Romney pushing the accountability mandate in MA.

          • it’s the Republican healthcare plan, and they act so appalled and call it government takeover and socialist..

            Nixon’s healthcare plan was more liberal than this!

          • McCain only wanted to tax HB — and replace it with a credit.

          • Did Romney do it alone or did he have a Democratic legislature in MA? Desperation to blame the evil other party for what is happening now is just a lame defense mechanism.

        • The HSA push is a banker’s dream because it creates new “savings” accounts for bankers to play with.

          • High deductible insurance coupled with HSA have been available for quite some time now. That’s now new only the push by government is new.

            The truly evil part of the current plan is the damn mandate with no checks and balances. The excise tax is also evil but if it insured lots more people I could live with that but I don’t see that as the goal really. The cuts to Medicare which will be used to pay for part of this POS, just as the boomers are coming in, are also a large screwing of the public.

            I don’t see much about this to like when you consider that the expansion of Medicaid will just bankrupt a few more states. Even that is probably a mess.

          • I know the HSAs have been around a while.

      • …its not like this piece of shit isn’t exactly what the republicans would have wanted passed anyway

        Exactly…how sweet is it for the Repugs that they get the bill they want AND then run against the bill they want. They have found a way to have their cake and eat it too. This is vastly better for the GOP than being in office and taking the blame for GOP policies…. let the fake Dem take the heat.

  6. the backtrack bunch must have one hell of a set of pictures, negatives and kneepads to use against this congress.

    they not only had Kucinich cave but do it in public, telling the people he is supposed to represent to ” go to hell”

    WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS

    PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE

    • I’m so disappointed and depressed with Kucinich’s vote change. I’m beginning to think my friend is right when he says “all politicians are scum”.

  7. I remember the good ol’ times when I was a 10 percenter (antiW post 9.11). Now I am a 3 percenter. Polls are manufacured realith and the truth is not democratic.

  8. You can put lipstick on a pig.

  9. I haven’t been this heated since the primaries…

    I could spit. (on weak-kneed dems)

  10. Wonder how much the Obamanation paid for that poll….

    OT: SHV, if you’re reading: Thanks for your responses RE Photography forums. Look like some good ones.

  11. Who is Dk’s opponent?
    Think I’m going to make a donation.

  12. Michael Moore:

    Within days, the House of Representatives will vote to pass the Senate health-care “reform” bill. This bill is a joke. It has NOTHING to do with “health-care reform.” It has EVERYTHING to do with lining the pockets of the health insurance industry. It forces, by law, every American who isn’t old or destitute to buy health insurance if their boss doesn’t provide it. What company wouldn’t love the government forcing the public to buy that company’s product?! Imagine a bill that ordered every citizen to buy the extended warranty on all their appliances? Imagine a law that made it illegal not to own an iPhone? Or how ’bout I get a law passed that makes it compulsory for every American to go see my next movie? Woo-hoo! Who wouldn’t love a sweet set-up like this windfall?

    […]

    Please, Democrats—just say that—then pass this poor excuse of a bill.

    Pass it because, if President Obama takes a fall on this one, I don’t know if he’ll be able to get back up. And then NOTHING will get done. We can’t have that. (And thank you Dennis Kucinich for hanging in there right up to the end and being the only one out of the 435 members to speak the awful truth.)

    It’s a horrible bill – but pass it anyway!

    {{headdesk}}

    • I heard him in the morning and transcribed some of the stuff he was saying in the last thread. Really ridiculous. He couldn’t keep his narratives straight. He was forgainst it 100% and says Obama is just too nice of a guy.

      • Wha???? “Obama is just too nice of a guy.” Well, this is Moore being a fathead who can’t just admit he was W-R-O-N-G about Obama.

        • His exact words were…
          “decent guy” and “of a generous spirit”

          • Oh, please. Can you imagine Moore’s future movies? It will be like the US doing something terrible to itself or internationally with Obama flitting around naive to the evil doers around him. My Lord, a “generous spirit”? For whom exactly?

          • so they’re all “bastards” except for Obama.
            i think mr. sicko is a fucking psycho.

        • Moore is the Grand Douche of the Douchie of Douchedom.

        • Those who drank the koolaid will make excuses for him till the bitter end. I have never seen people pretend there is such a wide chasm between the man and the policies he is pushing. They don’t realize how much they are insulting him with this meme. What Moore et al are really saying is that he is not in charge of anything and he is just being blown about by the four winds.

          Now that’s change you can believe in.

    • Because that’s what’s really important.

    • If obama takes the fall??? Uh, this bill is made up of the deals he cut with Pharma, AHIP and the for-profit hospitals. Who exactly should “take the fall” for this POS?

      Or, is Moore still pretending Obama is a covert liberal?

    • I have no idea why people pay attention to Moore. He’s like the symbolic working class guy that help progressives feel connected. He’s a self absorbed bullshit artist.

    • God what a bunch of suckers. This ins.co. bailout was the plan all along. It’s an big corp/oligarchy wet dream. And even so, they have these “progressives” on their side. Stunning. They’re stupidity still amazes me. And I’ve seen them pretty damn stupid.

      • and Obama had the never to make fun of people who vote against their own interests!

    • Pass it because, if President Obama takes a fall on this one, I don’t know if he’ll be able to get back up. And then NOTHING will get done

      MM

      excuse me but this is the by now very moldy carrot they have been waving at us FOR YEARS. A complete con….the only part that is true is ” nothing will get done.” If this horror is all they can do in a year and a half, off huffing and puffing when does Moore figure anything will be done? His statement is an extortion and a lie….nothing new in that .

    • Oh Michael, you sicko, NOTHING else getting done to this country by this illegitimate third rate street hustler until 2012 is a good thing. Do the words,”Do No Harm” mean anything to you?

    • Yeah, but only because he threatened to vote no! She’s horrified that he would sacrifice this wonderful bill for personal selfishness.

  13. 6pm et

    Obama interview with Brett Baer on Fox news

    time for greenie martini

    • Wonder if they’ll slip and have a big laugh out loud at the “progressive” suckers.

      I’m still picturing the back smoke filled room: “I know, let’s put together another dubya, same policies, same everything, push the oligarchy as far as it can go until we break their backs, but this time, and this is the good part, we’ll make this dubya2 a Democrate” (followed by endless laughing)

      So now we’ll have to wait until 2014 before these supposed “progressives” notice how horrible this thing is, since nothing in it kicks in until then. And then we’ll see all the crying and how could that be, and how could anyone have know.

      Fuck them all.

      • “more please?”

      • ….And then we’ll see all the crying and how could that be, and how could anyone have know

        Indeed…then they will say it happened was because we didn’t believe enough. If only we had believed better !!

      • DandyTiger, on March 17, 2010 at 5:03 pm Said:

        Wonder if they’ll slip and have a big laugh out loud at the “progressive” suckers.
        _____________________________
        he did! he actually said something about not giving in to “the left”

        what a prick.

        cant wait to see the approval ratings on Friday morning, though.

  14. Obama Tells St. Patrick’s Luncheon on Capitol Hill that Ted Kennedy is Watching Them This Health Care Week He’s good at doing the guilt thing.

    At House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s annual Friends of Annual luncheon this afternoon, President Obama told the crowd that the late Sen. Ted Kennedy, D-Mass., was paying attention to the health care reform battle as it reaches its final hours.

    The president said that today “we all feel the heavy absence of one of our greatest Irish-Americans; a man who loved this day so much; a man who I believe is still watching this body closely, particularly this week — and that is our beloved Ted Kennedy. “

  15. I think PPP is a joke. They only really became known as a political pollster in the primary and they had some very sketchy findings there. Who paid for the poll anyway?

  16. 44 is totally lying on Fox right now, right off the bat.

  17. RalphB, on March 17, 2010 at 4:55 pm Said:

    Did Romney do it alone or did he have a Democratic legislature in MA? Desperation to blame the evil other party for what is happening now is just a lame defense mechanism.

    Romney was happy to take credit at the time, which disproves your point. Further, again, as I cited, this is the alternative to Bill Clinton’s employer mandate bill in the 1990’s, which further disproves your point. I think the Democrats are basically the 1990’s Republican Party and the Republicans are the bat s*it crazy Party, and I support neither, particularly on health care, so I am not trying to desperately blame anyone, LOL. But I am also not trying to desperately find some hero Party out of all of this. The Republicans embraced the individual mandate before they opposed them.

    • There are certainly no heros in this mess on either side of the aisle. What I don’t want to happen is what I have seen before where Dems get screwed by Dems and it becomes the GOP’s fault so they can go back to supporting their party. That kind of crap got us where we are now.

      The alternative to Clinton’s plan was one from Dole which had no mandate and thus did not get to universal coverage. As for Len Nichols contention about Mark Pauly, the same could be said for Uwe Reinhardt on the other side. All the ‘managed care’ wieners were out in force through the early ’90s.

      • can I repost that?

        What I don’t want to happen is what I have seen before where Dems get screwed by Dems and it becomes the GOP’s fault so they can go back to supporting their party. That kind of crap got us where we are now.

        • ITA …my original point was that I don’t care if any of these asshole dems get re-elected.

          they all need to go. I’m not going to vote for someone until they support the issues I believe in…. and this piece of crap health insurance company bailout has pissed me off so much I may never vote for anyone again.

          THEY ARE ALL LIARS. and if they aren’t when they get there THEY ALL BECOME LIARS.

      • Mhmm, Chaffee senior and a number of other Republicans presented the alternative of an individula mandate to the employer mandate when Congress was debating Bill Clinton’s health care proposal. I’m not talking about the prior election. I blame the Democrats for this bill. Who else is there to blame? It’s their bill sponsored by the Party standard bearer. But Republicans were not opposed to the individual mandate in the 1990’s, they opposed an employer mandate.

        • The individual mandate in itself is not such a bad thing.

          It works well in Switzerland-everyone has some basic coverage.

          Of course, the insurance companies are not allowed to make a profit on that basic, required coverage.

          Fat chance that would ever happen here.

          • Yeah, we are not the Swiss, or any country with a rational health finance system. I just meant the Repubs came up with the indie mandate because BC said employers are accountable for providing health insurance, hence the employer mandate.

  18. Brett is being scolded for “interrupting.”

    • But, Obama can interrupt all day long. He always does that. Now, now, and arm goes out to pat the other person in a very patronizing and condescending manner. UG.

  19. oh and silly Brett EVERYBODY knows what’s in the bill
    che minchia!

  20. I’m guessing this is what the DiFi meeting was about.

  21. Why do I feel like the kids in “Lord of the Flies” just before they were rescued. But unlike that story, and in fact one of the biggest criticisms of it, life isn’t like that, you don’t get rescued. We’re so fucked.

  22. how many times has he said “let me finish my answer”

  23. Obama is fancying himself teddy roosevelt now.

  24. Something pleasant to alter your mood — a live webcam in a hummingbird nest (h/t Ellen)

    http://www.ustream.tv/channel/Hummingbird-Nest-Cam

  25. OH NO coming up: analysis from Brit Hume…

  26. You all are too brave to watch more of the Obama Drama.

  27. At this rate, Dancing with the Stars will have an endless list of possibilities for their has-been line-up.

    • ” Dancing with the Stars” …because pro wrestling can absorb only so many….

  28. Bret asked Obama about Tiger. At least Brit is gone, so he can’t comment about that.

  29. AB Stoddard nailed it in the panel just now: Obama was totally on the defensive.

  30. In case anyone is interested…they’ve posted the bill online.

    http://tinyurl.com/2gm2h6

  31. Gasp! They wanted to air an ad for tampons that mentions the word “vagina.” 😯 Mercy! We can’t have that!

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/richard-adams-blog/2010/mar/16/tampon-vagina-kotex-advertising

    • How about vajayjay? That’s apparently acceptable on TV.

      “Vajazzle your vajajay with TAMPAX Vajazzlers!”

      • I remember back in the 60’s when Playtex did a TV commercial for a new bra and the model had to wear it over a sweater.

        Girls in bikinis – okay

        Bras and panties – scandalous.

    • What’s really disgusting are all those Enzyte commercials.

      If Rahm took Enzyte he’d grow taller.

  32. The Koolaid Republic: Obama Party guilty of practicing good govt.

    The cruel irony is that Democrats actually deserve some credit here. When President Bush and the Republicans wanted to pass their big health care bill, the creation of a Medicare drug benefit, they didn’t even bother to pay for it. They were happy to run up huge deficits. When a government actuary predicted that the program would cost a lot more than its proponents claimed–a prediction that quite likely could have alienated enough conservative votes in Congress to stop the bill from becoming law–the Bush Administration ordered the actuary to say nothing and threatened to fire him.

    Here, instead, we have President Obama and the Democrats confronting truly difficult trade-offs, in order to convince skeptical government accountants that health care reform will reduce government spending by even more than the accounts predicted it would already.

    We hear a lot about the corrupt bargaining and backroom deals in health care reform. -There are valid reasons for that. But this is an instance where the Democrats are guilty of something else: Trying to practice good government.

  33. It’s RW but it’s funny, Obamafeld.

  34. I really hope this is bullsh*t or else it means 90+ percent of the liberals in this country are as uninformed and ignorant as the Bushies.

  35. Jane Hamsher says she’s oh so tired of being right all the time and fdl’ers say yes Jane you were so ahead of everybody! (It’s in the comment section of the thread about the Feinstein’s rate authority being scrapped.)

    • It was to be expected especially since Feinstein’s folks wouldn’t even let Jane Hansher in the office, but insurance execs NO PROBLEMA!

    • I’m oh so tired of Jane being self-righteous, a day late and a dollar short, and delusional all the time. Who’s with me? 😉

  36. It’s ugly out there.

  37. Was trapped in the Drs. office and saw Michael Moore on CNN.
    He was saying Obama cannot recover and that the bill stinks, but should be passed anyway.

    He made a comment about doing things “incrementally”–for example, “Let’s just free 30% of the slaves now and do the rest later.”

    I sort of dug that comment…HOWEVER, we told you so, MM…Obama was a sell-out from the get-go and he was “placed” in a way not befitting a true primary!!!

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