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The gritty truth in Mark Halperin’s pulp fiction

Brook's art project, 8th grade

I haven’t read the book but I did read a lengthy 10 page excerpt on the collapse of the Edwards’ marriage and campaign.  I don’t know if Elizabeth was a saint or Edwards a monster as they were written but it became clear over the course of the past several years that Elizabeth was living her ambitions through her husband. After I saw him in Chicago at YK2, I was convinced that Edwards was a one trick pony and PT Barnum his favorite philosopher.  Whether Elizabeth really ripped open her blouse in an airport parking lot or said the things she said is a bit of a mystery.  People with potentially fatal illnesses and dunces for husbands are liable to do all kinds of strange things.  But we weren’t there and there’s a good chance that some of this stuff was taken out of context for dramatic effect, with Halperin being the uber drama queen.

But following up on what Peter Daou said about Hillary’s campaign, this much I can confirm: her campaign never took the low road with us.  We were never official bloggers for Hillary.  We were a pro-Hillary blog almost exclusively after Obama made the “likeable enough” remark, Michelle Obama chastised Hillary about her tone and said she might never vote for her and the Obama campaign surrogates accused both Clintons of racism.  At some point in the campaign, Peter Daou contacted us and told us that he was at our service.  We could call him with questions and he invited us to the press briefing conference calls that I sat in on.  By the way, if you thought Andrea Mitchell was loathsome before the campaign of 2008, try listening to her oh so bored and this is so tedious and dismissively cynical questioning during a conference call with Howard Wolfson.

Never once did Daou ask us to do anything improper.  We weren’t encouraged to engage in character assassination.  We weren’t part of some big plan to subvert other blogs from within.  Instead, we found that posts that were upbeat and optimistic were sometimes linked to Hillary’s blog.  She and Daou seemed committed to winning the war of the blogs with positivity.  I didn’t feel dirty about my posts.

Daou certainly did sleep with his Blackberry under his pillow.  I emailed him at about 2:30am one morning a couple of days after the RBC hearing.  I was so angry and frustrated.  He emailed me back almost immediately and asked if he could call me the next day.  He did.  At about 7:30am. You can’t get that kind of responsiveness and customer service anymore.  He didn’t let Hillary down with us.  I always appreciated his professionalism and access.  I only wish we could have helped her more in return.  I also wish we didn’t have to go our separate ways from Hillary after she suspended her campaign.  But it wasn’t about Hillary anymore after the RBC hearing stripped our votes of any meaning.  It was about the voters’ war with the party.

But I did notice a common theme to all of the excerpts I read of Halperin’s book.  It seems that everyone was out to take Hillary down.  Edwards, Schumer, Reid, Kennedy.  In fact, her enemies came from within her own party.  And even if what Edwards’ supposedly said about taking Hillary out wasn’t an actual quote from a reliable source, one doesn’t have to look very far to find evidence that the sentiment was true.  The whole history of the primaries was of Obama and Edwards tag teaming to make Hillary look bad from that first extremely nasty debate in Philly to Edwards’ eventual endorsement of Obama.  I don’t think Edwards even knew why he had to bring her down.  I have often found this to be the case in the real working world as well.  Men do this to women and they don’t even have a reason.  Over and over again, I have seen a women achieve some managerial power through hard work and then watched as the men who worked with her or under her snipe and criticize and undermine her authority to bring her down.  She only got to be where she was because of a quota or she’s sleeping with someone or she’s not really that smart.  On and on it goes.  I don’t think they do it consciously.  It’s like some bizarre reflex.

Here’s the truth in Halperin’s book that he probably didn’t even know he was writing: men do not mentor women.  There are some exceptions but that’s the cold brutal truth.  When men say that a woman is polarizing or that she won’t be effective, they are really saying they won’t follow her themselves and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.  If the powers that be do not stand behind their protege and back her up, she won’t be effective.  If her proposals are not treated seriously, they won’t be taken seriously.  If there is no accountability for the dismissive way that others treat her, all her work will be for nothing.  And that will come to haunt the powers that be because training women is expensive.  You might as well not hire them in the first place if you aren’t going to take advantage of their talents.  Why teach them to read?

Being a woman in the real working world is not a ceremonial position or it shouldn’t be.  The Democratic party did a really stupid thing in 2008.  It dumped one of its brightest stars.  Yes, Hillary’s campaign staff let her down and there will always be a certain class of women who fall for the biting criticism of men and decide to join in.  They deserve what they get and no amount of karma is bad enough for them.  But it is the men of the Democratic party who let us down in 2008.  And until they are gone, no woman should trust the Democratic party ever again.

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261 Responses

  1. excellent post

    • yes it is. succinct and accurate.

    • Re Coakley, here’s some info I haven’t seen posted:

      Coakley has a formidable track record on issues that have been thorns in the side for Obama, who has been accused of being soft on Wall Street and unwisely extending the U.S. mission in Afghanistan. As Attorney General, Coakley forced a huge settlement with mammoth investment bank Goldman Sachs and has called for increased regulation of the financial sector. Like all the candidates in the Democratic primary, opposed President Obama’s plan to escalate the war in Afghanistan.
      Coakley also went to court to challenge the Environmental Protection Agency to enforce tougher emissions regulations, and challenged the constitutionality of the Defense of Marriage Act, which imposes federal limitations on same-sex marriage.


  2. Rifht on Riverdaughter! FUCK the DEMOCRATS!!!!

  3. oops!

    Right on Riverdaughter. FUCK the DEMOCRATS!!!!!!!

  4. Brava!
    They hate women. Never vote for them.

  5. Wonderful post!

  6. Agree. Completely. Never again will I trust the likes of the men in the Dem. party.

    And as for Elizabeth Edwards.. the real shame of that situation is that she was forced to marry a one trick pony like John in order to live her own political ambitions vicariously.

    Imagine a world in which women could live their own political ambitions! A place where the likes of Elizabeth don’t have to marry a Ken doll…..

    • I haven’t read the book or many of the excerpts, but if Elizabeth Edwards is prone to becoming “emotional”, who can blame her? This is a woman who lives daily with an incurable illness and a skunk for a husband. I would be a bit upset myself. She should be viewed with more compassion, IMHO.

      • Word.

      • Elizabeth is twice as smart as her husband. She should have been running for President instead of him. Women are going to have to stop living through their husbands and force things to change.

        • bb: The woman is seriously physically ill and has been for quite a few years now. You can scarcely expect her to have run for President. I’m amazed that she was able to campaign at all.

          • I’m amazed you thought I meant that literally. I was simply saying the Elizabeth would have been more qualified than John. Obviously, she made a different choice many years ago.

            I’m aware that she is ill and I don’t find the behavior described in the exerpts I’ve read from the book to be “crazy.” I read them as pure misogyny.

        • We, as a society, are going to have to stop forcing women to live through their husbands. Through the lens of patriarchy, a woman is almost always viewed as an extension of her husband, an appendage. Consider the attacks on Hillary, from both sides, that focused on her insignificance as a spouse. Her very real accomplishments were given short shrift; she was first and foremost Bill’s wife.

          • Societal change will come when women take what is rightfully theirs.

          • I agree. I’m just pointing out that when a woman as exceptional as HRC tries to take what’s rightfully hers, only to be bludgeoned with the wife stick, it serves to keep the rest of us in our place. It’s a Catch 22 situation. (And I’ll never forgive MO’s remark about keeping house.)

    • What is the evidence that Elizabeth Edwards was living her ambitions through her husband?
      I am not disagreeing with the premise – I am just asking.

  7. Your last line is for me the last word: the Democratic men, until they are gone, no woman should trust them again.

    This book has a bigger political footprint and purpose imho than Dems get right now and they should be careful how they read it. Halperin is no Dem hack. He was chief of staff for Dole. The targets in this book tell a big purpose:
    1. Reenergize and reopen the Clinton war take-down; get them both and for good.
    2. Take Palin down and fatally wound her as any possible Republican candidate/leader.
    3. Make McCain seem stupid and incapable and a non-voice in the Rep. party.
    3. Show the Dem party as a sleazy, back stabbing political swamp.
    4. Do not attack Obama directly but set the stage for the future that shows O profiting politically and personally from the Dem sleaze while coolly and obliviously doing nothing to change it.
    What does that add up to: Game Change is a hit piece on the Democratic party, all its key players and will be used eventually as the foundation for destroying Obama.

    • The only truth there is in Game Change is the truth about how corrupt the Dem party apparatchik are. Makes me sick.

    • The Democratic Party of 0bama has done a good job of destroying itself!

      May it rot and a new party form from its putrid ashes.

      • I am starting to think it may be better if more than one party rises from its ashes.

        I think the Dem party got too broad — trying to be pro-environment, pro-LGBT, pro-women, pro-union, pro-senior … but it has no real core, no real principles, anymore. It’s just about painting the other side as evil and making money.

        Maybe things would work out better if each core had it’s own party and they formed temporary alliances.

  8. I really don’t see much difference between this latest pile of crap and the tabloid sleaze they threw at Bill and Hillary in the nineties.

    Bill as a racist was new in 2008 but it didn’t fly then with anyone except the Clinton haters. They’ve been trying to sell Hillary as the wicked witch for two decades now.

    I’m just shocked we made it through 2009 without a major CDS eruption.

    That’s a new record.

    • You’re right, myiq. Halperin is just carrying on the misogyny and CDS from the campaign. He liked it so much, he just can’t let go. And there are lots of other guys who feel the same way. I thought a little better of John Heilemann previously, but no more.

  9. But it is the men of the Democratic party who let us down in 2008. And until they are gone, no woman should trust the Democratic party ever again.

    Worth repeating on a daily basis.

    Brook’s artwork is gorgeous!

    • Bravo, RD!!

      I will never forget Barak Obama’s comment, with a smirk on his face, “I know how to win.”

      Indeed, sir. Whatever it takes. The Chicago way.

      Enough, now. You’re done.

    • Maybe it is just the A$$hat men elected to office that should go!

      There are many men who supported Hillary out here.

      • We should get you special t-shirts, because there are few of you all, sadly enough. I don’t have much hope for this younger generation of men either. I strongly believe that young men, especially, feel the top down effect of bad responsibility and role-modeling. If they see a particular behavior (of a politician, athlete, or star) to be even tacitly being given the ok by the powers-that-be, then they ascribe to that behavior whole-heartedly, because they know there will be no consequences for their actions. Aside from politics, I’m thinking baseball’s McGuire’s latest comments that he was a victim of playing baseball in the era when steroids use was silently ok’d.

        • Maybe we should just smear lamb’s blood on the doorpost so the Great Puma Goddess will spare us 😉

      • I for one am grateful to all the men who supported Hillary and stood up against the vicious misogyny of 2008, and to those stalwart men who continue to fight the tide of woman-hate. If it weren’t for you guys I would have lost all faith in the male half of homo sapiens. I just wish there were more men like you.

      • Exactly, Red Dragon! I would change “But it is the men of the Democratic party who let us down in 2008. And until they are gone, no woman should trust the Democratic party ever again.” to:
        “But it is the men of the Democratic party leadership who let us down in 2008. And until they are gone, no woman should trust the Democratic party ever again.”

        I know a lot of Democratic men who supported Hillary Clinton.


    • “But it is the men of the Democratic party who let us down in 2008”

      Tell me about it. I just divorced a Obot personality cultist. Amazing to watch a highly-educated person become an MSNBC remote-control parrot.

  10. My compliments to Brook’s artwork also!

    • It’s gorgeous!

    • Wow! You have an artist on your hands.

      What do her teachers say about her? Mine advised me to have him go to art high school. (from about 13 on)

      • Yes, it’s a beautiful painting!

      • She gets good grades in art and her work usually goes on exhibition somewhere. It’s pretty clear that she’s talented.
        Very, VERY, hard to get a mentor for her in art. I never get any advice from anyone in the district about how I’m supposed to nurture this artistic talent.
        She has an academic mentor but she needs on in art. I’m all ears if anyone has suggestions.

        • Maybe check out any art centers (those that offer class during summer or exhibit local artists) and have a chat with the people who run it?

        • RD: check your email for something from me

        • RD: My mother had an MFA and at one time gave private art lessons to children and adults.
          Ask at your nearby university’s Fine Arts Department if any of their students or graduates give private lessons.

        • RD–Check out your local Art Leagues or Art Associations. Many sponsor lessons for kids; some accept kids as members. The youngest member of mine is 8 and has already shown with the group, and we have a 17-year-old who’s had a solo show.

        • RD — Brook’s artwork is so gorgeous, I copied it to my computer! I love her use of color! Have you thought about talking to your local art museum, ours provides classes for youth. And I’ve heard that there are art camps. Best of luck to her.

        • What’s her medium? I know a couple of professional artists. They’re pretty busy, but maybe they could email her…

        • Over here they have art high schools so it’s easy, and my son really did learn an amazing amount.

          Now he wants to get into sound design but I don’t know if that’s worth it because maybe a lot of that kind of work is being outsourced. (If anyone has any idea about it please let me know.)

          However the first thing to do is to develop what they call here “la mano”, or one’s hand (drawing and painting techniques).

          Practice makes perfect.

          • Oh and he really likes art camps.

          • Art high school means something like 20 hours a week is devoted to an artistic curriculum, and that the school is full of art, printing lithograph, graphics, computer, theater sets, fashion and costume laboratories.

            There are chemistry lessons but no chem labs, for example. Maths suffers. Art history flourishes.

        • I’d be happy to be the first buyer of one of her works. She have anything for sale? 🙂

        • RD, check Rutgers art dept. they may have grad students or profs who mentor

  11. Bravo!
    I remember the shock when turning Air America after months of loosing touch and listening to Randi having a breakdown over Kerry endorsing Obama. I was confused for a moment about her reasons – then she enlightened me with her beef: “he is going to split the anti-Hillary vote” (some Edwards supporters might be offended and go for her). That’s when I first became aware of this grand movement: the anti-Hillary. Then I saw it everywhere – media, internet, rants of people I knew. W disappeared in the memory hole, it was Hillary that invaded Iraq now.
    This book tries to bring it all back – only they messed up with Reid, so they’ll be undercut.

    • I remember Randi from the 2006 election saying if you want W impeached just get a Dem majority into congress. I think when Pelosi said it was off the table is when I stopped listening to Air America.
      (How tiny is Pelosi’s table anyway? Seems like nothing fits on it)

      • I stopped listening to Randi Rhodes when she began using Obama’s books as evidence for his exceptional leadership skills. She actually would read excerpts from it.

  12. The whole Democratic party is a swamp that needs to be drained. While I agree that the men are beyond the pale, many of the women exhibit ‘Stockholm Syndrome” symptoms as well. Unless and until the corrupt male power structure is dismantled nothing good can come from it. Look how quickly Coakley was forced to repudiate her rejection of the Insurance Company Protection Act. The men have the power and the women are forced to play by the men’s rules.

    • Sadly, I’ll have to agree. Caskill is the first to pop up in my mind. But I won’t ever forget Maxine Waters taking a shot at us “old disappointed feminists” either. And then there are all the others in between.

      • It’s (sadly) why I hope Brown will win in Massachusetts. I had been a supporter of Coakley but this latest fund-raiser in DC she had with Big Pharma is a deal-breaker. If that’s the Dem party, count me out.

        • Abbie, didn’t you get the memo from Axelrod/Rahm that Big Pharma has been designated a saint, and instead its the Health Insurance cos that constitute the big evil?

        • Wishing for Brown is hardly the answer. He thinks gays are “abnormal.”

    • EXACTLY… the women are forced to play along. So Put the women in the majority and change things.

  13. All of this is true, but I think there is another ugly truth as well: Hillary wasn’t opposed just because she was a woman, but because she was too populist. A President Hillary might demand that the Congressional Dems behave like Democrats and do something for the average person, and a Dem leadership determined to sell out to the banks, the drug companies, and the health insurance companies couldn’t have that. Especially when they had an alternative not only willing to sell out, but whose status as “the first serious black Presidential candidate” gave them flank protection on their left that no other Blue Dog could provide.

    • Your point is really important. Anyone who does not recall the history of the Clintons in Dem politics accurately misses the big story—the Clintons were not welcome among the power elites in DC—ever. Reading the Clinton Tapes I was reminded how often Bill was challenged with Dem opposition.

    • Good point. Last week, Gov. Paterson (NY) gave a passionate address about ethics reform in NY, and how the disease of special interests and self-interested politicians needed to be dealt with aggressively now or never. The public responded with thunderous applause (though some doubt his motivations for the speech or ability to accomplish it), and the representatives received it with a deafening silence. Sheldon Silver immediately said, “What he is proposing is not legal.” That’s the Dem! They do not want to change the system–they profit from it. That’s the bottom line. Obama is a puppet, and Hillary would have been a force to reckon with.

      • I think I really like Paterson. Is he doing a good job as governor?
        I hope he gets re-elected — what a stick-in-the-eye for Obie-Want-More-Money.

        • unfortunately many in NY do not think he is doing a good job. I think he is getting better (although I am not in NY) and has been showing quite a bit of backbone. Plus the thing I love about Paterson is that he was a loyal Hillary Clinton supporter and he left the dance with the one he came with. That type of loyalty means a lot to me and I think to a lot of voters. Just look what happened to Corzine…

    • Obama was getting $millions from Wall Street and other big money special interests months and months before Edwards flopped. They didn’t give Obama all that money just because they hate women.

      • No. They gave Obama all that money because they knew he could be bought.

        Take a look at the healthcare “reform” bill. They hadn’t even started debating the issues before BHO took single-payer (which would have really put the screws to the healthcare industry) coverage off the table. So the bargaining leverage to get any sort of reform was totally gone. What’s left is expansion, with no real enforcement mechanism to keep individual costs down. But we all knew this was coming when Obama was allowed to term his plan “universal” healthcare care, while leaving out 30% of the populace. The media should have made this an issue, but, of course, they were all Bots!

        Anyone who gives to the DNC, DCC or DSC is buying koolaid! Let’s support a very select group of feminist female candidates and tell the good ol’ boys to take a flying leap!

    • yes all true fear she would lead

    • Too populist and too honest. They want someone corrupt.

      I’m convinced the GOP elite dislike McCain/Palin for the same reason. McCain has many flaws, but I think he was determined to do something about campaign finance reform as President. And Palin didn’t seem to be susceptible to lobbyists when she was governor.

      • Agreed.

      • McCain had already done something about campaign finance with the McCain-Feingold bill. It was B0 who blew that out of the water by refusing to accept public funding-and that after pledging a “serious conversation” with McCain if McCain didn’t go with public funding. What a duplicitous liar 0 is.

        Anyway, I think you’re right. The powers that be didn’t like Hillary or McCain, probably because they’re not bought and paid for.

    • Hillary was opposed because she was an autonomous woman and the rigged Rs-and-Ds system of corporate welfare couldn’t control her. No matter how much they threw at her they obviously couldn’t trust her to be their puppet. Nor could the Democratic establishment count on her to keep them all at the top of the political food chain. If Hillary would have become president, the Clinton legacy would have overshadowed all other recent political legacies. They would have become too powerful. The corporate masters of both parties didn’t want to see that happen, and there were a lot of establishment figures on both sides, but especially on the Democratic side, who didn’t want the Clintons to be more powerful than them. This BS about their being so afraid that Hillary couldn’t win because she’s polarizing and Bill is a pig is a convenient distraction from the fact that Big Money and the establishment was behind Obama all along.

      • no matter how much money* they threw at her

      • Good point. It’s more about money than gender. But misogyny plays a role, and made it easier to undercut her. It’s two-pronged problem. Else we could just as easily have a female corporate controlled president.

        • that is why *autonomous* woman is “polarizing” and “divisive” to them, she threatens the rigged system. Even Sarah Palin, who a lot of liberal feminists have a hard time accepting as a feminist because of her right-wing affiliation, threatens the rigged system and is why the GOP elite joins in with the left to bash her.

          • Got it.

          • purple–I wouldn’t be surprised if the DC insiders are already plotting to do a PR distraction by making the first sino peruvian lesbian president in 2016. TC readers might want to consider sending in their resumes to both parties, but integrity and principles are probably disqualifications.

        • They did the same thing to Dean. When he threatened to break up the media if elected, that’s when they slammed him with that fake scream thing and derailed his populist campaign. Will people never learn?

          • They turned his scream of excitement into a, ‘He started screaming like he had gone mad!’.

          • It’s interesting to list who the media targets were in the past elections:

            Was Kerry a target? I forget. I know his wife was.

            (*I personally think Huckabee’s religious views are truly scary but I think it was his populism that made him a target).

          • Yes, but then he turned around and licked their hand. So they burned him again.


      • Right on Wonk.

  14. ….But her scorn for Elizabeth Edwards was evident, blaming her for her misfortune.

    “Someday, the truth about her is going to come out,” Hunter told Newsweek.

    So no wonder H&H don’t want to talk sources, I would not be suprised at all to discover that Ms Hunter was a source, fools

    • Just as that unnamed Edwards campaign manager had to be Axelrod.
      In fact I think the bulk of this book comes from him, Solis Doyle, Jonathan Alter and a few other big shot dems to be easily determined soon by their comments to it.

    • When a man cheats on his wife, the wife is always portrayed to be at fault. It starts with him whining about small things to justify his cheating. Once the wife begins to realize what’s going on, that her partner in life is lying to her face and belittling her behind her back, she goes from desperately trying to save her marriage to wanting to kill both husband and paramour. It tends to drive one a little insane. I used to hate Elizabeth Edwards for her contribution to the Clinton bashing during the campaign, but now I have a better understanding of her situation since reading the excerpt from the book. If she hadn’t acted a little crazy under the enormous strain of her illness and her spouse’s infidelity, she would not be human.

      Brook’s artwork is amazing. That is one talented young woman!

    • Ms Hunter has yet to provide the video work she was paid to do and interestingly that there isn’t anything negative about her in this Dirt Devil Book.

      As for Elizabeth, given her illness, she could have very well have had a fever and may have wanted to cool off and thought she was among ‘caring’ people and not some back stabbers.

      I remember how I was shocked to learn that Rosie would have said such horrid things about someone suffering from cancer, and thus the explanation of the cowards in this Dirt Devil Book too (throw the rock and hide the hand).

  15. Perfectamundo.

  16. At first I thought this book was about securing the future of Obama by attacking and destroying as much as possible any potential 2012 candidates who could possibly take him down, especially Clinton. Then when I looked at Halperin’s political history and read the excerpts that show the conniving of most of the Dem leadership—revealing how crude and slimy they truly are, I decided the book is more than what it seems on the surface—not what is past but what may be the future. I would not be surprised to learn that Karl Rove was the silent muse for this book. I think Rove probably played a role in bringing us O knowing the only way to resurrect the Repubs was to play a Dem fool and fup so bad that there would be a thermadorian reaction. I usually don’t do conspiracy theory but this book, given its source, really has my mind thinking.

  17. Thoughtful and true piece RD. I think you are quite right about one thing, and our resident psych PhD BB can elaborate: so much of this is coming from the reptilian brain. It’s unconscious. That doesn’t excuse it, but there is a primal fear some men have of powerful women, and they do not want to give up their position of privilege and dominance. Is it DNA? Is it eons of programming due to assigned roles? Physical power? All of the above? It’s complicated, but what we saw clearly in 2008, is that the evolved image of many “liberal” men is a complete sham. And the women who enable it are even worse. The reason I have such great respect and admiration for HRC, and women leaders who came before her, is that she is willing to be the target of so much hostility and ugliness in an effort to advance the rights and freedom of women. Even if we can’t see it now, I believe she has made a difference, planting seeds in the hearts of little girls and disempowered women who are watching. I know she has had a profound effect on me.

    • And one sees that dedication to empowering women throughout her life history. But I also think that the CDS is more than the women in power mode—because it is also about WJC too.

    • and they can’t stop, but I too believe this to be a good thing, women are shaking off the Dem nose ring and joining our power and brushing off the media on women issue and politicans

      • I just want to relay a comment my son made to me about Bill Clinton when all that Monica BS was occuring. He said that Bill Clinton showed him more than you can believe. That watching Bill continue to do his job and do it well was the best thing he could ever see. Doing your job when the worst is happening was truly inspiring. So often people will find any excuse to quit or whine or fall apart. Seeing Bill and Hillary hang in there is quite an example to me.

    • fif, she’s made a huge difference in my life also
      She’s even steered the way I am raising my children. I admire the way both Clintons raised their daughter. Even during the most ugly attacks. They taught Chelsea that people have to use their “God given ability” ,as HRC has said so many times, to make the world a better place. God I have such a crush on her…and I’m no teenager!

  18. Interesting research from Pew about women being held back in the workplace.


    • Well, I agree with the top number in that survey—it is still the old boy network that holds women back the most. I actually think one number is rather encouraging—only 15% think that the reason more women are not leading is that women are too weak to lead. My guess is that in the 1960s that number would have been more like 50% or more.

  19. This book shows the contempt that Dems. had for Hillary. Probably was mostly fear that she would change the game. But, in their eagerness to show how backstabbing the Democrats are, the authors have shown us how the Republicans are as well, for they are all politicans. Uniqueness is not a attribute that these guys can own. After all, they are only politicans. With no great will to change the systems for the good of America, we trot on with Obama, leaving the real “game changer” to do what she can as Sec. of State.

    • Isn’t it interesting that the party elites had such contempt for HRC but she still got the most votes from the people of that party.

      • Party elites are not representative of us. Thus, it does not surprise me that the numbers went to Hillary.

    • ..well that’s change I can believe in as an Independent, if the lines between Political Party’s and Political fringes has been blurred I’m happy today anyway

  20. A lot of men, especially men who seek power, see themselves in perpetual rebellion against their “controlling” mothers and wives. They carry this over to the work place. I’ve seen this happen a lot in my long experience working in executive suites. Once a woman in the office becomes powerful enough to be considered a peer, they act like petulant boys who need their space where they can parade around like they control everything. I’ve seen them bring companies crashing down doing this, even. When I started my consulting firm and became an outsider, it freed me from experiencing that behavior. I’ve even heard them use the “she’s not the boss of me, who does she think she is, my wife?” when speaking to each other about a woman in power. Men’s resentment of women have control spheres around them runs real deep. It’s a ritualized human version of baboon hierarchical behavior. They ultimately feel threatened by gay men for similar reasons.

    • “It’s a ritualized human version of baboon hierarchical behavior.”

      LMFAO! Happens in academia as well. When the men feel emasculated they indeed do become little boys rebelling against their wives/mothers. It’s nearly a desire to throw their shit around without having anyone scold them.

      • Mydaughter inquired of her male european prof about her progress(bc he hadn’t returned anything all semester).He sent her an e-mail she felt was an unfair characterization of her “participation” in class. She e-mailed him back in a totally respectful way but said she disagreed with him. He sent her back a page long diatribe accusing her of an “emotional” outburst and berating her in very personal terms. She sent it to the dep rep but seriously she thought the guy was crazy. He is twice her age and at one of the top “educated class” training grounds.My daughter said”I guess he has trouble with strong women”!

  21. Yes, Hillary’s campaign staff let her down and there will always be a certain class of women who fall for the biting criticism of men and decide to join in.

    How true RD!

    I’ve always thought, (and I KNOW many people who think the way I do) that Patti Solis Doyle was a plant. ( I know her brother. I worked on many of his campaign’s here in Chicago and I can tell you this with confidence, many people here in Chi-Town, those of us that KNOW and swim in Chicago politics, knew the Solis family was deeply embedded in the Kool-Aid container)


    I find it odd that this book came out just as Hillary’s approval rating is through the roof! This smells of Axelrove! These maggots( the authors of this trash and the media mosquito clan ) have all gotten their marching orders from that frat house located on 1600 Pennsylvania ave.

    Journalism today has taken the TMZ approach to news and it makes me sick to my stomach that too many people are all to willing to trade in gossip!

    • I thought it had the Axelrove taint too because it does not directly lay a glove on Obama. But that seems at odds with how bad it makes the Dem political machine as a whole look. And a lot of the stuff that appears to be accusatory on Hillary (and Bill) really is not much. Hill believed O scammed the caucus process in Iowa and bussed in supporters? Thought the other caucus plays were tainted with similar politics? Thought O was unprepared to be president? Lacked experience? Seems to me the polls today are filled with a whole lot of people who would say, year Hillary and Bill were exactly right.

      When they get through with the surface glitz of this book, I do not know that it does Obama any favors at all.

      TMZ approach to news. Yeah, big time.

      • Maybe it’s part of O’s 2012 campaign. Slime anyone who might possibly pose a primary challenge.
        It’s typical behavior of them.

        • This is what I thought immediately too. It trashes the Democrats, and Obama has done everything in his power to now separate himself from the Democrats, which explains for me the reason he has given such tepid support during the whole Obamacare process.

      • During the Iowa caucuses, Biden would look out at the crowd, see the Chicago contingent and call out “Hello, Chicago!”

    • thx for confirming things re Solis Doyle reddragon!

  22. Yesterday, my hubby ran across Ed Schultz’s show while channel surfing on Sirius radio. Schultz is blaming Elizabeth and Hillary for trying to destroy the Democratic party by NOT divorcing their husbands. WTF?????

    • Well, of course, that makes perfect sense. Why didn’t we all think about that as the perfect solution? Schultz is the dumbest thing on tv.

    • Schultz is an a$$! ( and also…an ex-repugnican! ) So I have to consider the source when listening to him!

      • ..but didn’t Harry Reid call and offer him a place on his Team recently?

        Have you read Craig Crawford lately …..now that it’s been confirmed he was correct he scratching out at those who picked on him

    • Yesterday morning I was watching MSNBC and some black dude was on talking about the the book. Didn’t catch his name but he apparently taught, or currently teaches, at Syracuse. He referenced his phone conversation with buddy Al Sharpton (who has been everywhere on the tv trashing the Clintons) as he defended Senator Reid and said there was nothing wrong with what Harry said.

      But he was talking at 90 miles an hour as he trashed Bill and Hillary and flat out stated they were both racists.

      And then he said: “Bill Clinton was trying to cut off the head of the Democratic party”.

      So, that’s where we are – the Clintons hate Democrats and they hate black people. I hope Bill is successful in cutting of the head of Obama’s Democratic Party.

      What a bunch of idiots.

      Let me add – since Bill and Hillary hate black people and Haiti is 95% black I feel certain they are not even following the news. now where is that snark buttom…

      • Well that’s what they’re trying to do with the coffee remark-cut the Clintons off from the AA base.

  23. You covered all the bases, again, here. But, I think the hardest part was what we saw as women? That it is all just a joke? Grim. Here is a follow up I saw this am.


    So many points in your article RD. I just can’t help wondering what happened with the Dem women though? I don’t see it as a male Dem prob only. The women should have helped Hillary. It will be interesting to see what happens to Palin, now — what will her party do?. All in all, a three ring circus all the way around.

    Yuck. It’s just sad.

    Indy. From now on.

    ps: Brook! the artisan! pss: a blend of science and art is botanical illustration? xxoo!

  24. The seriousness of the male D’s (and several women who managed to dominate the airwaves) intent on taking down the Hillary candidacy was vicious and set in concrete. They weren’t going to stop, they weren’t going to lose their focus, and they had no boundaries for how rough they were going to play.

    My only apprehensions at all over what might happen if Hillary managed to break through and win both the nomination and the presidency was that I could not see these same people supporting her in that role. As much as they have to grit their teeth and smile for Obama, what would they have done to Hillary? Would they have gone against her even when they knew what she was asking was the right thing?

    Obama isn’t going to destroy the ability for the D’s to regain the WH once he’s gone all by himself. These narrow-minded, selfish and cowardly congressmen and women are contributing greatly to the collapse.

    • There was a background fear in my mind, as the viciousness of the primaries steadily increased through the spring of 2008, that her life would be in danger if she won.

      Having that vicious unapologetic public hatred towards Hillary recede somewhat was the only upside for me of the rigged convention and Obama’s selection as candidate.

      • I would agree with that. In fact, of the female leaders around the world, a fairly high percentage have been the victims of assassinations.

  25. Please, let’s stop and think for a minute.

    Not all men are evil, and not all Democrats are evil.

    Many, many men supported and worked hard for Hillary, and 18 million people (mostly Democrats) voted for Hillary.

    Let’s use a bit narrower brush, okay?

    • Not all men are evil, and not all Democrats are evil.

      I agree. However, the male-dominated party establishment and their female enablers blocked Hillary and used raw sexism to take her down. They called her polarizing based on the fact that she has a cottage industry devoted to attacking her womanhood and characterizing her as a one-dimensional shrew–instead of discrediting their BS the way they laugh off the birthers who go after Obama, the left-wing adopted the right-wings attacks. They held her husband’s philandering against her when they rallied around him to defend him against the GOP’s invasion of his privacy during his presidency. Furthermore they held whatever they didn’t like about Bill’s presidency against her while giving her NO credit for the good things about his presidency.

      • Oh, I agree.

        My only point here is what I wrote: that not all men are evil and not even all Democratic men (or Democratic women). Too many men and women, of all political stripes, were profoundly awful to Hillary and they are the ones we must hold accountable.

        I think this book is trash and worse than that, it is written by cowards who won’t even tell who gave them these gossipy tidbits. For all I know, they are making many of these stories up or adding heft to rather more innocuous comments.

        There is NO way I would read this book and if someone gave it to me, I would tear out the pages and line the cat’s kitty litter box with them. I despise the authors of this trashy book, and I hope they get their just due in the after-world.

    • ok, how about most men with power in the democratic party.

    • I am pretty sure this post was NOT about the voters. Just about those elites subverting their will.

    • Not all men are evil, and not all Democrats are evil.

      Not all evil Democrats are men either.

    • You really need to learn to read. And no, I’m not cutting the Democrats a break. I’m an evidence based person and the data says the Demicrats knifed one of their own, a woman, did not strenuously object to the misogyny directed at her or, by extension, us, disenfranchised those 18 million inconvenient votes through MI and FL and then terrified women into voting for Obama by using the threat of Roe v Wade while at the very same time, erasing references to reproductive rights from most Democratic candidates’ websites. Did I mention the meetings Obama had with evangelical groups?
      Why are you here anyway? If you read this blog, you should know we are very skeptical of the Democratic party for good reasons. None of your pleas make any difference to us. We’re not easily pacified women.

      • I was not reacting to what you wrote but to what a few of the posters here had written.

        I was (and remain) as angry as you are with many of the Democrats, men and women, who were so hideous to Hillary. I was and remain an ardent supporter of Hillary.

        I would just make this comment: Martha Coakley stuck with her support of Hillary to the bitter end. Despite pressure from Democratic thugs, Coakley as a delegate to the Democratic Convention, cast her vote FOR Hillary. So, what is her reward for that loyalty? — an awful lot of Democrats are throwing their support to the Republican candidate in Mass.

        Obama, who went to NJ to campaign for Corzine, is not going to Mass. to campaign for Coakley. I guess he’d rather see his “key” legislation go down to defeat (which is fine with me) than support someone who, at the last hour, continued to support Hillary. (Corzine had supported Hillary all the way through, but at the Convention threw the NJ vote to Obama. So, Obama could find time in his busy schedule to campaign for Corzine but will not stir himself to campaign for Coakley.)

        • It sure didn’t do Corzine much good, did it?

          If I was Coakley I’d tell Obama to stay the hell out of Massachusetts until after the election.

        • MA got to cast their votes at the election? I can’t remember all the fine details of which states got jumped over to get from Illinois to New York and end the floor vote as quickly as possible.

          • oops – meant convention, not election.

          • wonk said at 4.33:
            Rethugs to have a talking point to rail against the Ds in upcoming elections …. If there is a political earthquake and Brown manages to pull off a huge upset, someone will cut a deal to get Snowe or someone else to flip.

            Right! No Repub would openly have to flip: just don’t show up at the filibuster.

        • “So, what is her reward for that loyalty? — an awful lot of Democrats are throwing their support to the Republican candidate in Mass.”

          If democrats are throwing their support to Coakley’s republican opponent it is because she has stated she will support Obamas HCRA and all indications are this is not what the voters want. Why would voters elect her to only rubber stamp Obama’s policies?


          • so they would support an even worse male republican? That is just idiotic. sorry, but the solution to our problems is more women in power. It is NOT more men in power because the women are not pure enough given the small amount of power they hold, just getting elected is a major accomplishment.

          • Democrats are going to lose for supporting Obamacorp’s policies… that’s just a cold hard fact. If she wins, I wish and hope she does not cave on HCRA. But the voters have the right to a protest vote. And it may well end up being a referendum on Kennedy as well. No bigger message to send to the DINOs than to hand over a vaulted seat to the enemy rather than continue to send DINOs to DC.

            It has nothing to do with “being pure” enough. She was polling like a shoe in when she was talking against the HCRA.
            Maybe just maybe the people are tired of say one thing but do another politricians.

          • sorry, but that is not going to work. All you are doing is pubishibg Coakly for not having enough power to go against the party at this point.
            Electing male republicans will just bring you MORE crappy male democrats who are blue dogs.

          • None of the Dems in the Senate had the courage to vote against the bill. None of them want to be tagged as the one to destroy O’s presidency. Coakley deserves as much criticism for this as Al Franken and Bernie Sanders do. I won’t urge people to vote for Coakley or not, but whoever people vote for, it’s not going to stop the corporate welfare system. Ds and Rs are rigged. K-street, Obama party, and Rethugs all need Obamacare too much for various reasons–Obama to declare victory, Rethugs to have a talking point to rail against the Ds in upcoming elections, and insurance co’s for obvious reasons. If there is a political earthquake and Brown manages to pull off a huge upset, someone will cut a deal to get Snowe or someone else to flip.

          • Coakley is selling her vote dearly to get concessions. She said that she would vote against the HOUSE-style bill because of its restrictions on abortion, but would “reluctantly” support the SENATE-style bill which was not so restrictive.

      • RD,

        Do you remember that some of us that were traveling to the DNC RBC meeting on May 31st, 2008 were denied the information of where the meeting was to be held (A PUBLIC MEETING). Even so, some of us packed our suit cases and headed out, even after the threats (oh, none of that made this Dirt Devil Book) and how we weren’t given access to the phone numbers to get a seat. Most of us ended up outside and were given reports by a few that got in (lived in the area) during breaks.

        Some of us risked threat of arrest and went up to the meeting once we were told the fix was in, but that didn’t make it into the ‘Dirt Devil Book’ either.

        • I got a room in that Marriott. I paid real $ to have that room. I was told specifically that there would be some seats to a few if they stood in line. I got up at 4 AM to be one of the first in line. Stood there till 10 or 11 AM. Then they said no one would be allowed in. They lied. They lied. The DNC lied. The whole place outright lied and then they cheated Hillary. I will never forget or forgive the DNC. They are traitors, cheaters and criminals.

    • Not all men are evil, and not all Democrats are evil.

      I dunno. An awful lot of Democratic, liberal and progressive men sure wallowed in the mud of misogyny in 2008; and they haven’t let up since. I truly believe that 2008 was a turning point–when the men of the “left” turned their backs on women and women’s rights, and came out of the misogynist pr!cks closet. Their hate was, and is, positively gleeful. And I don’t see any sign that a sea change is on the horizon. For that reason I will not be voting for any men from either party (unless he’s a very rare jewel).

      • And, I’ve seen an increase in misogynist ads on TV and more male-focused ads in magazines (yes, I’m thinking of you Newsweek). Of course, the ad world has been filled with misogynist ads but there seemed to be a bit of decrease before the primaries. I thought that wow a female president would lead to a further decrease, just as surely as we have an increase in ads of AAs and minorities since the election.

        This is merely an observation on my part. I don’t have any fact based #s on it nor is this my field.

  26. When those creepy piglet twins, kennedy and kerry, went public with their rabid support of completely inexperienced and totally undervetted obama, and when kennedy’s faux excuse was because bill clinton was supposedly “racist”, I don’t know how anyone in their right mind could possibly believe that their decision was anything but strictly gender bias drive spite. At least this book proves the obvious.

    • It seemed to also be related to the Kennedy legacy. What if there were two Clintons and only one Kennedy presidency?

    • No, it was much bigger and deeper than misogyny. This was about who was going to be the power brokers in the Democratic party—the Kennedy wing of the party or the Clinton wing of the party.

    • I’m guessing Teddy just wanted anything at all from Bill that he could use as justification for backing Obama. I’ll bet he chatted with Bill and led him down the road to saying something he could easily twist, then got off the phone and screamed “bingo”!

      • Then why wouldn’t Ted use it immediately, during the primaries? Since he didn’t, imo it never happened: Halperin just made it up.
        Media Matters now quotes Halperin admitting he doesn’t know what if anything Bill actually said.

  27. Deja vu. What I don’t understand is the persistent need by journalists to demean HRC any further than they already have.

    To the elitists Hillary Haters in the media all I have to say anymore is, “Go f*ck yourselves.”

  28. From Craig Crawford:

    The revelatory new book, “Game Change,” presents a moment in the 2008 campaign that I painfully remember. I was there, and I was a witness to NBC’s determination to undermine Hillary Clinton in late October in the Philadelphia debate. It was stunning to see what I thought to be real journalists becoming players, partisans in a cause I could not fully understand. To this day, I’ve never seen anything like it. I remember arguing on air that night with Chris Matthews, but realizing that I was on the wrong side of what had become an egregious example of media bias. What unfolded in the days, weeks and months following is beyond anything I ever imagined — a legitimate news organization I work for demonstrating a commitment to the promotion of a candidate it little knew

    • More from CC:

      Barack Obama bamboozled you, liberals. He did a deal with the health industry early on, promising to do as little as possible in exchange for their start-up campaign funds. The truth is that Hillary Clinton and John Edwards got screwed by promising to create universal health insurance. Why? Because they vowed to take on the health care industry with more far-reaching reform plans. Obama undercut them to get industry support, and it’s all coming home to roost. That’s why nothing of significance is getting done.

      • I am utterly appalled, confounded and embarrassed by the idiotic co-dependency of press submission to this adminstration.
        Posted by: craigcrawford.myopenid.com | January 12, 2010

        • Is this craig? Or someone posting comments there under his name?

          Oh please, liberals so scammed by Obama. You were idiots to believe him over Hillary in 2008

          Posted by: craigcrawford.myopenid.com Author Profile Page | January 12, 2010 6:44 PM

          • He is on FIRE. Read all his comments.

            Patsi, is there a word beyond epiphany? Because that’s what I experienced in those difficult days. Horror, it was. Marlon Brando THE HORROR in “Apocalypse Now” type HORROR. And not only because my damn ankle was broken. Bedridden and watching my colleagues as I did, it was a stunning thing to see what idiots we all are. Not just the horrific sexism, but the stupifying and repetitive drivel of our conventional crap. I have not recovered to this very day, and still go on TV as little as possible because I cannot stand the thought of associating myself with such. My ankle is hurting again just thinking about it. Thanks for the memories.

            (emphasis mine)

    • It wasn’t like the bloviating gasbags at MSNBC all caught Obamamania from a toilet seat. The word came down from their corporate masters to promote Obama.

      • The worst offender by far was head of NBC Jeff Zucker, who is probably going to lose his job over this stupid Leno/Conan thing. Too bad it’s not something related to the campaign because he was pulling the strings for Obama, absolutely all the way.

        • Who owns NBC?

          • I think GE owns NBC.

          • Right – so why did GE want Obama to be President?

            Hint: It wasn’t patriotism.

          • Right, and Jeffrey Immelt is GE CEO and he sits on Obama’s main economic advisory board. GE has been helped with defense contracts. They are in the process of selling NBC right now to Comcast. Zucker will be gone by summer. Imo though, NBC’s Obama media bias during the campaign was more Zucker than Immelt. He believed Obama would help his ratings, and he was right, until after the election.

          • Comcast has the majority share (or will have the majority share) of NBC now.

          • oops, threewickets beat me to it

          • Yep. GE supported Bush and then Obama.
            Pretty good investments for them.

          • Well, during the campaign, GE did – but they’ve since sold much of their interest to Comcast:


          • I always felt NBC, AKA GE, wanted a bailout from its GE Capitol division. It always boils down to money and GE was in BIG trouble financially in 2007 and 2008. Did they get bailed out? Were they allowed to become a bank and get TARP funds? You know damn well that money and corruption and quid pro quo were responsible. Obama and NBC most likely made a deal just like 0bama did with Big pharma, banks and Wall Street. You don’t need as much money for a campaign if a network sells out to a candidate. Tingle anyone?

        • Jeff Zucker—another Clinton basher about to meet cosmic karma. We need to make up a list and keep checking it twice.

      • Joe Scarborough and Pat Buchanon were the only exceptions.

    • I think we should have a scoring system for all the bastards in the media on their behavior during 2008. Crawford is smart enough and he wasn’t one of the egregious ones, but he definitely engaged in some group CDS with the boys when it mattered most. Nobody in media had the balls to stand up to the lies, race baiting and bashing misogyny. Despicable and shameful for America.

      • In defense of Crawford, he stood up for the Clintons and attacked his own cohort for their behavior. On the morning of the South Carolina primary, he was on Morning Joe and said:

        I have watched the coverage, and I really think the evidence-free bias against the Clintons in the media borders on mental illness. I mean, I think when Dr. Phil gets done with Britney, he ought to go to Washington and stage an intervention at the National Press Club. I mean, we’ve gotten into a situation where if you try to be fair to the Clintons, if you try to be objective, if you try to say, “Well, where’s the evidence of racism in the Clinton campaign?” you’re accused of being a naïve shill for the Clintons. I mean, I think if somebody came out today and said that Bill Clinton — if the town drunk in Columbia came out and said, “Bill Clinton last night was poisoning the drinking water in Obama precincts,” the media would say, “Ah, there goes Clinton again. You can’t trust him.” I really think it’s a problem.

        I really wish the video was still available, although you can read more about it here. Mike Barnicle’s jaw hit the floor hearing Crawford say this. Crawford had also been a nightly fixture on Olbermann up to this point, and after it Olbermann wouldn’t put him on again until the November election had passed.

      • Crawford stood up against the CDS and Obama-media a lot more than I ever saw most anyone else on cable news do.

    • As a teen, Chris Matthews said he was enthralled with Kennedy but fell hard for Nixon.

      I turned him off for good when he fell all over himself about the brilliant debate performance of Dunce Shrub in the first Gore-Bush debate. Shrub didn’t fall flat on his face, ergo, he won.

      Supposedly, Rove went to Welch at GE and said that if it didn’t sell Bu$h, then its monopoly over the airwaves would be compromised.

      If the MSM or DailyKos is selling it, run the other way!

    • I always liked Craig Crawford and remember that he was not seen again on the Olbermann show after he dared to criticize the biased campaign coverage on MSNBC. The Phil debate was was a true stunner, indeed. And that was only the beginning.

      Obviously, CC had to pay for speaking the truth. I assume he lost his job. That’s why I find it even more impressive that he has not backed off and speaks out again today …

      Does anyone know if he is still on TV? Somewhere? Or on radio? He is not only very interesting but also very charming and has a great sense of humor.

      You go, Craig!!! And thanks telling it like it was. And is.

      • just butting in –these pundits never see the irony that is right in front of their faces. In one breath, they call Bill a racist and in the next he’s asked to go campaign for someone in trouble. I wish he would tell them to take a hike.

    • From his comments:

      I am utterly appalled, confounded and embarrassed by the idiotic co-dependency of press submission to this adminstration.

  29. When authors refuse to name their sources, how is anyone able to check their facts for accuracy and their conclusions for soundness? Game Change judging from that 10 page excerpt is really a case of Crapola to the nth degree. How does anyone defend herself or himself from the insidious descriptions and charges posted in these poisonous pages? It is a hatchet job, pure and simple, and should be carefully and studiously ignored. Halperin and Heilemann are disgusting.

    • I haven’t seen a copy yet, but apparently there’s no index, either. This is intended as a here-today-gone-tomorrow effort. Serious historians wouldn’t wipe their asses with a book like this.

    • …and do they expect us to think that their “sources” are objective? But then gossip and innuendo sells, doesn’t it. Truth? Who needs it.

  30. I have to agree with those that point out that it is not just about maleness and femaleness. Many women took part in this. Jangles and TDRaicer are right – It is about power and class. It is about keeping power, class and eliteness.

    It is about not changing the system. The vehicle used was the easiest hatred – mysogyny. It was used to remind Hillary of her place. Yet she wouldn’t stop coming, like a Jason or Freddie, so their attempts grew louder, more sensational, more divorced from reality. Then Palin came along and here was another upstart, this time non-ivy league to boot. They were not having this occur again. It was bad enough that the bumpkins from Arkansas made it in there.

    I don’t think it’s totally about women – as usual we’re just being used.

    • Misogyny was the weapon, not the reason.

      • Yes and no. An awful lot of obots embraced that weapon a little too gleefully. They sure seemed to be enjoying themselves. I guess we can compromise and call it a very popular weapon.

      • There wouldn’t be any misogyny to use as a weapon if it wasn’t also a reason.

        • The people who decided Obama would be the nominee and not Hillary didn’t do it because of her gender.

          They’re the same people who tried to destroy Bill.

          • i do not think it is safe to say that they didn’t do it because of her gender just because they also tried to destroy Bill. it was an added bonus for them.

          • Eh, kind of. I think the top-down corporate masters were driven by something other than misogyny. I think the grass-roots were driven primarily by misogyny. Both tried to destroy Bill. And Hillary.

          • 100% correct!

          • Sandra S., exactly! And that weapon genie is not going back in the bottle. Women and women’s rights have taken a beating; and the erosion of our rights will continue until enough women realize that they fell for a cad with a well-rehearsed pick-up line. Hopefully, they’ll wake up before it’s too late, before we’ve lost all the ground we gained over the past four decades; but, lately, I don’t have a whole lotta hope.

          • Myiq’s right. Mysogyny is not the reason. Mysogyny was just easy to do (plenty of band wagon possibilities there) – its acceptable. But it was not the reason.

          • I’m with Thursday’s Child. There was more than one factor at work in 2008. Yes, it was party politics but it dovetailed with a groundswell of misogyny. By the time Palin hit the stage, it was out of control. I’m not sure the players who used the hate card knew that their weapon of choice would be so effective. I have to say that I was stunned by it and I’m not the most optimistic person on the planet.

          • it was both

          • And to destroy Gore. (And maybe Goldwater.) They go after any real reforming wonk.

      • Exactly my point.

      • I buy that line myiq—misogyny was the weapon of choice but the reason was deeply entrenched in the political theater and swamplands of Clinton bashing. And the Clinton hate was and is a clusterf$$k of a whole bunch of things. And TK was the leader of that pack from day 1—he wants a presidential candidate that will be the “Kennedy” pick. Thus we got Kerry; thus we got the undermining of Al Gore; thus we got 8 years of behind the scenes backstabbing of Clinton and the death of health care reform in ’92.

      • I don’t know about that, myiq. What the Democrats wanted most of all was power. With power comes money and other percs. They appear to have thought that Hillary couldn’t get them there. So, they took the ring to Minas Tirith and accepted the big money that would come with an attractive African American male. How could they lose? I think kowtowing to the special interests was secondary to achieving majorities. They probably thought Obama would be too weak to run he executive branch without help.
        In the end, they were afraid that Hillary wasn’t going to help them. The right thing to do would have been to get behind her after Kentucky, leave MI uncommitteds as uncommitteds and let them fight it out on the convention floor with the stipulation that she take him as her VP. It would have been an unbeatable combination. But by then the ring had already worked its evil magic.

    • It was both weapon and reason. It was so successful as a weapon because it played off of existing misogyny and expanded and exploited it.

      Just a small nitpick — I very much admired Clinton’s tendency to keep on plugging no matter how many body blows the nasty media and obots threw at her, but I’m not sure comparing her to homicidal, quasi-supernatural maniacal slashers like Jason or Freddie is so great. Maybe the Energizer Bunny? Even that one I find problematic.

  31. women in the democratic party let us down as well. don’t forget donna brazile. now martha coakley, who should have been a shoe-in, looks like she could face a real battle. and it is women friends that i hear bad mouthing her. our species misogyny is not limited to men. it makes me very sad to realize this.

    • This confuses me. As women, don’t we want those who represent us to be the model of our beliefs? Is it wrong for a woman to state the reasons why they don’t approve of the practices and policies of a female politician? Martha Coakley crumbled under pressure and is now supporting a republican HCR bill. We all have to live with what these people give us, and Obama is demanding congress give us crap. Why is stating that fact assumed to be women bashing women?

      I thought we were all so disappointed with the Dem party that we were planning to hold their feet to the fire and not vote for people who are not representing Democratic ideals.

      • I’m there.

      • Just one correction – the HCR bill is a Democratic bill. Can’t pass this one off on the Republicans.

        • I know that. But, based on the content, it’s a Republican bill ’cause it sure as hell isn’t good for the working class people of this country.

      • electing more male republicans is not the answer.

        • Nor is continuing to hold one’s nose and vote for a D that will buckle under the pressure of a POTUS who is on the side of lobbyists for the wealthy.

          • you totally missed the memo.
            vote for women, even if they SUCK!

          • Imo Coakley is holding out for concessions which is good strategy when the bill is probably going to pass anyway even without the 60 votes. (The GOP secretly want it too.) She balked on the House abortion language so it’s being softened.

            If Brown wins, MA is set to keep him out till the HC vote is over.

            All the Dems are giving some sort of support to this, including Hillary and Bill. Bill is campaigning for Coakley. She stood by HIllary in Denver and has a good track record on choice and gay rights.

            Brown is anti-choice, anti-gay, and tried to DENY EMERGENCY CONTRACEPTION TO RAPE VICTIMS. Cites at my blog, florasteele.blogspot.com

    • Mary, women do go along to get along and not every one of them is perfect. However electing more women would give them more cover to do the right thing.
      If we go on electing men because they lie to us about supporting our equality then we will never have equal representation.

      • TeresaINPa and indigogrl, I found your exchange upthread very enlightening and helpful and used it as the basis of a post (attributed of course). Just wanted to fyi.

        thank you. This is an excellent thread — wonderful insights thankyou everyone.

      • thank you TeresaINPa, i usually just lurk here. i think the point that i am trying to make is that women as well as men are being hyper critical of women candidates. if martha coakley had appeared in a centerfold, she would not have been taken seriously as a candidate for anything, yet scott brown’s centerfold is a giggle. martha has a record to run on so let’s pick that apart, rather than asking, what is scott brown’s record. it feels like hillary vs obama redux

  32. It is so Strange how you have to hear something over and over before you really get it.

    Last year I was vice president of my university’s student council (which is a two-year position, wherein the second year you take over as president). All year the (male) faculty advisers were hostile to me, accusing me of being too directive, of monopolizing the discussion, of being essentially a dictator. They eventually tried to have me impeached, but nobody on the council would support them on it (so, I guess they didn’t mind my leadership style). When that failed, they tried to guilt-trip me into quitting, and when that failed they basically threatened me. At which point I spoke with the university president and had a new faculty adviser named. This one is also male, and he’s a bit wishy-washy about standing up for us, but he’s not actively hostile, so I’ll take it. To be fair, though, the president at the time (a gay man) was incredibly supportive and stood up for me through the whole thing.

    But until now, I never made the connection that all of their criticisms of me were essentially that I was a pushy bitch. I got power through being legitimately elected and they resented my actually using it. Epiphany moment.

    • Wow, that’s quite a story. It’s pretty much what happened to Hillary.

      • Misogyny is at the root of the matter. Remember how the news media also trashed Hillary backers as “bitter middle aged women” ? It was kind of funny though how the age they attributed to us kept getting younger, in Iowa they said it was just women over 60, after New Hampshire suddenly it was 50 and over, then after the next win by Hillary it was women 40 and over – but in reality it was the majority of Democratic party voters female and male 35 and over, and very close to 50% of those 26-34. The Obots only held a majority for the 18-25 year olds.

  33. “I’m going to be blunt with you,” Mr. Angelides said. “It sounds to me like selling a car with faulty brakes, and then selling an insurance policy on those cars.”

    GE sold NBC but I still won’t buy anything with the GE name regardless of the sell to Comcast

    • Sounds like the bank hearings. Yes that’s a good analogy for what the hedge funds and Goldman probably did, except the insurance part comes first. For example, buy credit default swaps (insurance policy) on Lehman from AIG, then naked short sell Lehman stock to drive its price down to the ground until it defaults, then collect on the Lehman default from AIG which btw gets a giant bailout from us the taxpayers.

      Burn down a building and collect on the fire insurance, except we the taxpayers are funding the insurance claims.

  34. Oh look, you can make $685k a year working at a non profit in Daley’s Chicago.


  35. RD – thanks for being here since, hm, what – Feb 2008? It was a nightmare having been a reader and some time commenter at several blogs that went insane. Your passion and clarity provided a safe haven. Thank you for sharing your personal experience with Mr. Daou – it’s encouraging that he exists at that level. Not all are disingenuously hoodwinked(wink, wink, wink).

    The H & H hit piece took two seconds to identify, but I did read all ten pages at the NYMag site when it was first available. Some how, it came across as even more smarmy than a Lisa DePaulo(bottom feeder) hit. Brought back memories of the four non-blonde formers(Coulter, Weile, Olson, unGrace) who could read minds and conjure up specific situtations and events that only a fly(not a maggot or they would have a corner on that market) could know. This is how our millennium began – the ‘selection’ of the boy king, the media using flaming harridans who exercised no restraints in what they would say. Larry King sat with them many a night, it was all gossip, the trashier the better. This was the time I ‘discovered’ Fox for the first time – Paula Zarn’s lips knew no boundaries(apparently literally). The devaluation of human beings by our government and our media. The only political leadership we have had that can be considered democratic in the near past would be the Clinton administration which is why they are targeted. The two scariest points are 1. – there is no longer any, ANY pretense at being democratic, constitutionally adherent, practice rule of law and, 2 – the vast numbers of brain dead, greedy, lying professionals who are supposedly upheld by brain dead, and/or greedy voters.There is no masking or covering of these truths unless you’re truly mentally challenged or a lawyer(some – not all). I’ve been staring at it for ten years, watching the hate get reinforced, the attitudes formed based on mis-information and seemly being acceptable. Who we admire and what we value is so far from being what will create a world of peace, harmony, respect and justice. Those who have sacrificed the most are the ones who are going to suffer the most. Clue – they are not ego driven, but do for the good of all and require no pillar or podium.

    My fervent hope is that the Earth survives long enough for the pendulum to swing back and I live long enough to see it happen. Also, when I hear the reference, the President will speak – I don’t feel my skin crawl or shudder like I do now and did with Bu$hit. The H & H book(yawn) market – DC, NYC, Chicago and don’t forget those starZ of BOllywood – brainless miscreants that most of them are. When a supporter of a political candidate says, ‘look at the money'(initials are Chris Rock) or the wife of a presidental candidate says – ‘we are only doing this once, we will be too rich later’ or Opie goes bonkers over someone without one accomplishment -without any record of supporting any democratic issue – question this. Sigh, I’m in the wrong place to be saying this. No one here fell for this.

    I wonder if Peter Daou has any friends in high places who sees the truth also and has any shred of conscienceness and the fortitude to stand up?

  36. A link from one of the commenters at the Craig Crawford site. We all knew it was coming:

    “AP sources: Employer health mandate may be dropped”

    WASHINGTON – House and Senate negotiators working on President Barack Obama’s health overhaul bill appear likely to drop a proposed income tax increase on high-wage earners and possibly jettison a requirement for large businesses to offer coverage to their employees, Democratic officials said Tuesday.


  37. this is a quick post and run because I”m at work, but it’s worse than men don’t mentor women; what we saw in 2008 was men anti-mentoring women.

    I see it all the time at work too.

  38. “Yes, Hillary’s campaign staff let her down and there will always be a certain class of women who fall for the biting criticism of men and decide to join in. They deserve what they get and no amount of karma is bad enough for them. But it is the men of the Democratic party who let us down in 2008. And until they are gone, no woman should trust the Democratic party ever again.”

    Well said, RD!

  39. “… no woman should trust the Democratic party ever again”

    that’s it in a nutshell !

    “The last speaker alluded to this movement as being that of a few disappointed women. From the first years to which my memory stretches, I have been a disappointed woman… I was disappointed when I came to seek a profession worthy an immortal being—every employment was closed to me, except those of the teacher, the seamstress, and the housekeeper. In education, in marriage, in religion, in everything, disappointment is the lot of woman. It shall be the business of my life to deepen this disappointment in every woman’s heart until she bows down to it no longer.”

    Lucy Stone, 1855


  40. What do I admire most about HRC? She refuses to play the female as victim role. She is a woman warrior and she just rolls right over that crap and moves forward—winning wherever she can and always keeping her eye on the plain and simple truth that women’s rights are human rights and she is going to fight for them and defend them. And that is her life’s work.

  41. Men do this to women and they don’t even have a reason. Over and over again, I have seen a women achieve some managerial power through hard work and then watched as the men who worked with her or under her snipe and criticize and undermine her authority to bring her down. She only got to be where she was because of a quota or she’s sleeping with someone or she’s not really that smart. On and on it goes. I don’t think they do it consciously. It’s like some bizarre reflex.

    Here’s the truth in Halperin’s book that he probably didn’t even know he was writing: men do not mentor women. There are some exceptions but that’s the cold brutal truth. When men say that a woman is polarizing or that she won’t be effective, they are really saying they won’t follow her themselves and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. If the powers that be do not stand behind their protege and back her up, she won’t be effective. If her proposals are not treated seriously, they won’t be taken seriously. If there is no accountability for the dismissive way that others treat her, all her work will be for nothing. And that will come to haunt the powers that be because training women is expensive. You might as well not hire them in the first place if you aren’t going to take advantage of their talents. Why teach them to read?

    So what is the solution? It is certainly not a third party which will get no votes.
    More women in office is the only solution. Then we will not have to wait or hope for make mentors. Then we will know that the republican we are supporting, a woman is better than the republican that used to be there and better than the male democrat in many cases too.

  42. My solution is THE Third Party. Playing within the 2 party system right now is not the answer. Third party candidates can have a huge impact—Perot/Anderson opened the door for a Bill Clinton victory. The collapse of the Whigs opened the door for the Republican party of Abraham Lincoln.

    In the fashion of the day I say we launch our party WITH A BOOK and A BOOK TOUR. Our book, GAME FIXED: The truth sequel to Game Change.

  43. I haven’t heard/read anybody mention “THE PROGRESSIVES”. I always wondered where they came from and what exactly their agenda was/is.
    I do know that every so-called Progressive site or blog I’ve seen has been an Obamamination. How do they feel about what is happening now. I know we’re hearing a little remorse but they haven’t exactly used their pulpit for much. Every time I hear an Obot speak, I hear the talking points spouted from MSNBC, almost verbatim. NBC really has become a parody of everything thats wrong with our country right now. I wonder who is behind that. Perhaps the drug/pharma and insurance companies advertising on their network?

    • Actually Wilson was a “progressive” they then began calling themselves “liberals” when “progressive” began having a negative connotation

    • The progressive movements go to the turn of the century and came along with some of the “muckraking” literature of the day—The Jungle, Octopus etc. —-part of the movement had to do with challenging the “political bosses”. La Follette was a big name in the progressive movement in the midwest. Teddy Roosevelt was a leader in the more progressive wing of the Republican party in NYC and later, Bull Moose. TR helped make a dent in NY political reform, established the FDA in response to the exposures on meatpacking, establishing national parks and conservation even though he was a ruthless hunter.

    • I actually think the trouble Jay Leno and Conan are having are residual troubles from the backlash of many women (and men)who were Hillary supporters. We heard 3000 too many Bill and Monica (not)jokes from Jay Phlegmo and others. NBC can take one flying leap into oblivion. And especially MSNBC too. And Rachael Maddow, you really should be ashamed at what you did to Hillary!!! And CNBC….who used to kiss Bush’s tush on an hourly basis. You reap what you sow. And they have sown nothing but weeds. RIP!

  44. I believe in a higher power – but I believe in a higher power that is without a definitive sex – and until we as a society stop thinking of God or our higher power as a patriarchal being women will never move forward – maleness in an all powerful being puts us second – always second.

    We know that the priestcraft was a position of power and that the women priests and bishops were all killed off at one point because power wasn’t to be shared.

    But how do we make that shift???

  45. OK, so RD… I did not know that the Clinton campaign was that close in touch with you and familiar with this blog.
    BTW, great post!

  46. Brook’s artwork is very perceptive and beautiful.

  47. Joe Scarborough was another who defended Hillary (his “girlfriend”) constantly, and still does.

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