• Tips gratefully accepted here. Thanks!:

  • Recent Comments

    Propertius on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Propertius on The Fool
    riverdaughter on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    riverdaughter on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Propertius on “Pet Peeves”
    Ga6thDem on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Propertius on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Beata on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Beata on “Pet Peeves”
    Beata on “Pet Peeves”
    Propertius on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    William on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    HerStory Repeating on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Beata on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    William on The Welcome Escape of a M…
  • Categories


  • Tags

    abortion Add new tag Afghanistan Al Franken Anglachel Atrios bankers Barack Obama Bernie Sanders big pharma Bill Clinton cocktails Conflucians Say Dailykos Democratic Party Democrats Digby DNC Donald Trump Donna Brazile Economy Elizabeth Warren feminism Florida Fox News General Glenn Beck Glenn Greenwald Goldman Sachs health care Health Care Reform Hillary Clinton Howard Dean John Edwards John McCain Jon Corzine Karl Rove Matt Taibbi Media medicare Michelle Obama Michigan misogyny Mitt Romney Morning Edition Morning News Links Nancy Pelosi New Jersey news NO WE WON'T Obama Obamacare OccupyWallStreet occupy wall street Open thread Paul Krugman Politics Presidential Election 2008 PUMA racism Republicans research Sarah Palin sexism Single Payer snark Social Security Supreme Court Terry Gross Texas Tim Geithner unemployment Wall Street WikiLeaks women
  • Archives

  • History

    December 2009
    S M T W T F S
     12345
    6789101112
    13141516171819
    20212223242526
    2728293031  
  • RSS Paul Krugman: Conscience of a Liberal

    • An error has occurred; the feed is probably down. Try again later.
  • The Confluence

    The Confluence

  • RSS Suburban Guerrilla

    • Ginni in the spotlight
      NEW: Ginni Thomas met with Jan 6 committee IN PERSON. She did not answer my questions pic.twitter.com/5z6pypr0S9 — Annie Grayer (@AnnieGrayerCNN) September 29, 2022 New: In interview with Jan 6 cmte, Ginni Thomas reiterated her belief that the 2020 presidential election was stolen. “Yes" Cmte Chmn Bennie Thompson said when asked if Thomas said she … Con […]
  • RSS Ian Welsh

    • America Defeats Germany Again
      There’s a good article in Der Spiegel on the German energy/industrial crisis which is worth your time. Basically industries which have high energy costs are being crushed. In particular this means chemical and automotive, both big in Germany, but extends far further. (Indeed, the chemical industry was essentially invented by Germany in the 19th century, and […]
  • Top Posts

Aw, Jeez, Here comes the guilt trip: Some advice for the Deaniacs

Alright, Deaniacs and disillusioned Obots, listen up.  You guys were complete and utter fucking assholes churls to us last year but you’re new to the concept of disciplining your politicians so we feel obliged to help.  Solidarity and all that sentimental stuff.

In the past couple of days, Obama administration officials, the Villagers and the self proclaimed creative class new Villagers have declared that we are either insane or aren’t being grown up because we have either urged Congress to kill the health care reform bill or have decided that we will hold politicians accountable at the ballot box if Congress fails to follow our instructions and really reform health care.  We have been told that this may be our last chance, an opportunity like this will not happen again in our lifetimes, that if we don’t go along with a crappy bill millions of people will die and poor people will be left without health care and it will be all our fault.  God, how can we LIVE with ourselves?!  We’re the most heartless craven people on the planet.  There will be blood on our hands forever and we will wander the midnight tubes of the ethernet rubbing our hands and crying, “Out, Out, Damn Spot!”

This, you dickheads, my friends, is called a “Guilt Trip”.  Someday, you may be old enough to have adolescents (a fate you richly deserve) and they will pull this s%^& on you all of the time.  In fact, YOU did it to us last year when you told us that if we didn’t vote for Obama, women would have to go to back alley abortionists and would die, DIE!  How could we “old” women turn out backs on young, nubile, much more intelligent and beautiful Obama women and let that happen?  Didn’t we care about womens’ rights and were we too stupid to know that Democrats and not Republicans were committed to preserving them?   And how did that work out?

Here’s the thing, guys (and you are almost all guys), you and I voted these craven bastards Democrats into power.  They pitched their story to us about Change! and majorities and “getting things done” and universal health care and ending the war and improving the general welfare.  And we elected them and charged them with fulfilling those obligations to us.  Now, it is time for them to put their votes where their mouths were.  Pay up, Congresscritters.

It is not our responsibility to take the blame for a badly crafted bill that will do little to reform healthcare and may saddle us with no competition and a guaranteed consumer for insurance companies for decades to come.  It isn’t our responsibility that cost containment will be next to nothing or that patients may still end up bankrupting themselves because they can’t afford to pay the insurance they are now mandated to pay.  No, that was CONGRESS’ responsibility.  THEY are responsible for this thing they call healthcare reform.  If they want to pass a better bill, then they’d better damn well write one.

What they accomplish with a guilt trip is they take the workload and obligation off of their shoulders and they put it on YOU.  I’m sorry, but were you privy to any of the meetings where they decided what the scope of the reforms were going to be?  No, of course not.  They wheeled and dealed behind closed doors with each other and lobbyists and decided among themselves what the American people were going to get.

So, now they are faced with passing a bad bill or being forced by us to go back to their chambers and make it better before we accept it.  If they get us to feel enough guilt, they won’t have to do the work.  And if they don’t have to do the work, they won’t have to make the insurance companies and hospital lobbyists compromise.  They can proclaim their progressiveness and whine about how unfair Joe Lieberman is but they won’t have to do a single thing for you, the voter.  They can all go home for Christmas with clean consciences because they got us to feel guilty and all we did was take it and shut up about it.  Piece of cake!  Bring on the finance industry reforms and the employment crisis!

See where I’m going with this?  (Sorry I have to ask such an obvious question but after your antics of last year, it never hurts to ask.)

Real grown ups do not put up with this from children.  Why should we put up with it from our elected officials?  What real grown ups do is tell these people that they have a choice: They can do what you tell them to do and do it right or they can suffer the consequences in future elections.  Then, you have to back that warning up with actions.  You have to send money to their primary opponents.  You have to not vote for them for elected office.  You have to vote for the Green party or the socialists or some other player to be named later.  You have to turn your back on them and ignore them when they start pleading.  If you do not back your warnings up with actions, they won’t think you really mean it. And you have to keep doing it over and over again until they get the message and apologize to you and do what you want.

Don’t say it can’t be done and that these Congress people are tough and will hold out.  You can hold out longer and you have an advantage that the insurance companies don’t.

You have a vote.

And I have a vote.

And Katiebird, Bostonboomer, myiq2xu, stateofdisbelief, Kos, Jane Hamsher, Lambert, Violet Socks, Digby and every person in the lefty blogosphere and everyone they know who thinks like they do but don’t read blogs have a vote.

And those votes add up to a lot of discipline. In fact, just the prospect of you threatening to go get your belt has them thinking twice.  They’re looking at the numbers.  They’re testing you to see if you’re serious.  Be serious.

Now, I know you guys didn’t listen to us last year and you are part of the reason why we are in this predicament now.  But you can turn this around if you want and lay down the law and get what you want if you ignore the guilt trip.

Don’t fuck it up.

111 Responses

  1. What a woman!

    As the lady said a few post’s back…

    this is one RIGHTEOUS RANT!

  2. But, but…if we don’t support the so called reform, people will die…and the terrorists win…Or in South Park lingo: “you don’t hate children, do you?” It worked on everyone in Congress (Barbara Lee of All people and Krugman were spouting it). Do we dare hope that recently woken up from koolaid stupor B0bots can resist it?

  3. I listened to several Dem pundits state that they will come back because they have no place else to go. Think I heard that same thing last year.

    • Funny how they all roll out the same messages at the same time. Rather reminiscent of the election cycle in 2008 and the Republican Wurlitzer before that.
      Suddenly, we’re all told to grow up by several “very important people”. Or we’re told that we’re letting poor people down. I didn’t write that piece of crap bill. It’s not MY fault if it’s so weak that it may end up doing more harm than good. The thing has to work for ALL of us. Otherwise, it will get tagged as a welfare bill and the GOP will have a field day.
      See, this is where the bill gets extremely stupid for Democrats to pass. If it doesn’t help EVERYONE and the middle class get stuck with the burden of paying for it through subsidies, it’s going to come back to bite the Dems in the ass. They’d be doing themselves a big favor if they just said, “Know what? We’ve got to fix this. Then we’ll dump a guilt trip on Republicans for screwing the poor.”
      Seems like a no brainer to me but someone’s got to show Democrats that they have more to fear by not doing it.

    • Since I started voting in 1987 I only voted for 1 Republican. Kay Bailey Hutchinson way back when she got elected the first time. It had always been a straight Democratic ticket until last year when surprise, surprise I voted a straight Republican ticket. Next election I don’t know what I am going to do. I won’t be voting for any Dem’s any time soon though. They are toxic.

  4. “They’re testing you to see if you’re serious. Be serious.”

    I really, really hope people take the “Kill the Bill” movement seriously.

    • I don’t know if they have to kill it. They just have to send it back to committee and work on it until it’s right. Or agree to reconciliation.
      And get rid of the Stupak atrocity.
      And sit on Ben Nelson and make him scream Uncle.
      And tell the lobbyists, “No, thank you.”
      Simple shit like that might do the trick.

      • Whether they have to kill it or not — the phrase Kill the Bill — is a powerful rallying cry. It’s scary (almost as scary as Party Unity My Ass) and IMPLIES that people are ready and willing to walk away from it.

        Let Congress find a true compromise that brings people (rank-and-file democrats) back or they’ll rue the consequences

        • You have a point there katie….It can become a very powerful rallying cry!
          i think I will use it accompanied by this clip from the movie…After all…a good slogan needs a good tune eh?

          🙂

          just adding a bit of humor

          • I got both those DVD’s for my daughter when she was in college. She loved Kill Bill. She had to hide them in her dorm though because it was a Christian college.

        • I think it makes a great rallying cry too. Kill the bill is catchy.

        • I’ve been saying it for a long time–once I took a gander at some of the House bill.

          Do you know that, except for Reid and his little cabal, no one knows if the bill has even been WRITTEN!

          I listened to the clerk read the amendment. Conyers was right when he said “you need 2 lawyers to understand it.”

          KILL THE BILL!

        • Word, Katiebird.

          KILL THE BILL!

          And take no prisoners!

      • Wouldn’t that have to involve Obama switching sides?

  5. Howard Dean sold his soul to force Obama on us. Fuck Howard Dean!

    • Howard Dean’s soul may or may not exist. The fact that it is already consigned to a fiery fate is no concern of ours.
      I don’t like Howard Dean and didn’t like him when he was popular. I’m picky that way. In fact, the only thing I really appreciated about Dean was his scream. But he’s finally coming around to the reality of this health care reform debacle. We don’t have to support him but his followers need some help.

      • Howard Dean may be an idiot on many issues.

        Health care is not one of them.

        What he is now saying about this bill … you can take to the bank. (Or not. If they pass this sucker none of us will be taking *anything* to the bank.)

      • Most of DFA is/was middle aged. So I am not sure why you equate the two groups unless you are also making the mistake that the media did in 2004.

        BTW, where is Clark in all of this? How about Kerry and his rancid supporters from 2004?

        At least Dean is telling the truth about the HCRA now, unlike everyone else.

    • Dean’s a pol, not a progressive messiah. But he is dead-on right about this health care bill, and that’s the battle we are concerned with at the moment.

      Let’s not let our dislike of someone interfere with doing what’s right for the country.

      • Egg-zackly!!

      • Ditto. I’ll never forgive or forget Dean’s part in the primary theft, and there’s probably not a chance in hell that I’d ever vote for him if he ran for anything, but he’s doing the right thing on this god-awful Obamacare, so I’m not going to fight him.

      • WMCB, you’re right. I felt the same way when Lieberman put up his road block.

        This is a bad bill and needs to be stopped.

    • Dean can and will do whatever he wants with his coalition and advance his 48 state stratergy whatever way he pleases in the future, but unless he’s been in a coma for the past six months, I don’t buy that he only just now figured out that this was an industry bailout. This is way late to be pushing to kill this bill. He needs to start talking up singlepayer Medicare for All and swinging the pendulum back to the left. Then I’ll give what he says more weight. Otherwise his opposition is just theater.

      • And, I don’t mean the way he has compromised the concept of Medicare for All up to now, I mean going completely rogue and saying screw incremental BS–we tried supporting incremental BS and all we got was K-Street’s lousy mandate.

      • I think he just hit a point where anymore compromise tipped the scale from being something he could grudgingly support or at lease keep quiet about and something that would hurt the country and people.

    • Howard Dean needs to tell the fucking truth about how he and the DNC were behind the rigging of the nomination for WHATEVER reason before I give one shit about what he says. You broke it, you own it.

  6. Don’t fuck it up.

    They will.

    • I don’t know about that. Power can be addicting,

    • Someone’s been watching RuPaul’s Drag Race…

      What’s next? Lip-syncing for your life?

      Come to thing of, with that teleprompter…

    • Funny.

      I just posted the same thing down a ways.

      They *will* fuck it up. That is a given.

      But… even so. If we can align as PUMAs, Deaniacs and GOP-ers on just this one “Kill the Bill” issue. We might be able to stop them.

  7. I wouldn’t link to the Cheeto if this wasn’t so very relevant to the topic
    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/12/16/815429/-No-One-Is-Going-To-Save-You-Fools
    a “here’s how we did it to you” post

    He’s sold you out because he’s not afraid of you. And really, if I may be so bold, he shouldn’t be afraid of you. You don’t know who really runs the show, and you’re far too fickle and manipulable to count on.

    • That is TINS. He should know a fool when he sees one, since he sees one in the mirror every morning.

      “What an ass… Hillary Clinton stole Nevada!!!”, he said shrilly, fire flaming through his hair! Gawd, he just makes me laugh every time I see his posts.

      Eyes watering even as we speak.

      • Yeah, I saw that last night. He is an idiot.

      • Oh, I remember him! Isn’t he the guy who knew that Hillary was stealing Nevada because there was a Latino man and a white woman who were “claiming” to be married? And also the guy who opined that Latinos were voting based on Hillary being the only English word they knew?

        Got to love tge anti-racist Obots.

      • he is such a silly little ass. He once told me I was immoral because of my stance on abortion.

    • But he’s wrong about Obama being a nice guy. He’s not. If he were a nice guy, he would have distanced himself from the misogynism and the vote cancelling last year. He didn’t.

      • No he’s not a nice guy, he’s an ill-mannered petulant jerk when things don’t go his way. (The shoulder brush-off & flipping Hill the finger proved that.)

      • You got that right!

        The dem party “sold you out.”. Over at LR, there’s a quote (It may be John’s): that BO “is the errand boy delivering the bill from the grocery store.”

        He’s no leader. the other day when several bankers opted out of a mtg at the WH due to bad weather. My first thought was, I don’t think they would have canceled a mtg with LBJ.

    • Went and read that post. Jeesh….Why do I feel like I need to shower now?

      anyway…

      This comment struck me….

      Why aren’t we out protesting? Why aren’t any of us making noise about healthcare? This should be our call to get out there and kick some butt. I don’t know if it’s that we dont have enough money behind us, but surely there must be at least some seed $ to get going.

      I think we are just waiting for a leader. That’s where Obama is failing. He should be out there telling us all to call our congressmen and senators. He should be shouting from the mountains. Instead, he’s scared, just like the author says. Great diary. Sad state of affairs

      The last part infuriated me!

      You mean to tell me that you NEED someone to tell you that your being screwed?

      You need someone to tell you that you mean absolutely nothing to the powers that be?

      You mean to tell me you need someone to free your mind so your ass can follow?

      No wonder Obama was such a big hit with the “Kooks!”

      Those people are truly some of the saddest excuses for thinking beings I’ve ever come across.

      • They’re young and stupid. At least I hope they’re young. Otherwise they’re just stupid.

        • I know a guy who believes we’ll soon have a female President, because there’s one on tge show “24.” See, the reason Hillary lost is because the American people aren’t conditioned to accept the idea of a female President. President Palmer (of “24”) paved the way for Obama, and now that Jack Bauer reports to a woman, it’s a done deal!

          • lol

          • Have to admit, I got hooked on Commander in Chief, with Gena Davis playing POTUS. Remember that? Awesome concept. It piloted and was yanked after about 6 episodes. Probably caused a misogynist meltdown that made ABC cave. (I think it was abc…).

          • Oh, that was a good show–though it featured evil Hill bashing Obot Keifer’s Dad. Though, he’s Canadian so probably can’t vote. Geena Davis is great! I think a bunch of extra episodes came out on DVD.

          • Donald Sutherland did make a great evil Speaker however….
            I’ll try to find those dvds, would be a good pick-me-up escape right about now…

      • Delusional—still!

  8. Why is the purpose of principle such a difficult thing to understand?

    Some things are non-negotiable–period. There is more power in standing firm (in the long-run) than selling out. If the excuse of “this is the best we can do” was not always acceptable, we’d be much better off on all fronts.

  9. This entry reminds me of the advice Wes Clark gave John Kerry in 2004: “Don’t give them am inch, don’t ever retreat”. We know how Kerry took it.

  10. This may be OT, but it’s hilarious:

    • Can Al Franken be majority leader please?

    • I LOVE Al Franken. Damn, I have to put a donation on monthly autopay.
      I will never regret the tiny bit of filthy lucre I sent his way. Money well spent.
      Give me more Al Franken! More! More! More!

      • I love him too. I never got him on Saturday Night Live, but after listening to him regularly on AAR, I quickly learned to love him.

        • He was a hoot on SNL. I remember the first time I saw him was when he did The Al Franken Decade. It’s too bad SNL doesn’t allow clips on youtube. You have to see it performed. The transcript doesn’t do it justice.

    • Did you see this one of Franken vs Thune? Very Lying Liars.
      Way to go, Al!

  11. This post reminds me of a memorable scene from The Maltese Falcon (one of my favorite movies). It occurs near the end of the movie, where everyone is sitting around Sam Spade’s apartment waiting for the arrival of the “black bird”. Sydney Greenstreet is threatening Bogart with some sort of nefarious action if Bogart doesn’t go along with the plan for the bird. Greenstreet says that there are actions besides killing Bogart that can be especially unpleasant. Bogart says that, while that statement is probably true, none of those threats has any substance without the threat of death behind them.

    To me, that’s a good analogy for the present situation: no threats from the Dem/formerly Dem base have any substance unless people are willing to walk away from the deal–and walk away under any conditions. As RD says, that may mean voting for a Green, a Socialist, a Repub or a black widow spider, but if you say it, you have to believe it and mean it. Unfortunately, I still see too many on the faux left blogs saying that they just can’t bring themselves to vote for a non-Dem. My response to them is: if you voted for Obama, you’ve already voted once for a Republican. Now, be prepared to do it again for a truly worthwhile cause–not just to put a prima donna into office.

  12. I had always gotten this vibe from BO during the election process that was very similar to the one I had gotten form W at the start of W’s long and unfortunate career as POTUS. I never expected that things would go well for working class Americans with BO at the helm, but he has far exceeded my expectations.

    Who has BO ever helped during his brief and splendid political career but himself?

  13. Poll says Americans today approve the Dem party by 30%, the Repubs by 28 and the Tea Party by 41%.

  14. Why do Senators do this formal “my colleague on the other side of the aisle” civility while they rip on each other? Maybe medieval jousting and dueling served a worthwhile public purpose.

    • Senate desks aren’t allowed to be bolted down, because when the other Senator attacked Charles Sumner with the cane, he was trapped under the weight of the desk and unable to escape or fight back. 😉

  15. I’m a happy boy tonite.
    I’m going to forget about the back stabbing wankers, aka Democrat Party, for a while and turn wrenches on my grandson’s ride, a 1980’s Pontiac Trans-Am.
    I’ll enjoy depleting the oil reserves of a third world nation and raising the global temperature by 5 degrees every time I twist the key.
    I figure we’re all boned anyway and crying about it doesn’t help. Might as well have some pre-smog fun.
    Obama, Dean, Pelosi, Baucus, Kerry, Reid, they all got theirs and are living large on our dime so what the hell.
    First thing I’ll do after I get it running is see how long it takes to melt the tires to the cords and to pay for it I’ll use the money I was going to donate to the Dem campaign funds. Those guy can go begging to Big Pharma and Big insurance since they seem will to bend over for them.

  16. OT, but someone posted this on twitter:

    Hot guys and baby animals

  17. Has anyone read the new post up at Hillaryis44 about the “Byrdlock” top stop the bill? Do you think it’s a viable solution to stopping the Obamination Health Insurance scam? What can we do to stop this?

  18. I just read a Guilt Trip post on Huffington Post that said actually Obama is doing great and once the economy improves he’ll be doing even better, and besides Obama is not to blame for all the suckitude during his administration, it’s Bush’s fault and the fault of a “divided Democratic party that has, in many ways, betrayed him” ….

    yeah funny that the party is divided, that has nothing to do with the scorched earth campaign that Axelrod and Obama and his nutroots ran.

    • Flashback ’08: Obama sold himself as a singularly unique figure to bring out the best in people in Washington and make it work, it was his cool unflappable judgment that was supposed to make the difference, and after he won he said don’t worry about the team he’s assembling…

      “The vision for change comes from me” –President-elect Barack Obama

      • Is it just me, or is he the worst candidate in history? And possibly the worst campaign? He brings nothing. He’s absurd. It’s nonsense piled on top of nonsense. Maybe he wasn’t hired by the Bush family, maybe he was hired by Democratic insiders as a joke to see how much they can get away with. This wouldn’t even make a good movie script.

  19. Interesting. The truth that the Obamabots cannot see is seen very clearly indeed by those on the right. Hillary would NOT have screwed up healthcare like this. From commenters on HotAir:

    We should all be on our knees nightly thanking god that the Democrat who got the nod was as incompetent as Barack Obama, and not as competent as Frau Pantsuit. If she had won, I suspect this would already be law.

    JohnGalt23 on December 17, 2009 at 7:10 PM

    Oh, agreed. Had we been dealing with Hillary or a Lyndon Johnson, this would have been a done deal a long time ago. It’s only because we have the three stooges combo of Pelosi, Reid, and Obama that this atrocity hasn’t been perpetrated on the American people yet.

    Matt Helm on December 17, 2009 at 8:56 PM

    Agreed! The ONLY thing that has delayed that disaster is mass incompetence on the part of the Democrats!

    Dark-Star on December 17, 2009 at 9:52 PM

    • Hillary would have presented a proposal of her own and worked with both sides. Where’s BO’s. Where was his stimulus proposal? Pelosi/Reid are running the show and as I said up thread, he’s the errand boy.

      • I don’t know if Hill would have necessarily submitted a proposal of her own, but I do think she would have had a very clear idea of what needed to be in a bill that would actually be worthy of being called “healthcare reform” and that she would be very capable of communicating that to Pelosi and Reid.

        I don’t even know if it’s Pelosi/Reid running the show… I think Obama is getting exactly the bill he has been trying to get for the last six months. He was always trying to evolve away from a public insurance option. That was “just rhetoric,” like Naftagate.

  20. I am still reeling over Bill Clinton’s statement.

    • As persuasive as Bill can be,even he can’t convince me it’s a good bill just by saying it will do things without explaining how it will do those things. Really not one of his finest moments, but the material he has to work with is that bad.

      As far as don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good, that ship has sailed, we left perfect and good behind many many compromises ago. The current situation can be better summed up as “don’t let corporate welfare be the enemy of sensible reform that would actually be popular if it were on the table!”

    • I don’t mind paying taxes to cover these individuals.

  21. Good rant, RD.

    But you are talking to an affin wall.

    They *will* fuck it up. That is a given.

  22. […] And all they have as remedy is guilt trips […]

  23. Axelrove out it front again, using the same thugish same ole same ole weapon of choice that’s soooooooo effective when needing to cower resistance to another Obama failure (behavior modification at it’s best) when used on most group think Liberals. (Clybrun dose it better). The MO , insult the victim call them crazy or racist whatever works (Dean crazy , Jane Hamsher racist for the black face by none other than Lanny Davis), until of course they are cowered and STFU. Then after it’s over and the abuser has won, again, remind the poodle that the attack was caused by their silly misguided objection and was for their own or greater good. Followed by the kisses, look how wonderful the Obama is for forgiving your misguided indiscretions and keeping you in the fold (Axelroves conference call with Kos et all).
    I agree with offering support, but as we have seen, time and time again, with this crowd, they always cower and return for the next Obot beating and the cycle continues! And it still creeps me out to see the dance unfold.

Comments are closed.

%d bloggers like this: