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Open Thread: Is Obama a Socialist?

If only he was! We might be getting real Health Care Reform right now. Google defines a Socialism as follows

socialism (uncountable)

  1. Any of various political philosophies that support social and economic equality, collective decision-making, and public control of productive capital and natural resources, as advocated by socialists.
  2. The socialist political philosophies as a group, including Marxism, libertarian socialism, democratic socialism, and social democracy.
  3. (Leninism) The intermediate phase of social development between capitalism and full communism. This is a strategy whereby the State has control of all key resource-producing industries and manages most aspects of the market, in contrast to laissez faire capitalism.
  4. (Classical Marxism) The international communist society where classes and the state no longer exist.

I don’t see how this description fits the President at all. But I could be wrong. Why don’t we ask him? Ever since the primaries ended, some people have adopted right wing memes about Obama, (like that he is a Socialist) and claimed them to be the truth. Some of these people have even called themselves PUMAs. How rude! The Hillbuzz boys are a good example. Many of us really enjoyed their site at one point. But some time in 2008, they went off the deep end began spouting right wing birther nuttery about how Islam and ACORN is trying to take over the world and how Dick Cheney kept America safe and is a champion for Gay Rights. *spits out water* Since then, most liberals have been driven from their website, and it is now an echo chamber for reactionary conservatives. This morning, I was bored, and I saw that they had posted yet another loony article about how textbooks are indoctrinating children with political correctness and a belief in Climate Change or some such other thing, so I left a comment.

This website is more and more becoming an echo chamber for wingbat conservatives. I still love it, but I used to love it more. I don’t think I’ve seen an actual substantive post that didn’t have something to do with demonizing liberals, calling Bam a “socialist” (falls over laughing)or spouting some nuttery about how ACORN is taking over the world in months. There has been nothing about Health Care, nothing about the continuation of Bush’s wiretapping policies and torture, nothing about the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Nothing. Once upon a time, this website was wonderful. Now this morning’s post is about how… er

Europe is a weak, crippled, pathetic continent where once mighty societies once stood. It sure doesn’t seem like a coincidence the devolution of Europe coincides perfectly with its catering to all of this PC, pretend everything’s rosey, insist Muslims are Care Bears crap.

I’m sorry, but I just had to say something.

The Hillbuzz boys proceeded to ban me, and then wrote several subsequent comments about my evil partisan leftism and how I was trying to “censor” them. They called me a “good little Democrat” and so on and so forth. They defended themselves by saying they had never claimed to be liberal and had always explained that they were “moderates.”

If moderates and conservatives mounted a years-long effort to take back our schools and install boards who’d fight the Islamization of our curriculums and the re-writing of history in PC-terms, then maybe we can push back against these Alinsky/ACORN radicals before they take permanent hold of young minds and send America down the tubes alongside Europe.

I should be ashamed of myself! I’m just going to go back to destroying America with my socialism now. I only tell this story because it goes back to the Jones controversy. Idiot Right wingers should never be taken seriously. The Hillbuzz boys did, and look at what happened to them.

This is an open thread.

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54 Responses

    • I’m guessing PajamasMedia is conservative so they forgot to add all the liberals that are under Obama’s bus.

  1. Omg, yeah! We need conservatives to take over our school boards! Why that’s just what we need! We need things that certainly haven’t happened. Hey gosh, I wonder why they never thought of that? It would’ve saved me a lot of trouble, I had a hell of a time learning Arabic after the takeover.

    • The Hillbuzz boys are clearly full of it. I don’t recall my textbooks in school being like that at all. If they had a bias, it was conservative. You should have seen all the BS I had to read in my American Government class.

      • Yeah, first off half of us are using books that are 40 years out of date, anyway. Second, they can put a tiny section about First Nations in the back of the newer textbook, and it will just get skipped right over anyway. All we ever learned was teach to the test–and whose idea was it again to have all these stupid standardized tests where you don’t retain any information afterward? Oh yeah!

  2. The Hillbuzz boys……..

    They always had a Libertarian/log Cabin political mentality. It was odd that they were allegedly Hillary supporters since their political philosophy would be an anathema to her.

    • I’ve met a few Hillary supporters who have turned conservative because of the elections last year. While some here voted for McCain as a protest vote, there were some who blamed liberals for electing Obama and are now 100% Republican apologists. Sadly, one woman I know has now started defending Bush when she’s been a Dem her entire life. Alas, this is the fault of some Dem leaders for telling people they were no longer needed in the party. I was never a reader of Hillbuzz but maybe that is what happened to them.

      • I personally just think they lost their marbles. I remember how much I loved their site during the primaries. Back then I didn’t always agree with them (yes, they were actually centrists once), but I respected that because they were so intelligent and thoughtful and fair, and they were very involved and very emotionally invested in the campaign.
        I think that they had a lot of Obot friends- close friends, who abandoned them. Other close friends died. They mentioned that some of them lost their jobs, and all of it was done to them by obots.
        What they went through was really terrible, and I feel sorry for them, but it seems like a combination of things caused them to lose it.
        I don’t know about more conservative women who liked Hillary in General, but those who defected and became republicans could have just been conservative all ready but didn’t know it. I know that’s what happened to Afrocity.
        But I’m more like Cinie. This election actually just made me realize how liberal I am, not the other way around.

        • You know it’s interesting, but I think a lot of people were affected more than they knew. I know a woman who’s given me a hard time for defending Palin, though she can’t stand Obama, but the other day she told me I was part of the problem for doing so much work for Deval Patrick when he ran against Kerry Healey. She said she’s now open to voting for moderate Repub women, which is a big change. I don’t think her views have changed but she just doesn’t believe in the Democratic Party anymore.

          • I mean she thinks they’re all phonies, frauds, and liars, not that she doesn’t believe in alleged Dem principles.

          • It is amazing how Election 2008 has changed so many people. Before Obama I supported any and all Dems, no questions asked. I am still a Dem but more of an Independent because I no longer feel the need to vote for Dems like Obama who act like Repubs and get elected solely on cult of personality. I think that by the time Obama finishes his term in office, a lot of liberals will feel the same way your friend does. That they no longer believe in the Dem Party. That the Dems work in the interest of corporations and aren’t much different from the Repubs. There will be a lot more Independents and liberals sitting out the election in protest. And some will even feel okay with voting for a Repub. It’s amazing how much Obama has destroyed the Dem Party. The full extent of the damage isn’t clear yet but it is enough for the Dems to lose big in 2010 and for Obama to lose in 2012.

        • I feel the same way. I feel more liberal than at any other time in my life. Now I understand that my core beliefs are more liberal than any of the so-called liberals in the news, on MSNBC, and our current administration. I’m very proud of my decision not to support Obama and my opinion of him back in early 2008 is confirmed more each day. My friends no longer criticize me because they now see that they lacked my foresight about how bad Obama could be in office.

    • Well, you can’t be a gay man and not love Hillary. Even Gay Conservatives can’t help themselves. Just ask David Brock. 😛

  3. LOL Hillbuzz is a joke. I enjoyed its snark once upon a time when it was just Clinton vs. Obama, but not anymore. Only reactionary, right-wing nutjobs post there now. I wouldn’t visit it anymore.

  4. I have never been to Hillbuzz. Sounds like I’m not missing much.

  5. I didn’t read hillbuzz as much as other people, I enjoyed their “don’t be eeyore” snark during the very last days of the election, that’s about it… their politics always seemed tea party to me even before the tea party stuff started. When the first thing they said after the election was whoops we underestimated the generational change or something along those lines… I dunno, maybe they really did underestimate, but it seemed goofy to me.

  6. from the last thread, it was in spam before

    I swear, I think more voters were put off by Obot behavior than by Obama’s deficiencies.

    they kept saying Obama was inspiring and had this unique ability to inspire like no other…so I looked around at what he was inspiring–a Democratic party leadership that stayed silent while the MSM called half their voters expendable stupid old low information low class racist bitches on a daily basis.

  7. 1. No, Obama is not a socialist.

    2. I’ve never frequented HillBuzz, but people have emailed me stuff from them. It’s horrible, wingnut, vicious crap, completely indistinguishable from something you’d get from Freeperville or Little Green Nutballs. I think it’s disgusting they even associate themselves with Hillary.

    • Violet! *jumps up and down* Hi Violet! I wuv you!

      I know, some of the stuff they’ve said about Michelle Obama is pretty stunning. I’ll admit I’m not her biggest fan and I think her clothes are nothing short of hideous (as if that is supposed to matter), but I would never stoop so low as to say some of the vicious, mysoginystic crap they’ve spewed about her.

      • That doesn’t surprise me with that “textbooks subversively show men cooking and women fixing cars” stuff, WTF?

        • I know. They have been writing some pretty loony stuff as of late, but I just couldn’t resist with that post. My fingers were itching.
          “Tell them how goofy they are, Isis… do it.”

  8. Hi, back! Gee, what a nice welcome! Jumping and everything!

    Hillary is classy and gracious, not to mention a feminist and a liberal. How can HillBuzz even dare to name themselves after her? It offends me.

    • I KNOW, right? I swear, some of the shit they’ve written in the past six months. I’ll never forget when they first wrote that post about how Cheney is a champion for gay rights. There were still some Hillary supporters and other liberals hanging around there. I remember just rubbing my eyes and blinking, thinking my eyes were playing tricks on me.

      • Anyone who defends Bush and Cheney are no better than the Obots they criticize. It’s time to take off the rose colored glasses and be critical of both Repubs and Dems who place the needs of corporatists ahead of working and middle class America.

    • Can you imagine if she came across it? It’s like parody. Saudis are engaged in a conspiracy to bribe textbook publishers to indoctrinate us in wahabbism. And to really keep it on the dl, so we the textbook users won’t figure it out.

  9. young lady you have now officially made it as a writer.
    You have been banned for the first time.
    It used to be if you wanted a movie or a book to be a hit the best thing that could happen to it was to be ” banned in Boston.”



    • haha! Thanks, bb!

      Anyway, I’m off to bed now, my pretties. You’ll have to gobble amongst yourselves. Tomorrow is labor day, which means it is party tiemz :p

  10. Funny, I saw that happen on Hillbuz. I was thinking that I would stop reading any site that stood up for Van Jones. Now that is someone I did not think should have ever had a WH job in any administration. We should all be looking out for extremists on either side of the spectrum. We need to find a middle way to be able to get through these times.

  11. Great post, littleisis. I love all your contributions.
    I feel the same way about Hillary Is 44; their commenters have tilted so far to the right that I can’t enjoy the site anymore.

    • I still like Hillary is 44 but you need to ignore a few of the things like today’s post thanking Glenn Beck. But some of their stuff is on point and their archives are great.

  12. So, can anyone explain to me Josh Marshall’s theory about Sarah Palin’s secret plan to pass Bristol Palin’s baby off as hers? Was she going to use her voodoo magic to prevent anyone from noticing that Bristol was getting bigger and bigger as the campaign progressed, since it’s not like there would be any scrutiny from bats—- insane, virulently misogynistic obsessivly hostile media figures or anything. Is she just too dumb to know what “abortion” is, because it seems like forcing the kid to have one would be the easier route for someone so Machiavellian, unscrupulous, and indifferent. He’s clearly given this a lot of thought,

  13. Damn — spammy is still up.

    Josh is a c h a u v i n i s t p i g.

  14. Sometime I can post and sometimes I can’t.

    Tonight is a can’t night.

  15. Good night spammy.

  16. Of course Obama is a socialist. I guess you are just out of the loop and do not know of the secret plan of nationalizing Goldman& Sachs’ assets as well as all the banks & Wall Street as well as empowering (GM) unions.
    As for PC – it’s been my pet peeve since the 80’s. It was a RW think tank product, meant to turn the tables on liberals – making the conservatives look free spirited cool and funny – when making racist, sexist and other hateful remarks, while the liberals would be the tight asses prim despots who interfered with their “freedom”. The ploy was so successful – with movies, TV shows and comedy routines sporting it as title – that to this day people are misusing it. But at Hillbuzz, it seems it’s used in the original intended meaning.

    • I swear I’ve seen comments at many different sites, when all the conservatives who have made outrageous offensive comments and kept their jobs that they’re just being brave anti-pc heroes fighting against the stream. They’re so unPC they want everyone they disagree with fired. The disconnect is amazing.

  17. As for your opening comment on signature issue and only now setting the do’s and don’ts—-how about:

    Not ready on day 1 or day 101 or day 1001.

    • Sorry, I got this post mixed up with the one above.

      As for the question, “is O a socialist”. Folks why try to fit socialist, communist or other labels of the 19th and 20th century on modern politics. The original definitions of these labels quoted from the dictionary may fit some of the original political ideas of these movements but they do not fit the reality of today. By those definitions, I think you would be hard put to find a true socialist today. It’s like trying to decide if a “conservative” is a Torey or a Whig or a Burkean.

  18. Obama is not a socialist. He’s a crony capitalist whose policies are fostering the kind of banking and other monopolies this country hasn’t seen in a century.

    The problem is that the whole political spectrum has shifted rightward in the last couple decades. Hillbuzz may be “moderate” on the new spectrum, but from my perspective on what is now apparently the radical left, they’re pretty firmly entrenched on the loony right. They’re beginning to sound a lot like the Randies at Atlas Shrugs with the obsession with Islam and the commie-commie batshittery. Last week on another site I was called a communist and a traitor and then–apparently in all seriousness–the same poster informed me I “didn’t know shit about socialism.”

    I’m not sure why we’re enjoying this boomerang rebound back to the McCarthyite Fifties unless it’s displacement. I’m beginning to think that for right-wingers “Muslim” is the new “n*****,” with all the hideous stereotypes of Black men now projected onto Muslim men–many of whom, conveniently, happen to be Black.

    (Boring but probably requisite disclaimer: above comment applies to rightwingers a la Pamela Geller, not to feminists genuinely concerned with abuse of women in many developing Middle Eastern and African countries.)

  19. Contrary to popular belief, socialism is not a political system; it is an economic system distinct from capitalism.

    The core idea is that the State (or various types of communities) shall own together the means of production, that is to say that private ownership is limited to individual items.

    Out of that have different philosophies historically evolved and there is very little in common between different POLITICAL implementations. For example social-democracy rejects the idea of state ownership of the means of production and limits it to some core structures (defense, police, public services) of national interests. In some cases some industries can be owned in majority by the State but it has to do with strategic assets for the country and is often related to defense. It’s not question of owning banks, agriculture and most civil industries.

    There are practically no socialist states in the world today except Cuba and North Korea . Obama is no more socialist than I am the Pope. He is only the legal manager of a capitalist state. His policies and ideas stand far to the right to the majority of current European conservative leaders, inclusive the major ones.

    In the ideological battle between regular Right Wingers and more classic conservatives on one side and liberals/progressives on the other, he curiously reminds of Ebert during the Weimar Republic. I hope it’s not the case, because what Ebert indirectly produced resulted in a World War.

  20. I like this site and HillBuzz because both love and get what Hillary is all about and are committed, in their own way, to the betterment of this country.

  21. I have to say I agree with some of the commentators at Hillbuzz with what was being said about Muslims.

    I am a Muslim woman myself, I am not American but was extremely disappointed with the misogyny last year in the American elections. As most of you already know America sets the standards for the rest of the world, it is because of your country that my life as a Pakistani Muslim woman in Singapore is very different than my life would have been in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia. I believe the rights of women in Singapore mirrors the rights of women in America and I am very thankful for American feminist and hence the disappointment at what happened last year.

    Anyway why do I agree with some of the commentators at Hillbuzz. Well I don’t know about what is happening with textbooks in the US but the truth is with the extreme misogyny and violence in countries like Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, I am so glad I was neither born nor did I grew up there.

    Why has there not been a world boycott against Pakistan and Saudi Arabia similar to the South Africa boycott? Because Racism trumps misogyny and white man do not want to be called racist. I will never ever marry a Muslim because they are misogynist, they are raised that way. So the two links (provided by a commentator at Hillbuzz) about the rapes in Sweden committed by the Muslim men there, I do believe Muslim men from extreme misogynistic Muslim countries are more misogynist than say white men in the US ( and yes I know white men are no angels).

    So it is time feminist and blogs such as this stop being so kind about the vile misogyny in Islam just because you are afraid of being called racist. As you can tell my writing skills are not the best not as good as some of you here. But I just wanted to put my point of view here that as a Muslim women, Muslim men disgust me and even I am afraid of them so you can imagine the hell and trouble these Muslim men from extremely misogynistic Muslim countries bring to countries like Sweden, Canada and the US. And nobody, nobody says anything because for some reason holding men of colour of accountable for misogyny is racist. I believe the so called liberal men in the media used this excuse to accuse white feminist of being racist and not giving a damn about women of colour. That is not how I see it.

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