• Tips gratefully accepted here. Thanks!:

  • Recent Comments

    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Perspective.
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Perspective.
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Perspective.
    thewizardofroz on Perspective.
    riverdaughter on Perspective.
    James Bowater on Perspective.
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on In spite of it all…
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on In spite of it all…
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Happy Thanksgiving!
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Happy Thanksgiving!
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Happy Thanksgiving!
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Happy Thanksgiving!
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on In News: GA SOS thrown under b…
    Ga6thDem on In News: GA SOS thrown under b…
    William on In News: GA SOS thrown under b…
  • Categories


  • Tags

    abortion Add new tag Afghanistan Al Franken Anglachel Atrios bankers Barack Obama Bernie Sanders big pharma Bill Clinton cocktails Conflucians Say Dailykos Democratic Party Democrats Digby DNC Donald Trump Donna Brazile Economy Elizabeth Warren feminism Florida Fox News General Glenn Beck Glenn Greenwald Goldman Sachs health care Health Care Reform Hillary Clinton Howard Dean John Edwards John McCain Jon Corzine Karl Rove Matt Taibbi Media medicare Michelle Obama Michigan misogyny Mitt Romney Morning Edition Morning News Links Nancy Pelosi New Jersey news NO WE WON'T Obama Obamacare OccupyWallStreet occupy wall street Open thread Paul Krugman Politics Presidential Election 2008 PUMA racism Republicans research Sarah Palin sexism Single Payer snark Social Security Supreme Court Terry Gross Texas Tim Geithner unemployment Wall Street WikiLeaks women
  • Archives

  • History

    September 2009
    S M T W T F S
     12345
    6789101112
    13141516171819
    20212223242526
    27282930  
  • RSS Paul Krugman: Conscience of a Liberal

  • The Confluence

    The Confluence

  • RSS Suburban Guerrilla

  • RSS Ian Welsh

    • Happy Thanksgiving
      Be happy and be well. Please be careful about Covid. Viral load matters for infection, spending hours in a house with people is a great way to get infected. Feel free to use comments to discuss topics unrelated to recent posts. I’m doing my annual fundraiser. If you like my writing and can afford to, […]
  • Top Posts

Dear Mr. Fantasy…Dreaming of 2012

Relax and let yourself dream

Relax and let yourself dream

This story is a couple of days old; but since I don’t watch TV anymore, I didn’t hear about it until today. It seems that two of MSNBC’s most enthusiastic koolaid-slurpers, Keith Olberman and Eugene Robinson, had a discussion on last Thursday night’s Countdown about whether President Obama could find himself with primary challengers in 2012 if he doesn’t pass a strong health care bill with a public option. Here’s the video:

Rasmussen Reports took note of the suggestion.

Olbermann said the president has “compromised on everything so far and as self-defeating as it may be, the progressive caucus and progressives would abandon him if necessary, if this was to be the policy of this administration into 2012. If it’s necessary to find somebody to run against him, I think they’d do it, no matter how destructive that may seem.”

But just over a month ago, before the president signaled a willingness to give up on the so-called public option element of his health care reform plan, voters were evenly divided over whether Hillary Rodham Clinton would challenge Obama for the Democratic Party’s presidential nomination in 2012. Clinton, after all, was a very close second for the party’s nomination last year.

In fact, Rasmussen took a poll.

In a hypothetical match-up between the two most formidable female candidates in their respective parties, Clinton defeats former Alaska Governor Sarah Palin 51% to 39%, according to a new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey of likely U.S. voters. Seven percent (7%) prefer some other candidate.

Clinton performs better against Palin than President Obama who in a hypothetical 2012 match-up beats last year’s GOP vice presidential nominee by just six points, 48% to 42%.

And keep in mind that Hillary Clinton is the only administration official with a postive approval rating. Here she is meeting with Nelson Mandela in August of this year.

09f9a9dd-98e8-47e7-a6bd-4dee10732bca_600

In a trip around the “progressive” blogs today, I found some highly negative comments about Obama’s performance–especially the signals he is sending about the public option not being essential to health care reform. Here’s one from the big Cheeto:

He does not represent Liberals! He is a continuation of George W. Bush, from the War in Afghanistan, to TARP, to the lack of Transparency, to Gitmo, to Rendition, to Torture Secrecy, to Disregard for the Environment, to Lobbyist Appointments, to the Toothless DOJ….What bitter Irony! If the winger-morans understood anything at all about Pres Obama they would be cheering in the streets at his utterly Conservative ideals.

And from Huffpo:

Miles Zaremsky

The sine qua non of Obama’s candidacy was not only “change”, but believability. He also represented on the campaign trail a beacon of hope (remember that word) that attracted millions of supporters and converts from the ways of the last eight years. Now, without a public option as part of his health care reform package, he has turned himself into a political pariah that no one will be able to believe or trust. Pandering to one’s opponents who don’t want health care reform in the first place is disgusting. How sad and shameful!

Cenk Uygur (“Is Obama one of us?)

I have…said many times that this isn’t just about the public option or even health care reform. This is about the central idea of Obama’s campaign – are we going to have real change in this country or not? If Obama tweaks the system but leaves it largely intact, most people are under the impression that that is not the change we voted for.

A couple of comments from this Open Left post from last week

Obama is the worst President we have ever had. Our party and healthcare plan is going down and flames and what does Obama do? He goes on vacation and plays golf. I want to see him go down in 2012. He stands for nothing except getting elected. Democrats need to start looking at alternatives.

Obama’s killing us….Worst president ever, so far…..He’s got bankers raking in billions while tens of millions of average Americans are out of work. He’s got nothing going to counter the onslaught of the anti-reform nut-jobs so their message that government is the problem actually has credibility. His lieutenants in the White House seem already to be conceding (welcoming?) big losses in the mid-term elections. If he hasn’t outright violated every promise he made during the campaign, he’s yet to deliver on a single one that matters to the Democrats and Independents that actually VOTED for him last November.

And now, while most Americans can’t even afford to take a vacation, he’s off to the Grand Canyon, Martha’s Vineyard, and a long weekend at Camp David before returning to the White House next week to deliver a speech that will once again fail to insist on the public option.

Just for tonight, I’m dreaming that we really can have Hillary back. Join me if you dare.

digg!!! tweet!!! share!!!!

Add to FacebookAdd to DiggAdd to Del.icio.usAdd to StumbleuponAdd to RedditAdd to BlinklistAdd to TwitterAdd to TechnoratiAdd to FurlAdd to Newsvine

Add to: Facebook | Digg | Del.icio.us | Stumbleupon | Reddit | Blinklist | Twitter | Technorati | Furl | Newsvine

115 Responses

  1. so, they are just starting to notice?

    wow.

    • They’ve been noticing for awhile. Now they are talking about running someone against him in the 2012 primary. And he hasn’t even been in office for a year yet.

      • I’ll join you in dreaming it will be Hillary…

      • Did KO mention who this putative man is they’re going to find to run?

        • Um, maybe he’d run himself? 😉

          My New bumpersticker:

          Keith Olbermann for president (snark)

          (Yes, the snark would be on the bumper sticker.)

          • it sounds so wrong even with the snark

          • glasses to appear intelligent, can read off TelePrompTer, rude, condescending arrogant jerk, but can discuss sports for that faux populist touch, immature overgrown frat boy, history of mistreating female coworkers–he pretty much has everything WFN looks for in a candidate.

        • He said he couldn’t imagine who it would be. I’m sure Hillary isn’t on his list, but she is the most popular person in the administration right now.

          • Oh yeah, I don’t think they have any power, i’m just curious about his delusional mindset, as if he and the nutrootz could find some Non-Hill candidate who could win out of this nonexistant pool of nonuseless Dems.

  2. Nice-looking poll numbers there for Hillary compared with Oblahblah, especially this early. (But not surprising to me.) Now, if we only had primaries in 2012 without any rigged caucuses, Hillary could pull off a successful challenge quite easily.

  3. In a NY minute I will join you in the dream. In fact, one could say I never stopped dreaming it from last year.

  4. I keep hearing BO supporters say Obama’s signature campaign issue was health care…Wasn’t it “changing the ways of Washington”, and “moving past the ideological fights of the 60’s”?

    • doesn’t really matter too much now what his campaign was about.

    • This was the rewrite once Obama became president.

    • Yeah, a year and a half ago they were saying his signature issue is “bringing people together.” they have such active imaginations, they should just pretend he gave us UHC.

      • Oh yeah, I forgot “bringing people together”. One hell of an agenda they supported. 🙂

        • Yeah just like Bush, Obama campaigned to be a Uniter (all they were ever uniting was the CDS people in the media)

        • That started after the McClurkin thing. “If there is one thing you need to understand, it’s that the centerpiece of his campaign is to bring us all together across the aisle and give everyone a seat at the table. You can’t object, this is what it’s all about.”

          “So basically, you’re saying he’s all about trianguation. The same reason we loathe Hillary beyond all others and beyond all reason?”

    • Hillary’s signature campaign issue was health care. Obama’s signature issue was hope, change and unity. And also to attack Hillary by using sexism, CDS, and the race card.

  5. It may be a dream but I’m gonna hang onto it for all I’m worth. Please, please, please let this come true!

  6. Fairy tales can come true, it can happen to you…

    Oh please dear lord let it be so…

    Actually, hill wouldn’t primary Obama, so my dream is he decides to leave them wanting more. 😉

    • Howard Dean is starting to sound pretty worked up. Not that I’d support him, but it could be entertaining to have him out attacking Obama from the left.

      • I’d support Dean in a primary or a fake ficus for that matter

        • I wouldn’t, not after he threw us all under the bus even before the RBC meeting, and definitely not after that freakin’ show trial. Dean was just as key an enabler of the entire ‘New Democrats’ (aka “f*ck all you middle age white women, Hispanics, working class, elderly and anyone who isn’t urban hip and cool!) thing as anyone. More than most really. I will never, ever forgive him for turning a blind eye to the rampant misogyny emanating from the Obama campaign and even more virulently from his followers. Esp. since at the beginning many of Obama’s followers had been Dean’s followers.

          I wouldn’t vote Dean for dog-catcher. Or even fake ficus-catcher.

          • I wouldn’t support him, and I know he’d have no chance, but I’d love to see him act out his rage at Obama for throwing him under the bus with the rest of us.

    • That would be even better.

    • I’m still hoping that Hillary runs in 2016. I’m not optimistic about the leadership of this country for the next eight years regardless of whether Obama wins or loses the next election. I think Obama’s money and media machine might be enough to save him from losing the primaries.

  7. I don’t think he wants a second term. Another 4 years won’t add any more to is historic presidency. He’s got everything he wanted so why stay in a job which requires you to actually work? He’s managed to avoid it thus far.

    I also don’t think his backers want to contribute another half billion on a second term when they won’t likely get anymore out of it. He won’t be able to ram through any more tax stealing programs after next yr. after the Repubs mount a come back, Which is why he’s doing all this stuff in his first year. After that all he as to do is ride it out until he can get out in 2012.

  8. There is a chance the caucus part of the Texas two step is going away. Lawsuit filed by Hispanic group was successful.

    Hillary won the Texas primary, and then due to the rigged and crooked caucus vote, The One was awarded more delegates. Ugh!

    If Hillary were to run in 2012, she would take Texas.

  9. Olbermann said the president has “compromised on everything so far and as self-defeating as it may be, the progressive caucus and progressives would abandon him if necessary, if this was to be the policy of this administration into 2012. If it’s necessary to find somebody to run against him, I think they’d do it, no matter how destructive that may seem.”

    the content below is inescapable,

    Olbermann campaigned as if he was on the Republican side, this was not a campaign strategy, this was a suicide pact

    as Shakespeare wrote, that way madness lies:

  10. oh bb…be still my heart. My heart is still recovering from last year. I was just saying today that this would be a completely different issue re: health care if HRC was the one explaining it–clearly and in vivid detail–for the American people. 3 years is a long way off though…

  11. (((Tried dreaming…started sobbing)))

    😦

  12. 4 words:
    WE TOLD YOU SO.

  13. I know this is a bit off point but I have a very bad feeling that the next person we see smashed under the bus by the current administration will be Hillary Clinton, Obama is going to have to pass down the buck once again to get out of this one if the claims by Downing Street turn out to be true. Joe Scarborough said the same thing a week or so ago, that they couldn’t have released the Lockerbie bomber without the US having prior knowledge that it was going to take place:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1211495/No-10-turns-Obama-Clinton-criticising-decision-release-Lockerbie-bomber.html

  14. Oh pul-ease
    (HT to NQ)

  15. It is good of you to give us all something to dream for, BB.
    I’m not going to give up. I may be armed with only a keyboard and my vote, but it is enough for me.

    Oh, by the way! OT, but in case anyone is interested, this morning I was bored so I left a comment on a nutty post about textbooks over at Hillbuzz and in it I said Obama isn’t a socialist and that they had gone off the deep end, and then they banned me and literally used the entire thread to call me an evil leftist and accused me of censoring them. Go look, it’s great!

    http://hillbuzz.org/2009/09/06/has-anyone-caught-the-special-fox-has-been-rerunning-on-textbooks/

    I might do a post about this. The Hillbuzz boys were one of those people who went nuts after the Primaries and started saying Obama is a Commie and all of that other happy right wing horse sh*t. Their site has been flooded by Fundie Wingnuts and they drove all of the Clinton supporters away.

    They’re just an example of the type of people who make PUMAs look bad. Look at their posts about Van Jones. You’ll see what I’m saying.

    • great job isis! They used to be a great place to visit. Now they’re just skeerry!

      • Tell me about it. They banned me, so I was unable to reply to any of their subsequent comments about me. But after I left that comment they wrote about another twelve comments, saying things like, “People like Little Isis want to censor us, but we won’t have it.”

        And, “So, when people like Little Isis and other “Good Little Democrats” tell us we’re wrong, we just tell it like it is.”

        And then, “So tools like Little Isis can continue to pretend everything is rainbows and unicorns while Islamists and ACORN and other people try to destroy America.”

        It is hilarious. I can’t respond because they banned me, but I feel so flattered because now I’m their favorite person. Yay!

    • Those peeps over there scare the beejeesus out of me I gotta say, but I love the idea of a Little Isis tribute thread. 🙂 To paraphrase Reg, someday you will be President.

      • Now I just want to write a post about the whole thing to get their knickers in a twist. I think I will do it. Just to amuse myself.

        • Okay but…I just picked up a textbook and I swear, it was nothing but transgressive images of women fixing cars and men cooking! And it was written by Dr. Utopia! Maybe they have a point and you’re like the Manchurian Candidate. *eyes LI with suspicion*

          • Seriously, I thought we discussed this? You are not alloiwed to mention my secret Socialist plot to destroy America on the internet.
            My Marxist master plan is so complex that any inkling of it will cause the Hillbuzz boys to heroically expose me for the Islamicist, America Hating fraud that I am.

          • I have a split personality. Radical seriously loves you and wants to help you, but Patriot Seriously loves America and is gleeful that your plot to use Van Jones to collectivize Friday afternoon and Tuesday morning farmers’ markets has been foiled! Are you, have you ever been–

            false alarm. Islamo Pinko Seriously got the drop on America Seriously and locked her in the closet. Our plan is still a go. It won’t happen again, comrade.

          • Sorry, LI. I, islamo Pinko Seriously, love you and want to help you. Unfortunately, Patriot Seriously loves America. She escaped from the cupboard I had her locked in and was crowing about foiling you and Jones’ plan to collectivize Tuesday afternoon and Friday morning farmers’ markets. She had a question for you, too-/are you now, have you ever been–but forget it. I subdued her, and the plan is still a go, comrade.

          • Excellent Seriously. Htgfbb e'[fcb ohvbihyv ihv hv hgh…

            Now sweet innocent teenage Little Isis has returned.

            It;s okay Seriously. We all have those lapses in our memory. 😀

    • Excellent work, LI!!

  16. All this right wing hatred is so amped up at the moment. I almost forgot how bad it got during the Clinton years. It’s just nasty out there at the moment. I can’t believe the hate that Van Jone’s dredged up. It’s awful! Makes me wonder what it would be like if Hillary would’ve won. Any worse?

    • It would have been bad, but Hillary would never cave like Obama would have. That is the difference. It is like she would always say, “I have been fighting republicans and kicking their butts my whole life and that is why men like Karl Rove want my body.”

      It is the truth.

    • They would have tried but I like to think that she and Big Dawg were prepared–she did allude to that several times. It would have been fun. She would have fought back and won.

    • Hillary would have fought back, not just rolled over every time the right wingers attacked.

    • It was going to be the same no matter who was in office. Both sides demonize each other like there’s no tomorrow and deserve to be largely ignored.

    • The thing with Hill is after 18 years of this shit, she has stopped expecting them to be decent…and just moves forward . However if she was POTUS , I would expect the Dem congress to NOT support her and wet their pants every time the GOP frowned…like always. Barry
      does that for them already

  17. Tha caucuses and the DNC May31st shenanigans. Hooligans at the voting sites, rigging of voting districts, Democrats for a day, congressional strong arming, and a conned convention, followed by illegal, scammed campaign contributions. That’s how BO took the presidency. I don’t know that much will have changed by 2010 or even 2012.

  18. Unless the citizens of this country swear off of the media and stop ceding their power at the voting booth, 2012 will be MOTS. and 2016 will be MOTS. and 2020, 2024, 2028

    • They can’t help themselves. And we’re fools for believing that our support, grassroots activism, or even our votes matter. Corporations pick our “leaders.” Corporate media will shill for the corporate guy. We saw it with our own eyes and we continue to see it and yet still…

      We think we are watching people with different ideologies argue a point, but we’re really seeing two different corporations compete for profits.

    • The voters did reject the media. They chose Hill over Obama, and he came damn close to losing the general. Even most of his voters didn’t buy the media spin, they just felt they had no choice, or hoped Congress would take the lead, or whatever. The fact that the primary voters completely ignored the media and kept coming out in huge numbers until the very end says a lot.

      • Obama was the media darling but Hillary was media kryptonite. She just kept right on winning primaries. If the superdelegates hadn’t sold out, she’d be president now. We should not give up!

      • It shouldn’t have even been close.

        • Politics is like a game of hand grenades, sometimes close is good enough.

          • Would that have made that much of a difference, though? The delegates were assigned with that new system that rewards ‘loyal’ districts, with Obama’s advantages like in college towns and the loyal districts, wouldn’t it have still been skewed?

          • It shouldn’t have even been close.

          • Sorry to be in such a foul mood. Thinking about what could have been does this to me.

          • Yeah…right

          • Don’t misunderstand. The outcome is not Hillary’s fault. She did great and it was inspiring to see her go through to the end.

        • True, but no one has ever overcome such odds. The demonization of her and the beatification of him was like nothing else. The amount of money he spent, the number of caucuses where low turnout would tend to benefit him even without the fraud, pretty much the entire Dem Establishment in his corner and crossing some lines. With all these advantages, he should have won in a landslide, not lost.

    • sBill Clinton was an anamoly. He wasn’t supposed to win. But he did, and he actually did stuff for us and *they* didn’t like it. So they spent 8 years trying to destroy him. But the people saw and that’s why he left with the highest approval rating of any president in history at the end of their 2nd term.

      • Well, given how crazy the atmosphere was at the time and how unequivically the media was shilling for him, I think it’s amazing that the Clinton Campaign did as well as they did. It was like two tiny hands pushing against a tidal wave, IMO.

        Obama has been put on such a pedestal these past two years that I can’t really imagine the blowback from his broken promises being anything but big.

        But we’ll see what happens. For now we just watch in enjoyment while Obots individually have psychotic break downs.

        • And you also had all of the morons like, “my 7 year old thinks Obama is a nice man! Please take our party seriously!” It was like this tsunami of lunacy for them to push back against.

  19. Obamaman was the first one on TV allowed to go after George W. Bush, and that was about 7 years plus into his second administration.

    W. Bush was another Matthews crush, plus NBC needed to head off media consultation, which would have been a Gore issue. GE needed Bush and the corporatists in power.

    I wonder why the one person allowed to speak the obvious (the Emperor Has No Clothes) on TV after anyone with a brain had figured that out became the personification of Obama? Demonizer of Hillary? Hmmmm. Was there any preplanning here to bring about the next media darling? I mean even in Chicago, Obama was second to Gov. Blag as the machine’s favorite.

  20. Well at least the news isn’t all bad:

    Climate Change will trigger a wave of natural disasters (apparently signaling the end of the world)

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/sep/06/global-warming-natural-disasters-conference

    yippee

  21. New post upstairs!

  22. So my foul mood was touched off by my neighbors. I just got in the car, needless to say, dinner was ruined because I couldn’t curse out loud at Red Lobster.

    • I know, this is completely off topic, but it is so cute that you and your hubby go to red lobster together.

      Anyway, cheer up SOD. Is there anything they can say about the fact that ObamaCare is crap and he has a forty percent approval rating? And that Hillary is the most popular person in his administration?

      No, I think not.

      • He (hubby) loves shrimp. It’s “shrimpfest”

        • Oh my gawd, I love shrimp fest. I’m a pescitarian, so seafood is the only real meat I eat. On the rare chance that I get it, I gorge like no one’s bussiness.

        • Remember that Obot who wrote that piece sneering at Americans for eating at Red Lobster? It’s like dude, Red Lobster is where we go for fancy, get a clue. I’m sure he’ll be even more horrified at that. 😉

          • Um, yeah. Red Lobster IS where I go for fancy. It’s called, I love red lobster! Nyeh!

          • I know! He’s acting like how can we even eat there–yeah, actually you’ll be amazed to learn we go there for special occasions. Obots–living in a bubble.

    • There are so many things wrong with that statement/question

      • Perk up, Darlin’ You can’t reason with the stupid.

      • This is another reason why Obama has a problem, his supporters are sort of unpleasant. If Obama is so great, just be happy he won. Most people don’t enjoy being harassed like they need to assimilate into the Borg.

        • One day his wife had the nerve to ask me if I’d gotten over my “tantrum” yet.

          • How to win friends and influence people. I swear, I think more voters were put off by Obot behavior than by Obama’s deficiencies.

          • I swear, I think more voters were put off by Obot behavior than by Obama’s deficiencies.

            they kept saying Obama was inspiring and had this unique ability to inspire like no other…so I looked around at what he was inspiring–a Democratic party leadership that stayed silent while the MSM called half their voters expendable stupid old low information low class racist bitches on a daily basis.

          • And the answer is: Have you come down off the Koolaid yet. Clearly not. I have no patience for these Obots who think it’s the Republicans that are blowing his presidency. Not that they wouldn’t, but he can fail quite well all on his own. In fact, I think the administration is paying the Republicans to fake opposition so that they have an excuse.

          • oh bummer my comment went into the spam filter

          • That is what put me off seriously. I was new to blogs and I saw how Obots behaved in late 2007. It was beyond stunning. That was the very first alarm bell that went off in my head.

  23. SOD, Are those the same neighbors who planted trees separating your houses? I hope those trees are getting full and tall. Hey, I’d probably go fertilize ’em if I were you. It’s amazing they still don’t realize we have a majority and if anything that resembles a Democratic platform was actually being presented – and Obama had enough backbone to get the blue dogs in place – he wouldn’t have to “give those Republicans in Congress hell”. I don’t blame you for not engaging them. At this point, it’s still useless. Hell, it will still be useless when they realize what and who they voted for, because they’ll never EVER admit it. They’ll still blame republicans for Obama’s lack of leadership.

Comments are closed.

%d bloggers like this: