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Sunday: Krugman fails to cheerlead. Becomes just another Limbaugh

Paul Krugman

His eyes are so dreamy!

His eyes are so dreamy!

{{sigh, shaking head}}

What are we going to do with you, Paul?  Did you forget your Prozac, buddy?  You are being relentlessly negative.  Shouldn’t you be out there pushing for the country to embrace and promote the Obama economic stimulus plan?  Where’s your patriotism?  Your sense of hope and optimism?  Your insistence on a reality based understanding of macroeconomics and concern for the “general welfare” mentioned in the preamble is really harshing the Hopium mellow:

According to the CBO’s estimates, we’re facing an output shortfall of almost 14% of GDP over the next two years, or around $2 trillion. Others, such as Goldman Sachs, are even more pessimistic. So the original $800 billion plan was too small, especially because a substantial share consisted of tax cuts that probably would have added little to demand. The plan should have been at least 50% larger.

Now the centrists have shaved off $86 billion in spending — much of it among the most effective and most needed parts of the plan. In particular, aid to state governments, which are in desperate straits, is both fast — because it prevents spending cuts rather than having to start up new projects — and effective, because it would in fact be spent; plus state and local governments are cutting back on essentials, so the social value of this spending would be high. But in the name of mighty centrism, $40 billion of that aid has been cut out.

My first cut says that the changes to the Senate bill will ensure that we have at least 600,000 fewer Americans employed over the next two years.

The real question now is whether Obama will be able to come back for more once it’s clear that the plan is way inadequate. My guess is no. This is really, really bad.

What a downer.  No one’s going to want to hang out with you, Paul.  You are going to ruin *everything* for Obama.  Why are you getting on his case before he’s even done anything?  He’s just learning how to do this stuff.  It’s soooo unfaaaaiiiir!

His eyes are so piggy!

His eyes are so piggy!

Jeez, Paul, I never thought I would see the day when a liberal such as yourself would channel Rush Limbaugh. Clearly, you are becoming just like him.  You want to undermine Obama. You *want* to see him fail.  You can’t wait til he crashes and burns and you will laugh all the way from your cushy desk in Princeton reveling in his ignominious demise that YOU helped engineer.

Or maybe you’re not like Rush at all.  Maybe you are like those racist, closeted Republican, old, uneducated, working class, sino-Peruvian lesbians here at The Confluence.  The Axelrovian moles are out in force in different blog comment threads accusing we “shrieking bands of paranoid holdouts” of sedition.  But I have prepared a handy chart for those visitors looking for a rage fix.  Here is the difference between Rush Limbaugh and Conflucians:

Rush Limbaugh


Big, Fat Idiot

Scientists, health care professionals,
economists, attornies, academics, students, marketing/ad specialists, IT
, body coaches, opera singers, psychologists, DJs, librarians and freelance morticians

Lying liar

Not really into character assassination and rumormongering. We passed on the birth certificate
and Larry Sinclair gay sex stuff.

Tool of the right wing uber rich

Just a bunch of liberlal blogger types, defending our right of self-determination and freedom of speech

Bombastic, mean-spirited, misogynistic gasbag

Ruthlessly snarky

Paid millions of dollars to pollute the airwaves and clog up the intertoobz

We do this for free! Although, we are
considering other options as long as they don’t infringe on our ability to
call it like we see it

the agenda of the neo-feudalists

Firmly in the pocket of the working class American schlub

(and by working class, we mean everyone not making millions of dollars in
bonuses each year)

Which are you, Paul? Are you going to be a morbid crepe hanger, pointing out every inadequacy of the economic stimulus plan just because tens of millions of middle class Americans are about to experience real poverty for the first time in their lives or are you going to jump aboard the Obama Love Train and put your niggling, Nobel prize winning doubts to rest? You wouldn’t want to be the target of a Axelrodian generated discrediting campaign of vicious lies and innuendos would you? That would mean you can’t sit at the popular table anymore. You’d have to hang with the Conflucians and the {{gasp!}}, PUMAs!

It’s up to you, Paul. Don’t say we didn’t warn you.

270 Responses

  1. First!!! wow I will be right back to post more as soon as I get back from paying my quarterly water bill before it gets turned off ….and take the recycling to the bins … and you can add underpaid health care professionals to that list of “who we are ” .

    Oh and can we talk about changing the name of the nursing profession to get higher pay , because the word nurse engenders a stereotypical idea . Just typing out loud here 🙂

  2. And include internet radio station owners and djs too 🙂 teehhee

  3. Delicious!

  4. I am about ready to give up. Throw in the towel. Hang up my cynical shoes and bolt for the door. Channel my outrage and take up Scrapbooking as a way to shut down the voices in my head who keep repeating “we are so f*cked!”

    What is the use anymore of raging against The Machine? No one is listening and haven’t for at least 8 years. We fought against our party, the MSM, the congress critters, the blather that was fed to us while dodging the brickbats of having been called r*cists and bitter knitters for rejecting the possibility of this administration.

    We called out for answers and received none. We pointed out the need for experience and were beaten back. We urged the press to do do their jobs and were summarily dismissed. We pleaded for objectivity and we fed fairy tales.

    Each time we were offered W.O.R.M. when we begged for clarity. We saw promises broken before election day. We sit here and watch unacceptable nominees paraded before us and are instructed that warts and all, these are the only people who can save our hides. Lobbyists are placed on the payroll and financial institutions are pulling in money hand over fist to make up for deficits they helped create.

    Figures and numbers are thrown around with abandon and our future looks bleak while those who are elected as stewards are planning strategies at our expense to retain their seats come 2010. A criminal GOP administration goes scott free because we prefer to “look ahead”. A NY thief awaits trial in his 7 million dollar penthouse and complains of the restrictions.

    Nannies, personal chefs, high priced cocktail parties, meandering plane trips, are covered while the rest of us grit our teeth when opening yet another utility bill that has increased and wonder how we can meet the payments.

    Krugman is ignored. He joins us in beating his head against the wall, a voice in the wind added to the chorus of discontent.

    Someone needs to make me care once again. Someone needs to make me understand that we are not on the road to perdition. Someone needs to speak for me and many more like me. My horizon is empty, stark, blank. I give up.

  5. One HELL of a sunday morning sermon River! That is why I loves me some Confluence! No bs…..all the time!

  6. Thanks, Riverdaughter – nice summation – but where do we go from here?

    I tried faxing to all my elected reps this weekend – do they turn off the fax machines in DC when they’re not in the office???

    ERA today! 👿

  7. I prefer attorney to lawyer. And, uh hum, it was Larry Sinclair, not Larry Franklin (not that I know anything about that rumor). LOL

  8. I think Paul is risking alot doing op ed piece after op ed piece saying what a bummer this entire stimulus plan is. I wish he’d start in on the TARP too and talk about the need for an HOLC-type entity to renegotiate loans for folks that just want to stay in their houses.

    I have to say, with all this ’empty’ housing down here, we’ve turned into a boom town for the homeless. It’s hard to go into a neighborhood where there are tons of abandoned houses and not see the homeless moving in. I’m expecting this to just increase.

  9. Yay! You did it, RD. You actually cheered me up. I’ve been roaming all over the net reading depressing stories that I don’t fully understand. Suddenly after reading your post, I don’t feel so bad anymore.

  10. Dakinikat,

    I’ve been reading some stories that suggest that in addition to the “bad bank” thing, which looks like it’s going to happen, Geithner and Obama may actually be listening to Sheila Bair on helping people with their mortagages. Except it sounds like a pretty small part of the second TARP package, $50B. But like I said, I didn’t completely comprehend anything I read. Have you heard anything like that?

  11. I have to confess — I’ve never actually listened to Rush — I’ve only heard a few snippets here & there — so I’m working under the assumption that he is as bad as everyone here says. Nonetheless, do think it is totally and completely beneath the office of the President of the United States of America (note, I wrote “office” because after what I witnessed from Obama during the primary he has proven nothing is beneath him) to single out & attack a radio show personality. I don’t care if Rush is as bad as I believe — saying what Obama did is akin to the President who is sworn to uphold the Constitution to snuffing out dissent & I am disgusted by it. I believe we all in this country have the right to say whatever the heck we want to about the government, even if what we are saying is batsh!t crazy. That is how the First Amendment works. I don’t agree with what Rush says, but I will fight to the death for his right to say it.

  12. LOL!

    who is the freelance mortician?

    RD, this is getting worse by the minute — this has to be the most INSANE period this country has ever been in. That’s what it looks like to all of us.

    Wouldn’t it be nice to see some actual “seriousness” in the expressions? In photos? Like gee, “I’m very worried about my country right now” —-

    ps: note to miq2xu — Code Pink we aren’t — but I think what we are going to start seeing is a backlash from all those groups that were target-marketed and mislead.

    They will be ANGRY. Plus, we have a lot of people who are going to be very POOR and very angry now — and since they all have such HUGE expectations after a year or so (or more) of PROMISES — well?

    There is only so much “escaping” a person can do when LEADERSHIP is in order.

    Like working overtime to solve things?

    I mean, haven’t WE ALL DONE THAT? Umm, hmm.

    How is GEN OBOT going to cover for mistakes? They can’t.
    The strength of their ‘love” will flip like a switch to the opposite emotion if he fails them, no?

    And then, boy will they ever wish for Hillary or McCain. The only two who actually HAD enough EXPERIENCE to be leaders.

  13. bb: yes, Summers seems to support that now and is pushing it but the central part is still throwing money at the banks so they can pass the trash

  14. V — Capt. Spaulding (myiq’s avatar) is the freelance mortician.

  15. Love the chart, RD.

  16. What a great post! I’m in awe!

    The Krug was a Hillary supporter. He always had problems with Obama, but as a liberal economist, felt obligated to support (however tepidly) the Democrat.

    I hope that he continues calling ’em like he sees ’em.

    As for the HOLC, Politico says that Geithner is going to unveil a separate mortgage-housing plan on Monday. So maybe something like that will be done.

  17. Foreclosure mitigation. Reports suggest a stepped up effort for foreclosure mitigation to the tune of $100 – $200 billion. I don’t view this as an effort to prop up prices; it is simply not enough the weigh against the literally trillions of lost value. I also suspect it is very difficult to identify homeowners who can benefit from reasonable modifications that don’t require either a substantial and untenable taxpayer contribution or the homeowner becoming a virtual mortgage slave, tied to an unrealistic housing payment.

  18. that’s from Tim Duy’s Fed Watch …

    it’s an economists blog but he’s never really uberwonky

  19. I give up. The fight has gone out of me. My cynical approach has been defeated. The embers of dissension have been banked. I am tired of raging against the system. The spark has died out.

    No one is listening. Krugman is just another voice in the wind. We have been screwed and we know it. No one really cares anymore. It is all theater. We have been served a cold dish of contempt from those who act as our stewards and there is not a damned thing we can do about it.

    I want someone who speaks for me. Someone who truly understands what we face. Judging by my horizon that someone does not exist. The perpetual players on either side have nothing to offer beyond their own election cycles. The staleness that permeates from that quarter is stifling.

    The last criminal administration goes unscathed since we are “moving forward”. A wholesale thief awaits trial while residing in a multimillion dollar penthouse and complains of the restrictions. Tax cheats are nominated for key administration positions. Figures and dollar amounts reaching into the stratosphere are tossed around with abandon.

    Nannies, personal chefs, limos and drivers, high priced cocktail parties, meandering plane rides are the subject of the day. The rest of us worry about getting through another week, hoping to escape the ax that is perched directly above our heads.

    I give up. We railed and no one listened. We questioned and no one answered. We fought and the battle was lost. We stood up and were pushed back. The last vestige of hope was lost and there is no turning back.

    I have reached my limit as I witness this latest round of idiocy take root. “I told you so” has lost its luster since the truth of that remark is what we are left to consider. All too demoralizing in the end.

  20. vbonnaire, on February 8th, 2009 at 10:36 am Said:

    They ARE angry, the groups and people you mention. But some will look for anybody other than the the DNC and Obama to blame. Now, no elected president remains popular with all of the people who voted for him – but notice that Axelrod & Co are doing their best to shove the anger off onto the Congress, in an effort to deflect blame. Pelosi, for one, isn’t having any of it. She’s no post-partisan bletherer – she’s the one who threw all the elbows against H. Clinton and she understands that politics in D.C. is all about fighting, not Kumbaya.

    Here’s a link to one of the shrewdest politicians (and an Obama supporter, but not an accolyte) on the planet, pointing out what a rookie Obama is: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/02/07/BARM15OSI7.DTL

  21. my problem is with that second sentence there, we still don’t have a program that will ‘prop up prices’. As I keep saying, we have to stop the deflation and put a bottom on the market, otherwise it’s the Great Depression which is somewhat what Krugman is saying, but he’s not talking asset prices because he’s not a financial economist. he’s talking Aggregate Demand. There’s the stuff side of the economy and the money side that enables it. Krugman’s focused on the stuff side … because I essentially come from banking and have duo degrees in finance and economics, I’m still looking at the asset ‘prices’. not the demand for the assets alone. although Krugman has mentioned he fears a deflation spiral. he just doesn’t mention that what would stop it is the government making the market and putting a bottom in.

    hopefully, guaranteeing the freddie and fannie activity will help do that, but it’s not enough imho.

  22. I’ve started to detect some real disgust over Obama in precincts where one would never expect it.

    Even over at DailyKos there is much consternation over the obviously failed and obviously destructive attempts at “bipartisanship” Obama has engaged in. Any number of front pagers are now quite open in their rejection of Obama’s approach. Though they don’t put it this way, I think they are now appreciating that Ready From Day One was more than a campaign slogan.

    It’s so bad that if you go to the true redoubt of the KoolAid Brigade — Al Giordano’s blog for example — you will find posters who refuse to read DailyKos anymore because they can’t stomach the criticisms of Obama.

    And this is two and a half weeks into Obama’s Presidency. Generally, Truth will out. But so fast?

  23. So what do we do now? We are stuck and royally f*cked.

  24. Heidi Li, on February 8th, 2009 at 10:45 am Said:
    …….They ARE angry, the groups and people you mention. But some will look for anybody other than the the DNC and Obama to blame…….

    So true Heidi….because then they have to admit they were wrong! I thought the most satisfying thing post election would be saying “I told you so” …but it’s not. The thing I hold most dear is ‘ I wasn’t fooled” .

  25. hey, we may all live in tent cities soon, but we have a historical presidency! buck up paper doll!

  26. i am, therefor, I snark

  27. “I wasn’t fooled”

    Great potential for bumperstickers and tshirts there !

  28. frankly0 — I’m not surprised at all that the truth outs so quickly in the case of Obama — all he EVER had & all the moronic Obots who supported him EVER had was that he wasn’t “the other guy/gal.” Now he has no one to “not be” — he still tries lamely to say “I’m not Bush” (i.e., he “found” the deficit wrapped in a bow on his desk) but it isn’t working because this isn’t a campaign anymore.

  29. Meanwhile Michael Steele just got ambushed by George Stephanopolis over BS Washington Post financial obligations.
    I am glad that Michael stood up to him and denounced the Washington Post without sounding dismissive and condescending like Obama.

    Have a nice week everyone.

  30. The defenders are still out there. “He stumbled but it is to be expected since he is still learning” says one. Like being ready on Day One was never intended for him. I can’t take anymore!!

  31. paper doll — “I wasn’t fooled” — I love it — get thee to cafepress stat!

  32. I think the swiftness with which the Bush 3 era has dawned took most by surprise….wherever they were on the Barry topic . Lord! the mellow crashed so fast, its got friction burns!

  33. Thanks Dakinikat,

    But at the and of that story it says this:

    I can just see how this program evolved. Fed and Treasury officials meet with Wall Street titans looking for methods to unglue the financial system. The answer: Create programs that guarantee risk-free double digit returns for wealthy investors. In the meantime, I am trying to explain to aging Rotarians nearing retirement that they are simply screwed; the risk free rate for them and the other 99.9% of the population is pushing at zero.

    We are going to somehow have to force these guys to understand that Americans are not ready to be serfs yet.

  34. Reuters had an article on that:


    It was all about the “snowball” momentum, the logo, the astroturf, the Axelstein tactics and so forth while it rolled. But now?

    It’s the reality of actually “being there” and all they can say is “we escaped!”


    Plus, all the other world leaders (his age) are watching…

    Imagine what they are thinking?

    Very hard to have ANY confidence in he or BIDEN at all right now.

    Any of them. And we are DEMS — or were DEMS till now.
    As PUMAS we saw this coming over a year ago…

    All the yes we cans in the world don’t cut it in a time of total tanking.
    FDR they aren’t — and it will come back to haunt the whole Dem Party.

  35. Excellent post RD. Remember, Krugman remained part of this shrieking band of paranoid holdouts longer than anyone else in the MSM, particularly at the Times.

  36. There is not one, not one, politician I have any faith in. They are all a bunch of egotistic, lying, two faced, snake oil salesmen with one goal in mind. Power. That’s it.

    They could care less about you, me, or the next guy. Money is the only thing they have a vested interest in since that is what buys them the power they crave.

    Money. Power. Arrogance. A blend of what goes into the making of a politician and I don’t care what party he represents. They are all cut from the same cloth.

  37. angienc2, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:00 am


  38. yup, bb, I love Tim Duy, envy his students

  39. Apparently the weekend house parties didn’t attract a lot of support, according to McClatchy.


  40. i’m watching meet the press, have to say, I don’t miss Timmah

  41. Your so right Angie!

    Some ( not all ) are starting to understand that it may be cool to dig a guitarist who wears short pants…Ac/Dc’s Angus Young….When it comes to Running a country, we need an “Adult” ready on day one! ( Hillary!)

  42. BB, for some reason they WANT the ” wee ” people to pick up pitchforks. They are closing off every other possible remedy.

  43. Welcome aboard Paul! I always knew you were one of us…

  44. Pat Johnson, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:04 am Said:

    I’m with you 100%

  45. If you go to DINO Claire McCaskill’s Twitter account, this is what she had to say about Krugman last night:

    Just saw Krugman’s comments on reduction in recov act. Question for him. Would no stimulus act be better than one thats 800 B instead of 900?

    This idiot of a Senator will be one of the first to attack Krugman if anything goes wrong rather than taking the blame or holding Obama accountable for this.

    BTD is a douche but at least he’s calling out the hypocrites. His latest post is about McCaskill already rewriting her role in the stimulus plan: http://www.talkleft.com/story/2009/2/8/104419/7772

    Does it surprise anyone that she was one of the first people to endorse the Empty Suit?

  46. paper doll,

    Well, we could get into tinfoil hat territory, but I don’t want get all depressed again. But they are preparing for the food riots. Troops are being trained in urban areas all over the country. New Orleans had midnight maneuvers last week–US army and police practicing together. And then there are the clergymen who have been recruited to “reason with” unruly people.

  47. BB — BWAHAHAHA! Those morons are still trying to spin this saying the support is “considerable” given this is the FIRST national “call to action.” WTF? Are we to expect MORE of these idiotic house parties? Here’s an idea dumba$$ Obots — get the President to serve us not us to serve him. That’s the way it is supposed to work, you know.

  48. DV,

    How long before Jerelyn fires BTD for insubordination to the messiah?

  49. BB, it’s depressing, but it’s still good to know this stuff.
    Thanks for that heads up

  50. Capt. Spaulding (myiq’s avatar) is the freelance mortician.

    I’m a mortician and he has a business helping sick people find donor organs.

    It’s a joint venture – we call it “Stab ’em and Slab ’em”

  51. It is hard to watch Bwarney Fwanks “pontificate” on Tee-Vee. And that Claire McCaskill! What a hypocrite!

  52. lol Paperdoll @11:07. Gave me a good idea, though: get the concession on pitch forks. Should be pretty lucrative in the near future.

  53. My read on Krugman’s comments is that he really does believe that, most likely, we are indeed, as Pat says, royally f*cked.

    Krugman has been pretty careful not to declare that the stimulus as it stands will still not stop us from plunging into a deflationary trap. He acknowledges elsewhere that the factors behind deflation can be complex. But it’s pretty obvious that he believes a deflationary trap to be a too likely outcome if it’s adopted.

    And the thing is — which he also says elsewhere — it’s just not in any way obvious what would bring us out of a tailspin if we got into one. What pulled us out of the Great Depression was a combination of the FDR’s stimulus during the 30s, and, of course, WWII, which in effect served as Stimulus II from an economic point of view.

    What this suggests is that it may take a long, hard haul to get us out of any major slump, in which stimulus after stimulus is applied — requiring enormous increases in deficits — until finally we come out the other end.

    Think, though, of what that means both for our society and politically. Our society will be made to suffer under the burden of that slump. Politically, it will require enormous will and constant struggle for Democrats to argue their case for further deficit spending, especially when what they have implemented to that date had not succeeded.

    That’s what most scares me about our future. Suffice it to say, when I think of Obama, I don’t think of enormous will and constant struggle. He chose the cheap and easy way out of this fight, choosing a stimulus that would be much smaller than needed so that it would be relatively easy to sell. Had he chosen one of appropriate size, he would have had to fight harder (though not, I think, actually all that much harder, since the same parties would make the same noises), but he might have conquered the deflationary trap by “shock and awe”.

    As it is, with Obama as President, and the half measures he loves, we could be stuck in a rut for many, many years.

  54. Politics, instead of being a call to duty, has become nothing more than a career for most of those blowhards in congress.
    The rewards are much too great to overlook. How else to account for the leap to “lobbyist”, offering unheard perks, to those who once served?

    Personal chefs, nanny problems, limo and driver, chartered jets, top of the line hotels, tax dodging, they all add up after awhile to a mindset that has nothing whatsoever to do with the rest of us.

    There must be a way from preventing this cycle to continue but outside of term limits, which is never going to happen, these are the people who will continually be sent to DC as “problem solvers”. Pigs at the trough? These are hogs.

  55. That argument by Claire McCaskill is a classic in child-like “logic” No, Claire, the answer is no. But your question is irrelevant. Grow up and stop listening to your children.

  56. DV: she’s on meet the press right now with barney f … and a couple of republicans arguing about the stimulus plan

  57. BTD can still kiss my cat’s a$$ — he wanted Obama because he was more electable & his policies were “virtually identical” to Hillary’s. I’m not forgetting that he said that REPEATEDLY & shut down anyone who disagreed. He can start crawling from here to China & I’m not going to give him props for anything. I repeat, he has NO STANDING to criticize Obama or any Obot now, because frankly, he is an Obot, just smarter than the others because he covered up his devotion a tad bit better.

  58. Another great post, RD. That pic of Krugman — is he wearing a kata (Buddhist white scarf)?

  59. BTD is a douche but at least he’s calling out the hypocrites.


  60. now, they’re on the TARP

  61. Joanelle – email rather than fax…they probably can’t keep enough paper in the machines for how fast the messages are coming in.

    If Obama continues like this, we might actually see Hillary win in 2012 as the first write-in candidate to take the job of POTUS. The failure of the “stimulus”, IMHO, is about the only thing that will take Obama down. No forgiveness or room for error on this topic despite his “learning curve” grace period.

    This is the Obama the Republicans so desperately wanted, and they are going to destroy him in a swift move of exposing his greatest weakness. THEY learned their lesson with Bill Clinton on quantity and quality of destruction topics and they weren’t going to rely on personal attacks if they could have bonafide incompetence.

  62. Pat J — well, my grandfather always said pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered.

  63. Yes they are Boston! They’ve been running exercises here in Joliet Illinois for the past year.
    No-one in the ME-dia is reporting on this. Why? And don’t get me started on all those “FEMA” camps they have been building!

  64. angienc2, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:14 am Said:
    ……— get the President to serve us not us to serve him…..

    lol! Another way he’s like Bush. I remember on 9/11 all Karen Hughes had to say was ” the President is safe! ” Even the fawning press said, but what about us?? That doesn’t even enter thier minds. Just like ” Bush Lane,” ” Obama Way” is a one way street

  65. bb: yeah, they couldn’t rescue my neighbors who were drowning from their roofs, but they can practice shooting at them from helicopters … weird that, hmmm?

  66. Now, angie, my cats wouldn’t let BTD near them. Mine do not tolerate anyone who smells like (even old) koolaid, and I suspect your cat doesn’t either!

  67. Dakinikat,

    While they’re on the tarp, roll them up, throw them in the back of the pickup, and drive them out to the dump, OK?

  68. myiq — LOL — exactly — BTD is a hypocrite calling out hypocrites. Spare me.

  69. PumainSeattle– LOL — too true! I just think my own a$$ is too good for BTD! 🙂

  70. Ready on Day One? We will be lucky to see him ready by 2010 if he continues to take meandering plane rides and quick trips to grammar schools just to duck out of his duties.

    Getting Obama is like driving a “lemon” off the lot. Perhaps in time, and with many “fix ups” along the way. But it is not called a lemon without reason.

  71. TARP 2.0 sounds just about as well-organized as the original bail out. They are just going to launch billions of dollars into the economy and “hope” that it is used effectively. What kind of idiocy is that?!

    Earmark-Free Stimulus Bill Lacks Spending Direction

    When this bill passes, a Niagara Falls of money will flow out of Washington and into the accounts of state highway commissioners, governors and legislatures, local school boards, county executives — even mayors, Binder says.

    “It raises a whole host of questions about how efficiently money can be spent, how effectively it will be spent, how quickly money can be spent, just because there’s no set process here for determining how money will get out the door to create jobs or, as the president said, to save jobs,” she says.

    That doesn’t mean Congress will be responsible if the money is spent badly, he says.

    “The person who spends the money badly will be responsible. We are simply trying to build as many protections in as possible,” Obey says. “We have more oversight built into this package than any package in the history of man. If money is spent badly, we want to know about it so we can hold accountable the people who made that choice. And guess what? Regardless of what we do, there will be some stupid decisions made.”

    As it stands now, says David Walker, a former U.S. comptroller general, the bill appears to have no mechanism for directing spending. It’s left up to those state and local officials, who may or may not have the ideas or the means to spend it appropriately. And that will lead to “a series of disappointments that it’s too late to do anything about,” Walker says.


  72. brb

  73. does any one know how long it took dubya to hide out at camp david? was it his second week of office?

  74. Dakinikat,

    Did you see the helicopters? I heard they were *black* helicopters. {cue Twilight Zone music}

  75. Wow rats in the halls ; mice in the walls … the products are contaminated , and making people sick ….
    Oh wait that is the peanut butter factory .. I thought they meant the current administration ; the Cabinet and the House and Senate ( with the exception of a few good men and women of course)

    too bad we cannot recall them as easily as peanut butter products 😉

  76. Pat Johnson, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:04 am Said:
    There is not one, not one, politician I have any faith in. They are all a bunch of egotistic, lying, two faced, snake oil salesmen with one goal in mind. Power. That’s it.

    They could care less about you, me, or the next guy. Money is the only thing they have a vested interest in since that is what buys them the power they crave.

    Money. Power. Arrogance. A blend of what goes into the making of a politician and I don’t care what party he represents. They are all cut from the same cloth.

    I have to disagree. My area reps and ONE of my state senators have consistently voted with the people and against their own, when it is the right thing to do. I feel quite fortunate to have some very good representation in DC. The other senator needs to go, though.

  77. Maybe we should have a pool for how long it takes for Obama to take his first week-long vacation in Chicago or Hawaii? When is President’s day?

  78. bb: yeah, i did, the scared the sh*t out of a lot of folks, they announced it on the news, but most folks didn’t know about it, they were calling the police asking if the country was under attack

    it was like The Day the Earth stood Still here

  79. I love this post, Riverdaugher (and all the comments) and Krugman (of course)

    And my mouth is dry from spitting on BTD and TalkLeft. Jerlyn isn’t worth my spit. (or is it BTD who isn’t worth my spit and Jerlyn that I’m spitting on? So many Obots, so little spit)

  80. D’kat, sometime soon would you write a post on what those of us with a tiny bit left in our IRAs and 401(k) and 403(b)s should do. If anything other than hunker down, garden, and have barterable skills?

  81. The Teleprompter President is at Camp David for an overnight with the family and their invited guests. Next weekend they are bound for Chicago. Does my heart good to see the family enjoying every goddamned perk at their disposal.

    Forget the cost of fueling a plane and the overtime involved for those who must staff it. Forget the cost of the Secret Service. Forget the image this projects. Forget the security detail at the end of the ride in Chicago. Just as long as our Commander in Chief looks good for the photogs, who cares.

    Three weeks in and my loathing meter has tripled.

  82. From what I’ve been reading, they are cutting out state aid for education, low-income health care, and other critical services, but leaving in $650 million for cable service when digital switches over, plus millions for Frisbee Golf Courses & neon signage in Las Vegas. WTF?

  83. bb: down in the bohemian bywater we were all encouraged to play our apacolypse now music out our doors

  84. (we’re that kind of hood)

  85. dakinikat, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:25 am Said:
    does any one know how long it took dubya to hide out at camp david? was it his second week of office?

    dubya’s first 8 months in office were record setting for time on vacation, but he would go all the way back to Crawford. Obama, I trust, will try to break W’s record.

    I wonder if Obama is praying for that catastrophic event to change the subject right now.

  86. Oh Pat, he’s also going to Florida and Indiana this week to “sell the stimulus plan.” Apparently, Gibbs says the President is a “restless soul.”

    Correction: he’s an ADOLESCENT!

  87. BTD was one of the Obama supporters who promised to “hold his feet to the fire” after the election.

    Of course “after the election” means “no leverage”

  88. I don’t have access to a television right now so I can’t see what lies McCaskill is spewing on MTP. And I agree that I don’t miss Tim Russert at all.

  89. Wow, Dakinikat. That sounds scary. I definitely think we have to watch NO for signs of Obamageddon. Your fair city appears to be the guinea pig for the encroaching police state. The canary in the coal mine, so to speak.

  90. Nat’l Aunt, I have a Rep, “Bagdad” Jim McDermott, who keeps bringing up a resolution for nat’l health care — though he did fall for the kool-aid. And Sens Murray and Cantwell have been good overall, and supported Hillary.

  91. So many Obots, so little spit)

    lol! Thanks for that Sunday morning laugh-out-loud. 🙂

  92. Oh Please Claire!

    Get off your knees already….Barry is just not into you!

  93. On the They’re not all bad topic. Murray and Cantwell voted against FISA, too.

  94. Puma: i’m leaving what I’ve got where it is but I’m putting all of my new money into a fixed income fund. It’s paying 3% right now and i get to keep what i put in … that’s my strategy right now, and it’s the best I have to offer …

    i saw the folks that handle my money last week, i only lost 22% so we were laughing (more like crying) how sad that was because I REALLY beat the market!

  95. You can’t “hold his feet to the fire” when he never stands still long enough. Here, there, everywhere but where he needs to be.

    He is like the new groom who just discovered that his bride actually snores at night and his in laws are broke. Can’t get away fast enough.

  96. So many Obots, so little spit

    That belongs in the header

  97. Pat: well, how would he know what they were like? He spent his two years as Senator not figuring that out but running for president.

  98. Claire McCaskill’s argument is tripe.

    Does this faux populist really imagine that the public would tolerate no action whatever by the Congress on our current economic crisis?

    What would have happened if, say, Collins, Specter, and Snowe had refused to vote for a stimulus proposed by the Democrats? It’s obvious enough: the blame game would have commenced, and those three Senators would have to explain to their constituents why they have chosen to be obstructionists to the stimulus package on the table. All of those Senators can keep their positions in their states only by being perceived as moderates.

    It is unthinkable that those Senators would allow themselves to be depicted as the key votes who brought down the American economy because they refused to get on board with the stimulus.

    They could of course try to blame the Democrats, but the Democrats could simply say, we were elected, we have the mandate, and we won’t allow a clear minority in the Senate to stand in the way of that mandate.

    In short, if the Democrats were to hang fire on this issue, instead of caving at the first opportunity, there’s just no question they would have won.

    To see how much pressure there is to have some kind of bill passed, consider how even the Republicans in the House — in the House, no less — were forced into voting for the bailout. The one unacceptable outcome was that nothing would be done.

  99. and I just bought a grape vine for my Obama Victory Garden … i’m going to have jam and wine during the food riots if all goes as planned here

  100. This is what was taken out of the so-called “Stimulus Bill!”

    • $2 billion earmark to re-start FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal power plant in Illinois that the Department of Energy defunded last year because it said the project was inefficient.

    • A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film.

    • $650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.

    • $88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker (arctic ship).

    • $448 million for constructing the Department of Homeland Security headquarters.

    • $248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters.

    • $600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.

    • $400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent STD’s.

    • $1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.• $125 million for the Washington sewer system.

    • $150 million for Smithsonian museum facilities.

    • $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $3 billion.

    • $75 million for “smoking cessation activities.”

    • $200 million for public computer centers at community colleges.

    • $75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI.

    • $25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.

    • $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.

    • $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.

    • $6 billion to turn federal buildings into “green” buildings.

    • $500 million for state and local fire stations.

    • $650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.

    • $1.2 billion for “youth activities,” including youth summer job programs.

    • $88 million for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health Service.

    • $412 million for CDC buildings and property.

    • $500 million for building and repairing National Institutes of Health facilities in Bethesda, Maryland.

    • $160 million for “paid volunteers” at the Corporation for National and Community Service.

    • $5.5 million for “energy efficiency initiatives” at the Department of Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration.

    • $850 million for Amtrak.

    • $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint.

    • $75 million to construct a “security training” facility for State Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities of other agencies.

    • $110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.

    • $200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles for use on military installations.

  101. They see him as “cool”. I see him as detached, indifferent. They see him as “smart”. I see him as a front for others. They see him as “transcendent”. I see him as a fake who played on his color. They see him as “pragmatic”. I see him as devoid of ideas. They see him as “bipartisan”. I see him as a player.

    The disconnect between me and them is huge. I prefer reality.

  102. Thanks HeidiLi — I just checked out the article — just so you all remember CA was for Hillary. But in my town? They had it sewed up for O — real fast. I couldn’t even get a lawn sign for her — and the only office was for him. I will never forgive CAPPS. For that.

    Nor will I ever forgive ANY Calif. Democratic Women. This was a feminist issue for me. As a voter. That they did not help Hillary?
    All those women I voted in?

    Only RD knows the depth of my wrath on that — boy. Hillary was my issue. Right after she won CA — all the problems started didn’t they?
    With Michigan and Florida and Brazile and all the rest. RD got all of it, down. Every day. And gradually all the rest of you arrived until the Confluence is such an unbelievable powerhouse!

    It has been something to watch.

    At this point, I’m just worried (therapist) for the psyche of the country, overall. I feel that we needed some “stability” to see us through the transit out of war and the last eight years. I felt Hillary could do that — and McC had a stake because of his kids who were over there.

    Never once have we heard “peace” from O.
    Never once.

    O is Cheney’s 8th cousin. And look what Cheney piped up and said last week.

    Code Pinksters are beginning to see through the ruse of PELOSI et al. You can’t fool a Californian — we hate BS — we really do.
    We are progressives — what is really meant by that — my sense is NY and NJ are alike — maybe more on the eastern seaboard too — the northern states — that is why once I heard RD’s Voice — it was like a trumpet! It was amazing (and still is!) —

    all the voices here are — the writers — all the things you are talking about represent the feelings of “core Democrats” to me.

    Like RD, McC/Palin were difficult to choose — but McC (more him than her) was enough like Hillary I could cross party lines.

    McC and Hillary aren’t arrogant. They are workers.

    Government “works” for the people, not vice versa. At least it has always seemed that way save Nixon or last 8 years.
    Pelosi? Does she have WWIII in mind? I see her as a very sick individual. I also se her as using O — but that may have been mutual.

  103. “The disconnect between me and them is huge”

    Me too, Pat.

  104. frankly0, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:34 am

    Indeed. How depressing it was to see Dems cave yet again….when they hold all three seats of power!!
    WTF!!! with every Dem gain since 06, the only change is they cave in even faster.

  105. Excuse me, but the endgame here is not what is good for the nation but who gets to come back during the midterms and who gets to run in 2012.

    For most of them, their stand on the issues is how they can retain their own seats once again either in the House or Senate. To believe otherwise, and I am generalizing here but look at the cast of characters, they are only interested in the next election cycle.

    The “stars” are those of either party who get the most face time on tv. Their interests are not ours.

  106. He is like the new groom who just discovered that his bride actually snores at night

    On her wedding night as the groom is getting undressed the bride discovers that his left leg is missing below the knee and he has a prosthetic. She freaks out and runs home crying.

    Her mother asks her what’s wrong and she says “I can’t make love to my new husband – he has one foot!”

    Her mother says “You stay here, I’ll go make love to him.”

  107. Yeah, that “restless soul” thing is scaring the sh*t out of me.

    Always told BTD and the TL-ers that Obama should have been VP. Still historic, and it would given him time to mature as a politician.

    This was not his time. The country needed a leader with energy, vision and experience. It was Hillary’s time, and he stole it from her.

    I’ll never forgive him and the Democratic Party for that.

  108. oy, there is some guy on meet the press that says Obama’s War in Iraq is going to be longer than Dubya’s and that the Generals are going to start giving him trouble shortly …oy oy oy oy oy

  109. New book called: The gamble

  110. Didn’t Tom Ricks resign from the NYT? I thought I read that somewhere last year. He always made sense.

    Probably why he left.

  111. Thanks, D’kat.

  112. he’s at WAPO now from what I’m seeing on the tube

  113. An actual funny, dirty joke. Thanks for the laugh, myiq!

  114. Maybe we should insert a clause into the swearing in.

    “You have 30 days to decide if this job is for you. If after 30 days you feel it is too restraining, too overwhelming, too cumbersome to fit your needs, you may resign with no hard feelings. You will receive a severance package based on that one month service and we will pay for all moving costs.”

  115. Yeah yep Tom ricks 🙂

  116. madamab, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:43 am Said:
    ….. It was Hillary’s time, and he stole it from her

    Indeed, it was and is Hillary’s time ….that’s why she’s hit the ground running at State. There is a power there that comes from it being her time. However we could have had that for the oval office too . We was robbed…and hell yes, I’m bitter .

  117. well, i am definitely ordering that book … that discussion was down right mind blowing !

  118. Nat’l Aunthem, sorry, I mean to address my comments to Pat J on the they’re not all crooks topic.

    Reading too fast to try and keep up with all of you!

  119. he’s saying that pakistan/afghanistan are going to be Obama’s vietnam if he does the surge thing there

  120. It is natural for him to miss “the campaign trail”. After all, he was guaranteed swooning crowds and an adoring press who could not get enough of him. Imagine living without all that applause and the lights and the adulation which has now translated to “real work”.

    Hell, I would not want to give that up either. “Rev up that plane! I need my fix! I am beginning to feel that people may not love me as much anymore!”

  121. “restless soul” and axelface called him a ” hot house flower” why didnt they say this on the ‘campaign trail” I am sure they did not anticipate this much scrutiny.. and seeling this “package” the second time is going to be difficult


  122. Dakini-I’m listening to a book called “Bad Money:Reckless Finance, Failed Politics and the Global Crisis of American Capitalism” by Kevin Philips, also “The Cheating Culture: Why More Americans are Doing Wrong to Get Ahead”” by David Callahan-are they any good?

  123. Kevin Phillips is fine, don’t know about david callahan

  124. Sebelius is pro choice isn’t she?

  125. ps: Red Dragon’s breakdown……

    Oh brother. Talk about CLUELESS spending.
    Here is the fix:

    spend all those millions and zillions giving people a 35,000 a year job!
    drop interest rates on housing to 4% like McC wanted to.

    that would create some stability for the national psyche —
    a job and housing — those come first!

    Ps — housing could be done using an indigenous model — rammed earth — not expensive! The thick walls cut down on heating/cooling — straw bale works like that too.


    it’s not that hard.
    to create stability.

  126. Good morning everyone! Thanks for the welcome (downthread).

    I was just listening to Liz Trotta on Fox talk about all of the media backlash hitting Obama.

    Is it wrong to feel a bit of glee? I mean, I have such a bad feeling about all of this. At the same time I feel happy that I can tell my best friend “I told you so”.

    Obama has had a habit of moving on the next job as soon as he gets the last one. He has nowhere left to go now. What is he going to do now that he has to stand still? He is going to actually have to, gulp, work!

  127. i’m adopting paperdolls mantra for my friends:

    I wasn’t fooled

    i’m gonna put that on a number of my t shirts

  128. MB — VP for Obama would definitely have been better than President; however, I for one never agreed with that one either because I always saw him as a sociopath — no amount of time as VP would have cured him of that. That is the exact reason he was “rushed” into the Presidential slot — if he actually had to serve as Senator his non-leadership would have been exposed.

  129. Nancy: “………Obama has had a habit of moving on the next job as soon as he gets the last one. He has nowhere left to go now. What is he going to do now that he has to stand still? He is going to actually have to, gulp, work!”

    Or implode.

  130. Edge has a really strange sense of humor.

    I’m in awe

  131. MB — are you still here? Do you know how to get in touch with SOD & tell her to check her mail?

  132. purplefinn-

    At the very least, it will be entertaining to watch Obama fall apart, even as we are watching everything else collapse around us.

  133. Kim Gandy, and all those other feminist groups who jumped onboard the Obama Express to Nowhere, will never tell you the actual reason for their defection. And it had nothing to do with gender. Only a fool would fail to recognize the difference in what Hillary brought to the table as opposed to the very little Obama had to offer.

    The reason was his r*ce. They wanted the mantle of “tolerance and transcendence” with which to cover themselves. What better way than to choose a person of color to knock back those feelings of white guilt and be ready on Day One to actively point at their own progressivism?

    Experience and working with women’s issues were lacking in his resume. There was nothing of any substance to point to but they eagerly embraced this notion since they wanted to badly to have a seat at the table and to be able to feel good about themselves. Dissing and trashing Hillary was a small price for them to pay. He was about to sweep the nation in victory and they took a page from the blank sheet portfolio and produced again their own projections without examining it further.

    So he rewarded them by exclusion and the chipping away of women’s rights. Lesson learned. Too late to unring the bell.

  134. paper doll, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:49 am Said:
    madamab, on February 8th, 2009 at 11:43 am Said:
    ….. It was Hillary’s time, and he stole it from her
    Indeed, it was and is Hillary’s time ….that’s why she’s hit the ground running at State. There is a power there that comes from it being her time. However we could have had that for the oval office too . We was robbed…and hell yes, I’m bitter .

    I’m bitter too!!

  135. I remember writing to The Nation re: a story one of the writers finally did on the sexism Hillary experienced ruing the primary (right after the convention in Denver but pre-PDS — when, for a few lonely weeks the women on the left thought it was ok to speak up). I told them that the story was good too bad they are only printing it now when it doesn’t matter since their “chosen one” Obama had the nomination sewed up. I got a response back from the editor telling me that was b.s. that there were many pro-Hillary articles in the Nation — she couldn’t name one though — when I told her as much I didn’t get a response. Really, how can you argue with people who make sh!t up? F*ck them all, too.

  136. VB:Ps — housing could be done using an indigenous model — rammed earth — not expensive! The thick walls cut down on heating/cooling — straw bale works like that too.

    That’s very much in fashion at the Faculty of Architecture here in Florence. (a friend’s daughter is doing her thesis on that)
    They don’t get it do they-housing and jobs first.

    How about these ones too:

    • $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.
    • $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.
    • $1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.
    • $125 million for the Washington sewer system.

  137. F*ck them all, too

    So many Obots, so little spit

  138. I have to say I feel very uneasy about Hillary in this post. With his “Faith Based Initiatives” more than likely about to creep into the discourse and his bungling and bumbling the last few weeks, she may have to carry out his inexperienced positions in a way we never imagined.

    Axelrod has his eye on the next election and she may find herself more vulnerable as a result.

  139. Electing a woman would have changed the paradigm so much in one ” swell foop ” it terrified the erstwhile pantsuit support people from NOW and they ran right to the man and championed what they thought and werre led to believe was ” his cause” . The bought the empty suit hook, line, and sinker and he is sinking us ..

  140. myiq — LOL — I know, KB’s comment really needs to be made into a bumpersticker — I’d put it on my car.

  141. Age of Testosterone comes to end in Iceland

    Iceland, ravaged throughout history by volcanic eruptions and natural catastrophes, is struggling with a man-made disaster so overwhelming that the women are taking over. It is, they say here, the end of the Age of Testosterone.

    Next week a newly minted left-leaning Government led by Johanna Sigurdardottir will start to tackle the tough agenda of cleaning out the old-school-chum networks that have led Iceland to the verge of bankruptcy.

    Half of her Cabinet will be women; female advisers carrying briefcases move in and out of the Prime Minister’s whitewashed office, a former jailhouse in the middle of Reykjavik. Two women, Birna Einarsdottir and Elin Sigfusdottir, now run the struggling and disgraced New Landsbanki and New Glitnir banks.


  142. I don’t want any of my money going to faith based initiatives… that’s like saying you think astronauts for a flat earth are good investment too …

    what ever happened to science and rationale thought?

    Why all this emphasis on promoting ignorance and intolerance?

  143. dakinikat: Votes

  144. i guess when we all live in tents, the preachers will be there to talk about the flying spaghetti monster’s ‘plan’ of us, and all of this is going according to plan as they drive their BMWs back to their gated communities and sup on caviar and champagne

  145. and, no Obots — my car is NOT a Prius — the manufacturing of which & its battery actually leaves a BIGGER carbon foot print than a “regular” car — my car is fuel efficient low emission model. Unlike you morons, I take time to research the “next big thing” before committing myself too it.

  146. dak — ignorance & intolerance is all they’ve got — that is how Obama got elected, don’t forget.

    I would love to not pay taxes in protest of my money going to faith based initiatives, but something tells me I will not be as lucky as Geither, et al.

  147. The “Most Popular Headlines” on the same page as Krugman’s article includes this nauseating story:

    You Try to Live on 500K in This Town

    “As hard as it is to believe, bankers who are living on the Upper East Side making $2 or $3 million a year have set up a life for themselves in which they are also at zero at the end of the year with credit cards and mortgage bills that are inescapable,” said Holly Peterson, the author of an Upper East Side novel of manners, “The Manny,” and the daughter of Peter G. Peterson, a founder of the equity firm the Blackstone Group. “Five hundred thousand dollars means taking their kids out of private school and selling their home in a fire sale.”
    Few are playing sad cellos over the fate of such folk, especially since the collapse of the institutions they run has yielded untold financial pain. But in New York, where a new study from the Center for an Urban Future, a nonprofit research group in Manhattan, estimates it takes $123,322 to enjoy the same middle-class life as someone earning $50,000 in Houston, extricating oneself from steep bills can be difficult.
    The cold hard math can be cruel.


    Spit. Spit. Spit.

  148. ever notice that nuns are the only ones that are really forced to live with a vow of poverty?

  149. got your emails ang and MB- –you’ve both got mail!

  150. angie, yeah, I did the math on the hybrid cars with mileage, break-even, cost to produce, etc. and was surprised to see it add up to mostly hype.

  151. when i saw the cost of the replacement batteries on hybrids that was my signal it was a crock-o-shiest

  152. I read a post on NQ this am that includes an analysis of the stimulus package by Feldstein, the conservative economist. It really made sense. He actually opposed the Repub line for tax cuts saying basically that the ones put forward will do no good and until you get demand you will not get growth going again. He supported one of my ideas—let’s get the military rebuilt and re-equipped.

    Looking over the stimulus package cuts, what I notice about them is that mostly they are spending proposals that do not lend themselves to fast action. So maybe they are a good set of cuts. I am for education spending but school construction at its fastest track takes 4-5 years and 8-10 is not unusual.

    I am very concerned that we are looking at vast, huge outlays that are not going to stimulate—then where do we go?????

  153. dak — it is a misunderstanding that Priests take a vow of poverty — they don’t with the Franciscans (I believe) being the only ones who do. Nuns, on the other hand, do all take a vow of poverty — but everyone knows it is because it is only us wimmen who can’t live within our means. (rolls eyes).

    Poor bankers– can’t live on $500k a year. spit, spit, spit is right.

  154. d’kat — that “faith-based” crapola getting $$$ while poorer women can’t get contraceptives makes my blood boil.

    And the Obot administration has asked the Justice Dept to write some guidelines showing how it’s all ok and not mixing religion and politics. Nah, nothing to do with state-sponsored church funding going on here; move along now.

  155. I took a vow of wealth, but I’m having trouble keeping it.

  156. jangles: straight to a great depression and a public finance catostrophe, do not pass go, do not collect your salary

  157. Thanks Laurie!

    ps: by the time they plaster over rammed earth/straw bale you get a “plastered” looking house!

    they could use this in New Orleans and other devastated areas?

    rather than those FEMA trailers?

    Diversity in the “model” based on what each state has available — like stones, etc. When we PUMAS saw what was happening on the Indian Reservations? The Poverty that we thought was taken care of long ago? OMG.

    Better to go back to a model from 1900. Gardens (non-GM seed) — sustainable housing. That is what you call grass root progressivism out West.

    Even in cities you could set up plans for inner city renovation and urban gardens — all you have to do is look to the model used at about 1900 — as people lived and grew produce in each state?

    All those pioneers survived then, didn’t they?

    Urban renewal was a 70’s mission as I recall — it was a Dem thing back then. No reason it can’t be again.

    It has to be. The way this looks is starting to resemble times of French Rev and we know what the peasants did re the Bastille.

    Housing and Jobs first. Stave it off?

    Not a bad idea.

  158. Pat Johnson, on February 8th, 2009 at 12:18 pm

    Indeed Pat , N.O.W. etc. embraced thier hangman. Hillary was what they have been aiming at for 30 years ….and they stabbed her in the back. I think at some point all the higher ups knew there was no stopping the O express. The Upper Crust wanted him …end of story. So many got on . What extra pisses me off is they expect me to sallow/ believe the snake oil reasons they use to simply cover thier assess.

  159. The Nat’l Park Service and Nat’l Forest Service has millions and millions of dollars worth of projects which are “shovel-ready” i.e. could be started w/in a couple of months.

    Here in the rainy NW we have campgrounds, trails, bridges, and access roads, including parts of the Pacific Crest Trail, which have been out for several years due to floods. There are alternative PCT routes which are longer and many of those are in in bad shape too. There are actually less miles of hiking trails maintained now than when my parents went hiking — including day trips. And we could use some recreational activities that don’t cost the price of airfare and hotel rooms.

  160. SOD — got it. You’ve got mail too.

  161. vbonnaire: that’s the way they live in cuba, the neighborhoods all have ‘farms’ that grow food, they focus on sustainability

  162. WAKE UP FOLKS; That whole faith based initiative stuff Obama is supporting is a cover for his add on—non-secular community based organizations—-THAT IS ACORN FOLKS. Note also that the 2010 census is being moved into the WH and ACORN is likely to be very involved in gathering the data. If you think voter fraud was a problem with the O campaign, you have not seen anything yet. That census count does many things and will control not only political power but political payoffs in federal grants. This is the real Chicago politics.

  163. “because I always saw him as a sociopath ”

    Calif is progressive and hates BS? I live in the liberal belly of the beast as the wingers like to describe us – San Francisco. As soon as hillary announced her candidacy, all of my liberal friends began debating about what they did and didn’t ‘like’ about her. I saw the sexism creeping out all over the place. And when the primary got really hot, I heard friends saying Hillary should drop out. I would describe exactly what the situation was and put it in an historical context – they still wanted her to ‘get out of the way’ so that the candidate that ‘moved their hearts’ could become president. I was very disappointed at their non-positions and lack of substance. I saw sexism and misogyny as half of their motivation. (the other half was the race thing – cool to vote for the black guy)
    But when Sarah Palin came out of the shoot – my lord, the hatred and misogyny was stunning. I had to stop talking to many friends. I demanded several times to be taken off of those lying, smearing email chains about Gov. Palin.
    I went to a comedy show at my local church and the guy made fun of McCains war wounds and disability. He did the Caribou Barbie routine about Palin. The church audience howled with laughter at all of it.
    I had tears running down my face. Watching these people I thought I trusted and shared progressive values with – I was in shock.
    So is california all progressive? not in my book.

  165. dak & PumainSeattle — my brother & father are both engineers (my dad electrical, my brother environmental & civil). When the Prius first came out I was ready to jump on the bandwagon, but they both pointed me in the direction of the actual research. I was shocked at the results too & even more p!ssed off at the way it was being sold to “fool” people into thinking that they were actually better for the environment. Now I’m waiting for one of those hydrogen powered cars, but as my brother points out — where are you going to fill it up?

  166. Here in Philly, while they trying to close down libraries, the city is opening other ones


    that seem basically a room of books. The future of the libraries…. rooms without librarians

  167. I have to admit that I am getting sick of myself, constantly repeating the same old sad song day in and day out.

    I am sick to death of looking at “lawmakers” from both sides arguing over who has the best or worst plan when all along this whole debacle could have been prevented. Who were the watchdogs then who disregarded whistleblowers, regulations, commonsense economics? Who were the ones who sold us out by threatening bankers who were reluctant to lend mortgage monies to people with no income? Who permitted our borders to become porous and refused to punish those who employed illegals with nothing more than a payable fine and a slap on the wrist?

    Now they are bargaining away at how much money we need to borrow from other countries who will charge us a fee for borrowing back our own money which will take eons to pay back?

    I am sick of listening to my own tired voice repeatedly seeking answers to questions that should never have been posed in the first place as our own congress was too busy filling up their own pockets to worry about our collective futures.

    I give up.

  168. Jangles: I know I live in new orleans where every black politicians greases the palms of at least 6 pastors and their flocks … it’s just urban GOTV … and then the flocks get fleeced, it’s in every one’s best interest to keep them dependent on the programs and not get out of that cycle …

    i could watch it go on on the government access channels all day if i had nothing better to do

    and the same thing repeats with the repukes and their white pastors, a bunch of white trash churches supporting rich white pastors and pastors living in gated communities spitting hate, they have the same HUGE game going on in both parties

  169. the money that’s being passed over to “faith-based” groups is from the SSI fund for providing assistance to eldery and SSI recipients in need of rehab, etc.

  170. I mean RIGHT??

  171. Pat J — you can’t give up — I forbid it, ya hear? I need to hear you say what I am feeling 10x better than I can.

  172. RD,

    about the birth certificate issue. The confluence was right to pass on it, but it is nonetheless a VERY interesting issue in that it is a classic Alensky diversion tactic.

    The real issue is in plain sight : according to the Article II of the constitution to be illegible a president has to be a natural born citizen.

    According to every writing, cases and precedents that means being born on the territory of the United States and born of TWO american citizen at the time of his/her birth.

    O’s father was not an American citizen at the time of Obama birth. Case closed.

    The Birth Certificate saga will come down in history as a masterpiece of diversion.

  173. Oh, and I never get tired of saying “I was right” “I told you so” and “I wasn’t fooled”

  174. the programs just keep every one dependent, helpless and ignorant but they’re all saved! the politicians get the votes, and the pastors drive huge cars, wear expensive suits, live in huge houses, and become the camels that can’t pass through needle eyes, but then if their concerns were rewards in the afterlife, none of this would be the case … telling, but the sheeple just take it like a drug and pay just as much for their religion addiction as they would a crack addicition

  175. many of them are getting their rick roll on today ..

    myiq2xu: i’m in moderation … not sure why, but there i am …

  176. pathetic how many people will line up to get fleeced

  177. we passed on the so-called ‘whitey tape’ too

  178. Pat, watching him fall , and serve only , ONE TERM is going to be worth not giving up …

    the big O stands for ONE TERM

  179. Pat J,

    I know exactly what you mean. Watching all of this play out, I’m disgusted that there are very few grown ups on either side. I get so tired of trying to explain this crap to my friends who drank the kool aid- the ones that are still speaking to me.

    I give up. Let them have their way. I’m ready to grab a bottle of Jack, barricade myself in, watch the inevitable disaster, and get ready to pick up the pieces when all of the fools have been knocked on their asses.

  180. Swanie — LMAO — yep, I’ll watch it all burn down & I will happily say: I wasn’t fooled! I told you so.

  181. angie: problem is not getting fooled is not going to equate to not suffering … we’re getting dragged into this mess just like we were drug into it with Dubya. Obama’s cronies may get away with not paying taxes, but you know that you and I will not.

  182. angienc2,

    Yes, I too enjoy saying “I told you so”. It’s the only bright spot left.

    BTW: I live in Fort Mill. Don’t you live in Charlotte?

  183. angie — you got g-chat

  184. dak — believe me, I know we will all have to suffer not deservedly either, but I can’t help it, the fact that I wasn’t gives me a tad bit of comfort. 🙂

  185. Pat J. — you’ve got mail.

  186. swanspirit: You read an earlier comment regarding Faith Based Initiatives and the ties to ACORN. He will win the next election if he chooses to run, come hell or high water. They are about to realign the electorate once again with a census that will guarantee it.

    No matter how badly he screws up, no matter how less of a performer he may turn out to be, he will win hands down. This is not a 4 year run but an 8 year assignment that has no end.

    Rove had the first rollout plan to turn this into a Repub nation and Obama is just picking up the reins. There is no Repub contender at this point who has the stuff to overcome this right now. They are all the same.

    I wish I could muster some optimism but it just isn’t in me anymore.

  187. swanspirit: You read an earlier comment regarding Faith Based Initiatives and the ties to ACORN. He will win the next election if he chooses to run, come hell or high water. They are about to realign the electorate once again with a census that will guarantee it.

    No matter how badly he screws up, no matter how less of a performer he may turn out to be, he will win hands down. This is not a 4 year run but an 8 year assignment that has no end.

    Rove had the first rollout plan to turn this into a Repub nation and Obama is just picking up the reins. There is no Repub contender at this point who has the stuff to overcome this right now. They are all the same.

    I wish I could muster some optimism but it just isn’t in me anymore.

  188. dakinikat!

    I saw a PBS special on Cuba — the old cars etc. Healthcare etc.

    It reminded me of the 70’s — not that we in US follow that model — but at least there was care — old fashioned care — but care — in healthcare in that movie.

    It just seems that there is a better way than pure corruption?

    I think it would be very hard to see 4 more years of the same or worse — happen.

    This is one of those roll up the shirtsleeves times and get to work for Washington. People would be impressed by that.
    I didn’t read it yet but here is the hed:


  189. i think the Clinton years were the only break we’ve had for a long time in this long national nightmare that’s just a huge way of keeping an entrenched bunch of politicians in money and power

  190. i remember how relieved i was to getting rid of Reagan/Bush and I so wanted that feeling back this year

  191. now, we got chocolate bush

  192. dak — exactly right — that is why our corporate overlords had to make sure they took Hillary out — hence the 4 year plan where they plucked this empty suit out of obscurity in Chicago and “made themselves a President.”

  193. We are out of the frying pan (W) & into the fire (Obama).

  194. This whole thread has been so fun — I keep forgetting to speak up.

    (hiccup) I LOVE you guys!

  195. love you too katiebird … we all need our own island… we can call our Nation The United States of Common Sense

  196. Here’s a scary comment from Calculated Risk:

    mp writes:
    Stephanopoulos asks the *big* question, “Already in a depression?” and Summers waffles.

    I submit to you that if Conjure answered like that in this forum all of you would skin him alive.

    So, why is it that Summers gets so much wiggle room?

    HOW complicated is that question? If the answer isn’t “no” doesn’t that mean it’s “yes”?

  197. Pat… if those gas prices go back up, among other things..he can re-align… all he wants he can sew his ass on backwards .. it will not work …

  198. SOD — you have chat.

  199. katiebird: suffice it to say, both of them will get their paychecks regardless

  200. dakinikat, that’s so sad…..

  201. you know what? it is a beautiful day today –I’m going out for a while. Y’all be good!

  202. katiebird: well, you know the old saying about not having a dog in the hunt, right?

  203. angie: good idea …

  204. (thinking) yesssss?

  205. The stimulus package makes us officially the “United Scams of America”.

    As for faith-based initiatives, not surprising. The combine operating as the Chicago Clergy, fronted by scam artists like Wright and Pfleger, is awaiting its payoff – or its thirty pieces of silver – and that’s why Obie is devoted to the urgency of now in this economic ‘catastrophe’. Pony up, folks, the clerico-politico complex is taking over from the military-industrial complex.

  206. dakinikat, on February 8th, 2009 at 12:03 pm Said:

    Sebelius is pro choice isn’t she?
    She is a RC that is personally opposed to abortion but felt that she “”obligated to uphold state and federal laws and court decisions related to abortion.”


    I don’t quite understand how people who are members of a religion that thinks abortion is a “mortal sin” can say “I am against it but support it as a public official.” If she believes the tenets of her religion, the “I was just following orders” isn’t going to cut it at “the judgment”

  207. wow! what a thread to come home to!

    Dak: “i am, therefore, I snark”

    Katiebird (paraphrased) ” I think, therefore I spit”

    Pat: (in essence) “I see, therefore I loathe”

  208. I’m becoming a “yes” woman. I’m saying “yes” to everything RD and the Conflucians have said today!

    “I wasn’t fooled.”

    “So many Obots, so little spit.”

    Oh, and I’ve already taken my walk in sunny 58 degree southern PA.

  209. Another friend lost his job last week. Headline in the Seattle Times: Job seekers: older educated white men

    Translation–The sky is falling! Educated white men out of work! Who cares about everyone else!

    A faithful Demo friend that voted for Obama in the end after Edwards and Hillary support called sheepishly yesterday. People will be finding there way here–especially after celebrity PUMA Krugman finds a cozy spot!

  210. Katie! Why am I in moderation? Always mysterious….

  211. Hi {{{Joanie}}}, I have no idea how you ended in moderation. Akismet works in mysterious ways….

  212. My heart and mind are in the same place as Pat J’s. My soul has faith that we will survive.

    I am listening to Markopolos discuss the Madoff ponzi scheme passionately with the HF Committee and am enheartened by his example.

    And, taking a brief break form work, I am reading yet again my fathers doctoral thesis which brought him his Ph.D. at the University of Chicago and is being referred to in newly published works (in the Classics-I have been working on having it published but have very little time to give to this project), and one of the books he collected. He was a collector of books and so am I – both of us avid readers. This one is the oldest volumes in his collection, a French dictionary bound in leather from 1635.

    Probably held by many hands, it has survived many centuries just like the works he discusses in his thesis,and so will we. We will survive this, and if we remain as persistent in voicing our dissent as Markopolos, in spite of many years of being ignored, and not heard, until the unthinkable happened, we may be able to minimize disaster.

  213. The don’t call me threadkiller for nothing!

  214. ..all that Jazz {{{ putting up jazz hands}}}

  215. {{{{Katie}}}} lovey sissy boo-boo!

  216. and besides, bo and mo have only had a short time to get things all messed up, give them time to seriously cluster fuck so many things… and embarass the USA on a global scale .. they are just getting started………….

  217. red dragon: among costs removed

    • $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $3 billion.

    Note also that the 2010 census is being moved into the WH and ACORN is likely to be very involved in gathering the data. If you think voter fraud was a problem with the O campaign, you have not seen anything yet. That census count does many things and will control not only political power but political payoffs in federal grants. This is the real Chicago politics.</<

    That is scary, also because Soros is so heavily involved in Acorn.

  218. {{{SOD}}}

    Let me tell you why I have been missing.. My computer went ka-put, and I have had to elbow my way into the kids computer in between their endless sessions of World of Warcraft–meaning no how, no way.

    I am buying a new cheap computer just for blogging. (Ideas, Katie?)

  219. Help – I think my just submitted oost landede in moderation or the spam can.

  220. Joanie!!! when are we gonna have another one of those ‘joke’ nights here??

    {{hugs back}}

  221. I have to get ready for my youngests’ birthday party. I hope to be back later!

  222. looking-a French dictionary bound in leather from 1635

    Do you think it comes from the first French settlements?
    Very exciting….

  223. Joke night next weekend? Friday, perhaps? Kids with dad–computer—all mine!!!

  224. The White House can’t get anything right lately, but now they want to control the census?

  225. Laurie

    My dad lived in Europe for 20 years as an expat so it’s not from the settlements but exciting nevertheless.

  226. Regency,

    Control of census = control of redistricting.

  227. boomer — Egggzzzaaaaaccccttly… YIKES, that is not good.

  228. SOD, Boomer

    Did we expect anything else? After what happened during the primaries and these elections my thought was that things would be handled the Chicago way and that somehow the census would become a primary instrument to be controlled.

  229. Is there a reason why I am now in moderation for every comment?

  230. The repubs want/wanted the tax cuts. However, tax cuts don’t do any good if you are unemployed.

    Also, did they (Cong.) bother to fix that thing that’s been in since Reagan that makes unemployment taxable?

  231. Joanie: I’m the thread killer, not you!

  232. Hey ((( JoanieB ))) Good morning!

  233. Fredster – Unemployment is taxed for Federal income tax, but here, anyway, not for state or local. I am not really opposed to this because if your unemployment is your only income and it is low, you will not end up paying tax on it anyway. If you are on UC for part of the year and have a good-paying job the other part, it is considered part of your yearly taxable income. I am open to argument.

  234. “Pat Johnson” had an excellent point about the “Faith-Based” program & ACORN link. However I believe he is starting to build & fund that “Civilian Army” he talked about on the campaign trail. The interesting conflict is on one hand there’s this program. On the other hand in the “Stimulate Nothing” Bill;
    no education $ will go to ANY School, College etc…that prayer is included in their program.
    Also; remember this past fall when “we” the public totally rejected any, “Bail-Out $$” going to ACORN???
    Well I just read that $2million of Bank of America’s portion; went to ACORN.

  235. Why is ACORN getting any government funding at all??!! considering it has been under investigation for some time and in numerous locations.

  236. Why would Bof A give money to ACORN???

  237. Acorn must be of some use to BofA. Payback or pay-for-play’s in there somewhere.

  238. nothing like high unemployment rates to get kids into the military and whatever the youth service program obama has cooked up …

  239. ACORN is an Obama pet project and shovels money to his cronies … it’s pay for play

  240. the obama justice department won’t go after any B of A mergers or acquisitions if obama’s gotv effort is funded

  241. I go with pay for play regarding ACORN.

  242. Fran, on February 8th, 2009 at 2:40 pm Said:

    Fredster – Unemployment is taxed for Federal income tax, but here, anyway, not for state or local. I am not really opposed to this because if your unemployment is your only income and it is low, you will not end up paying tax on it anyway

    Guess you are right, but with U.C. being so low, that withholding could come in handy.

  243. Fredster – In our state, the withholding is optional.

  244. the obama justice department won’t go after any B of A mergers or acquisitions if obama’s gotv effort is funded


    Everything is so corrupt.

  245. dakinkat, I agree that the O adminstration has something up there sleeve for the poor kids. Their “service” initiatives are just nice covers for putting poor kids to slave labor while rich kids get the option of volunteering as a nice addiction to their college resume. It’s the reason why they scrubbed their service plan from their change website last year.

    In this economy, don’t be surprised that the poor and unemployed will be exploited to the fullest by this administration. If we end up in another war, we’ll have lots of desperate people sent to their deaths because there won’t be any other option to make money. It’s terrifying to even think of that possibility.

  246. PJ – you can’t give up – my husband said the new admin is like the “gang that can’t shoot straight”

    Some people like to watch, I like to listen – I’m on this blog everyday – but don’t always comment – what a group – I love you all – you all bring something special to this place.

    I was at a brunch this AM and there I was “listening” again – one of the gals there is an attorney – she’s also AA and I really respect her because she is sooo bright (she also has a Ph.D. in bio-chemistry) – her observation was very interesting, her great-grandma was a slave and she speaks very passionately about the plight of the AA population here in America – she said we all know that the way welfare has been used to keep particular groups “enslaved” and with the selection of an inexperienced, incapable black man they insured that they would “keep us where they want us.” This guy was not right fromt he get-go, he’s “screwing up badly and it’s going to get worse” this will insure that ‘they’ can say “look, you had your chance – you had an AA president and it didn’t work, so go away kid, don’t bother me anymore.”
    Her take on it is that if they have to they will do the same thing – pick an incompetent woman to run for Pres make sure she gets elected so they can then say to women “look, you had your chance…” that’s why they couldn’t take the chance with Hill, because she was too smart and well prepared – she would have opened the doors for women presidencies.

    It’s devious and may just be a conspiracy theory or she I guess she could be right. What’s your take on it?

  247. Oh, and Pat – I agree – I feel very uncomfortable about Hill – I don’t know what they have planned for her but although I think she’s a great pick for that spot, there is something funny about what’s going on – too many “support” people being picked.

  248. I want to say that I find all this bamboozling to be an enormous surprise, but no, I can’t even fake it.

  249. Joanelle: one of my neighbors and bf and I were talking about that back in october … she’s AA too, a librarian … she thought that because everything is messed up, that it would be nearly impossible for anyone to succeed right now, let alone some one with obama’s resume, she figured it was a way to placate AAs, keep them in the DEM fold, but the failure wouldn’t be blamed on the real power structure

  250. she and I were out saturday night with another AA friend of ours who lives in atlanta now … both of them were skeptical of obama, anyway i didn’t have to say anything but nod, they are not happy about the way things are going and they started being pissed about the time obama went to church on easter and lecture black people on ‘responsibility’.

  251. Joanelle: with the selection of an inexperienced, incapable black man they insured that they would “keep us where they want us.” This guy was not right fromt he get-go, he’s “screwing up badly and it’s going to get worse” this will insure that ‘they’ can say “look, you had your chance – you had an AA president and it didn’t work, so go away kid, don’t bother me anymore.”

    I told people this and they didn’t believe me. Told them. Now, they get to see it in progress.

    Hillary may or may not be totally screwed, but at least she looks good.

  252. they also said they used to get shouted down when they kept asking what is so black about this man?

  253. I have a black AA girl friend who is a very well informed kind of person also, and she also made a somewhat similar comment quite awhile back. When they know things are going to tank, they give it to the black guy.

    It was so obvious that BO was unprepared in the best of times, certainly not for the most challenging of times. And, to anyone paying attention, the problems have been apparent for some time.

    I think they did not want Hillary because they knew they could not ‘control’ her. They knew they could control BO.

  254. Dakinikat, Obie doesn’t have to BE black, he just has to APPEAR to be black. There’s a huge difference. Especially when you’re Spokesmodel in Chief.

  255. it was really apparent to me that friends of Ted did not want hillary (and bill back there) because they wouldnt’ have their day and their agenda… they orchestrated the entire damn thing …

  256. I have described him as a white guy passing as black.

  257. I’m waiting – it’s been my experience that what goes around does indeed come around – Karma can really be a b*tch! We can only hope they don’t hurt too many people before they get theirs


  258. Joanelle-
    I feel uncomfortable about Hill too, particularly after the Zinni affair. It’s almost as if she’s not being informed about what’s happening in her own department (like with Patti Solis Doyle.


  259. New thread up (open thread)

    This one is crashing my browser

  260. I am not in to much conspiracy. I think the beltway pundit class just didn’t want to have Hillary in power and the superdelegates were paid off.

  261. OT but Savage Politics Needs Help, too

  262. Hey guys, I am applying for a new job as an internet marketing assistant for a manufacturing company. I need people to go to my blogs and comment so that they look busy. the job is partly based on being able to create and administer web sites and blogs.



  263. You rock, Riverdaughter! What a great post addressed to Soul-Brother Krugman!

    I didn’t know, up to now, that Paul Krugman was a closeted PUMA!

    Could you please add to your ‘professional list’ :: “Immigration practitioners”? Thank you!

  264. Joanelle, on February 8th, 2009 at 3:21 pm

    The only problem is that Obama did this to himself. He cheated to get to the presidency so he only has himself to blame. This is no conspiracy to keep AA down

  265. I still don’t get the “sino-Peruvian lesbian”
    reference. Why sino-Peruvian specifically?
    Don’t lesbians fall under other ethnic
    categories too?

  266. Why sino-Peruvian specifically?

    Because Hindu-Latvian was already taken

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