Dearest Conflucians, our great MadamaB left a comment in DakiniKat’s Madelin Laundries post yesterday:
Kat – Amazingly, Senate Democrats gave away the Paycheck Fairness Act in order to get the Lilly Ledbetter Act. Can you believe this sh*t? And no one is talking about it.
Everything he does, you have to ask “what’s the catch?”
Some in Obama-lala-land (I will not link, but you know the cult sites) are claiming that we should just STFU and be happy that Obama is throwing us a bone with the Ledbetter Act – actually, they make it out to be Christmas, Hanukkah and New Year’s all rolled up into one.
But there’s a problem. Here an excerpt pointing out the differences between the two:
Rather, the Court held that when an employer issues paychecks pursuant to a pay system that is facially nondiscriminatory and neutrally applied, the mere fact that such paychecks may give present effect to past discrimination occurring outside the charging period is insufficient to restart the statute of limitations. The Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act expressly overturns this decision and provides that every paycheck continues a distinct discriminatory practice. Such a rule virtually eliminates the statute of limitations on some pay discrimination claims. Indeed, current employees – and even retirees who still receive pay or benefits – could conceivably file lawsuits based on discriminatory practices that occurred decades earlier, provided such plaintiffs could link their claims to compensation received within the statute of limitations. The Ledbetter Fair Pay Act would apply to pay discrimination claims brought under Title VII, the Age Discrimination in Employment Act, the Americans with Disabilities Act and the Rehabilitation Act.
The Paycheck Fairness Act, which amends the Equal Pay Act, also targets unequal pay practices through a number of provisions.
- The bill increases the potential damages for EPA claims by allowing the recovery of unlimited compensatory and punitive damages.
- It eliminates a key affirmative defense. Employers currently can defend EPA claims by proving they based their compensation decisions on “any factor other than sex.” The Paycheck Fairness Act replaces this defense with the “bona fide factor other than sex” defense, which only applies if the employer demonstrates the decision-making factor: (a) is not based upon or derived from a sex-based differential in compensation; (b) is job-related with respect to the position in question; and (c) is consistent with business necessity. But, this defense would not apply if the employee establishes the employer refused to adopt an alternative employment practice serving the same business purpose that would not create a pay differential.
- The bill prohibits employers from retaliating against employees who discuss their compensation with co-workers.
- It expressly permits class actions wherein similarly situated employees who do not wish to participate in the action would have to “opt out” of the action. This is an expansion because employees must presently “opt in” to collective actions under the EPA.
I’m no labor attorney, nor a politician, nor a law scholar (paging Heidi Li Feldman!), just a laid-off Juanita Lunchbucket who wants equal pay for equal work so I can earn my arroz and habichuelas just like the guy/gal in my same position and experience.
Help me understand this if I’m wrong: the Paycheck Fairness Act enforces and strengthens unequal pay claims while the Ledbetter Act just buys the claimant more time. Is that right? If that’s the case, it’s a another bamboozle by the Bamboozler -in-Chief.
Here’s what the NYT says (again, h/t MadamaB):
After signing the corrective measure, Mr. Obama ought to press Congress to continue the fight for equal pay for equal work by passing a second bill — the Paycheck Fairness Act — that would further strengthen current laws against gender-based wage discrimination. Among other things, this bill, which Mr. Obama co-sponsored while in the Senate, would make stronger remedies available under the existing Equal Pay Act; ensure that courts require employers to show that wage disparities are job-related, not sex-based, and consistent with business needs; and protect employees who discuss salary information from retaliation.
These changes may not please some business interests. But women still make, on average, only 78 cents for every dollar earned by men for performing substantially the same work. To narrow that yawning wage gap, tighter rules are plainly in order.
The House, to its credit, passed both bills. But Democratic leaders in the Senate peeled off the Paycheck Fairness Act after determining that pairing the two measures could jeopardize the chamber’s approval of the more familiar Ledbetter bill.
The new president can play a useful role in helping to rally Senate Democrats not to rest on their Ledbetter laurels and to persuade Republicans to come on board. In the House, only three Republicans voted in favor of the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act. In the Senate, five did. By now, Republican opposition to civil rights and pay equity is not surprising. That makes it all the sadder.
(ACK!!!!!!! Here they go again with the damn blame shifting? Obama doesn’t NEED Republican support, he has Congress & House!)
And without the Paycheck Fairness Act, Ledbetter Act is just garnish, IMHO. It’s like being sold a car without wheels. Ledbetter allows 180 day extension on every paycheck that was allegedly discriminated due to pay, but without the Paycheck Fairness Act, women have no increased protection against wage discrimination – and it will make it harder for women to sue an employer who is discriminating.
UPDATE for the PUMA paparazzi stalkers: If Obama co-endorsed the Paycheck Fairness act as a senator, what’s stopping him from signing it into law – from forcing the Senate to vote on behalf of the Paycheck Fairness Act like Obama did to House Democrats when he ordered them to drop the Family Planning Provision?:
Democratic Leaders Likely To Remove Family Planning Provision From Economic Stimulus Proposal
President Obama has asked House Democrats to cut a provision of their economic stimulus proposal that would give states more flexibility to expand Medicaid coverage of family planning services, the AP/Austin American-Statesman reports. According to the AP/American-Statesman, several Democratic officials said that House leaders likely would abandon the provision at Obama’s request, which was made “at a time when the administration is courting Republican critics of the legislation.” A final decision is expected on Tuesday, when Obama is scheduled to meet separately with House and Senate Republicans.
Why sell us a car without the wheels? What good is it?
And if we don’t fight for the whole enchilada, healthcare, equal pay, equal rights, voter rights, civil rights, etc., we’ll be fed kibbles and bits worth sold to us as Equality filet mignon.
Equality is not something you can fragment into pieces. Either we have equal rights, or we don’t. And guess what? WE DON’T.
If women want any rights more than they’s got, why don’t they just take them, and not be talking about it.
Filed under: Barack Obama, Cost of Sexism, Economy, Gender Equity, General | Tagged: Equality, Ledbetter Act, Obama, paycheck fairness act, Women's Rights |
The Confluence 
Great post, sm77. And an outrage. Here’s hoping a bunch more outlets pick up on this.
All I keep hearing from the bots when incontrivertible truth is spoken is give him time.
My response is why are women’s issues the focal point of Barack’s post partisan schtick.
He caves on women’s issues to republicans, for votes, feminist my ass.
Hope all women’s groups and women who fell for this BS are starting to wake up.
And PUMA’s are the only ones holding OBAMA’s feet to the fire.
Thank you Eleanor!
It took me a while to understand it – in fact, I’m still trying to understand it.
But it just seems to me that Ledbetter Act is GOOD, but not what we need to end unequal pay practices.
AMEN TAGGLES!
It’s just more flimflam and bamboozle from The One. Seriously – I haven’t seen one mention of any of this in the mainstream press, while they go to town making out like Obama is the great white knight, out to save all womankind from those big, bad discriminators.
Sigh. It’s depressing. (I thought you laid it out pretty well tho SM…What else is there to say? More stagecraft from our puppet-in-chief. Puppet of the ruling class, I mean.)
Taggles, what KILLS ME is that Obama is in a position where he doesn’t need Republican support. Democrats have both majorites in Congress, why the asskissing groveling!
The only reason I can think of is that Barack is a crypto-NeoCon, and everyday that passes during his presidency proves that.
As far as I know SM,
LL ACT allows one to sue for back wages if one finds out there is a disparity.
Paycheck Fairness, requires corporations and employers to pay the same for equal work. If they don’t there has to be a good reason.
So, even though LL is a step in the right direction, you have to have the guts to take on your employer and you have to know you are being paid less.
So you are right LL is a car without wheels.
Taggles – exactly – what is the point of being allowed extra time if the law can’t protect you while you are trying to prove discrimination?
That’s a suicide mission.
SM, it is positioning for future votes from the religious right.
He is keeping them on the line.
Taggles – )(*&^)*(&%^)&(*^%!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WTF is it with the religious wing nuts!!!
And why are Democrats falling for this crap!??
I went to a conservative board and pointed out that women only made .77 cents on the dollar to men.
they did not know. and they made me prove it.
and then there were the excuses that men needed to make more money to take care of a a household etc etc etc.
Another excuse given was experience or education must be the reason why women were paid less.
Sounds like the Lilly Ledbetter act is nothing more than a boon to shakedown artists and unscrupulous litigators.
Taggles: That’s the problem, the more Democrats cave into Republicans (which they have no reason to at this point), they will adopt the malicious and ignorant views these groups have. Especially with Obama’s expansion of the faith-based groups.
Moral Majority – my ass! Women are the majority and from experiencein the 2008 election, we know that Republican/Conservative women will stand with their more Liberal sisters for equal rights.
Wake up, Female America!
taggles – In “Conservatives without Conscience,” John Dean’s MUST-READ look into the mind of today’s conservative, he explains that conservatives embrace social injustice because they think they are immune to the factors that cause it.
That is why they seem so heartless and ignorant to us. It’s not that – they just don’t get that it could happen to them.
perries: the LL act doesn’t really get at gender discrimination … it’s not a bill for ‘women’s’ rights as much as an extension of rights for a group of classes … women are just coincidental to it …i think mostly it just extends the litigation time period which is good, but not a BIG deal.
taggles: We have all heard ad nauseum about men who support families. Apparently, in their world women who support their families do not count.
SM: The moral majority is neither,.
In a way the LL Act is an ambulance chasing lawyer’s wet dream. It’s good that people have the opportunity to sue. But you need to find a good lawyer. And a new job. Good luck with that!
These are the crumbs Obama throws the “progressives” and they eat them up with relish. This is the kind of stuff they can point to as evidence of Obama’s goodness. “He’s shutting down Guanatanamo!” “He wants equal pay!”
More about the Paycheck fairness act here
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c111:2:./temp/~c111VdoMg6::
There is no difference between either party! They are both the same power craving, personally intrusive, big money, corporate puppets, women hating, science deprived, assholes they have always been.
I hate them all!!
Obama’s name is not on the list of Senator’s who cosponsored this bill in the senate as the NY times claims
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:SN00182:@@@P
I’m sorry, OT but has this already been discussed?:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=atPwKdvRlWl4&refer=home
Obama Aide Who Insulted Hillary Clinton to Get White House Job
Email | Print | A A A
By Hans Nichols
Jan. 29 (Bloomberg) — Samantha Power, a Harvard University professor who resigned from Barack Obama’s presidential campaign last March after calling Hillary Clinton a “monster,” will join his National Security Council, according to a White House aide.
Power will be the NSC’s senior director for multilateral affairs, a job that will require her to work with the state department, headed by Clinton.
The appointment is expected to be announced shortly, said the aide, who requested anonymity.
Power, a foreign policy adviser to Obama during his primary race against Clinton, drew fire when she told the Scotsman newspaper in an interview that the then-New York senator’s campaign would do anything to try to win the Democratic presidential nomination.
“It looks like desperation,” the newspaper cited her as saying. “She is a monster, too — that is off the record — she is stooping to anything,” Power said, according to the paper.
Didn’t the Paycheck Fairness also have a provision that disallowed termination for disclosing salary, so that women would know when they were being discriminted against?
When you cannot afford to have a needed ten minute tonsillectomy then something is wrong with this country. When the Obama’s can hire a personal chef from their Chicago home to serve them in Washington and no one sees the irony here, then welcome to Versailles!
I hate these people!!
sorry OT (last post stuck in moderation I guess) but has this already been discussed?:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=atPwKdvRlWl4&refer=home
“Obama Aide Who Insulted Hillary Clinton to Get White House Job ”
That would be Samantha Power
I have just come in from chipping tons of ice off my car and I am in no mood for conciliation or making excuses for either party! Went through an entire can of ice spray and still one window is iced to the point you cannot see out. Not a happy camper!
I hate these people!!
SM77 – They are devoted activists who have very deep pockets. Plus, they are faith-based voters who are easily manipulated.
Any political party whose only interest is getting and keeping power would be crazy not to go after a group of voters like that.
I guess I never thought the Dems were that unprincipled, but now I know they are.
😦
Here’s some good news for women in politics:
Tomorrow Jóhanna Sigurðardóttir, a former union organizer, is expected to become Iceland’s first female Prime Minister and the first openly lesbian head of government anywhere in the world.
There’s a wonderful photo of her at Wikipedia and elsewhere online.
Would one of our regular bloggers like to celebrate with a posting in her honor?
And somebody on another thread said they “felt sorry” for Blago because “they” are making him the fall guy. Give me a f*cking break!
This is the same thief who was fine with withholding state approved funds from a Children’s Hospital until the administrator made a contribution to him. Jesus H. Christ! Feel sorry for him? Better the hottest place in Hell for this nimrod.
I hate these people!!
Cleanup at 11:25
Senator Olympia J. Snowe was one of the republicans that co-sponsored the Lily Ledbetter act. No wonder Obama and his supporters are trying to bully her and other 4 or 6 other republicans to vote for his stimulus bill.
Downticket – That link is from January 8, 2009. Obama had already resigned his Senate seat by then.
I will see if I can find out when the bill was first introduced. IIRC Carolyn Maloney and Ted Kennedy were the ones who sponsored the legislation.
I’ve always liked Olympia Snow. She is of the Margaret Chase Smith mold.
Outrage? This is blind outrage! And if one person chimes in with how happy and excited they are that the Repubs are not caving in I will personally make a house call armed with the ice pick and scraper.
No more f*cking excuses for either side. Let someone stand up for the public at large for once. 400,000 a month are being laid off. This means a loss of healthcare, food, rent and mtge payments not to mention that there are NOOTHER JOBS OUT THERE for most to qualify.
good analogy SM! In fact, I would go further — wheels are not THAT expensive of a “fix” for a great car — I think it is more akin to a new car without a MOTOR because what people fail to realize is how damned expensive & stressful litigation is — it can literally take years before you “see the money.” Additionally, while the Ledbetter Act gives women more time to bring an action the employers still have have the “any other factor but sex” affirmative defense — I’m not a labor attorney, but I know statutory interpretation & that language tells me that it is next to impossible for any employer to not be able to raise such a successful defense because that is an extremely light burden for them to meet. The Paycheck Act, on the other hand, makes the employer carry a much more difficult affirmative defense & would go a long way toward discouraging unequal pay in the first place. It is obvious to all but the kool-aid adled that the two acts should have been passed together.
I need a cup of tea. Am starting to sound like a blithering idiot.
This is no “loophole” you moron — this is LIFE. Your guy is a giant flaccid dud. Get over it.
Pat J — no you are not. You may be blithering, but you are no idiot! 🙂
Pat J: You need some chocolate.
(((((Pat J)))))
holy shit, Pat-you can just MELT the ice off your car, with your eyes, like a superhero!
And no, you don’t sound like an idiot-you make perfect sense
oh and I hate these people too!!!!
Thank you sm77,
You got that right! NO WHEELS,AND NO ENGINE. I am so glad you wrote this blog today. People don’t know the difference. The real teeth is in the Fair Paycheck Act. Ledbetter is good, but not good enough. Now we have an extended statute of limitations to bring claims under the equal pay laws that were enacted in the 1940’s. There’s not a whole lot of progress going on. with this one. Where is N.O.W. on this huge fuck job! Clinton never would have horse traded the family planning part of the stimulus or the Fair Paycheck Act, not to mention that she would have made sure women got our fair share of the job creation portion of the stimulus. These pricks can’t move fast enough to stomp on the back of our necks. What’s next, repealing Title 9?
Pat J – I hear you. I can’t imagine how anyone could think the Republicans are suddenly the answer after the past 20 years of the disgusting crap they’ve pulled.
However, some of our favorites do suddenly like Republicans, and we have to realize that demonizing those who disagree with us is not the way to go.
Bottom line is, the politicians are the enemy, not the voters. Both of our conservative friends would have voted for Hillary if they could have. Please keep that in mind, and have some chocolate.
🙂
(i’m the other sheri): Outrage? I am sure there will be plenty of it to go around – so much that it does, indeed, take a day to process some of it; just too much of it.
How can our fearless leader sit in his comfortable chair, legs spred, hands dangling (all we needed was the fireplace) and scream his outrage at his corporate friends and then have the nerve to tell us how bad things are while so many of us are living it? How can he do this after having spent 180 mil on his big party? Or, the cocktail party for the repubs? Or, the private chef from chicago? Is he wlling to “do without” just a bit to show leadership?
Jobs? Feel lucky if you have a job. Hang on tight. It’s going to be a bumpy ride. My husband is working in New York after we’ve had no income for 3 months. Only thing is, we live in Calififornia!! And, we are in our early 60’s. I could go on and on with stories about H1B visas but dont’ have time and I’m too damn angry these days. We don’t have time to “catch up”. And, F_ _ K fireside chat Obama and the horse he rode in on. That’s how I feel today – maybe tomorrow I’ll listen up.
mad, pat, everyone.
Repubs, Dems-they all f-ing suck!!
there isn’t enough chocolate in the world..
ZuZu at Calculated risk just wrote this long comment after watching a Senate Hearing on C-Span. She’s gone into incredible detail on what she saw.
And I’m stunned. Scared.
I think Pat might be angry…
What women need to realize is that the ONLY Constitutional right that we have is the right to vote. What the f*ck is NOW doing about that? Nothing — all they care about is Roe. Well you know what? Let them have Roe. Meanwhile, the rest of us women with a tiny bit of sense in our heads need to work together, regardless of “party” (note, all the female Republican woman voted FOR Ledbetter & I bet $1000 cash money they would have voted FOR the Paycheck Act) to fix the root problem — the patriarchy.
Downticket – I must have been confusing the Paycheck Fairness Act with a different one.
You are right – I can’t find any evidence that Obama was ever a co-sponsor of HR 12.
More lies from the NY Times.
GCH has a great piece on Jóhanna Sigurðardóttir, at Electric Blues.
katie, can you sweep up the debris at 11:25?
KendallJ; thx for the succinct explanation … nice to hear a lawyer say that
KB – Holy crap!
Hillary tried to warn them about these things years ago. But she’s just a girl, so they didn’t listen.
I can’t believe these fools are in charge of what to do with MY money and that they don’t want to do anything that will really help!!!
ARRRGGGGHHHH
Pat Johnson, on January 30th, 2009 at 11:26 am
It was I that said I felt sorry for Blago. He is as corrupted as the rest of them in Chicago but if you are going to be fair why not take out the whole lot instead of just one guy. Why go only after the governor. There are more big fish why not wait until the transaction had taken place
And btw — what I meant by my last comment in case it wasn’t clear — neither the Republicans nor the Democrats are “the answer” — both are just as much a part of the patriarchy as the other — we saw what the patriarchy did to Hillary AND Sarah this year. Don’t fool yourself — if women want rights we need to put aside the “labels” & work together to take them. First step: stop expecting Mr. Misogyny with a capital “M” to be “Christmas, Hanukkah & New Year all rolled into one.” (I’m looking at you, Naomi)
Done! Someone send me an email for more cleanup. I’m on my computer but working on a project. With email, I’ll get a visible flag that I could miss if I’m not actually reading the comments.
and NOW they’re realizing that that eroding the New Deal was a huge f*cking mistake????
AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH
Downticket has a good point — fuzzy said the same last night — 59 crooks in IL took down another crook! LOL Sounds like NOLA.
It seems that again backtrack gives all flash and no cash.
He did no work on either bill but the chicago way gives him all the credit. He signed his name without help and we are supposed to be thrilled. Whoppee
The jobs are shrinking in this country so it is a time when employers can say complain and be replaced.
At No Quarter there is a post about riots in different parts of the world due to economic failures. As usual they are looking to the USA for help.
We have the wrong person at the wrong time in history.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
angienc – Sister Naomi needs to get over herself, and we need to get over our love of labels!
I agree!
KendallJ, on January 30th, 2009 at 11:38 am Said:
perfectly put.
what people fail to realize is how damned expensive & stressful litigation is — it can literally take years before you “see the money.”
***********
Exactly…and bringing a law suit against an employer for unequal pay or other unfair treatment, you are committing occupational suicide. Without a “fair pay” law, Ledbetter is a Pyrrhic victory.
Hey MadamaB!
Thank you for the links – this post would not have been possible until you left the link on DakiniKat’s post.
PAT: hugs! I know, we just gotta keep demanding the full deal. NOW, NARAL, Planned Parenthood, not even our A-list feminists are talking about the discrepancy.
AngieNC: Amen, sister! You’re right, motor is also a good one too. But it’s either wheels with no motor, or no wheels with a motor.
It’s also interesting to me that Ledbetter is being hailed by the press and many blogs as a victory for women. Unfortunately for their accuracy, Ledbetter is a provision under the Civil Rights Act–it is part of age, gender, race, disability and other forms of discrimination. Lily Ledbetter happens to be a white woman, but she could just as easily have been a black man or a 50-year old employee or a person in one of the other protected categories.
Additionally, Ledbetter only allows employees to receive the difference in compensation for 2 years back pay from the time the discrimination is determined. Considering what most people earn, how many contingency attorneys are going to be willing to take on a case that could take years only to net them a few hundred dollars in fees?
Paycheck Fairness, on the other hand, is specifically aimed at discrimination against women in the workforce. Also, as mentioned above, it allows for punitive damages for intentional discrimination–an amount of money that might be appealing to an attorney in terms of covering costs of litigation.
What’s a “frontpage birther?”
See that misogynistic a–hole @ 11:56 describing SM as a “birther” — he is part of the problem.
I guess the person who calls us “stupid” doesn’t realize that other frontpage authors have children too.
Stupid is as stupid does.
Let them wallow in their ignorance.
The dumbass who linked this article and called me a birther says that the act didn’t pass.
Well DUH, you dumbass!
NYT says that that Obama should have put pressure to the senate for approval. But he didn’t.
And that’s the problem.
angienc2, on January 30th, 2009 at 12:01 pm Said:
See that misogynistic a–hole @ 11:56 describing SM as a “birther” — he is part of the problem.
**********
“Birther”?????? Haven’t heard that one before…I assume it’s frat boy speak for a woman being a brainless reproductive unit. These f*ckers are really sick..
we are all just a bunch of birthers, the misogynistic deniers of misogyny have spoken with their oh so eloquent and intelligent pea brains!
I left a mean comment on his pathetic blog — I feel dirty now — he really wasn’t worth the hit.
SHV — LOL — I think the moron meant “breeder” — Doesn’t matter, he can still kiss my you know what.
sm77 – They are dumber than dirt and have the reading comprehension of your PUMA cub at 8 months!
In any case, I find it hilarious that THEY are accusing US of fauxrage. Remember the RFK fauxrage? The video-darkening fauxrage? The LBJ fauxrage?
They really have no sense of self-awareness, do they?
I guess “frontpage birther” meant what I thought it meant. It just seemed so sick I figured it couldn’t be what they meant! I misunderstimate their psychosis.
son-of-a-birther..unless he was hatched
Given the people he thanks for the heads up, he crawled from the primordial goo of the site that will remain nameless.
Great post. Thanks for publicizing this.
DJ — LMAO! He may well have been hatched.
DYB – never misunderestimate the hatred of teeny-weenied Obamabots for women who will not submit! It reminds them too much of the fact that no woman will ever sleep with them.
Poor little babies!
brb yall!
OT but Gillibrand can speak Mandarin Chinese
Meet Lu Tianna, new U.S. senator
She is Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand, the new Democratic senator from New York State who took Hillary Clinton’s seat, and the word is she speaks Mandarin Chinese. Not only that, she does so with “good, straight tones.”
Gillibrand took the Chinese name when she was an Asian Studies major at Dartmouth College, where she graduated in 1988. At the time, Gillibrand went by the name Tina Rutnik. Tina sounds like “tian na,” which is Chinese for “that sky” or “that heaven.” Lu would be the Chinese equivalent of the first syllable of her maiden last name.
Here’s what the New York Times said about her in a Jan. 24 story:
She learned to speak and write Chinese before spending a semester in China, and wrote a senior project titled “The History of Tibetan Resistance to the Chinese Occupation of Tibet 1950-1988.”
http://news.yahoo.com/s/mcb_china/20090130/wl_mcb_china/china200901meetlutiannanewussenatorhtml
Thanks angie
Downticket –
But, but Caroline could speak…um…you-know
Downticket – In contrast, Caroline Kennedy can barely speak English.
You know?
👿
MadamaB: EXACTLY.
The NYT which is an Obama enabler, even calls him out on it.
The House passed it, the Senate didn’t because Obama should’ve pushed the blue dogs’ votes – and he DIDN’T. Obama let the ball slide on purpose.
Give the wimmen folk their 180 day extension, but lets keep it hard for them to prove discrimination.
Madamab–great minds
LOL DJ!
I didn’t see the birther comment. But, WTF, does he think he was hatched from an egg???
Thanks to Katiebird for doing the clean up! Can you come over and help me clean my house. 😀
I have folks coming over in 45 minutes and I’m still not motivated to pick up.
KB — that zuzu clip is revealing. Yup, the good ol’ US of A has all the social support systems of a developING nation.
Look what I just found on Partizane – an interview with Congresswoman Marcy Kaptur. She is incredible – telling her constituents to stay in their homes, even when the banks foreclose, and she will have their backs.
Check it out – well worth the read.
I LOVE this woman!
I heard on one of the news shows, as I was channel surfing, was that Paycheck Fairness would discourage employers from hiring women.
Now will someone please make some sort of common sense out of that? Please, because I can’t. After the birther statement and this one, I have to ask – does testosterone melt brain matter?
Also, for another rant, my daughter-in-law, who is atempting to attend school and work full time is searching for a decent day care. She only makes $10 an hour, which for the south is almost okay. A good daycare is $140 a week. After taxes and daycare, she will bring home $170 a week. If they weren’t living with me, until my son returns, how in the hell could she afford to live?
just testing to see if I am still in moderation?
LL is helpful only if you have lots of time and work(ed) in a well-paid job. How many unfairly-paid employees have a job that pays enough so that 30% of that 2-yrs of back pay differential is worth it to a contingency lawyer?
Obama mouthing off about “bipartianship” is effing BS.
madama- I can’t get into partizane, won’t let me sign up?
TRK – EXACTLY!!!
That’s the type of thing Carolyn Maloney writes about in her book. There is NO SUPPORT for working women in this country – ZERO. In fact, women are penalized, tax-wise, for being second wage earners. There is no mandatory maternity leave with full-pay, no mandatory child care….nothing must get in the way of the corporations making kajillions of money off of women’s backs.
TRK – to comment, you have to sign up for an account and be approved by an administrator, but you can read the stories without doing so.
If you are having problems signing up, make sure you fill out the missing letter in the word on the left hand side.
madamab, on January 30th, 2009 at 12:27 pm
Pat will appreciate reading that.
TRK – is she in FL?
I know in some cases there are day care vouchers through the WIC program.
madamab
Thank you for that link.
Can any of the lawyers here explain the homestead act and does it impact the foreclosure?
When I bought my house in California I found out about the homestead act. It cost $35 and sounded like it would be a protection against creditors.
I had never heard of it before and thought maybe it was not nationwide and only a western thing.
would it help some people who are losing their homes or overextended in debt.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE, MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
This is the Window Dressing Administration, supported by the Window Dressing Media. Who cares if the shelves are barren, long as those posing behind glass can be made to look even halfway plausible while they continue to rake it in at our expense, at the cost of our destruction, even.
Madamab-not to mention, that if dont want toapply for assistance, and you get a second job, you are also penalized for working the second job.
But let someone file for assistance and they are a worthless piece of crap. Just try to explain to a conservative that the way our government is set up, sometimes people have no option other than to live in Sec. 8 housing and get food stamps, because they cannot work and make it.
No, she is in SC.
TRK – it makes conservatives feel better to think that social injustice is deserved by those who are discriminated against. According to John Dean’s book, conservatives believe people are inherently bad, so this belief is easier for them to hold.
There are always a few people who will try to take advantage of whatever society gives them. However, public policy should always consider the many, not the few. And I believe most Americans are hard-working, good people. Guess that’s why I’m a liberal!
South Carolina does have vouchers for day care, however they have not had any money to fund it in ages. The only people who can get it now are children in foster care.
I admire Marcy Kaptur as well. I have seen her make a case in the House on more than one occasion and she reflects what most of us think in so many ways. We should send her letters of thanks.
Sorry for going off on rants. I am so sick of this bullsh*t heaved at us day after day when we know what is happening. A lot of big fat nothing. Giving that fraud credit for anything is beyond comprehension. He has done zero, zip, nada, to lessen any sense of anxiety that we continually face as this goes on.
Instead of bailing out those Wall Street crooks why not make it a little less expensive for those existing on prescription drugs to maintain their lives. Or easing up the interest rates on home mortgages as a starter? I may not have the answers but I see little in this stimulus package to assume that they do.
The only interest they have is in saving their political hides against losing a re election. Few took Hillary seriously during the primary but they sure as hell as willing to co opt her ideas if it means another shot at 5 minutes of face time with Matthews.
At a risk of sounding repetitive, I hate them all.
madamab — thanks for the link — and she’s right — no original note = no debt.
AngieNC, thank you so much for defending me at that idiot’s site. I left a comment myself.
I love it how they are building this PUMA hunting network.
If we were just 50 hags, why would there even be a PUMA hunting network?
SM: Direct me to the site. I am in that mood!
WHere are they, if they are hunting for us, I will let them know I am around. As Angie knows, the southern term is “aint skeered!”
Kim! LMAO! Exactly — I ain’t skeered. Come & get me. LOL
I believe the site is stupidpumas.wordpress.com if you ladies feel like you’re in the mood to play with your food before eating it.
👿
Pat, I hate to post it, but it is well worth it to see you rant.
http://stupidpumas.wordpress.com/2009/01/30/an-avalanche-of-stupid/
I am not interested in someone talking politically to me, I want someone who speaks commonsense for once. Or am I expecting too much?
folks do yourself a favor and make their irrelevancy continue by ignoring them.
I went there. I feel dirty.
They have a whole new post up called Stupid Angie and Stupid Madamab. What a nasty group of people.
they’re “buttburger” people.
geni-asses, the whole lot.
That is really hilarious – to have actual posts called Stupid Angie and Stupid Madamab! It is so stupid that I have to laugh out loud. I am still laughing.
Awwww, poor little small-penised fools. Do they think we give a rat’s ass what they think of us?
WE have, like, real friends and real lives.
Unlike them.
I went to the site and left a comment with my tag line.
I was polite and to the point.
Can any lawyer answer me about the homestead thing>
I understand it to be no one can take your house due to debt up to a certain amount.
Is this nationwide and would it help some of the people with economic problems now
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
Good afternoon,
Found an interesting article at AT today on Hillary Clinton and Samantha Power
madamab, on January 30th, 2009 at 1:25 pm Said:
Awwww, poor little small-penised fools. Do they think we give a rat’s ass what they think of us?
WE have, like, real friends and real lives.
Unlike them.
So true. LMAO!
I agree with taggles. By going over there we raise their numbers from the usual 5 comments to more than what is deserved.
As myiq would say, we are feeding the trolls.
Afrocity – My prediction?
Hillary will eat Power for lunch, and still have room for dessert.
She didn’t come into the State Department to be “watched over” by a malicious nobody like Samantha Power. The reason it took her a long time to accept the SOS position was because she was negotiating for autonomy from Obama. Do we think Obama’s little spy is going to fare much better than the President did?
I think Power is about to have her Obot eyes opened.
you’re right, pat.
the mandatory sterilization comment will be my last.
now, put down the ice pick.
I went over there and dropped a comment.
There doesn’t seem to be a lot of traffic there and I’m not about to help them with that.
PJ – I agree too. I just thought if you were in the mood to be really nasty, they were a good group to practice on.
😉
Amazing how there are only 12 of us, yet they are completely obsessed with our movement. And somehow we happened to get 5 million hits in less than a year. And get Hillary into nomination. And scare the pants off Chris “Tingling Leg” Matthews.
What have THEY ever done for this country, I wonder?
helenk, I believe what you are referring to is the Homestead Exemption Act. In the event of a judgment against you, the Homestead Exemption protects a certain amount of your equity in your home from ever being available to satisfy a judgment. The amount protected varies by state. I suspect that you could Google CA Homestead Exemption and find out more information.
Afrocity:
MadamaB is right – what I love is that Hillary is Samantha Powers’ BOSS.
Karma is a BITCH, and I love her for it.
MadamaB, they are PUMA Paparrazzi.
Madamab, I agree. Hillary will take away Power!
Fredster where is the link so I can drop a comment too.
Afrocity it’s up above: stupidpumas
afrocity — stupidpumas.wordpress.com
LOL — he is truly a piece of work. I’m amazed he can tie his shoes. But then again, maybe he uses those velcro ones.
helenk, on January 30th, 2009 at 1:27 pm Said:
Homestead exemptions vary from state to state so the amount depends on which state you live in. Some are very low (like NC that amount is only $18,500 per individual, $37,000 per couple) but meanwhile Florida has not limit on it.
Gotta go, everyone. Try not to cry because people with the iq’s of doorknobs claim you’re stupid!
MADAMAB HAKA 👿
madamab! those morons have a WORM for that too!! See, their little pathetic site is so little because WE are so few – ie not worthy of attention from the “big” sites they frequent! LMAO!!!
helen — obviously, I meant to write “meanwhile Florida has NO limit on it” & not “meanwhile Florida has NOT limit on it.” Sorry!
I put up a comment to you Angie, and it went to limbo.
I had said he/she had a link to that nasty site that rhymes with toast so it’s a part of the “thundering turds”.
Helenk,
Not to speak in too much lawyerese, but I can’t answer specifically without more information. From your question, here are some generalities.
1. Homestead Acts are state laws.
2. They cover the whole gamut of real property related issues, from protection to taxes to inheritance.
3. In the most general of terms from your question, I’m talking 30,000 feet here, state law can provide for protection for a primary residence of an individual (if married then spouses are covered as well) up to a certain dollar amount from creditors. This is accomplished by filing a declaration along with the deed in the county recorder’s office.
4. This all depends upon state law like most all property issues. It would depend on whether or not your state has enacted legislation.
Hope this helps…
for the love of mike
don’t their wankers get sore from teching them all day?
Do you have to get when you buy your house or could people who are having financial difficulties get it now and would it help them stay in the house?
I had two homes in Pa and never heard of this law. I wonder how many people do not know it exists and could they be helped by it.
At this point in the economic times every little bit helps.
When I found out about it my thinking was any future medical bills could not be used to make me lose my home.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
You read my mind Catarina, that is why, Angie, he can’t tie his shoes – A one handed typist.
helenk — you can claim your homestead exemption at any time but if a creditor gets a judgment against you a time limit to get it filed USUALLY starts to run in your state.
helenk: In FL you can declare homestead on just one residence. There is no cap, but creditirs can sue and place liens which are uncollectable as long as this is your primary residence.
Oh btw — that freak Miss Prolly or Ms. Prolly is a creepy stalker –she is quoting, from memory, about stuff I’ve written. {{shiver}}
They must be friends with the ugly red-headed guy from the other sites. You know…the one who was happy about his job in D.C.. The job where he’s a tour guide.
Did somebody call me?
Nasty, ugly people alright. Is it any wonder they adore the Big Zero?
“Birther” might be a reference to the birth certificate nonsense. They keep claiming that TC promotes that shite which is an outright lie. RD has made it very clear that the birth certificate topic is off limits here.
The point I keep making about Obama’s signing the Ledbetter Act is the timing. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that right after he kowtowed to the Republicans on Family Planning (and still didn’t get one vote from them!) he turns around and signs the Ledbetter Act. It was timed to deflect criticism over yanking the family planning funds. Obama loves playing both sides of the fence. But when you try to please everyone, you end up pleasing no one. I hope he keeps this crap up and pisses everybody off.
I went over but did not post. I agree with fredster, I don’t want to give that place anymore traffic.
Like Wonkette that stupid Puma blog is the perfect example of diarrhea of the mouth; constipation of the ideas.
chatblu
I only have one residence. But over the years I had two different homes in Pa and never once heard of this act.
My point is how many people in this country do not know about it and could it help them.
Thank you and the other posters for answering my question.
If it helps people how can we let them know it exists and what states it is in?
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE, MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
angie–You think NC’s number is low, IL allows only $7500! Some protection.
Correction: ugly, fat, red-headed guy. And Southerners know what they say about a red-headed stepchild.
gxm — “birther” may in fact be derived from that BC sh!t but the fact is it is only their misogynistic a$$holiness that makes the term seem “funny” to them. And yep, the fact that they think we do talk about that issue here shows how “smart & erudite” they are.
They still don’t even get that I actually MEANT Pyrrhic Victory when I wrote that — yep, women now have the right to sue for back pay, commit career suicide by doing so, put themselves through years of stress and attacks from the patriarchy all ending in a sure loss when their employer can show “any reason other than sex” for the unequal pay. Sounds like Pyrrhic Victory too me.
The Ledbetter Act is not just garnish. It’s very important. I’m a plaintiff’s employment attorney and I know. There is rejoicing in the plaintiff’s bar because of the Ledbetter Act. It’s good, it’s important, it helps people.
Who is Emma?
Afrocity:
On Powers vs Hillary: I certainly would not be surprised that O would send her to State as a mole. But it would seem harder to be a mole, when everyone knows your a mole. Kinda defeats the purpose. So there are probably others there of whom we are not aware.
That being said, from all the accounts that I have read about the people who have worked for Hillary thru her First Lady days to present, virtually all were very loyal and positive. I think Powers may be turned when she experiences the “real” Hillary vs the media Hillary.
Double agent, anyone?
You know, that web-site got more hits today from TC posters than they ever get.
grayslady — that is unbelievable! $7500 — what kind of legislators do y’all have in IL — oh yeah, Obama was on of yours! LOL
DYB — yep, I feel dirty — never should have gone there — afrocity & Fredster are right. It is no point arguing with creepy stalkers with their heads so far up their a$$es.
I thought they referred to SM as birther because she came up with Party Unity My Ass. Of course, I went over there and after reading the crap they consider so erudite could only respond with Go F^ck Yourselves.
Angie, could the IL situation be like LA. The Homstead Exemption in LA is $7500, but it’s based on 10% of the assessment by the parish tax assessor so it’s more like $75k. (I know I’m screwing up something here). BTW, there’s a move afoot in LA to raise it to $165.000 or so.
I may be confusing Homestead Act with the exemptions; not sure.
We need a new post up, this one is crashing my browser again.
How long before Rev. Wright is given some gig in the administration?
If Barky intended Power to be a spy – surely nobody thinks Hillary isn’t aware of all this. She’ll deal with Power in the appropriate manner. The question to me is: how will Power deal with Hillary as her boss?
DYB: Keep your nice tatted legs and thighs away from that ugly site. It will corrupt you! 😉
mlhath: But it would seem harder to be a mole, when everyone knows your a mole. Kinda defeats the purpose.
Normally the answer would be yes but you are dealing with Dear Leader who subscribes to the Chicago Way. We don’t really care here whether we know you are a mole or not. In fact the very presence and knowledge of a mole can have a debilitating effect upon any desired course of action.
They call us “birthers” cuz trolls are hatched, not given birth to.
angie–What kind of legislators? Crooked, for the most part.
I’m not registered with NYT so I couldn’t read the linked article. What’s holding up the Paycheck Fairness Act?
Not to mention the very idea of women ‘snooping and snitching” on other women for men is downright pathetic.
Fredster> No risk of me visiting that swamp! This is the only swamp for me! LOL.
I posted an update for the paparazzi – this post is being spread around to the frat-boiz-sphere
new post up! Ben Nelson has a brain!
afrocity> There’s already a spot with Power’s name on it in that special hell.
DYB, on January 30th, 2009 at 2:21 pm Said:
Fredster> No risk of me visiting that swamp! This is the only swamp for me! LOL.
That’s right. We’ll handle your corruption here!
Yeah it helps, but not enough.
Normally the answer would be yes but you are dealing with Dear Leader who subscribes to the Chicago Way. We don’t really care here whether we know you are a mole or not. In fact the very presence and knowledge of a mole can have a debilitating effect upon any desired course of action.
Afrocity – someone better send Hillary a book about the Chicago Way.
HelenK, homestead in Massachusetts used to be exemption of $100k, I haven’t checked recently. If you refinance the lender will make you release the homestead declaration for the new mortgage or equity line, but you can re-declare homestead after the new mortgage is filed with the probate court. In practical terms this means if you have a $300k property, and a $100K first mortgage, and and a homestead declaratiojn which protects a certain amount of your equity, if you want to take an equity line, (which is actually a second mortgage) for 50K, then you will have to release your first claim of homestead. Then you will get your refinance and owe $150K on your house. Then you can declare the homestead again to protect whatever equity remains up to the limit allowed by your state.
People also need to study the federal bankruptcy exemptions so they will not be intimidated by lying creditors.
re: Ledbetter act – sm77 – that’s right – it’s good, but not a whole lot because most people are not in a position to sue their employer.
Maybe someone should write a post about Homestead Acts
Afrocity:
You are right about the debillitating part. But, my money is on Hillary. I think she has faced much worse than Powers. Barky for one.
You are also right on that special place in hell for women who intentionally hurt other women. Maybe we need to come up with a female equivalent of an “Uncle Tom”. Auntie MoDo?
Good one mlhath.
mlhath:
YES!!! I”ve been saying we need a term that equals a “Female Uncle Tom.”
Fran – especially in this “perfect for employers” market we have. Women need more protection now more than ever from exploitation & discrimination.
Any ideas? Maybe someone more erudite than I could right a post that would include not only individual women, but groups of women as in NARAL, NOW, Planned Parenthood.
Female term for uncle tom
how about axis sally spewed propaganda for the Germans to the allied soldiers
Male term for anti-female Lord HaHa spewed propaganda for the Germans to allied soldiers.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
“Axis Sally” has a ring to it.
DYB
I have called nancy pelaosi Axis Sally for years.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
female term for uncle tom-ms femministes? Auntie Sallies?
Do you think he threw Pelosi under the bus too? She was for the female clinics, in the package.
Maybe we could get a number of them and vote. Most folks have already migrated to the next post.
Auntie Sallie is a good nomination.
Laurie:
That’s what made me laugh, here is Pelosi, expecting Obama to follow her lead and she pulled the rug from under her.
That’s what she gets for selling out a real feminist for a fake one.
And the worst part is that us wimmen folk suffer all the consequences.
Auntie MoDo?
I vote for this 😀 👿
Conflucians, I couldn’t agree more that the Ledbetter Act w/o the Paycheck Fairness is just a photo-op to make us women shut up.
Which in reality would women from all walks of life would rather have had passed? How many times have we women no matter party affiliation found out that we were hired or someone replaced us at a considerably higher salary given to a man? But 0 don’t deal with reality so its no wonder he went this way when he really could have earned that Feminist superhero caricature.
It’s no wonder Pres 0 believes he co-sponsored it; he claimed he was head of numerous Congressional committees during his Euro tour.
Let’s just see Naomi Wolf have another orgasm over this. I’m so pissed I could spit bullets!
i’m late to the prty (as usual) but angie is right that it’s a car without a motor. The current “ANY” factor but s*x language is an EXTRAORDINARILY low bar for an employer to meet. To give an example, an employer could say that a pay inequity is because the worker is a Capricorn or a vegetarian, or pretty much ANY other reason that is not linked to gender. (With the caveat that the plaintiff can then come back and show that the professed reason is pretextual.) Under the EPA, the employer has to demonstrate a “good” reason — a reason with some business purpose.
I hope I got that right because it’s what I’ve been telling my employment discrimination students all week….
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Great analysis. I wrote about this myself — AND I actually think Obama told the Senate to yank it. Why would the Senate pull it when it got more votes than the Ledbetter provision in the House?
But, with liberals falling into a coma with every moderate “advancement” that Obama makes, it is difficult to politicize the fact that more progressive alternatives exist! Believe me, I have tried.
Cheerleading for Ledbetter Law Drowns Out Discussion of More Progressive Pay Equity Measure