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Fashion Model Sues Google to Learn Identity of Cyberstalker

modelslasherbig Samir Dervisevic, a doorman at the Hudson Hotel in New York City, smashed this woman, Liskula Cohen, a Canadian-born fashion model, across the face with a bottle of vodka in January of 2007. Now I know our many lurking trolls are thinking, “the b**ch was probably asking for it.” Well, I guess it depends on your point of view. Here’s what happened. Cohen, who has appeared on the covers of Vogue, Harper’s Bazaar and Elle as well as modeling for Versace and Giorgio Armani, was sitting with friends at Ultra, when Dervisevic and his friend walked by. Dervisevic’s friend grabbed a bottle of vodka off Cohen’s table and poured himself a drink. When Cohen objected,

…she said Dervisevic – a doorman at an Upper East Side building who was born in New York to immigrants from the former Yugoslavia – exploded and threw a drink in her face.

“He called me the c-word and he started yelling at me, and then the bouncer told him to go away. He didn’t,” Cohen said. She then threw her drink on him, and he grabbed the bottle.

“He hit me with a bottle on my left cheek. The glass smashed. I went into shock,” she said.

Bouncers ushered Dervisevic away, and Cohen saw her white knit Ralph Lauren minidress was covered in blood.

“I went to the bathroom and I saw my whole career go down the drain. I looked in the mirror and saw a hole in my face the size of a quarter. I’ve been a model my whole life, and I’ve never had another job,” she said.

She rushed to the hospital, where she received 46 stitches – 30 inside her mouth and 16 on her face – to close the gushing wound. She said she has had trouble finding work since then because of the scars.

Dervisevic was promptly arrested and guess how much punishment he got? You guessed it, not much: thirty days in jail and and three years probation. And then he went right back to work. In July, 2008, he was again arrested for assaulting a woman.

….for allegedly whipping three glasses into a woman’s face at the Hudson Hotel. He claimed the woman and her seven friends attacked him in the bar’s VIP section after he bumped into one of them, his lawyer said.

But the women told police that Dervisevic went “berserk” and hurled the glasses unprovoked. He was charged with felony assault.

Now who could ever have predicted that a man who attacked a woman–a complete stranger–in public would be a repeat offender?

Today Liskula Cohen is fighting a different kind of attacker, an anonymous cyberstalker, who for unknown reasons, is determined to publicly humiliate and ridicule her.

Cohen is suing Google to learn the name of the blogger who has been single-mindedly stalking her, posting embarrassing pictures of her on the internet and writing about her in obscene and degrading terms. I won’t link to the site or name it. If our lovely trolls know how to use Google, they can find it easily enough.

Her lawyer Steven Wagner conceded it’s not easy to identify bloggers who lob insults anonymously, as New York courts have generally declined to force them into the light.

“We think we have a case,” he said. “This is libelous, it’s defamatory and you shouldn’t just get away with this.”

On the site, Cohen is ridiculed as a desperate “fortysomething” who “may have been hot 10 years ago.”

The Canadian cutie [sic] is actually 36, according to records.

Now, as many of our readers know, we here at the Confluence have been experiencing a bit of cyberstalking ourselves. And we, along with other puma sites have been subject to ridicule by other blogs–even supposedly liberal blogs that were started by women who claimed to be feminists.

This isn’t the first time. This year we learned through experience that anyone who won’t knuckle under and support the candidate the Democratic Party has selected, no matter how inexperienced or Reagan-like that candidate is, you will be called “fat, old, ugly, b**tch, c**t, and on and on and on–hatred so out-of-control that it would repulse anyone with any claim to humanity. The contents of our spam filter are truly revolting. But don’t worry about us. We’ve been laughing it off for ages. We just don’t care. Sorry trolls. We know who we are and we’re OK with ourselves. We aren’t worried about being one of the kewl blogs. We just want to give our perspectives on news and politics and discuss the issues of the day with each other.

But when the anonymous cyber-messages start to cross the line into repeated ugly threats and sexual innuendo from the same people again and again and again, you have to wonder. I know I will be following Liskula Cohen’s lawsuit against Google with great interest.

207 Responses

  1. PUMAs will exist as long as the government doesn’t function as it was intended to. It’s good that you’ll have laughter. You’ll need it. Your Messiah already took care of the 4th amendment. He’s intending on carefully looking at your retirement benefits such as Social Security and Medicaid so that he can ensure that he’s able to give banks and other institutions more bailouts. Keep giggling Wanktards.

  2. You can add John Conyers to the mix. He’s written a letter opposing Sanjay Gupta as Surgeon General. How long before he’s called a r*cist?

    I know, he’s black. But if Rick Warren wasn’t booted, Gupta won’t be either.

  3. I predict bitter will become the new angry. By the end of Bush’s term the phrase was if you weren’t angry then you weren’t paying attention. By the end of Obama’s if you aren’t bitter over the fact you are paying the government to screw you then you aren’t paying attention.

  4. Even more hilarious, the obots will have to support their elderly parents at the end of social security and madicare.

  5. Jmac,

    Of course he won’t rethink Gupta. This is Bush version 3.0. When did Bush rethink opinions or go by popular opinion? He didn’t. He was always right, even when he was wrong. The next 4 years are going to be more of a slide into the abyss. Count on it.

  6. Hey chatblu,

    That’s a great pun, even if it was a typo.

  7. If these cretins said the same things they say here to their employees, coworkers or students it would be called what it is: sexual harassment

  8. The jocularity of having to rely on the same stock market that today slid because everyone isn’t out shopping for your retirement……….it’s downright hilarious.

  9. Meh

    Calling me ‘bitter” really really bothers me. Not.

  10. I will too, BB.

    Great post. Some men just cannot handle it when a woman says no to them, about ANYTHING.

    And some women (like the women at FDL, who hilariously thought their Messiah was going to get rid of Joe Lieberman – as if he gives a f*ck what they want) like to play along so they can get their requisite pat on the *ss from the menfolks.

    It really is discouraging sometimes. But we will persevere.

  11. One of them called Riverdaughter – River Chucky. Not clever, doesn’t relate, not funny.

    My husband (supports the party) asks me if I’m hanging out AGAIN on RiverBottom – at least that’s slightly clever.

  12. Jmac

    You’ll get the last laugh. By 2012 he’ll be wishing he listened to you.

  13. Obama IS Lieberman, only more conservative.

  14. Jmac – No kidding! The Liebermonster was Obie’s mentor in the Senate. And those idiots thought Obama would kick Holy Joe to the curb?

    They’re just sad.

  15. cwaltz – he does agree with us – you can tell by the way his jaw clinches when I confront him – but he’s party chair and still clinging and hoping.

  16. Why bb — to what do you refer?
    The Obots don’t know about consequences as mommy & daddy have softened every blow for them, but I’m afraid they soon will.
    As far as the “kewl kids” go — if there is one thing I’ve learned from the advent of the internet is that the concept of “kewl” on line is the exact opposite of the concept of “cool” IRL — that is, those who usually belong to the “kewl” group on the internet are the ones sitting at the loser’s table in the school cafeteria.

  17. madamab

    It should be kinda interesting to count how many times Obama kicks his base in the teeth and how many times they kiss his feet after he does so.

    So far….FISA, Lieberman, Warren, female cabinet members….the guy hasn’t even taken office yet.

  18. We’ll get to be prescient. I get tired of being prescient.

  19. cwaltz, on January 8th, 2009 at 4:33 pm Said:


    Of course he won’t rethink Gupta. This is Bush version 3.0. When did Bush rethink opinions or go by popular opinion? He didn’t. He was always right, even when he was wrong. The next 4 years are going to be more of a slide into the abyss. Count on it.

    Exactly right — W thought he was elected because it was “part of God’s plan.” Obama actually think he is god.

  20. Angie – I love it!

    cool = PUMAs
    kewl = Cheeto-dust-covered Wankers in their mommy’s basements wishing and hoping that a woman might, someday, possibly, maybe, touch their wee-wees, but knowing it will never, ever happen

  21. Cwaltz — you forgot public financing — don’t you remember the bile spewed at Hillary when she said she wasn’t going to commit to public financing for the GE so early in the game & wanted to keep her options open & the ADULATION Obama got for saying he would take public financing?

  22. Exactly madamab — and the best part is that the “kewl” kids KNOW it is true.

  23. madamab:

    Not unless you count Rosie Redpalm

  24. Angie:

    But when Obama broke his promise, they said it was proof of how popular he was.

  25. On public financing-They were all crowing about how they were gonna beat the GOP good, without even noticing that how they were winning was exactly out of the GOP playbook.

    ‘I said before and I’ll say it again-It’s a bad model. It took the public less than decade to notice the GOP lied to gain power. I predict it will be an even shorter period of time for the Democrats. The pendulum will swing back when people realize that the Democrats don’t really stand for anything they say either.

  26. myiq — and when Obama shits on them they will say it is chocolate. I don’t care what lies they want to tell themselves, but as my great-grandmother always said: a cat can have kittens in the oven, doesn’t make them biscuits.

  27. I used to get angry with Lou Dobbs for saying both parties were the same. Now I agree with him.

  28. Pretty much Jmac

    I keep waiting for the opportunity to see a third choice. Party A and Party B have done what they want because they believe they can win by default. It’s been lazy but effective. The electorate needs to introduce a third choice to shake things up.

  29. Thaneks for the post, BB. It reminds us once again of the very real violence playing out against women in this world. A 30 day sentence is revolting!

  30. Hi scrubs!

  31. How much did that monster get for hitting Betty Jean’s daughter with a hammer? Somehow, if you attack a woman, it is seen as a lesser crime.

  32. Great job with this story, BB! This same kind of high tolerance for misogyny — as granted to the brute in the bar, as well as those online — is what our society yielded as well for BettyJean’s daughters, leaving them on the brink of death. Cohen’s story is eerily reminiscent, and I hope the law is able to extract the perps from Google/Blogger and have them reap the consequences of their harassment.

  33. You’d think a judge would understand that if a man destroys a stranger’s face because she didn’t like his friend helping himself to a drink from her bottle, that maybe he needs a little more than a 30 day cooling off period and probation. But no, they let these guys back out again and again until they kill someone.

  34. madamab, your description of FDL, sadly, seems so true. Same for Jeralyn at Talk Left. Obama’s the perfect leader for them: he also sold out his own in order to get ahead. Anyone notice how many AAs are getting the top assignments in O’s administration? I count only Holder and Jarrett (assuming Holder’s still in the mix). When you make a deal with the devil, there’s only one place you end up, and it begins with the letter “h”.

  35. Thanks, LB.

    Wouldn’t you think that this perpetrator and his friends might be a logical place for the police to start looking too? It could be his girlfriend (and you’d have to be very troubled to want to be the girlfriend of someone like that).

  36. Did you hear Obama’s speech BB????

  37. has the food fight start? did i miss the trick with the jello?

  38. Ironically, the two women at FDL, whom I won’t name, left the Cheeto place after the pie wars because they didn’t like the misogyny at DK. Now they are permitting one of their bloggers to ridicule an innocent woman because of her weight and because she dared to support Hillary Clinton in the primaries.

  39. oh, way, making references to Animal House should’ve gone on the how to popular thread, sorry

  40. Obama gave another speech?

    Which major problem did he solve this time?

  41. No, Afrocity. What did he say?

  42. I never voluntarily listen to Obama.

  43. bb, what do you want to bet that they would have stayed at the Cheeto if one of them had been asked to be a front pager? It’s called selling out.

  44. The speech this morning in Virgina…The one where he basically said kids from Chicago and Boston needed an education

  45. dakinkat:

    Toga Party!

  46. the great depression of 2009, didn’t you miss the sky opening up and the angels singing?

  47. bb: i take it you got my email?

  48. No way, Afrocity. I’ll have to go see what the Boston Globe is saying about it. Why did he single out Boston and Chicago?

  49. He also said we need more government

    (Senator Government ha ha)

  50. He gave an economic policy speech an outlined his plans to fix what dubya broke

  51. Obama: “To give our children the chance to live out their dreams in a world that’s never been more competitive, we will equip tens of thousands of schools, community colleges and public universities with 21st-century classrooms, labs and libraries. We’ll provide new computers, new technology and new training for teachers so that students in Chicago and Boston can compete with children in Beijing for the high-tech, high-wage jobs of the future.

  52. …Because everyone knows that we shore iz stoopid in shee-kaw-go

  53. Dakinikat,

    I’m looking right now. Sorry, I was off doing something else for awhile.

  54. afrocity, my mind is spinning. Chicago has the worst school system in the country. The Arne guy that Obama is touting for the new education chief hasn’t done squat for the city schools (although I understand that he plays a mean game of “pick up” on O’s basketball court). Now O has the audacity to say that Chicago kids need an education? What did he think he was getting when he hired Arne? Definitely GW Bush redux–hire your friends, not the most competent individuals.

  55. Dakini,

    Talk about the pot calling the kettle black….

  56. Grayslady,

    now you know we ain’t all lucky like themz Obama gals to git ours self in one of them dare fancy private schoolin’

    Them Chinese fixin to put some whoop on us in the jobz markit.

  57. bb: yup …

  58. That’s kind of funny, considering the Boston area is loaded with high-tech jobs and hundreds of universities.

  59. Deval Patrick is Obama’s bud and MA dems raised a ton of dough for Obama.
    It will be pork city in MA, woohoo.

    I heard today that Patrick has a plan to address MA’s 60% Obesity rate. It involves daily weigh-ins by teachers AT SCHOOL.
    Yup, now that’s their responsibility. In between MCAS they’ll publicly ridicule the fat kids.
    Sounds like child abuse to me.

  60. BB,

    My I went to grad school in Boston. Boston has a good system.

  61. Catarina, So are they taxing MA’s soft drink beverages too?

  62. Hey THAT ONE: Send YOUR children to those schools first and then try to fix them. It’s so infuriating that the people in charge of changing the system don’t even know the first thing about it. Palin at least sent her children to public school.

  63. afrocity, on January 8th, 2009 at 5:27 pm

    How does he plan on paying for the new computers, libraries when he plans on cutting taxes like shit

  64. Obama subtext: Everyone is stupid…BUT ME

  65. Downticket,

    Our fearless leader can’t be bogged down with minor details, or logistics.

  66. afrocity–that’s right. He wasn’t stupid enough to attend inner city schools in Chicago. My stepdaughter taught in one of the inner city grammar schools for several years and her stories are positively frightening.

  67. afro
    no soda tax yet
    but our state legislators gave themselves a fat raise today so Obama will need to bail us out and soon.

  68. hehe
    which of boston’s is a good system
    you must be talking about the grad school system

  69. Everyone,

    Check out Murphy’s latest post. The second Daily Pig award goes to Jim Newell of that Wanky place, the guy who has been tormenting a perfectly innocent woman and enouraged other blogs to do the same.


  70. Catarina,

    Admittedly I am out of the loop on Boston K-12. All i know is that the kids didn’t carry guns like they do in Chicago

  71. Downticket,

    It will be just like NCLB, an unfunded mandate. We’ll all have to pay more property taxes and fees. See how easy it is?

  72. afro

    sure they do
    they may be better at concealing them

    out of four friends that have taught in “the jungles” 1 remains employed by the city of Boston.

  73. I heard today that Patrick has a plan to address MA’s 60% Obesity rate. It involves daily weigh-ins by teachers AT SCHOOL.
    Yup, now that’s their responsibility. In between MCAS they’ll publicly ridicule the fat kids.
    Sounds like child abuse to me.


    OMG, Catarina. That’s awful. I wouldn’t let my child go through something like that.

  74. Boston has some rough school districts-mostly in minority neighborhoods.
    im not saying the schools here couldn’t use the money
    but it seems odd that Obama is openly playing favorites naming boston and chicago.
    is he going to reward his friends and screw the rest of the country?

  75. Kids need good educations everywhere and not just so they can be competitive with the Chinese.

    I thought his remarks were racist and a tad condescending.

  76. I find it telling that someone on FDL makes statements like “reconsidering that whole women’s suffrage thing.” Just like the wanker who is rethinking rape as a “Good Thing,” it’s all in fun, and we’re just humorless feminists to take offense.

    Imagine the reaction if someone said “reconsidering that whole freeing the slaves thing” or rethinking lynching as a “Good Thing.” There’s no question that even if it was passed off as “just snark” it would be perfectly clear that the “joker” was a vile racist and they would be instantly (and rightfully) condemned for their hate speech.

    So what are we to make of “liberals” who feel entitled to “snark” that way about women?

  77. Crap. I said the “r” word and now I’m in moderation. Someday I’ll get the hang of this blog.

  78. bb
    the program is called “Massfit” or something.
    it is really wacked.
    it involves wieghing, measuring, sending notes home to parents of fat kids (!)
    I heard there is no provision for physical education.
    to save money many are proposing having kids “just walk to school!”
    (it’s the parents’ fault the kids are fat b/c they drive them)

    also restaurant chains will have to post calorie counts.
    I have no problem with that.

    but the school stuff is a little too in-your-face for me.

  79. {{sigh}}

  80. And why did my avatar just turn into a bug? 😦

  81. is he going to reward his friends and screw the rest of the country?

    Is the Pope Catholic? Does a bear sh*t in the woods?

  82. thanks boomer!

  83. SOD
    NO SHIT!

  84. He left Kerry in the dust.

  85. boomer and SOD!


  86. catarina – it will always be about rewarding Obama’s friends. One of the main reasons princess Caroline’s people are giving Paterson to reward her with Hillary’s seat is that she supported Obama. They believe that Hillary’s replacement has to be someone that supported Obama.You were either with us or against us. Funny how they are forgetting that they are all part of the same party. I don’t know if the Democratic party will survive Obama. There is a chance of it breaking up in two parties in the next years.

  87. yup
    Lurch goes to Washington has been cancelled.

  88. Interesting, I was a very skinny child and the kids teased me and called me Olive Oil.

    Seems like I was born too soon

  89. Downticket, on January 8th, 2009 at 6:00 pm Said:
    I don’t know if the Democratic party will survive Obama. There is a chance of it breaking up in two parties in the next years.

    I pray you are right, DT
    I’d settle for half my party back.

  90. Actually if you want to know what bears do in the woods….oops that is another blog site!

  91. Catarina,

    Hell you can have it all. When I left in June I was done.

  92. 95% of NECN viewers surveyed oppose the MA legislature’s pay hike.
    Those m-er f-ers.
    Sal DiMasi is a THUG

  93. Afro
    I tried to go red, I’m too pro-privacy to listen to crazy women talk about my uterus like it belongs to them.
    As soon as they STFU about that I’ll take my fingers out of my ears and have a listen.

  94. This story is unbelievable I cannot believe this happens everyday to women it America!

    This must stop…

  95. I understand Cat, I am 39, been trying to conceive for a year. Frankly I couldn’t care less about abortion and Roe V. Wade will never be overturned. I am pro-choice, they are many Repubs who are. I am against partial term abortion.

  96. The evening news is filled with quotes from Dems who say they will not support the plan for tax cuts and reductions in FICA taxes. Etc.

  97. Hi all–been gone a long time. Nice to see old friends.

    So now the Democrats are criticizing Obama’s economic stimulus plan. Seems they’re kinda noticing it is more like a Republican’s stimulus plan. Seems they’re kinda noticing it’s handing tax breaks to businesses, and giving us all 500 dollars–yippee, shades of Dubya when he first took office, and we see how well that turned out. Seems they’re noticing this money is not being spent on infrastructure, real job creation, or health care.

    PUMA history:

    PUMAs recognized Obama was nothing but Reagan redux ages ago.

    PUMAs have noticed his choice of a pro-lifer as his HHS guy.

    PUMAs have noticed his dislike of women and gay people–and now the whole country is noticing that he will be sworn in by a homophobe and a let’s-keep-the-women-subservient preacher.

    Let’s face it. PUMAs are smarter than Democrats.


  98. oops partial birth, I meant

  99. afro
    im going to the Republican convention next year to stand with the Republicans for Choice people.
    They need support.

  100. hi magda!

  101. @Jangles…this is from an AP story on congression Dems’ reaction to Obies plan:

    One tax provision would provide a $500 tax cut for most workers and $1,000 for couples, at a cost of about $140 billion to $150 billion over two years. The individual tax cuts may be awarded through withholding less from worker paychecks, effectively making them about $10 to $20 larger each week.

    Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., said he doubted that a modest tax cut would change consumers’ spending habits.

    “In tough times people don’t respond all that well to marginal changes, such as a small amount of money added per paycheck,” Wyden said.

    Yeah, that $10-20 will go far as states and the feds start hiking gas taxes and other things. It will be into one hand and right out of the other hand.

  102. duh i mean next election
    i f-ing wish it was next year.

  103. I actually think that tax cuts could be good and should be part of any job creation initiatives. Tax and FICA deductions are direct and can be immediate. They are also easy to implement. He is going to have to get Republican support.

  104. Jangles I don’t think that amount will do squat for the average worker.

  105. I believe men who commit such crimes should be made penilely challenged.

    I agree to preform this procedure on all offenders with out a local or general!

  106. Catarina, I actually posted a comment on the previous thread about the whole waistline police thing. I think that its a serious crisis and I honestly believe that society should be aggressive. I don’t mean discriminatory, but I think vigilant about changing a child’s entire mindset regarding fitness and health.

    I was an enormous child and I took it upon myself at 13 to lose weight on my own. I developed a wicked ass eating disorder that I still struggle with today. I was never taught how to eat properly, how to exercise in moderation, etc.

    I don’t know. I think its a good thing.

  107. Fredster: I agree 10-20 per week is not much—I think 20-40 might be. I know it would make a difference to people like my son who are the so called working poor. The roll back in gas prices from $3 + to more like 1.75 here has been a big help even tho it adds up to only about 20 or 25 a week.

  108. Wasn’t backtrack on a board that was supposed to give millions to improve the Chicago school system? How did that work out?

    What will it take to make assaulting women a hate crime?
    I do not think the ERA will pass under this bunch but we can still work on it so that it is ready to go when this bunch passes.
    I do not have much hope that this bunch will do anything good for the country.



  109. Magdalena,

    Republicans would never say let’s spend our way out of this.

  110. Micki
    It is definitely a crisis, but the poor kids aren’t to blame
    and fer chrissake give them gym class again! Budget cuts have all but eliminated PE here even tho Obama
    says we’re on his bailout short list!
    do you wish as an adolescent girl you had been wieghed at school in front of all your peers?? I’d have died of embarassment and I wasn’t a fat kid..is that mental?

  111. Boomer — just for you ! mail in your box. Make sure all beverages have been swallowed before opening.

  112. Catarina–I WAS weighed in front of my peers. My parents forced me to take a sport every season (even though I hated sports and just liked playing my oboe) and we had to have physicals. We had to weigh in all the time for sports. Track specifically. We’d weigh in with the wrestlers.

    I agree wholeheartedly with the PE problem. That is the most ass backwards cut I can imagine. I also think that school means could be designed to be much healthier. Those meals are subsidized some kids could actually get two solid meals of good, wholesome food and have a chance to not become overweight and ill. I’m sorry, but if someone told me my child would have to be weighed and they may be embarrassed but they won’t get Type II diabetes, I don’t know. I’d have to think about it. Hard.

  113. micki
    if this had happened when my kids were at school
    my buff babe son wouldn’t have given a rats ass and probably would have jumped on the scale and dropped his drawers for good measure.
    my daughter was seriously underweight when she came to me at age nine and would have been really embarassed to by a public weighing

    i think its more damaging for girls-especially because of the ridiculous standards they are held up to.
    I will fight this-it’s not right.

  114. always the stick…never the carrot.

  115. they will have to weigh the kids privately.

    but i’d prefer they stick to reading writing rithmetic at school. and gym with a nutrition supplement.
    let the pediatricians do the weighing and send a note to the school with the immunization records

  116. seraphiclight,

    Do you have a link to that “reconsidering the whole women’s suffage thing” comment at FDL?

  117. Micki @ 6:16p
    You can have classes in school on good nutrition in school.
    You do not have to humiliate children to do it.
    There is more harm done to children by humiliation then obesity.
    Yes it is a problem in the USA. Yes it can be fixed with effort.
    The solution must involve parents,children,schools, business and some government example FDA.



  118. Afro

    Women who have an abortion during their third trimester do so for health reasons. NO one goes through 6 months of puking and swelling just to up and one day decide they don’t want to be preggers anymore. The partial birth thing was and is a sham.

    What we have now created is women who have already had to deal with making a distressing decision (due to a condition such as hyroencephalitis where the fetus is seriously deformed)being punished by possibly preforating their uterus(which means they increase risks in subsequent pregnancies) and hemorrhage.

  119. SOD,

    It’s a good thing you warned me or I might not have a laptop anymore. BTW, did you check out the photo of Jim Newell of Wankfest over at pumapac? I have other pictures too.

  120. cwaltz that is absolutely right and it’s important that we keep saying it.

    nobody is doing that unless they are up shit’s creek.
    and it’s not because women are “blue” or whatever the fuck the asshole said.

  121. Afro

    With all due respect the Republicans may never say let’s spend our way out of it but they certainly aren’t known for fiscally solutions. They continue to pretend that people can have lower taxes while keeping services. The so called red states often are more reliant on federal spending then the blue ones.

  122. bostonboomer, on January 8th, 2009 at 5:45 pm Said:

    re: Jimmy Newel — OMG! bb — I KNEW that is what those pathetic losers looked like! LMAO

  123. Listen, I do not want to humiliate children. Being overweight is humiliating enough. Believe me, I know. One of the major reasons I decided to lose weight was because I didn’t even know what to do anymore, so I starved myself.

    If I had never been overweight in the first place, I would not have had to suffer though 24 years on and off of therapy, a life time of poor self esteem and confidence problems and repeated bouts of going to the bad place, as recently as 3 years ago.

    And I never went to a pediatrician. I had a doctor who told me to lose weight.

    I respect that you will fight it, and I respect your reasons for fighting it. I am just in two minds about it, b/c I do not completely agree with helenk that humiliation is more damaging than obesity.

  124. cwaltz
    those red state aren’t getting shit now.
    first IL then MA and we’ll see what’s left after that.

  125. From a psychological perspective, maybe yes. But from a physiological perspective, obesity is so very, very damaging.

    It is hard as hell to relearn how to eat and to make exercise a daily part of your life, and stick with it and keep the weight off. It is much better to not become obese in the first place.

    Its a serious, serious issue.

  126. cwaltz: my daughter who is in ob/gyn training says they don’t really do abortions after fetus=25 weeks, they consider them deliveries, if they are ‘viable’ they are sent to the pediatric wing, if they were never viable because of severe problems they make arrangements to do whatever the parents want .. that can be everything from holding and burying to just acting like it’s the removal of a growth … terminations occur prior to 25 weeks

  127. I am watching the killing me softly 3 this is so awful I cannot believe some of this stuff and I am now going to be doubly aware of this type of insidious avertising…the 35 minute version is so much more detailed I think every man should watch it.

  128. Has anyone read the transcript yet? I challenge you to read where it talks about women. Coming on the eve of a possible Ledbetter vote, it was just beyond the pale. Not a single mention of women, unions, minorities or actually, even men.

    The education part is just a rehash of what he has said all along and approving of NCLB. Where are the schools that will train all those infrastructure builders?

    Improving energy efficiency in 2 million homes? Puny! Just passing out the insulation and weather stripping.

    Modernize federal buildings? I grant you they need it. But he says nothing about how. Does he mean the 10x more expensive but better way of actually fixing old ones, or just building new ones in cheaper places like Iowa cornfield?

    The electric grid part really gets me, yes it needs fixing, but I’ll be darned if I want T B Pickens doing it. Just more schlepping out to private contractors and less oversight.

  129. afrocity: no, they just increase military spending saying its for dense purposes for the same result … that was reagan’s trick

  130. catarina: prepare to be stalked

  131. bwwwaahahahahahahahahahaha

  132. {{{{Micki}}}}
    that sucks-it sounds like quite a struggle.
    it makes sense that you would feel so strongly about prevention.

  133. roofingbird-I am not suprised at all this country is in for a rude awakening that this guy is just going to piss away or nations time talent and treasure…..

    so sad it could have all been avoided!

  134. It’s absolutely retarded to think that in this day and age women are so stupid that they are using abortion as a form of birth control and yet that is the meme. People will choose a pill or a foam or other options over surgical options because the end result is less risk and less of a chance of complications. Of course both parties have gone out of their way to roll back reproductive choices by deeming birth control abortion, saying insurance doesn’t need to provide it and allowing the prices of the product to go up(which with all due respect is a sure way to increase abortion being utilized to eliminate unwanted pregnancies created by a lack of birth control).

    Women need to become more vigilant. I was apalled at the number of my republican sisters who were unaware that birth control was being deemed an abortifactant.

  135. dakinikat what do you mean?
    geebus you cant just say something like that 0-:
    did someone get my personal info?

  136. hey all I am going to be watching UF try to take down OSU in the BCS championship….gotta support my Orange and Blue!

  137. Well, Cat, I understand your perspective too. I don’t have a daughter. I just know what I experienced and I know I’d do ANYTHING to protect my daughter from going through the same thing I did. ANYTHING.

  138. Cwaltz if you happened to notice you would see that I am pro choice…and btw I know two people who aborted at 7 months not due to medical reasons, but that is their choice. Illinois could used stronger state laws to clear up matters such as this. If a PB child survives that is another matter.

    Just because I am pro choice does not mean that I must like every aspect of abortion laws and I felt the same way when I voted for Clinton as I do today when I voted for McCain. I also believe that life begins at conception but it did not stop me from being pro-choice.

    I would rather women have the choice so they would not drink a can of turpentine like my mom did in 1957 and sit in a movie theater on Chicago’s North side clutching her stomach. Or like my aunt who died from eatins some sort of red clay.

    Obama’s speech today did not reflect Republican fiscal values or Conservative values which are two different animals..

  139. thats ironic, Micki-I’d have done anything to get some meat on poor dee’s bones. she was an underweight little noodle and she agonized about her body. it was hard to watch.
    she has two kids now and the problem has been solved

  140. Micki

    It seems smarter to reintroduce exercise into childrens lives rather than weighing them. We used to have to exercise Monday, Wednesday and Friday when I attended primary school. It was the first 30 minutes of school in order to get the blood pumping.

  141. catarina: if you go any where antichoice republicans and try to encourage prochoice republicans, be prepared to be stalked and harassed, I speak from way too much experience with that

  142. cwaltz i could use a program like that here!

    ok daki, im sorry if i brought out the smelly ones-zap them!
    i have to go back to work anyway-break is over.

    ciao, all

    tr0lls, shame on you! Karma!

  143. My husband is into photography and just sent me this:


  144. oh those fuckers!!

    they know where i live dak, any day they’ll be hanging out in my driveway trying to beat me with their plastic crosses. and it wont be the first time. ive been spit on!

    i dont give a shit, ill fight them till i die. its part of my purpose on the goddesses earth.

    kiss my ass you crazy fucking fundies-you’re all genital obsessed! get a life! get laid! get your hands off my reproductive organs!

    there. better now.
    gotta go work.

  145. I am totally for exercise. My idea is to get rid of the scale and do body measurements and endurance tests to test fitness. Its been proven that overweight people who are active are less at risk than normal weight people who do no exercise. I think that the scale is an abomination. My point is more directed towards taking sodas out of the school, subsidizing GOOD WHOLESOME HEALTHY food and not feeding children disgusting food the gov’t gets at good prices that is filled with chemicals and fillers and additives.

    My position on the weighing children was more about people paying attention and actually being proactive about the issue. I don’t want to humiliate anyone. I am just willing to support programs that may actually start to resolve the problem at that level.

  146. Ok – I’m jumping into the fray re: the weighing kids in schools even though I don’t have kids & haven’t ever had a weight problem. If people are worried about kids being overweight then TURN OFF THE TV, UNPLUG THE COMPUTER & TAKE AWAY THE CELL PHONES. There is a problem with obesity with the children in this country because they are sitting down all the time with one of those 3 things. I remember being outside from the moment we finished our homework after school to the moment mom called us into dinner. Parents don’t take the tvs, computers, etc. away from their kids because they are lazy & don’t want to deal with the whining (or, horrors! actually having to spend time playing with the kid), so they give in.
    Additionally, everything is “fast food” or mircowaved pre-cooked stuff that is full of sodium/fat/etc. Parents let their kids eat this junk because they (the kids) “like it.” And the kids aren’t forced to eat any veggies because “they don’t like it.” Well guess what? If you gave the kid spinach & he doesn’t want to eat it, then don’t let him have anything else, let him go to bed hungry & in the morning serve him that spinach again — I guarantee you he will eat it & I guarantee he will not say “no” to food again. Again, parents allow this to happen because they are lazy — they don’t want the whining so they give in.
    However, what does NOT need to happen is for the schools/teachers to have to take over the responsibility! Especially if it involves humiliating the kids. There is a much better way and that is putting the burden on the parents, where it belongs.

  147. Micki @6:34p
    I do not mean to minimize the problem of obesity.
    It is serious and life threatening.
    With the right treatment lives can be changed.
    When you humiliate a child it can have life long consequences.
    Most people still have things from their childhood that they cringe when they think of them.
    We have to change how we look at our selves, how we teach our children to look at themselves.
    Teach healthy food habits, make healthy food more available to children and lower the cost of healthy food.
    Look at the prices of fruit and vegetables in grocery stores.
    Look at the prices and availability of junk food.
    It can be done but as I said it will take parents, children, schools, businesses and government to reeducate peoples eating habits.



  148. Afrocity — I think those remarks were r@cist too. Nothing in comparison to what my fauxgressive “friends” used to say about the LA public schools (usually some version of “of COURSE you CANNOT send your children to school with THEM”), but the “r” word nonetheless. I went about 30 rounds with my fauxgressive ex-husband about sending my son to my (working class) neighborhood elementary school back when he first started grade school. After being threatened with court action because the almighty “test scores” were average-ish in my neighborhood I ended up paying 20K a year for private school. Then Mr. Faux moved into a Richie McWhite neighborhood in the San Fernando Valley and guess what? NOW the public schools are perfectly acceptable (convenient as by that time I had run out of money).

    My two younger kids (with sensible new husband) are going to public school. Might as well pocket the $ for college; they’re going to need it.

    Topic? I predict that Arne will become the Michael Brown of this administration.

  149. Hi Angie

  150. And I don’t mean to see if a kid has a 22 inch waist! I mean to check for proportion instead of saying a person has to weigh “X”, etc.

    And it can be done in private and no one will know. Hell, I had to be measured in home eq to sew a skirt.

    I don’t know. I don’t know what’s worse–letting a girl be traumatized because she is overweight or letting a girl be traumatized b/c she got weighed at school, in the nurse’s office and that weight is recorded on a card.

    I don’t know.

  151. cwaltz – exercise is better since every child takes part in it. Making a child feel that being fat is the worst thing in the world will cause more damage to them than actually help them. Any type of humiliation caused by teachers is hard to get over. Unless you have thick skin, you easily become the class joke. It is not good for one’s self-esteem either.

  152. I was just at RealClearPolitics checking out O’s favorability numbers (still 56/39) They’ve got a poll up already for the 2010 NY Sen race. CK is beating King by 18 points.

  153. Afrocity — I turn 38 on Sunday and am TTC as well. (Am getting a little bit nervous too.)

  154. Angie:

    Lots of parents wish they could, but they are at work and the kids are “latch keys” who spend several hours a day at home alone while their parent(s) are at work.

    They come home from school with no supervision except maybe an older sibling.

  155. listen angie, trust me on this one you never, ever want to see a kid gag up spinach at the dinner table 😉
    its not worth it!

  156. I have to go, but I wish I didn’t. I appreciate hearing everyone’s perspective on this.

  157. SOD — re: Jimmy Newel pick — do you see his soft pudgy middle? What kind of college age guy has that? Heck, I know a lot of people “let themselves go” but at least they were fit when they were in their 20s!! LMAO!! And they call us fat!!

  158. Jadzia,

    So true and I would respect Obama more if his kids actually went to Chicago Public Schools. There is also this super head of DC public school system that is trying to turn things around. Why couldn’t Malia and Sasha attend those. I was in Chicago Parochial school system until High school and then we have lottery system to go into the top 10 public schools, It is a rat r@ce but there were smart kids in the CPS.

    He basically said Asian kids are smarter than Americans. Again I wonder if Obama really means God Bless America when he says it.

  159. “that” blog needs a daily weigh-in. vid conference.

  160. I have fond memories of exercising to “Go you chickenfat go”

    I didn’t really need to exercise. Like Afro I was an Olive Oyl. My mom used to have to put elastic in my jeans. I hated it because I had to wear designer jeans because Lee, Levis and Wranglers never fit right. It wasn’t until I was older I grew to appreciate the fact that I could eat just about anything and get away with it. It was kinda good for the ego to have boys fall all over themselves on the beach because there wasn’t an ounce of fat on me and I could wear that bikini. I hated it as a youngster though because I was all gangly and different.

  161. Jadzia,

    Mr. Afrocity just had andrology test so it ain’t him. all eyes are on me. I put it off while getting my grad degrees and time is slipping away.

  162. I’m getting ready to read the Omnivore’s dilemma. i saw Pollan on PBS , recently and thought the discussion about Fast food establishments was interesting. He blames the SBA, because fast food places are franchises, and take relatively little money to start up and the paperwork formula is already in place. So they are more likely to wind up one your street than a grocery store. It looked like a Chicago neighborhood in the example, where there were like, ten on one street. However, they were all started by small business owners.

    Plus 80% of us live in metro areas now, getting outside isn’t as easy or always as safe.

  163. myiq — I understand that, and I sympathize — but you choose to have kids, you need to take responsibility. If the kid has to come home by himself for a while after school only have fresh fruit/healthy food in the house for snacks. Don’t buy the chips & cookies & sodas. If you have to wake up extra early in the morning to prepare a healthy dinner for the kid to heat up later that is what you do instead of relying on pre-packaged junk food.

  164. From AP:

    They were especially critical of a proposed $3,000 tax credit for companies that hire or retrain workers.

    “If I’m a business person, it’s unlikely if you give me a several-thousand-dollar credit that I’m going to hire people if I can’t sell the products they’re producing,” said Sen. Kent Conrad, D-N.D., a member of the committee.

    “That to me is just misdirected,” Conrad said.

    Sen John Kerry, D-Mass., said, “I’d rather spend the money on the infrastructure, on direct investment, on energy conversion, on other kinds of things that much more directly, much more rapidly and much more certainly create a real job.”

    Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore., said he doubted that a modest tax cut would change consumers’ spending habits.

    “In tough times people don’t respond all that well to marginal changes, such as a small amount of money added per paycheck,” Wyden said.

  165. Cwaltz — I remember that “go you chickenfat go!” LOL!! And wtf is up with no PE anymore? That is just stupid — healthy body/healthy mind.

  166. Angie…you will flip!

  167. There are so many veggies and fruits out there that if your kid doesn’t like spinach let him/her have broccoli, carrots, brussel sprouts, corn, cauliflower, peas, green beans, pinto beans, lettuce or whatever(surely you can find something in the produce department they will eat)

    Getting it fresh is pretty expensive and canned you have to watch sodium but frozen in alot of cases is just as healthy or healthier because it is flash frozen and it is not that expensive.

  168. Afrocity — There are plenty of smart kids in the CPS — I went to college with a whole bunch of them (U of C, ugh). It REALLY pisses me off when I see politicians with big plans for the public schools sending their own little darlings to private schools. (And yes, I was disappointed when the Clintons sent Chelsea to Sidwell Friends as well.)

    Topic? Google will fight the Cohen suit. Once upon a time, I had a client who had stolen (nekkid, of course, taken long ago) pictures posted all over the ‘Net, resulting in about 50 porno links coming up every time you Googled her name — not so good for her straight career. Trying to get Google to do anything was like talking to a brick wall — even though we had tons of proof. I did not and do not get the impression that as a company, these folks really care all that much about the wimminz.

  169. Hi afrocity!!

  170. I will be back guys. My plane is about to take off back to Chicago. I will be on later. Angie the interview in DC was fine. I may even get to work with Obama (ugh).

  171. Afrocity:

    Ugh, I am so sorry. I haven’t had any of the testing done because in a fit of pique I tore up the fertility center’s paperwork and threw it away. They caught me on a bad day, and sending the paperwork to my house, while my in-laws were visiting, in a big envelope marked FERTILITY CLINIC didn’t help. Nor did the demand for thousands of dollars in “deposit” money.

    But Viagra is covered by my health insurance. Wonder why that is?

  172. SOD — if YOU think I will effin flip then it must be out of this world!

  173. afrocity — I’m happy for you? LOL

  174. Jadzia, if men required birth control pills the catholic church would be handing them out free as part of the sacraments

  175. I don’t know what I’m crossing my fingers for, but I will anyway.

  176. catarina, on January 8th, 2009 at 6:55 pm Said:

    listen angie, trust me on this one you never, ever want to see a kid gag up spinach at the dinner table 😉
    its not worth it!

    Cat — LOL! It doesn’t have to be spinach — but make the kid eat veggies — I cannot tell you the number of friends I have who’s kids only eat chicken mcnuggets & pizza (no veggies whatsoever) because that is “all they will eat” — BS — don’t buy/make that sh!t for them, they will eat eventually! I remember a kid in glass when the teach asked us what we ate for dinner & he said “what I’m served” — LOL — that is exactly how my mom ran the house — “I’m not your chef. You will eat what I make, or you will go to bed hungry.”

  177. Roofingbird,

    That’s really cool that you husband sent you that. Are you going to use it in the pumapac project?

  178. dakinikat — don’t sell the church short — if men were the ones that got pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament.

  179. Roofingbird,

    Have you read Fast Food Nation? I don’t know if I can handle it. I read the NYT mag. article by Pollen awhile back. It was interesting.

  180. boomer — mail’s in.

  181. BostonBoomer, the link is in your own post:

    supposedly liberal blogs that were started by women who claimed to be feminists.

    It’s worth mentioning that The Confluence is a PUMA blog which means that Jim Newell is spending precious moments of his life arguing with people who still think it would have been fairer for Hillary Clinton to have been allowed to play from the ladies tees during the primary season. And if you think that groups like the Susan B. Anthony List or the CWA are detrimental to the feminist movement, you’ll have to admit that The Confluence is really pulling out the stops when it comes to reconsidering that whole women’s suffrage thing.

  182. And yes, I was disappointed when the Clintons sent Chelsea to Sidwell Friends as well

    I think while in Arkansas, Chelsea went to a public school. While in DC it was just for her own protection.

  183. angie, sorry for the visual but i was a spinach-spewing drama queen

    you described my niece, above-chicken nuggets and pizza. shes not fat but not exactly healthy.
    i would never let that go on in my house-that’s bs and it is part of the obesity problem. mcdonalds, BK, etc..

  184. Ang-

    I was a particularly stubborn kid. I’d fall asleep at the table. I hated cooked peas(canned ones). I love them raw but once you make them mushy. gag. Don’t even get me started on liver. Just the smell makes me sick.

  185. Someone is determined to make people think Blago is craaazy

    Ex-advisor to panel: Order Blago to get psych evaluation

    When former Chicago television broadcaster Bob Arya joined Gov. Blagojevich’s staff as a senior advisor in November 2006, the governor described him as “a real asset to my administration.”

    But when Arya’s run with Blagojevich came to an end, he had a story to tell — one of intense jealousies by the governor toward President-elect Barack Obama, House Speaker Michael Madigan (D-Chicago) and others, a terrorized staff, and emotional instabilities that Arya said demonstrate the need for a psychological evaluation by the legislative panel weighing the governor’s impeachment.

    “Rod dislikes Barack Obama because Barack is living the life Rod envisioned for himself,” Arya wrote in a nine-page memo he has shared with the House impeachment panel.

    The document from the former reporter at CLTV outlines how Blagojevich’s profanity-laced outbursts caused his senior staff to blanch as they tried to deal with peculiar aspects of his personality.


  186. DownTicket — that is Obama’s side of the story. The truth is:

    Rod dislikes Barack Obama because Barack, the Eve Harrington to Rod’s Margo Channing, stepped in & stole the life that had already been planned for Rod himself.”

  187. BB yeah, he likes to share – I hadn’t thought of it but it’s a good idea!

    No I haven’t read it yet, I’m still trying to catch up on reading. I’m anticipating being disgusted. I finished Robert’s, Ladies of Liberty last week, working on Mankiller’s Every Day is a Good Day, Doris Lessing’ s Time Bites and out load bedtime reading HRC’s Bio. But blogging sure slows it all down.

  188. I have no idea what got me in moderation, unless it’s the authors name?

    “out loud”

  189. I got you out. I wish I had more time to read. Of course, when I do have time, I’m blogging.

  190. The fast food places at least make the nutrtional information available. Places like Olive garden don’t even do that. There are fast food choices out there that aren’t awful but you have to be educated about choices.

  191. Well, you are doing something else right now, and it’s more important. There is only so much anyone’s brain can take in. I thought when I stopped doing that endless research and report writing on all things waterproofing, I would have more time. But horrors, someone called and tried to drag my back into that just today.

  192. angienc2, on January 8th, 2009 at 7:36 pm

    I was thinking they were saying all this now so that when Blago implicates Obama they will call it lies since he hates him.

  193. the confluence chugs along in the weblog awards
    a good showing without cheating. ahem.
    dont forget to vote.

  194. cwaltz:

    Nutritional information at a fast food joint?

    What does it say?

    “Bad for you?”

    “If you eat this you will die?”

  195. cwaltz — what you say is true — but the kids are eating the french fries & the chicken nuggets, not the fruit salad or the yogurt.I don’t mean you can’t let the kid have that stuff every once in a while but not every night! I blame that on the parents for always giving in because the kid throws a “fit.”

  196. still love me some sarah:

  197. Thanks BB. I think it’s really true. We are so overloaded with information. Given the time any of us have, how do you find and read the good stuff, without at the same time letting someone else decide how and what to filter for you?

  198. Downticket, on January 8th, 2009 at 7:49 pm Said:

    angienc2, on January 8th, 2009 at 7:36 pm

    I was thinking they were saying all this now so that when Blago implicates Obama they will call it lies since he hates him.

    Oh, that too — they are setting up an insanity defense for Obama, but instead of Obama being insane, the guy accusing him is — it is like what they did to Sarah, Joe the Plumber, Hillary — you can’t believe that bimbo/tax evader/CLINTON

  199. It’s time for a laugh!

  200. When my kids were all home every night I would try to have something different for dinner. With 4 kids not all will be happy all the time. Pizza was something that was eaten on Friday nite while watching tv. We had no car so once in a while I walked my kids to McDonalds. They thought it was a treat.
    I had friends that either sent around the corner for fried chicken or opened cans for dinner.
    My kids thank God were healthy and my friends kids were subject to colds and minor illness.
    One day I got so tired of hearing my kids complain ” do I have to eat that” I stopped cooking and for two weeks straight every night they got spagettios.
    To this day my kids do not eat spagettios. They tell my grandchildren how mean they were treated because they complained about what was served for dinner



  201. If you go to a bulletin board in just about any fast food restaurant it will have the nutrtional information. It has everything you need to know cal count, sat fat, sodium, etc,etc. It’s just a matter of knowing where to look.

  202. cwaltz:

    What the hell do nutrition and fast food have to do with each other?

  203. If you’re concerned about nutrition, WTF are you doing at Mickey D’s?

  204. RD has a new one up.

  205. Generally when at mcD’s I will get a cheeseburger kids meal with apple dippers and a milk. I also get a side salad. It’s a little more sodium than I’d like but probably not anymore unnutritious than what many eat for lunch.


    Are you trying to tell me that Kraft Mac and Cheese is more nutritious or ramen or tons of other choices that people pick that aren’t fast food? Furthermore, as I stated I applaud the fast food industry because you can get the nutritional information. Try getting the info from Outback, or Applebees for their restaurant items, many of which are much much worse than anything a McDonalds offers(Outback fries, come to mind)

  206. From firedoglake: It’s worth mentioning that The Confluence is a PUMA blog which means that Jim Newell is spending precious moments of his life arguing with people who still think it would have been fairer for Hillary Clinton to have been allowed to play from the ladies tees during the primary season.

    What does that even mean? Quite to the contrary, Hillary forged ahead, winning more votes than any Dem in primary history, AGAINST all the odds. She was fighting the O campaign’s uncontested lies, smears, and fraud; the millions he raised from God knows where; the grotesque media coverage; and her own party. And she STILL beat his a*s. If the delegates had had any spine and the DNC had not applied the Roolz selectively to aid their preferred candidate, she would be the nominee, and now PEHC. How amusing that all the hypocritical women who chose the candidate who selects misogynists like Warren & Ludacris to represent him are chastizing US for being inauthentic feminists. Riiight.

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