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What are women, Jews, and gays – and those who care about them – going to do now in preparation for 2012?

[crossposted from Heidi Li’s Potpourri]

If you are a Jew, a woman, a gay person or a somebody who is not any of these but cares about somebody who is, and you voted for President-elect Obama in the primaries or the general election, read Katha Pollitt (article reprinted,with light annotation, below). Than ask yourself some tough questions:

  • Why did you vote for then-Senator Obama?
  • Has he met your expectations so far?
  • Do you think he will in the future?

If you are unhappy with President-elect Obama’s conduct now, what are you doing to work toward a better alternative candidate to support in 2012? If you think you will want an alternative, you better start working on that problem now, because the soon to be incumbent is already working to make sure he is the automatic choice for the Democrats in 2012, and that he maintains the money machine he created – depending on the precedent of foregoing public funding – to ensure that he will again be the Democratic nominee. We have had one term presidents in this country – usually succeeded by a successful candidate from the opposing party (e.g. G.H.W. Bush followed by William Jefferson Clinton; Jimmy Carter followed by Ronald Reagan). Now, there may be a Republican out there who you would be happy to see become president in 2012. But if you want an alternative to a Republican follow-up to the current term of President-elect Obama; and if you are have misgivings about President-elect Obama, for whatever reason, you had better start organizing around a different option for 2012, be that person currently an Independent or currently a Democrat.

My own view is that President-elect Obama, under the banner of empty p.c. talk, has taken real steps – ranging from the retention of Jon Favreau to Warren invitation to the cabinet appointments of Bob Gates and Ray Lahod – to erode whatever vestiges of a two-party system we have had in this country.  President-elect Obama has not ever and does not now speak for liberalism; he speaks for himself. But he will enjoy a tremendous advantage in getting the 2012 Democratic Party nomination: the Democratic Party ensured that for itself by rigging his receiving it this year in Denver. That is going to discourage any Democrat from taking him on. Of course, depending on how much damage he does to himself Mr. Obama may make it easy for the Democrats to nominate somebody an alternative by deciding to step aside, as Lyndon Johnon chose to do in declining to see renomination in 1968, a move that did not work out too terribly well for liberals or conservatives as it brought us Richard Nixon, one of the most disgraced and disgraceful Presidents our country has ever had to endure.

Read on to Pollitt’s essay…


From the Los Angeles Times

Opinion

Rick Warren is an insulting choice

Preacher Rick Warren’s views are simply too extreme for Obama’s supporters.

By Katha Pollitt

December 22, 2008

To understand how angry and disappointed many Democrats are that Barack
Obama has invited evangelical preacher Rick Warren to give the
invocation at his inaugural, imagine if a President-elect John McCain
had offered this unique honor to the Rev. Al Sharpton — or the Rev.
Jeremiah A. Wright Jr.
I know, it’s hard to picture: John McCain would
never do that in a million years. Republicans respect their base even
when, as in McCain’s case, it doesn’t really return the favor.

Only Democrats, it seems, reward their most loyal supporters —
feminists, gays, liberals, opponents of the war, members of the
reality-based community — by elbowing them aside to embrace their
opponents instead.

Most Americans who’ve heard of Warren know him as the teddy-bearish,
Hawaiian-shirted head of the Saddleback megachurch in Orange County and
the author of “The Purpose Driven Life.” Perhaps they also know he’s
the rare right-wing Christian pastor who sometimes talks about poverty
and global warming and HIV. His concern for those issues has given him
a reputation as a moderate and has made him the darling of Democratic
Party think tanks, ever hoping to break the Republican lock on the
white evangelical vote.

But on the signal issues of the religious right he is, as he himself has said, as orthodox as James Dobson.

And as inflammatory. Warren doesn’t just oppose gay marriage, he’s
compared it to incest and pedophilia. He doesn’t just want to ban
abortion, he’s compared women who terminate pregnancies to Nazis and
the pro-choice position to Holocaust denial. (Hmmm … If a fertilized
egg is as precious as a born Jewish human being, does that mean a born
Jewish human being is only as valuable as a fertilized egg?)

Speaking of Jews, Warren has publicly stated his belief that they will
burn in hell, presumably along with everyone else who hasn’t accepted
his particular brand of Christianity (i.e., the vast majority of people
in the world). And forget about evolution — the existence of
homosexuals, he’s argued, disproves Darwin. And while we may not know
how old the Earth is, the Saddleback website assures us that dinosaurs
and humans coexisted.

Warren claims that his views are mainstream, pointing out that in 30
states, the majority of voters have banned gay marriage. Popular
doesn’t mean right, of course, but regardless of what Americans think
about gay marriage, on other so-called social issues, he’s way out in
far-right field.

Take abortion. Most Americans, whatever their personal feelings, are
pro-choice. On election day, anti-choice initiatives went down to
defeat in all three states where they were on the ballot. Most
Americans do not think the one-third of American women who terminate a
pregnancy are running a concentration camp in their wombs, and would
have no trouble choosing between saving a Jew from a gas chamber and a
fertilized egg from a fire at the clinic.

Or take marriage. At his Saddleback Church, wifely submission is
official doctrine:
The church website tells women to defer to their
husband’s “leadership” even when he’s wrong on important issues, such
as finances. Never mind if she’s an accountant and he flunked long
division, or if she wants to beef up the kids’ college fund and he
wants to buy shares in the Brooklyn Bridge. The godly answer is
supposed to be “yes, dear.” Is elevating this male chauvinist how
President-elect Obama thanks women, who gave him more than half his
votes?

Or take foreign policy. In electing Obama, Americans overwhelmingly
rejected President Bush’s Wild West approach to foreign policy.
Apparently Warren didn’t get that memo either. Unlike many evangelical
preachers, he issued a statement against torture, but despite his
access to Bush, he told Beliefnet.com that he never raised the subject
of torture with him. (“I just didn’t have the opportunity,” he said —
although he apparently found plenty of time to lecture Obama about
abortion.)

On “Hannity & Colmes,” he agreed that the president of Iran,
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, should be killed because “the Bible says God puts
government on Earth to punish evildoers.” Really? The Bible says the
United States should murder the leaders of other sovereign states? How
many other heads of state does Warren want to do away with? If
Ahmadinejad, who is, after all, a more-or-less democratically elected
leader, had shared his inauguration with an imam who had called on
national television for the assassination of President Bush, Americans
would be calling for the nuking of Tehran.

In a news conference Thursday, Obama defended the choice of Warren: “It
is important for the country to come together even though we may have
disagreements on certain social issues.” That’s all very well, but
excuse me if I don’t feel all warm and fuzzy. Obama won thanks to the
strenuous efforts of people who’ve spent the last eight years appalled
by the Bush administration’s wars and violations of human rights, its
attacks on gays and women, its denigration of science, its general
pandering to bigotry and ignorance in the name of God.

I’m all for building bridges, but honoring Warren, who insults Obama’s
base as perverts and murderers, is definitely a bridge too far.

Katha Pollitt, a poet, essayist and critic, writes the “Subject to
Debate” column in the Nation. She is the author, most recently, of
“Learning to Drive: And Other Life Stories.”

81 Responses

  1. Oh, Heidi Li, brava! I am so happy you started posting here.

    Do you think there is any possibility of Hillary running as an Independent in 2012? She could be SOS for two years, step down and do it.

    Wow, Warren hates Jooz too? Good grief.

    “Who Would Jesus Hate?” is my new refrain, besides:

    Don’t blame me: I voted for Hillary

  2. The possibility of a second term for obama is great..that was well planned also. However..that does not take away the sickness that I feel just reading about a second term. The democrats got away with taking money from many questionable sources..which was also planned. He now has to repay terrorist groups and goodness knows what other sources outside the U.S. It’s a sad day when you not only sell your soul…you sell your country. All this I we are not sure that he is a citizen of the U.S.

  3. I know Obama has insulted women and gays but what has he done to the jews?

  4. I want him OUT of my Party.

  5. Downticket – Rick Warren thinks Jews are going to Hell. Perhaps that’s why he equates the Holocaust with abortion, since post-birth Jews seem to be worth about the same as pre-birth Christians.

    Don’t blame me: I voted for Hillary

  6. Downticket – make the jump – read Pollitt on Warren on Jews. And of course Rev. Wright was full of his own anti-Semitic comments.

  7. “Depending onon how much damage he does to himself Mr. Obama may make it easy for the Democrats to nominate somebody an alternative by deciding to step aside, as Lyndon Johnon chose to do in declining to seek renomination in 1968. . ”

    Oh, Heidi, I cannot imagine for one nanosecond that Obama would not run in 2012. His ego is just too great. But I hope a third party emerges from his four year reign – a Lou Dobb’s party of the people.

  8. Quote from Pollitt:

    ?Speaking of Jews, Warren has publicly stated his belief that they will
    burn in hell, presumably along with everyone else who hasn’t accepted
    his particular brand of Christianity (i.e., the vast majority of people
    in the world). And forget about evolution — the existence of
    homosexuals, he’s argued, disproves Darwin. And while we may not know
    how old the Earth is, the Saddleback website assures us that dinosaurs
    and humans coexisted.”

  9. Must go, everyone. See you soon!

    Don’t blame me: I voted for Hillary

  10. So of all the pastors Obama could find, he chose this guy? Why is Obama always drawn to such people? It seems he can’t help it.

  11. I got just the slogan for the Democratsin 2012, it riffs off Bush and the GOP’s shot at a second term. How we aren’t supposed to change anything midstream

    Here goes……

    Don’t change urinals mid stream.(Hat tip to my hubby)

    Feel free to use it Pelosi,Reid and Obama. It seems pretty apt.

  12. madamab,

    I would have no idea how to post donation information. I used to have a pay pal account many years ago to buy stuff online, but I think the rules have changed and I am sure that account is long gone.

    I have to leave the library and get my phone charged, it died a few hours ago. But I will be here for a bit longer. Any words of encouragement would be welcome.

  13. There’s something downright demented about insisting “God is kind and loving but he is going to roast anyone in Hades that doesn’t agree with my (per)version of His will and only will be accepting forgiveness of a select fews sins.” Warren can bite me.

  14. Of course, depending on how much damage he does to himself Mr. Obama may make it easy for the Democrats to nominate somebody an alternative by deciding to step aside,

    Heidi – you are such an optimist. I am certain that Obama will be running again in 2012. He is adding new contacts to his already big donor list. Who ever stated that Obama was using Pastor Warren to reach out to the evangelicals was right. Why else would he be sucking up to the republicans? Does he think they would do the same for Democrats if they were in power?

  15. Don’t mistake (perhaps overly subtle) sarcasm for optimism. Although, if Obama doesn’t fix, to some extent, the economy and actually get troops out of Iraq (and I have my doubts about whether anybody can do the former and whether he will do the latter), he could end up losing the support of the base just as LBJ did. Remember, LBJ was elected with tremendous support in 1964, all of which was was dissipated iby 1968, when in March, he announced he would not seek renomination.

    Must dash now. Will check in later.

  16. teresa,

    Check and see if you still have the paypal account. The only rules that changed was for the people who had seller accounts(they have to accept credit card payments and have a bunch of fees). We all should be able to chip in some money to a regular account. Do you have something like we have in our area “New River Community Action” that can help you ?

  17. the Right Rev Robinson of the Anglican Communion in America/Bishop of New Hampshire. He is a far better choice than this tool is. Mr Warren is nothing but a “Purpose Driven Bigot” who wants to turn the clock back to before 1900.

    He pines for a time when women could not vote and the definition of Homosexuality did not exsist. As for Leviticus-Christ himself said “I have come to deliver you from the law by fullfilling the law.”

    Since we do not live in a theocracy like Iran it really doesnt matter what the fundamentalist god (small g) says. See the right to “force” me to follow “fundamentalist” laws stops at my conscience and my life. The Fundamentalists have a right to believe as they wish; they just do not have the right force those beliefs on anyone else.

    Democracy is advanced citizenship. If you are not ready to stand up for those you most disagree with; you deserve none of the freedoms bestowed on you so dont b*tch when they are taken away from you.

    Fundamentalist are selfish and have not learned to share. I am sure they will have a big suprized look on their faces when they are placed with the goats and not the sheep at the last judgement.

  18. “CWaltz, on December 23rd, 2008 at 5:39 pm Said:

    There’s something downright demented about insisting “God is kind and loving but he is going to roast anyone in Hades that doesn’t agree with my (per)version of His will and only will be accepting forgiveness of a select fews sins.” Warren can bite me.”
    *********************
    I can’t think of a more evil religious dogma. Basically they think 99.999% of all humans who ever lived are burning in agony for eternity. The really sick thing is to see the “joy” on fundie’s faces as they talk about what is going to happen to all of “those” people who don’t worship their jeebus.

  19. A New Political Party? that would be nice and needed one that does not allow its candidates to be bought.

    what a bright Idea.

  20. LBJ lost his base when he escalated the Vietnam War based on a false report, then was caught on tape laughing about it. He might have withdrawn because he had a conscience.

    I don’t think Obama has one. He WANTS to lose the base. His team is happy the Warren issue is getting so much play. He gains part of the religious right and loses some gays. They (and a lot of journalists) think it’s brilliant. They think gays and pro-choice women have no place to go.

    As much as I despise Bush, one thing he never did was stab his base in the back.

  21. I am in moderation-Have no Idea-anyone know what trigger word I used?

  22. It’s nice to see Obama-supporting Politt in the critics seat. She was more than indignant at Palin and decided to let go of supporting Clinton:

    SPIEGEL: As an ardent feminist, you supported Barack Obama rather than Hillary Clinton in the primaries. Doesn’t that contradict your fundamental political beliefs?

    Pollitt:I was on the fence for a long time. But when Bill Clinton started interfering in the race, it reminded me of how tired I was of the Clintons. And I felt, let’s turn the page, let’s have new people in government. With the Clintons it would have been the same old group of people in the White House, because in reality you never just vote for the guy — or the woman — at the top.

    ***************

    Too funny “the same old group of people in the White House.”

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,586129,00.html

  23. Lets see Obama looses Women as part of his base because he is not pro womens rights and is not “really” pro choice.

    Obama looses Blue Collar workers over NAFTA and Free Trade.

    Obama looses Jewish folks because thay have denied Christ and will burn in Hell-Rev Warren told him so.

    Obama Looses the LGBT community because he picked the “Purpose Driven Bigot” as his personal preacher.

    who will be left to vote for Obama in 2012?

    Besides the republican fundies and the str8 AA community?

  24. oops I used another trigger word-spammy is out for me Help me Myiq2xu!

  25. heidiliofpotpourri, on December 23rd, 2008 at 5:43 pm

    I just find it hard to believe that the MSM will ever fall out of love with Obama. He misbehaves but then he justifies it all and then gives “great” speeches and they are back to spinning everything in his favor. Him being the first AA president is a bonus for them. The sad news is Obama is going to be president for the next 8 years. We can only hope he gets bored and starts competiting for Mr. Universe. Obama is the type that can never be satisfied. What will he do after he is done with the WH?

  26. purplefinn, on December 23rd, 2008 at 6:01 pm

    Someone better remind her. She wanted new people and now she is getting the old and improved Clintonistas who are now Obamaphiles(sp) and lets not forget the Chicago gang.

    “Be careful what you wish for” – credit to whoever came up with that.

  27. I am so in moderation…..

  28. Lets see Obama looses Women as part of his base because he is not pro womens rights and is not “really” pro choice.

    Obama looses Blue Collar workers over NAFTA and Free Trade.

    Obama looses J*wish folks because thay have denied Christ and will burn-Rev Warren told him so.

    Obama Looses the LGBT community because he picked the “Purpose Driven Bigot” as his personal preacher.

    who will be left to vote for Obama in 2012?

    Besides the republican fundies and the str8 AA community?

  29. the democrats will not have the guts to run anyone against backtrack. No matter what he does or does not do.
    Remember in the threats against AA who supported Senator Clinton. “Do you want to be the one that kept a black man from being president.”?
    The used race as a weapon and now they can not put anyone against him or they will be accused of racism.
    It is a two edged sword. They bought him they are stuck with him. The sad thing is the country is stuck with him too.
    ot
    Due the caroline kennedy cabal, I was thinking should I change my tag to
    women with brains and experience, men who support them and country before party always.
    What do you think/

    WOMEN,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM, AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS

    PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE

  30. A two term Obama is a certainty. I tried to read, but vomited before I could finish, and op’ed in the Wa Post saying we should start funding now for an Obama Monument.

    How do these people look themselves in the mirror everyday?

  31. There is no certianty of an Obama second term. I predict he will have such low pol numbers that Nancy and harry will pay some one to knock him off so Caroline Kennedy can run.

  32. helenk I agree!

  33. I wish you were right fuzzybear, but I don’t think so.

  34. We will know the powers that be are tired of Pampers when the Times Headline is:

    President Obama Found in Bed with both Dead Woman and Live Boy!

  35. Look Obama is a one termer if you told a democrat in 1977 that the disgraced republicans would be back so soon after the watergate mess you would have been laughed out of the press room.

    I say the presidence her is 1976-1980 this is carter 2 not bush 2. Obama is being set up too and I will laff when the zot falls on him!

  36. Nancy comes out as pro-life and against equal pay!

    I dont see it…. she will abandon him the moment she sees him weak!

  37. Katha Pollittt, Feb. 3, 2008:

    Why I’m Supporting Barack Obama

    http://www.thenation.com/blogs/anotherthing/279745

    Basically it’s the same old sh*t the rest of the “feminists” spouted to excuse their vote for Mr. Misogyny. I have no sympathy for Katha Pollitt.

  38. Katha Pollitt:

    I usually resist words like “hope” and “change.” But with Supertuesday barely 36 hours away what I think is, let’s go with the charismatic candidate this time. Let’s go with the candidate voters feel some passion about. Let’s say goodbye to the Clintons and have some new people make history.

    Plenty of feminists support Obama, by the way. for example Kate Michelman, former head of NARAL, and Ellen Bravo of Nine to Five. I signed a letter from ” New York Feminists for Peace and Barack Obama.” Other signers include the historians Linda Gordon, Alice Kessler Harris and Ros Baxandall; the sociologist Judith Stacey; the political scientist Ros Petchesky,and writers Margo Jefferson and Meredith Tax. You can read it and, if you are a New York feminist, sign it, here .

    See link in my prev. comment

  39. Downticket: Right, the press l-o-v-e-s him, more than Reagan, and that’s some kind of love.

    Plus, he takes his shirt off. Maureen Dowd probably has the poster on her wall.

  40. Fuzzybear
    Backtrack has bigger backers then nancy.
    She is expendable she sold the country down the river to get him in and now why would he need her?

    WOMEN WITH BRAINS AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS

    PUMAS,BUBBAS, AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE

  41. More from Ms. Pollitt:

    Hillary Clinton is smart, energetic, immensely knowledgeable, and, as she likes to say, hard-working. I’ve been appalled by the misogynous vitriol (and mean-girl snark) aimed against her. If she is the nominee I will work my heart out for her.

    But right now, I’m supporting Barack Obama.

    ____________________________________________

    These people disgust me! She makes the argument against Obama now, but anyone who was paying attention in Feb., 2008 knew about McClurkin, about Obama’s corrupt dealings in Chicago, about his sexist remarks about Hillary in Iowa and NH, and on and on. “I want to vote for a woman, just not *that* woman. Well, Katha, you got what you wanted. Now stew in it.

  42. Hi all, I occasionally post her under another name, badtothebone. I did that for awhile because I wanted to vent without having some Obama family and friends mad at me.
    madamab has asked me to post donation information (see lower thread) and I will do so as soon as I can gain access to my old paypal account. I appreciate any help coming.

    Teresa

    on topic… this Warren person is someone I would expect even Bush to shun. I just do not get it. Same sex is pediphilia, women are subject to their husbands and Jews are going to hell?
    What, there were no other white ministers in America

  43. President Obama Found in Bed with both Dead Woman and Live Boy!

    The powers that be will never post just a sentence. It will be – Obama again Lincolnesque by inviting all into his bed.

  44. The narrative gets even better. I had a conversation with my best friend last night (a Hillary supporter who came with me to the Elton John concert for her) who, in the end, voted for the guy with the D after his name “because the last 8 years were so horrendous that a change just had to be made.”

    The narrative from her about Warren was, “Why have anyone give an invocation at the event–what about separation of church and state?” Not that I disagree, because I don’t, but I am amazed at her ability to leap-frog over the issue (i.e., Obama sold you out. We do not know Obama) to another issue, which this is not about.

    And she is all three: woman, Jewish, gay.

  45. bostonboomer said: “I have no sympathy for Katha Pollitt.”

    Understood. However, I will welcome those who see the light even belatedly. Hopefully, she and others will have a full recovery. I love that it’s starting before the inauguration too!

  46. bb, you might enjoy the comments at Heidi Li’s Potpourri under this post. A good “I told you so” to Pollit.

  47. I agree with BB on this one. I’m still furious with Pollitt and The Nation. Pollitt was an idiot the entire year, there is no way I’m letting go of my fury with her. I’ve seen her play this ‘let’s all unite against the right’ game before, and don’t trust her at all.

    What I want to see are books, books, books from PUMAs documenting this year before it’s swept to the side. Maybe Heidi? Anyone?

  48. OMG, that was fun!!!

    Our local public radio station called to see if they “could count on my support again this year” and I said NO. They asked why and I explained that they had drunk too deeply from the Kool Aid well, that I expected them to be different from the mainstream media and they were not and that I had stopped listening to them several months ago. But good luck with the Rick Warren broadcast.

  49. Funny, Katha Pollitt didn’t seem so incensed back in August, 2008 after she *had* to have witnessed all the sneaky, cheating, intimidating tactics the Obama campaign used to get the nomination. No, she wasn’t that exorcised about the fact that misogynism and sexism played a huge role in how Hillary, and later Sarah Palin, were perceived. No, no, she just wanted to go with the flow, get on the bandwagon. The whole fresh air interview struck me as just another, “Yes, yes, we want a woman. Just not THIS woman. Isn’t Obama just dreamy???”
    I was so disappointed. This was supposed to be a leader of the feminist movement and she was so incredibly clueless it made me sick. So, now she’s incensed? Where was she when we needed her? Why didn’t she hold Obama’s feet to the fire back then?

  50. Too funny – Hopeful Black Guy thinks it’s great Saddleback is hiding it’s homosexual agenda:

    “And here is what’s funny:

    Warren is pulling all of his anti-gay stuff off of his website.

    The Obama haters are calling this a bad thing.

    Because surely, it would be better if Warren left all of that stuff up there.”
    Hopeful Black Guy

  51. And just think what might have happened if this had been Hillary’s inauguration. She might have had Kathryn Jefferts Schori giving the invocation. She would have been untouchable. Why? Because the media hated her, have hated her, will hate her in the future. But if she had won in spite of all that media hatred there wouldn’t be anything they could have done about the invocation. She would have picked a nice mainstream minister representing a church with broad outreach. Most likely a woman. And only the miserable fundagelicals would have had a fit over it, and we would have ignored them.
    But Obama seems to want to deliberately poke a sharp stick in our eyes. Well, good, I’m glad he’s finally getting some flak.

  52. RD,

    The things she wrote in her endorsement of Obama are just sickening. “I want hope and change, let’s get rid of the Clintons for good,” and asking people to sign all the “feminists for Obama” petitions. There are so many people I have lost respect for this year.

  53. Obama WANTS the left to complain. That way he looks good to his neoliberal masters on Wall Street.

  54. Somewhere on this Internet, there’s got to be one “I told you so” page with FISA, Favreau, Warren and others chronicled for posterity. And it should name names of people who didn’t/wouldn’t listen (Kim Gandy and Katha Pollitt among them).

  55. I just ranted to my mom on the phone about this for 20 minutes, and I’m still mad! Ugh.

  56. Any idea why I’m in moderation? It is my very first time…I suppose we should have a celebration of sorts…

  57. Exactly *what* did all the feminists for Obama see in him? I will never understand why they turned their backs on their own.

  58. sophie: You lost your cherry. Was it good for you?
    It happens to everyone eventually. Don’t take it personally. It’s how we keep the rif-raf out. When we read your comment and find nothing offensive in it, it will be released.
    There isn’t anything offensive in it, was there?

  59. How after two terms of Shrub, could any liberal be
    “tired” of the Clintons?

  60. Was it good for you?

    Jeebus, what did I miss?

  61. RD: It was good for me…I hope it was good for the rest of the Confluence (Enjoying a smoke now…)

    Thing is, I can’t figure out what triggered it. I generally steer clear of the known keywords and I don’t believe there was anything in there (unless certain proper names are verboten).

  62. bostonboomer, on December 23rd, 2008 at 7:41 pm Said:

    Obama WANTS the left to complain. That way he looks good to his neoliberal masters on Wall Street.
    **************
    I think he is more like a teenage boy with ODD. He gets a kick out of pissing people off. Kicking the boot lickers is especially fun.

  63. Wow..and again! What’s up with Spammy and me tonight? Think he’s jealous of how I tip Rico?

  64. The fact is that the Democratic party that we remember is dead. That thing that calls itself the Democrat party is the 0bamacrat party.

    So then should we cling to an old illusion or deal with reality?

    Is it at all possible to move to the Republican Party — and work for a moderate who is closer the sort of person we would like to guide this nation?

    The other alternative is to work toward a third party — but since the press seems to have been bought (like wh0res) the third party seems unlikely.

    There is always the Independent route — and I suspect that more people will choose this path.

    What I’m seeing is that both political parties have become corrupt — Neither party seems to be listening to the voters. It seems that nearly all politicians are crooked — and the Chicago style of politics will have moved to DC to corrupt an already corrupt system.

    Perhaps the parties have always been corrupt and we just didn’t notice until someone pulled back the curtain?

    For me the only option is to remain Independent — the more of us who are Independent means that neither party can win without the Independent votes. So in way Independents could be the third party.

  65. Great post. Thought provoking. I left the Dems in disgust last June. And have been happier ever since. Obama has eaten and digested the Left and they are just now realizing it. That is the main objective of Obama after all – destroy the Left.

  66. BTW, my rage is not in any way intended to reflect on Heidi LI’s post. I just wish Katha Pollitt and the rest of the elitist so-called feminists weren’t such a pack of hypocrites.

  67. New thread up

    The Festivus “Airing of Grievances” has begun!

  68. SHV, on December 23rd, 2008 at 7:52 pm Said:

    bostonboomer, on December 23rd, 2008 at 7:41 pm Said:

    Obama WANTS the left to complain. That way he looks good to his neoliberal masters on Wall Street.
    **************
    I think he is more like a teenage boy with ODD. He gets a kick out of pissing people off. Kicking the boot lickers is especially fun.

    You know what you are describing is a very sadistic individual. Someone who enjoys seeing the pain and suffering of others. We already know that 0bama is devoid of empathy — so it would logically follow that he is also a sadist.

  69. Lordy, Lordy, riverdaughter, @ 7:28 & 7:38, you nailed it again, me too.

  70. Great one, Heidi Li.

    This is a VERY dangerous combo when we think about it.
    Megalomania times two. Plus, apparently there is a global PEACE plan except? This kind of religious zealotism appeals to the same set who want world domination. It will not sit well in the eyes of the world’s other religions.

    Only a malignant narcissist is capable of such an act of non-empathy.
    We have already seen this demonstrated over and over again — but — this is not about creating dialogue and tolerance is it?

    I am VERY worried for Hillary in this circumstance, in terms of world diplomacy.

    The country (after the last eight years) did not need these kinds of wounds ripped open as they have been. If anything? It’s an insane megalomania…these are warmongers in more ways than we know, yet.

    I am really worried for Hillary in this mix. And I also feel sorry for the black community and Jeremiah Wright. A place had been opened for a dialogue between religious leaders after those tapes came out — now?

    To chose this guy? Very sad.

  71. Plus, he takes his shirt off. Maureen Dowd probably has the poster on her wall.

    Seriously, what’s up with that? What do they see that the rest of us don’t and since when did Obama being topless become big news that it needs to be written about in news papers?

  72. Has anyone ever noticed how much Barbie resembles Vera-Ellen in White Christmas? They have the same high cheek bones, wasp waist and endless legs.

    Of course, Vera-Ellen died in her ’50’s from the effects of anorexia.

  73. Dr.. Li,

    Katha Pollit is another “feminist” who supported Obama during the primaries and went after Palin with an ignorant extreme uninformed viciousness in the GE.

    She had been a sell out and peddling that point of view as a “glass half full” Virginia Slims papering over of women’s losses in soi-disant feminist spaces for many years now. Like many famous former feminists, she’s kept a constant and wary eye out for the approval of her employer (The Nation – look up their campaign coverage) and the men in her circle and her life.

    She really is not someone who should be cited now that her choices and the choices of those like her are coming home to roost. Women didn’t matter to her when it could have made a difference – why should it matter to women what concerns Ms. Pollit has now?

  74. lexia, on December 23rd, 2008 at 10:48 pm Said:
    I was not citing Pollitt out of ignorance of her hypocrisy. Indeed I was citing her as one of the very people I was calling upon to answer the questions that began MY comment. In Pollitt’s essay, she DOES convey correct factual information about Warren, so that was useful to me. But I thought the irony of POLLITT being all bent out of shape would at this moment after her pitiful display of non-support for Senator Clinton was self-evident. I’m just explaining now so that there will be no misunderstanding about what I think of Pollitt and why I used her piece.

  75. To be more succinct: People like Pollitt should precisely be referenced to show them up as having been had.

  76. My apologies, Dr.Li. I didn’t catch that from the original post.

  77. Wonder what Pollitt was offered, and what she didn’t get?
    Or was it all charisma and the tingle up the leg?

  78. No worries nor apologies necessary, lexia- what I consider subtle and ironic is likely to just be plain old lack of clarity!

    Back during the primaries, I harshed on the The Nation’s pathetic plea to Obama, AFTER they endorsed him, (and they don’t usually endorse). They published, online at least, an open letter to him on their site,signed by big shots, pleading with him to not turn out to be a conservative after his FISA flip. It was absurd.

  79. ow, aren’t ex OBamazoids cute?

    And by that, I refer to Katha Pollitt.
    There is NOTHING surprising bout Obama’s Warren choice- asusming you have 2 neurons and have paid attention to Obama’s actions as opposed to being hypnotized by his skin color.

    so here’s my question: is a symbolic gesture towards the AA community worth the eroding of pretty much everyone but white het males’ rights?

  80. Wow! As I’ve mentioned, my mother is a founding member of the OFB in good standing. I was dreading any politics-related conversations when I went to visit her last week, so imagine my astonishment when she woke me up early the morning after I arrived to scream, “OBAMA IS AN A**HOLE!” at me. Her reason: Rick Warren. Now my mom has never struck me as particularly LGBT-supporting (she’s not homophobic, it’ s just not something she seemed to particularly care about) but this had her rolling. She absolutely HATES Rick Warren. She even said, “You warned me and you were right! He turns his back on everyone! Watch, next it will be women and us Latinos, everyone who voted for him!”

    I was shocked…I didn’t even give in to the satisfaction of saying “I told you so.” She remained incensed with Mr. O the whole week, until I had to actually console her by reminding her that all politicians are untrustworthy, and recount my rage over John Edwards’ betrayal of his supporters, of which I was one (pre-Hillary).

    But if O has lost my mom (who has a framed picture of him and Me-Shelle on her bookshelf) he’s in for a rough ride.

  81. I almost feel sorry for Pollitt, et. al., who never thought they’d be the ones sacrificed to make peace with people who hate them and would see them scourged from the earth if they had half the chance.

    Oh, hell, no I don’t. Schadenfreude. It’s not just for breakfast anymore. We tried to tell you. We tried to show you.

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