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John Kerry for State? Good! Make Way for the 30% Solution!

Larry Johnson reports that he heard some gossip about Obama’s national security appointments at an event in DC last night.

Just got back from an event in Washington and had the chance to speak with some folks who are in the know about Barack’s national security team. Here’s the latest:

Secretary of State. JOHN KERRY. Here is the interesting background. Kerry called Hillary Clinton before announcing his endorsement. He said he would endorse her if she would promise him the SecState position. Hillary said no. Next stop–Obama town. Barack said yes and in early January John Kerry announced for Obama. So far so good. One minor problem. Barack made the same promise to Bill Richardson (please understand, Barack is not the first politician to promise different people the same thing). However, turns out two close associates of Richardson are under a sealed indictment expected to become public shortly. Ergo, John Kerry will be the new Secretary of State. Wes Clark ain’t even on the list.

Everyone here in Massachusetts is buzzing about the possibility that both Governor Deval Patrick and our junior Senator, John Kerry, maybe moving on up to join Barack’s team. Patrick has repeatedly denied that he wants to go to Washington and has said he will run for a second term as Governor.According to The Boston Globe:

US Senator John F. Kerry’s widely reported place on Barack Obama’s short list for secretary of state raises the possibility of dramatic changes in the Massachusetts political landscape, just days after Kerry won easy election to a fifth term.

Kerry’s leap to a federal Cabinet post would spur what strategists and even potential candidates are already describing as a mad scramble among a dozen or more Massachusetts political figures over a tantalizing opportunity, a rare open seat in Washington’s most exclusive club.

“These Senate seats come up once in a lifetime,” said Dan Payne, a Democratic media consultant who has worked for Kerry’s campaigns. “Anybody who has ever thought they wanted to be a senator will assemble the kitchen cabinet and take a good, careful look at it.”

martha520One strong candidate to take over Kerry’s seat would be Democrat Martha Coakley, currently Attorney General. Coakley was a strong Hillary Clinton supporter who fought to have the votes of Florida and Michigan counted and she was one of the holdouts who voted for Hillary at the Convention in Denver. So it’s possible we might be able to take a step toward the 30 Percent Solution here in Massachusetts.

Said Coakley, confirming her interest last night: “Certainly any politician in Massachusetts would be interested in that seat. They don’t open that often.”

Another woman who might be interested in running for the seat is former Republican Lt. Governor Kerry Healy.

According to the Globe:

The political landscape is further clouded by the health of Senator Edward M. Kennedy, who was diagnosed this spring with a malignant brain tumor. After undergoing surgery, he spoke at the Democratic National Convention, has returned to Washington, and is preparing to push forward healthcare legislation once Obama takes office.

Unlike most states that allow the governor to appoint a replacement, Massachusetts law says that a vacant US Senate seat would have to be filled by a special election within 140 to 160 days of the resignation. The Democrat-controlled Legislature approved the law when Kerry was running for president in 2004, to prevent Governor Mitt Romney, a Republican, from appointing a possible successor.

Democrats could try to change the law back to ensure Republicans don’t pull off a surprise victory. Patrick indicated yesterday he was open to the idea of reverting to the old system of appointments, but said he was “not pushing a change.”

Very interesting. It sure would be nice to replace Senator Kerry with a woman who was so supportive of Hillary Clinton. Maybe Hillary would take her under her wing and teach her the ropes. Who knows what they might be able to accomplish?

164 Responses

  1. Two new female U.S. Senators from MA would be great. I know Hillary will “work her heart out” to get them elected.

    Thanks for the change and hope post BB.

  2. Oh, BostonBoomer — what a wonderfully Optimistic post!

    But, seriously. Could Patrick appoint someone to serve until the Special Election?

    And who would Patrick actually appoint in that case?

  3. kb – Answer to your last question – himself.

  4. How wonderful it would be too see a woman claim a MA senate seat. It’s been an old boys club for way too long.

  5. I would rather see a female Republican or independent win Ma senate seats….enough DEMS…

    We need to have the checks and balances!!!

  6. Katiebird,

    They have to have a special election right away. Patrick can’t appoint anyone unless they change the law.

  7. interesting…….I guess senators will be appointed to replace Obama and Biden too. anyone heard anything about that?

    oh, Ted Stevens too,maybe…………

  8. mp,

    There is zero chance of any Republican winning a Senate seat in MA. They can’t even fine enough candidates for local office. The Republican Party barely exists here.

  9. I am waiting for TED to pop any minute!!!!!

    I think Caroiline Kennedy wil run for a senate seat from MA!!! betcha you!

  10. did ted stevens win AK?

  11. I don’t know what the law is in Delaware. Blagovich will probably appoint whomever Obama wants him to–if he wants to get a pardon later on. I’m guessing Jesse Jackson, Jr., but I know some of Obama’s big fundraisers and staffers will be wanting it too.

    In Mass. the governor cannot appoint anyone to replace Kerry. It will be a real election. We changed the law in 2004 to keep Mitt Romney from being able to replace Kerry with a Repub.

  12. Caroline lives in NYC and she knows nothing about politics. The talk has been that Kennedy’s wife would run for the seat. But there are other Kennedys here in Mass. Joseph Kennedy is a really good guy and has been mentioned for Governor.

    I just hope Martha Coakley runs, because she is really terrific. And she fought hard against Kennedy and Kerry over FL and MI. She was part of a group of women party leaders who refused to vote for BO at the convention.

  13. To hell with Kerry. I wasted my vote four years ago on that clown. And then he turns around and says that Hillary only took certain states away from his pal Barack because of Rush Limbaugh. Bloggers can say crap like that without evidence, but I expect more from people in government. Kerry should be living under a bridge somewhere, as Bush’s four more years were HIS fault.

  14. in January there will be 17 women in the senate. 13 to go. I hope Martha Coakley runs too.

  15. Hillary would support Martha Coakley but would Obama?

    Not likely.

  16. Cafepress has a shirt with Obama’s last day in Office http://tinyurl.com/5oknwr

  17. I sure hope Kerry is in Obama’s cabinet. That way he can get the appropriate “credit” for his endorsement when all Hades breaks loose.

  18. Coakley sounds good, but what about the populist lobsterman, Ed O’Reilly, who ran against Kerry in the primary and was supported by Heidi Li and many of us Pumas?

  19. Novak says Newt Will run in 2012.

    Question: If it were Barry/Plugs v. Newt/Sarah, which way do PUMAs go?


  20. ……and the Obots won’t care. I tell you if they had Precious on tape smothering his grandmother with a pillow they’d say she deserved it.

    My Obot associates think Obama will do something about prop 8 here in CA. What f’ing ever — keep believing.

    I have been sitting here 20+ years “hoping” to win the lottery and we see where that HOPE has gotten me. I never want to hear the word again.

  21. lililam,

    Martha Coakley *is* a puma, even if she wouldn’t use that term. In my book that’s better than a man who may or may not *support* women when push comes to shove. I’m sold on the 30% solution, and I will be surpporting women first from no on.

    If you read my post, you’ll see that there has to be an immediate special election. The person who runs will need to have a war chest ready, because there will be a real fight for the vacant seat. Ed O’Reilly can raise the money to run, then he should, but I’ll be supporting the woman whenever I can from now on.

  22. BB: I LOVE MARTHA COAKLEY!!!!!!!!!

    But Kerry as Secretary of State???

    Russia would laugh & spit in our faces. Look at what’s happening in Poland & How Obama literally through a foreign aide broke his promise to help Poland. I posted it here:


    Kerry handling stuff like this is NOT GOOD.

  23. Rich,

    Did you even read my post? It’s about getting rid of Kerry.

  24. simofish – he is also supposed to do something about FISa. Sen. Feingold said he would if he got elected.

  25. ((((( SIMO )))))

    It’s never going to happen under Obama. All those idiots who voted for Obambi and protesting Prop 8 are blaming the Mormons for it.

  26. SM,

    We’re not going to get anyone good out of Obama. Have you seen the picture of all the really really old people who were onstage with him at the presscon yesterday? I’m just hoping to get Kerry the hell out of Massachusetts and replace him with someone who cares about our state and about women.

  27. sounds like they are both good options, then, BB, and I see your point.

  28. BB: Kerry out of MA is good. Kerry as Secretary of State? VERY VERY BAD.

    Can’t they relegate him to New Doggie Diaper Duty?

  29. simofish,

    Unfortunately, the Obot zombies are lost to us now. We have to let them go to their destruction and try to save the ones who can be saved–the ones who haven’t yet drunk too deeply of the koolaid.

  30. SM,

    Who would you rather have? Colin Powell? I’m not convinced BO will really appoint Kerry. Maybe he could send him somewhere else. But please please let him relieve us of Kerry.

  31. Newt Gingrinch is at or near the top of the “Worse than Obama” list.

    That’s a pretty short list, too.

  32. Downticket:

    Hahahahahahahahaha! FISA? Feingold believed that? Yes, Obama will do something about FISA. He’ll probably get rid of the FISA court and just start spying openly on every American. He has to make sure we are all worshipping him. We’ll all have to turn on opera music in our homes to interfere with the bugs–like in East Germany before the wall came down.

  33. Interesting news about the two women who are interested in Kerry’s Senate seat.

    I have a feeling Kerry may find he sold his soul.

    Mountain Sage

  34. OK, maybe I was a little over the top in that last comment. Sorry…..

  35. Mountain Sage,

    The part I find interesting is that Kerry officer to endorse Hillary if she would promise him State, and she turned him down. No wonder he hates her so much.

  36. Newt will be close to 70 .. in 2012 .. personally, jmo… I don’t think the repubs will make the mistake again of letting ‘my dearly respected GrandPa run’ .. against the youthful … yuk.

    RNC chairman is a power position .. that speculation has possibilities …

  37. Newt has no chance. He already tried this year, and nobody paid any attention to him. He should stick to writing books and appearing on Fox News.

  38. BB: LOL! Anything to get Kerry out of MA! I agree with you. Jeesh, Secretary of State – bring back Madeline Albright. Hillary Clinton would be AWESOME too (she can do anything!)

    But Kerry? How about Press Secretary like Tony Snow? Official First Doggie Poop Scooper? First Lady Appointment Keeper?

  39. BB:

    Captain Spaulding plans to open a clinic that offers a 100% guarantee that its patients will stop slurping Kool-aid.

    It’s gonna be called “Captain Spaulding’s Kool-aid Detox and Organ Donation Clinic”

  40. SM,

    Kerry might make a good butler. He’s snooty enough.

  41. That would be a real silver lining, bostonboomer. And how great to finally unseat John Kerry. He does realize there are term limits on SOS, right?

    Lynette Long has a link to a great story about women in Turkey getting more representation in government by donning fake mustaches? Heh, I couldn’t help but think of a female professor at a college I attended that had a goatee. FOR REAL!!! Forget the penises … should we start on some sideburns to get real change?


  42. So, kerry is even more pathetic than i previously thought.
    meanwhile, weep for the empty lives these Bobots are condemned to lead from now on – a very sad, sad video

  43. Hey – I told ya’ll 10 days before the election Kerry was gonna be SoS.

    Rahmbo Emanuel as Cos and Joe (fucking) Biden VP

    Yep, change we need. This is gonna quite the cabinet of new faces for change in DC

    William Ayers for SoE? Why the fuck not? Go for it.

  44. myiq2xu,

    LOL! Did you see my comment on the previous thread:

    For some reason a small number of Democrats are immune to the koolaid. We must keep ourselves safe. Someday our blood will be needed to save the rest of mankind.

    I think I saw that in a horror movie once. Seriously though, there are going to be a lot of really devastated Amerians after people start to realize that Obama is just ushering in Bush’s third term.

  45. I read something interesting the other day. according to the article, Biden has been grooming his son Beau to take his place in the senate. but Beau is in the reserves (as an atty, I think) and is about to go overseas for a year. so the governor of Delaware may appoint a “place keeper” for a year. however, the fear is that the so-called place keeper might decide they want to stay in the senate, and that would upset Joe since he has picked his son as his successor.

    why do we bother to vote?

  46. Britgirls,

    OMG, that is hilarious. I love Lynette Long.

  47. “Obots check in, but they don’t check out”

  48. I was pretty sure Jesse Jackson was gonna be SoS

  49. mambopurr,

    He’s reaching all the way back to the Carter Administration. Let’s face it, this *is* the Carter administration redux. Zbigniew Brzezinski and Paul Volker, together again. And we will return to the austerity that Carter preached. Remember, Obama has told us that the coal industry will be bankrupted and our electric rates will “skyrocket.” At least 10 states will be completely crushed and taken out.

  50. BB .. I’m not so sure … I read/heard many calls – for Newt on conservative sites .. .. ! .. Actually … if Newt had run – F. Thompsons …’rawhide ride’ would have never gotten on the trail …

    imo .. Newt would have easily won over JMac… ..

  51. How about Bernadine Dohrn for Attorney General? As President, Obama can pardon her so she can get her license back.

  52. I hear Obama has a link at his “Office of the POTUS-elect” website for all his supporters to sign up for the millions of jobs available in his administration.

    The problem is most of those jobs (99%+ ) are civil service and they are already filled with loyal Bushies who are burrowing in..

  53. Briana,

    Newt did try to run this year. He couldn’t get any traction. You need money to run for President. Nobody was biting.

  54. Even Newt’s friends don’t like him.

  55. Grandpa Fred never got any traction either – although Joe and Tweety got leg tingles staring at his granddaughter/wife

  56. Fred just didn’t seem into it at all. I wonder if Huckabee plans to run again or if he’s enjoying the tv gig more than politics.

  57. The Obots (esp the elite) could not handle Carter’s recommendations. Remember the infamous request for setting the thermo at 55 evening/ 65 degrees daytime for the winter?

    O sort of revamped this theme with his “we can’t keep our therm at 72 degrees and expect the rest of the world to accept it.”

    Let me tell you- my sister sets that thing on whatever she da*n well wants. Late 20 something.

    They are waay too spoiled- never mind the hollywood types.

    But then again they don’t walk the talk.

  58. 1. If this story is true, Hillary should have promised Kerry Secretary of State. It’s politics; and Kerry’s endorsement would have really blunted Obama early. Kerry would also make a fine Secretary of State.

    2. I’m obviously not a woman. But trying to get a bunch of women in office sounds like pure identity politics. Is that what we’ve come to? How was Claire McCaskill? How about Nancy Pelosi, Katherine Sebelius? Anyone a big fan of Diane Feinstein? I’m not, and I live in CA. And I’ve read plenty of support for Palin on supposedly liberal blogs, and she is a pleasant, cheerful right-wing Republican. If we have devolved to a point where people are so disillusioned that all they can hope and work for are candidates of their own gender or race or sexual persuasion, then the game is lost. I don’t care how many women or men of what ethnicity are in office, if they are honorable, hard-working people who support and work for democratic elections, not fixes. But it may well be that people have so given up on that possibility, that they are going to all go their separate identity ways.

  59. William:

    If men are gonna think with their dicks why can’t women vote with their v@ginas?

  60. But of course, they KNOW what is “bestest” for us. (eyeroll)

    Liberal media is also more than a bit condescending imho. With all the pressure on the nation’s first president of color, they have to make sure that he now lives up to all the hype. Of course, they don’t really think that much of him do they now? Or else they wouldn’t have to go to such extremes to cover for him ,right media? Smooches.

  61. William, you have some catching up to do. Search on “30 percent solution” using the box at the top of the page. Then come back and discuss.

  62. Gail,

    The austerity isn’t for the elite. Get with the program. Obama drives an SUV. It’s only us working class hillbillies who will be suffering. We are the new serfs.

  63. Newt’s pretty smart but he’s got hypocrisy and baggage. Can’t the GOP put him in a think tank or put him in charge of the GOP party machinery. I really am not interested in seeing Sarah at the bottom of a ticket and am busy figuring out 2010 to worry 2012.

    If you are a conservative, can you guys get Guinn to run against Reid in NV? You all really need some smart moderate voices that can appeal to a broad swath of the electorate. The people you guys put forward need to be wiling to admit that execution of conservative values thus far have been less than stellar rather than continue to make excuses and try to shift blame.

  64. Rima, I’m having a hard time understanding what you just wrote.

  65. William

    Give the masses what they want. Identity politics was how this election was decided. We might as well go with the flow on it.

  66. LMAO bb –

    The Obama’s finace advisors include Jenny (2 Penny) Granholm ex Mich Gov (D) and John Bonyer ex Congressman (D) Mich the 2 people some would say helped bankrupt Michigan.

    Good Lord ya’ll didn’t ya read my list? When I said Kerry as SoS, I also said Bernadine Dhorn as Secretary of Political re-Eduacation, Deputy Sec Jane Fonda.

  67. The comment that started out “ANd ot hit the toppoic for a change, I”

  68. Bush and the Republicans to the country: no stimulus for you! …

    House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-Md.) on Friday cast doubt on a lame-duck session, saying one might not be held if there’s no deal with the White House on a stimulus.

    If there’s no deal, House leaders may scuttle everything but the reorganizing session planned for the week leading up to Thanksgiving, Hoyer told a group of reporters.

    “Clearly there’s no point in us doing something if the administration is going to take the position that they’re not going to sign something,” Hoyer said.

    The impetus for a stimulus seemed to grow Friday with a jobs report showing unemployment rising to 6.5 percent. Business groups have also called for a stimulus, which they say should include help for a U.S. automobile industry increasingly in dire straits.

    But Hoyer said talks with leaders in the Senate and the White House on a stimulus have failed to make headway.

    “We still don’t have any agreement to do that,” Hoyer said.

    Calling Congress back for a lame-duck without stimulus legislation that can make it into law isn’t “particularly useful,” Hoyer said.
    At the same time, the majority leader did say that if legislation is deemed necessary for the auto industry, such legislation in and of itself “could be enough” to warrant a lame-duck.

    Democrats have been crafting a stimulus bill that will likely take the form of tens of billions — if not hundreds of billions — of dollars in unemployment insurance benefits, food stamps, aid to the states in the form of Medicare and Medicaid payments and transportation and infrastructure spending. The Bush administration has balked at some of these proposals, and Hoyer’s comments could pressure the White House into offering concessions.

    We wouldn’t want to help all those unemployed “lucky duckies”, would we GOP?

  69. Why is Palin seriously scary? Why?

  70. Rima honey

    YOU might like to believe that all GOP folk are the same, we know better though.

    Thanks to this cycle the blinders are off.

  71. brit

    She isn’t to anyone other than Obots.

  72. kiki, on November 8th, 2008 at 3:50 pm Said:
    s…o the governor of Delaware may appoint a “place keeper” for a year. however, the fear is that the so-called place keeper might decide they want to stay in the senate, and that would upset Joe since he has picked his son as his successor.
    why do we bother to vote?…….

    I agree, kiki. I REALLY hate the whole “I have picked my successor” and the idea that husband, wife, child of the incumbent should get the job. We fought the revolution to get rid of that kind of government – why would we want to go back to it.

  73. Are mambo and Rima the same poster?

  74. BB .. apparently Newt is the one who set up a 30 million limit .. if he had gotten that .. he would have run .. No matter… I still say – repubs would have come out in bigger numbers for him then they did for JMc. .. jmo. from what I read/heard….


  75. So …………far right is the Child Enforcement Act, Domestic Violence Law, getting help and support for pregnant colege students…….good to know.

    I must be far right.

    Don’t lump me in with Obama fans. I know to research things BEFORE I make decisions or statements. You might take a leaf out of my book.

  76. C’mon, Rima, give us some examples. I’m not attacking you, but there are a lot of lies being circulated about her.

  77. Newt isn’t stupid. I may ddislike his ideology but I respect that he has spent time on Health care and enviroment and a whole host of other relevant issues. The GOP could do alot worse. The downside is he is the king of partisan politics. He spearheaded the hypocrisy on Clinton while boinking a Congressional aide himself. His divorce was messy.

  78. Blimey, has Obama already drafted tr0lls to start smearing Sarah?

    He’s started his run for 2012 already!

  79. Rima

    try spell check – it would be easier to read your posts, then.

  80. Gotta go … kid NEEDS Nick Jr!

  81. Yes we all know ABORTION is the be all and end all to feminism. Is that you Gloria?


    were you aware thyat it was the precious Democrats that helped get Partial birth passed? Were you aware that they did absolutely NADA after the SC ruled that birth control need not be carried on formularies. They did bupkiss to address the rise of the price of that birth control due to a donut hole they created. Don’t tell me who is and isn’t liberal. I’ve been paying attention.

  82. Interesting thoughts, BB.

    I’m not going to get my hopes up, though. It’s like katiebird said, if I support them, they aren’t going to get in.

  83. Just a little food for thought Rima.

  84. Oh and for the record Sarah believes in a health exception. which is a heck of alot more than the Democrats who voted to increase the risk of hemorrhage and uterus preforation to create the “partial birth’ travesty.

  85. Cwaltz .. Yep .

    repubs sure will not let anyone close to or over 70 run .. next time . Newt , I think would be smart enough to not even ‘think’ about it … power position sorta behind the scenes .. is more like it .

    but .. wtheckdik…??? .. LoL ..

  86. myiq2xu (and it’s not, since mine is 165), people can vote any way they please. But I didn’t work for Hillary Clinton because she is a woman, I did so because she was by far the best candidate. I am truly tired of identity politics.I saw Black voters defect from Hillary in droves, just because Obama was Black. Their right, their choice. But it’s a narrow and self-centered way to vote. I don’t think that the lesson of this campaign was that we need more women in office. I think the lessons were that we need more honorable politicians who don’t support fixing elections; and that the media is truly evil. The truth is that if Pelosi and Brazile hadn’t done everything they could to get Obama nominated, it wouldn’t have happened. Oh, and how did Maureen Dowd, Nedra Pickler, Anne Kornblut, Margaret Carlson, Mika Brezhinski, Rachel Maddow, Andrea Mitchell, Crowley, perform in this campaign?

    The Democratic Party has now become this uncomfortable coalition of identity groups, each bent on getting more of its kind in office. I guess I should have been spending more time spending my money and time to get White Jewish males in office, because there aren’t many of those. And I wonder whether this is the new political misdirection by the power elite: give identity groups one of their own, the one who doesn’t threaten their hegemony. Obama, then Palin; candidates to make us feel generous and gratified, while our money and country slips further away from us.

  87. Palin is the4 same as every Democrat on gay marriage. Her stance was the exact same as Joe Biden.

  88. miRa – For someone who claims to listen to what the candidates say you sure don’t hear very well.

  89. Oh and palin was so against the gay community that the “far right” extremist vetoed a bill that discriminated against gay couples. LOL I sure hope you have better than that RIMA.

  90. Oh and I knocked down some of your examples without any effort whatsoever.

  91. “Caroline lives in NYC and she knows nothing about politics. The talk has been that Kennedy’s wife would run for the seat. But there are other Kennedys here in Mass. Joseph Kennedy is a really good guy and has been mentioned for Governor.” Wasn’t one of the arguments against Hillary that we don’t need no stinkin’ dynasties?

    bostonboomer: I set up a new documents folder on November 5: “four more years.”

  92. “The WaPo cheerily adnits its unbalanced repotaing and its failure to cover issues instead of “the horse race.”



    Controlled burn. They’re calling it an Obama “tilt.” Liars. Liars. They *rigged* an election with corporate controlled discourse that did everything it could to drag that slimy used car salesman over the finish the line, from the moment they started to do a group witch-burning on Hillary Clinton.

    You’re a bunch of tabloid sleaze hacks and soulless apparatchiks. Washington Post, I spit on you.

  93. William:

    My alias is a test and you just failed

  94. Rima

    Palin has said (and done in Alaska) that although her personal beliefs might be different, she accepts what the voters want. If you do research into her political philosophy, she is more about the government shutting up about these things and letting people live their lives.

    Also, I really think the ‘oh my god if you vote republican we will all have to get back alley abortions’ crap is really old. Even if strict constructionists on the SC overturned Roe v Wade, it would just go back to the states, all of whom will allow abortions, with maybe the exception of Utah. We have to stop letting the Dems hold that over our heads.

  95. “Oh and for the record Sarah believes in a health exce”

    Actualy, I believe her stance was if the other’s LIFE was threatened, not “health.”

    She is on record saying she would be against abortion even if her daughte rhad been raped, which is fine (well..maybe not for her daughter,) it’s just that her choice shoudl not have to be everyone else’s choice as well.

    Again..spin away all you want, bottom line is her view on abortion is one that makes the far right happy. Same with stem cell research which really appalls me.

  96. This week has been a huge nightmare for me. I just want the honeymoon to be over.

  97. Let’s not call each other names, OK? We can disagree other ways. Try snark.

  98. If Martha Coakley decides to run for either John Kerry or Ted Kennedy’s seat, I hope that she can count on PUMA support. I promise to make calls, stuff envelopes, and stand on street corners for her. She’s middle class just like most of us and will not have a lot of personal money to spend. She stood for us when it wasn’t easy to do it. She’s presidential timber.

  99. As a female I agree with William in principle and think he’s made strong points. I also did not support Hillary because she was female. But I’ve had enough of our country and the world being screwed by male testosterone that it’s worth taking a shot at having more females in power, provided they’re more qualified than their opponents. Look at how Hillary has been impacted by men – first Bill’s shenangans, then Elliott Spitzer (one of her supporters), then John Edwards (who, if his affair had been publicized, would have not been able to gang up on her with Obama). I’m in Massachusetts and there are many women who would be great candidates – Martha Coakley, Therese Murray (current State Senate President), Shannon O’Brien (former gov candidate defeated by Mitt). I voted for Ed O’Reilley in the primary and see he’s now asking for a change in law so Gov. Patrick can just appoint someone to replace Kerry. He’s a good candidate too but, honestly, any of the women I mentioned have stronger experience than him. I’d like to reward these women for showing the guts to cast their convention votes for Hillary as the voters expected!

  100. 53% solution, please. I’m not settling for 30%. Let’s remind women just how many of us there are.

  101. Rima:

    Which Republican do you want on the ballot in 4 years?

    Because there WILL be a Republican on the ballot.

  102. Rima

    You are the one spinning

    You say she is against gay marriage when she has the same view as the dems and has even gone as far to actually do something on behalf of the gay community(which is a far stretch from standing on the stage with someone who says it is a disease). You say she is far right and fail to address the legislation her group has been instrumental in passing that is far from far right. Sarah palin believes terminating a pregnancy is murder, any pregnancy. I may not agree with that but I accept that and respect it. Sarah Palin has also done her darndest to support those same women going so far as to make certain that women have the opportunity to choose life when the opportunity arises. I don’t know when domestic violence became far right or ensuring women get the support for the children they gave birth to, or even making certain that young women who find themselves pregnant can complete college but if that is FAR RIGHT then sign me up as far right..

  103. William,
    We are at least considering a solution here at The Confluence. For many of us, the 30% thing works because women are such good multi-taskers, think things through etc etc. I agree that there are clearly some bad apple women out there and I would imagine that most of us would see through them.

    What would your solution be? It sounds like you are saying we need a third party to get what you want.

  104. BB

    I hate when people attempt to sell me BS talking points. If I wanted that I’d watch MSNBC.

  105. Here is how you claim to be for women’s rights but still keep women from achieving equality:

    You say “I support women, just not THAT woman. Or that one, or that one . . . “

  106. gmanedit,

    My point was that if they wanted a Kennedy, it wouldn’t be Caroline. I’m all for new blood and getting rid of dynasties.

  107. Rima

    Instead of continuing to call her far right address my points.

    When did domestic violence, child support or providing support for pregnant women become “far right.?

    When did vetoing legislation to discriminate against gays become “far right?”

    I can keep this up as long as you can.

  108. CWaltz,

    Your comment was excellent. It expressed the truth rather than irritation.

    Rima, we are well aware that Palin is conservative, but some of the things you have said about her are exaggerated. Furthermore, she isn’t running for anything right no, so why not focus on our topic.

    As for me, I’m going to be voting for the woman from now on. If that woman is Palin, she’ll get my vote unless a better woman is running against her. I’m sick and tired of being told to go to the back of the bus.

  109. Yes, Rima, let’s hear your response.

  110. “Rima

    You are the one spinning”

    Nope..I simply pointed out some of her stands that make the far right want her to win..again…why do you think they becasue so fired up by her being named?

    You are the one trying to spin out her stance into something else.

    However, if I wanted to be called names and listen to why women shgoudl vote for Palin no matter what her views might be, I can hang on far left or far right blogs. THis used to be a palce where it was all right nor to march in total lockstep, but..perhaps no more. I left Taylro March when seh became an Overnight Obot, and havent’ had much tim to blog any place since. Too busy actually doing things ya know.

    SO, I”ve got 34 parrots to feed myself, and it’s almost dark. People who want to convince themsleves that Palin is a closet liberal and work/vote for her in the future are free to do so. But peoepl really need to know what that means, and I honestly think a lot of her fans are not looking past teh surface.

    And now, before I start calling people names in return, which is counter-productive, I”m off to feed. But I hope to hell women dont’ start voting based solely on gender while trashign blacks who vote solely on race.

  111. Rima,

    Either respond to CWaltz’s specific points or drop it. Palin is not the topic of this thread. If you keep it up I’ll delete your comments.

  112. Rima,

    No one is calling Palin a closet liberal.

  113. Rima

    I have no problem with you disagreeing with Palin

    My problem is with your attempt to charecterize her as extreme.

  114. Tro!!s will drop long word-fog answers but can’t seem to come up with simple yes/no responses.

    BTW BB, did you read my early AM zombie thread today?

    I thought you might find it interesting.

  115. Is tonight’s scifi horror show “Invasion of the Obots”? Who are all these people? They’re repeating straight up obot haka. Have all the real Conflucians fled? (except myiq, cwalz, bboomer and few others?)

    Joe Kennedy would be good, but Martha Coakley would be better. Politically she is just as good if not better and yes, she is female. Ok, now I’m soooo hoping Kerry does get SoS. (what an apt acronym if he does). I’m so sorry, rest of the country, but we’ll get scr*wed on SoS no matter what (who else is Obama gonna pick, Hillary? Madelaine Albright? hahahaha), and Mass. might as well get an opportunity to rid themselves of Kerry.

    Ed O’Reilly is good, I voted for him, but compared to Coakely he has very little experience in government.

    I’m hard-pressed to believe that Patrick will stick around in Mass., esp. now that’s he’s faced with massive budget cuts he needs to make; he will not be popular at all very soon (he was struggling in his favorability ratings anyway). Just think; say you’re an obot and you are faced with incredibly hard choices that will make you unpopular and will take a lot of hard work; OR you can join The Best Cabinet Evah! and swan around in the national news for the next 4 years. Which would you pick?

  116. Rima has ignored my question

  117. scrubs57, I know that a thrid party is a very difficul thing to begin. We are so wedded to our two-party, Manichean system here, that no third party has ever managed to gain a foothold ever since the party realignment of 1860, when the Republicans replaced the Whigs. But I honestly don’t see how middle-class voters are going to be fairly represented by either of these current parties. The Republicans have no interest whatsoever in the middle class, except as people to buy things to help make them rich. And now the Obama Democrats seem to have as their goal the taking of middle-class safety net benefits away, in an effort to feed money to the urban poor. At least that’s how I read the 401K proposals. So middle-class people have no party to represent them.

    As far as getting 30% women, or 40%, that just obscures the real issues, as far as I am concerned. Yes, I suppose there are some “women’s issues,” that women are more atturned to. But just like Clarence Thomas doesn’t represent Blacks, so do many women in power have their own agenda, and their own self-interest, which may well not help any of us, men and women. Nancy Pelosi’s behavior in this campaign was beyiond despicable. And I was actually excited when she was made Speaker. Donna Brazile is likely to be the new head of the DNC, if she wants it. Does that help any of us? I suppose that at the end of the day, when the choices are close, a person might choose someone who is the same gender or ethnicity. But I am someone who abhors quotas, fixed percentages, all this stuff coming from the worse side of liberal instincts, which led to people going around to museums to see how many paintings by women and ethnic minorities there were hanging, and pushing to take some of those by White males down. Ultimately, I can only speak for myself, of course. But the idea that many women are now going to be spending their energy and time on getting only women candidates elected, makes me disappointed and uncomfortable. A lot of men worked for, and gave a lot of money to Hillary in this campaign. I would hope that a similarly gifted male candidate would evoke the same efforts and contributions from intelligent and progressive women.

  118. 1. If this story is true, Hillary should have promised Kerry Secretary of State. It’s politics; and Kerry’s endorsement would have really blunted Obama early. Kerry would also …… says William.

    Hillary didn’t need to promise Kerry anything – she took Massachusetts. Kerry and Ted Kennedy endorsing O didn’t help him one bit in that state – Clinton even thanked Ted for NOT endorsing her.

  119. “Again, there are reasons the Rep base was thrilled with her.

    This is a classic non-responsive answer

    BTW – The GOP base is about 1/3 the country, so by definition they cannot be “extreme”

  120. From what Palin has said, I agree with very little with her personal politics. However, given her actual record, she is nothing like the progressive* caricature. Like progressives* did with Obama, they projected whatever they wanted on a relatively new pol. But her record is the best way to judge her. She has yet to demonstrate forcing her personal beliefs on others. Until she does, it’s all speculation what she would do.

    One of my new rules is that if the media is for or against someone with much vigor, than there is a good chance that the opposite position is likely to be the better alternative.

  121. William:

    Women make up 52% of this country, but only 16% of elected officials

    Why is it wrong for women to want to double that percentage when they should be trying to triple it?

  122. Palin is against gay marriage – but then so is Obama. And almost all Democrats in Congress. Here’s something Palin did for the gay community in Alaska: she made sure spouses of gay workers had health insurance. Yep. She vetoed Republican legislation that would have taken health benefits away from partners of gay employees. It is because of HER that these health benefits still exist today in Alaska. Can anybody name one thing Obama has done for the gay community?

  123. If Deval Patrick has been as crappy a governor as most Massachusetts posters say he has, why would anybody think he’s qualified to go to Washington for anything?

    Peter Principle?

    Payoff for taking care of Obama’s illegal aunt in Boston?

    Deval Patrick? Good grief.

  124. In 2012 there WILL be a GOP candidate for President. That candidate may win.

    If not Palin, what Republican should be on the ballot?

  125. Occasional typos are definitely excusable, but consistent intelligibility often means that you aren’t really interested in a real debate, otherwise you’d spend a couple extra seconds to correct typos every two words. You can’t really value other people’s time if you don’t take time yourself.

  126. So basically

    You are saying that you are basing your position on her, not on facts, but on feelings.

    You see a base that is not your traditional ideology excited about her so therefore she must be jettisoned.

    Look at her actions Rima. This woman is not some extremist. despite her views on stem cells she was willing to join a ticket that was diametrically opposed to her viewpoint(because yes, MCcain was FOR stem cell research and she is on the record as saying she understood that HIS views would prevail if they prevailed.) Despite her opposition to gay marriage she vetoed legislation that would discriminate against gay couples. While she is against abortion, she has also pushed to ensure the women are supported. She is for enforcing child support, against domestic violence and for making certain young women are able to get education when they choose to have a child. This is a woman who doesn’t just say give birth and then forget about the needs of women and children. I respect that about her. Heck, I applaud it.

    Furthermore, i admire and respect that rather than complain about government that she chose to take a role in it. Is she perfect? No. Is she someone who i could get behind? Absolutely. I don’t expect to have a politician to agree 100% with me. I do expect them to be honest and fair. So far Palin passes my litmus. She’s fairly new so we’ll see.

  127. DYB

    Well he stood on the stage and gave a pulpit to a guy who believes gay is a disease to score political points in SC. Does that count?

  128. A Guide to Elite Opinion
    California’s Prop. 8, Alaska’s governor, and other abominations.


    The reason elite opinion

    makers are set on destroying her is fear. They sense that like Ronald Reagan, and unlike, say, Mitt Romney or Tim Pawlenty, she really, genuinely doesn’t care what they think, and for that reason is willing and able to go over their heads and make a strong, direct appeal to voters. Some of them may even remember that Ronald Reagan’s negatives were as high as his positives in the polls as late as 10 days before he carried 44 states in 1980.

    This is a time when elite opinion, including its conservative wing, is unanimous in wanting American politics to become a value-free zone in the image of Western Europe. A refusal to defer to elite opinion, the confidence that it can be overcome, may be the single most important quality in conservative politics.

    Apart from this willingness to go against elite opinion, conservatives should stop asking themselves who, if anyone, is the new Reagan. That way lies madness. So far there isn’t another Ronald Reagan. There may never be. Besides, most people (including his advisers) didn’t know Ronald Reagan was Ronald Reagan until he was out of office.

    What they should ask themselves instead is, can there be a conservative Barack Obama? That is, can a conservative presidential candidate be a dynamic speaker, draw huge crowds, go viral on the Internet, and launch a populist money machine capable of playing in the same league with Obama himself? (If not, if this proves to be something unique to the left, American conservatism may have a rather limited future.)

    One of the key characteristics of elite opinion, particularly at times like the present when it has become so unanimous that it has forgotten what it is to have a real debate, is repetition of the claim that some issues are settled, or no longer subject to serious debate. The end of the debate on global warming. The end of the Reagan era. The end of neoconservatism. The end of social conservatism.

    The end of Sarah Palin.

    The one thing to be sure of is that as long as elite opinion keeps declaring that something has ended, it hasn’t ended yet.


    I post this only for all of us to read other’s opinions .. I figure if we post ‘rush limblaugh’ stuff .. we can post this from the weekly standard . I found it interesting . It sorta goes along with what you are saying gq..

  129. Heh

    She could have chosen not to veto but actually worried about constitutionality. Sigh. We should only be so lucky as to have someone like that on a federal level. So far we have gotten rid of the 4th amendement. Anyone got odds on which amendment is next?

  130. Rima,
    Has she amended the state constitution? Until she does, you are purely speculating. I have speculated a lot of stuff that never came true, its a fun game. I like to people watch so that I can make up life stories about people. Perhaps that’s because I want to be a novelist some day.

  131. I’ve yet to see anyone equate Palin to Hillary.

  132. I have no delusions on Palin, only Hillary is Hillary.

  133. I ask for alternativesd to Palin, and Rima says Bloomberg and Romney

    Bloomberg is a multi-millionaire party-switcher and Rima says “I dont’ think Romney HAS any core convictions.”

    Yeah, those would be waaaaay better choices.

  134. “To those Americans whose support I have yet to earn–I may not have won your vote, but I hear your voices, I need your help, and I will be your president too.”

    –Barack Obama, November 4, 2008

    “Today I want to speak to every person who voted for my opponent: To make this nation stronger and better I will need your support, and I will work to earn it. I will do all I can do to deserve your trust. A new term is a new opportunity to reach out to the whole nation. We have one country, one Constitution and one future that binds us. And when we come together and work together, there is no limit to the greatness of America.”

    –George W. Bush, November 3, 2004

  135. rima

    The fact that you can name an amendment is exactly why we are discussing Palin. Obama, Pelosi and reid are not our friends. We are looking at what our alternatives might be.

    I started looking at Palin because of the caricature the media has made of her.

  136. “My concern is with women who want to twist it around so they convince themeselves they are voting for a younger HIllary in the process.”


  137. Myiq2xu,

    I didn’t read the comments. I saw the picture. I’ll try to read the thread soon. I’m thinking maybe rima needs to go. I can’t find any evidence of her being a regular commenter before today. Anybody remember her/him?

  138. Oh, Briana. Quit bringing your silly facts to the debate.

    One of the things that bothered me the most about Obama’s entire candidacy is that it was essentially the same in content as George W Bush’s. Post-partisan, integrity in evil D.C., etc. How intelligent people did not remember Bush’s campaign is beyond me.

  139. I’d look at Bloomberg maybe if he ran third. I really would like to see a third party. Bad and worse seem to be how the two major parties like it. I’d like to end that cycle. That said, i’d only do it if he was better than bad or worse.

  140. William and someone named lililam are sharing an IP address. They and Rima have been added to the moderation filter.

  141. Also, there’s a new post up.

  142. Katiebird,

    William and liliam are both real people. We went through this before. They are posting from AOL and their posts go back to a common IP address. Rima needs to be moderated, and I was just about to do it. Thanks.

  143. gq

    I got the same impr\ession. the whole thing was to be as vague as possible while spouting hopey changey messages that are reminiscent of compassionate conservative. God help us.

  144. BB, I fixed it. But, I’m watching William…..

  145. myiq2xu, you are virtually advocating quotas. How about 12% of people in government should be Blacks, 20% or so should be Hispanics. Only 2% Jews, of course. That’s why Jews fought against quotas for decades.

    I say again that if women are going to be pushing for more women to get elected to reflect their percentage of the population, then so will every other group. If a Hispanic candidate comes us, and 99% of Hispanics vote for him or her, is that good for the country? How does that help all of us? Women voting women, Blacks voting Blacks, Hispanics voting Hispanics. Why even have a campaign, or speeches, or debates?Just identify the gender and ethnicity of the candidate, and check the box.

  146. Anyone who responds to my alias with an announcement that their IQ is 165 should be presumed guilty until proven innocent

  147. Anyone who responds to my alias with an announcement that their IQ is 165 should be presumed guilty until proven innocent


  148. William:

    Us libruls luv quotas!

  149. I deleted Rima’s comments, because I don’t appreciate her highjacking my thread. I apologize for everyone who had to put up with her. I had to be away from the computer for awhile.

  150. Katiebird,

    I’ll be watching William too. He doesn’t seem to *get* the 30% solution. Liliam is A-OK.

  151. William,

    If it were a quota, we would push for a 52% solution. We just want a voice. Now drop it, or I’ll delete your comments too. I’m not in the mood.

  152. cwaltz> Since Obama spent well over $600,000,000 to run his campaign – we know that the next campaign will have to cost more. Come in: Bloomberg! He can certainly afford it without asking his voters to send him their monthly allowances. Actually, being a NYC resident, I like Bloomberg. And I just might vote for him for a third term. If he ran for Pres – I’d vote for him. (And let’s remember that when Hillary suspended her campaign, he threw her a “welcome back” party!)

  153. Bostonboomer, You don’t have to “watch me” or ask me to drop it. I see your progressivism does not extend to considering an alternative position. I don’t agree with you, and that seems to bother you so much, that you are threatening to delete my comments. You apparently only want discussion (and mine has always been polite and non-personal) when it fits your view of the world. I do not like identity politics of any kind. Sorry that you cannot tolerate that opinion, even to see it written by someone else. I thought this blog was originally started by Riverdaughter as a haven from political correctness and the squelching of differing opinions. If you are upset at the election, so are many other people. But it’s your thread, your blog; you go ahead and watch and warn some other people.

  154. the fact that so much money was sloshed into this campaign makes me want to have a requirement that public financing be used for presidential elections. Offices should not be up for sale to the highest bidder… that kind of stuff is why we fought a revolution in the first place

  155. On the subject of third parties (slightly ot), I am very much in favor of them in principle but can’t get behind them in practice.

    The U.S. is a winner-take-all system which structurally makes it very, very difficult for third party candidates to win. Not impossible, at least at lower levels of government (eg, Bernie Sanders of VT). Also, the existing parties have had years to build their own power structures and parties up as political organizations, and millions of Americans identify with a party as part of their self-identification. We’d really have to change the entire winner-take-all system first, before a third party would have a viable chance.

    Most European governments are parlimentary or more coalition-type systems which allows third parties to have a lot more power (although they usually don’t have successful top exec candidates). That’s why the Green Parties in countries like Germany have a lot more influence on govt politics.

  156. bostonboomer,

    It all sounds like circular arguments (William and the others) to me, they could be a pair of two on assignment(tr@ll).

    Imagine: Women represent 70% of the poor, hold 1% of titled land worldwide and the USA is ranked 69th in electing women. If Sarah inspired one little girl
    3 year old SARAH PALIN!!!

    she did a good job and I am not going to take part in denying any woman her right to compete in the political process.

    I am sure glad Janet Reno didn’t have to run for her position as AG as I promise you she wouldn’t have been able to. With only 16% of women being elected to office in the US and we are being hassled because we didn’t fall in line and because we aren’t grateful but mainly because we are FINALLY TAKING NOTICE!

    Goodness ME! We need more of those posters from long ago: Hang in there baby (maybe with a little puma instead of a kitten).

  157. frenly, on November 8th, 2008 at 6:08 pm Said:

    “the fact that so much money was sloshed into this campaign makes me want to have a requirement that public financing be used for presidential elections.”

    Yes, we would save money in the long run. They would be beholden to us.

  158. bboomer, thanks for getting rid of the tro!!. Sometimes they are amusing but Rima was just annoying.

    William — the problem is you are insisting on making up strawmen arguments against the 30 percent solution, and arguing those in a most annoying way.

  159. Regarding Palin, there’s this account by one of the people prominently involved in her preparation on foreign affairs:

    I talked to Steve Biegun, the former Bush NSC aid who briefed Sarah Palin on foreign policy, and he considers the leaks against her on the international stuff “absurd.”

    He says there’s no way she didn’t know Africa was a continent, and whoever is saying she didn’t must be distorting “a fumble of words.” He talked to her about all manner of issues relating to Africa, from failed states to the Sudan. She was aware from the beginning of the conflict in Darfur, which is followed closely in evangelical churches, and was aware of Clinton’s AIDS initiative. That basically makes it impossible that she thought all of Africa was a country.

    On not knowing what countries are in NAFTA, Biegun was part of the conversation that led to that accusation and it convinces him “somebody is acting with a high degree of maliciousness.” He was briefing Palin before a Univision interview, and talking to her about trade issues. He rolled through NAFTA, CAFTA, and the Colombia FTA. As he talked, people were coming in and out of the room, handing Palin things, etc. She was distracted from what Biegun was saying, and said, roughly, “Ok, who’s in NAFTA, what’s the deal with CAFTA, what’s up the FTA?”—her way, Biegun says, of saying “rack them and stack them,” begin again from the start. “Somebody is taking a conversation and twisting it maliciously,” he says.

    Of course the same so-called progressives — like the “objective”,”independent” Kevin Drum, as one instance — who once upon a time decried the press stories that Gore said he invented the Internet, and that Clinton staffers removed W keys and trashed the WH, are now spreading the Palin rumors as fast as they can type.

    Because Democrats are so different from Republicans.

  160. I was very proud of Madeline Albright (sp) when she served under Clinton and she did us proud. I hadn’t realized that Kerry had wanted a promise in ex-change for his endorsement.

  161. frenly, on November 8th, 2008 at 6:08 pm Said:

    “the fact that so much money was sloshed into this campaign makes me want to have a requirement that public financing be used for presidential elections.”
    Campaign Finance Reform and a NEW VOTING RIGHTS ACT!

  162. William,

    It doesn’t bother me in the slightest that you don’t agree with me. What bothers me is your hectoring tone, and your insistence on highjacking the thread. You might want to go read Katiebird’s new post that explains our commenting politicy and the purpose of The Confluence.

  163. William wrote: “I thought this blog was originally started by Riverdaughter as a haven from political correctness and the squelching of differing opinions.”

    You are mistaken, William. Riverdaughter started this blog as a haven for Hillary supporters who were driven out of The Cheeto and other O-bot blogs. This blog has specifically focused on issues related to getting women’s voices heard. Along the way, we’ve gained support from men and gay people who also want to be heard. We have agreed that getting more women into poltics is the best way to do that. If you read our blog regularly, you would know that by now.

  164. What goes around, comes around. If I’m not mistaken, didn’t the MA legislature change the law when Romney was Gov. so that he couldn’t appoint a replacement for (I think) Joe Moakley’s seat, making a special election necessary, and now they want to change the law back so that Gov. Patrick can appoint somebody for Kerry’s seat. What a bunch of hypocrites – and has nothing to do with Republican/Democrat (since no Republican could win) – it’s all about hand-picking somebody Patrick wants – forget about what the voters want, I guess. I personally think they should make Kerry pay for the special election. WTF? Win a seat on Tuesday, and leave a week later? On the other hand, I love Martha Coakley, and would love to see her get Kerry’s seat (or Kennedy’s, for that matter). Although I don’t like to see Kerry’s career advanced, I would be glad to at least get rid of him here in MA.

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