• Tips gratefully accepted here. Thanks!:

  • Recent Comments

    Propertius on “Pet Peeves”
    Ga6thDem on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Propertius on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Beata on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Beata on “Pet Peeves”
    Beata on “Pet Peeves”
    Propertius on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    William on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    HerStory Repeating on Once they’re in, you can’t vot…
    Beata on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    William on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    Beata on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    jmac on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    Beata on The Welcome Escape of a M…
    jmac on The Welcome Escape of a M…
  • Categories

  • Tags

    abortion Add new tag Afghanistan Al Franken Anglachel Atrios bankers Barack Obama Bernie Sanders big pharma Bill Clinton cocktails Conflucians Say Dailykos Democratic Party Democrats Digby DNC Donald Trump Donna Brazile Economy Elizabeth Warren feminism Florida Fox News General Glenn Beck Glenn Greenwald Goldman Sachs health care Health Care Reform Hillary Clinton Howard Dean John Edwards John McCain Jon Corzine Karl Rove Matt Taibbi Media medicare Michelle Obama Michigan misogyny Mitt Romney Morning Edition Morning News Links Nancy Pelosi New Jersey news NO WE WON'T Obama Obamacare OccupyWallStreet occupy wall street Open thread Paul Krugman Politics Presidential Election 2008 PUMA racism Republicans research Sarah Palin sexism Single Payer snark Social Security Supreme Court Terry Gross Texas Tim Geithner unemployment Wall Street WikiLeaks women
  • Archives

  • History

    September 2008
    S M T W T F S
  • RSS Paul Krugman: Conscience of a Liberal

    • An error has occurred; the feed is probably down. Try again later.
  • The Confluence

    The Confluence

  • RSS Suburban Guerrilla

    • Ginni in the spotlight
      NEW: Ginni Thomas met with Jan 6 committee IN PERSON. She did not answer my questions pic.twitter.com/5z6pypr0S9 — Annie Grayer (@AnnieGrayerCNN) September 29, 2022 New: In interview with Jan 6 cmte, Ginni Thomas reiterated her belief that the 2020 presidential election was stolen. “Yes" Cmte Chmn Bennie Thompson said when asked if Thomas said she … Con […]
  • RSS Ian Welsh

    • The Attacks On Nord Stream I & II
      Let’s point out the obvious. Russia had no reason to attack its own pipelines. If it doesn’t want gas to go thru them it just turns off the tap. Sabotage to the pipelines weakens Russia’s position, since it will be months before they can offer to turn fuel back on, which they would have wanted to offer during the winter in order to pressure Germany in specif […]
  • Top Posts

Wednesday: It matters who counts the votes

Nancy knows better than you do

Nancy knows better than you do

Last Wednesday morning, a vote was held in Denver in the hotels of the state delegations.  Later that afternoon, a “roll call” was held in the convention center and Barack Obama was hailed as our new nominee.  The funny thing is, those of us who remember what the primary results were in some of our states could not reconcile our memories with the way our delegations actually voted.  If you lived in AR or NJ, your vote was reallocated to Obama even though your state delegation should have gone overwhelmingly for Clinton.  On what basis did the state chairs make the decision to reallocate the vote?  Presumably, the vote earlier in the morning allowed this to happen and it should be a relatively easy thing to look at those ballots and say, “Ahhh, here’s the problem.  Hillary just didn’t get the votes she needed.”

Except, no one has been able to see those ballots.

Heidi Li, Murphy and our own LadyBoomerNYC have been posting about this in the last day but what is really infuriating is that those of us who were in Denver at the time tried to tell the media what was going on and there was barely a yawn from them on the subject.  It’s shameful to think there isn’t one media outlet looking into what happened last Wednesday (Late sighting! There is one.  See the “more” note at the bottom of the page).  After all, it was only our votes that we cast in good faith during the primaries.

The party will tell us that it is a private entity and it can make up and rescind its rules whenever it damn well pleases.  But it’s a public scandal when state legislatures debate and vote on the timing of the primary and state treasuries allocate funds for the primary and poll workers are trained for the primary and voters take time off from work for the primary and little old ladies get jostled in caucuses because they mistakenly believe that it is their civic duty to turn out for the vote for a private party that is under no obligation to follow its own processes.  It is a public scandal when millions and millions of dollars are solicited from individuals to fund a campaign and pay for advertising, buttons, stickers, lawn signs, campaign staff, goldfish snack crackers for volunteers, canvassing materials, phone time and rallies when the result of all that effort and money is that delegate ballots get filed in the trashcan at a private party’s convention.  It is a public scandal when the will and intention of the voters is shoved aside by Nancy Pelosi who substituted her judgment for the voters, for deciding that she knows what’s best for you, and that is Barack Obama, whether you like him or not.

Who is this person we “selected” at the convention?  What kind of man would allow, endorse, encourage this type of behavior on his behalf?  What kind of character does he have when he accepts the nomination that resulted from crushing the will of so many voters?  What kind of president will he be if he doesn’t honor the intentions of the voters in the beginning?  And what were Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, Jon Corzine and others thinking when they endorsed him?

What we know of the vote last Wednesday is that Hillary actually received more than 1900 delegates before the counting was stopped.  We have been told that the delegate count was getting too close for Pelosi et al to explain away.  We also know that some Edwards’ delegates wanted to switch their votes to Hillary but were told they were not allowed.  We know that delegates, who represent you and me and their states, were threatened and intimidated to vote for Obama.  What we don’t know is how close the vote actually was. We may never know because once a result is read out, and there is no protest, no media attention, the deal is done.  But no one who witnessed this should feel any less outraged and those who participated in the fraud should never expect unity.

There will never be any resolution to this primary season.  Barack Obama deserves to lose.  Save your breath, Obamaphiles.  You are not supporting a great man.  There is nothing admirable about a man who accepts fraudulent vote counts on his behalf.  Everything that comes afterwards is tainted.  And as for the media who hyped this man to astronomical heights, don’t expect us to ever trust anything you say until you report the truth of what happened last Wednesday.  We’ve never understood your hatred of Hillary Clinton.  It borders on the pathological.  Now, you are as responsible as the DNC and Obama himself for what happens from here.  You are responsible for whatever bad thing comes of this election because the will of the voters was not honored.

There isn’t enough scorn in the world to heap upon those who are responsible for this scandal that has turned our precious country’s reputation for fair elections into that of just another banana republic.  No man is worth squandering our legacy like this.  Especially *this* man.

More: Heidi Li has a follow-up on the absurd story that the California delegation has been tryint to foist on an unknowing public.  It looks like the LATimes is tepidly following up on the issue.  Also, see this page from TheGreenPapers for the startling results of the floor vote.  What was done to Hillary’s voters is disgraceful.

203 Responses

  1. Remember in November!!!!!

  2. I may not like it but fully understand what the DNC was trying to do at the Convention. Unity, baby, unity.

    What I have a harder time with is the MSM trying so hard to manufacture consent over this election and predetermining who the winner is going to be, no matter what.

    If this kind of rhetoric continues, anything less than a victory for Ds will be construed as stealing the election.

  3. Good Morning, rd… 1st day of school! (time for coffee here on the west coast)

    perhaps Gloria Allred will help us with a lawsuit?

  4. riverdaughter, will you share how you might vote when the time comes? If you don’t want to, I respect that because it is, after all, a secret ballot.
    I woke up this morning thinking that the Republican Party and its platform are inimical to everything I have ever believed or espoused, politically.
    Much as I’d love to cast a ballot for the first ticket featuring a woman in twenty four years, I cannot.
    Republicans call their Party the Party of Life. I call it the Party of Pain and Suffering.
    Look at how they exploited Terry Schiavo and her poor, deluded parents.
    I sometimes think that Republicans aren’t happy unless somebody, somewhere, is wasting away on futile life support (remember how Schiavo’s mother contemplated the possibility of amputation in order to keep Terry “alive?”. Poor mothers without support trying to find any kind of help for their physicall handicapped kids also float their boat.
    And unwanted babies born to hopeless parents and drop kicked into a Dickensian hell hole of foster “care?” That’s a shiny, new bike on Christmas morning to our Republican friends.
    So, I can’t punch the ballot for McCain and Palin.
    I can’t vote for Obama and the ruthless, win at all cost gang who hijacked our primary for him, either.
    What to do?

  5. via pumapac, a nice chart showing a compare and contrast of the votes.

  6. How can we DIG these stories?

    Riverdaughter, I think this is the best and most important piece you’ve ever written. Together with Lady Boomer’s “Null and Void” yesterday The Confluence is exposing the underlying rot at the base of the Democratic Party.

    What can we do to draw more attention to these posts? To spread the links so that THIS becomes the story of the day?

  7. SweetieSue: I believe that each one of us must do as our conscience dictates. You don’t need any guidance from me. You know what is right and wrong. Do the right thing. (*hint*- How many republican parties do you want?)

  8. Can Obama fly his own plane, raise 5 kids and be Gov? Sarah can.
    click here for video http://countusout.wordpress.com/

  9. I was definitely with you all after Clinton quit the primaries. All I can say now is that Clinton is satisfied with Obama, Clinton has urged her supporters to support him, and I am doing what she says.

    I haven’t seen one good argument on this site — other than hurt feelings — about why ANY Democrat would support these GOP turn back the clockers.

    I’ll repeat the question Hillary asked: Were you only in this for her?

  10. No, Kevvvboy, I was in in to have my vote counted and my voice heard. Neither happened, so go away.

    Clue: Hillary, much as I love her, does not own my vote. I do.

  11. (snort)

    Funny that Kevvboy choose this post for his trollish whine.

  12. BTW, guys, in the midst of the gross sexism going on, do not forget that there is a big element of classism going on as well.

    One of the reasons the press hated the Clintons so is that they were OUTSIDERS. They weren’t your usual Ivy League elites. They are hating Palin for the same reason (plus misogyny). She is not part of their little cocktail gossip circuit. Bill and Hill were white trash from podunk Arkansas in their eyes, and Palin is white trash from Alaska.

    The press hates Bubbas with an astounding venom. And McCain just picked a female Bubba. Both Hillary and Palin are “double weenie threat” to the Georgetown Social Club. Not a fan of cocktail weenies, AND do not have weenies. So the press goes batshit, as do the loafered elites in the Dem party.

  13. Kevvboy was for Hill. Not every former Hill supporter now for BO is faking it. For me, Palin makes things more difficult. Sexism trumped Party and the typical issues this election. To just say, oh well, so what? First woman VP…she’s republican, is just not that easy for me as it is for Kevvboy.

  14. Kevvboy: We feel we are honoring Hillary by urging you to support downticket Democrats for Congress. That is the ONLY way to ensure that the new president will not be able to ram through any nasty legislation with Republican help.
    Now, Hillary can ask me to vote for Obama. but Hillary knows that her supporters do not check their brains at the voting booth curtain. So, skip the “take her orders” argument and tell me what Barack Obama has done to EARN your vote. Because up to this point, he has done nothing to earn mine and everything to earn my emnity.

  15. What’s the big deal? This is the stuff I grew up on in the 50s and 60s. Of course, it was all happening in Communist Russia, East Europe, and some third world countries…..

  16. fred, I liked the first half of the video…..

    I cannot help it but I find Palin “interesting” (call me shallow)….in a down to earth kind of way… I can assure you most people in the area where I live can identify with her and her background in a heartbeat.

    Lets not forget that all this obsession with demonizing/neutralizing P is mere survival strategy for the D party. She is too much of a “fresh-new-face-kind of politics” to be allowed to outshine O’s “out-of Washington-new-comer” status.

    As I said, I am still waiting for the O/B hunting photo op. (and BTW, levitation beats piloting a plane anytime)

  17. “I am doing what she says.”

    atta a boy/girl.

  18. My Dad decided he wouldn’t vote BO when he did the brush your shoulder off. That arrogant dismissiveness just sucker punched my Dad. People do consider character when voting.

  19. RD: Excellent post—one of your best.

  20. The progressive blogs jumped the shark and landed in the kool-aid tank.

    I sure hope not of them notice Palin wearing white shoes, now that it’s past Labor Day

    Lord help her if she doesn’t wash her hands after using the ladies room. The villagers will probably stone her to death

  21. I know, I know it should be “atta boy”…jee.

  22. As Riverdaughter ever written a bad thread?

  23. Thanks RD, I needed that! I just opened my emails and found some atraucious trash about Sarah Palin and propaganda about the Convention, sent by a close friend of mine who has entered the Obama cult few months back. That a woman of her intelligence would scoop to such level of sexism blew me away. So thanks for the confluence, my refuge, my compass.

    That too shall pass. We will prevail….after some times.

  24. “The villagers will probably stone her to death”

    and so they should….the ****

  25. Please don’t allow this story to fade into oblivion. We have to keep pushing it. The party has become SO corrupt that it’s making W look like a boy scout.

  26. RD: Thanks for the clarity of your writing here. I have read the other posts and must admit that Null and Void was hard to understand. I am a California voter and, of course, voted for Hillary. I am really angry that my vote and that of so many other Californians was tossed overboard. I believe party rules allow even pledged delegates to abandon voter results but traditionally that has not come on the first ballot. If party rules allow delegates to abandon their voters on the first ballot, then we don’t have much legal room. But I think there is a huge political issue here and it is summarized by what you say. The big cure for this is a party rule that says delegates must record their votes for the candidate they represent on the first ballot—no matter what. Traditionally that is what has happened. I think a party that does not do that is very problematic. Another big question is why this bamboozling seemed so necessary to Pelosi and Obama. Everyone knew the election was really close so recording that it was would not have been a surprise. Once that first ballot was recorded with neither candidate having the required majority, it would have been so easy for Hillary to release all her delegates and urge the Obama nomination by acclamation. What really appears to have happened is that they began undermining her votes on the first ballot and her choice was to stand there and be humiliated or interrupt the process as she did and ask for a suspension of the rules and an acclamation for Obama. Be profoundly humiliated or surrender. This makes all the hard work of someone like Heidi Li who fought so hard to even have her name in nomination irrelevant.

    It will be interesting to see how the Republicans handle this in their confirmation of McCain and if they make a contrast. The big difference of course is that they have essentially a winner take all system.

    I could never vote for candidates of this party again until they clean up their mess and I know they are not going to do this unless they are defeated overwhelmingly for what they are trying to pull off. With the media totally in the tank for this rip off candidate, I think the Republicans will have little chance to defeat The One and when he is elected we will see a backlash against women because we did not STFU. Obama will abandon R/W as fast as he abandoned FISA. His appointments to the SC will make Republican appointments look like models of legal brilliance.

  27. I watch a panel discussion with local state Republican leaders and a few political analysts on C-Span. The analyst says that the Dems leaders are just as happy that McCain selected Palin as are the Republicans. He didn’t know who would turn out to be right. The Democrats are counting on, and have absolute confidence, that American men will not, I repeat will not, elect a woman. They plan to push the belief that McCain is one heartbeat from death and they rely on the sexism in this country that men will look at that and not vote for the ticket with a woman on it. In my opinion, every man and women who votes “present” (doesn’t vote for Pres) is a vote for Obama. The democratic party is NOT the party of your ideals. That party for now is DEAD. If we don’t nick this sexism in the bud NOW, we will all pay the consequences.

  28. Before this election cycle is over, I may not have a friend in the world left. Yesterday, one of the last holdout friends I had decided to call me and tell me what a lousy mother Palin was for chosing to do this with a special needs child and a pregnant teenage daughter.

    I let it roll, I couldn’t help it. Why in the hell is it the mom’s complete and total responsibility. Now if Mr. Palin had accepted the VP slot it would be just dandy. Mommy could stay home and take care of everyone.

  29. Too sphynx like for me, riverdaughter. I don’t want any kind of Republican party and I’m disgusted with my own at this point.
    But you’re right, no one can make this wrenching decision for me. Right now, I’m planning to vote down ticket only or stay home.

  30. Remember what Senator Boyda wrote to me in her letter yesterday

    As you probably know, Senator Hillary Clinton’s name was placed into nomination for the presidency at the Democratic National Convention. This was a thoughtful compromise that ensured that the voices of her supporters were heard in Denver. It is now up to all of Senator Clinton’s supporters to ensure that her message of change remains heard between now and Election Day.

    There were thoughtful to Hillary and us and now it is up to us, (thank God, I know Hillary was tired of carrying that burden around) to insure that BHO is our next POTUS.

    My response: NOT

  31. Fellow Conflucians, if you don’t hear from me for the next week or so, it won’t be from lack of interest. I am off camping at the Fraley Traditional Music Festival at Carter Caves State Park. If you want to hear fiddle music, lots of dulcimers, a little bluegrass, a little gospel, some Elizabethan ballads, even some foreign stuff from Texas called cowboy & Texas swing [that reference is for you, Carol], come on out & join us.

    I do have a tv in my camper, but the family has already warned me, no politics….. well, I own the thoughts in my head, anyway.

  32. Oh isn’t it just so thoughtful of them to condescend to allow her to throw her votes to The Messiah???

    These people should shut up. They just make me angrier every time they try to patronize us.

  33. Masslib: an astonishing number of people never saw that video of the entire finga, brushing, hearing them with the words. Someone else saw it, and told them it meant nothing…….

    ok, truly off now..

  34. WMCB @ 9:04 said:

    “BTW, guys, in the midst of the gross sexism going on, do not forget that there is a big element of classism going on as well.”

    I had a heated phone debate last night re: the Palin pick with my Obama supporting friend, Mike. It went on until the wee hours. I had him squirming at my question “What exactly would be sufficient qualification for her to be VP?” He was dead silent, knowing that whatever he said would highlight Obama’s lack of quals.

    His final answer “He’s smarter than her.”

    OMFG!!!! Classism in action. He thinks Obama is smarter ’cause he went to Harvard. I’m still raging over that and I think Mike shocked himself by saying it.

  35. WMCB,

    That was RIGHT ON and very very funny. My thoughts exactly!

  36. The Democrats are counting on, and have absolute confidence, that American men will not, I repeat will not, elect a woman.

    Showing how much of our fake primary season really was about sexism.

  37. I am the father of a special needs kid. Wife works during the day and I stay home. We homeschool (BTW today is first day of school in my district and we have not sent our IHIP yet, oh my, we are so naughty, moving can do that to people).

    Is my wife a demon/wh*re? I do not think so, but I am starting to believe that the DK and HP crowd may think so.

  38. Let’s pretend Hillary Clinton didn’t win all the big states in the primary. Let’s pretend Hillary Clinton didn’t have 18 million people vote for her. Let’s pretend Barack Obama is eloquent, intelligent, experienced, honest, unifying, and incorruptible. Let’s pretend that all the people who oppose Obama are uneducated, Catholic, working class, gun-toting typical white people (read: racist). Let’s keep this fantasy up until he loses by a landslide to a guy who 6 months ago had no chance of winning. I hope the DNC likes their parallel universe–sort of like all those people watching a Democratic president on West Wing while Right Wing was the reality show.

    I am troubled by Sarah Palin’s politics, which are anti-GLBT and women’s rights. She is very conservative. But I don’t like the misogyny being directed at her any more than I liked what was done to Hillary Clinton.

    I wish we had a concerted plan to make our votes visible to the DNC. I am sitting out or voting for Cynthia McKinney. Many friends are going over to McCain. I worry we’ll all get lost in the chads. What will signify the PUMA vote? We all own our votes, and must do as our consciences tell us. I find this a dilemma as far as letting the DNC know in hard numbers what it lost.

  39. Here is my argument for McCain Palin. If we do have Obama in the Whitehouse with a Democratic majority in both halls of congress, we will have the same Republican line up under a Democratic label that gave us an unfettered George Bush and we will have another 8 years of it and maybe more. If you think a Democratic congress would stand up to the O on any issue after what you have just seen in this election, I do not know what evidence you could find to support it. The Democratic party will become the Obama party; the term Obamanation will be real. Maybe PDiddy can give us a new American anthem.

  40. I agree with WMCB about the classism. And every time I hear the media or the Dems slam Palin, I like her a little more, and them a lot less.

    Bob Schieffer on CBS last night actually compared her to Eagleton and couldn’t disguise the excitement in his voice when he said that once Eagleton was off the ticket, McGovern was finished. It mad eme think of Obama’s history of making sure he has no opposition.

  41. The Democratic Party will not get my vote because of the way they shabbily treated Hillary, and expected her then to forget and try to save his rearend by speaking for him and them. The sexist blogger boyz really ticked me off. They are showing their colors again in regard to some of the criticism I have seen of Palin.

    So afraid of wimmin’ in control……

    The question is, how do I , as a feminist, support the advancement of qualified women, and thus the advancement of women in general?

    McCain’s pick of Sarah Palin has really got my attention.

  42. YES…….They have even gotten to Bob SCHIEFFER.

  43. Yes, I liked H. Yes, I would have voted for her in the GE.

    No, “this” is not about H anymore.

  44. Hillary-zila, what do you mean?

  45. Bob Schieffer on CBS last night actually compared her to Eagleton and couldn’t disguise the excitement in his voice when he said that once Eagleton was off the ticket, McGovern was finished. It mad eme think of Obama’s history of making sure he has no opposition.

    What are these people reading that gives them the right to talk like this? Eagleton? Seriously? They think McCain is going to cave on Palin?

    If McCain was a Democrat, I’d say Palin was out. But McCain? I think he’s looking forward to this.

  46. I hope every PUMA watches and listens to Palin tonight, if for no other reason than to boost the viewer numbers. I think Obama will be heartsick if the number of people watching her speech should exceed the number watching him. I would so love for that to happen.

  47. Thanks kbird. I have not been reading all the comments lately. Everything OK?

  48. My own party has told me that my vote does not count so why look for me in November? They have presented one of the worst candidates to ever grace the national stage and offered as his running man a candidate who has already demonstrated his ranking of women by past actions.

    The GOP has offered a candidate who has waffled on the issue of torture when he himself has been a prisoner of war and had suffered a similar fate. His VP candidate is a woman who has allowed her ambition to trump the privacy of her 17 year old child to become the subject of ridicule and derision while she seeks to obtain higher office.

    Since my choice for the “best and the brightest” was overruled, and I am being asked to consider any of the above 4, my decision will be to abstain in November. In good conscience, I am completely unable to come to terms with any of the positions these candidates espouse.

    Unless Sarah Palin can convince me otherwise that she is “something different” and a breath of “fresh air” in the bargain, I will continue to view her as just another self serving pol in good company with the remaining 3.

    My judgment is based more on her ability to allow her child to become a pawn in this game of vote seeking. Sarah Palin as a candidate is open to interpretation. Placing her child in that same spotlight shows a lack of judgment on her part and a display of wanton ambition that leaves me cold.

    I may be out on a limb here, but I am convinced that choosing between the privacy and well being of my child, I would have declined the opportunity to divulge her private life to the media hounds. No question that women are treated differently and with much more hostility, and Sarah may be prepared to take the risk on behalf of herself. Her child is another matter altogether. It smacks less of “feminism” and more like sheer unadulterated naked ambition.

    I can honestly say that I do not wish to see any of the above 4 candidates running this country but if so, they do it without my support.

  49. Like Fuzzy said last night, Obamanation thinks Palin should be shoved under the bus ASAP because that’s what Obama always does.

    McCain doesn’t think like that at all.

    It’s called loyalty.

    Also, it’s hilarious how they’re running scared. I had no interest in watching the Repub convention last night, but me and my husband will be glued to the screen watching her speech tonight.

  50. Probably it will not happen Jangles (even my die hard R in-laws watched the D convention).

    Wife and I will be watching…

  51. The new “O” party is looking more and more like the old “R” party as far as dirty, cheating politcs. This will be the first time I’m voting Republican.

  52. It appears to me that the Obama GE campaign is dead on arrival. I’m sure that the Repubs will get hold (or already have) of the facts of what went on in the D convention and will expose the fraudulent behavior and or use pieces of it to nullify BO as a candidate.

    I decided last week that I will more than likely write in HIll and vote downticket Dems – although voting for any of those who threw NJ votes away rankles me.

    Hmm, what happens if the candidate of choice chooses to or cannot continue with his candidacy? they should all go to prison for what must be illegal practices.

  53. Hahahahahahaha! Kevboy says he has seen hurt feelings here? Only among the trolls sweetie. This isn’t about “hurt feelings,” which is a very offensive sexist frame. If you read RD’s post you know that we are angry because our votes were stolen from us. But you probably didn’t bother to read it. I’ve seen you here before and you were never a Clinton supporter. Perhaps you have “hurt feelings?”

  54. Someone who was on the floor said on No We Won’t that some delegates had bruises on their arms. Shades of RBC…
    And they are scared of us

  55. Pat, pols are pols (H is one too) and will “do” what they have to “do”.

    Open season on personal lifes/families seems to be the norm these days.

  56. Pat,

    I will wait and see what Palin has to say also. As for her choice to accept the nomination even when her daughter is pregnant out of welock, I wonder what it would be like for a daughter to know that because of her, her mother gave up the vice presidency? Although I probably disgree with Palin on most issues, I can see that she was between a rock and a hard place. I guess we’ll have to wait and see how it all shakes out.

  57. Don’t we need a legal action to get this party started? Where’s Harold Ickes? Seems like he’d be interested in this project. I say, sue their asses.

  58. OT

    McCain camp hitting back hard:


  59. On fox news Senator Thune R-SD defended Sarah Palin.
    All during the primary did anyone hear one of the candy-assed, panty-waisted wimps in the democratic party defend Senator Clinton from the sexism?
    I did not hear one.
    I lived thru alot of the discrimination in the workplace during the late 50’s and 60s and saw some changes made. but apparantly not enough.
    I really thought it was getting better.
    This primary showed me it is not .
    Women and smart men will have to fight to make as politically incorrect as racism has become.
    Maybe it is a good thing that it was brought out in the open, now maybe it can be fixed.
    We can start with the faux new democratic party.
    From now on all votes must count.
    Sexist and racism and discrimation will not be tolerated.
    If we have to vote them all out and start anew so be it.



  60. Unity is the cover for the elites picking the candidate. The current elite leadership has basically conducted a coup and will not allow the great ignorant, female, working,unwashed, hormonal masses to choose someone who is not acceptable in background and social class. Like the Clintons. Or god forbid the Palins. The more the Obama nation and the press talk about the wonderfulness of the Democratic candidate and the awfulness of the Clintons, Palins and their supporters, the more I see it as an elite who is terrified of loosing their (or hoped for) social status. Obama appeals to their exclusiveness and snottiness. Obama is the Louis Vuitton candidate. Or a knock off of one.

  61. Parentofed,

    Have a wonderful time. It sounds great. I used to play bluegrass mandolin and went to many such festivals. I hope you have a lovely, relaxing week.

  62. I do not think they should send unwed pregnant women to leper colonies anymore.

  63. Great post RD, we should be reading about this in our local ‘news’ papers and this sham should be a scandalous feeding frenzy on all cable and networks ‘news’ programs…

    What do we get instead? Heaping doses of BS, disinformation, and sexism piled on Palin and her family. That is what Obama calls a ‘distraction’…

    Why does it appear that the media is covering for the DNC?

  64. I also received Kansas Senator Boyda’s email, like TheRealKiim.

    “As you probably know, Senator Hillary Clinton’s name was placed into nomination for the presidency at the Democratic National Convention. This was a thoughtful compromise that ensured that the voices of her supporters were heard in Denver. It is now up to all of Senator Clinton’s supporters to ensure that her message of change remains heard between now and Election Day.”

    A “thoughtful compromise.” Kansas only had 10 votes pledged to Hillary to begin with (out of 41). But in the end Hillary only got 6 votes cast for her. Another case of “4 votes” being “allocated” to Barack at the whim of the Party bigwigs.

    I can only imagine what it feels like to be from Arkansas, New Jersey, etc. to be totally disenfranchised. You know, I really don’t want a party that can just do whatever it wants. RD, you make it so clear that not only a civil crime has been committed here but that a criminal one as well.

    I am struggling with my vote. I cannot support Barack and the DNC. I don’t want to support the Rep ticket, but I really have no other choice (and I am an older white male who has no problem voting for Palin).

    I really feel for those of you in the swing states who must decide. Be true to your deepest self. Know that there are many other PUMAs struggling with you.

  65. I promised myself after watching the RBC meeting that I will not support any Dem in California but my own Representative. All the rest of them threw my vote away when they gave them to Barky. Nancy Pelosi and Barbara Boxer are up for re-election this cycle. I don’t get to vote in Pelosi’s district but I will be campaigning for who ever is in opposition. As for Barbara Boxer she is one of the big disappointments in my area for folding and supporting Barky. I won’t be supporting her either.
    Country before party!!

  66. “What Makes Obama Run?” from The Chicago Reader, December 1995

    This real-time story from the time Obama just started out in politics gives a picture of his reputation back then…Change? Yeah…not so much message, but as a person who has obviously allowed himself to be swallowed up…The story has a “glow” to it even then, but the actual quotes from Obama are something that are worth reading…

  67. “As you probably know, Senator Hillary Clinton’s name was placed into nomination for the presidency at the Democratic National Convention. This was a thoughtful compromise that ensured that the voices of her supporters were heard in Denver. It is now up to all of Senator Clinton’s supporters to ensure that her message of change remains heard between now and Election Day.”

    “They” will “do” and “say” anything to win. How thoughtful of “them”.

    Time to move on, children. Condescension always works with me.

  68. Upstate: Exposing your child to this type of media attention is irresponsible. She invites scrutiny, only fair, but the child at 17 deserves the right to privacy at all costs. This decision to allow her daughter to become a target is questionable. Sarah had my sympathy up until the revelation that her daughter was indeed expecting a baby and allowed this to become more of a media event than her own candidacy. For me at least, it casts a very bright light on her ability and motivations in allowing herself to become a candidate at the expense of this young woman’s right to privacy.

    The sensitivities of this young girl has been left in the dust and dirt and for what reason? So that her mother may attain higher office? I expect more from women to “protect” what is theirs. Sarah seems inclined to “serve”. Hillary objected vociferously with regard to Chelsea and the “pimping out” comment as I recall.

    I realize I sound judgmental but if this is a quality of the type of decisions we can expect going forward, I am less convinced of her sincerity. This type of exposure she could have avoided.

  69. myiq2xu, on September 3rd, 2008 at 9:15 am Said:
    As Riverdaughter ever written a bad thread?


    Any more questions to make me look like Isaac Newton? I need that for my ego.

  70. I remember snarking when Hillary suspended her campaign that at least we wouldn’t have to listen to WWTSBQ on a daily basis

    Boy, was I way off on that one

  71. Joanelle: make sure you check the rules for your state re: write in votes. Sometimes they default to the Party nominee.

  72. The McCain campaign is ready to go to war over the sick attacks on Governor Palin and her family.
    Maybe fighting back and not tolerating such attacks will change future campaigns.
    I really hope so.



  73. Just cast me in the role of a mother bear who would do anything to protect my child at all costs. At a time when this child, and for all intents and purposes at 17 she is still a child, should be able to get on with her life without the national media feasting on the spoils, she is subject to these events through no fault of her own.

    To think she would suffer some form of angst because her mother turned down the opportunity to become a VP candidate out of consideration for the child, is ridiculous. Is she thanking her mother now that her situation is a topic of daily analysis?

  74. Folks, I hate to say it, but I’m starting to get annoyed at Hillary.

    How much shit is she gonna take before telling Obama to fuck off?

    I have seen Obots b*tching that she wasn’t doing enough for the Precious.

    I think that’s probably the biggest reason Obama’s supporters didn’t help her pay off her debts.

    They won’t donate anything until after the election so they can hold it over her head.

    I doubt they will pay her anything afterwards either, even if she carries Teh Precious across the finish line

  75. WMCB – what you said at 9:00am

    My vote is my voice – I will be heard.

  76. I respect /understand your position, Pat.

    I am just having a problem with the simultaneous “pimping” /”open season-on-privacy memes going on on the blogosphere/MSM.

    I understand that the Ds need to preempt R on the morality/judgement issue (an area co-opted by R for years).

    However, I know hypocrisy when I see it (I am not referring to you, but the progressive blogosphere/media/DP surrogates)

  77. IMHO, Pat Buchanan has a really good article up on realclear politics (I know, shocking). He’s talking about Sarah vs Hillary in 2012.

  78. What I heard last night about the convention made it clear that the Republicans are going to fight back against the attacks on Palin. It was refreshing, to say the least.

  79. Obama must lose………………….. The leadership of the Democratic party is totally corrupt and will continue to manipulate, everyone to get what a few at the top want. We all know, that the defeat of Obama is the only chance of ever getting the party back. It’s the democrats last chance…………….. Obama must lose

  80. i guess i’m back to a half a voter again down here in FL. the 104 hillary supporters in the delegation only managed to cast 51 votes for hillary. good thing they restored our voting rights, or else we would have been down to a quarter of a vote 😉

  81. Pat,

    I think this would be the first time I disagree with you (hey there’s always a first)
    I had this discussion with one female parent yesterday in my daughter’s school. I really don’t see how this should have disqualify Palin for the VP job.
    Hey, the kid is 17, had sex and got knock up, so? Where is the crime and where is the shameful act?

    As much as I dislike Repubiks, I don’t think someone should pass the opportunity to be VPOTUS because the media and “progressives” would sniff the panties of a 17 yr old.

    It’s just reminding me of the insane column Dahlia Lithwick wrote a couple of days ago stipulating that women who are not backing Obama because of what happen during the primaries are about the confirm all the horrible caricatures about women we’ve had for so long in the media.

  82. did anyone see Geraldine Ferraro on GMA this moring? Mawm mentioned as we were going to work that she said that the PUMAs were a large group, comprising about 33% of Hillary’s voters.

  83. So it’s pretty much accepted that 2012 is Hillary v. Sarah?

    Pat’s so on board.

  84. Pat:

    I am sure the decision to release information about her daughter has had a predicted result. That said, if I was her daughter, I would prefer the public ridicule over allowing my mother to not take the nomination.

    If I was her kid, I couldn’t live with the guilt of costing my own mother this opportunity. It also appears that the family is strong and will support the daughter (I forgot her name ) .

    I personally am very proud that they have put the daughter out there. The WORST form of sexism IMHO is against young, unmarried mothers and that needs to be changed. People need to get over this crazy idea that young women ‘get themselves pregnant’.

    OUR FORMER PARTY is trying to hang the poor girl and her mother out to dry. The democrats, with the help of the media, are the problem here.

    Mary herself was an unwed teenage mother.

  85. FOX is reporting that McCain Camp is coming out today with nuclear and attacking “directly Obama” for all of this.

    Palin has the right to become the VP and the President. It has nothing to do with her character that the media and BO have launched this disgusting attack on their family. That is blaming the victim. So, let’s stop this now and put the blame where it belongs.


  86. Here’s a thought that’ll make you hide under the bed.”

    Somebody at another site predicted that something unexpected will happen before the election, but he said ha didn’t know what it would be or what effect it would have.

    His prediction bothered me because I agree with him But I’m not a psychic (although it sounds kinda like psychic) and I doubt he was.

    If there is one thing you can count on this year, it’s unexpected developments.

    Weird, bizarre developments no one has ever seem before are pretty much a daily thing.

    We live in interesting times.

  87. Carol, that’s really good to hear. I hope they kick BO’s a$$!

  88. I’m glad the McCain camp is hitting back hard. I wondered why they were being so quiet after their impeccable timing with ads so far in the GE. This feeding frenzy is deplorable. The transparent complicity of the media in trying to destroy this woman to elect Obama is even more rabid and aggressive than the CDS, because it has been unleashed just since Friday. It is a complete assault. And the Dems? I have lost all respect for them. They are loathsome. Daschle said Palin has “absolutely no experience?” The hypocrisy! I guess being a Governor is no longer a precursor to presidential qualifications. Even James Carville is in the shark tank. How can they sit there with a straight face and talk about her lack of credentials, when they are promoting Obama? I am so done with them.

    JAMES CARVILLE: “I just would make the point, is my family — I had five sisters. They’re all pro-life to the core. And they all would act in exactly the same way. That’s not the question. The question is, why would she be running for vice president? I mean this woman is almost absent qualifications for the job. I mean this is — she is — I’m willing to concede to the whole world that she’s a very committed pro-life person, that she’s an honorable person, that she’s a good mother. But that’s not the issue before the American people right now.” (CNN’s “Larry King Live,” 9/1/08)

    • Liberal Radio Host Ed Schultz Said That Gov. Palin Was An “Empty Pantsuit” Who Had Started A “Bimbo Alert.”

  89. Oh, Pat! Yes, I agree on the mother bear statement.

    I would have a HARD time passing by the ‘self sacrifice’ isle and heading to the ‘I believe in you, you are a strong girl and can handle this’ isle at the guilt store where I do my shopping.

  90. Pat,

    You’re probably right. Maybe they thought it wouldn’t be a big deal. After all, when Al Gore’s son got in trouble in 2000, no one called for Al to stop running for president. But McCain probably thought the Dems would respect the usual “rule” to lay off the children of politicians. They just didn’t realize how viscious the Obama campaign and supporters really are. Now they know.

    If Palin quits, will Obama then be the next President? I sure hope not.

  91. Is there nothing we can do to highlight the fraud of our votes not counting? We have attorneys on most sites. Have my civil liberties not been compromised?

    Is it possible to have a class action suit? I am not content to hope that BO loses in November. If he does, it will not be attributed to the electorate protesting the election. It will be attributed to racism. I can see a Diddy/Ludacris rant already.

    I would love to think the news outlets would do their job and expose the DNC. But to believe that if we just air the truth, they will run with it, is wishful thinking, in my opinion. That is not going to happen. They are all
    up in Alaska trying to figure out how many times Bristol had sex before she got pregnant.

    Every day I think I could not be more disgusted. And every day I am.

  92. I want a candidate with grit, I want verve – depth, knowledge, grace, a history of standing for my issues.

    Who is supporting “O”? The lotus eaters and the sheep.

    Gawd, after 8 years of Bu$hit – I am starved for character – no more Bu$hit. “O” is so vapid he sets my teeth on edge. Just seeing Pelosi, Dean, Brazile, et al, I get a gag reflex. When someone hands me *&@$poop – I reject it. Sorry – I’m ungracious, heh?

  93. I don’t think Palin is going anywhere short of an unexpected medical crisis.

    That woman’s a sticker.

  94. Let me put it this way: I am sick to death of the whole lot of them. Hillary included. All this drum beating on behalf of Obama is an out and out lie by those making these statements. He is not ready to lead. He is totally inexperienced. His campaign and surrogates are very off putting.

    I cannot stand McCain. And as for Sarah Palin, she has totally lost me. In my world, this people are shameless.

    As a result, I have nothing more to contribute. My views are slightly different and as much as I desire to see the end of the current DNC, there is nothing the Repugs offer to even come close to compensation. We have wasted our entire primary season on these 4 sorry excuses and there is no way I can continue to look for evidence that anyone of them is good for the country. Less trouble locating that proverbial needle in a haystack.

  95. When bloggers who used to brag about being part of the reality-based community are front paging a 24 year old DUI arrest by a candidate’s spouse, or reports he was registered 3rd party until 2 years ago, It’s not just disgusting, it’s disturbing and scary

  96. Pat, I would like to offer a counter opinion to your judgment of Palin. She has been a model of courage and defiance for her daughter, taking on the powers that be at the risk of losing her career. When she was a whistleblower against the Republican Party corruption, she had very little position in the state. It was more likely that he would be obliterated, but she did it anyway. The McCain camp knew about the daughter’s pregnancy, and I am sure they all discussed it. By not backing down to the character assassination, she is modeling strength and character for her daughter, and no doubt the entire family has circled the wagon to protect this young woman. That is a private family matter, and if they have come to an agreement about it, I don’t think we have the right to judge her qualifications as a mother.

  97. I was a young mother and believe me, the stigma remains. Even now, I am successful, have a decent career and make my own way, I still hear “You are 50 with a 32 year old daughter?” I had sex, my mother did not make that choice, I did. I had a child, my mother did not make have the child, so should my mother make concessions that will impact the rest of her life, because I made a dumb choice? I agree with Pat somewhat that Palin’s choice threw her daughter out there, but I have made so many choices that I “thought” were for the benefit of my children, and they look at me and scream sometimes “Mom, stop sacrificing for us and get a life!”

    Yes, Palin’s choice put her daughter in the spotlight, but that light will dim and her daughter may be stronger for it. I don’t know the answer, but I do know that it is time for women to say enough dammit!

  98. All this fuss about Bristol Palin shows me how crazy the Democratic party has become. I always thought that Democrats were more enlightened and open minded, that we somehow were more compassionate and allowing of differences. That whole concept has been blown out of my reality now.

    I for one will not judge Sarah Palin on this. I have no way of knowing what goes on inside her family. They have put up a cohesive and supportive front and that is more than many families get.

    The fact the John McCain asked Palin to run on his ticket, knowing these ‘issues’ is an action that should be liberating to women. Yes, you can have a family and you can be a professional, even the POTUS.

  99. The entire Republican party is closing ranks around Sarah Palin. For some reason just thinking about that makes me want to cry.

  100. correction: that SHE would be obliterated

  101. Yikes, that Carville quote is embarrassing.

    What’s this got to do with his sisters?

    And what are Obama’s qualifications, exactly? After all this time, I still haven’t heard one.

  102. Jeralyn (among others ) seem to think that if a candidate admits they have offspring the kids are then fair game

  103. Another point–when will Obama and all the other male candidates start getting the same questions about being a father and holding office at the same time? Joe Biden lost his wife and daughter in a terrible car accident shortly after he ran for Senator. He was then a single father with traumatized children. He continue to work as a Senator every day and no one attacked him for it.

    It’s the sexism that bothers me. Would there be the same attacks if Palin had a son who had impregnated his girlfriend?

  104. Of course it does Regency. It’s called respect and loyalty, and it magnifies the betrayal of the Dems of one of their greatest assets. Someone who has served the Party all her life. Now I feel like crying too.

  105. Very good point BBoomer. Shouldn’t he have been home taking care of those traumatized children? But he has The Man of the house.

  106. BB: I don’t see how they could have missed the horrible depths the New Democratic Party will go for a good smear. There is something else going on here – and I think it might have to do with family privacy and the right to life position.

  107. fif, yes.

  108. Dang all the typos–I need coffee!

  109. Kim,

    Thanks for your perspective.

  110. Fox News apparently confirms that Sarah Palin’s SS number has been stolen.

    Nuttiness, it really is.

  111. Megan Kelley is really pissed! She is all over it!

    It’s time. There are good people that have finally come to the rescue of this woman.

    Prove it is BO!

  112. It is really concerning to me what BO will do in retribution
    for not voting for him. I can see his controlling,
    ruthless personality. And he does not seem to have a
    problem suppressing free speech either.
    There will be only two major candidates to choose from,
    one will become POTUS.
    McCain is a moderate. I’ll take him anytime over BO.
    I’ll forget Mac has an R in front of his campaign, and will vote
    moderate this time.

  113. Pat, with all due respect, you are wrong. Every woman in history who has broken a barrier has had to do it amidst cries of how she was evil for “putting her family through the nasty attacks and horrible pressures sure to follow.”

    And yes, the “bad mommy” frame you are using is indeed extremely sexist. Bristol Palin has done nothing shameworthy, and for you to say her mother should hide her away and give up her aspirations because some OTHER people are going to find it shameworthy and attack her for it is just dead wrong.

    You do not battle these bastards by shrinking away and conceding to feel shame because they have told you you should. You have NO idea what conversations Sarh Palin and her family had together concerning this. Bristol is, after all, almost 18. For all you know, she fervently begged her mother to “Go for it, mom!”

    I find your sitting in judgement on this mother very troublesome, and completely unfair. I love ya, Pat, but you’re wrong on this. The blame belongs on those attacking, and NO ONE else.

  114. Wow , remember KO and Matthews stayed late and worked overtime when they thought the Clinton’s might have something to do with the PassPort breakin.

    Now, where are those Asswipes?

  115. it’s disturbing and scary

    It really is myiq. They do realize, don’t they, that the HUSBAND is not running for VP? This is Inquisition territory now. Such desperation.

  116. McCain’s not going to take this shit! It is a good day for America!

  117. myiq: I don’t know what happened at TL. BTD is taking a week off…?

    Maybe Jeralyn is pissed that she didn’t hold back on the KoolAid now that an alternative exists?

  118. “The Left are scared shitless of this woman!”

  119. The obamabots will do anything. Releasing Palin’s SS number, HOW LOW.

  120. Bristol’s boyfriend is going to be there tonight! Good for them. Stick it right in their face and then let’s see how has balls.

  121. You do not battle these bastards by shrinking away and conceding to feel shame because they have told you you should.

    WMCB: That is exactly what they want, and why they are doing it with such feverish intensity. One of the key memes they are pushing right now is: when will McCain bump her from the ticket, and “that will destroy his candidacy.” They saw her as a severe threat, frantically sought something to use against her, and then found something to sink their teeth into. I hope they STAND as Maya Angelou praised Hillary for doing. This behavior is every bit as bad as anything Richard Mellon Scaife ever served up.

  122. Obamanation is caught in an echo chamber.

    They don’t listen to or respect anyone besides themselves, and they’re deranged lunatics.

    They have disabed negative feedback, so no one can tell them how they look to normal, reasonable grown-ups.

  123. Megan Kelley is really pissed! She is all over it!

    Carol, I saw her last night on Fox, and she was great! She was so fiesty and furious about the double standard. Of course, O’Reilly was very patronizing and cut her off, but she kept right on going, and insisted that women need to stick up for each other (and gave the power fist sign).

  124. fif:There will be blowback for years into the future as well

  125. What Obama and his surrogates are doing, is just another …..OFF THE TABLE…..promise. we can add to his….OFF THE TABLE…..list. Lets see now……..Wife’s …he then trashs Cindy McCain for being to rich……..Race card…..then gets caught, using it……etc…..etc……etc. And now family members.

  126. The reason the media is so viciously pushing the SLUT! SHAME! BAD MOTHER! meme is because they know damn well that most families in America very much relate to the Palin family.

    In 2005, a full 37% of American children were born out of wedlock. I suspect it is even higher now in 2008.

    The Obama campaign is SCARED.

  127. I wonder if they can source the theft of her SS. Does that mean they can get into her medical records etc. There needs to be a massive backlash against this. Now do people see what kind of a presidency we would have under Obama? A fascist state indeed.

  128. What is the power fist sign?

  129. fif — We were watching her too. I just said the exact same thing “She is seriously pissed” to mister.

    I think that CDS provided some cover to Obama for what went on in the spring. They don’t have that cover now, but they’re too used to getting away with it. They’ve gone too far, now.

    Also, Beckle just found out that Obama is going on O’Riley and he took it like a punch to the gut. He was stunned.

  130. Hillary-zilla, and all the while, Obama stands back, and uses the same crap we saw with Hillary: “I do not condone these tactics. I think families should be off-bounds.” The Talking Heads are praising his nobility. AS IF Axelrod is not up to his eyeballs in this. Remember the RFK videos they disseminated to 1,000 media contacts?

  131. Riverdaughter: I am glad that you, Ladyboomer NYC, and others are doing your best to get this story out. True, the DNC might well counter that as a private organization it can follow or not follow its rules, as it wishes. However, I think the PUBLIC component here, i.e. the state funding that goes toward running primaries and caucuses, as you point out, could be leverage. Attorneys out there — get creative!

  132. Thanks Riverdaughter! This has to have been the most eye -opening year of my life since fleeing SA as a political exile in 1972. Never in my wildest dreams did I imagine these kind of fascist tactics being used in the USA. The most frightening aspect of course, are the millions who still cling to the “hope-in-a- bottle” that’s being foisted on them , and refuse to understand that they’ve been set up, sold out and worse, turned into zombies. They (the one’s who refuse to listen) are the one’s headed for the hardest fall! Shame on the DNC!

  133. Pat Johnson, I generally agree with your positions, but, I don’t on this. Why should you have to turn down a job, a position, a political opportunity because the MSM and bloggers smear you and your family? They are the ones that should be vilified and shamed. Families unless their is corruption, nepotism, real crimes that affect, etc. must be off limits. My hope is that this so backfires on the MSM, those bloggers and Obama and his cohorts, that this never again raises its ugly and vile head.

    Repeat, families and particularly children (especially, those under 18), must not be apart of this type of smear campaigning. I believe that it is up to us to ensure that this particular vileness is stopped. Sarah Palin and any other persons should not have to decline a position because of the fear of their children being caught in this garbage. I urge everyone of you to write Letters to the Editor decrying this type of behavior and continue to resist it by every means in our power (non-violent of course).

  134. Fist in the air: “Power to the people!”

  135. WMCB: Interesting, isn’t it. I think AA’s have a higher incidence of unwed mothers than other groups. I wonder how his supporters feel about this hysteria.

  136. I don’t care for Palin, because I don’t like conservative repub politics. The attacks on her because of her family dynamics are distasteful. WomenCountPac has put out a statement/fundraising piece which in essence states that although they don’t agree with Palin’s politics, they will take a stand against the sexism that is being piled on her. I agree with them.

  137. Coming up on Fox News, in an election between Hillary and Sarah, who would win?

    My money’s on Joan of Arc in a pantsuit (h/t Ani).

  138. This is an excellent post and thread.

    I think Palin bears watching to see how much “ambition” driven she is and how much “conviction” driven she is. I don’t know.

    For me Hillary is still OK in the sense that she is repeatedly outlining her agenda (co-opted by The One) and then saying this is why we need Barack Obama. She’s advocating for her agenda. It’s her agenda that we need. OK, we need her too. And because of a corrupt Democratic (sic) Party, we must settle for her role as a senator rather than possibly the best president ever. Quite a loss.

    I feel troubled by three things:

    The Democratic (sic) Party squeezed and cheated Clinton (the best candidate) out of the nomination.

    We are faced with a choice at the top made by the monied interests, not the people.

    I am considering Nothing on Top or not voting for the first time in my life. I have valued voting as a right, a duty, a privilege and a source of pride. Now it’s an irrelevancy. I’m definitely not over that.

  139. myiq2xu,

    I can not got to TL anymore. When I first found her blog, it was like a refuge…now, it it like the DNC, no room for opposing opinions. Get on that unity train, even thought the depot it is heading to is uncertain at best.

    I can not believe how some of my favorite posters are treated over there now.

    I wonder, is the side effect of supporting a candidate like Obama (whose convictions and principles are difficult to discern when you look at his actions) turn one into a Brownshirt automatically, or does it slowly overtake a person?

  140. Obama:

    Trashed Hillary – no one did anything.
    Trashed Chelsea – no one did anything.
    Trashed Female Supporters of Hillary – no one did anything.
    Trashed Cindy – McCain Fought Back.
    Trashing Paling – MicCain Fight Back.



  141. http://www.democrats.org/a/2007/02/in_support_of_a.php

    “In Support of Accurate, Open, Transparent Elections in the United States of America

    The following resolution was adopted by the DNC Resolutions Committee at its meeting on February 1, 2007, in conjunction with the meetings of the Democratic National Committee, February 1-3, 2007.

    Submitted by:
    Donna Brazile, At-Large/DC
    Mike Honda, DNC Vice Chair/California
    Susan Turnbull, DNC Vice Chair/Maryland
    Steven K. Alaria, California
    Donna Branch-Gilby, Vice Chair, Arizona
    Kalyn Free, Oklahoma
    Renee’ Gill Pratt, Louisiana
    Ben Jeffers, At-Large/Louisiana
    Ben Johnson, At-Large/DC
    Terry Lierman, Chair, Maryland
    Betty McElderry, Oklahoma
    James Metcalfe, Chair, Alaska
    Christine Pelosi, California
    John A. Perez, California
    James Roosevelt, Jr., At-Large/Massachusetts

    Resolution in Support of Accurate, Open, Transparent Elections in the United States of America.”

    Ha, ha!

  142. WomenCountPac has put out a statement/fundraising piece which in essence states that although they don’t agree with Palin’s politics, they will take a stand against the sexism that is being piled on her.

    That is good news.

  143. Wow, what is with Jerelyn? In her post, she acts as if getting pregnant outside of marriage is “sinful” and something to be ashamed of. What world is she living in? When I was in HS in the ’60s, many girls in my school got pregnant. Some of them got married and still graduated. That was in the days before easily available birth control and abortion. Now, in 2008, Jerelyn wants to return to the days of shaming unwed mothers? Give me a break!!!

  144. Got to get some sleep ….later…..hurry November..

  145. “Why should you have to turn down a job, a position, a political opportunity because the MSM and bloggers smear you and your family?”

    Hillary and Palin have become Women for All Seasons

  146. When I first heard that McCain selected Palin, my immediate reaction was that it was a brilliant pick.

    I knew the Obots would go after her, and I knew it would cause a backlash

    But I never expected them to head straight into tinfoil hat territory. The Obots have no idea how bad they look right now. And it’s not like no one is trying to tell them.

    They are throwing huge chunks of red meat to the GOP base that until now was almost apathetic about this election.

    And in many of the conservative regions of the country, they are VERY protective of their wimminfolk

    You know, the red states, and the rural/blue collar places like Ohio, PA, etc.

    If you went after the family if the NJ governor that way you would find Tony Soprano and Pauly Walnuts waiting for you when you came home.

  147. Leisa wrote: “I wonder, is the side effect of supporting a candidate like Obama (whose convictions and principles are difficult to discern when you look at his actions) turn one into a Brownshirt automatically, or does it slowly overtake a person?”

    It certainly seems that way. And that is why I do believe that ObamaNation is a cult. Back at DK, I used to try to get people to stop saying that because I thought it was insulting. That was before I heard about Camp Obama and the way the campaign was using bloggers to spread their propaganda. Now I’m convinced that this “movement” has all the characteristics of cult. And cults can induce sudden personality changes in vulnerable people. It appears that Jerelyn has finally succumbed.

  148. Eggplant, on September 3rd, 2008 at 10:51

    “Resolution in Support of Accurate, Open, Transparent Elections in the United States of America.”


    Should read: “Resolution in Support of Accurate, Open, Transparent Elections in the United States of America except when it interferes with our agenda.”

  149. bostonboomer, the Left are the new puritans, evidently. The hypocrisy is astounding, just astounding.

    I am dead serious when I say that the Democratic party as a whole has some DEEP pathology regarding women. The Republicans have plain old garden variety sexism, and plenty of it, but I have NEVER seen the sheer buckets of pus coming out of the right toward women that I have seen coming out of the Left this year.

    Democrats have much more contempt for women than the Republicans do, that is a demonstrable fact, and that has been an eye-opener for me.

  150. BB: No, I don’t think that is Jerelyn’s position at all – that is why her current ‘talk’ is so gross. I have every confidence that she would be all over defending BIDEN if the SAME EXACT THING was happening in his family.

  151. Leisa:

    The other day Jeralyn was basically arguing that Palin was guilty until proven innocent,

    Thats is kinda weird coming from a criminal defense attorney

  152. Jeralyn removed The Confluence and Anglachel’s Journal from her blogroll.

  153. WMCB,

    You are so right about the Democrats and woman-hating. Maybe it’s because they have been *pretending* to support women’s rights for years. Then when Hillary tried to run for President, all the repressed hatred just spewed out and they couldn’t keep up the pretense. I honestly don’t know if I can ever vote for another male Democrat. I’ll have to wait and see. But I don’t know if I can do it.

  154. I may just do some oppo research. How many sitting Democrats who are MALE have kids who fathered or mothered a child out of wedlock? How about kids with drug problems? Drinking problems?

    Let’s make a list! Then we can start screaming for them all to resign. While we’re at it, let’s include the media in that. How many of the talking heads have kids who have gotten in trouble in one way or another? Let’s make a list!


  155. I’ve been a dem since I was ten (repub parents–ick).
    But, I feel I have to vote McCain. Palin into the mix makes it tougher (for a day or two I was going to sit Nov. out).
    But then I caught more of the Obama carnival and I am firm that I have to vote McCain. I don’t like it… but it feels necessary. I feel that there is an opportunity for dialogue with repubs on many issues that I find them
    really abhorrent for. But you know what? I don’t feel like there is any room for dialogue with Obama. Obama has cheated his way through and the dem party has paved the way. That cannot go unaddressed.
    We know what the worse case scenario is with McCain… just more of the same repub foolishness. With Obama the worst case scenario is limitless. He is a self-glorifying dirty pol and our party has turned to unmitigated corruption.

    Thank you RD for this post. I expect when the truth comes out, all our hair will curl.

  156. As for BTD, based on his history, I think he’ll have a hard time knuckling under to Jerelyn’s new viewpoint. He didn’t knuckle under to Markos when he was threatened with being banned. He left rather than sign onto the “roolz.” It will be interesting to see what he does now. I do believe that his defense of Hillary against the misogeny was sincere.

  157. WMCB:

    It’s like watching someone you have known for decades suddenly change into someone you not only don’t know, but don’t want to know.

    It’s about as shocking as having your city council announce proudly that your city is hosting the NAMBLA annual convention

  158. John Cole called what the Obots are doing “panty-sniffing.”

    When John Cole thinks the Obots have gone too far, that should set off a few warning flashers.

  159. angelasmith, EXACTLY:We know what the worse case scenario is with McCain… just more of the same repub foolishness. With Obama the worst case scenario is limitless. He is a self-glorifying dirty pol and our party has turned to unmitigated corruption.

    Obama wants an Imperial presidency, period. Why would I not think that, when he has demanded an Imperial primary and an Imperial convention?

    McCain is a safer choice for me, hard as that is to fathom. He might pass some shitty policies, but he is not going to undo the foundations of democracy and representation. McCain is not Bush in that regard. I think he respects the voter, and our system of government. Obama is MUCH more like Bush in that regard – and seems to have the potential to be even worse.

  160. How many sitting Democrats who are MALE have kids who fathered or mothered a child out of wedlock? How about kids with drug problems? Drinking problems?

    WMCB: I have one name for you: Kennedy. That should keep you busy for awhile.

  161. McCain is a safer choice for me, hard as that is to fathom. He might pass some shitty policies, but he is not going to undo the foundations of democracy and representation. McCain is not Bush in that regard. I think he respects the voter, and our system of government. Obama is MUCH more like Bush in that regard – and seems to have the potential to be even worse.

    WMCB: we are in agreement yet again.

  162. If McCain/Palin win, I think that it will be good for America to see a working mom in the 2nd most high profile job of the country. That is a secondary barrier that needs to be broken.

    I am currently a stay-at-home mom, but when my first child was 3 wks old, I had to go back to work, part-time. I remember two comments from women: “Well, if’s really that important to you….” and “Wow, it looks like you bit off more than you can chew.” I believe that women have to stand up for all women’s right to make choices: to have a career or not, to be a Dem or Republican, etc.

    Some people are ambitious. Hillary is. I do not see what is wrong with that. Blind ambition is probably something rather different and related to some sort of pathology. I think we should stand back and let Palin speak for herself before attributing that kind of motivation to her. (Pat J., I have acquired a deep respect for you, I just disagree with you on this one.)

  163. for those of you already contemplating a Palin v Clinton race in ’12, this might interest you: from rasmussen

    Tonight, Sarah Palin’s speech may be the most important of the convention. Twelve percent (12%) of Americans now say that Palin is Very Likely to be the first woman elected President of the United States. Another 26% say that outcome is somewhat likely. For comparison, 14% say Hillary Clinton is very likely to become the first woman President and another 34% say it is somewhat likely. In a head-to-head match-up, Clinton leads Palin by eleven

  164. WMCB, on September 3rd, 2008 at 11:13 am

    Well said!

  165. Until I read Jerelyn’s post, I didn’t know that Bristol’s fiance is going to appear with her at the convention. I think that is a good thing. Politicians families are in the spotlight, and Palin is already governor of a state, so it can’t be new to them. But I do admire her for having this young man be with Bristol at this time.

    I am really opposed to shaming people for having sex, even though I think young teens should be encouraged to wait. But at 17, many many kids have had sex already. That is one of the reasons I *used to be* a Democrat–because I thought Democrats were more open-mineded. My sister married at 18, and I was worried for her. I didn’t shun her. My sister-in-law married even younger than that and, again, I was worried for her. But today she has two very happy, successful children and two wonderful grandchildren.

    I believe in *live and let live* and I’m not going to change my belief for any politician. If Jerelyn and the rest of the Obamabots want to do that, let them. There will be a terrible backlash for what they are doing to Sarah Palin and for what they did to Hillary.

    Meanwhile, I’m sticking to my core values and beliefs. I won’t join any cult.

  166. O/T: Could the difference between the DNC stage/Obama’s temple and McCain’s setup be any starker? The visual symbolism is striking.

  167. Thanks BB, this feels like 2004 all over again to me, only Obama is Bush.

    Myiq2xu, Jeralyn is on disconnect. She needs a vacation away from it all. Maybe then she will find clarity, but that unity potion is strong. I wonder if it causes permanent damage? So much for her practice is she is willing to spout things like being guilty until proven innocent in defense of sexist smears against Palin that designed to prop up Obama… Yep, throw away your principles Jeralyn. What is she thinking? oops… I forgot, thinking is not allowed on the unity train.

    KB, Jeralyn just removed some of the smartest Democrats fighting for democracy and our party from her blog roll. Oh well, I ‘hope’ she comes to her senses. I guess she can throw away her principles and try to convince people that Joe Biden is a champion of womens rights… Yeah, Anita Hill will really thank you for it, Jeralyn.

    I will not give TL my traffic anymore.

  168. WMCB, I keep reading your comments and nodding in agreement on all of them.

  169. Some guy on the airplane coming home from Denver told me that the American taxpayer gave money to both parties to help fund their conventions.

    I wish I was a lawyer. I go after the Democratic Party chairmen of any state that had laws stateing that the delegates must vote as pledged and make them prove they voted honestly – produce the secret ballets and affidavits. Then if the state chairmen did not do their duty by the citizens of their states then I would go after the national Democratic Party to reimburse the state for half the costs of the primary.

    I would be their biggest nightmare, they would envy the Catholic Church.

  170. I also feel that I am between a rock and a hard place concerning this election. I have never voted for the Republican candidate for president. I now live in Illinois in a very Republican county.

    I do not like either choice. I will probably decide to vote for McCain as a protest vote if it is clear that Obama will carry the state. I may vote for McCain if it helps Obama lose his adopted state and is an embarrassment in the overwhelming loss I expect it to be. I’m not very happy about having Sen. Durbin up for re-election this year. I’m mad at him for encouraging Obama to run before getting more experience.

    I am angry at the DNC because they thought that they could get away with what they did to Hillary because she was a woman.

    And I don’t hold it against Hillary for supporting this inexperienced, arrogant lout because she must preserve her options for the future. And it may be a hard thing for her and Bill to be put into supporting roles instead of being the star. If she and Bill can view this as time to prepare for 2012, it may be worth the wait for all of us.

    By designing a system of checks and balances a Democratic Congress might be able to limit the damage a Pres. McCain can do. And it will be President McCain once the Republican attack machine brings out Bill Ayers, Bernadine
    Dohrn and all the other skeletons in Barack’s closet. (Has a presidential candidate every been replaced? What are the procedures?)

    Myiq, I loved watching the “West Wing,” because it showed what a president could do and that policy is important. It was also my hope that it could encourage peolpe to expect more from their politicans.

  171. Betty, on September 3rd, 2008 at 11:26 am Said:

    I would be their biggest nightmare, they would envy the Catholic Church.



  172. What got me about Jeralyn and Tchris is the way they are trying to hype and spin everying so that it sounds positive for Obama, no matter how minor or unsabstantiatted

    Lord help Todd Palin if he has any unpaid parking tickets

  173. West Wing is the reason I love politics. Sadly, like politics, it eventually descended into a trite sentimentality I couldn’t follow. I was for the Republican in the end, I was for the cranky old widower, Arnie Vinnick. Matt Santos held no appeal for me. He was cocky with few accomplishments. I wasn’t interested.

  174. Gary,

    I myself would love to help Palin bust that glass ceiling this year, and then see she and Hillary BOTH top of their tickets in 2012. As a woman, I would be BURSTING with pride. Imagine – would that not be the biggest blow ever to the misogyny haters, if BOTH tickets were women, and there was no man they could prop up with sexism?

  175. Kudos RD – and down with the 2008 DNC!

    You didn’t count our votes – then don’t count on me in November.

    Voter Fraud is NOT the way to win an election, didn’t we learn that lesson in 2000?

  176. I have a long list of things the Democrats have done in this election that have pissed me off. But right at the top (along with the knife job done on Hillary) is the theft of my vote at the convention. Hillary stomped Obama in the Arkansas primary, and the delegates vote unanimously for him! I’m really mad that the person who called me from the Arkansas Democratic Party did so before the delegate vote; I would have been a whole lot less courteous than I was.

    As for voting for down ticket Dems, it will depend on how much they backed Hillary (Sen. Pryor–the male) or how quickly they turned tail and ran (Sen. Lincoln–the female). It’s almost like the female Democratic politicians have taken on the characteristics of the black widow spider but with a twist–they protect the unqualified male and eat the qualified female.

  177. […] Wednesday: It matters who counts the votes (by riverdaughter at The Confluence) Last Wednesday morning, a vote was held in Denver in the hotels of the state delegations.  Later that afternoon, a “roll call” was held in the convention center and Barack Obama was hailed as our new nominee.  The funny thing is, those of us who remember what the primary results were in some of our states could not reconcile our memories with the way our delegations actually voted… What we know of the vote last Wednesday is that Hillary actually received more than 1900 delegates before the counting was stopped.  We have been told that the delegate count was getting too close for Pelosi et al to explain away… [N]o one who witnessed this should feel any less outraged and those who participated in the fraud should never expect unity. There will never be any resolution to this primary season. […]

  178. “OldCoastie, on September 3rd, 2008 at 8:42 am Said:
    Good Morning, rd… 1st day of school! (time for coffee here on the west coast)

    perhaps Gloria Allred will help us with a lawsuit?”

    I’m all for that. Wasn’t Gloria a Hillary supporter? I am really very angry that my vote went to BO. I went to my polling place and pressed the button for Hillary…as did 70+ % of my State. The DNC had no right to switch my vote. They also had no right to award 4 delegates from Michigan, legally certified for Clinton, to BO…as well as awarding him the remainder of voters who did not vote. What a sham….and they should be sued. That may be the only way to get rid of a corrupt system.

  179. I remember reading that Michelle Obama was VERY angry with Obama because he was never around and she was raising their two kids solo. Didn’t she say she didn’t sign up for this. Being a “single” parent, that is.

  180. Hey all! Came across this and thought you would like to see it (Rudi Guiliani CBS’ The Early Show this morning):

    Mayor Rudy Giuliani: “Barack Obama has never governed a city, never governed a state, never governed an agency, never run a military unit, never run anything. Sarah Palin has been a mayor. She’s been a governor. She has a record of reform. She has a record of leadership. She’s run a budget. So, why are all these questions for her? Has anybody ever asked Barack Obama, can you bring up your two kids and be president of the United States? They are asking ‘can she be vice president and be a mother?’ Come on.”

    CBS’ Maggie Rodriguez: “So you’re saying you have no doubt and mothers shouldn’t either, that she can do it?

    Mayor Giuliani: “Where are the feminists? I mean is it just the early feminist groups? Where are they?”

    Rodriguez: “I think they are fair questions. It’s a lot to judge.”

    Mayor Giuliani: “They are questions. I don’t know if they’re fair questions. You can ask any question you want, then to designate it as a fair question. You know, can you be a mother and be a vice president? We’ve had a lot of fathers run for president and no one has ever asked them, ‘can you be a father and be president?’ Don’t tell me there isn’t a difference there.”

  181. I think it is a leap to presume that SP’s ambition trumped her daughter’s need for privacy.

    If this girl is made of the same stuff that her mother is she may have been the one to encourage her mother to forge ahead. No one knows the family dynamics and what discussions took place prior to SP’s acceptance.

    It is to her credit, and to her daughter’s, that they seemingly find no shame in the situation. What would it say about either of these two woman if they felt it was necessary to hide the pregnancy?

    The news about the pregnancy will be off the front page soon replaced by a new scandal.

  182. We got screwed out of a president our country needs.

  183. BPD,

    that’s very interesting. I’m pleased Giuliani (whom I personally do not like, but I imagine is a hero to many) can articulately sock it to the media actors. Someone on this blog said a few days ago that the so-called reporters and analysts are just paid actors. I’m inclined to agree, but this is sort of odd – it’s not clear to me, as much as Rupert Murdoch think BO is a rockstar, that he’s supporting said BO for POTUS. I’m inclined to think that, as self-seen stars and starlets, the hip and cool media are not what they see as the hip and cool candi-dude, and how silly of anyone to disagree or argue with them. Campbell Brown (whine, whine, whine) for example, does not seem to imagine that a right-thinking person could have a point of view different from hers.

    That’s why, IMHO, BO has such a good shot at this – simply, he’s a media darling.

    Good, though, for Giuliani .

  184. Thanks for this article. The DNC is an outrage. I cannot condone their un-democratic practices. Maybe this is what always went on and I was not paying attention before. But I am now! Perhaps the national enquirer will print this article – who would have thought they would be more responsible than MSNBC? As the MSM is biased in favor of Obama, we might as well be living in one of the third world countries. People around the world are watching and calling us idiots – spreading democracy? We need to learn to practice it here. P.S. The only kind of election Obama knows is one where you steal the election. That is how he got all of the “elected” offices he has held. He does not know how to win any other way, so he condoned this type of behavior. A leopard doesn’t change its spots.

  185. We’ll remember in November!

    And beyond – how can anyone think this is ok? Don’t they realize that when the dust settles Obama will closely resemble G.W. Bush during the 2000 election? Don’t they realize the kind of long lasting grudge they are heaping upon themselves – from their BASE!

    Unreal. Yet sooo the reality.

  186. Yeah. Rotten to the CORE, RD. And she is part of that — I can hardly look at her face without thinking of Cindy Sheehan,


    Well, last night I watched Fred Thompson give a speech about McC and it moved me to tears. Because it’s true. He’s a hero. He’ll get us out of this stupid Bushco war, keep us safe — you know what one of the searches brought up yesterday chez moi?

    “f#ck you white feminists”
    well, guess what I say ?
    “f#ck you Democratic Party”

    I hope McC reforms it. He’ll take on all the corruption on BOTH sides. It’s going to be great. I’m still, like all of us so dissapointed about Hillary — and as far as I am concerned there isn’t a decent MALE DEM to be found.


    Republicans may not be like us, but McC? REFORMS!

    hugs, growls & !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



  188. Great post, RD. I understand some of the sentiments here – we’ve been put in a difficult situation as far as voting. I abhorred the 2000 and 2004 election process; I felt, at the time, that Gore and Kerry should have fought harder for what was right. Fast forward to 2008, and I am stunned that my own party is as vicious and corrupt as “they” are. The only thing I know to do is not vote on top and vote “downticket” to keep things in order. That’s what I will do. For protest, I may write in Hill’s name.

    As far as Bristol Palin, I don’t see anything wrong with Sarah accepting the nomination. I am sure it was discussed with Bristol and as a family. If Bristol is anything like my daughter, she is a strong person who would be more offended that her mother didn’t take the job because of her.

    It amazes me that so much attention is given to this, It is so blatantly political by BO camp that it makes my stomach turn. Some people prefer to turn a blind eye pretending that sex is not going on with teens – it is continually forced upon them daily through media – music, movies, internet. We as a society do nothing about it and then scream when something goes wrong as though we didn’t know. (I use “we” metaphorically; not all of us, of course.) I could go on and on forever about this subject, but I take out an important book and read passages when I get all fired up about it: “It Takes a Village to Raise a Child” by Hillary Rodham Clinton

  189. Cynthia McKinney looks good to me as a candidate. Theoretically my state of CT is blue, but with Lieberman supporting McCain, who knows. So I don’t know what I’d do if it got close. I was going to sit it out, and not vote for POTUS, but only down-ticket. But then someone reminded me that if I haven’t checked a box in that category, someone could do it for me. And it isn’t like I trust the Obamatrons.


    I say let’s not get mad at Hillary, since that is clearly a victory for Obama. I wish she’d stop taking his crap, too, but she needs the Democratic Party. We don’t.

  190. I am a newcomer to The Confluence, and have been lurking for about four days, and have been immensely inspired, but this whole argument about Palin’s wholesale ambition getting in the way of her daughter’s privacy is rather bogus. Yes, as savvy political operatives, she, McCain, and the RNC, were probably well aware of the potential media frenzy to follow the announcerment of her candidacy, but shouldn’t the blame for this “media frenzy” be placed on those conducting the “media frenzy?” Not the victim.

    And as some have pointed out here, it is quite possible that the Palin family indeed did vet this exposure issue in full knowledge of what would happen, and concluded that “life would go on” after the bloodthirsty media barbarians were finally quenched, and then dismissed by the public after being allowed to show the world what it truly means to hold to one’s own family values and strength of character.

    Let’s face it. The people at this blog wish to send Obama back to from where he came. Perhaps the Palin family feels exactly the same way. I don’t think any of us will ever know the true motivations here of why Gov. Palin did not decline the invitation to join McCain, but perhaps, as an evangelical the idea to create an exciting enough ticket to do just what many PUMAs want to do was more than enough motivation. Gods will and all that…

    But I must admit that to see Bristol Palin up on that stage (in photos only), she doesn’t seem to be “eating it up” as the saying goes.

    I hope my intrusion ruffles no one here, and while I am a lifelong registered Independent in my early 50s, married male, uh, do have I to say white, but yes, I have tended to vote Republican or third party exclusively ev’ry four years, and with the addition of Palin, I am convinced to do so again, because I share the same moral outrage with what has happened to the democratic process exemplified by the collusion of the Obamacrux and the MSM as the PUMA Nation itself seems to be…

    Best to all of you in this movement, and welcome to the Radical Center!

    McCain/Palin ’08

  191. RD: This is a terrific article! I hope it is widely read!

  192. Completely agree that Palin should have accepted the nomination and should GO FOR IT. Her daughter is almost a grown woman, and, besides, what message does it send these lunatics? That qualified women can be forced out of power and the limelight by a bunch of screeching trolls?

    I am no longer a Democrat. They have acted beyond the pale on this.

  193. Overt is better than covert and I believe that this whole debacle is a blessing – the DNC is out in the open.

    But I don’t want to wait until November – right now I’m very frustrated not having something to move us toward some resolution of this horrendous abuse.

    Sending $ to reduce Hill’s debt is certainly something I and others – hopefully all of you have done but I too Myiq am getting annoyed with the Clinton camp – perhaps more frustration from no knowing what they are doing. You’re right – they aren’t going to pay her anything towards the debt – they are simply can’t get over themselves – are extremely angry right now because they can’t figure out how to get past the Palin non-issue. What century are they from anyway?

    RD will a write in for Hill in NJ go to Obama?

  194. Right, and when Pelosi didn’t even wait for the “no” votes of objection that BO be the nominee. grrrr. I need to be reset to factory default to stop replaying that one in my mind. Actually, the “Pelosi nomination resolution” bears being made into a clip. Double take.

    I guess you could say that one good result we have gotten as a movement is to make the DNC act even more obviously obnoxious, which is easier for more people to spot. We cannot stop the pressure. What am I saying? I need to get back to life as usual. Someone remind me: umm, what is that?

  195. I’ve been getting solicitation letters from the Obama campiagn and the DNC – at first I threw them out – then I realized that it appeared that they would be paying for my beliefs through their prepaid envelope so I’ve been sending them a friendly little message that since they threw away my original vote I guess they no longer find any value in what I think.
    Yes, it’s only .42 each, but so far I’ve managed to spend $2.10 of their money in only three days.
    Simple things tend to add up. If you opt to use this means of information keep it clean, friendly and enlightening.

  196. […] Wednesday: It matters who counts the votes (by riverdaughter at The Confluence) Last Wednesday morning, a vote was held in Denver in the hotels of the state delegations. Later that afternoon, a “roll call” was held in the convention center and Barack Obama was hailed as our new nominee. The funny thing is, those of us who remember what the primary results were in some of our states could not reconcile our memories with the way our delegations actually voted… What we know of the vote last Wednesday is that Hillary actually received more than 1900 delegates before the counting was stopped. We have been told that the delegate count was getting too close for Pelosi et al to explain away… [N]o one who witnessed this should feel any less outraged and those who participated in the fraud should never expect unity. There will never be any resolution to this primary season. […]

  197. I think this is an important thing for voters to consider.

    If you visit http://www.dncbloggers.com/, if you look in the upper right hand corner I’ve included a permanent link to this post.

  198. The DNC disgusts me.

    I’ve been saying that a lot now, but they disgusted me even more when they decided to use a widow’s grief for political gain — I’m talking about Mrs. Gwatney. We all know that Bill Gwatney was in favor of Senator Clinton and we all know Chairman Gwatney was murdered.

    The Arkansas delegation was demoralized. Mrs. Gwatney should not have been the head of it, because she was forced to do something her husband was adamantly against.

    I am a widow and I feel very badly for Mrs. Gwatney.

    As for New Jersey and Florida and any other state that voted for Senator Clinton _other than Arkansas_, where extenuating circumstances were clearly in play due to the murder of Chairman Gwatney, I am enraged.

    How dare they waste our money, time, and votes on this travesty?

    As for Obama, I will never support him, but I cannot support McCain either due to his nasty anti-choice ad (now airing in WI, where I’m from). I like Sarah Palin even though many of her views are contrary to my own, and I’m glad she’s McCain’s choice as VP; I think a little better of McCain for it. But I cannot support him.

    The DNC is flawed, corrupt, and has been extremely vicious to Senator Clinton. I do not approve of them. And I am completely and utterly disgusted.

    Damn you, DNC, for throwing this election away!

  199. Wanted to add one more thing — bring on the lawsuits! Please!

  200. Just catching up on the comments here and I am absolutely floored that CBS asked Guiliani about whether or not Palin can be a mom and a VP. What a time warp! I thought that this was 2008 not 1950!

  201. Joanelle said: “then I realized that it appeared that they would be paying for my beliefs through their prepaid envelope so I’ve been sending them a friendly little message that since they threw away my original vote I guess they no longer find any value in what I think.”

    You do know that those pre-paid envelopes can be used to mail things larger than what would fit in the envelope, right? Just tape the envelope to your item of choice, but I’d advise you to keep it realistic and in good, relevant humor (manilla envelope full of hole-punch “hanging chad”?) and not try something like a bundle of bricks. And no, that doesn’t mean that they’re billed only 42 cents for the mailing of your package.

    Years ago, a friend was getting a lot of junk mail from a particular source who wouldn’t take her off their junk mail list despite repeated requests. She started emailing them boxes of old newspaper, old auto parts, etc. with their prepaid envelopes, and it didn’t take a month before she was off the list.

    BTW, this is my first post here, so I have to say my saved-up comment: RD, good for you, on “the sisterhood of the travelling pant suit”!

  202. Someone please let our group know how we can participate in P.U.M. A. First let’s get Hillary as a write in for President, then let’s get Howard Dean sacked.

Comments are closed.

%d bloggers like this: