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American Dreamers

Union and Liberty - The American Dream

Union and Liberty - The American Dream

For 230 years, Americans have been united by a simple, common dream that tomorrow will be better than today. The promise of American life, handed on through a dozen generations, rests on this basic bargain: All of us should have the opportunity to live up to our God-given potential, and the responsibility to make the most of it.

Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, co-author,
Saving The American Dream

What is the American Dream? Both Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton talk about it and write about it. (Senator Obama’s The Audacity of Hope was subtitled “Reclaiming the American Dream.”) Both candidates appear to assume that we Americans are dreaming the same dream they are.  But I believe that this primary season has shown that the American Dreamers have very different visions of what it means to be a success in America, and that those visions inform their voting habits more than race, sex or religion.

The American Nightmare: Acquisition Overwhelms Responsibility

I Want It Now, Daddy!

I Want It Now, Daddy!

I want the works / I want the whole works
Presents and prizes and sweets and surprises
Of all shapes and sizes
And now
Don’t care how / I want it now
Don’t care how / I want it now

Veruca Salt, “Willie Wonka and the Chocolate Factory

Part of the American Dream has always been to acquire. We wanted the nice house, the backyard, the kids, the big cars, the promotion. We wanted to show up our neighbors by being the first to have the latest, coolest gadget – from the first TV to the first Wii. But ever since Ronald Reagan started glamorizing greed and telling us that we could buy now and pay never, our dreams of acquisition have turned into nightmares.

We refuse to admit that we have a responsibility towards our neighbors, whether it’s the ones down the street or the ones across the ocean in Old Yurp (they’re either with us, or against us). The madness of the economic and social libertarians has strangled the effectiveness of government (remember Reagan’s “nine most terrifying words?“) so that natural disasters, like Hurricane Katrina, are made into national tragedies. “Fuck you, I’ve got mine” has become the siren song of the conservative movement, and due to that movement’s almost total control of the corporate media, of much of America. Pardon me for saying so, but I don’t think this is what the Founding Fathers meant by “We, the people.”

The most dedicated Obama supporters are, in my opinion, mainly invested in the Acquisition portion of the American Dream. Obama is the coolest new product on the market, and they  Just. Want. Him. The Obama Rules state that it is our duty to shut up and elect him. Icons like Jesse Jackson stress his blackness as a reason to support him.  Howard Dean is proud not to be a member of “the white Party.” Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi appears to think he is a gift from God. Only very recently have high-profile Democrats become concerned that Obama’s shiny packaging might be concealing the candidate’s essential emptiness. Obamans don’t care how – they want him NOW!

But what kind of President would the Senator from Illinois be? That question is rarely asked by Obamans. After all, when you are in an acquisitive frenzy, you don’t often stop to think if buying that awesome Hummer is really the best idea in the long run, or if you really wouldn’t be better off with a dorky, but so much more practical, hybrid minivan.

Activism: The Other American Dream

Senator Obama taps into the idea of activism in many of his speeches. It’s shockingly hypocritical, because there is absolutely no evidence of activism in the candidate himself. He has the thinnest record of selflessness and accomplishment of any presidential candidate I’ve seen in my lifetime, yet he appears to ask the American people to do something he’s not willing to do. Don’t worry, though, it’s all part of the product. Obama makes people feel good about themselves, but asks for nothing real in return. The idea of electing a post-racial, post-partisan, transcendent figure is enough. The activism starts and ends with electing Barack Obama.

Here is where PUMA comes in.

It turns out that a lot of us PUMAs grew up in the time of Ronald Reagan and Bush 1, and were old enough to be politically aware in the 90’s. We saw firsthand what a Democrat could do as President, even with Congress fighting him every step of the way. We saw that President Clinton was serious about building the middle class and getting Americans back to work, and by refusing to kow-tow to the borrow-and-spend politicians on both sides of the aisle, he instituted responsible tax-and-spend policies instead. Most of all, the two-term President re-balanced the American Dream. Sure, acquisition is fine, but don’t buy that Hummer unless you can pay for the gas. And so we thought it would be, forever and ever, Amen.

After eight years of the Worst President Ever going through the American Dream like a wrecking ball, we Democrats were ready for a change. Many of us PUMAs couldn’t have cared less which Democrat made it to the top of the ticket this year – we thought they were all pretty good and were ready to vote for anyone the voters picked.

But as the primaries progressed, we PUMAs noticed a disturbing trend: no matter what Hillary did, no matter how many big blue states and swing states she won, she could not catch up to Obama’s pledged delegate count, because red-state caucuses suddenly meant more than blue-state primaries to Howard Dean, Nancy Pelosi and Donna Brazile (not to mention that they took two of Hillary’s biggest states out of contention for extremely suspicious reasons).  Meanwhile, although we might not have begun as Hillary supporters, many of us suddenly started seeing the Senator from New York as she really was: a tireless champion of Democratic values, our generation’s FDR, and a true public servant who could turn the old American Dream back into reality. A responsible government that gives all Americans the opportunity to make the most of what they have? I don’t care how many times Obama says “Hope!”, that’s one inspirational message. 

Our Purrrrfect Candidate

Our Purrrrfect Candidate

PUMAs and Hillary: Purrrrrfect Together

We PUMAs had found our purrrfect partner in Senator Clinton – a candidate who made us believe that America could still do good things; that Americans could participate in the world without destroying it; that we could fix our economy, our environment and our foreign policy. Thus, when Hillary was driven out of the race by the screaming hordes of Obamans, we PUMAs exploded into activism. In just under three months of existence, we have grown to comprise millions of members – and there are so many more who have never heard of PUMA, but feel the same we we do. Even more amazing, we have changed the relentless drumbeat of the corporate-owned media. PUMAs are appearing all over cable news and being interviewed in newspapers. Our first success was getting Hillary’s name in nomination at the Convention – something that, despite her huge delegate count and unequaled primary achievements, was not going to be “allowed” by the Obama/DNC Conglomerate.

The Future of the American Dream

Ultimately, Obama is right about one thing, although he doesn’t mean it: We ARE the ones we’ve been waiting for. No matter what happens at the Convention or in November, we PUMAs will continue our activism.  The American Dream is a good one and true, and we each must do our part to make it a reality. To do any less would be…irresponsible.


218 Responses

  1. Brava!

  2. Purrrrfect1

  3. Oops, that should be “Purrrrfect”

    You was, I wasn’t

  4. Madamab,

    I was just wondering where you were and up you pop with another great post. The newest great product indeed — so was the exploding Pinto in its day — perhaps a precursor?

  5. Thanks, guys! I think you’re all purrrrfect!

    Prolix – LOL! Except Obama, unlike his Pinto predecessor, is imploding. 😉

  6. madamab: You continue to mine all the best from your beautiful brain! Selfish, I know, but I miss these posts since you have found employment. Just never forget us please.

  7. Fabulous! The shiny wrapping doesn’t last long, in the real world. I have kids. They usually were more interested in the shiny presents under the tree before they were opened. 2 hours later, they’d lost all interest. The packaging piqued them, then they got bored.

    Obama is depending on the ADD demographic to sustain him all the way to November. That’s too far away for the instant gratification crowd. He peaked WAY too soon. He’s already gotten as many votes, excitement, and commitment as he’s ever going to get, and it ain’t enough.

    I know the media is trying REALLY hard, with increasingly frantic efforts to maintain the excitement, but it’s reached that point that every woman knows:

    The point when you smile and gently tell him, “This is getting ridiculous. It’s not going to happen again tonight, and we both know it. You’re probably just tired. It’s okay. Let’s get some sleep….”

  8. I wonder if RD read this before she posted this morning:

    BOCA RATON, Fla. — Minutes after pushing through the rope line to thank Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton for “all that you do,” Robin Shaffer said she was worried. She feared that the senator she respected and admired for being tough and experienced had not done all that she could to unify Florida’s fractured Democratic Party while campaigning here on Thursday for her former opponent.

    It was good that she said my supporters need to now support Barack Obama,” said Ms. Shaffer, 46, reflecting on Mrs. Clinton’s speech before about 700 people. But, she added, “I wanted her to repeat that one more time.”

    Aren’t they embarrassed to admit that she holds the key to his election? I mean god forbid he should actually try to woo her supporters himself. The subtle subtext is that it is below him because we really are all racist loons.

  9. Very well said and the poll numbers are showing that Obama is not able to close the deal.

  10. Pat, I’m still laughing from your post last evening about staying ahead of the Health Department and 25 watt bulbs.

  11. Ellen Goodman recently did her annual Equal Rites Awards. Quoting her on the Media Ms-Adventure award, she says “with Hillary-misogyny all around….” and gives it to Rush Limbaugh and Randi Rhodes, and says they should share the prize locked together in the same studio till the end of the election.

    Very fitting. Our fauxprogressive media has thus far failed to see that they are the flip side of the very machine they supposedly abhor.

  12. WMCB:

    This is Gary Hart’s revenge.

    He was the original empty suit candidate. The theory was the right packaging and some poll-tested positions, you could sell an unknown candidate to the voters.

    Mondale destroyed him with the comment “Where’s the beef?”

    BTW – Guess who Gary endorsed this year?

  13. gary, they continually speak of Hillary’s voters as if we were a commodity to be delivered to Obama, by fiat of Hillary or someone else.

    God forbid they should ask why HE HIMSELF cannot woo us, as thinking human beings, and what is wrong with HIM that he is unable to win over a key Democratic demographic.

  14. Iq, you ruined the post buzz with your typo. Sigh.

  15. madamab, I agree with your opinion about activism. I followed a link to that faux feminist hack, amanda marcotte the other day where she stated that for one, PUMAs have a lot of nerve becoming activists now, when they didn’t “get their way”.

    Well, you know what? a LOT of gay men my age have been activists our whole lives. When I was in my early 20’s my friends were dying left and right from a disease that people only whispered about. I screamed at protests with ACT UP until I had no voice. I marched on Washington in 1992 and saw the AIDS quilt take up nearly half of the mall.I worked at the AIDS nat’l hotline until my soul could no longer bear the hearbreak. These stupid kids are not activists, they are spoiled brats throwing a temper tantrum. They have got another thing coming if they think that I am in the least bit intimidated. I’ve stared down the grim reaper while the rest of the world idly stood by. And they can scream till they’re blue in the face, but I’m not going to sit down and shut up.

  16. prolix: Actually I am cleaning this morning. The usual bed changing, bathroom cleaning, vacuuming, etc. Boring. However, I have noticed a mark on the wall. Not sure if it is mold or a recreation of the Baby Jesus. But I am making a silent promise to myself to get to it as soon as the convention is over. Or something like that. Either way I am not up to the publicity right now should it be a sign from heaven.

  17. GQM:

    Don’t blame me – IT’S HILLARY’S FAULT!


  18. Awwww, Pat – how could I forget my fellow PUMAs? We will go on no matter what.

    I should be around more now that the training is over. 🙂

  19. godd–mn right, gary

  20. GCH: Many of the 55+ PUMAS have been activists since hish school. I have 14 classmates on the wall. We have been activists for over 40 years, and understand that personal sacrifice is a large part of it. (Many of us in the nursing profession also remember the beginning of the AIDs crisis as well as the deliberate withholding of federal funds that could have altered the course of the disease.)

  21. Gary – Marcotte said that?! (*&$)@(*$&!)(*&

    I wonder where La Marcotte was when the Iraq war was being lied into existence? I’ll bet you a million dollars she wasn’t out in the streets protesting.

    Guess where I was?

    And they say WE have a sense of entitlement? LOLOLOLOL

  22. After almost 8 years of the Republican horror of GWB so many of us were ready to get behind most any Democrat. I just can’t abide cheating from anyone and that’s what Obama and the DNC did. I’d never vote for someone who resorted to the tactics that Obama did.

    I’m still trying to figure out how he managed to paint the Clinton’s as racists and had it stick.

    Mountain Sage

  23. garychapelhill, one of the ways the bots are trying to dismiss us is by saying we’re all closet Republicans, we were never “real” Democrats, blah blah blah. Anything to avoid having to face the substance of our objections.

    I can’t tell you the number of PUMAs I know (whether official or not) who have BEEN activists for years, who have worked for the Party, volunteered every election, worked on local campaigns, and generally been the heart and soul of Liberal politics long before people like Kos ever learned to use a computer.

    As a nurse I was risking my damn JOB to give info to worried same-sex partners of patients when it was ILLEGAL for me to do so, while these clowns were playing Nintendo or something.

    I marched. I worked. I stuffed envelopes in the bad old days, when you couldn’t email 10,000 people at the touch of a button to garner support.

    They have no argument, so denigrate the messenger. That’s all they can do, because the truth is that many many longtime activists are PUMAs.

  24. Hillary got more votes.

  25. raindog, I’ll tell you the same thing I tell the Republicans: Get your fucking hands off my uterus.

    Because whether you are trying to control me by denying my reproductive rights, or by trying to hold me HOSTAGE to those rights, either way I am being bullied.

    And I don’t respond well to bullies, motherfucker.

  26. raindog: What WMCB said.

  27. People who march in step have difficulty watching that line of perfection being breeched. Veering off course demonstates that solidarity can be broken by one tiny misstep. In order to hold the line, one must reject any and all fissures. So the harangue and orders to march in step are elevated to drown out the sound and the fury. Reducing those of us who refuse to heed the call to an insignificant group of “poor losers” is the best they can produce.

    Rather than examine what makes us step away from the perfection of the message, they prefer to demean and dismiss. A closer look may reveal the shallowness of their drum banging and they are either too far gone in their conclusions or too fearful of viewing the corpse.

    Dissent is a right. It is a choice. We do not take it lightly nor will we bend to shrillness. Too much is at stake.

  28. WMCB and chatblu, it is infuriating isn’t it? I remember back then getting the same reaction by people outside of the gay community, including many progressives—it’s your own fault, you are literally dead-enders, etc. But we got our voices heard. I think that our activism may have saved millions of lives by pushing and pushing the govt to spend money on research and prevention. So we should definitely never give up.

  29. raindog: Keep your “thingie” in your pants and maybe there would not be a need to worry about the SC. A lady does not acquire that condition by “hope” and “change”. It is usually the “unity” position that produces a pregnancy. It says so right there in the biology book.

  30. Obamans like raindog are just proving my point. The only activism they care about is electing Obama. After that, they will all go back to their lives.

    WMCB – Word, sistah!

  31. Raindog – you’re cracking me up. Obama got more votes? I guess you’re talking about Texas where he lost by 100,000?

    He got more delegates. Big whoop.

  32. you guys, mawm just sent me the proof of the big logo we are going to have on the side of the RV and it is awesome.. I can’t wait to premier the PUMAmobile. Should be sometime tomorrow evening….stay tuned!!

  33. PJ:

    It is usually the “unity” position that produces a pregnancy. It says so right there in the biology book



    I think it’s time to start going on Oborg sites and saying, “So, as ‘good Democrats,’ you’ll surely be voting for Hillary after she wins the nomination. And hey, Obama will be VP, so you should all be satisfied with that.

    If you’re not prepared to vote that Unity ticket, you can just admit you’re all Republicans right now. C ya!”

  34. Can’t wait to see the logo. gary and Mawm are awesome! Our eyes and ears.

  35. GCH: Yes, it is. What passes for activism these days is much more akin to internet harassment. And, yes, you are correct about public response in the early days of the AIDS holocaust: society clearly blamed the victims. I’m certain that the protests had a great deal to do with the sudden reversal of government policy. I might have some respect for the Obamanians if they would get out and do something positive instead of harassing PUMA sites. Hireheels has a troll epidemic today.

  36. The thing about “progressive activists” (who by their own admission are new to political activism) is that the only real “activists” and “grassroots” are the people who support their candidate(s). Everyone is the “establishment”. Nevermind that Obama was the establishment candidate while Hillary had to rely on the fierce loyalty of her friends and supporters–both old and new.

    Oh well. Who needs reality. In their world, Obama got more votes despite what the certified elections say, and Obama voted against the war even though he wasn’t in the Senate at the time.

  37. GCH: PUMAmobile = PUMAProwler??

  38. Personally, I don’t plan on having any abortions.

    Got any other arrows in your quiver, rainchihuahua?

  39. Should clarify, the “online progressive activists”.

  40. The argument makes me sick. Women are entitled to make their own choices, SC or otherwise. Patronizing men have no idea what a life changing event this is and as usual, most women are left on their own when making this decision. Throwing out pseudo religious arguments and insisting on inserting themselves into a private matter is a violation. Intrusion into the most intimate features of life must be prohibited. Stay the hell out of my bedroom and leave my reproductive rights alone.

  41. According to Politico,we don’t need to worry about Clinton being asked to be VP

    “She was never vetted,” a Democratic official reported. “She was not asked for a single piece of paper. She and Senator Obama have never had a single conversation about it. How would he know if she’d take it?”

    The official also said Clinton never met with Obama’s vetting team of Eric Holder and Caroline Kennedy.

    And the official said she was never asked for medical records or for any financial 2008 information about her or former President Bill Clinton. The last information the couple has disclosed about taxes and financial holdings was for 2007.

    That makes me feel a little better. This news, along with the letdown to millions of her supporters when she is not selected, will seal his fate. His arrogance will be his downfall and I couldn’t be happier.

  42. Great post madamab.

    And Gary, have a great trip to Denver! I’m looking forward to reading all of your updates along the way!

  43. Don’t they mean “He was never vetted?

  44. Gary – The ONLY reason I care about his VP pick is that SOME people will finally stop saying he should pick Hillary.

    I mean, how could he pick Hillary when he won’t even be the nominee?


  45. gary: I know I have said this before, and I know I am not your mother, but I worry. As exciting as this is for all of us, I still worry. So please, please be careful. I won’t say this again but you guys know. Do everything you can to keep in touch.

    And yes, have a wonderful time! You are making history.

  46. Pat – Eddy said, “Okay, Okay…………………………..”

  47. myiq………Didn’t Obama promise to never, every attack McCain’s wife. I guess her money don’t count.

  48. What’s the news today folks? Anything brewing? I saw, thanks to Myiq, that the Acorn/CSI story is starting to move. I also thought I saw last night, Carol maybe, that the numbers are in and HRC netted 2.5M+. Is that right? doesn’t sound like a lot. Maybe some of her cash has been sent over to BO.

    Do we have a definitive answer on her campaign debt? I’ll go check at JUSTSAYNODEAL.

    I hope the press gives a little more time to Hillary’s Harridans, the convention whips. Maybe this group can gain strength from the media coverage. Kazoos rock!


    Sorry, but I have to say this, since I keep hearing the bleating of “But…but…but…Roe V. Wade! The Supreme Court!”

    I am so. fucking. sick. of this shit. I am sick of being held hostage by the Democratic party over my reproductive rights. I am sick of women taking the stance, “Oh, please, pleeeasse, Lord Democrat, I will do all that you ask if you only give me some tepid support for my embattled uterus. Yes, demean me. Yes, laugh at me. Yes, ignore all other inequities and cast me the crumbs from your table, and I shall be grateful and loyal. I’ll lick your boots. I’ll shine your armor. I ask for no real respect. But please, I beg you, Lord D, do not cast my frail uterus out among the Republican wolves to perish!”

    BULLSHIT. . Want to over turn Roe v. Wade? Fine. This is not 1960. Women have their own money, their own nurses, their own doctors. Quit threatening us with it and DO IT already, motherfuckers. Do it. Let’s have an all-out war. Let us go to jail. Let the country see. Let us set up mobile clinics that keep one step ahead of law and let us go to jail when we don’t. Let’s end this charade once and for all, and have a knock down drag out BATTLE and settle this SHIT.

    I’m done with the Roe v Wade argument. I’m done begging for crumbs. Stop dangling the threat of taking it away to KEEP ME IN LINE.

    FUCK. YOU. Go ahead. Do it. Bring it on.

    /end rant

  50. Pat, as a seasoned activist, I know the pitfalls of this sort of thing. I promise, however, to be especially careful so that we can come to Mass. next year for you to plan our wedding. we will have mobile wireless so we will be in contact the whole way…actually my biggest fear are those crazy corn children in kansas…now THEY scare me.

  51. Gary: passionate post!

    While I have not had the same experiences you have had, I also have marched against the war (Viet Nam that is) and for the ERA and against violence towards women.

    When I was in college in the 60’s, there was a group of older Americans called the Grey Panthers who protested, after the AA group, Black Panthers. Because I was a so cool kid, I didn’t pay any attention to them. But now I feel I have come full circle. I am 60 and a PUMA. You can’t get any more Grey Panther than that!

  52. WMCB, hell yes and amen!!!!

  53. 500,000 in Denver is what we need!!

    Activism: Madamab hits the nail on the head….AGAIN!

    Madamab….I agree with your last post….pick a VP for chrissakes and get on with it. The only difference in who he picks will be how large his loss will be. Hillary needs to be the nominee; obama needs to go back to Chicago, Kenya, Indonesia (pick one)


  54. check thepage
    halperin is saying that hillary was never vetted!

    chet edwards (who?) was vetted????

    forget it. i’m done with the one

  55. WMBC – You go girl, I’m in front of you all the way!

    But like I said yesterday, just in case, let’s go ahead and schedule our abortions ahead of the inaugural rush!


  56. gary: XX00 Actually I fear more your proposed trip to Carol’s if you want the truth. Freeing Ed is your first mission. Her hair and nails can wait. And carrying out the trash. And mowing the lawn. And moving the furniture. And buying her lottery tickets. She has a “list” all prepared in case you missed that.

    And I look forward to next February. Like I said, I have 8 rooms just waiting for anyone who wants to come up.

  57. gary, I am just so SICK of this Kabuki dance, and I know that the gay and lesbian community get the same “dangle the carrot and threaten you with the scary Republican alternative” treatment. It needs to end. The Dems need to put up or SHUT UP.

  58. WMBC: Lady, you rock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  59. gary – don’t worry about Kansas. I heard BO is losing by 23 points. The Republicans will great you with open arms.

  60. Oh my Gawd, WMCB, that was a righteous rant! THANK YOU.

    The assumption that women are powerless to stop it if Obama or McCain decide to outlaw abortion, is in itself condescending and patriarchal. Let’s call their bluff. Do they dare to incur the wrath of hundreds of millions of pissed-off women?

    Meanwhile, there is an over-the-counter anti-pregnancy pill. Any women over 18 can buy it if she has sex without protection and wants to stop herself from getting pregnant the next day.

    I guess we don’t need to ask who made that possible, do we? Our purrrrrfect partner and her fellow Senator from Washington, Patty Murray. yes, the same people who are standing up for our reproductive rights now while Obama creates symbols and clothing lines for himself.

  61. WMBC:

    YEA! What you said!

  62. Mc Cain should say, Obama promised he would never attack my wife. Well, so much for his word.

  63. gary – they will also “greet” you with open arms.

  64. madamab, I can see commando groups of women making night raids over the Mexico border to get that pill if they want to push us that far. Bring it ON.

    We are NOT powerless! Stop acting like we are!

  65. the sick thing is that if you look at Obama’s position on abortion it is in complete contrast to the Roe decision, which was basically a privacy issue if I’m not mistaken. In other words a woman has the right to make decisions about her body and reproductive health without imposition from the govt. Obama wants to outlaw some abortions altogether and suggests that women should consult the clergy or or other “professionals”. They might be “blue”, in other words. From what I understand of Roe, that is irrelevant, A woman can have an abortion because she flipped a coin for all they care, it is HER CHOICE.

  66. Woohoo WMCB – yeah!

    Oh and I love the whole line how PUMAs are having a selfish tantrum over not getting their way, but then we are supposed to fall in line to vote on the one issue of our uteruses. Nothing but blackmail and coercion and that doesn’t play, with me.

  67. Why should anyone trust Obama and who he would put on the court? We don’t have a clue – but if his VP choice is anti-abortion, why wouldn’t he choose the same type for the SC? We know he’s pro-business. His choice could be a lot worse than McCain’s choice.

  68. As a Taurus, I do not respond well to coercion or someone getting in my face. Having had to meet life’s challenges with little or no help, I kind of think I can probably make a decision on my own without seeking a consensus report attached. A stubborn nature can often translate into quality. Been there, done that.

  69. (timidly raising head above the ramparts)

    I’m scared, but in awe WMBC!

    You rock!

  70. yeah, gays and lesbians have been treated like the bastard stepchildren of the dem party since I can remember…and I’ve remained loyal anyway, because I bought the whole “where you gonna go” BS. No more…time to start a new party where everyone is given equal access to the rights that our constitution guarantees.

  71. All – I am signing off perhaps until next week. Please travel safely and take good care of yourselves, gary and mawm and all who are headed to denver. I am merely a reader and sometime commenter, usually way late on old topics, but yet I will be following closely and keeping you all in my prayers.

  72. This was a really nice post, because the minute this whole thing started and PUMA was forming, we recognized each other!
    We are the ones who didn’t vote for Reagan that year, and we are the ones who experienced the good Clinton years. And the last 8 years!

    As far as the haves/have nots — you are so right on that too.

    All the funding for non-profits has been cut to bone in my state.
    So sad. People have been turned to the streets, by companies.
    Where are the ethical ones?
    I do believe the entire government is corrupt.
    Beautiful expression of the whole thing, you did….

  73. agree with you gary – no ‘where ya gonna go’ stuff. That’s abuser talk. We walk.

    Pat, I’m a taurus too. Say, maybe there’s something in that. bye now.

  74. gary & Mawm – just so that you know – my realtor that sold me my house lives across the street from me. Needless to say, after 2 years I don’t have everything I need to have fixed done. Additionally, her husband is a juvenile driving around the neighborhood a Nissan 300Z like it was a Caberra – I have complained about the noise waking me in the morning as he refuses to park it in the back driveway. When I saw my name on “huffy’s list of donors”, I also saw that they gave money to Rudy. 2 streets over, my neighbors are BO organizers – got a lovely letter from them in the mail requesting my presence at their parties.

    I say the PUMA MOBILE has a home parked directly in front of these two neighbors as many nights as you would like to spend. (Of course, it also depends how long it takes you to get your chores done.)


  75. perries: Hurry back.

  76. gary: Beware! People have a habit of entering that house and are never seen again. One of you needs to remain outside with their foot on the accelerator.

  77. Pat – As I explained to last night, I can hear people rooting around downstairs. I’m not blocking any doors or windows.

  78. Hillary was never vetted….. hahaha, can’t stop…laughing…..hahaha….trying to pick myself up off floor….

  79. Bill and Hillary told BO and MO to fuck off!

  80. Talking about activists vastleft hasa nice comment at Corrente, in which he called Pumas closet republicans

    A Village majority is a minority of opinion that benefits conservatives and thus is routinely touted by the media as a majority.

    For example, if a small percentage of voters said that “moral values” mattered to them, the Village is entitled not only to pronounce that it’s the majority view, it’s also allowed to say that it means that most people want more religion in their politics.

    Other Village majorities include PUMAs who support McCain (and who are stealth Republicans, anyway), Jews who support the Iraq War, people who don’t want the healthcare system overhauled, people who wanted Scooter Libby to go scot-free, and people who don’t want Bush-Cheney crimes investigated./

    I’m beginning to thoroughly dislike nerdy leftwing young men. When I was younger, of course, I made the great mistake of finding them sexy…

    (In particular Pumas are upset about the loss of UHC. BO will NEVER give it to them. He’s just too weak.)

  81. Oh, man, I wish I could draw. I’d do a political cartoon of Obama choking and drowning in big waves of poll numbers, and a big ship labeled “DNC” beside him.

    I’d have Dean, Pelsosi, etc standing on the deck, frantically throwing him round life preservers labeled “Biden” “Bayh” “Sebelius” “Clinton” etc.

    That would make a GREAT political cartoon!

  82. Parentofed – It’s hilarious, isn’t it? She is the most vetted woman in the history of the world. As if Obama, of Ayers and Rezko and Wright, should be vetting her!

  83. Republicans, Roe vs. Wade (I’m willing to bet they think it is about abortion!), Racists, ………………….

    Is it me, or is that a Run on the letter R!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  84. Republicans, Roe vs. Wade (I’m willing to bet they think it is about abortion!), R*cists, ………………….

    Is it me, or is that a Run on the letter R!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  85. garychapelhill, on August 22nd, 2008 at 11:21 am

    I hate calling people stupid so forgive me but she does sound stupid. According to Robin, if Hillary repeated that her supporters should now support Obama that would have made them change their minds:smile:
    It was Obama that refused to have a revote in Florida. Hillary wrote him a letter which was printed in a news paper putting it all on him. It was him that didn’t want all the votes counted eventhough he had broken the rules by having tv ads during the primary.

    On which planet are these people on? Have they completely gone mad? Obama is the nominee. Hillary is not his mother. She doesn’t have to do all the work for him. If he wants to win he has got to start doing all the hard work. Instead of the one week vacation why didn’t he campaign? He is lazy and a weak. Hillary can’t win him the presidency. If he wants it he has got to fight for it instead of expecting that it will be given to him just because he is The One.

    He steals her delegates, calls her a racist, tells AA in Mississippi how Hillary is going to bamboozle and hoodwink them, have his surrogates trash her, uses sexist remarks against her, have his pastors bash her in their churches, his wife trashes Hillary and now him and his supporters expect Hillary to be his mommy:roll:

  86. Who vetted Obama? A background check is in order for this guy if no one else. Who is he? Where did he come from? What exactly was he doing during those Columbia Univ years? Who are his friends? How well does he know Ayres? What does Rev Wright actually propose in his sermons? What kinds of jobs did he hold down? What is in his portfolio? What were the purposes of his earlier trips abroad? What are his wife’s beliefs? Where does his money come from? These are some of the types of questions the FBI does on background checks for anyone entertaining a position within the government. And we sit here and take it at face value. Stupid.

  87. Meanwhile, there is an over-the-counter anti-pregnancy pill. Any women over 18 can buy it if she has sex without protection and wants to stop herself from getting pregnant the next day.

    Unless your only pharmacist within 50 miles is a fundie and won’t carry it. And why does that happen? Because DEM politicians didn’t fight hard enough to protect our rights on the ground. Now they’re trying to scare US into thinking it’s OUR fault if Roe v. Wade falls? I don’t know who deserves my wrath more: the fundies who obviously hate me, or the fauxgressives who say they’re for me when they’re crapping all over me.

  88. Oh yeah, how did he end up in that alley with the chicken?

  89. Pat: “Stay the hell out of my bedroom” How does Ed like that?

  90. Upstate: On this issue we are in complete agreement. Unlike Pam Anderson, nothing is filmed.

  91. Little Amanda, some of us were activists before you were born, not that I need to defend myself..

    That was a really dumb statement you made, because, after all, ALL activists are dissatisfied about something they didn’t get but still want, whether it be bargaining rights, an end to a war, voting rights.

    How many activists have you ever seen carrying signs saying, ‘ I am completely satisfied, I have everything I want’ ?

  92. Not quite on-topic, but the following quote reminds me so much of someone we all know, love, and voted for, that I had to find some place to share it.

    “When I look around at our world that is consumed with violence and injustice, it is abundantly clear that a concentrated effort focused on clear-headed thinking and healing is needed now by those in our population who are skilled at organization, diplomacy, nurturing, decision-making, budgeting, scheduling, and crisis management. And who might these people be? Yep, you got it – We women in the second half of life are the ones we have been looking for. You can’t raise a family, handle a career, and maintain relationships over thirty-odd years with out getting mighty proficient in these areas. Feminine experience and wisdom is needed to help carry the world through today’s chaos and into the next level of growth and evolution. ”


  93. For those that may have missed it earlier, I was quoting BO on CBS regarding his VP choice to which:

    Arabella Trefoil, on August 22nd, 2008 at 9:43 am Said:
    “I want somebody that can challenge my thinking.” (BO)

    Arabella: He has at least 18 million choices. No wonder it’s taking so long.

  94. ugsome: It perfectly describes the life experiences of the bloggers on this site. And it is penned by a woman who knows.

  95. vbonnaire – We did recognize each other, didn’t we? We are the ones who get off our butts and actually DO SOMETHING, unlike the pasty, condescending, kewl-kid-wannabe fauxgressives!

    Manolo Minx – I know, it’s a tough choice. In the end, they’re both our enemies, although I once thought the fauxgressives were my friends. 😦

  96. Laurie:

    Please send this message to Vastleft at Corrente: No, I don’t fit any of those categories; keep trying.

  97. mad – until this election – we USED to get off our butts and actually DO SOMETHING!

  98. Laurie, it is all those PUMAS and Hawkish Jews fault.

    Corrente, eh? oy…

  99. From ugsome’s link:

    There are currently 73 million women in the U.S. between the ages of forty and sixty (Time Magazine, May 16, 2005). For the most part we are the baby-boomer generation, but there are women both older and younger who are part of this special group. We made great strides for women in our twenties and thirties, but there’s still work to do as there seems to be a deeply rooted belief in our culture that menopausal and post-menopausal women have left their vital years behind. Little do they know we are at the peak of our creativity – and that the kind of energy and experience we now have is what is needed in a world that is out of balance for lack of feminine input and perspective.

    WOW. I heart that woman! How absolutely purrrrfect!

  100. on Marcotte — I have some news for you, Amanda:

    Typing on a keyboard is not activism.

  101. The only way I would vote for O is if he chose Michelle as his VP….

    Right….the sad part is that the ex-republican big blogs would be totally fine with it….

  102. pet rock! LOL!

    Or maybe the convention PUMAs can sing while they blow their kazoos:

    “Ch ch ch Chia! Ch ch ch Chia!”

  103. PUMA is the epitome of a grassroots movement. It is “We” of “We the People” and that is what scares Obama and the DNC. No matter what happens next week, the PUMA roar will be heard and remembered. PUMA is a force to be reckoned with and will continue to do so. Wake the PUMA at your own risk.

  104. Pat
    I was reading this book and one part made me think of you and other women who have raised children.
    The character thinking.
    there are women out there who worked out of their homes and did wonderful successful things.
    These women did this while cooking gourmet meals,having inttelligent interviews, heading the PTA and so forth and so on.
    She knew those women were out there and if she had a gun she would hunt them down and shoot them like rabid dogs for the good of womankind.



  105. FLVoter – Yes, we are awake – and wow, there are 73 million of us bitter dead-enders in the U.S., according to ugsome’s article.

    Can you imagine how many of those ladies are PUMAs, even if they don’t know it – and how many of their husbands, sons, brothers and nephews are PUMAs too?!

  106. Helen – LOLOLOLOL!

    I love your signature – it keeps getting bigger and bigger! (And you know, it’s a compliment to be called a harridan by those @ssh*les. They’re just whining because we have bigger balls than they do!)

  107. madamab, forgot (male) lovers….

  108. After 19 years, when hubby decided that I had “taken” the best years of his life and he took off with a snow bunny leaving me with 4 teens who were in the throes of adolescent behavior, I remember whining and crying to my own mother who merely looked over the top of her glasses and uttered: “quit your belly aching”. At the time I thought that was so cold on her part. But it made me angry and as a result the tears and whining gave way to action. I worked two jobs a total of 7 days a week. These kids, who up until then kind of had it made, began to do their part as well.

    Easy? Of course not. It was tough and a struggle but somehow we managed. With little or no help with the exception of our own resources we maintained. And slowly but surely we climbed out of that misery because we had no choice but to do otherwise. Women have been the mainstays of this society for centuries. We persevere. We make do. We put others ahead of ourselves. We soldier on because this is all we know. And we take it. Over and over because of what we are. Strong. Resolute. A force of nature.

  109. Evidently for Marcotte (much of whose stuff I admire, BTW), “activist” = “posts on my blog regularly”

    How myopic.

  110. Pat, you never cease (sp?) to amaze me.

  111. helen: We are multitudes. And your signature sign off is wonderful! Triple love it!

  112. sod, I am just waiting for the accusations of “RACIST” for my Chia pet novelty item comparison. It MUST be a subtle reference to his hair, I’ll be told.

  113. Laurie and others:

    Being familiar with Vastleft and Corrente, I think you misunderstood.

    He is saying the the Village Idiots say that, he is not expressing his own opinion.

  114. The vastleft post at Corrente is so clearly snark that if you construe it as attacking PUMA/Hillary supporters you need to take a deep breath.

  115. Hi freeper.

  116. WMCB — I used to read Marcotte several years ago but gave up when I realized how boring her shtick is. She picks the most crazed, offensive anti-feminist comments/groups and criticizes them, working herself up into a big frenzy.

    That’s not feminism, to me. First, it gives these nutballs more juice than they should have — just ignore the psychos.

    Second, it’s pretty easy, isn’t it? Instead of writing thoughtfully (maybe she can’t manage that — did anyone see the tape of her on netrootz nation? she can barely string a couple of words together) about feminist issues, it’s all the sort of who-can-shout-the-loudest crap that passes for political analysis on cable news these days.

    I’ve not seen any evidence that she understands feminism at anything but a completely superficial and sloganeering level. I think I started reading her site only because at the time it was all I could find that wasn’t hateful rah rah conservatives and by the way women suck commentary around.

    I suspected that when I stopped reading her, but now I know I was right, given the hatchet job she did on Murphy.

  117. Woo hoo!! That the trolls bother to come bleat in our little “eccentric anomaly” of a movement (which is much larger offline than online, BTW) is a good sign!

    If we were that insignificant, we’d be ignored, OTH. When’s the last time you went out of your way to pull in, go inside, and have your say to the Bowling Team of your neighborhood bar in Pittsburgh?

  118. I just noticed the tiny smiley at the bottom of this page.

  119. Ventured over to the Obama Ass-Kissing site formerly known as AP to find that just everyone is really excited, oooh, oooh, about his VP choice. Seems that he’s managed to keep the “suspense on hold”, and a new TX name is “spicing” up the action.

    What I see is a weak candidate desperately trying the Bush ploy of Distract, Distract from his tanking, and a pathetic media desperately trying to pull this loser out. Oh, and oooh, oooh.

  120. myiq and gqm….ah….thanks for the clarification….never read Vastleft/Corrente so I will take your word for it.

    Hey what happened to the freeper? poof?

  121. OverTheHIll: It must get pretty lonely for you sitting there devising rants aimed at taking potshots at people you don’t know and will never have the opportunity to meet. You have no idea what you are talking about which is sad since you insist on proving how unlightened your thinking has become and then chosing to inflict upon others. The kindest thing I can offer you is to tell you that nobody really cares.

  122. guys, ignore the troll storms…it is a symptom of their fear. These are not random visitors to the site. they come en masse and descend on the same post to make it look like we are full of dissent and to demoralize us. I was batting them off last night. I can tell it is coordinated because they all come at the same time, go to the same post and leave simlar messages, then as quickly as they show up, they’re all gone. I don’t know if it is the campaign, or other anti puma thugs, but if this is their idea of activism they have a lot to learn….

  123. The real problem with r*cism and sexism isn’t the fringe nut-jobs, it’s the subtler, mainstream haters.

  124. Pat for president?

  125. The bots have really been out in force lately. I think they are freaking because Obama’s polls are tanking and the media’s on it’s ‘He must pick Hillary for VP’ foxtrot this last week.

    Ahhh, it’s a pleasure to watch.

  126. I don’t delete trolls.

    I edit their comments

    “Blah blah blabbity blah”

  127. I need to get off mine and finish the housework. The suspense is just eating away at me for the VP slot. (not)

  128. SOD: Hysterical!

  129. Myiq & gq: My apologies to Vastleft. I was a regular reader at Corrente, and tossed them out when I began a serious boycott. Perhaps it’s time I returned.

    My only defense is that there has been so much crap & hate thrown at us from sites we formerly trusted, that now my pissed-off reflexes are on high alert.

  130. “new TX name”, parentofed? That’s hilarious. Maybe the new strategy is to try to get a bubba or a latino VP to deliver those blue-collar votes he lacks.

    Good luck, if so. Joe Sixpack is going to find that very amusing.

  131. Pat Johnson – You are an inspiration – and yet, so many American women have had to do what you had to do just to get by. Our strength and dedication is taken for granted, isn’t it? Imagine how much easier you would have had it if we had UHC and a humane work-life balance for women, including day care for working mothers?!

    I have never known until this election just how deep our societal misogyny goes. I’m a PUMA who has just started noticing how sharp her claws and teeth are. ROOOOOAAAARRRRR!

    BTW – the new fave for Obama’s VP is the guy Pelosi was pushing. He’s a House of Representatives non-entity. Quelle surprise. I can’t even remember his name.

  132. God made women strong to keep mankind evolving.
    We nurture, we teach,we try to make each generation better.
    We are there when things get rough to lend our hands and our hearts and sometimes our tears.
    We stand shoulder to shoulder with men to improve what we can.
    Strong women do not go quietly into the night.
    We scream and shout about injustice and make it known that it will not be tolerated.
    One of the main reasons backtrack will not win is women know he is not good for the country now and not good for future generations.



  133. WMCB: wouldn’t give them the traffic to see, but isn’t that the Chet Edwards guy?

  134. Barky, Barky, Barky!!!!!!!!!

    Hand over the reins now before you are sooooooooooooooooooo humiliated! We won’t even hold you responsible!

    Ras (latest poll)

    The biggest changes came in Ohio, North Carolina, Wisconsin, Colorado and Oregon.

    Ted can’t help ya here!
    Ohio—with 20 Electoral College votes–moved from Toss-up to Leans Republican following the second straight Rasmussen Reports telephone survey that showed McCain with a modest lead over Obama.

    Didn’t you beat Hillary here (maybe Edwards can help)
    North Carolina—with 15 Electoral College votes—moved from Leans Republican to Likely Republican. This change was based on the latest Rasmussen Reports polling and changes in the RasmussenMarkets.com data.

    Just a matter of time (those bitter CheeseHeads are no longer supplying the Cheetos)
    Wisconsin—with 10 Electoral College votes—moved from Likely Democratic to Leans Democratic. That move was prompted by the latest Rasmussen Reports polling which shows McCain closing to within four percentage points of Obama.

    You must have been having a Rocky Mountain High!
    Colorado—with 9 Electoral College votes–moved from Leans Democratic to Toss-Up, based primarily upon the latest Rasmussen Reports poll in which McCain holds a statistically insignificant two-point lead over Obama.

    Where have all the flowers gone …………..
    Oregon—with 7 Electoral College votes—moved from Likely Democratic to Leans Democratic. While the latest Rasmussen Reports polling shows Obama with a 10-point lead, the average of other polls and a national trends adjustment places the state in the leaner category.

    Maybe McGovern can come to your rescue!
    South Dakota—with 3 Electoral College votes–shifted from Leans Republican to Likely Republican based upon Rasmussen Markets data and a national trends adjustment.

    Barky – I just don’t know where you, Mo and the kiddies will be able to go when this is all over (oh yeah, it’s already over)!
    Other states had more minor changes:
    Connecticut from Safely Democratic to Likely Democratic, Louisiana from Likely Republican to Safely Republican, Maine from Safely Democratic to Likely Democratic, and Tennessee from Likely Republican to Safely Republican.

    This is what is known as REJECTION!


  135. Great post madamab! I love the Veruca Salt analogy–it’s so accurate, and captures the tone of so many Obot rants. They do not care about policies or substance or evidence, it’s just:

    I WANT!
    I WANT!
    I WANT!

    Pat J. has also posted about the constant element of tantrum in their arguments. They are children, obsessed with the latest shiny product being sold to them. All hype, and Axelrod the adman knew just how to sell it. However, illusion can only last so long until it inevitably leads to dis-illusionment.

    You would think this country would have grown up after the tragedy of the Bush years, but instead, people are grabbing desperately at an escapist fantasy to make all their dreams come true without any real sacrifice. Real hard, boring work doesn’t interst them, and we all know that is the only way anything gets done.

    Thank you, I love this site.

  136. This comment thread is great! I agree with all. You guys always post before I can write it. Slow typer, I guess Ha! PUMA FOEVER!

  137. Carol. all that will change once the VP is announced. Silly. Relax, Ds will do well in all 57 states.

  138. I am a gun totting, bible packing Republican who thanks to several members of Puma that have called in to conservative btr shows have come to offer my support. The reason being that if an Americans most prized possession (our vote) is cast aside we also lose another possession our freedom of speech. Thanks to members of PUMA I hope other Republicans will lay their differences and support PUMAs cause.

  139. I love that the media is trying to say the point of McCain’s video’s is that he has an expensive house. Do they really think we are that stupid?

  140. Mike?

  141. Do they really think we are that stupid?

    I don’t know if they think we are that stupid or that they are stupid enough to think that is how we will interpret.

  142. Mike W, I would hope that if your party gamed your primary, the way our party gamed ours, some of you guys would be revolting as well. Thanks for the gesture of support.

  143. Some Correntians fell for that “fall in line” bullshit after Hillary suspended her campaign.

    Vastleft tried to fall in line, but he couldn’t get the hang of goose-stepping.

    I consider them PUMAs, they just don’t want to admit it.

  144. I’m pretty sure mike’s a troll trying to get the message out that we call right wing radio shows….. this is the typical kind of amatuer stuff that most anti-puma sites do, they’ll come along next, copy and paste it and scream SEE THEY”RE ALL REPUGS!!!!! Pretty childish. Anyway, we’re not republicans here so we most likely aren’t buying what you’re selling, but imo, you’re a troll wasting our time.

    if he were a real republican, he would have gotten his phrasing right…its gun packing, bible toting…stupid trolls……they can’t get anything right

  145. madamab…in reading your latest review at Suite101, this sentence jumped out at me:

    (The voice-over for this trailer hilariously intones, “And when it happened for the third, fourth and fifth times, nobody saw it coming AGAIN.”)

    Couldn’t help but think of obama’s lame attempt to keep interest in his VP pick 🙂

    You do good work!

  146. Mike:

    We think McCain is scum. So are most or all of the GOP leaders.

    We are not Republicans. We are members of America’s newest political party – PUMA

  147. myiq, I still have a problem with the corrente crowd, I read the post about PUMA being “messy”, that it is amateur. well you know what mighty correntians??? how bout gettin off your intellecutal asses and DO SOMETHING besides wax poetic about “the new progressive blogosphere” like those of us who are PUMAS…just my two cents…

  148. WMCB,

    Great analysis. Obama did peak too earlier and now the American public has figured out that he doesn’t deliver what he promises. All his rhetoric garners now is a great big yawn — just like all the drama around a VP pick. Does anyone really care anymore?

  149. Thanks, PsstCmere!

    Hee! I am having a semi-respectful email debate with a former blog-friend from the Baby Blue place. He just did a lot of coverage of Hillary’s Florida stumping for Obama. He ended his 11th update with the words, “Are you listening, PUMAs?”

    Yes, they still think all Hillary has to do is snap her fingers and we will jump to attention. Sorry, Obamans, we are not mindless bots like you.

    And we only see four lights.

  150. BTW, madamab very good post, I laughed, I cried, I got angry. You know.

  151. Corrente is Corrente and the Confluence is the Confluence.

    We are separate and distinct, but we are on the same side.

  152. SOD, I don’t think anyone on this blog made any predictions about fundraising. Others may have, but we don’t know what sources or data they were using. I think we tried our best to help Hillary pay down her debt, and regardless of what the obots say, raising millions after suspending your campaign is nothing to sneeze at. Plus I read that she was actually able to pay off some of her vendors, so there is a positive side to it. She also has a very strong war chest of close to 25 million, I believe that is for the GE, but that she can now use for her future races as well. She herself has not said anything publicly about it, so I don’t know what else we can say here other than we tried our best to help.

  153. WMCB—your rant is great! I’m always to slow reading comments and links to stay in sync. with the comments. But I totally agree with you–plus–

    the SC could overturn Roe now if they wanted-they have the votes.

    a great many of us are past the ‘potential abortion’ throes and our daughters? did not raise them stupid.

    the repubs. (I don’t think) are that crazy. It would doom them for at least a generation.

  154. SOD – that handbook was hilarious!!! 🙂

  155. Pat,

    Hopefully, that spot isn’t a manifestation of The One. The media would be all over you and we’d never get to read your comments here on the Confluence. Better get out the bleach quick!

  156. myiq, agreed, and very well said I might add.

  157. kc: Precisely. At pushing 60, I am unlikely to require an abortion. As for the younger generation, we got them this right, now they need to take care of it.

  158. SOD, we have a variety of options if anyone feels like donating. check out the sidebars. You can donate to Hillary, PUMAPac, or JSND (I think–or it will take you to their site and you can donate there).

  159. I am not a troll and came here with my eyes wide open. We have many differences of opinions some so wide they will never be bridged.When it comes to our right to vote and that every vote must count that is where I am.
    myiq2xu Thats my feeling about most Democrats and I wont hide it, but I can put aside these feelings and do what is right.

  160. and usually RD’s cocktail parties have some kind of fundraising aspect too.

  161. You mean…. I pulled out my best manners and spirit of bi-partisanship and tried to be polite to a TROLL??

    Crap. Now I’ve done it. Because of me all the blogboyz can scream “SEE??? One of those PUMA’s got a relatively polite comment from a REPUBLICAN, and she responded POLITELY!! Oh, the horror!”

  162. I know WMCB, god forbid we should be civil to one another. It always reminds me when I saw John Bolton on the Daily Show and he said that Bush was not the president of all americans, just the ones who voted for him. I’ve heard Obots say similar things. I think it is a dangerous mindset. The president is president of all americans, whether they voted for him or not. This is not a zero sum game. We are all in this together, or at least we should be. That’s how the Dems used to act, but I guess they thought they had to start acting like republicans to regain power. it is really sad.

  163. Here is something we need to always keep in mind:

    The parties are more than the party leaders. They are made up of millions of people.

    Some are liberal/progressives, some are conservatives. (I am related to some of those conservative Republicans)

    They are not stupid, ignorant, nor evil. Treating them like they are will piss them off, just like the Obots pissed us off.

    I blame the GOP leadership for the current hyper-partisan political environment, not the rank and file Republicans.

    At some point we need to stop demonizing people we disagree with. We can compromise with them on issues without compromising our principles.

    “They started it” doesn’t justify endlessly perpetuating it.

    I am, of course, referring to Republicans.

    Obots can go fuck themselves.

  164. gary — I really like Corrente. I think we need lots of different kinds of sites for us real liberals/Democrats/whatever it is we are that’s so anethema to the fauxgressives.

    Some posters at Corrente are not very pro-PUMA, but some are.

    And I think PB2.0 is very important, because there’s nothing to stop the nerdrootsz kids from more wilding sessions without some sort of structural adjustments to the political blogosphere. Although I’m sort of thinking lately that with the election still so stupidly distracting, maybe some of the conversation should wait a bit. But then, I’m pretty ‘meta’ all ’round so maybe I favor that sort of thing disproportionately.

    In any case, there was an excellent and thoughtful post yesterday about PUMA and other JSND type groups.


  165. Mike: We are also not pro McCain if that is your intent to comment. We are just a vast and motley group of people from all walks of life who prefer to live under a democratic system as opposed to a puppet government. You are welcome here but not if your objective is to prostelize. It won’t work.

  166. Eh, don’t worry about it Mike. I have family who are Republicans, and we will never agree on some things, but I love ’em.

    I’m not askeered of getting Republican cooties by just talking to you. How ridiculous.

    And if some wild-eyed left winger Obot wants to say that makes me a wild-eyed right winger, they can kiss my PUMA ass. It’s called common manners.

  167. Mike:

    I wrote that last before I saw your latest comment.

  168. myiq and gqm- I’m sorry maybe it was snark-you know him better than I do.
    This is the link-his was the comment at the bottom:

  169. myiq2xu — hear hear! Well said.

  170. Actually Valhalla, I agree with you. I am amazed that they have been able to retain cohesion over there with the diversity of opinion. They have really been able to maintain a progressive agenda while allowing opposition to the Obama phenomenon. I think they are a model of what we should aspire to.

  171. The way Fox is now reporting on the supposed VP choice, Obama is going to walk out on Saturday accompanied by his pick and the rest of us are going to be saying: Who is that?

    Apparently some congressman from Texas has been vetted? Did they have to comb through the House to find somebody willing to be sacrificed? Whoever he is I have never heard of him which explains the “lack of ego” requirements announced by The One.

  172. Carol: Upthread, a great analysis of the shift in numbers. Please let this continue!

  173. It just occurred to me as I was pushing the vacuum back and forth (are we supposed to change these bags every year?) that if this is a “game” then Nancy Nancy, Horrible Howard, and Dastardly Donna would have been escorted off the field as referees for their poor calls. In fact, if this were Little League the parents would have all been arrested for assault.

  174. Damn Pat, we need to go have a drink or something. Your life sounded like mine and I, too, am a Taurus. Husband left after 19 years, with Upstate’s cousin from Oswego, a Ms. Ponzi. I had three teenagers and two jobs. I will have the two jobs for as long as I am still paying tuition.

    We persevered and we have done okay. The beauty of this is he came into town when we got news of my son’s orders. We were at a restaurant and the waitress thought I was also one of his children (he looks old) and we found out that his cupcake, Ms. Ponzi, had kicked him out for a younger model.

    Lordy, lordy, bless his heart.

  175. Pat’s cleaning, she cleans on Friday.

  176. Myiq –

    Hear, hear!

    At some point we need to stop demonizing people we disagree with. We can compromise with them on issues without compromising our principles.

    Very, very well-said.

  177. I think it’s pretty clear what VL is saying — it’s that no matter what the majority thinks, the media (et al) will pick out the few in any group who think the opposite and ‘tar’ the whole group with that opinion.

    The media and anti-feminists do this to feminists all the time. Why do you think hacks like Camille Paglia are so popular? She declares herself a feminist, spouts all sorts of anti-feminist bullshit, then media wankers have her on their shows to ‘rebut’ every remotely femnist thought in the world as invalid.

    This is a very old game — and for feminism (which I just happened to have paid more attention to than other issues on this tactic) every feminist in the world can agree on something, but if there is one woman anywhere who disagrees it ‘invalidates’ the entire lot of people. So if feminists say ‘violence against women is bad’ and Paglia or similar hacks say ‘oh no, women like to be slapped around’, well ipso facto per se quod demonstratum est collateral estoppel, it must be true.

  178. ” I am sick of women taking the stance, “Oh, please, pleeeasse, Lord Democrat, I will do all that you ask if you only give me some tepid support for my embattled uterus.”

    Bravo, WMCB. It’s time to stop buying into this con. As one of those post-menopausal women, I’ve got no dog in that hunt anymore. My daughter had to go through in-vetro to have the one child she’s got and would love to have another. And luckily, we have the resources to deal with an unwanted pregnancy in other ways should my granddaughter ever find herself in that situation.

    I believe strongly in reproductive rights, but that is not the only, or even the most important, issue in my life. And this is an issue that continues to divide women and keeps us from accomplishing other important goals like pay equity. If you keep getting negative results from the same old approach, it’s time to change the approach. And repealing abortion rights would set off a firestorm like one that has not been seen since perhaps the dries cut their husbands off and smashed up bars during prohibition (what were they thinking?) or the suffragettes marched through the streets smashing storefront windows and pulling down porch rails.

  179. Yesterday I got my obama energy tire gauge.
    I already had my puma braclet and tee shirt.
    I also have my Hillary tee shirt.
    I am set for this election and when Hillary is nominated I will do the strut in my tee shirt and wear my braclet knowing that we made a difference.



  180. myiq sure has a way with words…..like your style!!

  181. Valhalla, don’t get started on violence against women. I was a Women’s Advocate during all of the above and I got so sick of hearing, “Well is she crazy, why doesn’t she just leave him.” They have no idea of the cycle of abuse and all that it entails. BTW, I was paid through Bill Clintons, Violence Against Women’s Act (VAWA).

  182. I noticed that a lot of the lefty blogosphere has been talking about Republicans in ways we would never tolerate if it were race, sex, or orientation we were discussing.

    Look what Hillary did with Richard Mellon Scaife. He is a super-conservative Republican. She sat down and talked frankly with him, and won over a (former) enemy.

  183. LOL! Considering Obama’s prime requirement for VP, that he have “no big ego” (translation, must not overshadow The One), some have taken to calling whoever it is “The Caddy”.

  184. With all his talk about Roe vs Wade and babies as punishment, did backtrack ever think of having a vasecomy?
    A vasecomy means never having to say your sorry.



  185. Valhalla: Count Tammy Bruce as another one of those feminists they drag out occasionally to bolster yet another lie. What gets me is that both Tammy and Camille are gay. They must have met discrimination on many levels. Just knowing and agreeing that discrimination is practiced should be enough to run away from that agenda. Discrimination and exclusion packaged and sold to the public is damaging. But even more so when it comes from those who should know better.

  186. helen: You just hit the nail on its proverbial head!

  187. Does anyone have a new post ready?

    This one is three hours old, with nearly 200 comments

  188. myiq – EXACTLY!

    In the past, I have been VERY guilty of tarring rank-and-file Republicans with the same brush as their odious leaders. No more! Sometimes, Republican voters have a point.

    Oh, the Humility

  189. Pelosi was a ‘strong’ advocate for Chet Edwards….hemmm.

    So, she can advocate for Obama and advocate for Chet but Hillary is not in her good graces. Good to know, where Mrs. Speaker stands and whom she advocates for!

  190. We should know within 24 hours who really is in charge of the country since Chet Edwards is a personal choice of Nasty Nancy (which must indicate that he knows how to “graciously” kiss ass) to be VP. The big betting is on Biden. Not sure if he can control Joe who has a tendency to go off on is own tangents. Repubs are eager to get Joe. Say they have a lot of ammunition.

  191. I have a feeling that Obama is waiting to announce his choice so as to not give the pundits an opportunity to do their digging before next week. He may hope to deflect any talk of a floor challenge by waiting to the last minute.

  192. Pat. It was not my attention to prostelize,soap box or rant about any candidate. Like the PUMA pac members who have crossed party lines to encourage support I have come only to offer mine. To me it goes further then party politics it is the treasure we have in voting.

  193. Great blog, madamab. I too, have learned some similar lessons. A zealot is a zealot is a zealot. And while I may always be one to some degree, I have been humbled to learn that MY brand of zealotry can be just as blind and harmful as anyone else’s.

  194. Well-said, Mike W! Thank you. Country before Party!

  195. Mike: Although we champion Hillary we are more disgusted and turned off by our own DNC. Much of the problem has been the marriage of both that entity and the Obama campaign Chicago machine. We refuse to sit back and allow this to become a reality. Thus, PUMAs.

  196. Mike
    The country needs PUMA for this election and long after.
    The people have to remind both parties that they are to represent the people .
    Government of the people and by the people is what it is all about.



  197. To all the kool-aid drinkers! I wanna hear you say it together, now, in November:

    “I shoulda had a V-8.”

  198. Bob Somerby over at the Daily Howler is promising to do a piece on KO come Monday. Can’t wait! Bob accused him of going overboard this week and “throwing his poo around”. Cracked me up.

  199. Wasn’t Chet Edwards the idiot who Tweety nailed in that interview, who could not name ONE accomplishment of Obama’s, kept yammering “But..but..but…he’s inspiring!”? The one Stephanie Tubbs-Jones was laughing her ass off at?

    God, puhleeeeze let it be him! That clip is priceless.

  200. WMCB: He does not look like that one in the picture they are showing of Edwards. The guy with Matthews had white hair.

    Hope they realize if he does put Edwards on the ticket he had better explain to the 20 somethings that this is not the SAME Edwards who is Rielle’s boyfriend this month. It appears that they are also finding there may be another “friend” in the wings who was an undergrad a few years ago that he was also reported to be “consulting” with.

  201. New post up

  202. PUMA as a political party is different than PUMA as a movement. A Party’s goal is electoral victories. A Movement, on the other hand is about issues.

    While some may laugh at the discussion going on at Corrente (of which I am a regular), many of the same sentiments expressed here were similar to what the folks at Kos and the rest of PB1.0 were when they first started. The discussion at Corrente is about avoiding a similar meltdown. Our view over there is that the ad hoc nature of PB1.0 was a big part of the problem and much of PUMA as*we* see it is being done in a similar ad hoc reactionary manner.

  203. This post is so well written. You are a very good writer and your points are so well taken. I feel so demoralized about going to the Convention (I am a delegate for Hillary) because the DNC leadership assisted by Speaker Pelosi are beginning to find ways to circumvent the rules. We are now hearing that we will be voting in the hotels at our morning breakfast with the state delegation and not on the floor on Wednesday evening. Never before been done like this..
    The most glaring absence is any comment from Howard Dean about whether or not FL & MI will be seated with full votes; how any of the rules will be implemented. Seeing the demise of the political party I have worked for all my life is beyond sad.

    After watching two presidential elections be stolen by the Republicans, now to see my own party ‘select’ not elect a nominee is extremely hurtful to one who trys to not become cynical. I know you are correct that we must continue to work, but Lord, I am getting so tired!
    Thanks for writing an excellent post.

  204. Pat. I know PUMA supports Hillary and am not shy to say I dont. What I have seen reading PUMA pac and River Daughter is that Obama stole the campaign from Hillary. He bought delegates whose areas clearly supported Hillary and they went Obama. That is clearly misrepresentation and borders on criminal actions.These actions happen in dictatorships and have no place in America. If not for Puma and River Daughter I would be ignorant of this.

  205. naoko – THANK YOU for sharing this. Please re-post it on the more recent thread that Myiq2xu has just put up. I want everyone to read it!

  206. naoko,
    please bring your comment up to the new post so everyone will know. Everyone needs to see this.

  207. Bye, all.

    My last load of laundry has finished drying so must go pack for Denver. Hope to see some of you there.

  208. chris we honor the strike here. this is your first warning.

  209. gary said:

    I marched on Washington in 1992 and saw the AIDS quilt take up nearly half of the mall

    I was there too!!!

    Back in the winter, when the pundits were going on and on about his having the “youth vote” and “new voters” my thought was that we Hillary supporters weren’t born or registered yesterday.

    madamab: Excellent post!

  210. WMCB, on August 22nd, 2008 at 2:50 pm Said:
    Wasn’t Chet Edwards the idiot who Tweety nailed in that interview, who could not name ONE accomplishment of Obama’s, kept yammering “But..but..but…he’s inspiring!”? The one Stephanie Tubbs-Jones was laughing her ass off at?
    God, puhleeeeze let it be him! That clip is priceless.

    WMCB, that was TX Sen. Kirk Watson, but that clip is a classic! Here for your viewing pleasure:

  211. To make up for my misunderstanding over VL at Corrente-here is a post from Lambert which clears up what the Village is: “a sac of pus ready to burst”

    very interesting reading from back in June.

    Oh and if you like your reading hard progressive, from Arthur Silber: he considers both McC and BO to be in their own ways “exceptionally dangerous”

    here’s another from Lambert again on stages of grief: “trope pushed by Obama supporters considered toxic”

  212. WMCB – I am in awe of the greatness of that post.

    I just this past weekend had a conversation with a lesbian couple who were Hillary supporters and now support Obama. As I switched into PUMA high-gear, they were shocked that I wasn’t supporting Obama and that I might actually vote for the evil McCain.

    “What about the supreme court?” they wailed. I told them if the Democrats were so worried about the supreme court they should have thought about it before they hijacked the primary and violated their own party charter in order to promote a weak, unvetted candidate. I told them that I was not going to be held hostage by the Roe v. Wade issue.

    “But NARAL gave their support to Obama!” they argued. Yes, I told them, and shortly thereafter he changed his stance on abortion rights to ‘sorta free choice but not really.'”

    “Obama has the most liberal voting record in the senate!” they challenged. “When he bothers to vote” I countered. Just showing up and voting “present” doesn’t count.

    We kind of dropped the subject after that.

    BTW, is anyone else annoyed that Barky has actually picked a running mate and plans to campaign with him this weekend? Dude, YOU’RE NOT THE NOMINEE YET!!!

  213. fantastic post!

    But as the primaries progressed, we PUMAs noticed a disturbing trend: no matter what Hillary did, no matter how many big blue states and swing states she won, she could not catch up to Obama’s pledged delegate count, because red-state caucuses suddenly meant more than blue-state primaries to Howard Dean, Nancy Pelosi and Donna Brazile (not to mention that they took two of Hillary’s biggest states out of contention for extremely suspicious reasons). Meanwhile, although we might not have begun as Hillary supporters, many of us suddenly started seeing the Senator from New York as she really was: a tireless champion of Democratic values, our generation’s FDR, and a true public servant who could turn the old American Dream back into reality.

    Best summary of how we got here.

  214. Yep, how’s that women’s rights messiah working out, indeed. I could’ve told NARAL that for a quarter. Sad how we’ve come to expect this kind of wishy washy BS out of the party.

    I also agree with

    “At some point we need to stop demonizing people we disagree with. We can compromise with them on issues without compromising our principles.”

    This is called “doing the people’s business.” The people’s business can only be done by rational people over rational issues. If someone says to me, “You Democrats spend too much money,” we disagree, but there is at least a concrete basis for discussion. The sentiments “You Democrats are going to burn in hell,” or “You PUMAS are ideologically incorrect, get out of our party,” stem from religious thinking, and you cannot do business with that.


  216. WMCB, on August 22nd, 2008 at 12:09 pm Said


    Oh HELL yes!!! Rant on.

  217. An important share, and please excuse if someone has posted this already. Eye witness accounts of the caucus fraud.
    It’s worth every second, very well done and still quite upsetting.

    DNC Caucus Fraud Documentary.
    Please inform others!!!

  218. Heard on Fox News last night: (who woud believe I would ever find relief in listening to Fox News!!)

    Geraldo: ” Is it true that Michelle’s hatred of Hillary is why she wasn’t named Veep?”

    Former Governor of Maryland, Michael Steele, a black man, says, “Yes, Michelle has a lot of influence and spouses have a lot of influence in these matters” grinning and nodding at the same time.
    _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
    I kid you not.

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