• Tips gratefully accepted here. Thanks!:

  • Recent Comments

    William on What Fate Is Ours?
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on What Fate Is Ours?
    William on What Fate Is Ours?
    William on What Fate Is Ours?
    William on What Fate Is Ours?
    jmac on What Fate Is Ours?
    Beata on What Fate Is Ours?
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Media-Created “Reality…
    Propertius on Media-Created “Reality…
    Ivory Bill Woodpecke… on Media-Created “Reality…
    Propertius on Media-Created “Reality…
    Propertius on Media-Created “Reality…
    Beata on Media-Created “Reality…
    Propertius on Media-Created “Reality…
    Beata on Media-Created “Reality…
  • Categories


  • Tags

    abortion Add new tag Afghanistan Al Franken Anglachel Atrios bankers Barack Obama Bernie Sanders big pharma Bill Clinton cocktails Conflucians Say Dailykos Democratic Party Democrats Digby DNC Donald Trump Donna Brazile Economy Elizabeth Warren feminism Florida Fox News General Glenn Beck Glenn Greenwald Goldman Sachs health care Health Care Reform Hillary Clinton Howard Dean John Edwards John McCain Jon Corzine Karl Rove Matt Taibbi Media medicare Michelle Obama Michigan misogyny Mitt Romney Morning Edition Morning News Links Nancy Pelosi New Jersey news NO WE WON'T Obama Obamacare OccupyWallStreet occupy wall street Open thread Paul Krugman Politics Presidential Election 2008 PUMA racism Republicans research Sarah Palin sexism Single Payer snark Social Security Supreme Court Terry Gross Texas Tim Geithner unemployment Wall Street WikiLeaks women
  • Archives

  • History

  • RSS Paul Krugman: Conscience of a Liberal

  • The Confluence

    The Confluence

  • RSS Suburban Guerrilla

  • RSS Ian Welsh

    • What Would Chinese Democracy Look Like?
      A few months ago I read a couple of books by the Singaporean intellectual Kishore Mahbubani. In “Has China Already Won he discusses Taiwan. The one exceptional trigger for a war involving China is Taiwan. Most of the time, the Chinese leaders have a lot of policy flexibility. There are no strong domestic lobbies to worry about. But the one issue where the Ch […]
  • Top Posts

Is the DNC Pro-Choice?

Hillary or Obama?

Hillary or Obama?

What is the difference between having your name on a roll call vote and being explicitly nominated for president at the Democratic Party Convention in Denver? It turns out that one is merely symbolic and the other is a real threat to Barack Obama.

If Hillary Clinton’s name is on a roll call vote, her delegates have the opportunity to vote for her but their votes have no more weight than “present”.  They only count if her delegates create a petition to have her name entered into nomination.  If she signs the petition, she can be nominated and the roll call will count, provided the DNC doesn’t contest the petition or try to block it in some way.

It turns out that the DNC is negotiating with the Clinton camp to make the convention as scripted as possible,  That is, every possible avenue to put her name in nomination is being systematically blocked.  The rational is that if the DNC can have only one nominated name on the ballot, then the roll call will look like it is unanimous.  Obama will declare UNITY!  The balloons will drop, or will be set free if the acceptance is at Invesco Field.  Or may there will be no balloons at all in order to keep with the green theme.  Maybe they will let loose 2 million snow white doves to carry the message of unanimous, unity, unanimity to all points of the country.  On the wings of snow white doves!  Fly, little birdies, fly!  May they release little packets of unisoness on Howard Dean and his henchman Donna Brazile.

I am getting carried away. Ahem!

As a New Jersey voter, I choose not to vote present.  Hillary Clinton won my state by 10 points.  Barack Obama got trounced here.  Present just doesn’t suit me.  I’m not a “present” kind of gal.  I want to make a statement.  Something along the lines of “F%^& You, Howard Dean and Barack Obama.  COUNT MY VOTE!”

So, my question is, is the party pro-choice or not.  Do we get a selection of candidates to choose from?  You know, the one who won the biggest and swing states plus popular votes vs the one who won Idaho?  Is this a pro-choice party or is it a Potemkin party?  Are we Americans and do we believe in Democracy or are we Zimbabweans where the winning candidate is forced to remove his name from the ballot?  It’s looking like Zimbabwe these days with the way this election has been run so far.  Damn!  I just KNOW that’s going to end up in a “Riverdaughter is a Racist” blog.  Unfortunately, corruption and corrupt elections look the same in every country.

Keep it in mind, PUMAs because in the next couple of days, we will need your help settling the question once and for all.

For updates on this and other activities going on here at the PUMA savannah, tune into NO WE WON’T with Sheri Tag and Will Bower tonight at 8PM EST.  There will be details on the upcoming Pre-Convention PUMA Conference as well.  Be there!

109 Responses

  1. riverdaughter we must be doing something right as they are getting more and more upset with us.now some bot is claiming dara took the money donated to her and went on vacation,what aload of******.the other thing and i find this highly amusing is that i should not be spreading mud and lies when i ask about rezkos tennants being without heat and that it was barkys job to know what was going on in his state senate district .riverdaughter since you have served on a school board you know how much work is involved in holding a public office and your job is your constituants.by the way i still have a long distance crush on you,you wright so much better than i do.

  2. Don: Darragh has been working her ass off for her PAC. JAYsus. She does all of her work pro-bono. Any travelling she has done has been in service to her PAC. You’re right, they’re getting worried. This is laughable. For one person to put so much effort and intensity into an organization leaves no time for vacations.

    Yes, I’ve been on a school board. It was unpaid and ended up being very long nights and lots of meetings with ginormous packets to read through and understand. Everyone should do it for a couple of years just to get s a sense of what governing and legislating is all about even on a small scale. It’s not a ceremonial position.

  3. Another GREAT post RD !!
    They all just thought they were “SO MUCH” smarter than “us” by cheating Hillary out of “making her VALID
    CASE to the SD’s”. Now somehow the’ve switched their “un-fair” treatment of Hillary to “us”. Why is’nt it Obama & crew’s job to win “us” over.
    “We” just are not going to REST until the CASE IS MADE & HEARD !! PERIOD !
    I DARE the SD’s to “look us in the collective EYE and, say they think BO will make a better Pres. than “our” HRC”.
    Go PUMA!

  4. I am so glad that I am pro-choice in Denver-Clinton needs to keep her options open she should not sign away her right to be nominated not for the VP slot and certianly not in the name of party “Smoonity”!

    Also I am still steamed that at least RD did not get the nasty letter from the evil “alledged” Hillary supporters.

    I also had a vision of Howard Dean and Donna Brazile covered with poop-It could be the new Red Bull commercial where a 9 million puma’s are locked out of the Denver Convention they all drink a Red Bull at the same time, get their wings, and fly over Invesco Field and drop a nice present on the “big O” and his supporters…Dean and Brazille included.

    This commercial would surely win a Cleo!

    fuzzybeargville

  5. The added benefit to invesco Field is natural fertilizer is best and would lessen the need for pertoleum fertilizers in Green Denver!

    fuzzybeargville

  6. Fuzzybear – Here’s a DNC Party Smoothie for you. Drink it up quick. It tastes yummie.

  7. They could achieve the same thing with the “unity” ponies flying overhead. When the s*it flies it has to fall somewhere. Why not Mile High Stadium? Since they will be up to their ankles in it anyway listening to the crap that is sure to be blowing out of Obama’s mouth.

  8. RD – you have three outstanding posts back to back. Thank you for putting into print all the horse hocky the DNC, media, “abberate party elders” actions.

    I miss Hillary – hearing what she had planned. May 31 ended my membership in my life long party. You validate my concerns and give me back some of the hope that Hillary gave to me.

    You rock girl!!

  9. This is the best and clearest explanation about those negotiations! And it’s a great template for a Letters-to-the-Editor campaign making sure everyone knows what is happening behind the scenes.

    Thanks, RD!

  10. If Obama sucked as hard as he blowed-the Mississippi would run North Pat! your right 9 million Pumas sh*tting on Obama and company would be the hieght of redundance!

    Arabella what flavor is the smoothie? I love strawberry bannana pineapple!

    fuzzybeargville

    Hey we are at +1.5 million hits- dont we get a prize?

  11. Prize suggestion on the achievement of 1.5 million hits- Clinton/Rendell 2008 Ticket! come on Dean you know its a real Winner better than a Obama/(fill in the blank) ticket

    fuzzybeargville

  12. Are we paying the bill for those 300 babysitters – er “advisers” who are traveling around with Obama? How much advice does a person need? 300 seems a little over the top to me.

    If Howard, Rahm, Nancy, and Donna were running the DNC as a business they would have been escorted to their cars and told never to return. How could so many be so wrong? Like Bush, they never expected to have to go beyond the first strike. What now, folks?

  13. I thought Miss Donna told us we weren’t needed? So why all this ineffectual and clownish whip snapping about our votes now? If she was that wrong, then fire her ass. Barry is so phony , such an aggressive cancer, that when he goes down, he’s going to take the whole media/ dem elite superstructure down with him . Just when that will be is the only question. All the Kings horses and all the kings men are already straining now at propping him up.

  14. The smoothies come in the same flavors as the koolaid. You too can be Mile High on Obama!

    They think PUMAs will get too tired, too hot and too depressed to keep up the resistance. But we didn’t drink the koolade and we won’t drink the Mile High Smoothies. Heck no.

  15. riverdaughter,your service on that board shows how dedicated you were to the education quality in your town and i totally get why you get so frustrated concerning brook .this is why i harp on the bots about obama and the problems with rezkos apartments in obamas district.he did not do the job he was elected to do.what gets me is how his supporters think this is just throwing mud at him.boy do we as anation need to have civics taught in our schools again.

  16. I wonder if Obama will run into Hugo Chavez while he’s in Europe, cuz evidently he’s planned his European Tour for the same week:

    http://www.elpais.com/articulo/internacional/Chavez/estoy/seguro/vere/Rey/elpepuint/20080721elpepuint_2/Tes

    The article is in spanish, but basically they’re wondering if Spain’s King will see Chavez since the last time the two were together The King told Chavez to shut up (the video is priceless). but I would LOVE to see a pic of Obama and Chavez “running into each other in some airport he he.. 🙂

  17. I am sorry I am not that kinda bear Arabella I dont do Koolaide and the odds of me pulling the lever for Obama are greater than me winning the power ball next week!

    I am a Hillary supporter but she does not own my vote!

    fuzzybeargville

  18. If November puts an end to this trainwreck of Obama and the DNC I am prepared for 4 years of McCain. The party needs a thorough overhaul and it won’t happen if they are rewarded with a victory. If I have to personally wheel McCain into the Rose Garden for a daily outing I would prefer to do that than take a chance on where this party and nominee plan to take us in the future. A sobering thought.

  19. A picture of Chavez and Obama would be a priceless as that one with Bush and McCain wrapped around one another like cobras. Too funny and difficult to sp’lain.

  20. I am a Hillary supporter but she does not own my vote!

    I’m in agreeance with that.

    I crack up when Obamabots scold us by telling us that “Hillary told you to support Obama.” Hillary does not tell me what to do. I have a mind of my own.

  21. This young black girl has an amazingly long and eloquent (because apparently off the cuff ) rant on your subject today, RD, in a youtube video.
    The process is what bugs her too. The sad demise of the former Choice Party, indeed.

    http://anvp.wordpress.com/2008/07/17/race-as-a-strategy/

  22. You have to hand it to Taylor Marsh. She is like a traffic
    cop trying to steer her posters in one direction and they still insist on going their own way. Just took a peak over there and she has the Don and Alice letter up and is practically sitting on their laps in agreement, exhorting us holdouts to just give it up and get that Dem in the WH.

    Some of the poster love nothing more than throwing her own words back in her face! It is positively delightful. She owns it, she wears it.

  23. RD, where are you getting your information from? If you have actual information why would Hillary negotiate at all? How can the DNC block anything ? If, as the courts ruled, the DNC is private and they can do whatever they want, we need to get the actual facts out to the public.

    Does anyone have any authority they can site, or is all going to be innuendo and opionion which can be denied.

  24. I hope this is not a repeat – I do not have as much time to read comments these days – but, if you have not already signed The Denver Group’s open letter to Howard Dean – please do if you agree. I will not post a linky as I am not sure how to do it.

    There are some great comments made by the people who have signed – comment #131 is outstanding to me.

  25. sorry, thats “opinion”

  26. Dot, that is Patsy (I think that’s her name) who is a US soldier – she is AWESOME. I’ve read some of her posts at NoQuarter and she is all sorts of WOW. Love her!

  27. nh…he he…opionion sounds like some kind of weird vegetable/drug hybrid

  28. dot commodity: Wow! And she did not have to refer to notes or a teleprompter. She knew exactly what she wanted to say and she did. Everything that PUMA stands for!

  29. boo, I hate to complain, but that petition requires a “donation”. I think that is contrary to the spirit of a petition

  30. I made the contribution. It probably is going towards one of their ads.

  31. Pat, it said it didn’t go to the people with the petition, but to the site itself….seems kind of fishy to me

  32. gary: There are so many out there these days. Because I cannot do what you and Mawn and the others are doing and planning to do, I want to at least still feel a part of all this and contributing a little here and there makes me feel involved. I just hope that we are not taking advantage of in the long run.

  33. DATE: July 19, 2008 7:13 PM CDT
    NAME: Elixir
    ADDRESS: MA
    AMOUNT: $20.08

    I’ve done the school committee stint, two terms. It was terrific and you really get to see what government can and CANNOT do. Ever since education reform, school committees have 3 responsibilities – approve the budget, hire and fire the superintendent and set policy. Very frustrating. Everyone should do it, you look at education with a different perspective.

    Do we have any idea if Hillary will go along with this nomination thing? Is it possible taht the DNC are strongarming her and she will not participate in the convention even if PUMAs turn the tide and get her a roll call? Silly question…of course she will.

    Can we have Hillary back now?

  34. They are looking at mass defections if her name is not put into nomination. The groundswell will dwarf PUMA if that happens. Right now PUMA is a creation of the blogosphere. For those who are not as into blogs as we are, the day will be a reckoning if they push her aside.

  35. elixer: Where are you in MA? I am in Western MA.

  36. Pat, what you do right here for all of us is priceless. Your wit is something I look forward to every time I come on here. I’m going to keep you to your word of being a bridesmaid too : )

  37. PJ, I’m 10 miles north of Boston in Melrose.

    I’m listening to Will bowers online radion connection and I’m wondering who is the woman speaking now, one of our PUMAs here?

  38. Guys, if you really want to get upset, check out Tennessee Guerilla Woman’s site. It looks like A T and T is sponsoring tote bags with their embossed logo to be on sale at the Denver Convention.

    FISA anyone??????

  39. Has anyone heard word of the total amount pledged to eliminate Hillary’s campaign debt? I thought I read somewhere that the figures would be released today. I was looking forward to the good news that she wouldn’t be financially in need to reduce the debt and wouldn’t need to “negotiate” with nobama. Did I get the date wrong?

  40. elixir; It is either Darragh Murphy or Shari Tag. They kind of sound alike. Whoever, she is angry!

  41. It’s Shari, or taggles who posts here.

  42. Sheri Tag… thanks PJ. She certainly is angry but she’s nailing every point. Where’s the link to the letter again? hmm, I’ll check around.

  43. Shari is introducing Deb Barnes, the Washington coordinator for the PUMA convention in August.

  44. elixir: If you cannot find it I will try to post the link for you.

  45. SM,
    yeah, she really showed political leadership potential. Awesome kid. I couldn’t comment at her blog.

  46. You cannot beat that price.

  47. dot: Would be great to get her into that PUMA documentary.

  48. Pat Johnson,

    yeah, the complete lack of any evidence of a teleprompt on such a long PUMA rant was astounding. She nailed everything!

  49. Can someone enlighten me? If, as Dean has said, “the rules were so clear on this matter”, what exactly is under negotiation?

    If there is nothing in the current rules that would deny Clinton’s name from being placed into nomination, I don’t understand why her campaign would be negotiating anything. If anyone related to the DNC – including Obama, Dean, Pelosi, Reid, or Brazile – is attempting to keep that from happening, there shouldn’t be any behind-closed-doors negotiating. This should be made public – loudly!

    So, what am I missing? I’m feeling a little fuzzy here. And I’ve haven’t had a drink all day!!

    A Confused PUMA

  50. PJ, got it. Thanks.

    Deb Barnes is great, she establishes a very positive tone without coming off angry. I think that’s very important to keep our message strong.

  51. Mawm, rd, gary and possibly madamab are going. I so envy their ability to be there.

  52. Dotcommodity and Pat Johnson,

    Thank you for the link. She is terrific, not to be overlooked. What a powerful speaker.

  53. When the poor white doves are released, they are soon hawk food, or die shortly since they are raised in cages. These are the kinds of birds who spend
    their lives in a cage and then are release from a box and fly to “freedom” when the top is removed, but are pelleted by a “hunter” like Dick Cheney who is standing a few feet away with a repeating shot gun. The ones who die fastest are the fortunate ones.

  54. CB: What a visual!!!!

  55. Has anyone got info on cheap airfares to Denver? I’m checking and from Boston it looks like JetBlue has the best rates at $169 @ way.

  56. If they release doves, they will have PETA all over them. If they release balloons, they will have eco-warriors all over them so the only thing they can release is Hillary! Hurrah! That would be the only reason that I would even watch that ridiculous event.

  57. Joan, they’re going to want to release the hounds if those of us who are going to Denver have anything to do with it.

  58. Pat,

    This is the kind of hunting “practiced” by Dick Cheney. Doesn’t require much skill just scattershot. We learned this when Cheney shot the attorney who was on a “hunting trip” with him. As someone said, to call Dick Cheney a hunter is equivalent to calling the head chopper at an abattoir a hunter.

    But the sad thing is that these doves are released, unable to survive outside of a cage, and are supposed to represent freedom. I’ve seen sharp-shinned hawks chasing them through my neighborhood. They have a brief taste of fresh air and then die tragically.

  59. What is the big deal if he is illegitimate? Not his fault what his parents did or did not do.

  60. Obama=Shane???

  61. Obama hardly answers any questions.

  62. mystic4hillpuma,

    From reading Heidi Li’s Potpourri (she’s behind the Denver Group), her delegates are waiting to hear from her what she wants them to do.

    Reading the rules, it’s unambiguous that as they stand now, she (or rather, her delegates, it’s a bit complicated) could cause her name to be put in nomination. But this is the DNC and they could certainly change the rules at any moment. We’ve all seen how that works.

    But even if Hillary could use the rules to have her name put into nomination, she may not want to. Then the DNC could be even more stupid and crappy to her than they already have been. I don’t know what she’s negotiating for — maybe it’s over the party platform, maybe it’s over $ flowing from the DNC to her supporters within the party, maybe it’s about when she’ll speak at the convention — primetime or (as I’m sure Dean would have it) during a commercial break. I’m sure there’s a million more possibilities I can’t imagine.

    I think there’s all sorts of tricky things going on behind the negotiations info blackout, and both sides have an incentive to keep it all confidential.

    But one thing I know about my gal, she’ll do her very best by us and our interests. Of that I have no doubt.

  63. garychapelhill: I am another one of your fans – you and MAWM have been so active and done such great work here!

    To sign the petition costs nothing – once you sign it, there is a donate screen but you are not required to donate. The Denver Group is doing lots of good work for our girl Hillary. I hope it’s ok to mention.

  64. I trust Hillary’s judgement.

    I await the moment Obama releases the hot air over Mile High Stadium. Just picture it – thousands of lovely hot air baloons filled with Obama’s hot fetid breath, all floating into a Colorado sunset.

    It will be awesome.

  65. Pat J: If you still out there, I found one of the online petions I signed a while back (Count the votes) and found your name right next to mine. I got so excited and thought, “Hey, I know her!” What an honor!

    Riverdaugher: You are tearing up the place with these posts. I like the graphic.

  66. Listening right now. Finally getting the difference between ‘on the ballot” and ‘in nomination” and the fact that the delegates are OURS not Hillary’s – OUR VOTE needs to be honored. So WE need to ask for it.

  67. Valhalla: Thanks! It is all fairly confusing, and while I know Hillary will do her very best by us, I hope she doesn’t give up her right to have her name placed into nomination.

    I’m listening to NoWeWon’t Radio right now, and they’re talking about this subject. I missed the name of who’s talking, but he’s explaining the rules – which are incredibly confusing (of course, I missed half the conversation). One thing he said which I think is important, is that having Hillary’s name placed into nomination is more for US – her voters – to give US a voice, and that all of her supporters need to continue to demand of the DNC that her named be placed into nomination.

    The voice of PUMAs must be heard!

  68. Gary-I worry for your safety there because they may really release the hounds on you-like the K-9 corps. Not to mention the Obots getting carried away. I’m not usually a worrywart but I’m kinda concerned. Those “free speech” cages sound pretty grim, too. Sure you and Mawm and other brave PUMA pals wanna go?

  69. Joan, if we don’t go they win, and the party I’ve belonged to for 20 years is gone. I have to go.

  70. I hope what I am hearing is wrong . re – Hillary’s debt .

    not official yet – so will NOT post links

  71. what are yo u hearing?

  72. briana,remember the big push by us did not happen until after july 1st so no numbers until after 1st aug.thease numbers will be for june only.

  73. Honestly the more I think about it , why don’t they ‘the’ Clintons do what Romney did ?? – didn’t he just write off his campaign debt . . pay the creditors .. & voila gone ! —

    none of this bmail chit ! .. I get so tired of being punished by obots cause ‘they’ gotta pay off Hillary’s debt ..

    I realize it’s a lot of money , however I really do not believe that the Clintons have ever been ruled by money . Sometimes I think – she now , – doesn’t want to be prez … and you know what ..?? I all most don’t blame her ..!

    I love her , why on earth should she get beaten up anymore ..?? .. the ‘One’ will get plenty of chit – ‘if elected’ –

    then repubs will rule no doubt like after Carter ..

    oh heck !!! .. who knows .. just ranting ..

  74. I’m hearing 25.2 million debt – ap

  75. her debt increased????

  76. As long as HRC has debt, there’s only so much she can be expected to do for the DNC and Obama.
    Settling the debt is a double-edged sword, however, it’s power is determined by who wields the sword.
    Basically, either way, HRC is in control.

  77. Have you all considered what you will do if Hillary concedes or otherwise withdrawals from the nomination? Will you consider Obama to have the nomination legitimately? Have you considered what you will do if there is a ‘floor’ fight, but all the SD still side with Obama? Will you consider him to be legitimate?

    I applaud what Denver Group is doing, but I will never vote for Obama no matter what. It is too late. It is Hillary or McCain period.

  78. Obama will never be legitimate. He stole delegates from Clinton. If he wins a floor fight, or hillary gives in I would still oppose his candidacy.

  79. garychapelhill,

    Wouldn’t you just love to know if Obama is expecting Hillary to pick up all her own expenses to do these Unity fundraisers?

  80. NH–for all the money BO raises, his campaign is cheap as hell. At the Unity, NH rally, they were passing out dixie cups with water—too cheap to spring for individual bottles I guess. It looked like they were passing out cool-aid—I swear to god!. I remember thinking there is no way I’d drink something that a stranger gave to me in an open cup..

  81. o.k. Don .. I’ll try to get positive again ..

    🙂

    thanks for the reminder , cause NO I had forgotten – I was away .. and have been going up and down the mountain .. for the last 4 weeks or so and still doing it . …

    I am sure I would have been reminded when I got my Aug. bank statement .. lol

    I would like to hear something , in some way – from Hillary . Meaning like does she want it anymore???

    that would sure help . .. I will continue to help her all I can , all though I think I have gone over the limit .. with the tee shirt thing .. I really don’t care that much , I mean like what are they gonna do ? .. LoL .. put me in jail ??

    the ‘former’ dems who voted for fisa will come and get me … oh . I am so afraid .

  82. Sorta makes sense-interest due on past due accounts-same as for the rest of us. Would be some big number due to big debt. Though they still include her loans which should be subtracted. My guess, anyway.

  83. brianna, they’ll just send you a letter telling you you went over and if you want to get a refund or contribute it to her GE fund. That’s what happened to mawm

  84. O will never be legitimate-too late to undo what has been done.

  85. garychapelhill- wow, that is amazingly cheap. But I bet he is going 5 star for his comfort.

    How could Hilary’s debt increase unless she if being forced to pick up expenses of these Unity gigs.

  86. riverdaughter and gary i was just told by a bot that i am using a screen name,can someone please tell me my real name since the bots say don tufts is not my real name so it must be true lol.

  87. Here is the AP report. States she raised $2.7 from donors in June. No report for our efforts in July.

    http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CAMPAIGN_MONEY?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2008-07-20-21-14-44

  88. I still think Hillary has a Plan A, B, and C. And, whatever those are, they will be ways that she can serve the people of this country and do her best to get her issues out there. I don’t know if she still wants to be President either and I, too, can’t blame her if she decides it’s not worth it, but I pray that she does want it! We need her!

    I still think her debt needs to be paid off because O. uses that to rationalize why he isn’t bringing in the kinds of $ he did in the past, i.e., his supporters are helping Hillary pay off her debt! Aarrgh!

  89. Sounds like the information Heidi got on Hillary’s debt in July was totally wrong.

  90. Don’t believe the first reports out on her dept. It also included her personal $’s in the total they are showing. The AP SUCKS, they usually are wrong and never retract their mis reporting, but of course, we all know this…

  91. The AP report says she is still loaning her campaign money (1 million.)
    Sounds like she doesn’t really want to pay it off too quickly.
    Plus, those figures are from June and don’t include the July 4th push.
    She also had 23 million for the general.
    Obama has 2.
    It also shows Obama’s not doing squat for her.

  92. Hey folks. How’s everyone tonight?

  93. Does anyone here know anything about the web site hillaryclintonforum?
    It has a report that Will Bowers said Hillary’s debt is paid off.

    http://www.hillaryclintonforum.net/discussion/showthread.php?t=20615

  94. Well, I hope it’s true that the debt has been paid off. That would be fantastic and a giant help to her in Denver when her name is put into nomination.

    Need to head to bed to get ready for work tomorrow. G’nite all.

  95. There does not seem to be any clear figure coming out that either the debt has been paid or nearly paid, or that the figure has now increased by another 5 million. Confusing.

  96. If Hillary is nominated at the convention will she agree, and sign it. Since nobody is talking to her, or even worried about it.

  97. agree Pat .

    & Ohioana I can’t even get that link to open – the link that hillaryclintonforum is using to proove it .. maybe it’s just my puter .. who knows .. this is the link they are saying ‘they’ got it from … the one I can’t get to open.

    http://texashillblog.wordpress.com/2…t-is-paid-off/

  98. Hello all.
    I’ve beeen out of town all day and just began reading this thread.

    elixir, et al, I just came from visiting family who looked into a flight to Denver at the end of the summer.
    The flight to/from Chicago-Denver, on Frontier Airlines, was ~ $170.

    They aren’t PUMA, nor are they going to the Convention. But they were planning a trip to Denver.

  99. Hey, Leslie! Thanks for the cocktail Friday night. You had already gone by the time I got here(very late). Sorry I missed you!

  100. Hey Joan! You are so very welcome. After that mango margarita last weekend, I owed you big time! glad you got the message.

    i have a link to an opinion from today’s Chcago Tribune. I was so hoping to post this tonight
    (now I realize that it could have been posted earlier today. But here it is for anyone who didn’t see it before.

    Anxiety, then Separation

  101. leslie, I followed the link you posted and thought the comments were more interesting than the story.
    Seems the realists were on a roll until the Obamanuts showed up.

  102. I found it interesting this morning when I got the paper. I didn’t even know about the comments until only a few minutes ago. And YES, the comments are good.

  103. It is late, and I go back to work tomorrow. I need to say goodnight.

    See you all, Tuesday. I’m going to the ball game tomorrow night after work.

  104. Thank you for another great post!!
    Flying white doves, I love it. Obama should get onto the stage riding a unicorn (a la http://youtube.com/watch?v=adc3MSS5Ydc )

  105. Hillary reports raising $2.7 million for June and ending the month of June $25.2 mil. in debts. She owes $12. mil. to vendors and lent herself $1 mil. and her total loan to date is 13.2 mil. This mumbers do not include and July figures. If I remember correctly, Will Bower reported the donations had exceeded $ 10.Million. This would leave just a small amount left owed to the vendors. Funds raising has continued since that $10. remark and maybe the debt has been cleared. It does not appear that Obama raised much, if any in June for Clinton.

  106. URGENT:
    Time Magazine is going to be interviewing Nancy Pelosi and they are taking submissions for questions. http://time-blog.com/10questions/nancy-pelosi/#comment-6405
    I’ve already posted my PUMA question, so let’s flood the magazine with PUMA related questions and issues and let TIME MAGAZINE take notice of us!
    And spread the word as far and wide (and quickly) as possible.

  107. […] 21, 2008 in My Power The Confluence by Riverdaughter No Comments Leave a Commenttrackback addressThere was an error with your […]

  108. […] Is the DNC Pro-Choice? (by riverdaughter at The Confluence) What is the difference between having your name on a roll call vote and being explicitly nominated for president at the Democratic Party Convention in Denver? It turns out that one is merely symbolic and the other is a real threat to Barack Obama. If Hillary Clinton’s name is on a roll call vote, her delegates have the opportunity to vote for her but their votes have no more weight than “present”.  They only count if her delegates create a petition to have her name entered into nomination.  If she signs the petition, she can be nominated and the roll call will count, provided the DNC doesn’t contest the petition or try to block it in some way… So, my question is, is the party pro-choice or not.  Do we get a selection of candidates to choose from?  You know, the one who won the biggest and swing states plus popular votes vs the one who won Idaho?  Is this a pro-choice party or is it a Potemkin party? […]

Comments are closed.

%d bloggers like this: