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From FOX News:

Some bloggers opposed to Barack Obama say they suspect Obama’s supporters — with the assistance of Google — may have tried to censor them when the Internet giant froze their Web sites for five days last month.

Seven blogs run by Democrats who oppose Obama’s nomination for the presidency were incorrectly flagged as spam sites by Blogger, the hosting service Google has owned since 2003. Google says it was an automated response from a spam filter.

But the bloggers believe that Web surfers who support Obama took advantage of a loophole in Blogger’s system that allows readers to report spam blogs, the artificial Web sites that abound on the Internet and are used to promote other sites.

“It appears that [Blogger’s] policy can be manipulated by people determined to shut down the free exchange of ideas,” said Carissa Snedeker, whose blog, BlueLyon, was among those that were frozen.

“It’s unusual — I’ve never heard of similar blogs of the same nature being shut down like that,” said Danny Sullivan, editor-in-chief of the tech site SearchEngineLand.com.

Google said in a press release that the blogs were blocked because an automatic spam filter had locked on to those seven Web sites.

“We believe this may have been caused by mass spam e-mails mentioning the ‘Just Say No Deal’ network of [anti-Obama] blogs, which in turn caused our system to classify the blog addresses mentioned in the e-mails as spam,” Google wrote, referring to a coalition of disaffected Democrats who oppose Obama’s candidacy.

Maybe Google is telling the truth, but then again, didn’t we just read that Silicon Valley (home to Google) is a hotbead of Obamamania?  One thing is for sure, the behavior of Obama supporters certainly makes this story plausible.

(Cross-posted at Klownhaus)

262 Responses

  1. I used to love spam, hope, change, ………………

    Hand me a bucket!

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  2. Hey — just got back from the San Francisco rally — we had a GREAT time. I am downloading the video now – then the photo’s.

    Donna Brazilenut came walking down the street and had to walk right through us !!! She didn’t agree with “Donna you promised to resign” sign — she did agree to our “women aren’t HOs” sign. Like we give a shit what she thinks.

    I think we should start a website counting how many days it’s been since the “presumptive” nominee was decided by 795 of her peers that she hasn’t resigned. Have the NPR tape on there. I am taking a class on websites — so not ready to do it yet. But I toss that idea out there.

    Keep up the good work everyone !!!!!

  3. SimoFish, on July 15th, 2008 at 5:37 pm Said:
    how many were you?

  4. only 9 — but we were effective !!!!

  5. Why is it that every article people write about us makes us sound like psychotic paranoid holdouts?

    Apparently, if someone goes to the Rasussen website, they’re still polling Hillary against McCain and she’s winning by 8 points.

  6. Thanks so much for going!

  7. regency – I love that Hillary is ahead, even with a suspended campaign!


    Wanted to post a great new video “I’m Looking Through You”:

  8. Ugh, spam is grotty.

  9. I was blocked as well. This was real and it was no accident – I did not have anything on my blog that would trip an automatic spam filter, this was absolutely deliberate and content-based. All of our blogs got hit at the same time.

    FWIW I don’t *think* it was an inside job (from Google), I think it was Obamabots using a spam-reporting form to aggressively flag sites. Either way, it just shows how incapable of forging unity this group of thugs is.

  10. Obama on Ellen re-run today.

    This was from a few months ago.

    I turned it on and Ellen was saying, “Hillary is saying she’ll be ready on Day 1 . . .Tell me what you will do on Day 1.”

    OBama: a few seconds of hemming and hawing, and a genuinely blank look on his face. Then he jokes that he’ll walk into the Oval Office and sit down at the desk and say “Hey. This is cool.”

    Very slight and awkward laughter from the audience, both in Ellen’s studio and in Texas where he was speaking via satellite. That was on *that* day months ago. Imagine how it sounded today. It was embarassing, juvenile, and completely unpresidential.

    Then: More umming, until Obama says that really on Day 1 the first he will do is call a meeting of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to end the war in Iraq.

    Ellen says something like: “Good, that’s what I want.”

    Now, imagine how that sounded today. I don’t know much about Ellen’s politics, but this rerun made the guy look bad. Like a nitwit and a liar.

    I turned it off at this point. It pretty much said it all to me.

  11. Rasmussen”

    These numbers help explain why Election 2008 is competitive even though events so heavily favor the Democrats — because the Republicans are on course to nominate their strongest possible general election candidate but the Democrats are not.

  12. Magdalena,

    That’s why Ellen loved Hillary. She knew what to say as well as what to do.

  13. Check out the article on Gretawire “Good News, Bad News”. McC says yes to appearing on the show to talk about women’s issues, BO says no.

  14. regencyg: Bless Ellen, I say. She may be doing PUMA work showing that re-run, then. She may be here among us.

  15. OK — some film from today’s rally. This was after the “fund raiser” started.

    Wish I would have had my “flp” out for Brazilenut but I had just put it away — we weren’t really expecting her to be walking down the street !!!

    Shout out to the WARRIORS of the East Bay for showing up !!! New Warrior Amy too !!

  16. SimoFish: Great video. Can’t wait to see Donna B!

  17. If Google can block whatever blog they select one can only imagine what they can do with FISA in their corner. Scary stuff.

  18. didn’t we just read that Silicon Valley (home to Google) is a hotbead of Obamamania

    i saw a story about some SV venture capitalists who were early Obama backers. i think many ppl at Google back Obama.

    however, i didn’t see anything about Silicon Valley being a “hotbed of Obamamania.” of the 4 Congressional Districts that encompass SV, 3 voted for Clinton (Districts 14, 15, and 16). only one voted for Obama (District 14, which includes Stanford as well as Mountain View, where Google is headquartered). Even in District 14, Clinton did fairly well: 54,911 to 63,365 for Obama. (the votes in the other 3 districts were not that close – Clinton won by 20,000 votes in two of the three.)


  19. sorry, i guess i hit the wrong button for my /indent. i hope this works.

    didn’t we just read that Silicon Valley (home to Google) is a hotbead of Obamamania?

    i saw a story about some SV venture capitalists who were early Obama backers. i think many ppl at Google back Obama.

    however, i didn’t see anything about Silicon Valley being a “hotbed of Obamamania.” of the 4 Congressional Districts that encompass SV, 3 voted for Clinton (Districts 14, 15, and 16). only one voted for Obama (District 14, which includes Stanford as well as Mountain View, where Google is headquartered). Even in District 14, Clinton did fairly well: 54,911 to 63,365 for Obama. (the votes in the other 3 districts were not that close – Clinton won by 20,000 votes in two of the three.)


  20. sorry again. my vision is off today. i need preview to be able to read what i’m posting.

    “3 voted for Clinton (Districts 14, 15, and 16)” should be (Districts 13, 15, and 16)

    sorry for any confusion.

  21. LAMusing: Good for Greta!

    Obama: Afraid of Greta. Afraid of traditonally woman-bashing Fox. Afraid of women who care about women. Afraid of Hillary. Afraid of floor votes. Afraid of women who cast floor votes. Afraid of men who cast floor votes.

    Al-Qaeda must be shaking in its boots.

  22. Thanks, folks, for representing us in SF. Someone, I believe it is Delilah Boyd, has a clock up for Donna to resign. Of course, the more advertisements for her resignation promise, the better

  23. SimoFish, thanks for the video and for doing a great job at the meeting.

  24. SimoFish

    Thank you so much for being there. You guys are great!

  25. Al-Qaeda must be shaking in its boots.

    so must the Republicans in the Senate. if he’s afraid of town-hall meetings, afraid of debates, afraid of appearing on Greta, how likely is he to stand up to any bad legislation the Dems agree to pass in order to appease the Republicans? or, e.g., for any SCOTUS nominee the Repubs threaten to filibuster?

  26. Hey SimoFish–I LOVED your sign!! Please save it and screen it to make t-shirts. I’ll be the first in line to buy and distribute. Did my part today to spread the PUMA word and get everyone up to date in my little ‘burg about BO and the cesspool at the DNC. Just my drop in the bucket, but that drop can become the snowball that starts the avalanche that brings down the whole mountain. Go PUMAs!

  27. Just went to read the end of an earlier thread, and folks were talking about the planned entertainment at the August convention. Someone questioned who would sing the national anthem?

    This is really smarmy of me, but maybe they could get that jazz singer who sang the Weldon piece in Denver a couple of weeks ago. Renee Marie, that’s it, she was supposed to sing the National Anthem, and she sang what’s popularly called the Negro National Anthem, Lift Every Voice and Sing. It’s a wonderful piece, but to sing it in place of our National Anthem…..

  28. Way to go San Francisco gang – great signs and great energy – you did us proud.

    Sorry DNC we will NOT be quiet and we will NOT just go away – we’re here to stay – Democracy needs us!

  29. Obamanation is still in full panty-twist mode over the New Yorker cover.

    They need the collective stick removed from their behinds.

  30. Please put me down on the record for saying that when/if he becomes POTUS the access to him will be severely limited just as it is with Bush. No questions unless prepared in advance, only photo ops allowed, everything held tight to the vest, he will be unavailable most of the time, and his apologists will be the only ones center stage.

    We are getting a taste of that now and maybe we can giggle at McCain’s blunders but the press has always had open access to him. It played to his advantage since he became their darling but no questions were off the record.

    This guy has so much to conceal, beginning with his inexperience, that the press gets little from him. His so called policy speeches are just that. Speeches with no follow up questions. Very, very troubling and just another effort to control the message.

  31. YAY Massachusetts:

    The Massachusetts Senate voted Tuesday to repeal a 1913 law used to bar out-of-state gay couples from marrying here. The law prohibits couples from obtaining marriage licenses if they could not legally wed in their home states.

    Now if they had only done this 3 weeks ago, i’d be married right now…

  32. gary and Mawm: Come on up here! I’ve got plenty of room in my 8 room house! So many beautiful outdoor venues for a wedding here in Western MA.

    Only condition, can I be a bridesmaid??

  33. Pat of course….although you know there is no bride, right? he he

  34. “We believe this may have been caused by mass spam e-mails mentioning the ‘Just Say No Deal’ network of [anti-Obama] blogs, which in turn caused our system to classify the blog addresses mentioned in the e-mails as spam,” Google wrote, referring to a coalition of disaffected Democrats who oppose Obama’s candidacy.

    This is the biggest load of horse shit. What they are saying is that anyone capable of spamming(having the computer automatically send out thousands of emails to people who would not be expecting them, which is about everyone with a computer)can bring down entire sites. If this is true, it is actually a really big security hole of Google’s. Something just about anyone could exploit, and that is why I don’t believe it. If this were true, they certainly wouldn’t be broadcasting it. I’m sure there are hackers trying to re-create right now to no avail.

    The fact that they mention the Just Say No Deal co-alition is telling to me. Most of the blogs linked to on the Just Say No Deal web-site already existed before JSND, but I’m sure a lot of the Obama people are clueless to that. They probably first caught wind of the PUMAs and learned about JSND at the same time, conflating the two, so their excuse includes reference to JSND like it really is some kind of central administration.

    Authoritarian rule comes naturally for these people. I don’t think they get what grass roots really is.

  35. I just love getting dressed up!

  36. don’t put it past google to have been behind the shutting down of the websites.
    go to google news page on any given day and u will find BO has about twice as many mentions – and mostly positive ones at that – than mccain.
    even more interesting, if u check foreign corpmedia websites daily which i have done for years, is u will see multiple pro-BO articles on a daily basis and usually NOTHING on mccain.
    in britain, it is particularly noticeable that the rightwing news outlets are the ones most guilty of this – UK Telegraph, UK Daily Mail, UK Times and BBC. it is truly maddening.
    the corpmedia creates “reality” and the pollsters assist them.
    in australia, 7 out of 10 newspapers bought each day are owned by murdoch, and yet the main pollsters, newspoll, are owned by him too. it is truly sickening.
    the fix is in unless u can counter the “official” polls with your own transparent polls.

  37. Pat, that sounds wonderful.

  38. Please put me down on the record for saying that when/if he becomes
    POTUS the access to him will be severely limited just as it is with

    And all of the whiney-ass liberal hypocrites who piss and moan up a storm over this behavior will instantly turn into “yes-but” apologists for it.

    They have no deeply held principles at all. None, not one. Bush locks protestors into “freedom zones” and they act like the Earth is shaking off its axis. Barky does it, and you’re a racist if you complain. Bush only permits scripted appearances, and the founding fathers are rolling over in their graves. Barky does it, and they will applaud. Bush shits on the Constitution and their spittle flies like hail. Barky does it, and they kiss his ass over it.

  39. What I found interesting is that it took 5 days for Google to figure out they weren’t spam sites.

    It should have taken 5 minutes tops.

  40. Anything for you guys! You should know that if you already don’t by now.

  41. Is this an early taste of Big Brother? Wouldn’t doubt it.

  42. Okay. I saw everyone on the other thread disclosing their age.

    Pat – I am a taurus also – May 11 – this explains a lot – Eddy is mine.

    I’m 20 years old.

    Oh wait, I meant my waist is 20 inches.

    Damn, I’m confused, I meant Michelle has 20 people that like her.

    And 20 is the number of minutes it will take to get BO, MO and the kids into the Chevrolet Minivan that they will drive away from the convention in when Hillary wins.

    20 – ummmmmmmm – how many versions of one story BO has under his belt!

    20 – the number of years for each count BO and MO will receive on each indictment.

    $20 + $0.08 – the number of dollars everyone should be contributing by Friday if you got it and it won’t hurt.
    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule$

  43. myiq2xu,
    I am a software developer. There is so much information Google has on those sites. Two minutes and they would know they weren’t spam blogs.

  44. I was just saying to Ed this morning at breakfast, can you believe the number of stories Obama puts out each day? He responded that Obama must be an actual Texan since they are so much in the habit of exaggerating everything.

    I had to agree.

  45. San Francisco says you’re welcome — can’t wait to meet everyone in Denver !!!

  46. Is it true that Murphy got a death threat today?

  47. Ya’ll know me well. College freshman-to-be, Scorpio, 18 years old, November 15 1989.

    Also, a very adept Big Dawg enthusiast.

  48. It would not surprise me one bit if she had — who was that one asshole Barkybot, some elected idiot, who said something about how when the fascists come to put us in concentration camps, he’ll just let them?

    It’s not THEM I’m worried about, buddy. Wrong pronoun. When the death threats are coming only from Barky’s side, then they are the ones I’m worried about.

  49. regencyg – that’s my dad’s birthday -1925.

    Can you give us a clue where you are going?

  50. Janis, that’ was Steven Ybarra.

  51. SimoFish,
    “Shout out to the WARRIORS of the East Bay for showing up !!! ”
    Donna’s also scheduled to be in Seattle and Portland this week. PUMAs are organizing to “show her some love”.

  52. Carol, I thought I told everybody already which was probably not the wisest thing to do security-wise but I’m not there yet.

    It’s in California. The Claremont College Consortium: Claremont McKenna College, Pomona College, Harvey Mudd, Claremont University, and Scripps College.

    I’m only enrolled at one but I can have a dorm at any of them, eat at any of them, take classes at any of them. I’m excited.

  53. What city is that in?

    My son went to USC and never came home.


  54. In Claremont, CA, near Santa Monica.

  55. Oh my God! You will be very close to where my son lives and works.

    You will love it.

  56. Just talked to my 86-year-old mother-in-law, who was planning to vote Democrat for the first time in her Republican life, to support Hillary as President. I was surprised to hear she is still pulling for Hillary so badly, she is hoping Obama will choose her as VP. I cannot overstress how completely unlike her Republican self she is these days. But Obama dealt her a setback today; she watched him speak. She reported to me–and I could hear the surprise and disappointment in her voice–that he is not a good speaker. This from a woman raised in the backwoods, who speaks hesitantly and with what she knows is poor grammar. She wasn’t fooled; and she wasn’t inspired.

    Just a report on one nice older lady who votes, but doesn’t blog . . .

  57. Fantastic. Glad to hear it. I was afraid I wouldn’t like it.

  58. Santa Monica is the beeyootiful part of LA

  59. Magdalena, I’m betting there are a whole lot of stories just like your mother-in-law’s that we aren’t seeing. THey’re happening across the country.

    And people wonder why Hillary is still outpolling McCain & Obama! She’s the people’s choice.

  60. ParentofEd–a little off the subject, but since you brought it up…I have a problem with our National Anthem lately. Not with song itself, but the way it’s being sung, and by whom. I am so sick and tired of people singing our Anthem like they are trying out for ‘American Idol’. AND I like to sing the song myself. Can anyone remember the days of being in a large arena, and hearing the whole place singing? God, that just gave me goosebumps. Why do I have to listen to little Idol songster/songstress mangle MY Anthem? Ferchrissakes, there was even a FLOAT IN THE ROSE PARADE sponsored by an organization that is teaching children the National Anthem because NOBODY KNOWS THE WORDS ANYMORE.

  61. It will be warm during the day away from the coast and cold at night all year long. Take you coat, sweaters and socks.

    It’s hard to get used to the time change because all of their tv starts at 8 vs 7pm. When I lived in East Bay SF it was really hard to stay awake. I missed all late night tv for the 10 months I was there.

  62. DanceswithPumas — We had a blast !!!!

    Donna Brazilent — she didn’t like our sign – Donna, you promised to resign – but then –we don’t give a PUMA what she thinks.

    I encourage Seattle and Portland to stay positive. We handed out the PUMA flyer and we had copies of the Denver Group ad — we tried to use a lot of humor.

    One old man wearing a suit, hat – he must have been at least 85 years old — said – “what are you doing? ” We told him — “we’re voting for anybody but NObama.” He said “yeah, I can get behind that !!! ”

    Overall we all agreed we had a really good response. We made sure we didn’t block the sidewalk. We kept it positive and up beat.

    One woman came over and said — “the lady in the pantsuit said it was over!” I said “I can think for myself and ANYBODY BUT OBAMA” — we had to keep chanting it to drown her out.

  63. regency: If you did tell us, I forget your major/minor. I am so proud of you even though I have never laid eyes on you. And you better take that laptop along to stay connected to us.

  64. SimoFish: You and you ladies rock!!

  65. Carol: I have 50.00 extra in my checking account. Where do you want me to go to make this happen?

  66. Pat: Biology&Political Science–double maj.

    I’ve not yet become the proud owner of a laptop but I’m hoping to get one at my scholarship conference next week, coincidentally sponsored by Magic Johnson who’s a big Hillary supporter.

  67. Magdalena, I hear you LOUD and clear. There is a whole movement – I call it the “silent movement” folks who are just like your mother – going about her everyday business and NOT voting or impressed with him. I know several people like this. My mother in Iowa and her friends – love Hillary – and voting for McCain a republican for the first time. I was in Boston last month took a side trip to Rhode Island – had brucnh with a dear friend’s mother – she said the same thing — can’t and won’t support NObama.

  68. Irlandese: Vanessa Williams sang the anthem the correct way at some event. Did a great job.

  69. Pat: Thank you for being proud of me. It’s always really encouraging the hear–read–that.

  70. SimoFish: Got to tell you, from my neck of the woods I have yet to meet anyone voting for Obama.

  71. regency: XX00 To my little playmate in Texas and another Big Dawg fan. Not so much like you, but a fan just the same.

  72. Pat: {{{{hugs}}} & solidarity.

  73. Bank of America – deposit it into my account!

    Why don’t you save it until later in the week – I am hoping we are going to have another drive in the next couple of days!

    Otherwise, go and buy yourself another T and post!

    I love Magic – he is a great man!

  74. SimoFish: Congratulations for your picketing today. Brave thing to do, in Obama and Pelosi Land.

  75. Carol: I get to see him next week so maybe we’ll talk.

  76. Carol: I am sticking with you, girl. Want to watch our totals go up, up, up! Food shopping tomorrow and with coupons, specials, etc., I may have a little saved from that to add in.

    You call it, I will follow your lead. (God only knows where that will take me.)

  77. regency: Be sure to hand him copies of those diaries you created. I have them in a folder if you need them. I am sure he will be doubly impressed. You have a true gift and I don’t throw that around indiscriminately.

  78. Tell Magic to call Hillary and tell her to stay off of that sinking ship. Tell him to tell her to read the blogs and know we ain’t done with this election yet.

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  79. Pat: Yeah, I’m sure he’d appreciate that. I’ll keep a copy because I can. It can’t hurt too much. I had to write an essay to win and the lady STILL remembers me and it’s been three months since she interviewed me. Apparently my name is memorable. There are not a ton of Regency’s out there.

  80. regency: Use your gifts. Those diaries were beautifully rendered, especially from someone your age. You can plead that without the laptop you may not be able to create more of the same. Magic always seemed like a great guy, particularly among his younger fans. Promise you will do the same in the future when you have achieved the means to do so.

  81. Charles: Fantastic news isn’t it? Let’s hope some more will see the light and act accordingly.

  82. SimoFish, I used to live in SF–thanks for standing up for us out there.

    Simo and Pat: It’s a mixed bag of voters among those I communicate with. Just three examples: I have an academic friend in his forties who will vote Obama. When I asked him what he saw that was so inspiring in Barack, my friend said he reminds him of Michael Stipe and Sting. My hand to God, that was all he could come up with. I have a 52-year-old businesswoman friend who was a Hillary supporter and like me has never not voted, has always voted Democrat, but who will stay home in November. Most of my family and in-laws are Republican and will vote McCain. My husband is a Hillary Democrat who doesn’t like Obama but will vote for him with fingers crossed, because he is a Democrat.

    Yes, I know, I’m working on him . . .

  83. Charles: I was just about to post the news as well. Here is a link to NoQuarter which links to Alegre:

    If this rumor turns out to be real this is a very big deal. Even if Obama gets the nomination, it’s pretty embarassing when half the party along with a good number of the SDs still want Hillary a month after she suspended her campaign.

  84. Should be fun, reg. I have tons of friends who went to Claremont/etc and they all loved it.

  85. Haha. Magdalena, I am also working on my friends who were Hillary supporters but for reasons like SCOTUS are holding their noses to vote for Obama. I’ve already sent all of them links to this site and the PUMA blog. We need to let them know that there are many of us out there and there are other choices besides voting for Obama.

  86. Magdalena: I have to admit I have never known an election season like this where the Dems have been so unmotivated about their candidate. We were always able to find the weaknesses from the other side, but here we sit, discussing the apparent lack of qualifications and inexperience the beauty they have stuck us with envelops.

    In “the old days” I would be taking delight in pointing out McCain’s deficiencies but with this guy at the top of the ticket it is almost hypocritical. He is just, in not more, equally as bad.

  87. Pat, I definitely will. I’m still writing but it is incredibly intimidating to read the likes of madamab, William, RD, GCH, and so many others and then put my own writing out there. So much talent out her; who needs me.

    Chances are that Magic will give all the scholars a laptop and printer. That’s what he’s done in the past. Either way I’ll get a laptop and keep working from Cali.

    GQ: I’m glad to hear that. I’ve never known anybody that went there but I’m looking forward to it. I want to join their Debate Society. (Can you tell I love to debate?)

  88. Pat, I agree.

    For years I have defended my status as a Democrat to Greens and others who have traditionally regarded the two parties as interchangeable. This year, for the first time, I find myself completely unable to do it. Each time Obama opens his mouth and violates the separation of church and state, or the right to privacy, or the right of a community to regulate guns, or the right of a woman in mental distress to choose an abortion, I am left with no recourse.

    No, SCRATCH the last two words above, and you get:


  89. Charles and DisenfranchisedVOter,

    thanks for the links. i hope these are the first of many.

    many SDs waited until June to endorse Obama; i don’t think most of those who waited particularly want BO. some definitely prefer Hillary and others live in districts with strong Clinton support.

    regencyg, congratulations! i’m sure you’ll like Claremont but it’s nowhere near Santa Monica. it’s on the far east end of LA County next to San Bernadino County. very different weather! but it’s pretty and an excellent place to go to college.

  90. Despite what Obamanation says, I’ve never believed the “McCain is Bush III” meme.

    My bro-in-law is a diehard conservative fundie and he thinks McCain is a liberal.

    I think he’s a centrist, just like O-whats-his-name but without the slick packaging.

  91. Reg, I’m not a fan of Southern Cal in general but the area can be a lot of fun.

  92. sassysenora: Thanks for the correction. I’ve never been there. I was supposed to go months ago but my mother intervened in her way and sank that plan. Ugh. She did that everytime I wanted to go on a trip! Do you know how many times I had to bite my tongue? Do not complain about my never having been away from home if you intervented every time I tried! I love her but good gracious, mother.

  93. GARY / MAWM: So are there two Kims?

  94. regencyg,

    each voice is important. never forget that.

    don’t compare yourself. you are unique and worthy. you never know whose voice will resonate most with listeners or readers. your voice may touch people that others cannot.

  95. regency: Let me spell this out as plainly as I can: you are as talented as any of the diarists on this blog. If not, you would never have been permitted to have been allowed to assume that revered place.

    Who needs you? You would be surprised. Reread those diaries and the comments? Can you honestly say that you did not learn something as you went along? Opinions expressed come right from the intellect and the beating hearts of these posters. I am always amazed of what I learn just by lurking as a matter of fact.

    Having the ability to express yourself is the highest form of communication. You do so with much insight and an equal measure of wit. A pretty impressive combination as most on here would attest.

    You have managed to keep pace with the conversations and plenty of times I have learned from you. Imagine that, you have been able to reach across the miles and be able to impart knowledge to someone well passed your age group who has been around awhile.

    Until you revealed your age I had no idea that you were this young. It was amazing that someone of your years could offer such strong and well presented opinions and hold your own as well.

    What you have to offer? So much that has yet to be realized. I told you once before that you will make a name for yourself one day and I will remember that I knew you when.

    You are allowed to doubt yourself but never your abilities. They are solid.

  96. I don’t know where else to ask this….I am moving my blog to wordpress. Could someone change my link for me please?


    Thanks very much.

    Mountain Sage

  97. Eh, soCal is nice. I like everything but the goddamned traffic. Other than that, the diversity is fabulous (I can hear nine different languages walking to the post office), and you can get fantastic food any time of the day or night.

    I know people who complain about the weather (my roommate misses greenery and pines for Oregon), but I LOVE not having to care about rain, and I’m practically a desert organism myself, so I love the hot weather, too. It cools down at night, so it’s still entirely reasonable, in my estimation, even when it goes near 100 during the day.

    In a decade though, who knows how hot it will be getting. 😛

  98. I am so still clinging to the belief that the supers will do the right thing. Otherwise, the fizz went out of my enthusiasm that Saturday that Hillary suspended.

    I will only feel vindicated when Obama loses the general. We do not need his brand of politics as we deserve much more.

  99. I should warn you though, that I’m closer to the coast than San Bernardino, and HOLY SHIT does it get hot there. Again though, it’s more livable at night — and speaking as someone originally frmo the east coast, as long as it cools down at night, that’s all I ask. Just let me SLEEP fergawdzsake.

  100. It all depends on their being a floor vote. Oh, I’m still going to feel cheated and vote for Johnny Mac no matter how much I can’t stand him because Barky scares the hell out of me.

    However, they will never in a million years permit a floor vote and roll call. Ever. They will steal it in plain sight, and every whiney liberal Moan of Arc who complained about the Florida mess in 2000 will look the other way for it. 😛

  101. Until you revealed your age I had no idea that you were this young. It was amazing that someone of your years could offer such strong and well presented opinions and hold your own as well.

    no dis on regencyg bc i agree that she is strong and articulate. i think she writes very well.

    however, my daughter (who is the same age), many of her friends and classmates, and many of my friends’ kids are also strong and articulate. often more so than ppl my age bc many of them have fewer opportunities to discuss politics, give presentations, etc. ditto for many writers on the university blogs (or wells, etc.) that i’ve read. some of the best writers are undergrads.

  102. Pat Johnson, thanks. I can’t even respond to the rest of them because we’d be here all night, but thanks goes a long way, I hope.

    Janis, I live in Texas. It’s summer 9 months out of the year. I’m expecting hot. I was expecting to be attending Bryn Mawr so I was about to start shopping for cold but that’s another old frustrating story.

  103. Then the only good thing that might happen is for the nation to see this “hijacking” up close. I remember 1968. Not a pretty sight and the Dems went down to defeat.

    We may be a bunch of bozo’s as a nation at times, but the American spirit always demands fair play. This may be the one thread that holds us together in the end. Righting the wrong in the only way left to us. Our vote.

  104. sassysenora: I didn’t take it as a diss. I have underclassmen friends who are far more articulate than me. When we went to the Alley theatre earlier this semester, this junior and I discussesd politics. He’s a very stayed, calm, rational McCain fan and I’m obviously pro-Hillary. We commisserated on the notion that Obama is a frakking lightweight. What is he doing here? It was great to be able to talk politics with somebody, anybody.

    You should have been at the forum I went to at DeBakey High School where we talked about voting fot the first time. There were some mad smart folks there. It was on the news the Monday before March 4th.

    I’ll have to dig up the link so that you can find out how much we loves our politcs here in TX.

  105. Do I hear the sound of the chickens coming home to roost??

    From Politico:

  106. It will be cold there at night. Especially near the mountains. I looked it up. It is known for trees and PHD’s.

    Jessica Alba
    Mark McGuire

    lives or lived there.

    A person can be drafted – that would be Hillary.

  107. regencyg,

    if you can find the link, i’d appreciate it.

    i think ppl of different ages, from different places and cultures, etc. can learn a lot from each other. not always but often enough.

  108. Google is one of the top 20 donaters to Obama.

  109. Would anybody mind if I just emailed it to you? I trust you guys but this is a public forum and I am on this video so I don’t felel %100 about just putting it out there.

    Anybody who does want to see it can just email me at asabbeyaspossible(at)yahoo(dot)com.

  110. One reason googling for Hillary always pulls up that “Vote Different” video “produced” by an Obama campaigner is that google is a beneficiary of campaign donations from the Obama camp:


    Obama’s campaign spent nearly $3 million on online advertising related purchases between January and April. The biggest recipient of the Democratic Presidential hopeful’s online ad dollars was Google.

    The search giant scored over 70 percent of money spent on online media buys for the Illinois Senator’s campaign this year through April, according to information compiled from Federal Election Commission filings. More than $2.08 million was paid to Google, as listed by Obama for America in its itemized FEC reports.

    After spending about $640,000 in January on online advertising, the campaign pumped its online ad budget up to $1.18 million in February. Expenditures tapered to about $905,000 the following month. Filings show spending of only around $234,000 in April. However, previous monthly reports suggest more April online ad payments will be reported in the future; Google didn’t even appear in April spending data supplied by the campaign.

  111. Pat: Perhaps the supers will do the right thing after all. Many did wait until the last minute to flip over from Hill. And there was enormous pressure. They were being threatened with primaries. And Dean kept throwing the “new voters, new money” story in their faces.

    But I believe they are slowly learning that the new money was old Republican anti-Hillary money and the new voters were also Republicans. And the “new generation, whse imaginations were captured” turned out to be 800 paid bloggers!

    One by one, we need to let them know we still love them and they can come back home. Except Pelosi, Dean, Brazile, Daschle, Richardson, Kerry, and Kennedy. (My apologies to any Kool Aid drinker I may have inadvertently left out.

  112. MyDD has a handwringing post about us up, check it out its hilarious


    apparently we are all old, techno ignoramuses who have developed some sort of psychosis because our over 40 brains don’t know how to deal with the internet. Regency, if you’re out there, i’m sorry but your generation (at least those online) are the whiniest bunch of elitist snot nosed brats imaginable. here’s a sample

    Re: I have spent time with Alegre (2.00 / 1)

    I think a paper could well be written on the psychology of the online PUMA phenomenon. It’s puzzling how otherwise rational adults could behave this way.

    And they’re almost all over 40, right? I wonder if its how that age bracket deals with online interaction as compared with under 40’s…

    And yes, I know that there are plenty of people of that age who handle the Internet just fine. That doesn’t mean that there’s no difference for those who avoided getting online well beyond the rest of us. I’m just speculating, but the reason I ponder this topic is the peculiar way these folks have internalized all this.

    It is very hard to understand.

    OMG this is what 8 years of NCLB has wrought!!!!

  113. steveeboy – we don’t exist so why are you here?

    Note, Hillary’s people have jobs and lives and families……………………..

    We aren’t a bunch of college kids with time on our hands – well, regencyg is.

    Now, goodbye and good luck thinking BO is winning.

    It’s good you think 9 of us paid off Hillary’s debt.

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  114. garychapelhill, I don’t claim this generation. I claim Hillary’s and that’s all there is to it.

  115. steveboy knows he’s not allowed here, besides its past his bedtime and that always makes him cranky….if he sticks his nose in again, just ignore him

  116. gary – you left the extra “e” for effort out of his name.

  117. heh, guess he’s one e short of a full alphabet

  118. gary,

    thanks for the link. it was amusing. they all seem like concern trolls except they’re not trolling since it’s now an Obama site. but their clueless “questions” and theories which are merely attempts to bash us in a slightly reworded form seem the same.

    it seems ironic that they’re ostensibly trying to understand PUMAs since that would have been much easier if they would actually talk to us (without being condescending or blindly spouting the same talking points) instead of driving us off sites like myDD. of course, that would take work and might challenge their narrow stereotypes so that must be off the table.

  119. What S-boy and the author cited by GCH have in common is that they assume because we don’t drink Kool-aid there must be something wrong with us.

    “Is it a genetic defect or is there an environmental cause?”

  120. gary,

    You can’t judge the 18-30 age group based of the online keyboard jockeys. They are arrogant because they can hide behind their anonymity. And some are just ignorant and out of touch–can you really take Stoller and Bowers seriously? I know I never did.

    I don’t think these blozos represent the age group, but I do think there are some generational battles we are now facing (and that has implications for Social Security, Medicare and even Universal Health Care). As someone who worked to bridge the generational divide in my last community, I blame Obama for these battles and am not happy.

  121. MyIQ,
    And that is an extremely dangerous mindset to have. When you start thinking “something is wrong” with a group of people, you start losing the ability to treat them as people.

  122. I was checking out that MyDD thread. Apparently, many of them are “puzzled.” Wonder when they added that word to their collective vocabulary…

  123. Can ya’ll ignore the troll? Really? Just because they get their jollies out of disrupting blogs, doesn’t mean we have to let them. They embarrass themselves enough without us having to constantly engage them on non reasonable grounds.

  124. regency, gq,

    I guess i should apologize, for lumping them all together I’m kinda doing the same thing they are…oops

  125. Gary:

    Trolls aren’t people

  126. did anyone ever see the gap troll?

  127. You can apologize by buying me a drink in Denver, Gary :o). (Although I’m not certain I’ll be able to go. Sigh)

  128. Wow! Lots of good news on this thread. I hadn’t heard about the Mass. news. Gary and Maum, come on up. We are a lot closer to you than Calif.

    Regencyg, That quote from Rassmussen Reports is terrific. We should all forward it to Howard and Donna.

    SimoFish, You did great! Kudos for contributing to Donna’s coming nervous breakdown.

  129. GCH: No offense taken.

    SophieL: Wait until they bust out with the word “quizzical.” Then you’ll know they’re being paid in thesauruses.

  130. Gary did you find out if there are two kims?

  131. The Fox story does get some of it wrong — there were more than 7 blogs — there were several more — all within a few minutes of each other and all listed in the blogroll at justsaynodeal. WhatSuddenly was one of the blogs and when I got back up and running — just about a day and a half in my case — I wrote about it. Comments really picked up only they were obamabots–but, hey, I could delete them. PUMA power.

  132. gary, i assumed that many of the negative comments about PUMAs were from ppl who are over 40. the person who posted the comment you quoted said s/he was 49. (though s/he should learn to write; this -“I wonder if its how that age bracket deals with online interaction as compared with under 40’s…”- strongly implies that s/he is under 41.)

    i think PUMAs tend to be older women and the OFB tend to be younger white or black men but there is quite a bit of variation in both populations. it’s easy to forget that sometimes.

  133. hey regency…..my niece graduated from Pomona a few years ago and she really loved it! I can put you in touch with her if you have questions. she’s very nice.

    you gotta like a school that uninvites Alberto Gonzales to speak.

    and…..my niece’s advisor ended up on Lynn Cheney’s list of dangerous college professors. he was so proud he framed the list and hung it in his office!

  134. Hehe…I’ll take this as a compliment! (From that same thread over there.)

    What they’ve started is like a snowball rolling down a mountain:

  135. It’s interesting that they enter blogs with the sole purpose of provocating attacks on themselves. It’s a very dysfunctional hobby. I think they are “The Catcher in the Rye” crowd.

  136. Kiki, I would love that! And yes any school that does that is worth its salt. Dude, the school sounds cooler and cooler.

    Sometimes the school that isn’t your first choice can end up being the best choice.

  137. Regencyg,

    Congratulations! You’d better not forget about us when you get to CA. I hope you get that laptop and write some more posts for The Confluence.

  138. Gary – LOL! Thanks for posting those comments.

    sassysenora – My stepmother, a 67-year-old AA; my father, a 66-year-old Jewish man; and my brother, a 38-year-old Jewish man, are all Obamans.

    My brother’s girlfriend, a nice Jewish goil in her 20’s, is a Clintonite, and so are her parents, liberal wealthy Californians.

    You never can tell.

  139. regency, I’ll email you

  140. yes kim, that does seem to be a different kim. I don’t know how that happens…maybe bboomer knows.

    that post seems to be just a way to start spreading the new “anti-pumas” sites….its cross posted at something called clintonistas for obama and also links to yestodemocracy. I’ve been to both sites and they are VERY poorly written and seem t have no audience…it really is as if our trolls took katiebird’s advice and started their own blogs, but no one came. I guess My DD is trying to do outreach for them

  141. Oh dear, we made poor adtleft cry!


  142. bostonboomer: I may be around less at first but I’m really committed to this whole business, either getting Hillary or getting McCain. I’ll be doing that then too. I unfortunately start school during the Convention so I’ll be completely useless. Expect me to be online all the time.

  143. Okie-dokie, Kiki.

  144. Does anyone else have the sense that we wound down early tonight? Is it me?

  145. Regency,

    The Claremont Colleges are very special. You are closer to Pasadena
    than to Santa Monica, but downtown Pasadena was very hip in
    the late 70s and up to the early 90s (last time I was there). The classic
    Southern California downtown is a prize. Pasadena was a wealthy
    town from the beginning. The smog may or may not be acceptable.
    The cars get cleaner but more people move to Southern California and more gets paved over. It’s a desert that is artificially supporting many more than the 650,000 that the L.A. Basin can support in an environmentally healthy way.
    One hopes the mountains are out (not covered by smog) more often
    than not. I haven’t been back to my hometown of L.A. for a long
    time. It is both exciting to be back, but sad to see all of the landscape paved over. My father had the same story to tell, but it really
    was paradise when he was a boy.

  146. CB: A lot of natural landscapes are getting the same treatment. Soon we’re going to have parking lots where our parks used to be.

    I hope there will be something left by the time I get there. Hasn’t CA been on fire for 3 weeks?

  147. My honorable Conflucians, seems like my time to comment has been limited to late evening, but I salute you!

    MYIQ2XU: LOVE THE PICTURE! Thanks for helping me out with Progressive/EJones last night. We must institute a Conflucian pledge to not engage the trolls.

    RegencyG: YOU GO GIRL!!!! Remember, don’t fall in love too fast while at school. I’ll give you permission to get married & have babies AFTER you earned your degree, especially if you are going far from home. YOU GOT THAT? You don’t want your Scorpion Dominican Sister on your ass. Always save a piece of your heart JUST FOR YOU.

  148. If we are winding down early, I’m disappointed. For once I have a little time to spent with my Conflucian pals. Oh well, my two weeks of torture will be over in a few days.

  149. after the degree? Shoot, she needs at least a good five years after school to enjoy life :o).

  150. sorry every one fuzzy was out with the boyz tonight and the bots among them are excited about an obama/clinton ticket….they are convinced that no republican could win in this economy…..and that obama din not vote for FISA he pushed the wrong button. well fuzzy is tired and trying to get rested up for this weekend am going to jax for big pool party.


  151. Oh, poor, deluded BTD at TalkLeft. He has called the election for Obama already.

  152. Ah, BB — I’m just getting here. And the party is over?

  153. I could use some company while I do some research and work on ye ol’ resume, BB. Otherwise, I might get back to that book. I started reading.

  154. katiebird,

    It’s not over for me. I’m glad to see you. I’m going to stay awake for a bit longer.

    Hi fuzzy!

  155. gq,

    What are you reading?

  156. I’ve got a stack of books I don’t want to read. I might go back to ones I liked….

  157. I gave in and put on Larry King who is beginning to look an awful lot like a lizard because his Nibs was on at 9. It took about 5 minutes of it then turned over to Hannity who was really going after Bill Richardson about Obama and his changing views. Well naturally Old Bill said that Obama was not changing his views but Hannity mentioned the website. The new word out there now for website changing is…..get ready for it…..updates!

  158. Am reading a book based on short stories by an African author called: Tell Then You Are One of Them. Powerful stuff.

  159. SM: Don’t worry. I fall in lust, not in love. And then I don’t do anything about it so I think we need to worry about me being a eunuch not a wife.

    Fuzzy: Obama/Clinton will not happen in this lifetime.

    Madam: BTD has always been deluded, but that’s neither here nor there. He’s also been wrong a lot.

  160. did anyone notice “obama for america”(get me the vomit bucket) is strangely close to “Bartlett for America” from the west wing remember leo came up with the idea/slogan writing it on a cocktail napkin.

    looks like even that was plagerized….not one original idea….

    Mr Obama you are no President Bartlett-

    can we have hillary back now?


  161. Here’s a question to ponder:

    If Obama is so freaking inspirational, why did his popularity peak in February?

    I haven’t heard of anyone converting to Obamanism since then.

    Reluctant support, yes, but not conversion.

  162. pat, i didn’t understand about three things in your comment.. 🙂 maybe its bed time.

    whats a Nib?

    hannity mentioned what website?

  163. fuzzy,

    I want Hillay back in the worst way. I really miss her smiling face. Obama is so dour and sour.

  164. fuzzy, did you hear that Mass. now allows out of state gay couples to wed? Pat is going to be a bridesmaid, maybe you could be a groomsman…we”ll have a virtual wedding.

  165. Sorry, His Nibs and Hannity was talking about Obama “scrubbing” the website Prior to his speech on Iraq. Then changing what he originally said a few months back.

  166. Fuzzy,

    I thought the same thing. That is disgusting. Bill and Hillary combined are more like Bartlet than Obama could ever be. He is Matt Santos who had no business in the White House even on fictional television. (Ironically, Matt Santos is based on Obama–and just as arrogant. Axelrod was a consultant on the show.) This man is all fiction.

    The country still picks Hillary, fuzzy. You saw that Rass poll putting Hillary 8 pts ahead of McCain in a head-to-head?

  167. regency that is true-but I let them dream i said Obama/Kerry they asked me what do you want us to lose? I told them I was not one of us.

    next week I will float Obama/Hagel

    see how that goes over?


  168. BB, I’m reading The Great Experiment by Strobe Talbott. It’s exactly along the lines of my thinking, so I’m too biased to be objective.

    I just finished Armageddon in Retrospect, a collection of unpublished works by Vonnegut and The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao by Junot Diaz. I highly recommend the latter.

  169. Regencyq–you are moving to my old stomping grounds! I grew up in Temple City, which is a few mins southwest of Pasadena. My 90-year-old grandmother still lives in Chino, which is right down the road from Claremont. My best friends from grade school are in Claremont and Corona. Claremont McKenna is a very prestigious school–you are obviously as bright as your posts and comments indicate. You ARE the hope for the next 60 years. You’ve put my mind at rest that young people are not obsessed with mindless media entertainment, and can think for themselves. Good Luck!!!

  170. gq,

    I envy you having time to read. I guess I have to work harder to get my disseration finished so I can be a PhD like you.

  171. hi guys! how are the conflucians this evening?

    that spam in the cd tray is makin me sick! lol

    I hate spam as much as I hate hotdogs and spinach.

  172. Also when asked about Bill Clinton, Obama made the usual crapola speech about how “Bill is such a talented and well respected name throughout the world, I would love to consult with him but I also respect Bush Sr on his worldview along with Brent Scowcroft and Jim Baker and Colin Powell”. That is when I tuned out. Republicans all and Colin Powell lost every shred of credibility with me when he went to the UN to plead Bush’s lies and knew it.

    But Jim Baker! The architect of the 2000 debacle. Obama has some real love for the GOP.

  173. Love hot dogs and spinach. Not necessarily together….

  174. Gary I would love to be a groomsman-but could we call it best bear?


    yes i saw the raz poll

    obama/mccain obama + 3

    clinton/mccain clinton + 8

    This is I believe first proof there is a Puma/JSND effect. Those five percentage pts difference are pumas and clinton dems who are not getting on the unity pony! 6 weeks and we are already affecting the polling.

    I am awaiting the reverse lemming effect where all of hillary’s supporters see we are not budging and falling into line and they begin to run away for the big “o”.

    some polling groups will soon be saying that unity is not working and begin to poll us on our feelings and then the party may have to listen!

  175. Word, Fuzzy!

    Good night, lovely Conflucians! New play tomorrow. 🙂

  176. Fuzzy, try Obama/Dean just to see what happen.

  177. nighty night madamab..

  178. Pat I am not so sure Colin Powell “knew” Bush was lying about WMD I think the Bush administration carefully manipulated Gen Powell and the intel he got. I want to give him the benefit of the doubt here.

    Yes shame on him (gen Powell) for allowing himself to be manipulated but do cast him as a total bad guy. I had a friend who was a driver for col powell and said the guy was a no bullsh*t guy and really to the oath of his office seriously.

    I think his hasty retreat from the administration was because he could not stand working for people who lied to him.


  179. madamab: Anything in there for moi????

  180. BB,
    It is nice to get sleep. Finishing up the written dissertation was a nightmare. I had ~30′ of sleep during the last three days and have no idea how I was functional. The last couple months were a bear. I was working on paper we were submitting, had to get my oral presentation together and my written dissertation together. I slacked a little too much on certain aspects, and I wouldn’t recommend doing that. As an aside, I’d recommend using Open Office for the written part. You can count on the PDF converter every time, and it’s easier to keep track of figures/images–if you’re not using LaTeX, of course. The nice thing about Open Office is that you can cross-platform with no problems, I jump around between Windows (booooo) and Linux (woohoo). It’s also freeware and open source, which I’m all about.

  181. Totally off Topic but, mister just found this cool video of a little kid playing Come Together

  182. bostonboomer, you are so right:

    in love with power
    please not this man
    not at this hour

    ‘Night all!

  183. actually I was thinking of

    Obama/Please someone run with Me!

    as a bumper stickeror

    Obama/I dont need anyone


  184. Michael: Sorry, that was no hasty retreat. He remained for 4 years. And he knew he was being lied to and still sat there with all those reservations while these kids were sent over there to die. I will never forgive that since Powell had enjoyed a sterling reputation up until then. Even Tony Blair had members of his cabinet resign in protest.

    Scowcroft at least wrote an op ed page in protest before the finalization so I give him credit. But Powell’s resignation may have made a huge difference. Now we will never know for sure.

  185. so what you think?

  186. Ok, Ok, I had to use Endnote on Windows/Word (booo) for my references. Sigh.

  187. Cool kid!!!

  188. Can’t wait Madamab!

    Irlandese: I didn’t know it was so well-known. Glad to hear it. I’ve heard good things about it and I’m pretty excited to go. Thank you for the compliment.

    Pat: I think Pizza and spinach is the combinationt hat needs to die. Forever.

    Fuzzy: We told them. We’ve been telling them for months. They don’t listen.

  189. Think it will be Obama/Richardson Obama/Hagel Obama/McGaskill Try rhyming those.

  190. Pat! Isn’t he? We watched it through twice we liked him so much!

  191. Entirely unrelated rant:

    WHY the FUCK will no one simply tell me what a Blackberry costs per freaking month?!?!?!?!

    I want phone, texting, and browsing. That’s it. Just that. That’s all I want! Why is it impossible to find out what the hell the stupid thing will cost per month?! Christ, it’s like buying a damned car.

  192. I loved what he was doing with his right hand.

  193. OMG, gary, if you get married here in MA there is so much I can help you with. Will it be an ocean wedding? Where to have the reception? I know several lovely florists. Oh this could be great fun!

  194. masslib, i’ve been to MA once, about three weeks ago on the way to Unity. I defer to your wisdom on a MA wedding

  195. Fuzzy,

    I say what about Obama/To Be Announced ’08!

  196. Jon Stewart on TDS did a bit on the New Yorker cover.

    I don’t get the hoopla. It wasn’t funny, nor offensive.

  197. The Berkshires, Cape Cod, overlooking the harbor, the Butterfly Garden, even the Cheers bar! Endless sources.

  198. yeah Pat but I am sorry for the General and he has spent the last few yrs making up for it and I am sure because of his character that he has had many sleepless nights over the butchers bill of this war…

    I also think that he may have believed that WMD did exsist. I know there is not a self serving bone in his body if there was he could have run and won in a 2000 prez bid no matter which party he chose to run under.

    Pat I do see your point about the general, but it is so counter to his character to knowingly do that for personal gain. I have to believe there was something noble in his actions if he knew anything.


  199. I have a feeling it’s going to be Obama and some totally unknown woman so they can say, “There, you dumbass PUMAS, we gave you a chick so shut up and vote for us already.”

    Either that or Nancy *shudder* Pelosi.

  200. The Obamabots love making a mountain out of a molehill.

  201. Powell used to be the only Republican I would consider voting for.

    Now there are none.

  202. Michael: I guess you and I disagree on this issue since Obama has made a huge deal out of Hillary voting in favor of Bush going to war yet can overlook the fact that Powell had a great deal more direct participation.

    She was one senator out of many where he held a high post within the administration and had the president’s ear. How can Obama defend one and condemn the other?

  203. back to the PUMA/JSND effect- it also proves that obama needs us more than we need him-what can he offer us to get our loyalty he know Hillary as VP wont do it.

    He also knows we dont trust him or any of his promises. so what can he give us?

    Pos a Clinton/Obama ticket? or is his ego to big? will he let his ego distroy the party?


  204. Gary, this is going to be so much fun. Please let me know when you have decided on a date. Oh my, I am going to post some wonderful ideas for you. Pat’s already tossed up a few suggestions. We need to think about how many guests you and mawn plan to invite, the budget, plenty of details.

  205. For the record: If he chooses Nancy Pelosi as vice president the fallout will be too enormous to contemplate. With her 9% approval rating as the Speaker of the House, what would she be able to run on? Beside, with the Botox injections, can she continue that smile over the next 6 months without doing serious damage to her facial structure?

  206. Pat: Obama can do the hypocritical double lutz with the best of them.

  207. Obama, our own Tonya Harding!!

  208. Pelosi is not going t5o give up Speaker of the House for the VP spot. If he runs with a woman it will be that mousy Sebelius.

  209. I’m going to have nightmares tonight just thinking of an Obama/Pelosi ticket. Oh my God!!!

  210. but pat, if nancy becomes VP just think of the lucrative opportunities starring in Madamab’s plays

  211. I dont necessarily disagree with you Pat I just think he has been tortured by the whole insident and I cannot belive he did it for personal gain or loyality.

    I am just trying to understand his motives for doing what he did.

    Senator Clinton and John Kerry “voted for war” and Hillary had the courage to say “you do not get any do overs in this life”. That prevented the repugs from calling her a flip flopper-and probably sealed her fate with the DNC.


  212. When Sebelius gave the Dem position after the last State of the Union Address I thought I would fall asleep. Boring speaker.

  213. gary, so true. This could be my ticket to stardom. But still….

  214. The big question is who McCain will choose?

  215. cant have courage or character in a Dem candidate that would be to republican!(sarcasm drips)


  216. I’m pretty sure it won’t be Pelosi as VP. I’d also venture that, given the closeness of the Senate situation, it won’t be a Senator from a red state (sorry, Evan Bayh).

  217. I’m going to have nightmares tonight just thinking of an Obama/Pelosi ticket. Oh my God!!!

    Sorry, Pat. Think margarita, yummy, tasty, ice-cold margarita … there, that’s better. 🙂

  218. Obama sure cannot praise the Republicans enough. Reagan, Bush Sr. But he had little time to point out the Clinton’s contributions to the country. He leans to the right in my book.

  219. McCain wants his wiskey buddy Hillary-but will settle for someone else


  220. Janis: I had an apple martini earlier tonight with a neighbor. Could have had another only she did not offer. I may need to stay buzzed up for the next 4 years if he gets in.

    Please supers, change your votes!

  221. I bet he goes to Huckabee. Another loony tune.

  222. Who are they going to dig up for VP? It cannot be Hillary. That ticket would look so upside down as to have been sucked in from an alternate reality.

  223. I am serious about the above he would gaurenty his place in history(herstory) if he died in office and hillary took his place and he would be giving the Dems the big finger!


  224. Fuzzy: I know almost for certain Mccain would take Hillary if he could get her. That would be a winning ticket, I believe that sincerely.

  225. McCain/Romney might be incredibly tough to beat. Romney was a legit presidential contender with friends in the conservative community. Will he risk a Senate seat by choosing Dole, Hutchison, Snow/Collins to get the female vote? He’ll probably wait until after Obama choses his nominee so that he can counteract Obama.

  226. myiq: What about Olympia Snow in Maine? She’s a moderate Republican.

  227. I agree with both of you. And for the same reasons you gave.

  228. SophieL: I don’t think the GOP is overly fond of Olympia. She has bucked them a few times.

  229. Hillary won’t take a VP from McCain and I seriously doubt he’d consider her.

  230. The GOP hates Hillary. They would never approve of that ticket. He would lose most of his base support if he announced that. However, the premise is a good one on its face.

  231. Fuzzville: I would die of sadness and irony if that happened. A mixed administration. Not that I’d be happy he went because I really like him but that would be historic in its irony.

  232. From what I have read there are 3 possible choices he is looking at: Pawlenty, Huckabee, Romney.

  233. We could do some serious damage by floating our own balloon on that one -McCain/Clinton Unity ticket!


  234. I miss Hillary. She was the life of the party.

  235. Regular republicans love Hillary, given what choices they’ve got. They weren’t prepared to become Democrats or Indies to vote for her but many of them would have pulled the lever for her in November. Especially women.

    Of course she wouldn’t take it, that doesn’t make it a bad ticket.

  236. I think I heard rumors about Palin (AK, Gov) and Hutchison (TX, Sen). I expect McCain’s search to be more quiet and tight lipped. I think he may choose the more surprising person. McCain is a better pol than he’s given credit for. No one wanted him in 2000 and he made a solid run. No one wanted him in 2008 (but he was my prediction) and he won.

  237. If Obama picks Richardson and McCain picks a woman (say the Gov of Alaska), many Dems will be voting for McCain, even the ones who are talking the Unity-speak.

  238. Gov Lamb fm Colorado wrote a book about a Prez candidate who did that the pres candidate chose a AA female to make history because he knew he had cancer whis I could remember the Books title!

    good read for political thrillers-

    It was there that I learned that if no candidate gets th 270 electors needed to win then in congress the house picks the President-

    Guess who picks the Veep in such a case- The Senate not the house suprize!


  239. myiq, what did Jon Stewart say about the cover?

  240. fuzzy,
    Floating McCain/Clinton does more harm than good. For Hillary to have any influence/opportunity in Denver, you can’t run around saying she’s going to be on the GOP ticket. No Super would support her and they definitely should not. Also, McCain/Clinton is the worst of all possible worlds. It reinforces McCain as the liberal and Hillary as the conservative. Both are viewed skeptically within their party by a significant faction and the joint ticket alienates both skeptical groups. It’s a lose-lose ticket.

  241. Oh, and he ran as an anti immmigration 3rd party candidate title was “1988” I think. he had a controversial commercial that ran 1 time (like LBJ’s bomb commercial against goldwater) in the animated commercial immigrants swarmed the statue of liberty and pulled it down.

    good book


  242. As long as he does not pick Condi Rice. That would be a complete disaster.

  243. Quick question: Are there any maxed out Hillary donors here?

    I ask because some of us are floating the idea of “Adopting a Delegate” who supported Hillary through it all and bombarding them and/or their PAC with money as a show of PUMA force. Raising a few hundred k for one of these pols would show PUMA power.

  244. lose lose for the Right and Left wings of the party’s but for the centrist? 60% of who love moderation?

    She could denounce it and so could McCain…strongly I would suppose but then maybe the party would see that we are less likely to vote for a Obama/Clinton ticket.

    I believe we are heding to a nation of 3 parties the right the center and the left – with the center party taking the best philosophy’s of the right and lest and trhowing out the crap….

    In 2012 that is the only ticket that will win


  245. Michael; We agree once again.

  246. thank god-I was worried pat-well all time for fuzzy to go to bed

  247. I’m with Fuzzy on that one. No one’s threatening a McCain/Clinton ticket, but it would be a centrist ticket. Center-right and center-left. Bill Clinton was center-left and that was the best thing to happen to this country in decades.

    Radical edge politics don’t work anymore. It’s time to come to the center. That the real Unity.

  248. They say that Obama is “slithering” to the center right now.

  249. Nite, Michael.

  250. Good night Fuzzville!

  251. Pat: Obama is slithering to the right. Give him time.

  252. gq: Have you seen this?

    I am all for this idea. The folks in NYs 10th Congressional District are getting harrassed by the Obama folks because they waited too long to endorse.

  253. I know everyone seems to have retired for the night but I want to share this passage I read recently. It’s not relevant in the least but I found it remarkable. It’s from Naomi Wolf’s “The Beauty Myth.”

    “You could see the signs of female aging as diseased, especially if you had a vested interest in making women too see them your way. Or you could see that if a woman is healthy she lives to grow old; as she thrives, she reacts and speaks and shows emotion, and grows into her face. Lines trace her thought and radiate from the corners of her eyes after decades of laughter, closing together like fans as she smiles. You could call the lines a network of “serious lesions”, or you could see that in a precise calligraphy, thought has etched marks of concentration between her brows, and drawn across her forehead the horizontal creases of surprise, delight, compassion, and good talk. A lifetime of kissing, of speaking and weeping, shows expressively around a mouth scored like a leaf in motion. The skin loosens on her face and throat, giving her features a setting of sensual dignity; her features grow stronger as she does. She has looked around in her life, and it shows. When gray and white show in her hair, you could call it a dirty secret or you could call it silver or moonlight. Her body fills into itself, taking on gravity like a bather breasting water, growing generous with the rest of her. The darkening under her eyes, the weight of her lids, their minute cross-hatching, reveal that what she has been part of has left in her its complexity and richness. She is darker, stronger, looser, tougher, sexier. The maturing of a woman who has continued to grow is a beautiful thing to behold.”

  254. SophieL: And I am sure they did this to others. They are despicable!

  255. Pat: they did do it to others. Throughout the whole campaign, they were threatening people with contested primaries. And then there was the name calling…

  256. Wasn’t it Romney who said kids are better with dead parents then they are with gay parents?

  257. regencyq, god I HATED Santos. All he did was talk and talk without ever actually saying anything. Plus, he was an arrogant jerk and was always throwing much better people under the bus.

    Yeah, I can see the resemblace to Obama.

  258. I ask because some of us are floating the idea of “Adopting a Delegate” who supported Hillary through it all and bombarding them and/or their PAC with money as a show of PUMA force.

    Well.. I don’t know if I’d do it that way. What I think is a good plan is to look for the Hillary supporting delegates who are now being hit with primary challengers because they stuck up for her. Raise money for those real Democrats and support them for reelection. Picking one puts that one delegate in an awkward position and I think is not fair to them – support them all, PUMAs are real Democrats.

  259. […] 16, 2008 · No Comments This was posted at the Confluence: Hey — just got back from the San Francisco rally — we had a GREAT time. I am downloading the […]

  260. Simo fish – please give us your blog – or a link to watch for your SF rally video, updates

  261. dg, that is the plan.

  262. Please let me say it again, go to the CNN and MSMBC comments and as PUMA”S attack any and all of the articles, where you can to get attention for PUMA. I am now starting to see where some OBama supporters are trash talking the PUMA movement. This is good advertisement and maybe some of it will filter into the minds of the super delegates. The more they worry about the PUMA’s the more it helps Hillary.

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