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Dear Super Delegates: Find an excuse, ANY excuse

SD’s, this message is for you:

You wanna know why PUMAs exist?  It’s because we are f%&*(ing tired of losing every four years.  Seriously.  I’ve been a Democrat since the 60’s when my earliest memory consists of screaming, “it’s a free country!  I can say whatever I want!” across the playground.  But in all the years I have been elegible to vote, I’ve bet on the winner exactly twice, in 1992 and 1996.  Yep, in all of my adult life, I have seen the DNC and my party squander one opportunity after another.  First there was the competent but brutally honest Mondale.  Then there was the oddly unemotional, dweeby Dukakis.  I actually liked Gore, if not his rhetorical style.  Then came Kerry, who seemed like the honest Abe Lincoln sort, minus the brilliant mind.

In each case, the DNC seems to get caught off guard.  The RNC develops some ingenious wedge issue, points out some stupid little idiosyncracy of the candidate and voile!  $100 million later, the Democratic candidate is toast and we’re stuck with another Republican, raiding and pillaging his way through the treasury.

This year, I swear, Rove did his magic from within the party because we have become our own worst enemy.  Not only have we pitted gender against race with predictable results, but the party seems to have brought out the worst in itself complete with self-righteous, moralizing, values nannies who want to club us over the head with the teachable moment on race.  Do these people even know what party they’re in???  We’re DEMOCRATS.  We don’t DO the racist thing.  If the Dolores Umbrage types wanted to interrupt the most important election of our lifetime to lecture the country on racism, they should have waited until the General Election.  In the primaries, it’s just a frickin’ annoyance.  *We’re* the bright students, remember? Jeez!  Enough of that. I digress.

What’s worse is the way the Deaniacs have taken over the party.  Now, I have to admit that I actually used to hang out with these people.  (BTW, I cancelled my hotel reservation for Netroots Nation if anyone needs to snag one)  But I never understood the fascination that these people had for Howard Dean.  If anyone has ever read Malcolm Gladwell’s book, Blink!, you’ll know what I am refering to when I say that my thin slice of Howard Dean was that he was and is a dilettante.  He dabbles.  He likes to play politics and theories and he’s an idea rat.  But his campaign in 2004 said to me “failure to stay on task”.  He’s an adult with ADD.  He’s bright at all get out but he can’t follow through.  And what we have with the party is the result of a bunch of nifty, keen ideas and absolutely no leadership.  It’s chaos x 10^23.

In a year when the party is hurting for money, some events in Denver have been cancelled in favor of fundraisers. But the party planning committee has gotten all high-maintenance with a list of food regulations for the catering staff including “no fried foods” and going so far as to specify colors.  Ooo, yeah, there’s some Rush Limbaugh material right there.  Why is it that the one time a delegate can get away from the fam and live it up, the party takes away the tempura shrimp in the sushi and makes extra sure you get your daily dose of beta carotene?  What is WRONG with these people?!  Do they think the bills in Denver are just going to magically pay for themselves?  And now they are renting Invesco Field for the Dauphin of Democracy’s Investiture?

But the biggest insult this year in a year of insults has to be the deliberate attempts to exclude half of the Democratic party from full participation at the convention.  Let me give it to you straight, SD’s, this is a catastrophic strategy and just plain stoopid.  You may not want to admit to it because it’s like finally facing up to the fact that you’ve spent way too much on vacation and you’re afraid to look at your bank balance.  But look you must.  The party is being ripped asunder.  In any other year, Barack Obama would have faded away like Dennis Kucinich.  He’s a great idea but there’s no way he can possibly win.  He just doesn’t have the institutional investment yet.  He hasn’t had time to learn the legislative ropes or form coalitions of his own or work on any policy to achieve expertise.  He’s a big fat zero except that his skin color makes him unique.  But let us not fool ourselves.  The symbolism of his historic candidacy is not going to be sufficient to overcome all of his flaws, not in the general election.  And the reason I know this is because, the party has jettisoned the people it needs the most to make him competitive- the so-called “Old Coalition”.  Do you think we are going to “get over it” before November?  You can have the oldest opponent on the planet, an opposing party that is as discredited as can be and a sycophantic media (for now), but without half of your party, it is going to be a nail biter.  And we’ve seen how nail biter’s have gone in the past 8 years.  Couple that with the fact that the half you pissed off is ready to vote for the other guy and you have another lost election.

Did I mention how PUMAs are sick of losing?

Now, I don’t know what you have against Hillary.  And I don’t know what made you guys think that we were all just going to fall into line like Republicans.  But you’ve gotten a lot wrong this year.  Forcing Obama down our throats during the convention is going to backfire, HUGELY.  In fact, considering the number of votes Hillary got, to have anything less than a knock-down-drag-out floor fight is going to be a disaster.  Forget what David Axelrod, Donna Brazile, Nancy Pelosi and Howard Dean are telling you.  Throw out the old models of what you expect voters to do in the fall.  You cannot take that kind of risk.  There is too much uncertainty.  And if the general election voters detect that you are not serious about winning in the fall, in a year when gas is creeping towards $5/gal, the war in Iraq drags on, there is a financial crisis looming and a million other things that affect the average Joe after 8 years of George Bush, the party as we know it will be dead.  There goes YOUR institutional power.

Forget what the power brokers tell you or what the Teaparty Ten tell you about how uncomfortable and destructive a floor fight will be.  At this point it is the only thing that will save you.  If Obama can win it legitimately in a fair, open and transparent convention, the party will emerge more unified after the convention.  If the party feels that Hillary is the better candidate, well, Obama either takes VP or an old, cold tater and waits for his turn, as he *should* have done before his ego was inflated to go for it this year.

But as Mark Rubin suggested yesterday, you may feel you are in a bit of a bind.  How do you go against the perception that Barack Obama is the party’s nominee without looking like complete suckers?  Hey, I don’t care what you guys choose as the excuse to knock Obama down and level the playing field between him and Hillary.  FISA sticks in our craw quite a bit.  Why not go with that?  Jesse Jackson made a good point about Obama using Republican campaigning rhetoric by overemphasizing morals to the detriment of economic issues. Maybe one of you might want to call him out for being a closet Republican and start calling loudly for his nuts.  If you start musing publicly about how unlikeable his arrogance is and if you slip in a few words in favor of Hillary in there, where’s the harm?  I don’t care what excuse you use, just find one.

And get rid of Donna Brazile while you’re at it.

Did I mention how PUMAs are sick of losing?

185 Responses


    Riverdaughter for Hillary’s VP! 😉

  2. call him out for being a closet Republican and start calling loudly for his nuts.

    LOL!! I love your wit, bite, and humor, RD.

    Where can we find a list of SDs who caved in to endorsing him before May 31st? We should do our own little housekeeping.

  3. Christ, rd must have spent her vacation living inside my head since these thoughts are almost exactly what rolls around my brain when I am running the vacuum or talking back at the tv!

    The piece speaks for all of us. Perfect once again, rd.

  4. bravo ! that pretty much expresses my feelings on the subject…



  6. I got an e-mail from the southwest puma party.
    July 15 2008 between 11:00am and 1:00pm a “” victory fundraiser for obama with donna brazille” at the palace hotel in San Francisco.
    Planned demonstration.



  7. This is one of your best essays, riverdaughter — it’s perfect.

    Now, I don’t know what you have against Hillary. And I don’t know what made you guys think that we were all just going to fall into line like Republicans. But you’ve gotten a lot wrong this year. Forcing Obama down our throats during the convention is going to backfire, HUGELY.

    And we’ve got just TWO months to prove it.

  8. rd speaks in one voice for the 18 million of us out here. That is what makes her soooooooooooo good!

  9. Bravissima! Like Hillary, you are rested and in fine fettle, RD.

  10. They better wise up now or this whole thing is going down!


    PUMA$ Who Donate Rock!

    All PUMAS Rock!

  11. SOrry Pelosi 202-225-0100

  12. I just called the DNC and a spokesperson for the office of the chairman said Hillary’s name will be on the ballet with no preconditions.

    I can’t hardly believe it, to confirm call DNC (202-863-8000).

  13. Contribution Details

    Date: July 11, 2008 12:05 PM EDT
    Contact: TucsonTransplant

    Amount: $25.00

  14. Yes, I am a PUMApac Gal

  15. Rock on RD — once again you have crystallized a million thoughts into an brilliantly lucid missive.

    Thanks for continuing to guide us through this horrible mess.

  16. Stunning. The rational mind (PUMA mind, that is) is screaming for the SDs to wake up. They are like that group of religious zealots that were waiting for the comet to take them up to heaven – total f*%king suicidal nuts!

  17. I read but don’t post. I just put another $50.00 in for Hillary.

  18. I have to get Heidi Li’s e-mail address. Not to put to fine a point on it, but that first Denver Group ad FUCKING BLOWS. I’ve been doing advertising and marketing for ten years at this point, and I need to do a little work this weekend and send those people a PDF. Christ, I almost fell asleep reading ity, and it read like a goddamned third-grade essay, plus there were typos. INEXCUSABLE.

    I crank up Illustrator this weekend, and then I’ll send those people the ad they SHOULD RUN. Jesus Christ. That was embarrassing.

  19. That was an awesome rant. The best part about it that it’s the d*mn truth.

    The people in the upper echelons of the party need to leave their offices, ignore their “advisors” and get out into the streets and listen for once. That might put the fear of g*d into them – maybe.

  20. Love it! You won’t see an op-ed like this in the traditional media. Proud to be a PUMA.

  21. janis: I like the Boston Tea Party concept but I have to admit that it wasn’t sexy enough.


    TucsonTransplant $25
    Carole H. $50



    fuzzy – start the process! I’m personally glad our representatives no longer think torture is off the table! Go get them!

    I however, don’t get to start my fun until we hit $10,000.

    Let’s go gang!

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  23. Contribution Details
    Date: July 11, 2008 12:29 PM EDT
    Contact: Kim
    Greenville, SC

    Amount: $10.00

    I got a shirt yesterday but I can afford to give another $10

  24. Janis,

    Get on it baby. And throw in a bit about our fundraising prowess.

    “Hey SDs? Look over here! You want it? We got it!!!

  25. I love it!

  26. RD, it will be by the time I’m done with it. What they want is a big, fat gorgeous picture of FDR witting behind the Oval Office desk, with a very big, very simple headline:


    Follow it up with text: In 1932, Franklin Roosevelt entered the Demoncratic Party’s nominating convention with XXX delegates, merely YY% of the total needed to secure the nomination.

    Had his name been removed from consideration, the United States would have been robbest of one of its finest presidents, the man who created the modern Democratic Party, Social Security, the FDIC, and who led this nation to victory in World War II.

    Senator Hillary Clinton enters her party’s nominating convention with XXXX pledged delegates, and only ZZ% separates her from Barack Obama.

    History and the traditions of the Democratic Party demand that her name be entered on the convention ballot.

    Or some such. Like I said, me, Illustrator, this weekend. AND NO GODDAMNED TYPOS IN THE GODDAMNED COPY.

  27. Witting. “Sitting,” maybe?

    Typos in a blog comment == okay. Typos in a paid ad? Not so much.

  28. Janis – you go girl! (Are you really Hillary?)

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  29. RD!!!! GO! GO! GO!

  30. BTW, anyone who can fill in those XXX and YYY numbers for me and confirm that FDR got in on the 4th ballot (or tell me which ballot it was) get my eternal thanks.

    DO NOT ANSWER THIS QUESTION IF YOU CAN’T CITE SOURCES. Don’t answer if all you can say it, “Um, I don’t know, but I think it might have been the 6th ballot, but I’m not sure where I heard it.”

    Seriously — cite your sources, if anyone out there can chase those numbers down.

  31. Janis, that ad’s perfect! Go for it.

  32. Actually, I have as many worries if he does win. I think he’s unqaulified and lacks principles.

  33. katiebird – send it to me again – I’m ready. I had to change computers.

  34. I literally have the “birds and the bees” taking over my balcony!

    Do you think they will share it with me?

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  35. Carol, I’m at katiebird@gmail.com (I think I’ve kept up but I will be leaving soon for errands and the email will help me catch up when I get back)

  36. Janis-excellent off the cuff!

    don’t forget the consequences……….. ROAR.

    (God, the minds here are incredible!)

  37. RD-Great, inspiring post! Brilliant!

    Janis-Love your ideas for the ad! I think Heidi and Marc would be receptive. Contact her at her site.

  38. Janis, fourth ballot:


  39. Janis, nice article describing the 1932 convention and confirming that FDR won on the 4th ballot: {http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2008/3514fdr_1932_victory.html} link

    Don’t know if that link is going to work correctly.

  40. Here’s the NYTimes’s list of pledged delegates:


  41. However, I’m not sure you want to cite this kind of maneuver as a precedent (from wiki):

    On the first ballot Roosevelt was well ahead of his rivals, of whom the strongest was Smith. However, he was still below the two-thirds percentage he needed to win. On the next two ballots Roosevelt’s total went up only slightly, and his managers – Louis Howe and James Farley – became concerned that if he did not win the nomination on the next few ballots, his strength would ebb and move to other candidates. Before the fourth ballot began, Farley and Howe cut a deal with the press baron William Randolph Hearst in which FDR would make John Nance Garner, the Speaker of the House of Representatives and also a candidate, his Vice President. Garner and his manager, Texas Congressman Sam Rayburn, agreed to the deal and on the fourth ballot Garner withdrew his candidacy and supported Roosevelt. Additionally, former Secretary of the Treasury William G. McAdoo, whose own presidential ambitions were thwarted by Al Smith eight years before, gleefully changed California’s votes from Garner to Roosevelt, which set off a stampede that led to Roosevelt’s nomination by the end of the fourth ballot.


    DATE: July 11, 2008 12:35 PM EDT
    NAME: G

    AMOUNT: $50.00

  43. citation:


  44. Okay, as accurate as Wikipedia is, I have FDR entering the convention with 666 delegates, and needing 90. A 2/3 majority was needed of the 1135 delegates in play.

    Not only did he not get it until the 4th ballot, he only gained 16 delegates at the 3rd ballot. 16 out of the 90 needed to win.

    It should be a set of ads — we also need to find people (Dems and Repubs, like Ted Kennedy and Reagan) who kept their names in play and on the ballot (in 1980 and 1976, IIRC) even when they clearly were not in the running.

    These ads need to send a CLEAR message, one message per ad. Giving peple an essay to read is badness.

    I also need to know where their buys are. Are these things in newspapers or magazines? Can they get a bleed? How many colors are they running?

  45. Janis, I understand that the first ad ran today, I believe, in the Chicago Tribune (paper copy only).

  46. Cool. I’ve already got it in my head. I’ll send them a PDF and a zipfile of the thing tonight, then. I’ll start on it when I get home.

  47. I am not sure I could agree that we would ever be certain that the playing field was leveled. SDs have been pressured with losing their seats, and money has been promised for re-election campaigns and who knows what else. I could never be sure that an Obama win was legitimate. Frankly, because of Obama’s own actions, I hold him responsible for the actions of the MSM and his supporters, and I will never vote for him no matter what happens in Denver. It’s Hillary, McCain or none.

    “At this point it is the only thing that will save you. If Obama can win it legitimately in a fair, open and transparent convention, the party will emerge more unified after the convention. If the party feels that Hillary is the better candidate, well, Obama either takes VP or an old, cold tater and waits for his turn, as he *should* have done before his ego was inflated to go for it this year.”

  48. There are delegates like Charlie Rangel who supported Hillary and will vote for Obama. That’s not going to change, and it’s no help to her.

  49. Great post riverdaughter.


  50. Great one RD! and the art!

    Big. Fat. Zero.!

    without a birthcertificate! with a faux presidential seal

    I just came from No Quarter — you can get there from RD’s links — really important tandem reads are there. If you want to read more about the target marketing and the effing corruption come to my place for a quick link in to the Guardian.

    Over at Corrente, RD’s previous incarnation has been mentioned and they are talking about the need for a progressive blogosphere to counter what happened as regards this whole election

    Frankly, I think he paid off the media…

    I’m really wondering if mag covers are now sold as ad space?

    At NQ he wants to wipe Hillary off the ballot? But PUMAs know she is very real and was our chosen one.

    The whole “censored” way they are doing things? Ethically, morally very WRONG. Whatever you do — don’t let him get his handle on the helm of our country. He can’t win. Can’t.

  51. I got 2 t-shirts on Wednesday but, here’s another contribution:

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 11, 2008 1:09 PM EDT
    Contact: DancesWithPumas
    Amount: $20.08

    Will said “we” raised $10 mil.
    How much more do we need to pay down Senator Clinton’s debt?


  52. Now that Hillary’s name will be on the ballet in Denver with no preconditions what is our next move?

  53. RD — great essay and thanks for keeping all our eyes on the prize.

    These issues — democracy, enfranchisement, and fairness, political courage (or lack thereof, currently) are what made me become a PUMA.

    Really, I don’t care about Obama, not specifically. He is just the cardboard cutout that Dean chose to relive his 2004 campaign failure through, and force his ineffectual la-la-la ideas on the base of the party through. Obama has much to answer for, true, but he’s the symptom, not the problem. (granted, he’s the open, weeping sores symptom, but still just a symptom).

    The Democratic Party is nothing if it is not the party that stands up for those who don’t have a voice of their own in the political process. It is nothing if it is not the party that invests in democracy above torrential self-interested navel-gazing. In short, they are nothing.

    They’ve abdicated their responsibilities. Now we are the voice of the voters. I think this can’t be said enough, or said loud enough.

    And this is the point we should hammer on, with the SDs, the media, and all the voters out there who believe the propaganda that they have no choice in November. They do. We’re it.

  54. This convention won’t be like the past. Those were true fights with supports working hard to gain votes for thier candidate. Now, all these SDs who were strongest in Hillary’s corner have already capitulated and come out in favor of Obama.

    No, nothing can change the fact that Obama is grossly unqualified for the job. Add to that all of his other failings and I will never vote for him.

  55. obama goes for the bubba vote…


    Obama may sponsor race car

    Sports Illustrated reports:

    SI.com has learned that for the first time in history, a major presidential candidate may sponsor a race car in NASCAR’s premier series. According to sources, Barack Obama’s campaign is in talks to become the primary sponsor of BAM Racing’s No. 49 Sprint Cup car for the Pocono race on August 3. Details of the agreement are expected to be worked out over the coming days.

    i betthe good ol’ boys are gonna REALLY be trading paint with car #49. look for it to go sailing over the top rail in turn 3 halfway through the race.

  56. Then I am volunteering as a member of the pit crew.

  57. Wow, it’s anything but substance for him, isn’t it?

  58. Riverdaughter: Dolores Umbrage – LOL!!! I just saw the Harry Potter movie on HBO last night with my PUMA Cub & thought how she’s the archetypical Obamabot “rules” Stepford surrogate.

    WAKE UP SUPER Ds, PUMAs or (you know who) IS REAL!!!

  59. HI SM! Got to finish my housework but keep checking in for totals. Making my “Nancy” call at 1:45.

  60. Is Obama aware of the moonshine running history of NASCAR?

  61. Puma SimoFish is organizing this action.


    WHO: Donna Brazile
    WHEN: July 15, 2008 – Tuesday
    TIME: Noon to 1:30
    WHERE: Palace Hotel, 2 New Montgomery Street, San Francisco
    WHAT: Fundraiser for “Obama Victory Fund” with Donna Brazile

    We’ll be at the hotel around 11:00 with homemade signs. The media will be contacted on Monday.

    This location is accessible by BART and MUNI, and we believe the cross street is Market.

  62. NH — don’t forget, though, that over 200 SDs for Clinton have not switched endorsements.

    The Pelosi-Dean-Reid stampede of SDs at the end of the primaries, complete with the usual backroom threats and arm-twisting, stopped precipitously right after June 3.

    Clinton still holds her pledged delegates, and they are not budging.

    Party ‘Unity’ is just a fiction in their little minds.

    ‘nother topic: Has PUMA sent Gerry Ferraro a PUMA shirt? I’m thinking she deserves one, if she hasn’t already gotten herself one.

  63. Ha, I’ve been writing to Super Delegates this morning and Cindy Spanyers just called me a stalker. Let’s stay on the prowl!! Good work, RD.

  64. campskunk, if I were an Obama donor, I think I would be really cross that my money was being wasted on sponsoring a race car.

  65. campskunk – can we move up the date of the event! My hands, wrists and fingers are in overdrive from keying – repetitive use injury!

    Bye, Bye Birdie!

    PUMA$ Who Donate RULE!

  66. Folks we only need 2 seats to capture the Senate.

    Help out if you can-


    McCain for President

  67. MOVE the Total:

    Kim $10
    Mac $50
    DancesWithPumas $20.08

    Grand Total so Far:


    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  68. NH: I understand the anger and the desire to punish but before we get to a point where we are between a rock and a hard place where we choose the hard place, I want to give the party every opportunity to come out of its psychogenic fugue and do the right thing. No hard feelings, no recriminations, Just come to their senses and save the party from certain destruction.
    Broker the damn thing in Denver but don’t give in to Obama just because the Deaniacs are screaming for it. They’re immature. We know it and we can’t let the babies have their way.
    Some group of SDs need to grab the reins of leadership that Dean has foolishly thrown away,
    Governor Rendell, are you with us?

  69. hello every one am home for a quick lunch and a BIG afternoon lean on the crowd for Cash for our Girl Hillary I think we must be in the home stretch here and surely the debt will be paid. remember my reasons for leaning on you are purely for our own good to repeat:

    If you dont want a Bush scripted convention Donate(first lean)

    If you do not want Our girl silenced from now to august being used as an Obama lawn ornament donate-(second lean)

    If you want to see Carol give Madame Speaker a “special” hair cut at $ 10,000.00 donate! (third lean)

    going to change the hampsters on the wheels at the ol’ power plant see you all this evening dont know if i will make it home for lunch but will try for a late afternoon lean!


    dont forget if we excede our goal Dr Dean gets a special high Colonic to clean out all this sh*t he has been spreading about our girls debt!

    special entree item tonight-par-boiled Donna Brazile under “soundproof” glass! I am just tired of the witches voice!

    carol can I have a total please….

  70. fuzzy – $7602.62

  71. Part of me is with NH — I think the fix is in, and the DNC is determined to nominate Obama and embarrass Hillary in any way it can.

    On the other hand, I keep getting e mails from Hillary’s campaign asking me to transfer my 2008 GE donation to her 2012 Senate primary — and I’m holding out, hoping for a miracle.

  72. If the party feels that Hillary is the better candidate, well, Obama either takes VP or an old, cold tater and waits for his turn, as he *should* have done before his ego was inflated to go for it this year.”

    This is the part that scream entitlement. Hillary was not entitled to the nomination. There is no “waiting your turn” in politics. If you’ve got the nerve, the message and some support, then you go for the brass ring. Obama went for it, played the game by the rules established by the DNC and WON. All of this “he should have waited” is just sour grapes that Hillary did not have the will to go for it sooner and lost her chance. Hillary should have run in 2000, or 2004 or at any time before that. She didn’t and she lost to a younger candidate.

    The sense of entitlement that permeated her campaing was overwhelming. The presidency is not owed to anyone and certainly not to her. Hillary can feel free to run again in 2012 or 2016, or 2020. She can keep running untl she can’t walk anymore fo all I care. The point is that as far as 2008 is concerned, the nomination is over and Hillary is not the nominee.

    A sure fire way for the DNC to lose in November would be overturn the result of the primaries and give it to he. That’s the spark that will start a civil war within the Democratic Party and permanently split the party apart. Hillary is a smart woman and she knows that a convention fight would be disastrous.

    On the other hand, giving the nom to Hillary would do one thing that I did not think was possible….it would break the Democrat’s hold on black america. The GOP has been saying for years that the Democrats take us for granted. We would be able to see that live on television. We could see a demographic shift of parties the likes of which American politics have not seen since the 1960s

  73. “Rove did his magic from wihin.”

    Maybe Brazile’s friendship with Rove helped create this magic.

  74. I’m a NASCAR fan, and I can tell you right now that as much as people love Ken Schraeder, no one gives a rat’s patootie about who is on the hood of his car. A sponsor like Home Depot, Lowe’s or FedEx who spends the really big money to sponsor a car for years will get the benefit of that sponsorship, but that’s about it.

    Plus if it rains on qualifying day or Ken doesn’t qualify on time, they’ll have spent all that money and not even get in the race. At least if they were going to do it they should have tried a car that will definitely make the race. More brilliant Obama judgement! **snick**

  75. oh my goodness- ladies and gentlemen carol is only a mere $ 2,397.39 from giving Ms Pelosi a skalpin’ er special haircut! carol you are strong arming everyone right appealling t their everyweakness…

    my fav is if you dont give we will have to listen to Obama for the next 5 months telling us how he bailed Hillary out with a full chorus of o-bots in the background singing praises to his generosity…

    please save me from having to get my vomit bucket!


  76. also re: entitlement issue brought up in previous comment.

    Giving votes to a candidate who actually took his own name off the ballot is what I would call a good example of entitlement gone amok. Hillary never deemed herself entitled — that was part of the MSMs negative storyline. repeated over and over till everyone believes it as truth.

  77. Excellent post, RD–and me too. I’ve only voted for 2 winners since my first vote in ’72, both Clinton.So proud of that man!!

    Janis, your ad sounds great. You are right–the fewer, more concise words the better. Focused and to the point.

  78. Rd,

    I just think a group of vocal brave SDs–not even a huge amount—need to come forward and start a stampede. It needs to be orchestrated, and there needs to be big noise and $$ support from us for the world to see.

    Someone knows someone who knows someone.

    Can’t we get a group of them together for a big announcement? They would get a heroes greeting for standing up for Democracy and our REAL party principles! (Like to generals and economists that got together to support Hillary)

    If what was said upthread is true, that there will be an open vote with no pre-conditons, then Janis nees to apply her talents toward a differnt series of ads (i’ll help).

  79. Keisha: Don’t get your knickers in a twist. No one was less ready for the nomination than Obama. EVERYONE was more entitled to it than him. Edwards, Biden, Dodd, Richardson, any one of them could have made a better case, and *did* , for having earned it, than Obama did.
    Some of you have gotten this thought stopping thing in your heads that Hillary felt she was entitled. But you fail to recognize that even if this is what she actually felt, that if she hadn’t paid her dues and if she hadn’t been so prepared, that claim would have been laughable.
    Just because she might have felt entitled, justifiably, doesn’t give you the right to disrespect her abilities, talents and experience. It is really just too fucking bad for Obama that she turned out to be the candidate she is because he can not win without her supporters and her supporters don’t think he is worthy of our support. However, she is worthy of yours. In fact, it’s hard to imagine a stronger candidate and one under which more Americans would prosper. Indeed, even when the African-American community turned their collective backs on her, SHE never turned her back on them. It was Hillary at the Black State of the Union event when Obama couldn’t be bothered. It was Hillary who never turned down an event where she would reach out to people who might have been her enemies. And she won them over and won their respect.
    It is time you showed her respect as well.
    As for convention fights being disastrous, how would you know that it would be disastrous? The DNC has already decided that Obama will be our nominee whether slightly more than half of us think he isn’t ready to run a Senate committee yet, much less the White House. The election year has already created a disaster. Haven’t you been paying attention? Do you think that having a conflict free, scripted convention where one person is shackled and forced to concede everything is going to lead to party unity? Please explain how you think this is going to happen? I really want to know how you expect to overcome human nature and teach the world to sing in perfect harmony by blowing off half of your base and telling them to go fuck themselves during the convention. Tell me, what is the color of the sky in the world you live in where that plan is going to work?
    Those of us who are planning to vote for downticket Dems can sit out four years of a McCain administratation. I’m not planning to vote for him but I’ll be damned if the party thinks I’m just going to hand over my vote without them telling me what’s in it for me.
    Start thinking with your head instead of sticking it in the sand.

  80. I love it!

    First they show “$23 million, blah, blah he forgot to ask blah, blah”. Then Will tells them “we don’t need” anything from BO.

    WILL – Tell them this is our campaign, our debt, our Leader. Tell them to stop acting like she is begging. That reallyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy pisses me off!


    Love you President Clinton 2008


  81. Keisha–you’re contradicting yourself. Re-read your comment.

    How could she have run before 2000? Her husband was president.

    The nomination is not over until Aug. 28

    You said that he should ‘wait his turn’ if he isn’t nominated (first para.) then in the second, there is no ‘waiting your turn’ in politics.

  82. I just read over at NOQUARTER that Bo’s take for June was a mere $30 million versus the $50 million they projected.

    Theeeeeeeee wheels on the bus go round, round, round……

  83. keisha if you dont think the partys split now you had better have some coffee rather than kool aid..as far as the party goes they had better do something other than give it to precious,my god its the first of july no republican attack ads yet with the country hating bush and according to rassmussen today he is ahead of mac by 2pts.if you think this poser can win i have some beechfront property here in north phoenix i sell you for a song.

  84. When they get to Invesco Field, they should officially change their name to the Barack Obama Dumbocrat Party. It is becoming obvious that they would rather have Obama lose than see Hillary in the White House.



    Kim, what are we supposed to say? i can’t use the Pumapac site. i looked for the action/growl/whatever they’re calling it now but couldn’t find anything. that site is too disorganized and difficult to access for me.

  86. Love the rant, RD. I’m with you all the way. This in particular stuck out for me:

    And if the general election voters detect that you are not serious about winning in the fall, in a year when gas is creeping towards $5/gal, the war in Iraq drags on, there is a financial crisis looming and a million other things that affect the average Joe after 8 years of George Bush, the party as we know it will be dead.

    One of the big reasons I’m so angry is the fact that we have some of the most serious problems facing us since the Great Depression, which we may relive if something isn’t done. My mother lived through the Great Depression. In fact, her family were among the Okies who fled Oklahoma after the Dust Bowl and lived through the “real” Grapes of Wrath. She looks at what is happening right now and sees all the similarities.

    We are looking at disasters ahead of us that none of us have ever had to live through in the next decade if something serious is not done. There is nothing Obama has ever done or said that makes me believe he is in the least bit capable of reaching into himself and solving even one of the problems facing us. He wants the glory, but has no clue of what the job really means. And even our craven, idiotic democratic leadership should have been capable of understanding that. After all, they’ve had time to watch his lack of work ethic in the Senate. So they know who he is, and yet, they STILL shoved him down our throats. Quite frankly, they deserve to be impeached themselves for their stunning disregard for the good of the country.

  87. Carol:
    With a push from me, my sister donated $25 to Hillary by using the 5 Bucks icon.
    Although she never reads blogs, she’s a HUGE Hillary supporter, and wants her money counted here, so please add her.

  88. keisha: Stick it in your ear, dear. This “pseudo nomination” has been in the works for a couple of years. Hillary by no means felt “entitled”. If that were the case why would she have been opposed by 6 other candidates, most of whom had far better reasons to run than Obama as they came with the one word he could barely choke out: EXPERIENCE!

    She fought, and you know what, goddamn it, she won the popular vote. Your guy has to wiggle and bend his way around the final outcome. So please, spare the rest of us your “take” on all this and go back to making your yard signs.

  89. samsgrandma, on July 11th, 2008 at 12:11 pm Said:

    I just called the DNC and a spokesperson for the office of the chairman said Hillary’s name will be on the ballet with no preconditions.
    I can’t hardly believe it, to confirm call DNC (202-863-8000).

    the DNC has been saying that since someone posted that they said they wouldn’t on no quarter. i kept telling ppl to just call the DNC instead of spreading rumors but you know how rumors are. i’d see something pop up every few days saying the DNC was not having a roll call vote so i’d call and they’d say they were going to have a roll call vote. i think the DNC calling off the roll call vote was just a rumor.

    however, i think the DNC and the Obama camp are trying to push Hillary into agreeing to not have the roll call vote by not putting her name into nomination. RD reported about that yesterday:

    “Under party rules, Sen. Clinton’s huge delegate count gives her the right to put her name into nomination. “But do you do it?” asked Ms. Brazile. ”Politically, does it heighten tensions?” (from the Wall Street Journal)

  90. sassy: Good luck, I could not get through and I had it on redia about 6 times. PUMAs are out there.

  91. Riverdaughter and others — I sure hope to meet you in Denver !!!! I am there the whole week – flying in early Sunday – leaving Friday morning. Protesting the whole time – I will be eating fried foods of all colors.

    They will hear me ROAR !!!

  92. Pat, what do i say? i don’t know why i’m supposed to call Pelosi.

  93. sassy, hold on I will try to paste it here.

  94. sassy:
    Here’s a Script to use. Feel free to change as you see fit, but PLEASE remember to say that you are a member of Puma PAC (remember the PAC part so we don’t get confused with Will Bower’s group). We really want them to know WHO we are.

    Hi, this is Alice. I’m a Democrat from Dallas and a member of Puma PAC, the Voice of the Voters in the Democratic Party. I’ve heard that Super Delegates will only be able to have a “Symbolic Vote” for Senator Clinton at the Convention in Denver. Is it true that super delegates are being encouraged to cast their votes for Senator Obama, even if they believe Senator Clinton would be a better nominee for our Party, just to make a SHOW of Unity? Well, I just want Speaker Pelosi to know that I am a Democrat and a voter, and I am not fooled by a Show of Unity. Senator Obama recently said they were “negotiating” whether Senator Clinton’s name would be in Open Nomination at the Convention. Well, as a member of Puma PAC, I just want Speaker Pelosi to know that DEMOCRACY IS NOT NEGOTIABLE!

    Thank you very much for your time and for taking my call.

  95. Pat, thanks!

  96. Pat, what they mean when they say that Hillary “felt entitled” is that that uppity bitch had the nerve to come in all qualified and knowing more stuff, and who does Little Miss Thing think she is?

    That’s about it.

  97. Keisha, Obama supporters and the media [e.g., see Time’s Michael Kingsley latest words] consistenly maintain that Obama’s biggest asset is being black. Any sense of entitlement here is for Obama because of his race. I’ll say it clearly: He is our only Affirmative Action presidenial nominee, and that will become a tiresome theme when we confront the problems of our country. It’s also an insult to truly qualified black candidates who wouldn’t resort to race-baiting.

    And if you think I’m a racist for saying that, just stick around, because it is only a matter of time before the majority of Americans say it.

  98. WTF is a “symbolic vote?” Is that like the “symbolic votes” for Nikita Krushchev and Fidel Castro they used to have?

    Getting a fucking straight answer out of these assholes is like wishing on the monkey’s paw. “We want her delegates seated.”

    “Okay, we’ll seat them.” But they can’t open their mouths.

    “We want them to be able to vote.”

    “Okay, done.” Only for Obama.

    “We want them to be able to vote for Clinton.”

    “Okay, FINE! See? See all the concessions we’re making to you unreasonable harpies?” Their votes just won’t be counted.

    “We want the votes counted!”

    “Okay, FINE BITCHES!” They’ll only be symbolic votes!


    “OKAY THEY CAN VOTE FOR HER FOR REAL!” After they finish running across a gasoline fire naked while drenched in kerosene!

    Fuckers. Goddamn stinknig rat fuckers, every one of them. FUCK the DNC.

  99. I thought Obama had to let his internet trolls go since he didn’t raise enough money.

    He said the bloggers were ineffective anyway.

    By the way, Rock on RD and Pat.

  100. Janis: Next time I turn her over to you! She won’t know what hit her.

    By the way PUMAs, I got through to “Nancy’s” office and some nice man directed me to her Voicemail which was great since if we pile up the calls on the Voicemail she will have to take notice. Best I could do. The young man was very polite.

  101. All votes for Hillary are symbolic votes, meaning: they don’t count. Including the votes of voters in the primaries.

  102. Keisha, on July 11th, 2008 at 1:34 pm Said:

    A racebaiting, know-nothing, in corruption up to his neck, chicago loser..and yes, LOSER, lying, backtracking, hypocritical DO ANYTHING TO WIN who is being supported by backroom deals (did you WATCH the entire 8 hour debacle on CSPAN during the RBC?!?!? you know, the one where they voted behind closed doors, breaking their own damn charter?!?!) I did!!

    Sorry, but this whole thing is gamed, and it’s all because of one thing…


    Not because barackula is half black and half white, with some arab thrown in there…not because he’s “transcendental” but because of the CHICAGO MONEY TIES!!!

    Good God woman, start doing your own f*cking research, and think for yourself!

    As it is now, you’re voting for a perceived “black” version of GEORGE W. BUSH, and you’re an obamabushbot!!

  103. Contribution Details
    Date: July 11, 2008 2:20 PM EDT
    Contact: Delphyne
    New Jersey
    Amount: $20.08

    OK, Carol – here’s another for Hillary. I wanna see that haircut for Nancy!!

    Janis – love your idea of the ad and especially loved our post at 2:19!! Particularly the very last sentence!

  104. They are just repeating the mantra they heard from Fr. Pfleger (I use the term Father with reluctance).

    “Hillaaarrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyy thought she was entitled and then this black man came and took it from her.”

  105. I feel completely energized today even though I am cleaning and it is humid here again. Just reading these posts and diaries gives me that tingle going up my leg like Chris Matthews must feel. Either that or a case of sunstroke.

    PUMAs rock! Carol, Michael is going to go over the moon!

  106. Guys,
    what Keisha seems to be saying is that Obama is a fucking coward who can’t go mano-a-mano with Hillary in a floor fight. He’d rather close his eyes and pretend that forcing everyone to support him is going to work, even though all evidence points to the contrary.
    That’s the message that Keisha and Donna Brazile and Nancy Pelosi and Howard Dean is telling us. Obama is a wimp. He doesn’t have the cojones to take Hillary on. Not only doesn’t he have the balls to do it, but even if he did, he couldn’t win it because he’s a lightweight and she’d deck him in the first round. Sort of like how she beat the shit out of him in the last debate they had before the PA primary.
    Isn’t that it, Keisha? Remember how he went to NC and gave that stupid little campaign rally with the “brush the dirt off your shoulders” gesture? Several times? We’re not stupid. We know there was a Jay-Z song. We get the cultural reference. In fact, we get it *too* well, Keisha. Just like a coward who was soundly beaten, he went to a friendly rally and made fun of her behind her back. Yeah, that takes courage Keisha. THAT’S the man you are voting for. It’s not just experience he lacks, it’s maturity and bravery.
    Man, I can not WAIT to see what John McCain and the behemoth GOP 527’s are going to do with all this material.
    You can be damned sure that Hillary would stand up to them. But Obama hasn’t got a fricking prayer. He hasn’t fought for anything in his life and he sure as hell isn’t going to start now.

  107. Thanks Pat, made my call on the road, so I could not answer.

  108. http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2008/3514fdr_1932_victory.html

    according to this source, which is, BTW, extremely interesting reading, FDR received the nomination on the fourth ballot.

    Anyone who is interested in reading this entire article, it’s long but it goes into a lot of detail about the machinations to try to defeat FDR and “install” another candidate. The intentions were to establish a Mussolini-Hitler still regimen. Hmmmm, sound familiar?

  109. okay, typing too fast. that is “style” regimen, not still.

    Sorry about that.

  110. I’m about to buy another t-shirt in honor of Keisha!

    I’ll be back in a second.

  111. Pat, I got through. the guy who answered put me through to her voicemail but at least i got to leave a message.

    thanks for the script!

  112. Lavinia: I soooo much want to believe in your link but it’s got LaRouche stamped all over it. That makes it somewhat less than credible. I hope you have a secondary source that will back up the details of the intentions of all of the players as the votes themselves are not in dispute.
    But LaRouche? {{cringeworthy}}

  113. Obama shows us who he really is and where he places women. He simply stands behind them, a la Nancy and Donna, to do his dirty work for him. Hillary was much too strong for him alone and he relies on women to pave his way.

    Sickening spectacle to say the least about a future “leader”.

  114. #
    SI.com has learned that for the first time in history, a major presidential candidate may sponsor a race car in NASCAR’s premier series. According to sources, Barack Obama’s campaign is in talks to become the primary sponsor of BAM Racing’s No. 49 Sprint Cup car for the Pocono race on August 3.


    I am waiting breathlessly for the Obama Generation Pepsi ad.


  115. Love you RD!

    Not sure I have ever commented, but I gave
    $20.08 last week and $50 yesterday because of this site’s encouragement.

    We’re with you Hillary!

  116. Janis,

    i’m not sure the DNC ever said any of that. i’m not sure why ppl are saying that Super Delegates will only be able to have a “Symbolic Vote” for Senator Clinton at the Convention in Denver. there are a lot of rumors flying around. some may be true (or partially true) but many are not true at all.

  117. May I get out of moderation?

  118. Alice: You mean, “I’d like to buy the world a Coke” ad.

  119. RD, you’re right.. I don’t know what to say. I didn’t read through it all fast enough to see that. Sigh.. well, the facts about the ballots are right, at any rate.

    The rest, I most assuredly am not going to be able to confirm.

  120. Just got this from Amanda Michel. I guess even though I unsubscribed from HuffPost, I am still on the Off the Bush Mailing List. They want input on the perfect cabinet.

    THIS IS THE EMAIL THEY SENT (still do not know how to do the quotes thing):


    Today we introduce a new feature to OffTheBus, “Here’s My Take.” It’s the brainchild of Jennifer Bogut, an OffTheBus op-ed editor and comment moderator, who wanted to open up discussion in a way that op-eds and comments don’t permit. Think of it as a citizen think-tank. Or a focused discussion. Or a debate.

    “HERE’S MY TAKE #1”: How would you design the incoming administration? Pick your presidential candidate, and then outline your dream cabinet.

    You don’t have to nail down every position, but pick at least five from the list — Secretary of Agriculture, Secretary of the Interior, Secretary of Commerce, Secretary of Justice, Secretary of Defense, Secretary of Labor, Secretary of Education, Secretary of State, Secretary of Energy, Secretary of Transportation, Secretary of Health & Human Services, Secretary of the Treasury, Secretary of Homeland Security, Secretary of Veterans Affairs, and Secretary of Housing & Urban Development. Here’s President George Bush’s cabinet, in case you’d like an example.

    To help you out, check out Jennifer’s submission. We’re looking for responses similarly formatted – identify your pick, and then explain why in 2-3 sentences. Be reasoned and clear.

    SUBMIT YOUR ANSWER: Send your entry to campaigntrail@huffingtonpost.com and put “Here’s my take” in the subject line. Include your name, a quick bio, and, if you’ve got it, a headshot.

    DEADLINE: Midnight Friday, July 17


  121. Dear Keisha, or whoever you actually are: I just followed Bonita’s lead and bought a t-shirt in honor of you. Thanks for dropping by, sweetie!

    Have a super day,
    no really,

  122. Sent $50 more for Hillary.

  123. RD, Keisha and most of her generation have only ever grown up with largely useless national conventions. As far as they know, the national party convention is when everyone comes together to coronate the guy everyone knows they’re supposed to go with, and for a few nights, all their favorite shows are preempted. They are used to a useless, three-night long advertisement constituting a national party convention.

    They have NO CLUE that a convention is actually suposed to be a functioning thing, because they’ve never seen one like that. They never lived to see it, and their high school history classes probably stopped at the Korean War and didn’t even go through anyof the party conventions up to that point.

    They are completely uninformed. They really do know nothing — they think presidents just drop out of the sky at us, like iPhones and shuffles. MArketing gurus tell them what the latest fad/candidate is, and they obediently toddle forward and go for it. No decision-making needed, just Get The Cool Thing And Be One Of The In Crowd.

    Keisha — PARTY CONVENTIONS SERVE A PURPOSE. You may never have seen it within your lifetime, but they really, honestly do. A contested convention might as well be a sign of the Apocalypse for you, but to the rest of us, it’s a sign of democracy. It’s anybody’s race at this point, STILL. And — here’s the kicker — YOUR GUY MIGHT STILL LOSE.

    That is, if it’s a fair fight. Which he and his cronies are doing everything to prevent.

  124. Wow: , did Jesse Jackson call him a closet Republican? In those words?

    Thats the first of the super Ds to call it like it is.


    Forget the nuts stuff, the first is the lead here:

    First Superdelegate Sees The Light –
    Calls Obama Closet Republican

  125. Here’s my receipt. Thanks for the motivation Keisha. This ones for you.


    DATE: July 11, 2008 2:39 PM EDT
    AMOUNT: $50.00

  126. #
    riverdaughter, on July 11th, 2008 at 2:41 pm Said:

    Alice: You mean, “I’d like to buy the world a Coke” ad.


    Oh dear, that forms an all-too-vivid picture in my head… I can see it now, in all its insipid, groupthink, commercialized and crass glory. Ow!

  127. “WTF is a “symbolic vote?” Is that like the “symbolic votes” for Nikita Krushchev and Fidel Castro they used to have?”

    Janis, and every wise person here: I wish so many spot-on comments here could be recced.
    What Janis said.

  128. On the other hand, giving the nom to Hillary would do one thing that I did not think was possible….it would break the Democrat’s hold on black america. The GOP has been saying for years that the Democrats take us for granted. We would be able to see that live on television. We could see a demographic shift of parties the likes of which American politics have not seen since the 1960s

    i think you may be right. that’s what Obama’s selection (not election) has done now. women and the working class (who have already been moving to the Republicans) are going to move away from the Dems. the Dems take us for granted. they already showed us that on May 30th. Obama’s aides and Brazile have said outright that they neither need nor want us. this is not just going to hurt the Dems in 2008. unless the Dems change dramatically, we’re leaving for a long time.

  129. The DNC is considering, along with the networks to cut the convention by one day. Hmmmmmm, I guess the money problem is bigger than we have calculated up to now.

  130. Carol, Carol. (waving frantically from The Kingdom of Lurk) Please add my $50 to the total.

    Gotta get to work. Love you guys.

  131. Janis, you effin rock.

  132. can someone clue me in on why ppl are ranting about “symbolic votes”? (no dis on rants.)

    who said something about symbolic votes? Dean? Pelosi? Brazile?

  133. sassy: Letting her votes be recorded but having absolutely no meaning in the process. The bastards!

  134. Pat,

    IOW, that’s the shortcut for Obama bribed the SDs and the DNC leaned on them? aka cut backroom deals?

  135. sassy: When the superdelegates started to come out in full force long before the primary had ended and the public votes had not all been tallied, you had to have had a deep, underlying suspicion that something underhanded was going on.

    MA went overwhelmingly for Hillary yet my two senators came out for him. She won WVa handily and Byrd came out for him. Edwards fell all over himself to back Obama when his wife was already on record in opposing his healthcare plan. It just stunk to high heaven. Yet the states who were left, including PR, with few exceptions, went for Hillary. Go figure. The fix was in.

  136. Donna B is at it again with another one of her famous e-mails:


  137. RD – remember, Arianna called BO a “Coke Zero” when he renigged on the FISA.

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rock!

  138. Pat Johnson, on July 11th, 2008 at 2:53 pm Said:

    They make it seem like they have lots since BO is having his speech at a huge stadium which I heard is going to cost them 3 million

  139. RD – and by the way, the SD’s don’t need an excuse, they need some integrity!

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  140. HillBuzz caqlled Backtrack Onbyme the New Coke.

  141. While I was gone, Keisha set-off a fire storm of donations. Keisha – Hillary, the Universe and I certainly appreciate that!

    I am taking the totals to the next thread. Please keep donating what you can and post upstream for the tally!

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rule!

  142. Janis – You are dead-on about that ad. I’ve done a lot of copywriting myself and it did suck, although the intentions and the ideas were great. I noticed the typo too. Go to it, girl! Do you need the email address for the Denver Group’s founder? If so, email me at:

    madamab at gmail dot com


    Any excuse indeed, like – “We are saving the Party from itself and nominating the most electable and Democratic candidate. The primaries were a tie and we are breaking that tie.

    And Obamans – GET OVER IT!!! 🙂

  143. Pat, thanks for explaining. it sounds like “symbolic votes” is the new “backroom deals”.

    i was suspicious. there were articles showing that many of the SDs who were endorsing Obama got quite a bit of money from him. and both the DNC and the Obama campaign leaned on them. that’s what i said above (backroom deals were cut ).

    i think Kennedy’s hated Clinton since her work on the Nixon impeachment. i can’t remember exactly but something her boss said or did somehow lessened the public image of JFK in Kennedy’s mind. and since Clinton, obviously, did what her boss told her to do. (it was her first job out of law school. what else was she going to do?) anyway, i think Kennedy has hated her ever since then.

    Obama supporters tried to bring that up again in this campaign but they just looked stupid. i think Edwards got promised some cabinet post. Richardson too.

    i think there is a lot of misogyny in Congress. i think that’s why so many ppl like Kerry and Byrd (and Kennedy) support Obama.

  144. Just because I felt like making this observation again:

    Obama is only neck and neck with a man who represents a party at the nadir of its appeal.

    He’s utterly FAILED to meet fundraising targets for this month, and has clocked his fourth straight significant decline.

    He only “won” the nomination because he gamed caucuses and proportional delegate awards. What are there none of in the general election?

    Caucuses and proportional delegate awards. 🙂

    Obama’s on the decline, plus his best game is looooong behind him. He’s coasting to a stop, and the only game ahead is the one the rulebook for which would have awarded victory to his rival. Heh.

  145. Kerry, Byrd, and Kennedy are supporting Obama because it makes them feel hip, young, and cool. They should just screw their seceretaries and buy red convertibles and get it the hell out of their systems.

  146. Pat Johnson, on July 11th, 2008 at 3:10 pm Said:
    sassy: When the superdelegates started to come out in full force long before the primary had ended and the public votes had not all been tallied, you had to have had a deep, underlying suspicion that something underhanded was going on.

    MA went overwhelmingly for Hillary yet my two senators came out for him. She won WVa handily and Byrd came out for him. Edwards fell all over himself to back Obama when his wife was already on record in opposing his healthcare plan. It just stunk to high heaven. Yet the states who were left, including PR, with few exceptions, went for Hillary. Go figure. The fix was in.


    So were you upset that over 100 Superdelegates supported Hillary before the first primary or caucus.

    You have no credibility to complain about SD coming out in suppoirt of Obama before the last elections when a big chunk of Hillary’s came out before first ballots were even cast.

    You folks need to accept the fact that Hillary started the election with all the money, the party elite’s support, a pre election lead in superdelegates and the Clinton name….and she lost.

    For all of Hillary’s experience, she failed to prepare a post Super Tuesday strategy, she blew most of her money in Iowa leaving her short, she ran a top down campaing until she was pushed to the wall, she hired incompotent people to run her campaign, she ran an incumbent campaign in a change year and she had a piss poor ground game and on top of all that, she unleashed her husband on the public where he repeatedly put his foot in his mouth and cost her key constituencies. Additionally, Hillary KNEW before the process began that half the country hated her with a firey passion. She knew that she had the highest negatives of any of the candidates. You’d think all of her vaunted experience would have prepared her for that….It didn’t. Instead she gont steam rolled buy a guy who understands the importance of grass roots campaigning, who threw away the old electoral map and blazed an entirely new path to the nomination…all within the established rules.

    Hillary was unprepared and lost to a more efficient campaign. Her debate performances could not compete with the fact that he was doing better on the gound. While you’re discussing the fact that Hillary had 18 million followers, remember that she lost the other half of the party. She needed his coalition as much as he needed hers. You PUMAS might like to ignore that fact, but its true. I know that you folks don’t respect the fact that just as many people supported him, but as voters we count as well.

  147. RD this is right on on the mark. Crystal clear, encompassing all issues the SDs have to “face-up to” AND shows that PUMAs are not “bitter, whiny old has-beens”. Some (or should I say all?) are brilliant, well-educated and tough.

    Can it be sent to every superdelegate?

  148. Brilliant!!! We’re sick of the crap!!!

    I hope I’m as brilliant today on Sirius’ India Talk channel 110…the Blog Bunker at 5:30 pm ET.

    I’m so nervous I’m about to revisit my lunch….


  149. Keisha, your talking points are at least six months out of date.

  150. Add this to the total:

    I donated another $50 to retire Hilary’s debt @ Heidi Li’s site @ 7:45 am before leaving for class today.

    Good post RD & Janis straighten out those Denver Group folks (I’ve donated to them also) on effective advertising.

    Proud PumaPac member

  151. Keisha, if I weren’t so bored with you I may have responded with a snark here and there. However, I am tired and your refrain is one I have heard over and over until my ears bleed. Please do not come in here and violate Hillary to a group of hard core supporters. You are not among friends.

  152. What’s key is for PUMA to keep the pressure on the DNC and force their hand. Make them defy all the rules and deny Hillary her rightful place on the ballot.

    Whether a bolt of lightening strikes the SD’s and wakes them up to the reality of what’s happening here or not, it won’t matter. We still will have made them show their willingness to anoint obama and escue all of the rules and/or buy off or threaten the SD’s to fall in line.

    Our goal is to make certain they don’t get away with this lie. We have to force it out in the open for all to see. Otherwise, they will spin it that the Dems have all come home.

  153. Keisha, there must be a blog somewhere that would be thrilled to have you. This isn’t one.

  154. DancesWithPumas, I’ll be there with SimoFish. Please come join us if you can.

  155. Keisha, so what?
    HRC made mistakes.
    BHO gamed the caucusses.
    That doesn’t make BHO a good candidate or HRC a poor one.
    There is simply no reason for the powers that be to promote Obama other than the fact that he’s black.
    His only verifiable accomplishment is running for office in sham elections, gaming the system all along the way.
    Your only point seems to be that he’s slicker than spit.
    Well, you may be right, but that’s hardly impressive.
    And again, so what?
    Nobody here is going to either vote for him or welcome you with open arms.
    We’re not interested in debate, we’re interested in getting the better candidate elected.
    If you can help with that, fine.
    If not, why not talk to someone who cares?

  156. Well, actually, both Gore and Kerry did win the election making the GOP’s last WON election in 1988 -20 years ago.
    Giving up won elections is another thing Democrats do – and in this case – judging by what delegates told Hillary last month, they gave up on this one before the primaries started.
    sorry, I never kept the original link to this one:

  157. It’s bad enough that our afternoon has to be spoiled by a troll. But does it have to be spoiled by such a damn boring drone of a troll?

    I am in awe of those of you that have the patience to bother to respond to such critters. Me, I just wanna set off a troll bug bomb and not come back until they are all lying on their backs with their feet in the air and their mouths shut.

  158. I don’t want to make your blood boil RD. But, this puts the “urrrrrrrrrrrrr” rather than the Purrr, out there for all to see. Astaire he is not, nor JFK, nor anybody else that was a decent Dem.

    Why is she letting him humiliate her like this?

    It’s bad news all around.


    more P.U.M.A, is more powerful. Don’t vote for this imbecile. Ever.

  159. Keisha: Does your candidate have what it takes to fight it out at the convention or not? Because that’s what it’s going to take. The candidate who did not win CA, NJ, NY, PA, OH, MA, FL, MI, WV, TX, TN, IN didn’t win diddly-squat. He won a bunch of delegate rich but Democrat poor western states. If he wants the nomination, he is going to have to fight the real winner, the one who would have had it all sewn up on Feb 5 if it hadn’t been for the underhanded dealings of Donna Brazile and company.
    So, what’s it going to be, Keisha? Is he going to come and face us, the 18 million who thought he wasn;t ready to be president and convince us to vote for him or not? Is he going to challenge Hillary at the convention or is he going to count on his friends in the DNC to do his dirty work for him? Can he stand toe to toe with Hillary and win or is he just a sham?
    What’s it going to be, Keisha? Because we aren’t taking what the DNC is dishing out and sooner or later, he’s going to have to face us.
    He either wins at the convention or he loses as the ballot box.
    Why don’t you go ask him? what is he afraid of?

  160. vbonnaire: that was the same breakfast where he forgot to ask for people to help pay her debt. Consider the source.

  161. “Some group of SDs need to grab the reins of leadership that Dean has foolishly thrown away,
    Governor Rendell, are you with us?” Riverdaughter

    Yes I agree with this statement and I think a fabulous way to go. Let’s work on Rendell, to get behind us, someones got to step up.
    Where are the REAL DEMOCRATS, besides us Pumas?
    Isn’t it something…that not one person in the Democrat Party has stood up for her, and said that she’s the most qualified, and I want her leading this country, not some neophyte, who can’t complete a sentence that doesn’t have 15 “uhs” in it.

    This article is well written, and RD, what about us emailing this to the SD’s and lbeling it “A Must Read”

  162. Word word word. Keisha, if the guy can only win with someone’s thumb on the scale, then he’s not fit to win in a fair fight.

    Things don’t get easier once you’re in the Oval Office. It’s not a coast downhill from there. If he doesn’t have what it takes to win in a fair fight, he doesn’t have what it takes to be president.

    FDR only won his party’s nomination on the 4th ballot — and thank dawg we got the guy tough enough to win in a long, hard fight, because as a nation we had a long, hard fight ahead of us!

    I don’t WANT some twit who can only prevail when the deck’s stacked against him! We’ve HAD a spiled, inexperienced slacker in the Oval Office for eight years already! Let’s just do the smart thing for once and pick the one who can do the effing job.

  163. Fred and Ginger? So in other words, we’re STILL FUCKING BACKWARDS AND IN HIGH HEELS!

    That’s not something to fucking celebrate.

  164. Janis, no it isn’t/ In fact, it’s a pretty patronizing thing to say. But the outlet that is quoting it is Australian which has been known to be pretty right wing.

  165. Okay, gotcha.

  166. RD, loved your post. Thanks once again.

    I’ve caught up on some of today’s read and only have a minute—the guys in my house are real Nascar fans. Very possible that the car Barack is planning to sponsor WON’T qualify for the race and if it makes it in–won’t make it to the finish. Sounds just right for Barack–what a plan. LOL

    Catch up with you all later

  167. Janis, this is such a great comment:

    “what they mean when they say that Hillary “felt entitled” is that that uppity bitch had the nerve to come in all qualified and knowing more stuff, and who does Little Miss Thing think she is?”

    Funny? yes; but also so true. Replace Hillary’s name with the name of most of the women I know and those lines capture the essence of our discontent. We own it.

    good stuff, thx

  168. Just out of curiosity; what makes you think that Democrats would fall in line behind Hillary, or even rethugs for that matter?

    Rethugs, with the help of right-wing media, accused the Clinton family of drug abuse, embezzlement, and murder, and people bought into it.

  169. so did a lot of obama supporters to their eternal discredit….Democrats don’t treat other democrats like republicans, that’s why we’ll never vote for obama

  170. garychapelhill: “so did a lot of obama supporters to their eternal discredit….Democrats don’t treat other democrats like republicans, that’s why we’ll never vote for obama”

    The same can be said about Hillary. Remember, the pendulum swings both ways. I’m not saying that Obama’s hands are clean, but Hillary is far from being a saint.

  171. its one thing to go after your opponent in an election, but give me one example of the horrendous treatment that her SUPPORTERS received from his campaign being done by her to his supporters. She never did anything like that. We were treated as if we were republicans, and that’s shameful. Obama and axelrod are nothing more than an even more ruthless bush/rove, and t hey are going to lose big time because those of us who he (and his supporters like you) smeared will do whatever it takes to rid our party of that kind of politics.

  172. garychapelhill: “but give me one example of the horrendous treatment that her SUPPORTERS received from his campaign.”

    I can’t. Her supporters have received no horrendous treatment from his campaign.

  173. tell that to the millions of democrats in WV and KY who were written off as racist. the obama campaign did NOTHING to stop that meme, and actually reinforced it by not campaigning there and blaming the voters for watching fox news and buying the racist stories about him. You are a liar and a traitor to your party (if you really ever were a democrat)

  174. garychapelhill: “You are a liar and a traitor to your party (if you really ever were a democrat).”

    You call me a liar and a traitor, and you say that Hillary supporters are being treated horrendously.

    Pot, meet Kettle.

    This is typical right wing tactics. When you can’t prove your case you resort to name calling.

    On the front of the puma party website they have a Democrats for McCain slogan, and you have nerve to call me a traitor. McCain is the man who took a complete 180 on torture and wants a 1000 years in Iraq.

  175. I don’t even know what website you’re talking about. My vote belongs to no one but me. Don’t lecture me about McCain when Obama caved on FISA and basically gave GWB no worries about EVER being held accountable for his crimes.

    “This is typical right wing tactics. When you can’t prove your case you resort to name calling. ”

    did you read my comment? I called you a liar and a traitor because you are. You conveniently ignored my actual proof that he wrote off all of those voters as racist. He went as far as to blame them for watching fox news and therefore not understanding how wonderful he is. got that??? HE BLAMED THE VOTERS FOR NOT VOTING FOR HIM.. What a tool you are if you can blissfully ignore that. And despite the constant barrage of sexism against her by assholes like you, Hillary never once blamed his supporters for not voting for her.

  176. was he the one doing the whispering, because a lot of people heard it:

    “I’m not well-known there,” Obama said. “You know, some of these e-mails and rumors that have been talked about penetrated in West Virginia [more] than they have in some other states.”

    “more than they have in some other states” that basically is blaming them for being too stupid or too racist in WV to see past the rumors….that is elitist and offensive…and on KY:

    “And there are a lot of voters who get their news from Fox News. Fox has been pumping up rumors about my religious beliefs or my patriotism or what have you since the beginning of the campaign.”

    that sounds like blaming the voters to me. get your facts straight ,Underhanded Tool, before you come here spreading your lies. Obama will NEVER be president

  177. how about not being a coward and joining us on the current thread. Trolling old posts and posting your debunked propaganda and charges of racism are not allowed, sweeite

  178. get lost dumbass

  179. My hubby and I both got shirts last night. Put us down for 1 large ($100.)

    rd: Actually, I’m an ardent student of FDR and have done a lot of reading about his life and especially about his rise to the presidency. It’s quite a read and not exactly everything we think noble about FDR is reality. But what I wanted to say here is that I came to the very same conclusions, independently and through my study of FDR, that Lyndon Larouche came to about the state of our country pre-FDR’s presidency and through to today. Facism was actually vogue in the US (yeah, hard to believe). It was taken up by the salon elites and an accessory-type version of it was in mass market to the wannabes. Sort of like being a world citizen bordering on anit-American is appealing to a lot of young people today. Through free trade (it really does sound benign, doesn’t it?), we were rapidly losing our political, social and most importantly, our economic soveriegnity to European bankers. Very much like we’re seeing today with currency speculators, well, speculators of all stripes. Before I go on, let me assure you that I’m not now nor have I ever been involved with the larouche people. But one thing I know they are big on is a thorough knowledge of history–not just US history, but world history–so that when someone comes at you with a cliche’ and follows it up with just enough intellgent sounding clap trap to sound thoughtful, one can rebut such nonsense with their own knowledge of world events. Naturally it takes a lot of reading and thinking and talking and debating with others to come to some sort of knowledge base and that’s why, today, so many of us can’t argue beyond yesterday’s news and the flotsam and jetsom floating around us.

    Anyway, one book “The Defining Moment” is a fascinating biography of FDR and I was surprised to learn (and I’ll check my other books and the background of the writer, too) that FDR’s privileged upbringing (family banking interests, etc.) and indifference to the lower classes didn’t play well to the electorate at the time of his governor run in NY. He was considered quite a snob and elitest. He won by the slimmest of margins against Al Smith and Tammany Hall. I won’t detail it all here but the really fascinating part, according to this author, is how his polio played into his change of thinking about people in general.

    Since FDR’s presidency was a paradigm shift in American politics, how we adopted that alphabet soup of regulation and social change I would encourage some summer reading on the subject. And perhaps also reexamine Larouche’s data on the subject, too. I try to look not just at the messenger but the substance of the message, Oh, and that’s why I’m not voting for Obama.

  180. just watched this video you have to watch it to the end wow 50,000 Righteous Men

  181. AA4Hill: That video is pretty powerful. So, if I understand the reverend correctly, the reason the AA community is turning out for Obama is because they worship him? He is a savior of sorts? It’s not like Obama hasn’t gone out of his way to reinforce that image. I understand it. It’s regrettable that Obama can’t be one of those 50,000 men. Then, even *I* would vote for him.

    Didn’t much care for the anarchy protesters for the Denver convention. They could endanger the peaceful protesters who are planning to go, many of them moms of kids.

  182. love this post!!
    obama will not win
    hillary 08! or 12!!

  183. […] begs the super delegates to find any excuse to dump […]

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