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Things That Make You Go WTF?

From Matt Stoller at OpenLeft:

It’s interesting to consider how Clinton would have voted were she the nominee, and there’s no way to know now.  Why did she vote properly this time?  She doesn’t have a strong incentive to vote  either way this time.  She’s going to be a very powerful Senator going forward with a substantial PAC and web operation regardless.  I wonder why she did this.  It’s possible she voted this way to embarrass Obama, though it’s more likely she just believes that this is a bad bill.  Maybe it’s heralding a new Clinton who is less cautious and more willing to fight for liberal principles.

Gee Matt, with punditry like that, you truly deserve a high-paying job alongside MoDo and Bloody Bill Kristol.  I very much want to tell you what I really think of you, but this is a family-blog.  So just think of the most abusive and insulting thing anyone has every said to you, then scream it at your reflection in the mirror while pelting yourself with rotting fruit and animal feces.

Stoller is a prime example of Obot illogic and the poster child for the dangers of kool-aid addiction.  Rather than simply give a tip of the hat to Hillary for her vote on the FISA bill today, Stoller feels the need to speculate as to her motives.  And of course he ignores Occam’s Razor and assumes complicated and corrupt motives on her part.  Finally, at the end of the sixth sentence, he arrives at the obvious and logical answer: Hillary voted against the FISA revision because she thinks it’s a bad bill. 

I guess it was too simple.

Stoller exhibits the CDS mindset that saw racism in the words “fairy tale” and nefarious intentions in a comment about RFK’s assassination.  He also is in deep denial and is rationalizing Obama’s yes vote on FISA so as to turn it into some shrewd and necessary political calculation, instead of facing the cold, hard truth: Obama is not the person his supporters think he is.

We really need a 12-Step program for Kool-aid detox.

PS: The graphic came from Clyde’s Place

273 Responses

  1. Donna Brazile
    When: July 15, 2008 – Tuesday
    Noon to 1:30
    Where: Palace Hotel, 2 New Montgomery Street, San Francisco
    What: Fundraiser for “Obama Victory Fund” with Donna Brazile.

    We’ll be at the hotel around 11:00 with homemade signs – I am looking for some sign suggestions – come on RD Puma’s — help me out.

    Anyone interested can contact me at sd1939@gmail.com

    RiverD – you were brilliant on NO WE WON’T !! Thanks for all you do !!!

    Go Hillary Go – thank you for voting NO today !! We love you !!

  2. wow new virgin thread ok Carol is taking a nap and we need some dollars so hillary can rack up some delegates….


  3. We had discussed a 12-step program for kool-aid users quite awhile ago. Guess it’s time to get it out of the planning stages. Problem is, most of the addicts don’t realize that they have a problem. We’ll need interventions. “Take the keys – friends don’t let friends vote for Obama”.

  4. Pitiful I believe it’s called delusional denial…and now Jessie Jackson speaks the truth and his son backs up the Bus and calls him names. My guess there is nothing left of the party after Nov..

  5. Donna I ain’t your Sweetie!
    Welcome to the woman who single handedly distroyed the democratic party

    to long

    how about Hey Donna You Suck


  6. Welcome to the asphalt, Rev. Jackson. Rev. Wright has been expecting you.

  7. Salt –
    I think Will B. should take over Coward’s role and instead of the DNC Party in November – it will be the PUMA Party or Darragh could take the lead role – Or maybe RiverD lead us — all fine choices.

    I am liking Lynn de Rothschild – good Fox Interview – ignore the tag line

  8. You know, come to think of it, we may have enough Revs under the bus to apply for some of those faith-based dollars……

  9. Donna dahling
    Marry Me
    Love Arianna

    Donna Oprah’s taken
    You are no Gayle

    Donna read my lips…Party Unity My Ass


  10. We have so many reverends under here that we should start a church. What should we call it?

  11. Like your tag, myiq: “stupid should hurt”? It’s so easy for 20-somethings like Stoller to fall in love mindlessly. So much for political acumen.

  12. Wow-za! MyIQ!!

    I’ve never been a Stoller fan — I’ve always thought he lacked a certain something…. Critical Thinking? Humor?

    It makes me sick that Hillary’s vote isn’t good enough for this clown. Her MOTIVES for the vote are assumed to be evil.


  13. First Church of the Asphalt.

  14. “Brazilenut, my moma say’s you’re a liar !!”
    Donna, stop the hate !! (her favorite e-mail response)

  15. regencyg, how about the old Flip Wilson favorite: The Church of What’s Happening Now. It should really rock.

  16. Fuzzy – keep ’em coming !! I am loving these 2

    Donna Oprah’s taken
    You are no Gayle

    Donna read my lips…Party Unity My Ass

  17. giving simofish some sign ideas for a Donna B Welcome in San Fran next tuesday-

    lets all pitch in

    oh and thank to all the donors now for the rest of you…
    fuzzy leaning…

    MIssing Gary and Mawm…my fav gay duo


  18. grayslady, it does rock because the bus can’t keep all it wheels on the road–to much luggage in the undercarriage.

  19. Haaaaaaaaaaaaa…

    Whoever created archiving is a genius. I just had to dust a couple of shelves to find this:

    It’s official: Obama will back a filibuster of any Senate FISA legislation containing telecom immunity, his campaign has just told Election Central. The Obama campaign has just sent over the following statement from spokesman Bill Burton:

    “To be clear: Barack will support a filibuster of any bill that includes retroactive immunity for telecommunications companies.”

    As we reported here yesterday, MoveOn and a dozen top liberal bloggers were preparing to wage an aggressive campaign today to pressure Obama and Hillary to say that they’ll support Chris Dodd’s vow to filibuster any Senate FISA bill containing telecom immunity. And late yesterday both Obama and Hillary put out statements saying that they’d back Dodd’s threatened filibuster of the current legislation that’s just come out of the Senate intel committee.

    Btw Creative class, what is your “or else”?

    My fellow Conflucians don’t yell at me because I have to do this:


  20. There are now so many people under the bus they alone could fill the Mile High Stadium.

  21. It is amazing what the polls reflect. Most agree that there is only a 2-6 point difference between Obama and McCain. That is not a big deal since we can all probably agree that McCain’s campaign is dismal.

    Wonder what the polls will reflect after today. I am hoping they go low.

  22. Hahaha! That tag is hilarious myiq. But I know. It does hurt.

    EPU’ed from downstairs, for Pat:

    Sorry, I got sidetracked. Pat, Darragh was on the phone call, so PUMA was representing. I will say this: Mark your calendars for July 19th. And August 26th.

    I think I can tell you this much too: A group of groups, for lack of better terminology (sorry, I’m tired) is organizing an action for July 19th with regard to the Declaration. They are going to change it (somewhat significantly) and call for national action on July 19th, the 160th Anniversary of the Seneca Falls Women’s Rights Convention. I’m sorry I can’t be specific about the action, or the changes, or the groups. I was asked not blog about it until they prepared a press release and made an announcement. But I think I am allowed to say that much in comments here at The Confluence. The organization looks pretty good, too.

  23. myiq2xu-why is it everything that hillary does has to be turned into a process story?

    I am beginning to think these Bozo’s dont deserve Hillary as their president -they will never love and appreciate her like we do….

    Donna -Da rulz say -open convention-roll call vote


  24. Keep saying it out loud, MaBlue: WE TOLD YOU SO. I’ve certainly been thinking it to myself all afternoon.

  25. I wish I was in San Fransisco this weekend. I’d tape a Declaration to Donna’s forehead, I swear.

  26. er, next Tuesday….

  27. That last thread was so long it took me forever to read it. I loved that WSJ article. LOL! When are we going to find out how much money Obama raised in June. It must be disappointing or they would have released the numbers by now. How long can they keep it secret? It looks like there are some people with real pull refusing to vote Obama or support the DNC.

    Ha ha Howard and Donna. You blew it bigtime. You could have had both Clintons raising money for you. But you had to have an unqualified candidate who gets more unlikeable the more you find out about him. Losers!

  28. oh oh oh how about…
    Donna your momma would slap you


  29. Every day something different comes out which cements our original feeling that this election has been rigged. We kind of thought it was then pulled back as she started mopping up the votes. But those supers had me puzzled right along. What was their rush to announce?

    When Kennedy, Kerry, and Byrd came out for Obama when both MA and WVa were solidly in her camp, you knew then there was something wrong.

    There has to be a way to show how divided and determined we are to force an open convention.

  30. Pat, we have to continue to organize, to convince people in powerful positions via our rhetoric, to show up in Denver, and to get some of the leadership and the troops into the convention. We need to be able to petition the party before and during the Convention.

  31. annabelle I am telling you the tide is turning and Rush may be ahead of everyone on this….I dont like him but He would not say it if he did not mean it…


  32. Here’s a question for the sippy-kup kidz: Assuming that Obama has a core ideology (big assumption, no factual basis) is he a liberal/progressive pretending to be a centrist to win votes in November, or is he a centrist who was posing as a liberal/progressive during the primaries in order to win the nomination?

    IOW – Was he lying then or is he lying now?

  33. fuzzy, I do feel the tide is turning, but I’m not about to listen to Rush about it, or believe for one second that he even has any authority to speak on it. But I agree, the tide is turning, thanks to many of Obama’s mess ups.

    You guys remember myiq’s PB an J 2.0 post? Here’s an idea I’ve been tossing around. Obama’s own troops are ripe for picking off right now. What if a bunch of PUMAs organized talking points and mass actions online at places like DK and MyDD, OpenLeft, etc? I mean, we can turn it around on them, right? And recruit? And how fun would a little group psy ops be? Anybody?

  34. myiq: One thing I know. He’s always lying.

  35. even though Dean Pelosi and Co want Obama if they see that the cost of their support is not worth it they will abandon him in a New York Minute…they are self preservationist 1st and foremost….of course they could be KamiKazi’s to but I doubt it

    mmmm-donations please


  36. Good post and true! I think those that call themselves PUMA’s are not addressive enough, but this post was proper and there are other people who need to be taken down, sort of speak. Here’s the thing: the next president of the US should be a woman, and should be Hillary. Men have not yet accepted that they are in a minority. And they’re acting like they’re the majority. And they took the presidency from her. That requires that ‘no hostages be taken’. It requires that the truth be told and that a sow’s ear be called a sow’s ear, and there are a few of them amongst us men!

  37. Michael: Let’s not kid ourselves here, Rush will say anything. This is his way of being “informative” to his Dittoheads. I would put very little stock in anything coming out of that idiot’s mouth, remember, this is the same guy who urged his listeners to vote for Obama wherever they could in order to beat Hillary. Not a credible person.

  38. I listened to RD on PUMA radio. And it was great! So much fun.

  39. Hillary’s body language is so revealing she speaks for Obama but her whole body is repelled by him…

    They must be crazy putting her on stage with him she makes him look so small (and not in a good way) and insignificant.

    I think Hillary will win and Call of the stadium event Obama will take his GE $$ and pass them to the DNC.(if that is legal)


  40. Annabelle,
    I like that idea. Sort of like leafletting a neighborhood (which I should also be doing….)

  41. I sure would like to know the rest of what Jesse Jackson said. I don’t care about the apology. He is no Obama fan. It’s amazing how Obama’s AA supporters have shut down all dissent in their own community. Sad.

  42. welcome joeysky


  43. Oh, hey joey! I had no idea you hung out here. 🙂

  44. Katiebird,

    How can we get PUMA leaflets?

  45. I just stumbled upon this new blog by a Denver delegate…yet another person upset with what has happened:


  46. Donna – did your mamma tell you cheating is an Obamanation?

  47. Pat I agree but I just feel that the more they try to squelch dissent in the party the more apparent it will become. I dont think the unity pony is work at the top at all there are rifts at all levels of the party even among the insiders.


  48. BB, Joanie and I have been working on some. Well, Joanie did a lot and they’re stalled on my desktop. Maybe if you yell at me, I might be humiliated into actually DOING something?


  49. Along the CDS lines, BTD catches Matt Yglesias making a complete imbecile out of himself:

    I don’t believe that if Clinton and Obama swapped roles that they’d be acting any differently. But the reality is that as long as Obama thinks he’s going to be wielding executive authority, he’s going to be useless as a check on out-of-control executive authority. If Clinton wants to channel whatever regrets she has about losing the primary into taking up that cause, well, I think that would be an excellent decision for her to make.

    Of course! Hillary Clinton ALWAYS has a debt to pay to society, after all the atrocious crimes she committed.

    Anything good Hillary does is to make good on something, we don’t know exactly what but there must be something she’s certainly guilty of, maybe just being born.

    These guys are starting to put me in a horrible mood.

  50. Great post myiq!
    If he opens his mouth it’s a lie!!!

  51. Katie,

    I could never yell at you.


  52. But BB, what if that’s what it takes?

  53. bostonboomer, want me to do it?

  54. Donna did you lose something?
    Oh I found your principles over here
    under the bus…

    Donna GO HOME

    Donna-Hate is not a family Value

    Hillary may forgive-
    PUMA’s Dont!


  55. I’ve been reading the comments on that Kos thread (with Hill’s FISA speech). Those people are vicious. I need to stop reading. I think I need that single malt from last night’s cocktail party.

  56. We will probably hear that Jesse’s remarks were merely things he channeled from Hillary.

  57. How come no matter what Hillary does she must have motives? Can she not just be for the people and the constitution???

    I can’t remember who posted this here before but I agree and wonder often-

    Can we have Hillary back now?

  58. Donna Brazile = PUMA Snack


  59. SophieL: Just think of those trolls at Kos as people who would have readily defended Hitler. Commonsense is at a premium over there.

  60. Donna – be careful, Jesse’s after some nuts.

  61. Donna Brazile – Let Us Have Hill!!

  62. iq, the rationalizing sounds so much like the Bushbots a few years ago. every time he did some stupid thing, he was ‘playing chess’ while everyone else was playing checkers. many of them eventually figured out that, no, he’s not being strategic, he’s just a dumbass.

    Obama’s a lot like Bush, but I don’t think he’s dumb. it’s going to be very difficult for his bots to say he’s ‘playing chess’ when his whole shtick has been about rejecting the old politics. if he’s playing a game just for votes, then what was his whole campaign about anyway?

    he’s putting his loyal followers in a very difficult position.

  63. Pat: the comments there are in the same vein as the quote at the top of this post. Only in multitudes and many with bad grammar, bad manners, or both.

  64. I don’t assume that the Democratic leadership is stupid. There are always exceptions, but the safe bet is they are smart and have some kind of strategy.

    When I see one of them get up in front of a camera and say something really ignorant, I assume they are playing dumb and lying through their teeth. (The explanations for the FISA vote is a perfect example) My cat wouldn’t believe that shit and he’s a moron.

    I think they planned to ambush Hillary early in the primaries. Obama was kind of a stealth candidate, and should never have been taken seriously with his record. But he had money, organization and top-level support.

    His win in Iowa was a surprise for Hillary, but it was based on his Chicago organization astroturfing the caucuses (just across the border from Illinois) The plan was to ride the momentum to New Hampster, win the caucuses in Nevada and win big in SC, then knock Hillary (and everyone else) out of the race on Super Duper Tuesday.

    But PUMAs-in-waiting up in New Hampster rallied to give Hillary the win, and hispanic union members helped her eke out a caucus win in Nevada.

    Hillary won on SDT but she didn’t have the organization that Obama set up in the red caucus states that he ran through in February.

    That was a stunning blow, because Hillary should have had an advantage as the well-known front-runner. The state party people should have gone to her.
    Which begs the question, how did a rookie Senator with no big-league experience get the money and support to build his own 50-state political machine? It had to be set up and running before he ever won a single vote.
    The people backing Obama are angry at Hillary because he was supposed to lock up the nomination in February, with practically no close scrutiny. The nomination ended up costing them waaaay more than they planned, too.

    Whoever they are, they are wealthy, but they probably budgeted $40-60 million to buy the nomination, and it cost 4X or 5X more than they planned.

  65. Ethics Complaints Filed Over Obama Mortgage Rate

    The conservative public-interest group Judicial Watch today filed ethics complaints alleging that Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.), the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee, broke the rules when he accepted a discounted deal on a 2005 mortgage loan, as first reported last week by The Post.

    “Americans ought to be suspicious when a United States Senator such as Barack Obama, obtains a sweetheart mortgage deal,” Judicial Watch President Tom Fitton said in a statement. “We have serious concerns that Senator Obama’s mortgage may have violated the law and Senate ethics rules.” The group filed separate complaints with the Federal Election Commission and the U.S. Senate Ethics Committee.
    read rest here

  66. Casey-
    I also said everything Hillary does becomes a Process story…Hillary said she would stand against FISA…..she did Dot Period The End! her character QED!

    Obama said I will stand against FISA…hthe excuse machine was running before Obama pushed the button…He did not DOT PERIOD The End! his character QED


    MMMMM Leaning Leaning Hillary is depending on you all to support her to denver…give a little bit of your selves tonight we have come so far together


  67. In case anyone was feeling all soft and fuzzy about the “Unity Thing,” check out the NYTimes front page today (I used to respect the Times, being a NYer. Stopped reading in February when Dowd and Frank Rich started foaming at the mouth):

    A prominent donor to Senator Obama recently sent an email plea to other supporters, asking them—for the sake of Democratic unity—to write checks to Senator Hillary Clinton to help retire her $23 million in campaign debt. Some of the replies are unprintable, given the coarse language, the donor said. A sampling of others included:
    “Why would I help pay off debts that Hillary amassed simply to keep damaging Senator Obama?” [Translation: You see, it’s all Hillary’s fault. She pointed out all those horrible issues like his lack of experience, and his phony policy positions.]
    “Not a penny for that woman. Or her husband. Or—god forbid—Mark Penn.”
    Mr. Obama has asked his top donors to help raise money for her debt, and so far they have come up with less than $100,000. “A paltry sum,” in the words of one Clinton official.
    Among the complaints from Obama campaign officials is that Mrs. Clinton’s expectation for help has been a moving target; in other words, it is unclear how much money from Obama supporters will be enough to satisfy the Clintons…Mrs. Clinton is helping Obama with the understanding that he would do more for her. [Translation: They are just greedy insatiable power mongers.]
    Clinton donors and campaign officials remain surprised, and some, offended, that Mr. Obama has refused to ask his entire list of donors, more than 1.5 million people, to send [small donations] for Mrs. Clinton’s debt. Obama officials said they did not want to distract their donors for the main task at hand, raising money to defeat Mr. McCain.
    Alan Patricof, a top Clinton fund-raiser and family friend: “I think most people thinks that helping Barack is the best way to get help from the Obama camp to help retire her debt, which is a major source of concern for her right now.”

    WE HAVE TO PAY OFF HER DEBT! She is being held hostage.

  68. kiki: Exactly. It must be difficult to sit at the computer every day and think up reasons to defend him when you know deep in your heart of hearts that he has pulled the wool over your eyes.

    Imagine again being that idealistic and really turned on to a candidate you never bothered to question and now it turns out you backed a loser. Must be hard to get up in the morning to that reality.

  69. grayslady: Church of What’s Happening under the bus! love it!

    Let’s face it, the blogger boyz are still arrogant, dumb shits, and have been all year. And I mean that in the most [old]lady-like way.

  70. it’s a little busy, but my Donna sign would say:

    If 795 of my colleagues decide this election, I will quit the Democratic Party.
    Donna Brazile

  71. Thanks to RD for coming on the show! She was great!

    I hope you all enjoyed it!

  72. Oh man, that mortgage deal is gonna hurt. Timing couldn’t be more perfect. Something like 300,00o going to be foreclosed on this month alone. Do you remember when the swift boaters first appeared? It was July of 2004, maybe June at the earliest. But that thing slowly, lowly sizzled in the Conservative press for weeks before the major media took it up and hammered it relentlessly right before the convention. I won’t call it yet, but this could be Obama’s budding swift boating. Couldn’t happen to a nicer guy.

  73. C’mon, Stoller thinks Occam’s Razor is something you shave the dog with.

  74. taggles: Yes we did! It was a great experience. You guys sounded wonderful.

  75. SimoFish,

    Since it’s for a fundraiser, how about:

    Don’t Need My Vote?
    Don’t Need My Money.

  76. another sign idea:

    Donna, please don’t change my vote!

  77. I am still convinced that Obama could announce that Michele is really a Michael and the two kids were left over from an Angelina adoption and the press would praise him for his ability to write his own name without looking at his wrist.

  78. Alright, I’m out. Gonna have a glass of wine and drift of to sleep.

  79. Do pledged Obama delegates have the obligation to switch votes at the convention if they feel that he no longer represents the sentiments of those that elected him?

    The DNC rules not only allow it, they encourage it:


  80. Michael- Yea, she stands her ground no matter what!

    And no matter what Donna is not allowed under this bus! I have been here a loooong time and we have standards.

  81. Pat, I guess the lucky thing is most of the blogger boyz probably don’t have to get up in the morning. there’s no real tight schedule in the ‘rents basement.

  82. “Not a penny for that woman. Or her husband. Or—god forbid—Mark Penn.”

    Translation: We need every cent for Tony Rezko–Obama needs a vacation home!

    “Obama’s a lot like Bush, but I don’t think he’s dumb.”

    Yeah, but honestly, that makes me think worse of him. He’s not dumb, but he’s content to slide by making stupid gaffe after stupid gaffe when he should be boning up on policy, ie, the necessary qualifications for the important job he wants. I agree that he’s craven, but he could make more of an effort to appear knowledgeable and qualified. Instead, he’s like the high school kid who has a brain but can’t be bothered because he knows he can slide by by charming the teacher.

  83. Donna – Honorary co-founder of

    Just Stay Home

  84. If the political cost of supporting obama becomes more that the political gain Pelosi and Dean the superdelegates and donna brazile her self will dump him like toxic waste into love canal….these people are self preservationist 1st and foremost.

    We may have to put up with them to get hillary in office but thats what midterms are all about-a night of the long knives for every one of those folks who abandoned our girl.

    Pelosi back to her vinyard in sanoma,dean a seat on the board of regents at the university of vermont ,brazile a post in greenland as a political corespondent for the onion. wexler will be polishing shoes on the beach in west palm. Obama and his lovely wife will be returned to the south side to do community organizing for a new gay black log cabin republicans group.

    goodnight from fuzzybeargville

  85. as for wtf, why are people always apologizing to Obama, but he doesn’t apologize for anything? No major presidential candidate has been treated worse overall than Hillary, and no candidate has ever had gentler treatment than Obama, but he gets the apologies?

  86. Obama is very thin-skinned for a politician. everyone needs to apologize to him. however, he’s sooo magnanimous, accepting apologies left and right. what a guy!

  87. chatblu said: “We had discussed a 12-step program for kool-aid users quite awhile ago. Guess it’s time to get it out of the planning stages.”

    How’s this for a start?

    Step 1: Admitted they were powerless over the kool-aid
    Step 2: Came to believe that Hillary is the better candidate.
    Step 3: Made a decision to join PUMA and to return the Democratic Party to its roots of representation for all, including gays, women, latinos, blue collar workers, etc. and that EVERY vote counts.

  88. if I could be at an Obama/Donna protest, I would like to carry a sign saying:


  89. Clyde Tombaugh discovered Pluto because he noticed it’s gravitational effect on other bodies, and correctly concluded there was something there. Then he just had to find it.

    Before the first caucuses in Iowa, before the first absentee primary ballots were completed and mailed in, Obama had more money than anyone but Hillary and he had an organization that was actually superior to hers.
    Obama was raising unheard of amounts of money for a virtual unknown. He was raising money at the level of an incumbent running for reelection or a sitting VP like Gore.

    Meanwhile, top-tier candidates like Edwards, Biden and Dodd were sharing motel rooms and clipping coupons from the EZ-Shopper to buy lunch.

    Face it, with his resume, he should never have been taken seriously. If all the candidates had mailed in their resumes, Obama wouldn’t have been called for an interview.

    So, using the idea Tombaugh had and observing the gravitational effect, who is behind Obama that we haven’t seen?

    Whoever they are (singular or plural) they are wealthy and politically powerful. They planned this long ago, because some of the moves that have been made go back as far as 2002. when Axelrod, one of the hottest political consultants in the Democratic party, hooked up with Obama.

    Both Hillary and Edwards tried to hire Axelrod for this campaign, but he was already unavailable back in 2006.

  90. Parentofed-

    PUMA”S dont apologize we go in for the kill and eat our prey alive-

    I see little troll activity tonight I is because they are to ashamed in their candidate to show their faces….

    Okay please so I dont get beaten up by carol please please make a few hillary contributions to night….

    fuzzybear is going to hibernate

  91. kiki,
    help me out, I’m tired. What does that mean?

  92. Thank you pat johnson! tune in on Sunday, alegre will be there. Will, will be around too!

    You guys are the important part. We are going to make history! PUMA baby!!!

  93. All I can say is that the Obama campaign is so obsessed with the Bush 2000 and 2004 campaigns that they are turning into them. This is just classic Freudian psychology or something like that. They want to be just like them. Bush 2000 was amazing at message control. But that works well in the R party and may work with the Neo Libs and the AAs of this party but the rest of us just aren’t going to go along.

  94. Obama is exceptionally thin-skinned, much like Bush.

    What a great quality for a President!

  95. myiq2xu,

    You are kicking ass today. Well said.

  96. one more time Obama’s new campaign promise:

    No More Grenadas!

    and a final Donna insult- Ms Brazile you are putting me to sleep


    PUMA who give ROCK

  97. How about a sign saying:




  98. Contribution Details
    Date: July 09, 2008 10:54 PM EDT
    Contact: Gary xxxxxxxx
    Chapel Hill, NC 27517
    Amount: $50.00

    I just heard on the radio show that now we only have until the 11th…..Carol add this to the pile….

  99. ohioana, a reference to one of Obama’s statements a few months back: “”I understand that Senator Clinton, periodically when she’s feeling down, launches attacks as a way of trying to boost her appeal”

    I felt it was a sexist dog whistle. it’s the kind of creepy and appalling thing he’s gotten away with saying.

  100. myiq: besides Soros?

    On a lighter note, does that mean we have to call Obama Pluto (and stop calling him Goofy)?

  101. myiq-
    you are right. It seems they started planning this after the 2004 convention. Could they have???

  102. Seriously:

    Do you really think Bush is stupid? He’s no genius, but he went to prep schools and an Ivy League university.

    That dumb redneck routine is an act, as is his mangling of the english language.

    He even admitted he likes it when people “misunderestimate” him.

    He doesn’t like policy stuff so he ignores it, and lets his underlings handle it.

    But all these miscues and mistakes sure work in his favor quite a bit, don’t they?

  103. As I said to a friend of mine the other day (who was a hillary voter in Virginia and is now happy to vote for McCain) about the Invesco Stadium acceptance speech, “In these situations, why am I always one of the people standing on the sidelines shaking my head.”

    That’s really who all of us are. We are those people who just laugh at the fads and the hype and are just wise enough to sniff out a con a mile a way.

  104. oh, thanks, kiki, I get it now! I thought maybe it had something to do with polls.
    Good one!

  105. I get the t-shirt with that contribution. have you all seen it? the message is pretty clear, take a look:


    For everyone who has been counted out but refused to be knocked out and for everyone who works hard and never gives up. This ones for you

  106. One thing we can all be sure if is that Hillary voted now as she would have if she were the nominee. She is a woman of her word and she always does the right thing. How the bots can rationalize this is just outrageous and shows they are seriouly delusional but I’m loving Jesse Jackson right now.

  107. Thanks to the person who posted the “clip” from
    Lady Rothschild ‘s(? spelling) FOX interview.
    I was looking forward to seeing it & WOW she did’nt

  108. Gary (sniff) I didn’t get the tee-shirt….

  109. I hate all these O supporters always talking about how putting the face of Obama forward as the face of our country will help our standing in the world. Not only do I find this insulting, as if the rest of the world wants only symbols not substance to solve problems, but it’s creepy. It reminds me of societies [Mayan?] that sacrificed virgins to attone for their sins & show the gods how pious they really are. Jeez, they act as if he’s the modern day virgins in the volcano.

  110. I read a story (Rolling Stone, NYT or WaPo) that talked in detail about Obama’s rise from nowhere.

    It mentioned Obama’s 2002 anti-war speech and it quoted him saying that he was invited to speak at the rally, and he agreed but had Axelrod review his speech first.
    He said Axelrod was in campaign manager for his 2004 Senate run (but supposedly he wasn’t running yet when he gave the speech)

    Axelrod – Exelon lobbyist/astroturfer

    Exelon – Parent company of Commonwealth Edison

    William Ayers’ father – former CEO of Commonwealth Edison

  111. Had to go fix dinner for my girlfriend – I am loving all the suggestions and wrote them down.

    My favorites
    Donna – be careful – Jesse’s after some nuts !!
    Donna, Hillary may forgive – Puma’s do not

    I am hoping we have enough people for all the suggestions – I will make the signs over the weekend.

    I have my ne “dendy” t-shirt – to wear !!
    18 Million Strong (front)
    Country before Party (back)

    Bring the flip for evidence gathering !!

    Gotta go now – I am on internet restriction (will secretly check iphone later!!)

    Thanks everyone for all your suggestions and being in this with me – feels good. Hope to meet some of you in Denver — We should get name tags with our handles!

  112. KB, oh no!!!

  113. katiebird,
    any leaks on the PUMA leaflets?

  114. Gary it could have been worse. I think I made my last donation to her Senate campaign by mistake. At least I got THAT part right this time. I think.

  115. I know there is a place to check that says I acknowledge that this is going to retire her primary debt. So I assume that’s what it’s going to..

  116. Gary:

    As always, you inspired me (it’s the NC connection):

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 09, 2008 11:13 PM EDT
    Contact: xxxxxxxxxxx
    Fayetteville, NC xxxxxxx
    Amount: $50.00

  117. Ohioana,
    send me your email and I’ll send you a draft in the morning. It needs some editing but I won’t have time to focus on it until then.

    I’d REALLY appreciate it if you let me send it too you. Joanie’s pleas don’t seem to have any impact on me at all. Maybe a request from a non-family-member would force me to finish it??

  118. Strike the iron while it is hot! This is a snippet of a comment from a BO supporter on his site. I am sure there are many like this guy who are disenchanted. How does PUMA reach these guys?

    Then came FISA.

    Incredibly, Obama reneged on his promise to fight retroactive immunity for the telecoms. Did I mention it was also inexplicable?

    So, anyway, I’m back supporting Hillary. Now if only there was a grassroots campaign I could join to get the Dem convention to choose Clinton! Is it too late?

    Also the web traffic on BO’s site is tanking and tanking fast. Check this out:

  119. Contribution Details
    Date: July 09, 2008 11:14 PM EDT
    Contact: SophieL
    Amount: $50.00

    And I get a T-Shirt!!

  120. Gary, I got a receipt thanking me for my contribution to her Presidential campaign…. THAT sounds like a good sign.

  121. Ohioana, my email is katiebird@gmail.com

  122. katiebird,
    it’s the one I use to sign on.
    do you have access to that as a site administrator?

  123. Gary et. al. we’ll have to coordinate which day to wear the shirts in Denver…Thursday would be my first choice…

  124. yeah sophie!!! and capts!!!! Everyone else get yout t-thirt!!!!

    PUMA$ who dontae Rock!!!!!

    Carol…I’m off to bed, I guess you’ll get this pile of money off the floor in the morning!

  125. ohioana — OK, I’m adding “email to ohioana” on my to-do-list…

    Thank you!

  126. iq, I’ve wondered over the past 7.5 years or so if Bush was really stupid or just playin’ it on tv.

    I don’t think his iq is 2x anyone’s.

    I do think he has really good political instincts. and I do think he’s really lucky and knows how to work a silver spoon.

    I bought Kitty Kelley’s Bush family biography the other day (39 cents at the thrift store, couldn’t resist) and his Yale classmates are appalled that of all the alumni of that time period, he would be the one who became president. they think he’s…..not bright, and was never curious or engaged in anything other than partying or bullying.

    according to the book (and I do think KK researches well, to avoid lawsuits), he barely made it through prep school and college, and mostly coasted as a legacy.

    so I dunno. the dumbness could be an act. but people who know him and are willing to go on record seem to think it’s the real deal.

  127. capt—I’ll wear it every day. just stay about 4ft away by thurs 🙂

  128. katiebird, I just sent it.

  129. Katie–we know we’re done when we start making donations to her innauguration committee 🙂

  130. @myiq2xu, 10:48

    “So, using the idea Tombaugh had and observing the gravitational effect, who is behind Obama that we haven’t seen?”

    I’d start the list with the telecoms, and then move right on through the health insurance companies and the energy companies. After that it’s just a million here and a million there.

  131. myiq: I don’t think Bush is as dumb as he comes off, but I don’t think he’s that smart either. I think he’s just the front guy for a machine. Like Obama.

  132. I think W might be a little smarter than Obama….we didn’t have this many bushisms already back in 2000 did we?

  133. pm317, do you think that’s an honest comment? It sounds a little off to me?

  134. BTW – When Obama moved to Chicago to become a “community organizer” it was Ayers’ family money that was funding the organization he worked for.

    Bill Ayers’ is a college professor with a radical chic persona. He probably tells stories about his outlaw days to impress people and pick-up chicks.

    His older brother runs the philanthropic foundation their dad founded.

  135. gary,
    I like how you think! Yes, contributions to her inauguaration!

  136. Gary, wear that t-shirt every day! with the exhaust here under the bus, who cares?

  137. Gary — That’s a beautiful dream!

  138. that t-shirt is cool. interesting tho. what does this suggest re HRC’s view on “unity”? the message isn’t exactly unifying.

  139. gary,
    I think bush has gotten (or at least appears to have gotten) dumber as the years have gone by.
    Now, if we think what o would be like after a few years given where he’s starting, it’s very frightening.

  140. There have been times that I’ve fantasized that one day we discover that Bush is really a Lex Luthor type evil genius, and everything he’s done was all part of a diabolical plot.

    If that were the case, the last 7 years would be easier to take.

  141. myiq2xu,
    If that were true, he’d be one heck of an actor!

  142. MyIQ, I think that Ayers relationship is as damning to Obama’s campaign as the “God Damn America” tapes.

  143. Well, off to bed. Morning comes early around these parts.

    Have a good evening, everyone.

  144. #
    katiebird, on July 9th, 2008 at 11:23 pm Said:

    pm317, do you think that’s an honest comment? It sounds a little off to me?
    I have no way of knowing. But I am seeing a number of such comments — people are bringing them in from kos, BO and other sites — I would expect a lot of buyer’s remorse and don’t want to miss an opportunity to see what we can do to take this to Denver. I think this FISA thing will hit hard those who really believed he was different. These are the same people who want Bush held accountable and now Obama is moving away from it . Look for a lot of buyer’s remorse among anti-war people.

  145. Indi,

    Reads to me like “bite me with with your unity, you personal space invading hack.”

  146. yeah iq, but I don’t think the last seven years are ever going to be easy to take.

    and they’re not just going to go away, unfortunately.

    that’s whether he’s evil or stupid.

  147. pm317,

    At least we’ve got nearly 2 months to work on it…

  148. I just donated and ordered the T-shirt, too. Just got some other merchandise delivered today, and hope the Size Medium will do. Just need some venues to wear them…

    By the way, just realized something: The lampooned Hillary in a misogynist way by calling her, and selling her likeness as “The Nutcracker”.

    What do we call Jesse Jackson now, “The Nut Cutter”?

  149. Katiebird:

    Everyone who talks about William Ayers focuses on his past. I think that approach misses the forest for the trees.

    I don’t give a shit what Ayers did 30-40 years ago. Rev. Wright was a sideshow, Ayers is the one to look at.

    I used to do investigations and I learned to trust my instincts. When something doesn’t feel right, start digging right there.

    My instinct tells me there is a big story to be investigated in the Ayers-Obama relationship.

  150. KB, did you see the link for the website traffic? He peaked in February and then there was another smaller peak in early June but since then it is like a free fall. Shouldn’t he be generating new interest for people who did not participate in the primary?

  151. Just in case you still thought Obama really gave a flying fig about Clinton’s debt, guess again:


    Obama Briefly Forgets to Urge Help for Clinton

    Wednesday, July 9, 2008 11:00 PM

    Article Font Size

    NEW YORK — It was all part of a careful arrangement: Democrat Barack Obama would get fundraising help from his erstwhile rival, Hillary Rodham Clinton, in exchange for his help retiring about $10 million of her campaign debt.

    But Obama momentarily forgot his part of the deal at a major New York fundraiser Wednesday night, forcing him to retake the stage after he had concluded the event and said goodnight to the audience.

    The Illinois senator spoke to about 1,000 donors in a Manhattan ballroom, all of whom had paid at least $1,000 to attend. Many were Clinton supporters until she dropped out of the race last month.

    Obama praised the former first lady as tough and smart. “She wore me out,” he said to laughs.

    The Democratic nominee-in-waiting then wrapped up his speech and thanked the audience, moving to shake hands along a rope line.

    After a minute or so, the music was cut short and Obama returned to the stage.

    “This is not the speech part, but it is important,” he said sheepishly, urging the group to reassemble.

    “Senator Clinton still has some debt, and I could have had some debt if I hadn’t won. So I know the drill,” Obama said, encouraging donors to use the forms under their seats to make a contribution to help her.

    “It’s very important to us, and obviously Senator Clinton will be grateful as well,” Obama said.

    Things went a bit more smoothly a few blocks down Park Avenue, where Clinton introduced Obama at a smaller fundraiser that netted about $4.1 million for the joint Obama/Democratic National Committee Victory Fund.

    “Whatever brings us here tonight I hope is understood to be not only unifying but transcendent,” Clinton told the 125 major donors.

    Obama, in turn, echoed Clinton’s call for unity.

    “With just half a wing this bird can’t fly,” he said.

    The two flew together to New York from Washingtonfor the fundraising swing and were to appear together at a breakfast Thursday morning. An event to help Clinton with her campaign debt was canceled because of Senate votes in Washington

  152. I don’t know if anyone has seen this yet, but there is an interesting short article on MarketWatch about Obama and “the English language”. He just keeps stepping in more “stuff” all the time! ;o) No matter what he says, he is offending people all the time:


  153. katiebird:

    Who’s doing the AM post?

  154. “With just half a wing this bird can’t fly,”

    what the hell? if she’s the other half, that’s still only one wing barry. you’d be flying around in circles if you could get off the ground at all.

  155. Concurrent with Ockham’s razor, I am reminded of the responses of the rational paranoid.

    O: Hill is out to get me.
    A: But she always says good things about you.
    O: She’s just laying out an alibi.
    A: But she only does you good turns.
    O: She is trying to lull me into a false sense of security.
    A: I think you misjudge her.
    A: She sent you to deceive me!

    Their theories are observation neutral. No thing can disconfirm their worldview. They say we are whacked for seeing their behavior as cult-like. Kool-Acquired Intellectual Deficiency anyone?

  156. Actually, MyIQ, I’m fascinated by the entire Ayers story. I’m not an investigator though and could never pull it together myself. I read everything I run across about him.

    However, I think that Ayers past AND the fact that Obama’s first campaign event was at Ayers house makes the link between them easy to illustrate.

    Once THAT link is made then all sorts of fun can be had exposing their other joint projects. I think.

  157. MyIQ, I’ve got something half done. Should I finish it for morning? I could post it about 8:30 central time…

  158. Waaaaah! I donated 7/5/08 to HRC’s primary campaign — heard/saw nothing about any T-Shirt. Got a message about yes the donation was for the primary campaign. I’d been clicking on various bookmarked links to find one that did not go to her Senate campaign. Let me see if I can find that URL again.

    And I must put in a plug for the Denver Group PAC (Heidi Li’s)– donated to them — they are going to be running ads!

    Might be time for another love $$ to HRC, tho, I get paid tomorrow.

  159. “did you see the link for the website traffic?”

    YES! And doesn’t that graph pretty much reflect his electoral power? His campaign lost votes at about that same rate, didn’t it?

  160. If I’m really going to take the morning shift, I’d better get to sleep. Goodnight!

  161. regency, yep, i agree about shirt message. the shirt doesn’t appear to be featured at site.

    signs for brazille — Hmmm, I like

    My Mama Taught Me To Say KISS MY ASS

    or how about

    Kiss My Divided Ass

  162. “Indi, on July 9th, 2008 at 11:28 pm Said:
    that t-shirt is cool. interesting tho. what does this suggest re HRC’s view on “unity”? the message isn’t exactly unifying.”

    And whyever not? To me it means someone standing up to make America work for the ordinary working stiffs. …. Instead of stiffing them over.

  163. pm317: That graph neatly sums up the primary for OB. A picture is worth a thousand words. Every Picture tells a story. . Show that to the SDs.

  164. oh, i think we can glean some great unifying messages from it — not the unifying message howard and donna are looking for tho

  165. LOL Indi.

    I can’t wait to get my T-shirt. It will nicely complement my Hillary hat, coffee mug, and “I’m your girl” button. It’s my new unified ensemble.

  166. I’m thinking of a post involving Ayers and Obama’s fundraising.

    To give you a hint, I already picked out a graphic, and it involves a tinfoil hat.

  167. Re: the O’bots return to reality: “So, anyway, I’m back supporting Hillary. Now if only there was a grassroots campaign I could join to get the Dem convention to choose Clinton! Is it too late?”

    Errr, it does sound a little naive to me. But yeah, dropping a post & link to the Denver Group or PUMA Pac websites is a good idea. (Thx to whoever suggested it upthread).

  168. Concludes Rep. Jackson, Jr.: “Revered Jackson is my dad and I’ll always love him. He should know how hard that I’ve worked for the last year and a half as a national co-chair of Barack Obama’s presidential campaign. So, I thoroughly reject and repudiate his ugly rhetoric. He should keep hope alive and any personal attacks and insults to himself.”

    so not only did Jesse Jackson Jr. throw his father under the bus in a most dramtic way, this whole thing is actually about HIM!!! What an arrogant prick!!!

  169. Indi,

    I agree!

  170. Thought for the evening — If BO takes the convention to a stadium finale, there will be overhead shots (helicopter/blimp) like any major outdoor sporting event.

    Consequence: There’s no way to confine dissenters to a “Free Speech Zone” out of view … and there’s great latitude for creative visibility.

    Think ahead.

  171. #
    myiq2xu, on July 9th, 2008 at 9:55 pm Said:

    Here’s a question for the sippy-kup kidz: Assuming that Obama has a core ideology (big assumption, no factual basis) is he a liberal/progressive pretending to be a centrist to win votes in November, or is he a centrist who was posing as a liberal/progressive during the primaries in order to win the nomination?

    IOW – Was he lying then or is he lying now?

    This is like the Matrix. I do not know. Mind-boggling. OR, like Kevin Costner in that movie, No Way Out, he could’ve been a plant all his life – a life-long Repub trained in Hawaii and Indonesia to infiltrate the party and run for office.

  172. So, do you folks think it’s like they’re saying at Kos? That Hillary is behind today’s diary (which had nearly 1000 comments, last I looked)?

  173. sophie, i have a Hillary purse AND Hillary held it! lol.

  174. holy crap! someone at Huffpo actually blamed the ‘uninformed populace’ for Obama’s FISA vote.

  175. Speaking of Bush, and I only do so because it is so hot here I cannot sleep, I always hoped that like the Bob Newhart episode where they ended the show by saying everything was just a dream, the same would happen with him. But no, I wasn’t dreaming his is for real.

    Stupid, maybe not, ignorant yes.

  176. I got her to sign my I heart hillary shirt!!!!!

  177. Indi: I am so jealous.

    Myiq: I am looking forward to your Ayers post.

  178. Shortly after this vote, I saw on another blog an Obamabot say that Hillary just voted this way to make Obama look bad. These infantile dimwits just can’t see that the only one who made Obama look bad was Obama! They.just.don’t.get.it!

    Then, another one said that Obama will fix this AFTER he’s president, that’s why he didn’t vote yes on any of the amendments to strip the immunity from the bill, because he would do a better job. My gosh, these people are just brain dead!

    I’m so proud of Hillary I could bust, really. Although, MSNBC has been making excuses for Obama all night and even Feingold said that Obama will be the guy to fix this, as President. THEN.WHY.THE.HELL.DID.HE.VOTE.FOR.IT.THIS.TIME????

    I can’t stand this, it’s like screaming into a hurricane…none of those dumb asses get it. Ugh.

    I also noticed that MSNBC was trying to ignore the FISA bill as much as possible (move along to the next segment, quick!) and they are more concerned over the interview with Obama and his kids. “Oh, look at the cute little children. What FISA bill? Was there a vote taking away our 4th Amendment rights? But, look at the little children, aren’t they cute?”

  179. very cool gary, were you wearing the shirt at the time?

  180. actually, i think i am going to start carrying my HRC purse again.

  181. Indi and Gary

    me jealous too!

  182. Hillary Clinton is actively trying to undermine the Democratic Nominee for President out of spite. Her campaign staffers are betraying the party and the causes they claim to support. The truth of the matter is that this is about money, and shills need to pay their bills from renovations of their mansions. They want us, the people who are struggling to buy a tank of gas to get to work, to do it. They, like the politician they represent, are shameless.

    well, at least they’re not saying it is republican operatives anymore…..but how unoriginal.

  183. Does anyone know who voted first? Did she cast hers before or after him?

  184. indi, yes I was…it was at the event in Winston Salem with Maya Angelou…I wrote my first post here about that event–it got posted on Hillary Hub– What a moving event..

  185. i have to say, hillary has such a presence about her. i loved hearing her speak. she’s beautiful in every sense of the word.

    AND she gives a better speech than you know who.

  186. Please add this to the pile. Gotta get her FREE!!!!

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 10, 2008 12:11 AM EDT
    Contact: xxxxxxxxxxxx
    Austin, TX xxxxx
    Amount: $50.00

  187. everything Hillary’s ever achieved in her life was just to make Obama look bad. why can’t you people understand that? even the stuff she did before he was born! it is her life’s work to make him look bad.

    what a waste – he’s so good at it himself, he really didn’t need her.

  188. woo-hoo Ralph!!!!!

  189. o, now i am jealous. i wish i had made the winston event.

  190. FYI if anyone doesn’t already have it: Below is the link to contribute to HRC’s primary campaign fund (gives donor message about thx for contributing to primary fund….so I assume this is to pay down the debt and not going to her Senate campaign:


    nothing about T-shirts, tho (sniff)

  191. “myiq2xu”
    If your still on, thanks for the info on Ayer’s involvement
    with Obama’s 1st community organizer job.
    Right now everyone talks about ALL these troubling relations as “separate” relationships. Remember the
    ALL have a 20 yr. origin. No-one explains, “WHY CHICAGO”??
    I’d like to know “if” any of them are “linked” to Obama’s
    1st mentor Frank Marshall Davis?? They met in Hawaii when Obama was 10years old & he (RMD) was being “watched” by the CIA for communist views.
    Obama’s 1st boss was a female with the last name of Davis ( I think I heard) .
    Don’t forget the 1/2 brothers in Kenya??
    Just a thought

  192. https://contribute.hillarycampaign2008.com/tsland.html?sc=1983&utm_source=1983&utm_medium=e

    that’s the link to the t-shirt…you have to donate $50, but worth it if you can afford it, and it clearly states that all donations go to debt retirement. And the shirt is so cool! We’ll all be wearing them in Denver!

  193. tpt–heard you on the radio show!!! you were great!!

  194. Stoller is just jealous Hillary voted against it and Obama voted for it. Obama is triangulating and Triangulation is a B!@#!@.

  195. so not only did Jesse Jackson Jr. throw his father under the bus in a most dramatic way, this whole thing is actually about HIM!!! What an arrogant prick!!!

    JJJr and Obama make quite a pair, don’t they? they’re both narcissistic, arrogant misogynists who like machine politics.

  196. For people interested in the Obama-Ayers connection, I believe Jeralyn at Talk Left did some really solid research into their connections and put up some posts awhile back. That might be a good place to look.

  197. Steven, don’t forget ‘she’s only doing the right thing to make Obama look even more punk-ass for punking out–that bitch, standing up for our values!” lol

    myiq–I don’t know if Bush is stupid, but he’s sure as hell intellectually lazy, and frankly that amounts to the same thing in practice.

  198. myiq,

    i liked your P B and J 2.0 post. (i read too late to join the discussion.)

    i’d like to see a post on Ayers and Obama’s fundraising. i’d like to see a post about Obama’s fundraising in general, too.

  199. GaryCH,


  200. “That Hillary is behind today’s diary (which had nearly 1000 comments, last I looked)?”

    Yep. Hillary has nothing better to do than concern herself with Cheeto scarfing basement dwellers. The rest of the world doesn’t think about them at all except to reminisce ‘het, remember that creepy dude in science class who ate the raw chicken instead of dissecting it?’ but Hillary? She’s obsessed. They matter to her.

  201. Thanks for the link Gary. I just bought myself a Tshirt.

  202. tpt/ny:

    I don’t think it’s that complicated. I think Obama was recruited out of Columbia to work as an organizer, nothing sinister about it.

    But when he got to Chicago he started making friends, some legit, some shady. Ayers was connected to the community organizing job, and that’s where he met Rev. Wright too. Rezko came later.

    I think he was using them, just like they were using him.

    But Obama’s powerful backers are from (or connected to) the Chicago area. By the time he arrived in DC he was already running for President.

  203. @katiebird:

    If you send the leaflet to me, I’ll take a look. The fab GF will probably take a gander as well. Joanie has my email addy.

  204. myiq2xu, on July 10th, 2008 at 12:41 am Said:

    I don’t think it’s that complicated. I think Obama was recruited out of Columbia to work as an organizer, nothing sinister about it.

    No offense, but niave. Everyone who wants to get into politics does “community organizing”. You know what his organizing mostly amounted to? Signing up voters for the Daley machine.

  205. Carole, another entry to sweeten the running total!

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 10, 2008 12:35 AM EDT
    Contact: LHinSeattle
    Seattle, WA 98XXX
    Amount: $50.00

    …and that T-shirt can’t come fast enough.

  206. Hey guys – Heard about an hour of the No We Won’t segment. It was so great to hear your voices!

    About Obama and telecom connections? Look no further than his campaign manager, David Axelrod. The guy is in bed with AT&T. When you know about this, his vote is not a big surprise.

    Myiq, katiebird – Believe it or not, I’ve got another play. I think I’m possessed!

    Going to bed now, but you can take a look at it over at my place if you want. Let me know if/when I should post it tomorrow.

    Ciao belli,

    Madamab (pronounced: MahdahmahBee) 😉

  207. Masslib:

    I was responding to a comment that speculated that he was hired because of his mother’s marxist friends.

    I think it was more straightforward. But once he was there he got mixed up in Chicago politics, which have been corrupt pretty much since the city was founded.

  208. myiq2xu, ok, agreed, except I would say he was there to get mixed up in Chicago politics.

  209. masslib: It’s like joining the mafia, you know what you’re getting into when you sign up.

  210. Thank you for the link, Gary.
    I bought a t-shirt for myself, and then I went back and bought one for Murphy/

    DATE: July 10, 2008 1:00 AM EDT
    NAME: DancesWithPumas
    AMOUNT: $50.00

    DATE: July 10, 2008 1:05 AM EDT
    NAME: DancesWithMurphysPumas
    AMOUNT: $50.00


  211. I love you DancesWithPumas. T-shirts being shipped tomorrow.

  212. Forgot the details.

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 10, 2008 12:38 AM EDT
    Contact: Lisa Dawn
    xxx, WA xxx
    Amount: $50.00

  213. Thanks for the link to the t-shirt, Gary! It induced me to go ahead and make my contribution now.

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 10, 2008 1:46 AM EDT
    Contact: CognitiveDissonance
    Amount: $50.00

  214. BREAKING!!
    from http://alegrescorner.soapblox.net/frontPage.do

    “Breaking! DNC Deadline of this FRIDAY re Debt
    by: Alegre
    Thu Jul 10, 2008 at 01:54:38 AM EDT
    Someone just confirmed that there is a DNC deadline of this Friday for wiping out Hillary’s campaign debt you guys.
    If we don’t get this taken care of by then they’ll use this to pressure Hillary re keeping her name off the ballot in Denver. That means no real Roll Call vote!

    NO WONDER BHO’s donors dragged their feet in helping to wipe out this debt. DAMMIT all they had to do is sit on their hands and the DNC would finish this off by ending all hope of an open and honest vote in Denver. It’s just like the revote in Michigan.

    So here’s the deal – we need to GIVE UNTIL IT HURTS on Thursday and Friday. Take care of the last of that debt and tell Howard, Nancy and Donna (ESPECIALLY Donna!) go get stuffed.”

  215. I’m not going to go read the Cheeto blog comments or any more of Stoller (what a tool) or Yglesias (likewise), but.. it seems the entire logic thereof can be.. “uh.. I don’t like what Obama did.. people don’t like it.. uh.. this is bad for Obama.. um.. LOOK OVER THERE OMG U GUYS ITS A WITCH!!111”

    Far as psyops go, I’ve just been reminding many of the “liberal” netroots – You Blogger Boyz Are Suckers. You Got Played.

    Change they could believe in? Hah. We tried to tell them about Obama but they weren’t hearing it.

  216. Funny, how everything revolves around B0. reminds me of W who thought attacks in Iraq were staged “to embarrass him”. These people sure lost any grounding in reality.

  217. Why are so many of these jerkoffs named Mathhew?

    Matt Stoller gets in a fever “‘overthinking” Hillary Clinton’s vote against trampling on the Constitution. Matt Yglesias thought so hard about Iraq that he supported the invasion.

    Both supported Obama and demonized Hillary Clinton.

    Both have drunk enough Kool-Aid to float the Nimitz.

  218. from, Mary Ellen, this little reminder that Feingold is far less than Godly:

    “Feingold said that Obama will be the guy to fix this, as President. THEN.WHY.THE.HELL.DID.HE.VOTE.FOR.IT.THIS.TIME????”

    And about all this Feingold worship the past few years. This little gem has to expose him as an absolute dope. We should all remember that this is the guy who made sure that Ashcroft made it out of committee.

  219. myiq2xu-
    Thanks for the heads-up! I remember reading about
    how Rezko found him when he came to Chicago, after
    reading about the Harvard Review thing.
    The question in my mind is: “Why Chicago”???
    I thought the Frank Davis guy could be the key??

  220. From ER nurses everywhere: Please, please don’t let stupid hurt, The system is overburdened to begin with.

  221. morning thanks to all the big givers last night…before carol comes out with the adding machine this am I am going to have to do a big fuzzybear the doorman lean on all the lurkers out ther we need you to help hillary ans show our support for her FISA vote……It will send a message….

    Also Garychapelhill thanks for keeping the cash machine going all night long will be back to do mid afternoon lean at lunch today…..

    Remember: When the bear leans on you you have to move-to the donation window at hiedi li’s site…GRRRR

    morning all,


    Ok the joke is funny can we have Hillary back now?

  222. and donna -A Liar wont Inspire!

    have a good day

    Fuzzybeargville leaning leaning leaning

  223. Okay folks, especially Carol our wondrous fundraiser, here’s my receipt :

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 10, 2008 7:27 AM EDT
    Contact: Marjorie Kenosha, WI 53143
    Amount: $20.08

    I am on Social Security and can’t really afford it. But to me it’s an investment in the furture of my Grandchildren. So if I can give til it hurts, and it did, so can a lot of others.

    Let’s make a better world for our kids and our grandkids even if right now it doesn’t seem to some of us that they deserve it.

  224. kenosha- was heading to work one lat ck and you made my mornin’-big fuzzy kisses

    fuzzybeargville-see carol we did not do so bad over night

  225. How can the DNC change the deadline for elimination of the campaign debt? Do it or what?

  226. Good morning all!

    myiq, great post! The Ayers connections have bothered me FOREVER! (well, maybe just since December/January or so) That’s how I ended up here in the first place. Thanks for your work.


  227. I’ve read this “DNC moving up the debt” thing, but it sounds weird. The only technical rules concerning debt come from the FEC, and I’m don’t pretend to know there rules, but I believe it has to be retired before the DNC convention, according the FEC.

    But I don’t see where the DNC has the power to tell her debt to go to the bathroom, much less anything else. If there’s an official source for this story other than hearsay, please link!

  228. Thank you fuzzybear!

    Now let’s all of us make Senator Clinton’s day by ridding her of the debt-monkey on her back. If ever you were gonna give til it hurt, now is the time.

    “Just cause you got the monkey off your back doesn’t mean the circus has left town. ” George Carlin

  229. Twelve Step Program for Kool-Aid Detox

    1. I admit I am powerless to change Barack Obama’s position on anything or his willingness “to do anything to win”—that his candidacy has become impossible to support.

    2. I admit that the power of the PUMA can restore me to sanity.

    3. I have made a decision to retain my vote as my own.

    4. I have made a searching and moral inventory about why I can no longer support Barack Obama.

    5. I have admitted to myself and to others that I was deceived by Obama’s promises of “hope” and “change”.

    6. I’m ready to use a more discerning eye and ear when I listen to campaign rhetoric.

    7. I have come to realize that the 2008 primaries were a flawed process.

    8. I have decided to hold the Democratic Party accountable for the travesties that were committed at the RBC meetings and for the lack of oversight of the primary processes.

    9. I will make amends for any damage I may have caused to the political process by speaking out whenever it is possible to do so. I will make myself and others more aware of the scope and damage caused by sexism and racism in our society. (And if I have a couple of spare bucks, I’ll send a donation to either the Denver Group, the PumaPac, or to retire Clinton’s debt.)

    10. I will continue to keep a critical eye on Obama and the DNC. I will not be afraid to voice my disapproval.

    11. Having come to the realization that my supporting Senator Obama and having not called out the DNC for its behavior helped get us to where we are now, I will help to correct that situation by participating in at least one of the Just Say No Deal groups regularly. The support of fellow Disaffected Democrats will be essential as I struggle with my new independence.

    12. Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, I will try to carry this message to Obama supporters, and to practice these principles in all my politics.

    I started to do this for ha-ha’s then changed my mind and got serious instead. (I may still publish the satirical version at a later date.)

  230. I hate to link to Countdown, but Jonathan Turley and Rachel Maddow had a very interesting and enlightening discussion about the FISA bill and vote and Obama’s stand on the bill. Have you seen this?

    Do you think Olbermann will have a “Special Comment” on Obama’s vote?

  231. As I was saying (I do not know what happened to my previous post), I leave for a few days and when I get back I cannot even recognize the name of many of the posters anymore….jee the Conflu has really grown.

  232. “OhVoter”
    I’m OFF MSNBC & definately KO, so I missed this!

  233. I don’t know what’s going on with the money situation, but pony UP folks. You can drink early if it moves you but you’ve got pony up. Don’t make me get Fuzzy to start leaning again.

    Y’all know the mission. Pass it on to everybody. We’ve got until tomorrow–allegedly–to get this done.

  234. Agreed, we have the power if we align to change this broken corrupted two Party boss assault on our democracy, and we certainly are saying no more we are done you’ve gone too far. The food fights and Obama drama are already old and getting older the Dem brand was broken before Obama, Hillary was bring it back with honor and empowerment but now IMO no chance going to the White House anytime soon. The spirit if the Party is not dead it just broke off with all of US when we dumped the Party chains the manufactured white hat. But we also need to begin to organize to grow you are correct if we stand still we appear to wallow, we need to plan to reach out to the Hispanic community, bring in the seniors other groups silent unaware of their numbers and power but disaffected all with a shared community of interest and build a mandate for our interest our communities. To bad Hillary will not break from the Party…but a leader as you say will emerge.
    Like you I’m done with the past political process it’s a fraud and it’s harming our futures and the Dem Party growth strategy was militant and failed to bring along the Base.

  235. I am absolutely amazed how cowardly and stupid this vote by Obama was. In fact ALL of the Dems who voted for the bill should be booted out of office. If Obama’s only motivation was to NOT be labeled “soft on terror,” then he is even more clueless than we thought. He could have used a vote against the bill to show that he is strong and stands up for the principles he espouses. He could have touted his vote from the rooftops with sound reasoning (just like Hillary did) and turned the tables on McCain and put himself in a strong position.

    I believe there is more to this vote for Obama and most of the dems than meets the eye — and it probably is MONEY. The telecoms have very deep pockets.

    Dear God, we need Hillary more than ever. This country is in trouble if McCain is elected, but this country is in even more trouble if Obama is elected. Please wake up DNC — Please wake up Super Delegates!

  236. Good Morning Confluencians, have only been lurking lately, had surgery and have 14 stitches in my head. Oww! But I got to watch C-Span and see the vote, and I saw our girl come in and felt so much better.

  237. Another $20.08 from Samantha and mom.

  238. via VastleftJesus’ General shows some class:

    Wednesday, July 09, 2008
    …to ,Lambert, Vast Left,, and NBFH,.

    Clinton votes on FISA:

    Cloture: NO

    Passage: NO

    You told me so.

    Any additional comment from me would be superfluous.

  239. People shouldn’t say “WTF”. We all know what that stands for and it isn’t polite.

  240. Did you hear the latest BO gaffe? This guy is such an amateur, if I didn’t dislike him so intensely, I’d actually be embarrassed FOR him:

    Apparently, at the recent dual fundraiser with Clinton, he was supposed to make an appeal to his supporters to donate to Clinton’s campaign for the sake of paying down her debt. Instead, he talked entirely about himself, said “good night” to the crowd, and began walking off stage with the music playing. Finally, his aides grabbed him, gave him back the mic, and he had to yell out, “Oh yea, wait. I got carried away and forgot to ask you to help give money to Senator Clinton’s campaign …”


  241. Might I say – YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Ohio $100
    elixir $100
    garychapelhill $50 – please get us a post with all of the
    captsfufp $50
    SophieL $50 – Happy Birthday next week – this will be
    your best present ever!
    RalphB $50
    LHinseattle $50
    DancesWithPumas $50
    DancesWithPumas $50 (no, this is not an error)
    CognitiveDissonance $50
    kenoshaMarge $20.08 (love you)
    samanthasmom $20.08 (where’s dad and
    Lisadawn82 $50 – you did not buy just a T-Shirt – you
    my dear are helping to buy back
    this election!

    fuzzy – ya did good!

    Grand Total so far:


  242. Get well soon Kim!

  243. I watched some of the news shows this morning while getting ready for work. Even checked in on Joe and CNN, which I normally don’t do anymore with the expectation that there would be fallout from Obama’s FISA vote.
    The only thing they talked about was JJ’s comment and then how well (presidential)Obama reacted to it.

    Are you kidding me?

    The story should be:

    1. The end of the 4th amendment and Obama flip flopping again.
    2. The disaffection of the left towards Obama for the flip, coupled with the disaffection of one of the most prominent black leaders in the country. Coupled (tripled) with the loss of Hillary’s financial backers as evidenced by the WSJ.

    Instead we get smirky comments about male anatomy.



  244. garychapelhill, on July 9th, 2008 at 11:51 pm Said:
    “With just half a wing this bird can’t fly,”

    what the hell? if she’s the other half, that’s still only one wing barry. you’d be flying around in circles if you could get off the ground at all.

    Gary, I’ve been laughing for about 15 minutes now, and loudly, and at work. You’re hilarious. I never noticed what an idiotic statement that was.

    Soon we’ll need books recording Obama-isms….

  245. I have moved the money countdown to the next post!

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rock!

  246. Carollllll…….I donated $100 for two t-shirts too….add me to your list, please?
    This is in addition to the 120.08 on July 4th….

  247. Contribution Details
    Date: July 10, 2008 9:44 AM EDT
    Contact: XXXXXXXXX
    Amount: $20.08

  248. […] join  myiq2xu at The Confluence in spluttering with incredulous laughter that even when Hillary does the right thing, she […]

  249. Date: July 10, 2008 11:17 AM EDT
    Contact: xxx
    Amount: $50.00

  250. That was a t-shirt 🙂


    DATE: July 10, 2008 11:33 AM EDT
    NAME: Julianne Barbato
    ADDRESS: W. Sahara Ave.
    Las Vegas, NV 89117
    AMOUNT: $50.00

    And getting my Dendy (aka Denitra) T-shirt, too!


  252. BTW, Dendy is also a Jersey girl…from Hudson County, on the rivefront. 🙂

  253. I don’t agree..

  254. you don’t agree with what?

  255. Lookit:

    The DNC ruling in FL and MI did not change the outcome of the primary election. It was not that close.

    Let’s be honest. The DNC ruling is just a distraction. Most people do not believe he won the primary with that ruling. That math just is not there.

    The experience gap is a legitimate concern – the argument that will win over others and may swing delegates to her camp.

  256. JW, come up to the active thread.

  257. GUYS!!

    The republicans have been financing him right from the start, and that can go as far as the Middle East.and Africa.

    that’s who he is in bed with–I’m sure it’s easy to prove, but with the PUBS & the media behind him, not to mention OPRAH——We have only us and our Senator CLinton—We may never know. Hopefully, together, we can stop him, even if we have to vote for McCain.

  258. Putting his face in front to represent us???

    What a crock,

    Woman hate him, the jewish hate him, the israelites hate him, the intelligent hard working hate him, I’m sure the veterans aren’t crazy about him, the elderly don’t like him.

    Just who does he represent—maybe hate is a strong word, but it is also an emotion, contrived from injustice, harm, and wrong-doing.

    Yeah, we’ll put his face on a bag of CHARMIN< that’s where he belongs.

  259. Janis,

    What is the active thread?

    Sorry but I’m new here.

  260. It isn’t GW who is in charge, it’s HIS father and his “illuminaries”

    got to loosechange.com, (if it’s still there)—you’ll see who’s really in charge–It’s not George W and it never was.

  261. go to rickilieberman@gmail.com



    or Hillarysupporters.com

    You’ll see the link for the T-shirt with the $ 50 donation

  262. if we retire the debt, we make her look good,

    Besides–the fact, WE’RE STILL HERE, and we’re going nowhere, except to DC for her inauguration!!

  263. PS—according to her Finance Director ( I forgot his name)—he’s linked to “say no deal” somewhere.

    there is no deadline for Friday, per HIM, but, the sooner we get the debt off her back

    the BETTER

  264. […] Things That Make You Go WTF? [image]From Matt Stoller at OpenLeft: It’s interesting to consider how Clinton would have voted were she the […]

  265. PS–I’m going to buy my T-shirt

    Add my $ 50 to the list

    Nice site, first time I was here, many laughs, much intelligence, hope to talk to you all real soon!!

  266. I do not understand how this is acceptable to Senator Obama’s supporters.

  267. […] As I write this post, the news is abuzz with Senator Barack Obama’s “pivot” to the center as it is being called by supporters.  I am going to write a full post about this but this is […]

  268. That’s what is so great about Hillary: like her husband she is firmly in the center. I’ve heard a million times that Bill was the best Republican president we ever had. She’s no radical, and she deserves support from all sides.

  269. fif.. some of you still appear to be under the impression the Obama actually had 1.5 million donors. He DIDN’T!!!! I urge you to check out the FEC website beyond the front page map. The Campaign consistently lied.He had 1.7 million DONATIONS!!!! As of May he had less than 300 thousand donors making the $200 itemization mark. The remaining amount, after the $200 itemizers are subtracted does not account for his claims in donors. Plus keep in mind, those folks making the itemization list may still be counted multiple times. I saw one woman on the Missouri list with 18 separate donations. I don’t think he has the financial base everyone assumes.

  270. He has a lot of people who have pledged to donate monthly – so yes, he has far more donations than donors. A friend of mine is one of those who pledged to give money to him monthly. (BTW she is steamed about his FISA vote so they’re not all blind.)

  271. I’m be there with you, SimoFish. I think my sign will be about Donna and her momma, too bad her momma raised a fool.

  272. Hi, I’ve been listening to No We Won’t radio, and keep on hearing about a video about horseshit and blow it out your a$$. Does anyone know where I can find it? thx

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