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Saturday: What we want and when we want it

Good morning, Conflucians and PUMAs!  Today is the first day of my vacay at the beach.  Yesterday was cool and dreary aaaaannnnd so is today!  I hope we’re not seeing a theme here because that would su, er, be of low quality.  Well, in any case, I will be running around like a chicken with my head cut off because I have *once again* managed to put everything off until the very last moment  Yeaahhh!  I *love* a stressful morning.  It gets my blood flowing.

All in all, guys, I think we’ve had a great month for an online movement.  It looks like we have stemmed the tide of Democrats who thought they had nowhere else to go but Obama.  We’re in the news and on our own radio station and we even have Donna Brazile’s attention.  Well, done everyone.  Thank you Diane and Will and everyone in the Just Say No Deal coalition.  As Murphy would say People United Mean Action.  Now, what are the next steps?  Well, there are many exciting ideas that are being put into action.  I will be sharing some of them with you in the near future but there is no doubt that we need to tell the nation and the DNC what it is that we expect of them.  And the place to start is a fair, open and transparentl convention that The Denver Group is working for.

PUMAs, I can think of nothing so reasonable to demand than that all delegations are counted fully, that delegates are awarded according to the votes that were cast and that all voters have their wishes recorded publicly through a roll call vote for all candidates who participated in this season’s primaries.  In fact, I can’t think of why the DNC thought they could truncate this process without penalty in the first place.  It is the breadth of arrogance in the DNC that has brought us to this point.  Did they think no one was watching?  It may be very true that only the political junkies watch C-SPAN but even those Democrats that actually have a life know that something is wrong when up to 32% of them decide they will not vote for the party’s nominee.

So, how do we get the word out?  Well, that is the mission of the next month.  Our mission is to demand an open convention.  PUMAs, this is not a radical request.  It is a very rational one.  Any voter in a state that spent millions of dollars on their primary and who will not get an opportunity to declare that state’s choice should be outraged by that.  That includes voters in CA, NJ, NY, MA, PA, OH, TX, AZ, FL, MI, WV, KY and many others where Clinton won decisive victories.  Those primaries cost millions of dollars that could have been used to pay for gifted and talented education, senior citizens services, mass transit, energy costs for the poor, state health insurance programs for children who don’t qualify for SCHIP, green space initiatives to keep local farmland as farms, beach erosion programs, to fix bridges and roads, and on and on.  Instead, those state legislatures committed millions of dollars for a primary when the DNC had apparently rigged the process for the anti-Clinton candidate.  To me, that smacks of fraud of the taxpayer’s dollars.  Don’t think so?  Why don’t we ask Floridians how they felt about the prospect of having to conduct a new primary at more that $15 million dollars?

This is your task for the week and the month. Time is of the essence.  Think about it.  How do we get more Democrats to realize what is going on?  How do we get a fair, open and transparent convention?  What kind of message would be most effective?  So, think about it Conflucians.  I will be checking in while I’m on vacation but I might not be here first thing in the morning.  Also, there will be activities going on in the week ahead.  Tomorrow, NO WE WON’T on blogtalkradio will be having a conversation with Harriet Christian and Paulie Abeles about their experiences with the DNC and the attacks on their characters.  Synchronize your watches for that.  On Tuesday, July 8th, Diane will be havig a cocktail party with a TV crew from Japan and we’ll be doing a virtual cocktail party here.  It would be great if other PUMA sites would join in virtually as well but more details about that when the time comes.  We’ll lift our Causmos to one another and PAR-TAY!

So, for now, ciao, Caros!

119 Responses

  1. So, the chairman of my State Democratic party just sent me an email. He wants me to join him in donating money to Hillary’s campaign. I can’t figreu it out, this guys’ an Obama supporter, and way before I thought it proper to call for ‘Unity’ he was doing it. It’s all about electing Obama to him, and he makes that plain in his email.

    I think they are trying to co-opt part of our gig, Confluentians!

    Contribution Details
    Date: July 04, 2008 7:30 PM EDT
    Contact: Sima

    Amount: $20.08

    This was in response to our drive to pay off her debt, so Carol, count my contribution, please 🙂

  2. Good morning, riverdaughter,

    I hope you have a wonderful vacay and will be hoping you get some sunny days. Up here in MA, we have had rain every day for weeks now. I’m sick of it. Let’s hope the sun gods shine on us this week.

    We are going to miss you, but we’ll try our best to keep the Confluence jumping.

  3. Carol,

    I noticed that a few people have noted their contributions from yesterday on earlier posts–there are a few on the Diss me Donna one. You may have already seen them.

  4. Have a great vacation … I live at the beach I love it so much !! btw am on the air with GODDESS RADIO til one pm EST today ..so if anyone wants to wander over and chat I wuold love to give you a shout out on air 🙂 http://www.cygnusradio.com listen here

    http://audio.cygnusradio.com:8000/cyg1_hi.m3u or come to the website and click the big listen button, chat is very safe no trolls allowed 🙂

  5. Have a great vacation !!! I live at the beach I love it so much !
    am on the air with GODDESS RADIO until one PM EST if anyone wants to drop by and chat I would love to give you a shout out on the air and talk about our plans http://www.cygnusradio.com and hit the big listen button no registration is required for chatting and the chat room is striclty moderated by me so no trolls 🙂

  6. Good Morning!

    I went over the last posts from all the postings yesterday. I am sure some will continue to post their contributions!

    I say we make it a “JULY 4th Weekend” pay off “OUR DEBT” event.

    As of now:

    Lizgranny $44.44
    glennmcgahee $20.08
    SIMA $20.08

    Grand Total $2331.76

    Thanks so much everyone!

    I will be so excited to see overall results.

    PUMA$ Who Donate Rock!

    President Hillary Rodham Clinton 2008

  7. Happy well-deserved vacay Riverdaughter!

    Good morning all! It’s been a great few weeks indeed -I know that Murphy at PUMAPac has secured funds to hire buses to take PUMAs to Denver, room and board are on your own – but it’s great to see definite plans in action.

    So if anyone wants to hop on the bus (and not be under one for a change) or donate to the Denver Bus fund, please go to PUMAPAC on the blogroll for more info.

    They have buses that will leave from different cities – check which one is closest to you.

  8. Hey Everyone

    I haven’t commented in a while. But I remember when there were only 7 or 8 of us on here. I guess I was PUMA before being PUMA was cool. I found on my desk at home a post it note that I brought home from work. On it I had hastily written down “confluence.com Riverdaughter.orgpress.com.” I had been listening to Riverdaughter on a radio show on 103.1 WILK. At the time I was desperate to find anyone on the net who felt like I did about the election. I read a comment or an article or something on the net that referred me to this radio show. And when I heard RD give the name of the blog I wrote it down and brought it home. And I remember when PUMA was named on this site.
    What I see here in Ohio is just a total lack of enthusiasm about the presidential race. A colleague yesterday said she didn’t know what she was going to do. She was a “Hillary girl” she said. I almost said I was voting for McCain but instead said my vote is my own and for certain it won’t be going to Obama. I read this site daily. And frankly, this is where I get all my news (frightening). We are going to make a difference. And if we are blamed come November so be it.

  9. 46%! 32% will stay home. The rest will vote for McCain. By my calculations that’s 8.3 MILLION Democratic voters!

  10. I’m glad the question of how we inform other Dems and the general public came up. Indeed! Is it not possible to interest someone to write an article or editorial delineating both what happened and the unfairness of not including all candidates for consideration at the convention–i.e., all that the above article noted. The vast majority of people don’t even realize that it was only thanks to the SDs that Obama was declared the winner! The numbers represented by the caucuses vs ordinary votes is also something nearly no one is aware of. Likewise wrt violations contemplated by the DNC for Denver. Putting this info on the front page somewhere will make it much more difficult for the Brazille’s of the DNC to continue their back-room deals and cover-ups. If we can’t get the attention of a newsreporter, then maybe we need to stage a little peaceful demonstration outside the doors of the likes of Dean/Pelosi. Maybe a squad of bikini-clad women with DON’T COVER-UP placards will get their attention! I’m game!

  11. I myself am going to get some much-needed vacation time up and around the Seattle area (I miss my Dodgers but the Mariners will do). Before I go, however, I will be going to the Denver group and sharing some of my before-mentioned “lottery” winnings. I shall again whip out the plastic and give them $100. Carol, I’m still not sure how to show my receipt but it’s there, so please count me in. Have a terrific week–see you all on the 10th.

  12. Causmos == cocktails for a cause? Intriguing!

  13. Senator Obama ran unapposed during his first state senate run after getting everyone else removed from the Dem ballot. Then he ran against Keyes for Senator which was like running unapposed. Now he’s trying to get Senator Clinton off the ballot at the Convention. What I’m trying to figure out is how he’s going to get Senator McCain kicked off the Republican ballot. Hmmm.

  14. Hi PUMA’s !!
    My son’s watching the movie, “Rat Race”.
    Believe it or not there was a line that reminded me of PUMA / JSND; it goes something like this:
    “Good things take time” / “Great things happen all at once”!

  15. Guys:

    I got an email from Paula saying that even if you have given the 2300 max to hillary, you can still give $$ to retire the debt for hillary…


    please give and invite people to give as well..

    we need to free her from that fraud! (who seems to be imploding by the minute, did you hear him say what kinds of judges he wants to appoint…I see no differenece b/w him and mccain)

    I knew he would unravel.. I just didn’t expect it this quickly..

  16. AnabelleP: I saw the article on the poll and enjoyed reading until I got to the part where they talked all over again about the 5 stages of “grief” that we’re apparently experiencing.

    Can’t CNN figure out that what we’re experiencing has nothing to do with grief? Can’t THEY get over their own grief and accept the fact that we won’t vote for their darling?

  17. Carol-

    Please add $80.32 to your count.

    I donated $20.08 yesterday as did 3 of my houseguests. If they wanted to stay they had to pay. lol!

  18. Morning all. Hope you have a real nice, peaceful vacation RD. You’ve had a stressful and eventful few months. And you are the midwife of PUMA which must be very satisfying. What is that old Chinese curse? “May you live in interesting times.”

    I found a nice list and email addresses of the RBC of the DNC over at Soapbox and have spent a good share of my morning emailing and letting them know what I think of them. (I said it politely but firmly.)

    I also let them know that this lifelong Democrat would not be voting for Obama under any circumstances. Then I said:

    “If Senator Clinton and her supporters are not treated with respect and if her name is not on the first role call vote, I will vote for John McCain. At least the Republicans allowed their voters to elect their nominee.”

  19. Is there somewhere private we can go to discuss next steps?

  20. Hi, guys, I’m staling in my morning chores to pop in again. I just had an idea about how to get the word out. Well, 3, actually. The thing that is working against us right now is that many Americans are on vacation and not paying attention to the news. So, why not go where the population is? What about Aerial banners at the beach? Imagine a plane with a trailing PUMA banner. Or how about billboards on the highway? I have no idea how much they cost but if they were strategically located, they could be a lot less expensive than a TV ad but maybe just as effective. Finally, what about temporary PUMA tagging. I call this “PUMAs mark their territory”. It would have to last only as long as necessary for nature to wipe it out. Like, I could write PUMA in the sand at the beach. Or someone with a front lawn full of shrubs might carve PUMA into it. Or Spell it out in grass or flowers.
    Get creative. There must be a million natural ways to say PUMA and spread it virally to the non netheads.

  21. Well, we have to be able to enumerate our complaints to the Convention, and demand resolution on our grievances. That’s what the Declaration is about. It can be changed if it’s not exactly to other PUMAs liking, but I think the Objections and Resolutions are dead on. We can use the document and our leverage to force them to seat the delegates as is for MI & FL, to force them to do a roll call with Hillary’s name on the ballot, as well as force concessions in the platform for addressing sexism and the exploitation of cultural issues, as well as other changes. We could even demand she be VP, which, if he’s going to win anyway (not bloody certain in my book, but that is CW) then I sure as hell want her there watching our backs, and over his shoulder. I want a witness I can trust.

    I think our real world action for tomorrow will also be helpful for taking it out of the blogosphere. Also, getting to Denver, which I’ve now made the commitment to do. That’s my 2 cents.

  22. Oo, Oo! One more thing: The DNC is probably going to come back with the same stupid unity message and tell us that we’re running out of time if we want to fight McCain in the GE so we must have a coronation instead of a convention. And here’s my response: “If you don’t have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?” The answer is “4 years!”

  23. I love that, RD. Just making a PUMA sign for you car is huge. I have one hanging from my rearview, and people see it all the time. PUMA on one side, Hillary on the other.

    Also, PUMA (The sportswear co.) Has some great simple graphic shirts. I wear mine everywhere.

    Have a great vacation!

  24. BFF: Didja notice I didn’t use the word “suck”? I used “of low quality”. See? I can be taught. Cle-asssy.

  25. What about Aerial banners at the beach?

    That’s a great idea! I was at the beach yesterday and saw a few of these messages fly by. Everyone looked up. It really does get noticed.

  26. Also, if we can force the proper seating of the delegations and the roll call with Hillary, she very well could win. It’s a long shot, of course, but it could happen.

  27. What about booths at political events? Are you a PUMA booths.

  28. Annabellep,

    I think this year that CW is wrong wrong wrong. That guy is NOT going to win. Regardless, I can’t bear to have Hill as VP. I don’t even want to visit the concept in my mind.

    Our job is to keep up this momentum. We have to convince the people that count that he is a definate loser. Without question–the only way we can succeed.

  29. ssmith, on July 5th, 2008 at 11:50 am Said:
    I got an email from Paula saying that even if you have given the 2300 max to hillary, you can still give $$ to retire the debt for hillary…

    I don’t think you can donate to retire the debt if you are maxed out. I’ve e-mailed Paulie and Heidi Li for clarification.

    Riverdaughter– enjoy your vacation and thanks for posting my video to promote the Denver Group.

  30. Joanie, I’m not saying that has to be part of the agenda, but there are people for it, and they are part of the movement. Personally, I’d support it but it’s not MY agenda, it’s OUR agenda. I do get that.

    And I agree that defeating this particular faction is the paramount issue this season. The only way they go away is if they lose, and even then it’s not certain. But I’m torn, quite frankly. If they win without us, we will be left with no power at all. They will have no cause to listen to women in particular or cater to their needs. They might even backlash, since I consider Obama to be Bush 2.0, and he is just as vindictive in my opinion. I don’t want to get stuck in a situation where the only losers are us. I think we have to consider that possibility as we move forward.

  31. Here’s an idea:

    Have some creative PUMAs design some official brochures and flyers in pdf or other common formats that could be downloaded free from PUMA websites, printed at home and then mass printed at a local Kinkos or Staples copy center.

    That way individual PUMAs can easily and inexpensively get their hands on something they can take to local events and shopping malls to distribute.

  32. Which beach ?? I LIVE at the beach OCEAN CITY MD where the planes fly over they cost about $300400 per fly over I would be more than happy to help set it up ….With help we could certainly get it done !!!

  33. Carol, please add mine.


    DATE: July 4, 2008 9:17 AM EDT

  34. Lots of vacationers from DC come here too 😉

    that is $300 – $400 per fly by sorry for the typo we would want a fly over and PICTURES taken of IT as well

  35. Whoa! Is that all an aerial ad costs? That sounds completely doable.

  36. http://www.ocean-city.com/aerial.htm website for aerial adverts 🙂

  37. geeklove:

    if you are still here.. did you get paulie’s email.??. that’s what she said..

    I’m really confused now ….

  38. myiq, they have something like that over at PUMApac, but they could use help in recruiting talented, professional graphic design artists and marketing people over there to volunteer. Know any?

  39. My feeling is that it’s not “flyby” type of recognition that’s needed, but a reasoned article or discussion REVEALING what few people are aware of, regarding the behind-the-scenes actions of the DNC. Someone respected needs to speak in EARNEST about the concerns that exist regarding the PROCESS, and the dangers of flouting it. Is there a trustworthy democrat who has not gone over to B.O.? Even a single objective person who can report on these legitimate grievances—better yet, 2 or 3—would do the trick and get people thinking. Otherwise it looks as if the DNC is the proper, legitimate authority to trust on all things, and flybys are just…flybys—-one of a million side-groups vying for our attention. Let the leaders of the DNC be called upon to answer these complaints in a reasoned forum. The person leading the expose needn’t even make it about B.O. and Hillary, but rather about the PROCESS, and the concerns that need to be taken seriously regardless of the personalities. If a person wins the nomination by means deemed untrustworthy, then that is a serious STAIN on the party and our government. B.O. should WANT to clear the air (if he were all he claims to be!)

  40. I cant call right now because i am on the air doing GODDESS RADIO but i can call after my show is over …but i can check it out riverdaughter you want my number ?? my email is swannieATcygnusradio.com

  41. Hatsepshut: Who? Who can we get that people will listen? Who’s left to lobby? We’ve got Lou Dobbs, Corbett, and Greta Van Susteren on our side. Maybe Neil Cavuto. I’ve yet to see someone in writen media sympathize with us.

    Maybe WaPo?

  42. Adding to my last post:

    Despite our numbers, most of us are physically isolated from one another. Many of us have never done anything like this before, and the isolation is intimidating. Not many of us could do like Gary and Mawm and travel all the way from NC to NH to protest.

    If we were all in one place we could meet and start diving up tasks according to ability and available time.

    We are together online, and many PUMAs have knowledge and experience to share. PUMA websites need to provide an answer to the question “What can I do?” when someone wants to help.

    We need PUMAs who are experienced at political action to put together a handbook for those who have never participated in something like this. Those who are good at graphics design and advertisng can do their part, as can skilled writers.

    I’m not a gregarious “warm-fuzzy” person, and i have cold-calling strangers and knocking on doors. I’ve always been good at writing stuff, so it comes easily to me. But I know there are many people who have difficulty expressing themselves in writing, so they won’t write letters to the local newspaper or congressman.

    The GOP learned that they could provide standardized form letters that people could easily copy and send. Why can’t we?

    We need to strike a balance between speaking with a unified voice and “top-down” message control, so using PUMA websites as organizing centers is the key.

  43. RD: Great ideas: taking it to the people.

    Back in the day, I would see stickers on toll booths saying “A Lesbian was here.” I saw a lot of them and thought, wow, she sure gets around! Anyway, in these days of InkJets and Staples, we could easily make our own stickers quickly. (File this under Small Acts by the Many.)

    Just Say No Deal

  44. I have no problem with meeting someone in public and going from there …. maybe its living at the beach …and this casual lifestyle …
    hey if you dont mind if i wear sandals and shorts 😉

  45. Count me in, a long time lurker, very occasional commenter.

    DATE: July 4, 2008 8:00 AM

  46. writing letters to the editor in places where you are vacationing can be effective — something describing PUMA objectives. also, if you live in a state with big tourists areas, writing to those papers can be effective in that locals and many vacationers will benefit from the information.

    if a flyer is prepared, printing a supply and leaving those in coffee shops in your hometown or in towns you are visiting can be effective messaging. it would be helpful if any flyer prepared went easy on black or colored background so that printing out copies wouldn’t burn up at-home ink-jets. a trip to kinkos is also an option.

    also, for the really enthusiastic, true print shops are surprisingly affordable.

    if i were to print in large quantity, i think i would create a size that is easy to carry and easy to drop places — 5 x 7 or 4 x 6 or even a book mark shape. brief message and reference to PUMA sites. something like that. just thinking out loud here.

  47. I want a BANNER that says


    ok just kiddin but honestly I dont know what took me so long to think of it 😉 hehehehehe

  48. ssmith
    Paulie said via e-mail in response to your comment when I asked for clarification,

    “Actually it’s correct. Got it straight from the campaign. Contributions go to Senate Re-Election campaign and she can use the money any way she wants… Contributors maxxed out to national campaign can contribute to the Senate campaign (not sure what the max is on that…)”

    I’ve asked Heidi Li to comment, but I haven’t heard from her yet.

    I personally do not know what the answer is.

  49. Great idea to get the simple word PUMA out everywhere in vacation places. Planes dragging banners at the beach; bill boards at entrances to major thoroughfares, etc.

    I also hope PUMA is just a beginning in reforming our politics so that we are once again a democratic country, beginning with the Democrats, but expanding our demands to Republicans after the Dem Convention. This is a powerful idea, a movement whose time has come. The Republicans infected Americans with aughoritarian tactics in 2000 and 2004, and now the Democrats have caught the authoritarian virus. We won’t take it anymore; we are the flu vaccine; we SAY NO DEAL. PUMA is for DEMOCRACY everywhere.

    I think PUMA should support voter ID with procedures designed to help those who might have difficulty getting one. A driver’s license is required; Selective Service proof-of-registration is required. Voting is an important priviledge and duty of every American; an ID to do so should not be onerous.

    In addition, I think PUMA groups should be active in every major city and region in the country to check the legality of every new voter signed up for the primaries and the general election. We know bHo’s minions will continue to pull a Chicago on us and add many dead and imaginary people to the rolls. Let’s get legally active here. I will be active in my city in this regard.

    We are donating in various places — PUMAPAC, DENVER (especially buses), Hillary Retire the Debt, ads, and many, many more areas. Someone on one of the blogs, maybe, riverdaughter, even yourself, suggested that we develop a fund — the REAL DNC Donations — donations by PUMAs and others that would have gone to the DNC if the leaders had not been such skunks. PUMA could hold the money in trust until the DNC functions democratically.

    Other actions. Make sure that the work of the computer companies that make the voting computers is validated by two other (competing) computer companies so that no hidden code is involved. Also PUMA should make “A PAPER TRAIL OF EVERY VOTE CAST” a mantra from here on in.

  50. Regarding Obama’s political “luck.” Not only did his Harvard-hired election
    official level the playing field so he could run unopposed for his
    first political office–removing a real community activist, Alice Palmer, based on four forged signatures, his Democratic opponent for U.S. Senator imploded during the primary with a wife-related sex allegation.

    During the general election,
    Obama’s Republican opponent’s divorce records were somehow obtained
    and revealed to the public (L.A. Times, owned by a Chicago corporation). Surprisingly, another wife-related sex allegation. Two weeks before the election, the Republicans sacrificed a hapless out-of-state black candidate, although I must say, the clip of the debate I saw on You Tube between Keyes and Obama would have had me voting for Keyes. Obama did lose when he challenged Black Panther co-founder Bobby Rush for the House of Representatives after a brief tour of the State house.

    Also, isn’t it so Bush-era that Hillary Clinton has to have lawyers “negotiate” her roll in the Convention? Obviously, her name is on the first ballot. All of the manipulation to get the Unqualified one nominated will ultimately backfire. One thing that Rove has done is to make a large number of
    Democrats aware of his tactics. Now we can recognize it when Dean, Pelosi, Brazile, et.al. play the same game.

    A woman who campaigned all over the country for Hillary said she learned t about the other side of Obama from black women from Chicago who support Hillary. She said that she thinks Obama will be the one, but that his administration will be filled with corruption. Just what this country needs after eight years of Bush.

  51. Geeklove,

    That would be wonderful if true. But that is how a local politician got in big trouble here in CA. Hillary doesn’t need that kind of problem.

    (Of course, CA has a pretty strict law.)

    I imagine the campaign desperately wants it to be true. Only the die hards have been paying close attention and most are maxed out.

    But I caution folks to wait for a WRITTEN statement from the campaign. (After all if that was true, couldn’t she use the general election funds?)

  52. I love the flyong banner idea. Who can forget “Surrender, Gorothy!” from the 2000 recount?

  53. Just Added Another Person To My Voting Options
    I am considering Voting for Cynthia McKinney. Women , African American and Democrat. 3 4 3. Shit and shes not a FLIP Flopper

  54. Annabelle,

    I understand exactly what you are saying, I do. For myself, I file that mentally and move forward toward the outcome I want to see. It’s the focus that ends up magic. I really believe in our power, and we will override vindictivemness in the end, IMO.


    I’ve been thinking the same thing, and have been advocating a PUMA document clearinghouse through Katiebird for awhile.

    I think a good post would be to provide links to simple/ good materials AND to provide clean and effective PUMA talking points. At any given time, any of us could be called to represent this movement to press, and we have to be unified and prepared to be effective. (plus safe, as Fuzzy pointed out re: Diane)

  55. vindictivemness — (WTF??) Mom told me not to learn to type. “Dead end” she said. Worst advice ever.

  56. I was PUMA back in Feburary. I am an African American and not one of the black Hillary supporters are backing McCain and they are not staying home either they are voting for McCain. I am one of those PUMA race traitors. I am not voting for him because I am PISSED that Bill Clinton was branded a racist. That little weak man called Bill Clinton a terrible president and it hurt me when he called Bill a racist. I decided right then I was not voting for Obama. There is only one thing he can do to get my vote and that is sincerely apologize to Bill Clinton. I would not accept a public apology and I would only accept it if the Big Guy forgives him if not then he wasn’t sincere enough for me. I do not think Obama is man enough to admit he was wrong and apologize. He is going to lose because he refuses to say and mean three little words. What is so hard about saying “I am sorry.” “I was wrong.” Its not a horrible event being wrong but it must be corrected and Obama will not be a man enough to say it. It would make his life easier.

  57. Just got off the phone with the aerial advert guy “Bob” who was as nice as he could be … the rates are:
    $450 per individual flight
    $350 for eight flights
    $250 for sixteen ….

    Hatsepshut I completely agree that we need more people who have greater audiences , but I also think that the more people we gather by letting them know we are here… the more weight our voices carry and the more chance we have of gaining their attention and having someone of that stature on our side …

  58. I like the idea of a bookmark shaped handout or a sticker that says PUMA and some kind of catchy slogan. Probably people could get them printed up at local copy places.

  59. Joaniebone
    in high school they wouldnt LET ME take typing they said that was for secretaries and I was on the academic track and wouldnt need it … and I begged them those silly stupid nuns
    so now if it werent for backspace I couldn’t type a word

  60. I don’t know if there is a Puma logo yet?
    If not, we could come up with one.
    If so, this is what I know how to do. Its not much, but its what I know.
    I can purchase t-shirts wholesale, I’ve got a transfer machine. Its a very quick inexpensive way to get something going… I’m just putting it out there.

  61. Many offline PUMAs, who don’t know they are PUMAs yet, need to be informed about our movement and helped out of isolation. I use PUMA and blog. PUMApac.org as part of my real name email signature, and have received inquiries, followed by joining and active participation. I talk with people whose vehicles are sporting Hillary bumperstickers.
    I’ve approached people at work with great results.

    If you are like me and not the gregarious “meet and greet” type, there are still plenty of things you can do. There are tons of pre-formatted PUMA letters, business card, brochures, flyers, posters, faux currency to mail back when you receive solicitations for contributions, etc. at Murphy’s Action Center. http://pumapacusa.org .
    All of the above can be printed and distributed as handouts, attached to cars, left at places of business, laundromats, clubs, etc.

    All y’all are skilled writers / communicaters, you could compose letters and flyers that those of us who aren’t skilled could then use, with or without modification. There are a ton of organizational items that need to be researched and compiled in advance of Denver.

    There are “Daily Growls” listed (simple actions that can be accomplished quickly and easily), there are plenty of actions in which each of us can participate.

    There are tons of things each of us can dedicate an hour or more per day that will us closer to accomplishing our objectives. Please support your movement with action.

    Sorry if I sound preachy or pushy, we need helping hands and the pressure of time is bearing down on us.


  62. print shops, and i’d recommend using a union print shop, can print bookmarks in a stock about the weight of a standard index card for cheap. and certainly stickers can be made too, alittle pricier. it is probably time for an artist in PUMA to create a drawing of a PUMA logo that PUMA has rights to. i am not aware if that has been done already. to keep print jobs cheap, keeping things limited to two-colors is best.

  63. As for Hillary having to negotiate with lawyers for her role in the convention (I read this, but for the sake of the Democratic Party hope it isn’t true). She has to be on the first ballot. I received this email:

    “Historically, what has happened at the Democratic Conventions is:
    In the last 10 Democratic Conventions (1968-2004) one was uncontested (Bill Clinton’s 1996 re-nomination). Of the remaining nine – even though the ultimate nominee in every case had a clear majority of delegates well before the Convention – in SEVEN of the nine, the names of the other contenders were placed in nomination and voted on at the Convention. The only times this didn’t happen were in 2000 and 2004 (although in 2004 Rep. Kucinich still received some votes on the roll call).

    This year we need to make it known that we want Hillary’s name to be placed in nomination. We believe that if this does not happen it will disenfranchise a great many Hillary supporters that we need in order to take back the White House in November.

    Example of an email that I [the person sending the email to me] received:
    I just heard on MSNBC (Fineman-Newsweek) that the Clinton camp as been negotiating for Hillary name to be put into nomination at the convention, that Obama doesn’t want to waste the time, and that he hears that she will not be nominated. Do you know where this stands? If this is true, it is a deal breaker for me.

    It is my understanding that this will be decided between Hillary and Obama’s campaigns. We do not know what is happening behind the scenes but we do know that we are united in our belief that 18 million people voted for Hillary, that hers was an historic campaign, that her delegate votes need to be counted for the record, and therefore her name should be placed in nomination. Hillary delegates want to do what they were elected to do and vote for Hillary on the first roll call vote.”

  64. there are plenty of suppliers. wonder how this one might view a PUMA order?? demstore.com

  65. I LOVE the plane banner idea! Lets settle on the right words before making the investment. I will pitch in for a flight over my region.

    There has to be a clue to answer the inevitable question, “What is PUMA?”

    My suggestion: PUMA WILL CHANGE DENVER!

  66. Me thinks it might be time to upkick the Take It to Denver meme.

  67. Many of us don’t the the PUMAPAC link to those resources because for the sake of time, this is our only blog. Also, many can’t read all the comments. Can someone compile these resources in a post? It would be so helpful to those of us that don’t have time.
    Also, we can set that post a few days from now to give people time for submissions.

    Just a thought. My background is in marketing strategy and copy, but not graphic design as much. Something super-slick visually would be great.

  68. where are you joanie ?? Those I checked on are only over Ocean City Md .. and I think the banner has to have a web site or number to call or some kind of ID that people can find, like PUMAPAC.COM or

    TAKE THE DEM PARTY BACK PUMAPAC.COM something simple like that

  69. as to a banner, the JUST NO DEAL brand with the website may be worth considering, too.

    large audiences are key. if you have a state fair in the summer, or something like a NASCAR race. big big audiences…big bang for the buck.

    the message should not be controversial on its face. i don’t know what kind of permission one needs to fly over, not sure if there’s any “clearance” of message required….like over NASCAR for example.

  70. “CB”
    Your “2” posts were very informative. Keep “us” filled in.
    I would love to have seen his debate with Keyes.
    Go PUMA!

  71. excuse me, that’s JUST SAY NO DEAL, of course.

  72. I love it JUST SAY NO DEAL is great

    OF COURSE !!!
    duh what was I thinking

  73. I’m in Seattle. As long as the banner defines PUMA as having nothing to do w/Obama plus a contact.

    Short and Sweet.

    Lets get the ball rolling on short and effective suggestions today, then publish a running list (tomorrow?) weigh in, and decide!

  74. joaniebone, annabellep, myiq2xu and others!

    I strongly agree that we need a central site that has many different kinds of materials easily accessible. We should have the Declaration there, fact sheets to support the real vote at the Convention, links to all the videos that support PUMA whether made specifically by PUMAs or not, etc. etc.

    One thing that’s been a bit frustrating for me is when I think I’d like to look up a video I saw days ago or a really great blog post, I end up having to comb through blog entries trying to find it. Blogs are great for discussion but not for information.

    We have to make it really, really easy for people to find what we’re about. We have to make it really, really easy for people who are already on board to catch up on what we’re doing quickly.

    I was very happy to read RD’s post today because I think we also have bring some focus to all the efforts. We have the energy and passion to last 100 years (or a million) but it’s going in many directions. Given that PUMA’s only a month old the focus we have is already amazing, but we have only a short time until the convention and the GE.

    One example — if we did have a centralized web page, we could have an Action items section divided into ‘Top Items’ — say 2 or 3 thing everyone should do, and a ‘What To Do When You’ve Already Done the Top Items’ section.

    I’m unfortunately not skilled with web pages or I would volunteer to create PUMA Central myself. I will happily help in any way I can, though. I’m more like myiq2xu, not so warm fuzzy but a lot with the writing-type stuff.

    Finally (sorry this is so long), I really like the face-to-face idea if we can manage it. I sent my email into the regional (I’m NE) request but haven’t heard anything.

    Second Finally — Are f2f’s part of the plan? I’m in the Boston area — there seem to be a number of us — we could use the Meetup site to get just a smaller than NE group together in a shorter time, maybe. I’d be happy to set one up. What do the NEs/Mass./anyone within driving distance of points NE think?

  75. Many people don’t know that JSND refers to Obama, so we have to be careful to spell it out to the real low-info voters. Okay no more from me–too much already!

  76. This is an article written in 2004. It shows how Hillary was never part of the plan


  77. dear hearts and gentle people

    I have to go upload my show for the podcast will be back later 🙂 I cannot stay away long

  78. Carol, I sent in my $20.08 contribution to Hillary yesterday before leaving for the day.


    DATE: July 4, 2008 1:19 PM EDT
    AMOUNT: $20.08

  79. how about?


    ok, work in progress….

  80. Be sure to add me to the contributing PUMAs as well! And where can we go to find out how big of a dent we made??

    Dear Ryan,

    Thank you for your generous contribution. We are at a critical
    stage in the campaign, and our online supporters like you are
    making the difference. The more people we reach, the more resources
    we will have to help Hillary win. Send an email to your friends and
    family asking them to support our campaign by making a contribution
    at http://www.hillaryclinton.com/joinme

    If you have any questions about your contribution please contact us at


    DATE: July 4, 2008 1:36 PM EDT
    NAME: Ryan Fleury
    ADDRESS: Fort Campbell, KY 42223
    AMOUNT: $20.08

  81. regencyg, on July 5th, 2008 at 2:00 pm Said:
    Me thinks it might be time to upkick the Take It to Denver meme.

    Exactly. Where has being “nice” gotten us…or anyone?

  82. Since Obama is reversing on Roe V Wade, there is no reason for those who are sticking for Obama because of it to stay. I wonder if those now 8 million voters will begin to double.

    I wonder how Donna Brazile is going to spin this recent reversal?

  83. By Aug, they will have to bus into Denver those folks they have hauled around all primary season. How can anyone be buzzed about BO at this stage/? The kool aide tub looks about dry .

  84. Linda C., on July 5th, 2008 at 2:35 pm Said:
    I wonder how Donna Brazile is going to spin this recent reversal?

    She’ll say,

    “what are you talking about?? We never said any thing about that and if you remember we did, you aren’t a Democrat . Now stop emailing me, cause my mama taught me to work for a living ”

    okay, I’m challenging Donna….help

  85. Donna will tell us we have no place else to go, what else?

  86. Annetoo: the buses will be placed in containment areas. i’ve been doing research on what they’re planning for protesters in Denver … basically, big ol’ cages


  87. Ideas possible.

    Someone in the PUMA origination needs to start wooing Fox News talk show like Bill O’Riley and various other media outlets and send out people who can relate well to them.

    Somehow manage to attract enough attention to warrant a news conference. Do something very compelling that will make people say, this is crazy, they can’t do that.

    CNN has a segment with Wolf B. that the girl goes to different web sites/

    Meetings, meetings, with all the media groups and we need to span out with enough people to get attention. Sooner or later someone will listen.

    We need bumper stickers printed up with something snappy that is also very classy. People wanting one could buy one to cover cost of mailing them out.

    Hold meetings in people’s homes who volunteer for drumming up ideas and how to make them happen.

    I think Pumas could have their very own lemonade stands, selling bumper stickers, hats t-shirts etc. and do it with class.

    Anyway some ideas that might work.

  88. I don’t think we should ever forget the first democratic precept that the DNC did this primary (sic) season was to throw one person one vote and the first amendment to the wind.

  89. Thanks to all for these excellent, constructive ideas. I did see that Murphy’s site has some printable postcards, etc., with PUMA logos (on the “Daily Growl” page).

    What’s the consensus: should we push “PUMA” or “Just say no deal” or come up with something of our own?

    Regency: Yes, let’s get “Take it to Denver” rolling again.

    Valhalla: I’m in Rhode Island. There are Confluencians in the MA area. A meet-up would be great.

  90. ssmith, on July 5th, 2008 at 11:50 am Said:
    Here is the fine print on the form.
    “… An individual may contribute a maximum of $2,300. By submitting your contribution, you agree that your contribution is designated for the 2008 primary election debt retirement, when aggregated with all of the individuals other 2008 primary contributions…”

    I do not believe that one may contribute in excess of $2300for the primary/debt reduction.

    I have contributed to her senatorial campaign as a show of support.

  91. Off topic maybe:

    I was thinking of the recent comments by Brazile selling PUMA as a bunch of republicans and why she would choose that strategy.

    I think if they acknowledge that PUMA are disgruntled democrats that superdelegates might be swayed to change their vote. Therefore, they must at all cost pass it off as a republican based movement.

    Just a thought.

  92. dakinikat, on July 5th, 2008 at 2:52 pm

    No I meant for anyone to show enthusiasm for BO by Aug, they will need to bus people in to get anyone to wave a “change ” sign, they will need people brought in.

    Protesters , of course , will be treated to the GOP tactics of an echo chamber somewhere in left field. Any by the way, I like your blog

  93. “Meet Me In Denver” would be a great bumper sticker. I still remember how fired up Hillary was about Ohio.

  94. Gary and Mawm: What’s the website that Mawm put together? I can’t seem to find it on the blogroll?

  95. regencyg, on July 5th, 2008 at 3:02 pm Said:

    “Meet Me In Denver”

    Sounds good to me!!

  96. I like “Meet Me In Denver,” too. It’s catchy.

  97. I just put up an action post.

  98. ah, thx Annetoo .. and i see …

    i’ve been wondering about using pink panther dolls as puma things … are there any of those pink pather stick to the window things we could put on our cars? we could put signs on them and change them out daily, if so …

  99. http://www.melaniesemporium.com/Pink_Panther_Stuffed_Animals_and_Pillows.htm

    here are some, we could change their little tshirts to honk if you love Puma or something …

  100. http://cartoonfansclub.com/pluspanther004.html

    here’s a set of three for like 20 bux

  101. “Many of us don’t the the PUMAPAC link to those resources because for the sake of time”

    The PUMApac Action Center is separate and doesn’t include comments.
    I just hate to see time and effort wasted trying to reinvent the wheel.

    pumapacusa.org = action center
    blog.pumapac.org = comments

  102. I get word out on Obamas dangerous liasons the old fashioned way, mixed in my comments at dailykos:

    h ttp://www.dailykos.com/user/dotcommodity/comments

    I think because I was always an eco kossack, that group is much more geeky, diverse, more policy focused, and they accept much more diversity in politics without getting their panties in a twist. Even some of the new ones are quite good allies in promoting good eco policy. So I do still post there. If you want to get your licks in on environmental questions, I’d suggest joining the prepub group, that way you only go into eco diaries there.

    h ttp://groups.google.com/group/dailykos-environmentalists

    And hey, even kos is a PUMA, now!…:-) no, I know there would still be cds again if they had a clue about her continuing threat. But its like they stuck a fork in her. Now she’s done, just as they clamoured for. They simply have no clue about PUMA, other than imagining Hillaryis44 is the sum of their opposition.

    And if their shiny new toy is not so shiny anymore? Well, they are back to grumbling…

  103. okay, i’m running with it now!

  104. Dances with pumas- I agree!

    But I was surprised, because I had visited PUMA PAC before looking for this stuff, and didn’t know that I had to go to Daily Growl on the Blogroll. I probably seem dumb, but I think its so easy for people like me to lose momentum in the search.

    It should be in a post, not in the comments– how to get there and how to add a new contribution.

  105. DancesWithPumas —

    Sorry, I didn’t know about the link to pumapacusa.org. Obviously all my ideas were already put into motion a while ago, plus some!

    The link to the images gallery is giving me a url not found error and a 404 error, though.

    Do we have an official slogan and logo? Besides Party Unity My Ass (which is priceless AND catchy of course). Like ‘It’s the Democracy, Stupid!’ (just kidding).

    We can use places like CafePress and Zazzle for t-shirts, stickers, etc. There’s already a lot of PUMA stuff on CafePress. I’m planning to get myself some of it today.

  106. The PUMA Pac site can be a bit confusing. It took me a few times to figure my way around.

  107. I think it would be really funny to have an airplane fly over the beach with a banner reading:


    I didn’t say it would be helpful. I just think it would be funny 🙂

  108. I love the Party Unity My Ass slogan. It’s so validating.

  109. In Minnesota, lawn signs proliferate before every election like dandelions in the spring. Please add lawn signs to the proposed PUMA paraphernalia.

    Politicos traditionally campaign at the Minnesota State Fair (Minneapolis-St. Paul, Aug. 21-Sept. 1), one of the largest in the country. Fairgoers can make an impression with PUMA shirts and PUMA or Hillary campaign buttons.

    Immediately following the State Fair is the Republican National Convention (St. Paul, Sept. 1-4). Minnesota, a blue state since the Nixon era, is a battleground this year–just as in 1892, the last time the Republican National Convention was held in Minneapolis:

    Where would a Minnesota meetup be announced?

  110. PumaPac already has a slogan and I think it’s a good one: “Voice of the Voters”. Isn’t that exactly what we want to represent?

  111. Don’t know if anyone has brought this up, but shouldn’t some sort of press release be sent to local news outlets alerting them to the banners beforehand?

  112. I’d like to be able to refer people to a site that just lays out link after link of the facts from reliable and proven sources. For starters:
    1)Donna B on CNN saying the “new” Democratic party no longer needs blue collar and Latino voters to win.

    2) the facts about MI and FL- emphasizing Obama and his buddies who voluntarily took their names off the ballot and that Hillary was not the only candidate that who left her name on. I’m surprised that people actually think she intentionally put her name on in an underhanded way.

    3)stats from RealClearPolitics (or wherever) that explains how Hillary’s delegates were from primaries in swing states based on 34+ million voters and Obama’s were from caucus’ in republican states based on 1+ million -and newspaper articles from those caucus states about what happened at those caucus’ and all the complaints that were filed but never followed up on (if proof can be found)

    4)and of course the RBC meeting including a copy of that particular rule that I read somewhere at the time that said something like… any candidate who voluntarily removes their name from the ballot will receive NO delegates.

    Just fact after fact, article after article showing what went down. Also, even though I love the Party Unity My Ass slogan, it may be off putting to some Democrats. Some people may not be interested in “joining” or protesting, but may be upset enough to email, write or call DNC, delegates, etc. (they’ll still be a PUMA) Make it mostly “educational” for those who have no idea what really happened, but provide a link to pumapac and others.This should be directed at all Democrats whether they voted/supported Hillary,Edwards, Biden or whoever…yes even those pesky Obama supporters. After all, if they’re TRUE democrats they should be concerned about corruption in their own party.

  113. Phoenix – where in MN are you? I’m in champlin – DFL sent me email about party on the 12th in St. Paul – looking for somebody to come along – will be wearing PUMA shirt – Obamabots scare the shit outa me & I don’t want to be there alone………………….

  114. count me in: $20.08

    As far as the question on how to wake up other dems, I believe an effective strategy would be some research and writing on how many people in Obama’s district in Chicago were screwed out of affordable housing due to his lack of leadership. Remember, most of the buildings to be rehabilitated by Rezko were in Obama’s district, and yet, Obama never asked his buddy, Tony, why there were no construction workers at any of those buildings–Maybe, because he never checked or worse!!

    Also, promoting Obama’s inconsistencies on women’s rights would be very informative and effective. I am referring to the article on Obama vs. McCain in terms of equitable pay among staffers.

    Also, selling PUMA gear on the justsaynodeal.com website would help raise funds. Remember–Pink sells!!!

    We also need to find a way to reach older voters with no internet…silver PUMAS.

    I also believe the idea of promoting voting for McCain is the most effective way of beating Obama. As a poster on another blog said, “staying home or writing Hillary in is really a vote for Obama.”

    We could use the American Cancer Society’s method. Each of us can print and mail/deliver flyers to our neighbors at our own mailing cost.


  115. SusiePuma,

    Nice to hear from another Minnesotan. I’m not that far from you, and I know the event you mean, but I wasn’t planning to attend.

    The Democratic National Convention takes place during the State Fair. Depending on what happens at Denver, Minnesota PUMAs might want to meet up at the fairgrounds.

    Anyone else here from the North Star State?

  116. For those who wish to stay together in a long term commitment to the ideals and rinciples that Hillary Clinton has spent a lifetime promoting, http://Together4Us.com offers access for activists, funders, students, policy-makers and ordinary people to come together in support of each other and their goals for America. Please come to our website and join, use the code below to put our linked logo on your website and distribute our message and this code to all your network. Spread the word. We will be happy to put up a reciprocal link, your own co-branded web page on our site, or your own blog.

    Thanks so much,
    Gretchen Glasscock,

  117. I’m using chalk and writing PUMA08.com all over the streets and sidewalks. It is not permanent so no one can get mad.

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