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New England Patriot

Recently, the Supreme Court overturned a law in the District of Columbia that created a complete ban of hand guns there.  Even if you don’t own a gun or even if you would never own a gun, please try for just one moment to look at the world from another person’s perspective.  If you do own a gun, you won’t have to pretend.  Try to imagine you are a gun owner.  You might enjoy hunting, and you are probably interested in ensuring the protection of your family.

Now think about the implication of the DC hand gun ban.  How do you think you would feel about that?  I used to think people in the NRA were sort of nuts to get really worked up over things like wait times for hand-guns, or background checks.  I would argue that those things are not incredibly restrictive, and don’t keep people from owning a gun.  Their retort would always be that those laws were steady erosions of the second ammendment.  I would think they were sort of hyper-sensitive.

What a difference a law makes.  If I imagine myself a gun owner, I would have really been looking  closely at the law in DC.  You can’t argue that the governent isn’t going to take away your guns, because that is exactly what they were doing for 30 years.  We shouldn’t have dismissed their concerns, but because I’m not a gun owner I never knew what they were doing there.  I don’t subscribe to the NRA, and really never knew about the ban until Tom Palmer filed his suit, and the case made its way to the highest court of our land.

Barack Obama recently made a statement about the SCOTUS judgement overturning the ban.  What do you guess his position is now?  He was never for the ban.  However, guess how he felt just earlier this year?  Did you guess he was for it?  Watch the clip below, and you will notice something amazing.  Obama manages to be both for the ban and against restriction all at the same time.  It is classic Obama.  Say something really incomprehensible, so later you can pull a WORM ( What Obama Really Meant). 

What is really a feat of sophistry is the reasoning that allows him to be both for a ban and against one at the same time.  He seems to be making the argument that there are different sets of rules for the urban dweller as opposed to the rural one. 

Very bizarre.



Here is another protester from the Unity sham rally in NH.  I think not being able to nail down Obama on his real opinion on second amendment rights might be making him a little uneasy about supporting the presumptuous nominee.  After having met him, I thought he was someone I would like to have on my side.

76 Responses

  1. I probably won’t be popular for saying this but I was for the DC gun ban. I lived in DC and it’s a very violent city.

  2. When one sees a post without any comments, the temptation to post “first” is strong!

    I promise it won’t happen again!!

  3. I watched that first video twice and I stiill don’t know what his position on it is.

  4. I used to be one of those gun owning gay guys-no I was never a republican just a gun owner. I was also a naval officer once too-but never once a republican.

    I dont have one now had to get rid of them when douglas got sick at the end and kept misplacing things so I have found I can live without one.

    I have no quams about non convicted citizens owning guns-sorry just dont


  5. One of my early apprehensions about bo was that he talks out of both sides of his mouth at once .He is very good and practised at it . In my experience privately and professionally ; I have found people who do that to be either ” people pleasing ” meaning they do not ever take a stand for fear of displeasing someone , or they are dishonest and dont have a stand or personal point of view and are manipulative and possess an agenda for whch they are not forthcoming .Guess which one applies to him .:)

  6. Today in San Francisco a father and his two sons one 20 and one 16 were buried today. I coached Michael in little league for several years and he and his family attended the same school as my nephew for 9 nine years. Their crime? They blocked the path of a car drivien by a gang banger. The father backed up to let him pass and as he did he opened fire and killed Michael and his father at the scene. Matthew died later at the hospital. I believe guns are meant to be in the hands of the militia and not in the hands of civilians. Gawd help us all if the NRA isn’t stopped.

  7. Florence, I didn’t know about the ban until recently.

    I am sort of shocked. I always thought there was no way they were going to pass something that banned guns totally.

    I can see why they may think it would work, but I guess it hasn’t. It has been in place for 30 years, and DC is one of the worst places. I don’t know what the answer is, but doesn’t it seem it is not a ban?

    Maybe, the ban proponents think that the ban wasn’t successful in lowering gun violence because there were not bans in the rest of the country and therefore the guns found their way in. Who knows? I am ambivalent about it. I really haven’t thought about it a lot.

    I just seems wrong to me to ban them totally because it is part of our constituion, but in any case it is moot, because SCOTUS says

    NO Ban 4 U!

  8. Swannie, that was the point i was trying to make. I am not really pushing a position on 2nd ammendment here. What I was trying to show was another of Obama’s word clouds, and how him making very bizarre conflicting statements is making a lot of people nervous about where his real stance is on things.

  9. I can see the ads now = “I was for gun control before I was against it”
    (shaking head)
    again I ask, how can anyone take him seriously?

  10. i don’t believe one word out of his mouth anymore, so I can say liar pretty easily.

  11. WORM (What Obama Really Meant) — lmao !!!

    In reflection that’s exactly what his campaign says all the time.

  12. Great video!!
    “John”, you are a true American!! The sadness in his
    voice & on his face, “BROKE MY HEART”!!
    “I AGREE Gary C.H.” , I don’t understand a thing he’s saying. One things true,Obama can sat NOTHING better than most”!!
    **EVERYONE-MAKE-ROOM-UNDER-THE BUS”. Obama’s latest “staffer” that “BLEW-IT” on the DC
    gun-ban thing!!

  13. Does anyone know what’s going with Diane at HH? I saw in a post that she had some troubles.

  14. Mawminc,

    I agree with you about Obama talking from both sides of his mouth. It’s hard to know where he stands on anything.

  15. lol – so is official yet, there are more people under the bus than on it? lol

  16. Obama is widely credited with losing his race against Bobby Rush because he didn’t show up to vote on a gun bill.

    Obama paid a political price for missing an important vote on a crime package. That was during the 1999 Christmas holidays, as Obama — who describes himself as suffering from “chronic restlessness” — embarked on an ill-fated attempt to unseat Rep. Bobby Rush, a popular Chicago Democrat.

    When the legislature was called into special session to vote on gun control, Obama and his family were visiting his grandmother in Hawaii. His 18-month-old daughter, Malia, was sick and unable to fly. The measure was narrowly defeated, and Rush criticized him. Obama lost by 31 points, his only electoral defeat.

    “I take my legislative responsibilities extremely seriously,” Obama said after the measure fell five votes short. “In the midst of a congressional race, I’m well aware of the potential risk of missing a vote, even if that vote doesn’t wind up making the difference on a particular piece of legislation. But at some point, family has to come first.”

    Oh, and you’ll love this:

    Obama was a steady supporter of abortion rights, said Pam Sutherland, Planned Parenthood’s chief lobbyist in Springfield, although he caught flak from the political left in 2004 as he ran for the U.S. Senate.

    The reason was a series of votes on such issues as late-term abortion and parental notification when Obama voted “present” instead of yea or nay. He said he was not tacking toward the center, but an opponent in the Democratic primary sent mailers portraying a rubber duck and proclaiming, “He ducked!”

    Obama said his votes helped provide cover for other legislators. Sutherland said the votes were part of a strategy designed with Obama’s help to deny Republicans easy campaign sound bites.

    Designed with Obama’s help? A strategy that was designed with Obama’s help and allowed him to get out of voting on controversial issues was designed to help other candidates?

    Holy fucking mother of sweet potatos! How does any self-respecting journalist publish anything that insanely stupid?

  17. I don’t believe a word out of his mouth anymore either. I really wonder where he stands on any issues.

  18. mawminc, he presents so very smoothly and “loquaciously” that it allows the “listener” to hear what they want if they dont look too deeply . There is no substance there; which is why so many people call him an empty suit , or if you use another visual “wearing the emporers new clothes ”
    For instance this latest thing he has decided to support , the FAITH BASED INITIATIVE , which originally was shrubs way of blurring the lines between religion and government. At least for those of us a bit to the left that is how it appeared , and to those on the very far left government monetary support of any religion is disconcerting to say the least , no matter how secularly it is disguised . Well along comes mr talk out of both sides of my mouth at once while smiling and with those icy eyes in shocking support of it . ( remember the character wormtongue from The Lord of the Rings ) if examined closely the “faith based initiative ” would be a money funnel 500 million dollars worth ; directly from the govnerment to religious institutions deemed worhty . This is a far right position to be in ; from a consitutional point of view , but it allows money to go directly from government to religions . So if you have an agenda ;and you have a direction in which you want to funnel money ; it behooves you to double talk your way around it , and support what would other wise be an insupportable position . Talk out of both sides of his mouth indeed !

  19. Ah, that post title!!! masslib, where are you, fellow commiserating New England Patriots fan all through the season that almost was.

    Here in DC, I wonder what will change about the gun ban. I expect they’ll find a way bureaucratically to make it extremely difficult to legally own one.. Also, the trouble with the District is that plenty of illegal ones come in from Virginia primarily, it’s not all that far.. crime is up this year and the police chief briefly sectioned off and set up checkpoints around some of the worst hotspots.

    Can someone delete the Sinclair post?

  20. I don’t particularly care what anyone’s position is on guns (considering the frightening degree they are used in suicides, I’d rather have more restrictions instead of fewer), but for heaven’s sake just be consistent!

    This is what makes me crazy when it comes to Obama. He flips and flops around like a trout in the bottom of the boat and his media fanboys slurp up the “Position of the Moment” and absolutely ignore anything from before.

    I used to say on myDD that Obama is basically a Stalinist. The cult of personality and the ever-changing political position ruthlessly enforced by his violent cadre and co-opted media just makes me sick.

  21. Ha! I always get the urge to post “Zed” in a commentless post, ghost2. Carry over from my Plame-Libby Trial days over at FDL. Those were the days…we all knew who the bad guys were and they were always on the other side.

  22. Wow, great video, mawm. I like that guy too.

  23. In the Feb video Obama said he agreed with DC that they should take illegal handguns off the street. The ban wasn’t about illegal handguns – it was about all handguns.

    He spins and spins and spins and spins and spins. Who isn’t dizzy?

    And anyone who gets up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom and checks in with Riverdaughter has a major addiction problem!

  24. I agree with Florence.

  25. I own a gun. A .380 semi automatic handgun. As a single woman living alone for 8 years – pretty isolated in the country – it hung in a holster on my bedpost. I considered it a deterrent. If you point a gun at someone who’s broken in chances are they’ll turn and run. If they kept coming, then I wouldn’t have hesitated to use it. There was no waiting period when I bought it years ago, but there was a background check including a search for domestic violence charges.
    Right now, I live in a house with an alarm system so my gun is unloaded and put away. And there are no kids in the house. But it’s hard – if not impossible to keep guns away from criminals. I’m not willing to give mine up until they do!

  26. I have to admit that I was a gun owner once. Luckily I didn’t have to use it to protect myself but I didn’t really trust myself with it. I understand having a gun for protection especially in your situation. My sister lives in the country five miles from the nearest store yet her house has been burgled twice recently plus she has bears visiting.

    I live in SF and there is way too much gun violence here and honestly I don’t understand a need for an automatic weapon.

  27. From the original Saturday Night Live. There was a cigarette commercial for Lark cigarettes where they drove around asking folks to “show us your Larks”.

    SNL did the takeoff on that.. (very grainy; someone taped the TV showing the shtick)

  28. Guns don’t kill people, bullets do.

  29. Obama is looking for a running mate.

    Good luck, Barry, on finding someone who is qualified for the job who isn’t way more qualified than you are!
    Finding someone less qualified, on the other hand, will be impossible.


  30. How long can O continue to try being everything to everybody without imploding?

  31. While I’m not a fan of Obama, and have become less so with each passing moment that he acts more Republican, I don’t have a problem with the idea that gun experience in rural versus urban areas is quite different — because that’s reality.

    I think it’s why rural gun owners and urban gun banners don’t see eye-to-eye — they both have legit arguments based on life experience the other side hasn’t had.

    Gun violence in the cities will NOT be solved by more gun ownership, as some gun advocates like to think. Traditional rural gun ownership doesn’t lead to the kind of violence seen in urban areas, either.

    I’ve long thought that this was part of the reason why gun control debates go badly in this country, because there really are two very different constituencies with a lot at stake — on opposite sides!

  32. fredster that is so funny SNL I remember the cigarette commercials winston’s remember their’s:

    pardon my grammar but obama looks good like a candidate should…

    then the surgeon general warning:

    The Surgeon general reports this product is hazardous to your health. It kills brain cells. Women should avoid using this product whether pregnant or menopausal or not.

    morning gotta earn some cash to keep carol happy on july 4th


  33. Not too long ago, Obama, his surrogates, his supporters, and of course, the media, were saying that Hillary would say anything to get elected. They painted her as this power hungry bitch and nothing was off base in attacking her.

    Now that Obama is flip-flopping all over the place concerning those major issues he swore he stood for but has shown us what a consumate lier he really is since Hillary was cheated out of the nomination, by his constant changing of positions such as not taking private money because he didn’t want to be beholden to private entities (bullshit!); would vote against FISA (what a crock); was against NAFTA (never was); is following GWB by supporting faith-based initiatives (what a panderer) — and as a result his media enablers and his kool-aid drunk followers are making one lame excuse after another for him. It is sickening and it shows the double standard we were all screaming about when Hillary was in the race.

    This is the “hope and change” candidate we’ve been waiting for?

    The hypocrisy is breathtaking and I remember how the obama camp, the media, the bloggers, the pundits and his supporters attacked Hillary every for any perceived change in her positions or every misstep, it just makes me furious.

    I can only hope that those of us who see through this charleton remain united in stopping him from ever getting anywhere near the White House.

    One thing is for certain, it was Hillary who was the real candidate of “hope and change”.

  34. Mike H. What are you talking about. The right to own and keep a gun in your home. Or your Obama double talk.

  35. ??

    From reading everyone’s entries & going to the various link options; it seems ( HOPEFULLY ) Obama
    is “IMPLODING”!!
    GO PUMA!!

  37. Florence- I lived in DC for many years and agree with you about the ban. It is a great place to live, but it always bothered me that I was living in some sort of ‘protective custody’ of the Congress. All these Republicans are all for local control until the people are for something that they disagree with. DC tried for years to solve its crime, poverty and social justice issues only to be stopped by the men in the big house that ‘know’ better.

  38. Hi guys: posting this b-4 I go to work.. please

    1) Remember July 4th is “Financial Indepedence Day ” for Hillary, the quicker she pays off her debt, the less she has to campaign with him.. PLEASE donate, if you can $20.08 on July 4th, and see if you can recruit 2 more people to pay off the debt and contribute $20.08

    When donating, PLEASE PLEASE use the contribute link off of http://www.justsaynodeal.com , the link in on the main page, this way Hillary knows where the money is coming from..

    2)JustSayNoDeal now has a radio show as well, they will be airing 2 times a week, both being 1 hour shows, they are in the process of building it up and want to have names like Liberman and others on. PLEASE listen in. The next show is on Wendsday 7/2 at 7PM EST. Cynthia Ruccia of womenforfairpolitics will be on. Bookmark the site and check it out for the schedule of the shows.

    the site: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/NO-WE-WONT

  39. Can you asure us Hillary will stop campaigning for Obama, once her debt is payed.

  40. I believe he does not want to take a stance, because his big money people ie..Daley, Jackson etc are fighting gun control in Chicago, because there are shootings and deaths everyday in Chicago right in his neighborhood. A police officer was killed last night. There were 4 shootings last night alone in his neighborhood. He doesn’t want to piss on his money machines and short circuit them

  41. When I’m in NYC I never even consider getting a gun, but taking care of an ill elderly parent out here in Indiana, I am frightened of all of the wild animals running around this area these days. Though I’m still reluctant to even learn how to use a gun, I wonder if I would sleep better at night knowing that if some large animal somehow got inside the house I could protect myself and my family. Or if I would sleep worse knowing there is a loaded gun within my reach.

    As far as Obama is concerned, I think that it can be safely said that he doesn’t give a sh*t about any other human being but himself, so being honest is not part of his agenda. I believe that he is probably manipulated by the people who “own” him at the moment, and he has to manipulate everyone around him to get the results that he needs to get for those powerful, wealthy supporters who have been financing and managing everything for him right now. Their needs may change at any time and he may get that call from the upstairs office, so he has to keep himself open—which is not problem as he doesn’t seem to really believe in anything except a chameleon’s CHANGE. I imagine that life in that fast lane would be pretty much like life outside at night in Indiana—only the fittest survive. Or the sneakiest.

  42. Over here in Sweden you need a licence, like a driver’s licence, and a permit to own any firearm. You also need to state a reason for owning it and protection is NOT a good enough reason. Moreover you need a special hunting licence and membership on a hunting team to be allowed any hunting rifles. Plus there are very strict rules on how you are allowed to keep them. Locked up away from ammunition f.e.

    I just find it very hard to imagine myself a gun owner, thinking about fireing on someone for “protection”. Hunting is whole different matter.

  43. Let’s get real here. There are too many goddam guns floating around this country. When it’s common for little kids getting shot up, it is obvious that there are just too many guns! If Obama is for some gun restrictions, then that is one, and so far only one thing I see positive about him.

  44. Karolina – What wild animals do you have in Indiana? No sane animal will attack you at home but some might attack you in the wild if you appear threatening.

    As for Obama, I just cannot understand how people can support him. But I guess many decide on image and not issues.

  45. AA4Hill,

    No offense intended, but we don’t push rumors and smears here. There is absolutely no proof for the charges you posted about.

  46. Andre, that is fine. Obama can take that position. My problem is that he never sticks to any certain position. He changes all the time, somtimes in the same day (I’m thinking of his statements about Iran to the Montanans in the morning and Oregonians in the afternoon).

    Then, like in the first clip, he lies and says he had never expressed anything differently.

    So, at this point, Obama could tell me his positions and they could line up exactly with mine, and I would still tell him to F*** off, because I don’t believe anything he says.

  47. If Obama were trustworthy. If you count on him following through with what he says he will do, he could take a position that he resepected gun rights, but wanted to put reasonable restrictions on the aquisition and use of guns. If people could believe him, it might sway gun owners that he wasn’t interested in taking their guns away totally.

    However, if no one can trust what you say, they aren’t going to buy anything your selling, much less some nuanced compromise.

  48. Hillary-zilla: She will be less obligated to campaign with the fraud if her supporters pay of her vendor debt, which why donating thru the Justsaynodeal site will show her exactly where and who the donations are coming from.

  49. Washington D.C. said. You can’t own and keep a gun in your home. SC ruled. Yes, you can, it your right.

    D.C. went to far.

    Now, tell all about Lions, and tigers and bears, oh my.

    Guns on the street. etc, etc, etc.

  50. B,

    Why do you think there are no wild animals in Indiana? Depends on where you live, but most of Indiana is rural. Up in NH, I know people that have bears in their back yard every night. Not that I believe in shooting them.

    Why wouldn’t you use a gun to protect yourself or your family? Maybe I misunderstood, but do you mean if someone were trying to kill you, you wouldn’t shoot them?

    Anyway, I definitely think guns should be licensed. There are obviously way too many guns on the streets. A lot of big cities are like the wild west. In Boston last week, a baby girl was shot inside her home in her father’s arms by a stray bullet.

    On the other hand, I agree with the SCOTUS decision about militias. The second amendment is meant to protect the rights of ordinary citizens to have weapons available if they need them to form militias.

    Frankly, with the way Bush and now Obama have undermined our constitutional rights, I don’t want ordinary people to lose the right to protect their communities. I don’t want the government having all the weapons and the people being defenseless against an out-of-control government.

  51. ssmith

    People will be happy to know their donations will not be claimed by Obama, that was a big concern.

  52. B–in this area there are gangs of feisty racoons, independent venturing opposums, slithering snakes, hungry (and some nights howling) coyotes, and I saw a grey wolf (so beautiful) come out of the woods, look around and then go back in. And (yes) a cougar has been sighted 25 miles away from here. Whether I encounter an animal that is sane, rabid or not, is not a choice that I am allowed to make. I’m a city girl. I like having options, but among animals in the wild–I am not in control of their mind or health. Thanks for your comments, though.

    I personally believe, and I’ve said this here before, that the people that support Obama, do so for their own agendas, and with the thought that they can control him for their own purposes once he is given the presidency. That’s an insecure plan that has failed in former historic situations, because once someone reaches a position of power, they are not so easy to control. Hitler was put in place by bankers in order to allow him to destroy Russia. Well, he turned around and went after the West first, probably to protect himself.

  53. Everybody please take note. Obama always slips a strawman in all his arguements. He is for everything, and against everthing. He always has and out.

  54. The fake seal is under the bus, the campaign finance promise is under the bus, gay people are tossed out of the bus but not yet run over by it. Gun owners, hop on, and be sure to conceal that weapon. Child rapists, take a seat in the bus’s electric chair seats. While you are putting in your fare for the bus, be sure to contribute to a faith bases initiative. And oh, by the way, Obama also got a sweetheart deal on his mortgage: http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-loan2-2008jul02,0,7220594.story?track=ntothtml.

  55. Bostonboomer – I din’t say that, I just wondered what animals lived there since I am not familiar with US wildlife.

    If someone tried to kill me I think it is far more safe to try to run or hide while calling the police than having a gun in my hand. Actually, I doubt I’d be able to pull the trigger even if I did have one. Agree with the importance of a drafted army/militia instead of a standing one. Here people (so far only compulsory for the guys) have to do military service when they are around 18-19.

    Karolina – Since I’ve grown up in the countryside in the north of Sweden I am used to the idea of wild animals. I do know that American variety may be more dangerous but it is VERY unlikely that people get harmed by wild predators. You are more likely to get harmed by a falling tree (or a dog). Certainly learning a bit about how to handle a meeting is far more valuable than a gun. Remember, most animals are ten times more dangerous wounded and more afraid of you than you of them.

    If you meet a big animal talk softly to it while slowly backing away the same way you came. Never get between a mother and a cub. And if you walk through high grass, stomp your feet to scare away/warn the snakes.

    I agree with many people having their own agendas for voting Obama but it just depresses me to see celebs like Dylan supporting such a flawed candidate.

  56. Thanks, B.

  57. Hillaryzilla — have you ever lived in a rural area? Or a city? Or both?

    There’s a VERY different culture and experience of someone using a gun on a farm or in a rural town, hunting, scaring off coyotes, etc. — versus — living in a city with urban crime, gun violence, drive by shooting.

    When you experience the first, you have a very positive experience of the gun as a tool, and an essential one at that. When you experience the second, you don’t see guns as anything other than harmful weapons used by criminals.

    And you don’t need or use a gun in the city the same way you do in the country, you just don’t. That’s what makes this such a sticky and hot-button issue, and it’s why there are strong and legitimate emotions on both sides of this particular fight.

    So, while I think Obama is needlessly two-faced about many things, his comment about the difference between rural and urban gun views is accurate, in my opinion, so that is NOT something I would slam him about.

  58. Mike H,

    I don’t that argument, that someone in a rural area should be able to own a gun to protect themselves, but someone in an urban area can’t. If there is more crime in the city, shouldn’t people have a right to own and gun for protection from it?

    Also, even if I ceded to Obama that his urban/rural split is justified. Although, I’m still not sure that is what he was saying, isn’t it troubling that he is lying now, saying he never supported the ban in DC?

  59. I guess a lot of people do not see a gun as an effective means of protection. I think if one holds that view, it is very easy to say that there should be a ban in the city, since there are not a lot of wild animals there. Hunting is not allowed in the zoo.

    I have never owned one, but am thinking about getting one.

  60. Here we go again–the blatant double standard. Alrighty, then. I live in rural northeast Oregon. There is huge tradition of hunting–with hunting guns, not handguns. Before moving here 10 years ago, I lived in Los Angeles. You’d better believe I exercised my 2nd amendment right; as a single woman who’s been held up TWICE at gunpoint, there was no way I was going to live there unarmed. BO wants it both ways–appease gun owners and try for rural votes, but stick it to urban gun owners by saying, well, it’s up to the states if they want to control you. How much more Republican can you get?? We have PLENTY of laws about background checks and so on. The biggest source of illegal handguns? Criminals! So what are the rest of us supposed to do in the meantime? Be law abiding citizens whose local government has taken away our 2nd amendment rights while criminals have the run of the streets? And as for not needing a gun in the country, you have NO idea the havoc methamphetamine use is doing to rural areas. People feel the need for protection from criminal elements here just as much. Not just to “scare away coyotes”. I wish it were that simple.

  61. Thank you Toni4Hill for that poignant and sad story. I agree 100%! IF that criminal didn’t have that gun, your friends would still be alive today. I know that the NRA is working hard on the same ban in S.F. Everybody walking around with guns in their pockets – nice. What is wrong with our society?

    I agree, too, about not understanding the two Obamas in the video. That’s how people like him operate – they are double talkers; have an answer for everything and always have an agenda.

  62. I think that I agree with Irandese and Mawm. I feel that the 2nd Amendment should be upheld—but we and our government should work hard on raising the currently very low level of resonance (level of energy) in all other areas of our country’s citizen’s lives (education, health care, protection of all citizens and their civil rights, economy, strength of infrastructure, cultural developement, persistant striving for our own & world-wide peace & well-being, etc.) so the guns are not such a topic of interest, and crime is low-low down. Eventually.

    Simplistically, I sometimes think that Repubs want a wonderful life for themselves and their families and protection from the “bad guys”, and the true Dem’s job is to make sure that everyone’s life is as good as possible, so the whole community continuously evolves toward something ever better, with no one left behind.

    And all this WITHOUT faith-based initiative (gag).

  63. Mawm, I think it’s assumed–rightly or wrongly–that police, who are allowed to carry unconcealed weapons, are more readily available to help an urban citizen than a rural citizen. If you’re way out in the country, by the time the police arrived, the damage from criminal or animal would already have been done. Or so goes the thinking–and it’s probably correct (except, perhaps, to believe that the police will necessarily arrive in time to help if you live in an urban or suburban environment).

    Unfortunately, for many individuals, guns give a feeling of power to the powerless. Instead of feeling secure in their own skin, these people often need external sources of power to try and bolster their feelings of self-worth: guns, powerful cars, even (and, happily, less dangerously) a large, showy, expensive home. I’m sure there’s a longer list of these emotional crutches, but the point is that when you combine these feelings of personal inadequacy with a dangerous weapon, you end up with tragedies such as the shootings at Virginia Tech. That, to me, is the danger of allowing universal ownership of firearms. Even those of us who would never dream, ordinarily, of using a firearm on another human being, have our moments of supreme despair or foolish stupidity when we could be a danger to ourselves and others.

    These are the issues that I think Obama understands, as a city dweller surrounded by neighbors who live constantly with feelings of powerlessness, but will never be honest enough to address. It’s not bitterness, as he claims, but the need for all of us to feel empowered in our everyday lives so that we don’t need to rely on externals for feelings of power. Unfortunately, Obama’s idea of top-down government does exactly the opposite, although many Obots have convinced themselves that he is actually preaching the gospel of personal empowerment. What a mess!

    Personally, I believe in responsible gun ownership, although I’m opposed to individual ownership of any type of assault weapon. Of course, that doesn’t address Obama’s complete lack of conviction on any stance relating to gun ownership. I truly don’t know what any of his beliefs are. Maybe he doesn’t have any real beliefs and is just a nihilist. Difficult to say.

  64. greyslady, I lived in DC and when I was burgled it took the police 4 hours to arrive, but DC is the most corrupt, bakcward municipality on earth…..

  65. I think the crime in DC has less to do with whether or not people have access to guns, and everything to do with corruption.

  66. grayslady

    ” … the need for all of us to feel empowered in our everyday lives so that we don’t need to rely on externals for feelings of power.”


    “Unfortunately, Obama’s idea of top-down government does exactly the opposite, although many Obots have convinced themselves that he is actually preaching the gospel of personal empowerment. What a mess!”

    (sniffing, kleenex at the eyes)
    And exactly.

  67. grayslady,
    I see where you are coming from. Like I said in a comment above. I am ambivalent about this issue, so I am not trying to really push one side or the other.

    One thing I would object to in your comment is this. You said.

    That, to me, is the danger of allowing universal ownership of firearms. Even those of us who would never dream, ordinarily, of using a firearm on another human being, have our moments of supreme despair or foolish stupidity when we could be a danger to ourselves and others.

    I think this is a slippery slope, because if someone is feeling that way, extreme dispair, and they want to hurt someone. They don’t need a gun. They could us a car, or a knife. You may argue that the gun allows someone to inflict a lot more damage quickly than any other instrument, so it has a special status.

    But it seems unfair to keep law abiding citizens away from guns just because some people would misuse it.

    I don’t know. It is a complicated issue, and everytime I think I know how I really feel about it, another “Hey, but what if…” comes up, and I know that I am still ambivalent.

  68. GaryCH, I hear you. When my home was burglarized it took the police half an hour to arrive, at which point, even if the burglar had been on foot, he could have sauntered away. Four hours is simply heinous! Why must the nation’s capitol be so corrupt?

  69. Mawm, I totally agree with you. It is a slippery slope. All I’m saying is that even those of us who think we would only act rationally if we possessed a firearm have our moments of humanity, and those moments of humanity can lead to tragic consequences.

    Maybe I’m just worried about you having a gun in the house–even though I don’t know you personally, and it’s really none of my business. But you and Gary both seem like the best this country has to offer as citizens, so I’d like to think that each of you would always feel safe and protected without relying on firearms. Please forgive my impudence.

  70. I’ve always enjoyed watching people who defend my right to use my uterus intelligently suddenly say that I’m not smart enough to use a firearm.

    Just replace “gun” with “abortion” and you get the same arguments. “If it only prevents ONE TRAGEDY, then it’s worth it!”

    “Women are too nurturing and motherly to make a choice like that! I’m defending them against themselves!”

    “We don’t want to ban them entirely, just control them a little!” Just a little more, oh then just a little more …

    “Let me share with you a tragic story AGAINST guns/abortion that will completely overbalance your tragic story in favor.”

    And on and on it goes. Humans are funny.

  71. I tried to watch the video and it was gone. What happened?
    I have never had a gun in the house because I had 4 children. Also i was afraid that if attacked it could be taken away and used against me.
    That is my own belief and I do not question the right of law abiding citizens owning guns.



  72. helen, I can still see it. Try flushing your cache.

  73. “Just replace “gun” with “abortion” and you get the same arguments. “If it only prevents ONE TRAGEDY, then it’s worth it!””

    Thanks, Janis, for writing that. It was more succinct than I could have phrased it and I thought it deserved repeating.

  74. Toni4Hill,

    Did the NRA pull the trigger? Sounds like to me that you have a collective view of things, blame everyone else but the criminals. That gang banger did not get his gun from the local shop. Why dont you support disarming criminals instead of holding lawful gun owners responsible and taking their property away. Perhaps Toni you should leave the USA and find a nation with the kind of gun control laws you want. May I suggest Cuba, Belarus, China or Myanmar.

  75. I just don’t get the self-defense angle. Handguns are lethal weapons, designed to kill. If it was just about protection why not buy stun guns, pepper spray or any other non lethal means of defense?

    And even if you have a gun and is 100% ready to use it – how certain are you that your hands wont tremble and make you wound the attacker instead? An attacker who then is involved in a life or death struggle with you?

    Toni4Hill (as well as you others) is always welcome to move here to Sweden. No Nra AND universal healthcare. 😉


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