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This is how THEY do it.

First, let me apologize beforehand.  I am not trying to make this about me.  I posted the clip of my FOX interview on Sunday, and I am posting it again, but this time it is to demonstrate the tricks of the con men and women that are supporting Obama, and how they will do anything to get him elected.

Our first example of posers to principles is a group called, of all things, News Hounds.

This is the interview as posted by NoQuarter.  Nothing new if you’ve already seen it in the previous post.

This is the link to the News Hounds. I wonder if Ed Rendell’s Hounds have anything to do with it? I don’t have time to research it. I don’t care. Whosever hounds they are, they aren’t very good. They can’t smell the ironic position they are in. The entire site is devoted to being media watchdogs for Fox, yet instead of playing the interview in its entirety, they chopped out the first half, where I talk about the RBC decision.
They don’t even have the excuse of editing for time. The clip is only 3:32 long, but nothing can get in the way of their narrative.
They do not want to talk about the ugliness of RBC. They want to save all their hate for Fox. There can be no critique of Democrats at this point. Later we will hold their feet to the fire.

The next item is a little more ugly business. This article is about Murphy, and accuses her of really not supporting Clinton. As evidence of this. The reader is told that an elections contributions search on Murphy shows only one donation to McCain and none to Clinton. This fits the narrative of their story, that we are all a Republican front group, and Murphy has been lurking in the wings, ready to assume the role of the outraged Clinton supporter to lure others to vote for McCain.
This is so ridiculous, and is easily debunked by doing a search for one’s self. I went to:

Huffington Post’s Tool
I’m so sure Arrianna Huffington is misreporting campaign contributions to help Murphy seem like a real Clinton supporter.

This article just wants to focus on a donation to McCain in 2000, but never wants to show you her donation to Clinton in Q2 of this year.

What a farce. This is the change we have been waiting for? Ordinary little smear artists and propagandists: We can all be one now I guess.

However PUMAs, the noble cat does not feed on this trash. Perhaps an Opossum would eat it, if it wandered to the garbage can hungry enough.
No my Pride, we don’t do this. We are on the right moral side of this issue. We cannot resort to their habits. PUMAs feed on live meat, the Truth.

I’m sure there is going to be a lot of this, and I don’t know if it is worth showing all of it when one of the purposes of it is to confuse people and distract them from the main arguments, so here it is again for you.

On May 31st the DNC broke its own Sunshine rules and went behind closed doors to negotiate a deal where Obama got delegates that came from voters who had chosen Clinton.
We will not condone this act of Anti-Democracy by voting for the candidate you installed. If we do, we are saying we are giving up our right to credible elections.

Super Delegates, listen. Nominate the winner of the popular vote before September, or hear us…

ROAR in November!

135 Responses

  1. Cutting and pasting, trimming to fit has been a hallmark of the dirty dog tactics all along in this campaign – I have been calling some of our favorites in the media , “mongrels” for a while now 😉 –
    One of the most egregious in my mind , has been the use of the clip of Hillary saying that she thought the votes in Michigan wouldn’t count ; as proof that she knew that going in , but they have conveniently left off the end of that statement she made .. which is that she was leaving HERS ON so that the voters of Michigan knew she and the democratic party cared about the voters ! BIG difference . So I am not in the least surprised that hounds behave like ..well .. hounds

  2. More tricks….

    “Musings on Pollsters: Confessions of a Former Gallup Study Director…”


    As a former Gallup study director, I view the polling of Zogby and Gallup in non-technical terms…and recount some of my own experiences witnessing manipulation of data…

  3. Please go to these sites, and let them know whether or not you are Republicans. I have been talking to all of you for quite sometime, so I know you guys really well. But these people all want to believe that you are just a bunch of Republican dirty tricksters.

    Let them know the truth. The truth will set them free.

  4. Putting a call out for NH pumas. There is a reporter that wants to interview you.

    Just speak up in the comments.

  5. As I said in the previous thread, there is no solution now but to defeat these bastards soundly in November so that they won’t rear their ugly heads again.

  6. #
    mawminc, on July 1st, 2008 at 9:39 am Said:

    Let them know the truth. The truth will set them free.

    Not sure they care for truth so much — if they did they wouldn’t be where they are. We know what we are and we have to be resolute in what we do.

    Thanks, BTW for your NH trip. You both made us proud.

  7. Just wanted to thank you for all the reporting you have been doing.

  8. mawminc, I appreciate this truth-telling, sorting out the fresh from the spoiled, the PUMA meat from possum trash. You help keep the lines open.

    I wonder if too much is being made out of the RBC closed door meeting and taking away 4 Hillary votes. Yes, this was a scam and anti-democratic. However, I would like to see “the works” kept up front all the time — fraudulent caucuses; gaming the states (FL and MI, no; SC yes – large AfAm vote); double voting (caucus and states); closed door meeting against Charter-Bylaws; stolen votes; unearned attributed votes (MI). When the package is put together and kept together, I think it helps public understanding of the rage and dedicated action.

    Thanks for your great interview and public work for PUMAs and JustSayNoDeal.

  9. Excellent article Mawm, and a personal thank you for posting this.

    You really hit the nail on the head about our being on the side of right and freedom.

    You are also right that Sen Obama’s supporters will continue their ugly attacks — this is their standard operating procedure.

    Every woman who stands up to them, be prepared to be called a bitch, ugly, stupid, fat, and a c***t.

    Every man, be prepared to be called a woman, a f*g, and a wimp.

    And those are the NICE things they’ll say.

    They can only WISH that I’m a republican.

    Thank you again Mawm and everyone at the Confluence– we really ARE all in this together.

  10. Amanda Marcotte (from the Pandagon site) is a hypocrite and a liar. Remember when she got fired from the Edwards’ campaign?

    Among other things, Marcotte had written: “The Catholic church is not about to let something like compassion for girls get in the way of using the state as an instrument to force women to bear more tithing Catholics.” She also questioned, in explicit language, what would have happened if the Virgin Mary had taken the emergency contraceptive called Plan B.

    Last month, Marcotte wrote of the Duke University rape case: “Can’t a few white boys sexually assault a black woman anymore without people getting all wound up about it? So unfair.”

    Oh, and the irony…at the time she blamed her critics as being sexist:

    Amanda Marcotte, whose writings were assailed as anti-Catholic, wrote yesterday on her blog that the Edwards camp had accepted her resignation. She blamed her most vocal critic, Bill Donohoe, president of the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights, writing that he “and his calvacade of right wing shills don’t respect that a mere woman like me could be hired for my skills, and pretended that John Edwards had to be held accountable for some of my personal, non-mainstream views on religious influence on politics,”

    Please go ask her why it was ok to decry sexism when she was in the hotseat, but she is free to use the same tactics to smear others. what a tool

  11. They have just dreamed up a narrative ‘nothing to see here…’ to prevent non-blog folks that are pissed from joining PUMAs. They want them to believe this is a Republican trick so the every day folks will feel like they have to vote for the Dem.

    I voted Repulican in my first few elections. My parents voted Repulican and I didn’t realize until I was well in my 20’s that the Democrat’s message was a better fit for me. I think Murphy is my age and likely had the same revelation.

    I’d say that coming to terms with your own positions makes the RBC actions harder to take. For some of us, we weren’t born into Dem families and voted Dem our whole lives, we made a choice based on our values and against our families.

  12. Maum,

    Just so you know, News Hounds is a blog that has been in existence for years. They cover the doings of Fox News. I’m not defending the piece you linked to, which obviously is based on zero research into the puma phenomenon.

  13. bostonboomer,

    I didn’t know, but I really didn’t care from where the site originated. I just liked the fact that they were named Hounds.

    They’ve unleashed the Hounds!

    A PUMA can take several Hounds.

  14. Murphy,

    I’m so sorry you have had to deal with this ugliness. Any time you need back up, let us know. We are here for you!

  15. Maum,

    I totally agree. I just wanted you to know that the site is not linked to Gov. Rendell and his silly HOUND initiative. The good news is that we are getting so much publicity. People who identify with our message can see through the lies–especially if we keep hammering the message as you did in your post.

  16. ChumpedDemocrat,

    help put it into a short succinct paragraph. We need to package it so that people don’t get bogged down trying to understand it.

    You are right. There is more here than just RBC. It is just for me, there is no way they can credibly explain the RBC decision except that Obama bought off who he needed to to get the MI deal.

  17. Thanks BB, and JJMtacoma.
    I’m 39 —
    good lord, my parents would cry if someone called them republicans. In my neighborhood, that was a below-the-belt insult.

    Not that there’s anything wrong with being a republican! well, maybe a few things. . .


  18. On Amanda Marcotte:

    The Edwards controversy is only the tip of the iceberg. Recently Marcotte was involved in two other controversies in which she was accused of being sexist, racist, and a plagarist.

    First, Marcotte recently published a book which contains cartoon drawings that other feminist bloggers found both sexist and racist.


    Second, another blogger, a woman of color called brownfemipower accused Marcotte of stealing her ideas about sexual violence and immigration. Other feminist bloggers agreed with her charges and wrote about the controversy extensively. Marcotte has no room to talk about either racism or sexism.

    I know that SM and other Latino bloggers here know more about this than I do. I started researching the story based on comments from SM and others on the night we discovered Marcotte’s post on puma.

    I’m going to put up some more links in other comments to avoid the spam filter.

  19. One of the primary reasons for the failure of PB 1.0 is the acceptance that dishonesty and biased reporting were acceptable because they were “for the cause.”

    I mean, the GOP-controlled media are biased and dishonest, so we have to fight fire with fire, right? But then the bias and dishonesty were turned against other Democrats, and we see the results.

    Dishonest reporting is like being a little bit pregnant. You either are or you aren’t.

    Biased and dishonest reporting must be fought with truth, just like fire is best fought with water.

  20. David: I thought you did a fantastic job in that interview. I’ve been disappointed by the failure of the MSM to discuss what motivates many PUMAs–the RBC vote-stealing–and I was delighted to see that you focused on that. The MSM doesn’t want to talk about it but it is the KEY reason! I also loved that the stereotype of the bitter old hag HRC supporter is being laid to rest by all these smart, young, attractive spokespeople! Great job.

  21. Here is Amanda Marcotte’s wikipedia entry. It includes information about the Brownfemipower episode. I forgot to mention that Brownfemipower has closed her blog and her writings are no longer available to those who previously enjoyed them.

    Here is a post from Brownfemipower that either she or someone else rescued and posted on wordpress.


  22. On Brownfemipower: A couple of posts on the controversy involving Amanda Marcotte’s plagarism.



  23. amanda marcotte along with pam spaulding (she used to post at americablog, enough said) were snorting the cool aid before they even had a chance to put it in the water. They’re both local too…wonder if they’re part of the democrat/satanic cult in Durham I commented on yesterday (and in case any trolls don’t get it, that last sentence was snark)

  24. From NQ:

    H.O.U.N.D. =

    Hope Of Unity Now Dead

  25. Monty Python’s Flying Circus – “Oscar Wilde”
    [ from Monty Python’s Flying Circus, third season, first shown 18.01.1973 ]

    Ah, my congratulations, Wilde. Your play is a great success. The whole of London’s talking about you.
    Your highness, there is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about.

    Not to diminish the pathetic attacks by the Obama cultists, but the more they try to tear down and besmirch PUMAs, the more media attention PUMAs will get, and great PUMA spokespeople like mawm, and murphy, and Diane, and Will can get the word out about who PUMAs really are!

    And all of us PUMAs everywhere need to make sure we repeatedly bombard the MSM with thoughtful, direct, clear, calm, and rational reasons why we are PUMAs.

    The more crap the Obamabots throw out there shows a real fear on their part about the power the PUMAs have to change the direction of this election.

    Channel the anger into action! Don’t let the a##holes get you down! We are PUMA, people!!

  26. NO DEAL sent me this link: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/30/google-and-the-anti-obama-bloggers/. Apparently Obamabots have been going to Blogspot, identifying Hillary supporters or anti-Obama sites and saying they are spam. Then Google blocked the sites.

    I am also outraged that Obama says he won’t attack anyone’s patriotism and then has Wes Clark say John McCain’s being a POW for 5 years is basically irrelevant. Right. Courage and honor are useless virtues. I am not a Republican, but I admire anyone who endures that kind of suffering the way McCain did. It’s like when Obama gave Hillary the finger–it’s slippery and sleazy. You can’t call him on it, he thinks. I am disgusted.

  27. garychapelhill,

    Do you feel a need to attack every single blogger who isn’t affiliated with PUMA? Even those who have excellent feminist credentials such as Amanda and Pam?

  28. I missed that one birdgal but it is so on target;
    H. ope
    O. f
    U. nity
    N. ow
    D. ead

    And that’s easy to understand. PUMA is from the people. HOUND comes from a politician. One is a movement. The other is PR.

    That HOUND ain’t gonna hunt Ed. Not when the other choice is a proud feline with an attitude!

    PUMAs together make PUMA POWER
    PUMAcrats love their country, Obamacrats love Obama.

  29. bostonboomer, can I copy one of your comment and put into one of the propaganda sites?

  30. Ben,

    If they attack us with their propaganda. Absolutely yes!

    Did you go and look at their articles?

  31. Well, yeah, it’s reasonable enough to criticise their criticism.

    But to take the side of theocrats like Donohue is very reprehensible.

  32. Mawm, thank you for this great post. And thank you again for a PERFECT interview! We are really up against some dirty, dirty stuff, and must not only have courage ourselves, but provide cover and strength for young PUMAS that aren’t quite ready to face the bad world.
    I have a great introduction to PUMA–a one page succinct letter that summarizes the RBC thing very simply. It can be distributed as a flyer to reach out to anyone that has a Hillary sticker on their car. I’d love to show it to you guys.

    Is there a place where you can post resources like this for anyone to download? I’ve gotten REALLY great feedback on it.

  33. Ben, why can’t you learn to read? I did not criticize her for her position vis a vis donohue. I pointed out that she is a hypocrite for using the same tactics against murphy that they used against her (which she decried as sexist then) Now she says that Murphy is some right wing creation, not a real woman with a different opinion, and I find that quite sexist–forgive me if I laugh at her “credentials”….a hack is a hack. come back when you’ve brushed up on the reading comp skills.

  34. See “talking points that don’t revolve around someone named Murphy” at http://lynjaci.blogspot.com/2008/07/talking-points-that-dont-revolve-around.html

  35. I have to say, Murphy is obviously a past McCain supporter who switched to Hillary and then once HIllary dropped out McCain became the preferred candidate. It doesn’t make her a Republican, but it could make her a pretty solid McCain supporter.

    It’s a story that is very hard to dispute, given the hard evidence in OpenSecrets. However, it doesn’t mean every single PUMA is doing the same things for the same reasons.

    The goofballs would love it if we were all a buncha Republicans. ;-).

  36. What is going on in this country? Dissent is still part of my constitutional right, or was the last time I looked. Shutting down blogs, distorting statements, tampering with videos, threatening citizens. I never thought I would ever see this practiced within the USA.

    Hate to sound paranoid, but many of these tactics were what brought the nazis to power in the 30’s. Manipulating the public into believing what was printed and broadcast was one of the most elementary achievements in the rise to power.

    I hope I am wrong but this smacks to much of similarity.

  37. It’s a cycle of abuse. The bullies vs. the folks that have trained helplessness.

    and we PUMAS are breaking it. there is always hell to pay when you escape an abusive relationship. personal experience.

  38. Maum,

    You can put anything I’ve done into your post you want to. Post away!

    I also recommend that everyone go read the comments on that post of Marcotte’s wrote, “Pumas are Swiftboats.” The commenters there are the epitome of the faux intellectual elitist attitude that was reflected in Obama’s “bitter” remarks in SF during the PA primary.

  39. Ben,

    Saying that Marcotte and Spaulding drank the koolaid is not an attack in my book. If you think it’s an attack, please explain why.

  40. Pat Johnson,

    wait till you see the post gary is putting up at noon. You will see the effects of Obama campaign’s use of the race card everytime you criticize them.

    I believe this is a like a Kristal Nacht type time. I am not saying that we will soon be sent to camps, but there is definitely a fascist/authoritarion squah the dissent campaign going on.

    Very scary times for liberals.

  41. Murphi- your 39? you look much younger in the fox interview!

  42. Received this in my in box!

    If you’re interested in fighting back on behalf of Sen. Clinton, we’re
    sponsoring a public pressure campaign to get the Senate Commerce
    Committee to crack down on the media bias in the election. For info,
    a sample letter and contacts, here’s the page link.


  43. bostonboomer,

    exactly, a few of the posts were criticising grammar and spelling. I’m thinking, Could you possibly see the Forest less for the trees?

  44. It is scary how much they are like the freepers/bushie media that they once vowed to hold accountable!
    Including the kill the messenger tactics – the revealing of personal info on line – I distinctly remember freepers doing things like that to thoe waitresses who reported on the underage drinking of the W twins.
    I left the Dem party on May 31. Calling me Republican has little meaning to me at this point – yet another party that steals elections.
    We need to make our own media! (and seem to be on our way to do so)

  45. even more amusing is that they totally ignore Marcotte’s argument that we are republicans and start on the comparisons to the crazy 9/11 truthers. they can’t even keep the story straight.

  46. What really needs to be considered is that if Obama has not fully discredited FISA, then beware. What better excuse to quell dissent when you have names, addresses, links, to intimidate your opposition and what better excuse than “national security”.

    I may sound like I am coming from another planet but this is very disturbing that they would even go to the lengths of having like minded bloggers deleted from the net who oppose this candidacy.

    What happens after November 4th should he prevail? I shudder to think. Call me crazy, but I posted here months ago that I was sure the “fix” was in and was criticized for not being more positive. It looks like I was vindicated in the long run but these recent moves have me very concerned.

    I may just out and out vote for McCain because his supporters have not, to my knowledge, resorted to these dirty tricks. Obama scares me.

  47. edge—remember Malkin stalking the boy from the SCHIP commercials and giving out his family’s address…

  48. I am in moderation.

  49. Yeah, how original and classy of you to insult my reading skills gary.

  50. Mawm – WE WILL FIGHT ON – this makes us stronger. I’ll meander over there as soon as I catch up with stuff here.

    And Bostonboomer – Amanda Marcotte is a Feminist for Hire, she stole BrownFemiPower’s work and took it as her own thinking that she can get away with it. She didn’t think that a Hispanic chick had so many readers. Also, her defense of the racist imagery in her latest book is UNBELIEVABLE. This was back in February. How Pam Spaulding can defend her after this is beyond me. They are Obamabots after all, can’t see TRUTH if it hit them on the head.

  51. I want to highlight a couple of comments that were posted to the Marcotte piece, to demonstrate what I mean by this faux elite attitude. Interestingly, the same commenters obviously have only surface knowledge and understanding of politics and current events You can tell why they support a sociopathic con-man like Obama. They are attracted by the elitist attitude and don’t look any further at his policies and basic philosophy, which is very authoritarian and far from liberal.

    Here are a couple of examples from one of the most snotty of the commenters, Ms Kate:

    Interesting how they all hail from decaying, dying, depressed parts of the country.

    I’m hoping that the population of younger people swelling the west and northwest, the ones who will suck representatives from these places come the 2010 census, will massively outvote them.

    Ms Kate on 06/28 at 09:50 PM

    BTW [name deleted], Obama is more qualified in terms of actual length of public service than Governor Backwater Clenis was when he was inagurated.

    Both have fewer years playing tea party with wives of heads of state as a 3am emergency event.

    Ms Kate on 06/29 at 01:57 PM

    Here is what Ms Kate has to say about The Confluence:

    It isn’t from a paragraph … I know how to read, and I know how to use google and click links.

    It isn’t that paragraph … it is your WHOLE BLOG that reeks of narcissistic blather.

    Sorry, but it isn’t all about you … it is about the future of this country. Go ahead and hold your little pissing fit that you didn’t get your pony, just leave my kids and our collective future out of your silly little tantrum, ‘kay?

    Ms Kate on 06/29 at 11:59 PM

  52. well, if you are going to critique what I write, ben, I feel entitled to point out that you did not read it with the comprehension skills necessary to make said critique. I’m sorry if I hurt your feelings 😦

  53. Wouldn’t you just love to have Ms Kate as a neighbor or sitting on your local school board? She just cannot get over herself and her moral superiority. She is straight out of the school, “I’ve got mine and to hell with everybody else”. Another misguided elitist.

  54. Yeh,

    I like it that we are treated like crazy conspiracy theorists for pointing out (as someone said) what happened in “the light of day” at the RBC meeting.

    Last night, a fellow Clinton supporter (recently caved to unity) told me to my face that I was essentially a nutjob for being PUMA.

  55. Well if we are all nutjobs, there won’t be an asylum large enough to hold us.

  56. I am off to Target with my Hillary sticker still affixed to my bumper. It stays. I still have the right to announce my preference, at least for now.

  57. that’s just more psy-ops…nobody in their right mind wants to be “crazy” crowd. don’t let it get to you. the freepers have been doing it to us for years, but we know they’re crazy. it’s just odd coming from people we once considered allies, but they are just the same as the right wing loudmouths

  58. More from Ms. Kate. She is very judgemental of Midwestern and Appalacian areas of the US, isn’t she? I wonder if she thinks MA, NH, and RI are “rust belt” states too?

    By the time all you rust belt types finish finding ways to disenfranchise eachother over thickness of registration forms and ATM voting, you become even more irrelevant than you already are. Just wishing for a “Good Father” or “Good Mother” figure to make all your mob-dominated patriarchal anti-democratic institutions work again ain’t going to make it happen.

    I suppose that when Obama is elected, and you then lose even more representatives in the 2010 census because nobody else wants to live in your depressed shit-hole states, it will be his fault – and not yours for continually failing to see that the answer to “not working” is NEVER “more of the same”?

    Ms Kate on 06/30 at 09:05 AM

  59. I couldn’t care less what these clueless morons call me. I’ll wear their condescension as a badge of honor.

  60. BB: Is Tx rust belt because we can’t stand that mofo. At least, I can’t.

  61. bboomer, that sounds like a comment straight from freeperland. we don’t want to work? what??? Is she calling us welfare queens?

  62. bostonboomer,

    Wasn’t this about the same thing Obama was telling his San Fran donors about PA people, just with different words?

  63. GCH: I wear “crazy” like a badge of honor. Who can ignore crazy? It just made me the most popular girl at my school. Rather enjoyed that, I did.

  64. Hmmmm…this is interesting. Looks like Ms Kate actually lives in my area. The Somerville Theater? That’s the next town over from Cambridge, MA.

    SOROS! That must be the connection to the Freemasons!

    Funny, I didn’t see you outside the Somerville theater on friday night …l

    And I’m still not sure why all these Pouters Under McCain’s Ass showed up expecting to be catered to and wooed … this is PANDER GONE afterall!

    Ms Kate on 06/30 at 09:14 PM

  65. This article in today’s NYT helps to explain a lot of the Obama fans’ hypocrisy. I was unsurprised to read the ‘feminists’ on the site parroting right wing talking points and sexist jabs against Clinton, but be completely OK with Obama’s FISA capitulation, desire to *expand* Bush’s faith based programs, reneging on his pledge to accept public financing, and paying his female staff members less than his male staff members.

    Basically, it boils down to “If my side does it, no problem!”: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/01/science/01tier.html

  66. Not feeling that Unity Love from those commenters.

    As I’ve said before, although I am a 40-year Democrat, being called a Republican this year stings less than racist, dumb, and old.

    As for Ms Kate, nothing about her makes me want to reconsider. If she’s venting, fine. If she’s trying to persuade, she’s a failure.

  67. Maum,

    Exactly the point I made above @ 11:13AM.

    Sorry, for posting all this stuff, but I really want people to see what we are up against. These are Obama’s peeps. They are basically no-nothings with very high opinions of themselves, who just love to look down on other Americans.

  68. I won’t bore you guys with any more examples, and I see that Maum has been over there too. It would be wonderful to put some of these ugly comments into ads and run them in places like MI, Ohio, PA, and FL.

  69. regency,

    I’m not sure what the rust belt is. I’m guessing it is the states that depend on their manufacturing base (especially cars), like MI, OH, IN, etc.

  70. Gary,

    I think by “not working” she means that these states need to suck it up and realize that manufacturing “doesn’t work” anymore as an economic strategy. I guess that means she likes NAFTA? I don’t know, and Ms. Kate probably doesn’t know either. Her thinking process is pretty muddled.

  71. Here is a new video from the Pink PUMAs

    Please rate it.

  72. Do any of you recall when many people on the blogs complained about how the Democrats needed to learn how to phrase their messages to be short, to the point and expressive for the soundbites they were allowed before they were cut off. Personally I believe that is now true of the Pumas. You do need to get together and develop your message to succinctly express how the Democratic party, with the aid of the MSM Took Away our ability to nominate fairly and democratically the person we wanted, by structure of ROOLZ, invalidating votes of people of two key states, etc., etc. in other words, making it a selection, rather than an election by the people. Personally, I do not wish to support McCain and I noticed earlier on that some people were in support of Puma, but dropped out in view of that particular strategy. Surely, if you made it clear that voting for McCain was not the main priority for this organization, you would lose the Republican in Puma disguise description.

  73. The Rust Belt is also called the Manufacturing belt, and is located in the Northeast and along the eastern seaboard of the US. I think she was trying to say something about the midwest and south, and the accepted prejudice that it is filled with bible-thumping racists, but she apparently doesn’t have enough education to realize this. Color me unsurprised.

  74. “CB” thanks for the city edition link.
    I’m going to send them the letter I wrote to “B. Boxer, +
    all the members of the RBC/DNC committee “before”
    they threw the democratic party UNDER-THE-BUS!!**It would be great if others will as well.
    **The public needs to know “WE” have been saying this PROTEST for some time now!! It’s not sour-grapes!!
    Don’t forget the Senate Judiciary Committee run by Sen.A. Spector # 202-224-5225 , they are interested
    about the “un-democratic nominating process of the democratic party”.
    Go PUMA!!

  75. I wonder what folks who stay home, or otherwise refuse to vote for McCain (as a protest) will tell themselves if Obama is elected.

    If they don’t want to be responsible for the consequences of a McCain presidency, will they accept responsibility for an Obama presidency.

    I respect everyone’s decision but, we have a purpose here. That purpose is to not elect Obama. What is the best chance of doing that? I am an Independant Democrat and I don’t care how the Obamabots want to mischaracterize me. It is my responsibiltiy to work hard, within my ability and means, to fight this injustice and unDemocratic election. I don’t like to be melodramatic, but I sincerely believe that if we don’t take back our country from these elitists, if we don’t tell the MSM in no uncertain terms that their control is over, I believe we are in danger of an era of tyranny.

  76. NH,

    I think the individual strategy depends on what state you live in. Here in MA, if Obama and McCain are close, I may vote for McCain. But if Obama is losing MA, he will already be losing in a landslide. In a state where McCain is an easy winner, people can write in Hillary without helping BO. It’s only the swing states where people have to be really concerned about their votes.

    But I still haven’t given up on Hillary yet. I will make my personal decision in November, when I see how the polls are going here in MA.

  77. bostonboomer, no one should give up on Hillary. We are fighting for her even though she is unable to fight openly.

    Democracy must prevail. Superdelegates must choose the will of the people over Obama’s bribes.

  78. BB,

    I respect and understand what you are saying, but I think you take a great risk by basing your decision on polls. This primary season is evidence on how badly the pollsters have done, and how evident is the bias.

    I live in Florida which the polls say will go Repub, but I believe there will be a great deal of voter fraud come November. Any chance of an Obama win is unacceptable to me. Since I can only control my vote, I will vote McCain.

  79. BB, this one comment from Miss Kate tells us all we need to know about her:

    “Interesting how they all hail from decaying, dying, depressed parts of the country. ”

    No real Progressive, no true liberal, no decent human being would say anything like that. That’s the kind of comment that honest to God liberals used to excoriate Limbaugh and Glenn Beck for saying.

    Don’t know this female critter who calls herself Kate but I would advise you fellas not to patronize her corner. I’m sure whatever she’s selling is waaay overpriced and worn out.

  80. Ha ha. It appears Ms Kate comes from the same decaying state that I do. Massachusetts. LOL!

  81. NH,

    I feel the same way, but I don’t see the need to make my decision today. As I said, I am still rooting for Hillary. It’s not over till it’s over.

  82. I don’t care if I’m the last paranoid shrieking holdout. I’m not voting for Obama.

    If he wins anyway, I’ll work to defeat him in 2012.

  83. michael, whatever sweetie, how bout reading the posts where we address your tired talking points. nice subtle smear…but a bit amateurish..no run along

  84. I wrote the post you linked to above. I would like to respond to two things: (l) We are not associated with Ed Rendell in any way whatsoever, and (2) if you’d taken the time to read our Manifesto, you would have learned that our blog is devoted to monitoring Fox News, thus, yes, we “save our hate for Fox” (your words). And no, we “do not want to talk about the ugliness of the RBC,” again, because we limit our scope to critiquing Fox.

  85. Looks like today Lord kos himself has joined those of us who have a wee problem with issues…

    those high info types are suddenly discovering the man is not a progressive Democrat when it comes to actual positions, not mere hype and shame: its just not enough….

    and even witholding his mighty fundraising machinery…

    add the h to http

  86. myiq: I’m sure if he somehow wins this year, we will have LOTS of help to defeat him in 2012…

  87. NH

    I respect and understand all other decisions, but like you I feel strongly that to not vote, write in Hillary or 3rd party is to throw away the power of that vote.
    I live in New York, a place that is expected to go blue, yet I hear of so many Dems that are not happy with Obama as a nominee. Many will be voting McCain, and I am one of them. Like you I will take no chances. Harriet Christian is from New York and feels the same. In the interview that she did with Larry Johnson of NQ, she asked Larry who he was voting for- Larry said he was not voting for Obama but that the state he lives in will probably go blue so it didn’t matter- Harriet, being Harriet l pointed out to him that if everyone felt that way then they would be giving Obama a victory. Listen to the audio of the interview at NG – she was very good. I encourage everyone here to listen to it if they get a chance. Again, I respect all decisions. This is an individual choice everyone must make- but please if you truly do not want to see an Obama Presidency then the lesser of the two evils is to vote McCain, regardless of where you live.

  88. melanie, you weren’t critiquing fox, you were smearing John. give me a break. You implied he was a republican tool. You are as bad a propaganda hack as you try to make fox out to be. How’s it feel to be called out on YOUR bullshit???

  89. I can’t speak to John’s motives but knowing Fox as I do, there is no doubt in my mind that THEY were using him as a propaganda tool.

  90. no melanie, you’re the tool.

  91. there is no doubt in my mind that THEY were using him as a propaganda tool.

    how is what you did any different? In fact you are worse because at least fox didn’t censor him like you did. If you reallly believe your bullshit then I reallly feel sorry for you. I at least thought you were knowingly a propaganda agent for the Obama squad. We know that fox has an agenda, but guess what? so do we, and you take a megaphone where you can get it, especially when the rest of the media won’t do its job and actually report the news. why aren’t you after MSNBC? what about the obvious pro obama propaganda coming from them Give me a break. You are a tool, a liar, and a hack,

  92. I just asked a question on the previous post and would love to hear your response.

  93. Michael: I am welcome, perhaps you are not.

  94. I couldn’t agree with you more. The “news” in this country is well, it has been canceled. I think CNN, MSNBC, CBS – the whole lot – need to be monitored but we only have so much time so we limit ourselves to Fox.

  95. Propaganda tool = Anyone you disagree with?

  96. I give up.

    To the mod – thanks for posting my comments.

  97. you give up what melanie? you didn’t address ANY of my concerns. And I am the mod….I thought you might try to defend yourself….

  98. Melanie, you could easily have put up the 3.3 minutes interview, but you only wanted to show that parts that fit your narrative. You also said

    Throw a disgruntled Clinton supporter on and let them (no interruptions) bash Obama and rave about McCain.

    Since you edited the clip, and never mentioned this. No one knew that I was protesting the Unity rally. I wasn’t just someone they put up there on a whim.
    In fact, I organized the protest.

    What I think is alarming is that none of the other networks even acknowledged us. You would think CNN or MSNBC would at least do 20 seconds by saying, something as brief as “There were protesters”.
    But they didn’t. We were blacked out.

    You want to focus on FOX, but MSNBC and CNN are shilling for Obama. I think you must like it, because you support him. When is propaganda OK? WHen it suits your needs?

    Fox didn’t edit me. You did.

  99. michael, give it up, I know a concern troll when I see one. The answers to all of your questions are in numerous posts on this site, look them up yourself.

  100. Michael, read through previous posts here. Then come back and ask us.

  101. mawm, glad you showed up, i have to leave for a bit

  102. Mawm,
    As you invited comments from those on the PG site, you may be alarmed that any questions seem to be deleted at an alarming rate. You may want to speak to Mr. Hill regarding overzealous censorship, which seems to be a key concern of the PUMA movement. I am getting the impression that a civil, open exchange of ideas is unwelcome here, and would very much like to see that this is not the case.

  103. I am begining to wonder ——- We pay off Hillary’s debt. —- Will she still campaign for Obama.—Or what.

  104. I am not the mod here

  105. Michael, if the mods here are a little over zealous it is from 4 months of sexist, homophobic, and racist vitriol coming from Obama supporters. I do not trust anyone who has been online, reading, and like you guys “monitoring” the news, and hasn’t seen through Obama’s anti-democratic, divisive, and generally devoid of any real substance campaign.

    It should be so obvious to any thinking person that Obama is playing you.
    How do you feel about his various flip flops and positions these past two weeks
    Death Penalty
    Faith Based initiatives

    Come on this guy is running so fast to the right. McCain may actualy be the Democrat in this race.

  106. As I cannot find any references to the supreme court and do not even know what a concern troll is, please consider me very slow and take this as an opportunity to educate me. I don’t doubt you have ample reason for your beliefs and would like to understand them. Please refer me to a link that addresses this and I promise to stop bothering you. In the interim, I will google “concern troll” and hope that you can believe that I really would just like to understand the PUMA movement.

  107. My invite was to defend the little propaganda hit job you tried on Murphy in that post.

    Not to list for you all the reasons why an Obama presidency would spell the end to working class people having a voice in government anymore, or credible elections even.

    Defend your selective reporting of the facts.

  108. OK Michael, I will try to boil it down. Thank you for asking in a very respectful manner.

  109. Michael:

    PUMA means Party Unity My Ass. We believe that Barack Obama is unfit to be President and will not vote for him He is not only unqualified, his conduct during the campaign has disqualified him from the job. We also believe the process was corrupt and undemocratic.

    There you have it.

  110. Obama wins by pulling voter suppression, and voter fraud.
    Taking his name off the ballot in MI
    Blocking revotes
    Pulling massive voter fraud in the caucuses, and before you ask for the proof. It is coming out. There is a group making a film about what happened, and other groups compiling all the evidence. Most of the caucus results are really fictions.

    The DNC was been trying to derail Clinton since the beginning.
    Sitting on FL and MI, not being leaders in trying to work out a revote.
    Violating their own sunshine rules by negotiating in secret to give delegates to Obama from voters that went for Clinton.
    They had been grooming him since 2004.
    All of his initial campagin staff were former Dean people from 2004. Highly unethical for the DNC chairman to lend his staff to one candidate.

    Obama and his divisive techniques
    He has divided the party.
    He has divided us by race.
    He has divded young and old.
    He has divided working class people from the party that is supposed to represent them.

  111. Obama is a disaster. Plain and simple. Do you think he can unite the country if he is dividing the party? Just because we are not getting a lot of media attention, don’t underestimate how many of us there are.

    We just weren’t in the Obama plan. He was expecting us to just get over all the crap he pulled, but guess what? When we started trashing Democratic principles like the right to have your vote counted. I knew I had to work my heart out to defeat him. We need a party that will stand up to count the vote. I remember all my liberal friends saying that it was so unfair that the winner of the popular vote was not the president. It is sad to me that some of those same people are now arguing that not counting FL and MI was just fine and dandy, and that giving Obama delegates that went to Clinton is just great too. Why? Because they want Obama to win. That is not Democracy. That is a Bannana Republic. We cannot sit idle while our right to credible elections is taken away from us.

  112. Michael look at Gov. Ed Rendell has said about the primary process in the state of Pennsylvania. He admits it is totally unfair and has to be fixed.

  113. Wow. He asks for it, and I pour my heart out. Oh well. See you next time I link to one of your propaganda jobs.

    Oh by the way, the acronym WORM stands for

    W hat
    O bama
    R eally
    M eant

    Don’t be surprised if you find yourself having to WORM around a lot these days. It must take a lot of Kool-Aide to continue to support a guy so far removed from core Democratic principles.

    This faith-based crap is soooo transparent.

    He wants the Evangelicals.

    Go ahead and tell me why faithh-based government programs are such agreat idea. I didn’t know one Democrat who didn’t completely trash talk that crap when it was coming from Bush.

    You guys are the biggest Hypocrites.

  114. Blacks punishing legislators who supported Clinton

    In Georgia, Representative John Lewis, a prominent civil rights leader, is facing primary challenges from two black candidates who have been critical of him for backing Mrs. Clinton for months before shifting to Mr. Obama. To underscore the point, one of the challengers set up his headquarters in the same building that served as Mr. Obama’s office for the primary. Nearby, in Savannah, Representative John Barrow, who is white but represents a district that is largely black, is under attack from a challenger who says Mr. Barrow was also late to endorse Mr. Obama.

    New Yorker, Representative Gregory W. Meeks of Queens, faces a primary opponent who has sought to make an issue of Mr. Meeks’s support of the Clinton campaign in a district, New York’s 6th, where Mr. Obama drew nearly 56 percent of the vote.

    The man seeking Mr. Meeks’s seat is Ruben Wills, 36, a former chief of staff for State Senator Shirley L. Huntley and an organizer for Mr. Obama in southeast Queens. “I was on board with Obama from Day 1,” Mr. Wills said. “Meeks had to be dragged across the line.”

  115. Mawm:

    The whole Obama campaign is faith-based.

    “He is The One!”

  116. mawminc, on July 1st, 2008 at 3:56 pm Said:

    Melanie, you could easily have put up the 3.3 minutes interview, but you only wanted to show that parts that fit your narrative.

    That’s exactly right. I was posting about Fox News’ continuous use of ex-Clinton supporters to tout McCain. It is common practice all across the Internet to post portions of interviews or segments in order to make a point.

    And as for you being at the Unity rally, in fact, that information was included in my post.

    And I did tell readers that you were

  117. Thank you for proving me wrong in my initial belief that questions and dissent are not tolerated.
    I knew nothing about the propaganda hit job on Murphy other than what I had read in that post. I had never seen the PG website before today. I agree with you that there was selective reporting and was not impressed with how you were insulted rather than debated.
    The immediate deletion of my initial 3 or 4 questions really seemed to reinforce rather than discredit the belief that the PUMA movement is a Republican tactic. I left a post up at the PG site saying as much, which I will retract in their discussion.
    Your willingness to allow my questions and provide answers shows there is more to your movement than political trickery. Please consider how the vitriol that has been directed at you is not seen by an outsider, while the comments regarding Obama are when dealing with outsiders such as myself.
    I absolutely hated the stripping of Michigan and Florida’s votes. It was an absolutely idiotic decision. However, when I see such outrage over the allotment of those electoral votes, I have to question whether that same outrage was present before it caused a difference in the outcome. Did anyone demonstrate about this decision before then?
    I have to run but very much look forward to reading your comments later. I really want to see the movie you refer to earlier and want to know more about how you see a McCain presidency as being better. Thank you for allowing me the chance to talk with you, even though I still don’t know what a concern troll is.

  118. Sorry Melanie, I’m not buying what you are selling. You were trying to say that I was a poor schmuck who was being used.

    Did you ever think that I might be using FOX news to get my point across?

    When you edited out what I said about the RBC, you made the rest of my remarks out of the context.

    You can try to defend what you did, but stop calling yourself a media watchdog, or newshound, or whatever. You are an anti-FOX propagandist.

  119. Michael, yes it absolutely was there before May 31st. It was there for a lot of us when we watched the results from FL and MI, and were told they wouldn’t count.

    Most of us were not demostrating or protesting loudly about it during the primary, because we all assumed(wronly) that there would be a resoultion to it like revotes or just seating them as is.

    Obama blocked revotes, and that is when my heart really hardened to him. I cannot stand what the REpublicans do to our elections, and I see Obama doing the same thing to the Democrats. Taking your name off the ballot is a very anti-democratic thing to do. That is the reason it is illegal in many states, and why he couldn’t do it in FL.

    Credible elections is the only thing that separates us from all the Bannana republics out there. After FL 2000, OH 2004, now, when do we start to get angry and do something about it? If our vote doesn’t count we can have all our rights taken away. TO me voting rights are more important thatn anything else. That inlcudes RoeVWade.

  120. Mawm,

    Breathtaking summary! I’m off here for the eve..back late. My patriotic blood is boiling again, but there is (another word besdies “hope”?) on the horizon.

    Bye for now, Patriots.

  121. Worst typist on the Confluence–evah.

  122. Michael, thank you for your calm words. If I get really riled up, I am sorry. I am very passionate about this. I am an ordinary person. I was not even bloggin until late April, only reading blogs. Now I have been turned into a full fledged Activist. I will no longer sit and watch the TV while my country is being dismantled piece by piece, and I am certainly not going to sit idly by while it is done by a Democrat.

    Clinton won the election, but Superdelegates decided to go with the guy with the deepest pockets. That will not stand with me. This goes all the way to Denver, and if Obama is still the nominee in Sept. It is McCain all the way. I want divided government, if Clinton isn’t the nominee. THe excesses of the Bush years, in my opinion, were due in large part to Republicans controlling both the house and senate. I see the same danger with an Obama presidency. RUbber stamping legislation, but also no oversite.
    One thing I know, if there is a Clinton in the White house, you will start seeing the media doing its job again. They will want to find everything out on them. Good. That is the way things should operate.

  123. This is what I got yesterday, when I posted at a similar site telling them we were not Republicans”

    I am sorry that you feel that way.
    I am NOT trying to spread any form of propaganda. PUMA is the true propagandist here.
    I have to tell that PUMA was no grassroots movement. PUMA was founded and aided by Republicans to ensure a John McCain defeat. Look over at
    I am not trying to stop anyone from voting however they like. This petition is simply there for those who understand and acknowledge that the FOUNDERS of PUMA are GOP attack dogs. I dont mean to be offensive to anyone about anything, but I cannot allow another 4 years of failed George Bush policy. I will continue to debunk PUMA. I also have to point out that my petition and site can’t be all that ridiculous when they have been linked by the DNC, PAdems, NOQuarter, etc…

    I am sorry that you feel this way. I hope you find reason.


  124. RD and mawminc, I would like to cross post on The Confluence a blog post I wrote on Darragh Murphy. I interviewed her via email on Sunday about the Republican smears. It’s now up at MyDD. Please consider.

    PUMA Pac Founder, Murphy, “NOT a Republican”

  125. Kim, they cannot possibly imagine we are real Dems. I have been talking to you all since April. I know you are Dems. If you were Repubs, I would think you were really insane for having been on this blog so long.

    PUMA just had its month long birthday. It was birthed here. If anyone doesn’t know about the birth of PUMA. There was a blog post about it yesterday.

    That is how PUMA was born. No one is an operative. And they say we are the ones with the conspiracy theories!

  126. grlpatriot, I let RD know, if she hasn’t seen your comment.

  127. Backstabbers! We Will Remember in November Video!

  128. Thanks mawm.

  129. Have any of you been reading one of your blogroll member’s blog, Heidi Li’s Potpourri. They have helped found The Denver Group and they intend to try to get to the bottom of getting Hillary on the ballot and some of her proponents placed on the list of speakers at the convention to speak for her. Anyway, read it, because this sounds like some people that may have some experience to get something done. This is probably is not new to most of you, but it sure lifts my spirits.

  130. PUMA is a recourse for those of us who know that both Republicans and Democrats have contempt for voters and taxpayers. The Democrats were just much more blatant about that during this primary.

    PUMA is an idea long overdue and a logical development of a party that is supposed to be Democratic, but has fallen victim to its own hypocrisy. It is significant that Rendell didn’t address the unfairness of the primary until he was “inspired” to do so by PUMA. While the primary was the immediate catalyst, I think PUMA has been fomenting in the US since the hanging chad debacle in FL’s presidential contest.

    PUMA was set up to advocate for voters since the political regime of both parties seems to be blind, deaf, and very, very unethical.

  131. I have so little time to read and post now – RD is my first stop every evening – wonderful posts by all. I can remember when RD was new, then BB, Katie Bird, Gary and Mawm – I can’t list you all, but a HUGE thank you from me since I have little time to read now.

    Txindy – you succintly said PUMA should get their talking points down – I agree wholeheartedly. Heidi Li has wonderful ideas and great ACTION which is what I seek now. The Denver Group is one I support as well as getting Hillary’s campaign debt paid out.

    This is just a big Thank You from someone who is so interested and wants to get my country back and knows and has known how deficient BO is – I too still hope for Hillary. If she is not given what she is due, I will wait to see how to make my vote count against BO the most.

    Pat Johnson above referenced the BO ‘moment’ comparable to nazis – so true. Even down to der leder Axilrod – dye his mustace black like he does his eye brows and you get an image of his soulas in Adolf. The behavior of the BO fans completes that picture – hate, ugliness – their superior attitudes smacks of “elitist’ but that is such a misnomer because they are the opposite of The Very Best. An elitist in my view would be the best person – Not who has the most $$$. So, like some many labels we are hearing spewed, this one should be ignored or changed to hucksters – frauds. BO is a grotesque presidential candidate – completely inadequate.

    Gary and Mawm – you guys are really doing a great job!

  132. RD, it can’t be said enough times:

    It is not Hillary’s responsibility to unite the Democrats.


  133. You know, the Green Party is an option in this presidental election cycle too. McCain is not the only non-Obama choice of action.

  134. For those who wish to stay together in a long term commitment to the ideals and rinciples that Hillary Clinton has spent a lifetime promoting, http://Together4Us.com offers access for activists, funders, students, policy-makers and ordinary people to come together in support of each other and their goals for America. Please come to our website and join, use the code below to put our linked logo on your website and distribute our message and this code to all your network. Spread the word. We will be happy to put up a reciprocal link, your own co-branded web page on our site, or your own blog.

    Thanks so much,
    Gretchen Glasscock,

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