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Wednesday: Tell me sweet little lies

learAnglachel and Bob Somerby are channeling Shakespeare. The extended metaphor involves King Lear, Goneril and Regan, and Cordelia. (What kind of parent names their daughter Goneril?? No wonder she had a score to settle.)

For those of you unfamiliar with the play, King Lear, is a self-absorbed, vain man and a bit of a control freak. He challenges his daughters to a “love test” where they are to flatter him with speeches about their devotion and he tells them he will divide his kingdom according to who loves him best. Goneril and Regan outdo themselves in hyperbole. But Cordelia, Lear’s favorite, simply tells her father the truth and doesn’t embellish. She doesn’t think you can just talk about love but you must demonstrate it. And enraged Lear disowns Cordelia on the spot and divides the kingdom between her two sisters. The rest of the play is full of plot twists and double crossing and lots of pathos and death and eventually sophrosyne when it’s too late.

So, anyway, that’s the background for Anglachel’s and Somerby’s commentary. Now, how does it apply to our present situation. Well, Anglachel and Somerby touch on one aspect of the primary season related to the promise to accept public financing but there is another aspect as well and I’ll get to that in a moment. It turns out that last year, several of our fine Democratic candidates took the pledge to accept public financing for the General Election but Hillary did not. Yes, the others prostrated themselves before the press, outdoing each other to prove they were more incorruptable, less lobbyist toe-sucking, more devoted to the purity of the voting public than the other guy. Cordelia, er, Hillary, perhaps knowing how expensive a presidential election could be, just said no. Lear, er, the media, was livid. She was completely diss(own)ed. Well, they would have eventually found a reason to hate, hate, HATE her, but I digress.

So, what happened last week? Barack Obama, that paragon of virtue (oh, *please!*), decides to opt out of public financing. He says he never *really* made a promise and a committment to it anyway. He just said he would support the idea of public financing. It’s like “Blessed are the Cheesemakers”, it’s not to be taken literally. Now, the media and the Obamasphere are shocked, SHOCKED that he would renege on his promise. To be fair, there are a certain number of cynical or completely deluded Obamaphiles who will forgive anything he does. But, then, he also backtracked on FISA as well.

And this where I extend the metaphor a little bit further. Because I remember my days at the Big Orange Cheeto before it became the sludgy birthplace of future spam filter inhabitants when the Kossacks glommed onto whoever would tell them what they wanted to hear. In fact, I remember comment threads where I argued with people about how Edwards wasn’t all he was cracked up to be. He sounded so truthful in thought, word and deed and would NEVER take a dime from a lobbyist, er, federal lobbyist, to be precise. It seems that he never officially disavowed state lobbyists. And he would have NEVER voted for the Kyl-Lieberman amendment. And he was completely immune from the corrupting effects of those mean, nasty, greedy corporations and big pharma people who didn’t deserve to live. He would just stop his ears. And why could we be sure he was the boy scout he said he was? Because he *said* so and by golly, that was good enough for most Kossacks. I think it might have been one of the frontpagers even said quite honestly, “He tells me what I want to hear.”

Someday, I would thunder, Edwards and Obama are going to take it all back. They HAVE to take it all back because in order to win, they can not continue to pander to the purity police on the left. They will have to tack right in order to appeal to conservatives and Republicans and swing voters who they will need to win in November. And no sooner does Obama snag the nomination (or so he thinks) than he immediately backtracks on FISA and sells out our civil liberties. He has to do this to prop up his non-existent national security creds. We would have been better off voting for that toothless Kyl-Lieberman amendment that was all symbolism and did not harm any constitutional amendments in the drafting of its legislation. THAT kinda made sense. Did you or did you not approve of state sponsors of terrorism? Hillary voted that having Iran funding Hezbollah was a not such a cool and groovy thing and we should be on record as opposing it. Where was Barack? Conveeeniently AWOL that day.

Here was the bottom line and I never could get the Kossacks to see it: Edwards and Obama knew what sweet little lies to tell them. They told the future Obamaphiles exactly what they wanted to hear. Oh, sure, the Big Orange Cheeto was being infiltrated by clever Axlerod and Trippi trained moles who knew all of the Pavlovian trigger words that would get the Kossacks salivating on command. But instead of being on their guard, the Kossacks and others ate it up. Why? Vanity, I think. They liked the flattery of having the presidential candidates showing up at their YearlyKos forum. They liked the idea that they had something to do with winning the 2006 elections for the House and Senate. They saw 2008 as their moment to purge the government of the corrupt and vile influences of corporations and insider politicians. They were going to be a political version of the Essenes and become more pure than pure. Cleaner than clean. Stronger than dirt. (Those of you who just caught that last reference have instantly aged yourselves)

But Hillary wouldn’t pander. She never courted the Kossacks or the Obamasphere in general. She was roudly booed at the YearlyKos 2007 presidential forum. I know because I was there. It was disgraceful. She was just getting the hang of facing really tough crowds and I could see her physically withdrawing a bit in her chair. “Oooo”, I thought, “She’d better learn to stiffen her spine.” And she did. I never saw a hint of that in her again.

Anyway, as time went on, I started to realize that she wasn’t avoiding the blogosphere to snub us, though there might have been some misunderstanding at first as to how important the online cauldron was for message origination and for this I blame Mark Penn. No, what I saw was a person who seem to know where she stood and didn’t feel the need to flatter any particular group. As Wes Clark once said, action follows from principle and that is what I saw in Hillary. She was grounded, she knew her policy landscape and she had a set of guiding principles. She presented them to you and asked her to join her. She didn’t tell sweet little lies that she was going to have to backtrack on later. She was attractive to both left and right and felt no need to pander. That infuriated the blogosphere and they disowned her. How many times have we heard them question whether she was a true Democrat?

As Anglachel sums it up so well:

One of my favorite essays ever is Stanley Cavell’s magnificent work on King Lear, “The Avoidance of Love”. In it, one of his themes was that love, and those virtues that are related to love, such as honor, responsibility, respect, loyalty and honesty, are not things that can be claimed or spoken. They must be demonstrated. They are, to grab some graduate school lingo, performatives, made actual in the doing, and they bear a difficult relationship to language because they are difficult to represent in that way. Declarations of these virtues, most of which either are also political virtues or else have a political correlate, stand in tension with the actions of the one who declares – the act of declaration is an invitation to judge.

Cordelia’s love was ordinary, quiet and steady. It did not change to suit the situation, even as she could see the fate that might befall her unless she submitted to her father’s imperious demands. Lear was not the only person in the room passing judgment.

As for the play, well, it was a tragedy.

I think it needs a rewrite, PUMAs.

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169 Responses

  1. I was never a regular visitor to the Great Orange Cheeto, but Balloon Juice seems to be a microcosm of the place.

    I’ve been lurking there the last few days and it’s amusing to see their mental contortions to rationalize what The Precious is doing.

    My favorite is the argument that Opossum can’t stop the FISA sell-out so he needs to go along with it to preserve his national security cred and to avoid alienating the Dem leadership.

    I pointed out that those same arguments work for Hillary’s vote on the AUMF, which, unlike FISA, was popular with voters at the time.

    I don’t think any heads actually exploded, but it was close.

  2. myiq: I think you’re on to something there.

  3. “GREAT POST”!
    I really like the “Stiff Spine” reference. I got a tee shirt
    with that theme in NC. I treasure it!
    Well “PUMA PAC” , Ms. Murphy represented “us” well !
    Thanks to ALL of THEM who have put themselves out there for “our” cause!!
    Well I donated to HRC to retire her debit!
    Hopefully she will not need his $$$
    The Goal is she’ll be , “Financially Independent by Independence Day”!!

  4. According to Glenzilla, Opossum may be spared from having to choose between donors and voters (“My ducats! My daughter!” ) on FISA, at least until next month.

  5. Thought provoking post. Love the word sophrosyne! And this is the first time in a long time I have seen anyone bring up the idea that love is action, not words. My parents were born in 1910 and as far as I can remember never said they loved me. It never occured to me to feel bad about this since they proved everyday that they did. It was bad form to be too effusive.

    I have been complaining for some time now that our society has become focused on words and symbols, not the underlying deeds, facts, etc. This happens at both a personal and societal level. Just look at how we are enamored of the grand gestures – the fancy proposals, weddings, etc. No wonder we are now willing to elect men who just pretend to certain beliefs and qualities. The media gleefully goes along with these phoney images if it fits their biases. (Bush only bought his ranch after he decided to run for president, but I know people who thought he really was a rancher! And don’t get me started on Saint Barack, the new kind of politician.)

    What all this indicates is that we no longer function cognitively at a mature level. Magical thinking is a hallmark of the thinking of young children., which should be replaced in early years by the ability to reason objectively. Children believe that symbols are the same thing as their referent. (For example, most believe that the name of an object cannot be changed. They also believe that wishing will make things happen.)
    It is frightening to see the extent to which this low level style of thinking now pervades our culture. We have been advertised and entertained into infantilization.

  6. Good Morning, Riverdaughter & myiq!

    I don’t think anything could be more perfect than reading Anglachel (and following her to Somerby’s post) while I wait for you morning essay. AND THEN finding that you’ve written about those very posts!

    It’s like we’re all sitting around the breakfast table together. But, you are the ones who don’t need 2 cups of coffee to be presentable.

    These posts are the first to actually make some sense out of this bizarre election: This election season has been as relentless as a Shakespearean tragedy.

  7. Typo alert!

    Yes, the others prostrated themselves before the press, outdoing each other to prove they were more incorruptable, less lobbyist toe-sucking, more devoted to the purity of the voting public than the other guy.

    Didn’t you mean “incorruptible”?

    Speaking of mental contortion, here is what TM wrote about Obama throwing American Muslims under the bus and their reaction thereof:

    One news item is that Rep. Ellison, an Obama supporter who happens to be Muslim, ran into a bit of a road block when trying to help out presidential nominee Senator Barack Obama. The fact is that Obama courting evangelicals is advantageous to the candidate. But when a Muslim legislator wanted to stand up for Obama that wasn’t seen as a plus. Religion is the problem for politicians, but Obama wants to poach evangelicals from McCain so he’s happy to wade into those waters. However, with the underground smears about Obama being a secret Muslim, the campaign is understandably concerned about the political punch a photograph without explanation can be if circulated. We all know how this works. Obama’s decision to court one religious group, while having an image problem due to propaganda with another is not an easy thing to navigate. We all know that America has an anti Muslim prejudice since 9/11. In politics this is worse. John McCain having a Muslim representative speak on his behalf wouldn’t be a problem. Obama is in a different position due to the smears already circulated. We shouldn’t pretend otherwise. Moral of this political story: religion and politics can set off fireworks. Nobody’s listening.

    I probably haven’t had enough caffeine. Can somebody explain to me very slowly what she’s saying here?

  8. What a great post.

    Great way to start the day.

    PUMA

  9. I’m on my fourth or fifth cup.

    Around 3am I decided if i can’t sleep I might as well wake up (it’s 515am hereabouts)

  10. (nodding) Bernie — your’s is a very good comment. I’m glad it’s up at the top…

  11. RD and katiebird:

    Since you’re here, what’s the rule about guest posting here?

    Who do I have to kill/marry/bribe?

  12. She had to be honest because she knew the hysteria would call her out on the tiniest misstep (i.e. she couldn’t afford to lie–even if she wanted to).

    When you give anyone a blank check, especially an unprincipled opportunist like Obama, you all but demand them to exploit you.

    Great post, RD.

  13. I realize I am a bit late on this story, but I am abroad and haven’t been following stories very regularly. But, I was reading the NYTimes (my first visit to the NYTimes in months) story about Clinton returning to the senate to cheers, and this stuck out:

    Others described Mrs. Clinton’s luncheon manner as characteristically “workmanlike.” She smiled and dutifully dispensed handshakes, air kisses and “good to see yooos” to former supporters and nonsupporters alike. “I got a handshake,” reported Senator Claire McCaskill of Missouri, a supporter of Mr. Obama, after the lunch. “No hug, no air kiss.”

    Mrs. McCaskill also said that in brief remarks, Mrs. Clinton voiced her full commitment to Mr. Obama’s campaign — in recounting this, Mrs. McCaskill feigned relief by pretending to wipe sweat from her forehead.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/25/us/politics/25scene.html?_r=1&ref=politics&oref=slogin

    She didn’t get a hug or kiss? She had to pretend wipe sweat from her forhead??? SERIOUSLY???

    YUCK. Reason one million why I cannot stand McCaskill.

  14. Ah, yes. Finally I understand the Shakespearean nature of this election cycle.

    My 82 year old Mom thinks Obama is a Shakespearean charactere, but I can’t remember which one. Richard II?

  15. Anglachel’s post doesn’t got to anglachel.

  16. Opossum. I like that.

    O/T: Is anyone going to do a post on how strange all these polls are? Barack has been seen as the nominee for months now, basically since February and he has been absolutely struggling in swing states. And yet we’re supposed to believe all of a sudden he’s got this big bounce nation wide and is beating McCain in all those crucial states? Something seems off but I don’t know what.

  17. The link, I mean.

    *sigh* I hven’t slept since last night.

  18. The media gives us the polls they want us to see.

    The theme this week is that the Dems are coming around, so the polls show that.

  19. plural:

    The OFB are claiming we don’t exist (other than as a GOP ratfucking operation) and that all Democrats are now supporting Opossum.

    It feels weird being imaginary.

  20. myiq2xu: check your email in the address that you provided in your comment.

  21. Plural: I know. We’ve all seen how wrong they’ve been these past few months during the primaries, but perception becomes reality and Clinton is a much better candidate than McCain, especially on the economy which was her trump card against Obama, the misogyny, and the media.

    I didn’t know how much I would dread an Obama presidency until I saw those polls. I fear for our country, I really do. We’re teetering on the edge here and the least worst option seems to be a divided government with McCain. I don’t see a Democratic Congress opposing Obama at all, no matter how awful his policies are.

  22. Claire should be glad she didn’t get spit in her eye and a wedgie.

  23. I don’t need to know what McCaskill thinks about anything.

    And I’m used to not existing — I’ve been an enthusiastic Clinton supporter for sixteen years 🙂

  24. If I was Hillary I would’ve gone after that *(* (&+, McCaskill with a stilletto.

  25. RD, do you really mean to say that the Kossacks were Hillary’s first tough crowd? Heck, she was first lady of Arkansas for 12 years, she traveled the world as first lady of the US, and she won over upstate NY running for Senator.

    Surely she was just thinking, “OK be that way. I can be tough too.”

  26. Davidson, it’s all in the way the questions are formed and the order and how far people have come on the journey to “not vote for the Democratic nominee” in a year when they planned to do that.

    Remember that a year ago most of us (probably) thought that Obama was qualifed to be on that stage?

    A lot of people have barely begun to think about the election. Wouldn’t most of them assume the Democrats were nominating someone with basic job experience (at least?)

  27. RD:

    Claire had nothing to worry about, Hillary isn’t like that. (most lady-PUMA’s OTOH . . .)

    That’s what’s so funny about stories like “Hillary’s enemies list” – the Clinton’s have no history of acting like that.

    The whole meme comes from the fact that they hired private investigators to prove that many of their accusers (Paula Jones, Kathleen Willey) were liars.

  28. Plural, I believe she was thinking, “I can have my secret service detail kill all of you and there would be no witness.”

  29. plural, I think it’s very possible that she’d never seen such a tough – openly rude – crowd. I don’t remember ever seeing behavior like the Kossacks display before last year.

    Even the 2004 election wasn’t that bad.

  30. Is PUMA PAC murphy’s organization? I’m getting confused by all the groups….

  31. riverdaughter–

    This is a bit of a tangent, but I’m glad to hear that you were highly critical of Edwards’ candidacy. I always feel lonely because so many people are so respectful of him. I give him credit for bringing up poverty and working-class related issues–he did a great deal to help the debate on health care in the campaign–but I always saw it as a rather cynical positioning strategy. Edwards is as much a fast-track artist as Obama, though he’s slightly more tolerable for having been a person of real accomplishment before he got into politics. His only goal in public life was to get up the ladder as quickly as possible, actual achievements be damned. After getting elected to the Senate in 1998, he immediately began pushing himself as the Vice-Presidential candidate for 2000, and when that didn’t work out, he immediately began work on a Presidential run in 2004. (As we all know, he got the Veep slot that year.) He would not have been reelected to the Senate in 2004 had he run. Even if the GOP hadn’t swept in, he’d have been deservedly picked apart by his opponent for poor attendance and lack of constituent service. If I were a North Carolina Democrat, I would have had to hold my nose to vote for his reelection.

    If you’ve ever hired people in a competitive process, you know you look at the resumes first to screen applicants. You’re not qualified unless you’ve been a Senator, a governor, a major cabinet secretary, or a House member who’s either been a major committee chair or in the leadership. You should have completed at least one (highly proactive) term as a governor or Senator, multiple terms in the House, and experience of note beyond being a cabinet secretary. In order to run things, you have to understand how a multi-department government bureaucracy operates, and you have to know how legislative and executive branches deal with each other. That’s why Cheney was so effective in taking over things; his experience in these areas was miles beyond Bush’s.

    With these standards in mind, the only Democratic candidates who would have made it to the job interview were Clinton, Biden, Dodd, and Richardson. The Obama and Edwards candidacies should have been dead in the water with Kucinich’s and Gravel’s. Unfortunately, our system all but demands that we first encounter our Presidential aspirants as personalities–we interview first and (perhaps) look at the resume later. A lot of people never bother with the second step, and experienced and qualified candidates are passed over in favor of unqualified charmers.

    Well, this comment went from being a bit of a tangent to completely off-topic, but I’m glad I got it off my chest. Rant over. Time to get to work.

  32. My mother is an office worker. She does not follow politics like we do, but she always votes. She has already called Obama “too tired to be president” and “a baby.” She thinks he’s a cult leader. She’s not going to vote for him.

    Mom is has a masters in drama – she knows her Shakespeare. Last week she said that Obama has “a lean and hungry look.” But she also has accused him of walking “with cat-like tread” and I think that’s from Gilbert and Sullivan.

    I tell these stories about my mom because she often brings me back to reality.

  33. If you want to read a modernized version of King Lear, read Jane Smiley’s Pulitzer Prize winning novel “A Thousand Acres.” In this novel, ‘Lear’ tries to divide the family farm in IOWA among three daughters and, well, every form of betrayal and tragedy follows. It’s a good summer read.

  34. Pol C — I was a “hold your nose” Edwards supporter based on his “Poverty Platform.” I never liked him much (but I told myself I wasn’t going to date him) and I (like you) mistrusted the usefulness of his experience.

    (shaking my head)

    I will never treat the Presidency so cavalierly again! From now on the first thing I check will be the resume. Voting history, speeches — blah, blah, blah….

    As this post of Riverdaughter’s proves — it’s in The Actions. What have the candidates DONE.

  35. @KB: I guess we’ll just have to wait until September to see what happens, but I just fear the political climate is just a gimme for any person with the letter “D” next to their name and the media will push Obama no matter what. I know that if people knew who Obama was and who he wasn’t, he would lose but I think it’ll be too late for the media to finally fully vetting Obama in September.

    We’ll see. I hope you’re right and those polls are wrong.

  36. ben, I can’t possibly take two tragedies this summer. My summer reading is ALL feel-good women’s literature.

  37. I’m reading Ruth Rendell all summer.

  38. Ack. I meant to write: “….it’ll be too late for the media to finally start fully vetting Obama…”

  39. Davidson, Democrats stopped voting for Obama (at least in winning numbers) after the Wright Tapes surfaced. Don’t you think independents and non-primary-voting Democrats will be affected by those tapes and Bitter-Clinging and who-knows-what too (Ayers/Dohrn)?

    AND — combine those almost cartoon-like issues with the fact that Obama IS Completely UnQualified — how does he overcome them?

    ?? “Sure I announced my very first political campaign at the home of Domestic Terrorists but, since then I’ve ….” What? There’s nothing.

  40. Pol C:

    The only President in the modern era that didn’t meet your criteria was Eisenhower, who had military experience instead of elective office.

    I think a candidate should have been reelected at least once to a statewide office as well. That gives you an idea how the voters felt about their first term.

    I would rule out mayors (Guiliani, Bloomberg) and rich guys (Perot, Forbes)

    But resumes aren’t enough either. George H. W. Bush was one of our “best qualified” presidents ever.

  41. Riverdaughter,

    What a wonderful summary of the basic plot of King Lear. Yes, as amazing as it seems after the years and years of Hillary bashing, she is the one candidate who played it straight. I want so much to believe that she can still be the nominee! Why do we have to be stuck with such inferior choices! Well, truthfully, I do believe she can still do it. But has she given up on the idea?

    Yesterday I read Jerelyn’s post on TL about Obama asking his donors to pay “some” of Hillary’s campaign debt. In the comments, Jerelyn suggested that since Hillary no longer needs the money she raised for the GE, she could ask her donors to turn that over to Obama. My heart just lurched at that. How can Jerelyn suggest such a thing?!! I don’t think I’ll go to TL anymore.

  42. myiq — Doesn’t military experience at the level of Eisenhower (or even Clark) equal Pol’s criteria? It’s just so rare….

  43. I watched CNN for a moment as I was flipping channels. The pictures of Hillary always get me to stop, even though I know better, and this said “Breaking News,” and yes, I should know better about that too. But the breaking news was that Obama was urging people to help Clinton retire her debt and my heart felt a stabbing pain as she, so much better than he, so much more capable, strong and honest, had to be humiliated. All the pundits were out and I turned it off after reading Hillary’s comments about supporting Obama. I think this is what the party wanted. They don’t want Bill Clinton to go down as the greatest Democratic president since FDR. No, that is reserved for JFK. JFK. JFK. JFK. And they certainly don’t want his wife, because she can’t be JFK, JFK, JFK. Obama can be the black JFK. So they sunk her, humiliated her, put her up on the platform like Hester Prynne (sorry to get away from Shakespeare here and come home to Hawthorne).

    The post today was beautiful, RD. I agree about Edwards, whom I supported initially. Back in the beginning, I was taken in. No more. Not for a while. Your posts illuminate what is happening, which is why I love coming here. New insights every day.

  44. @KB: I hope you’re right, but I think the propaganda is all-out for Obama and since this is a Democratic year, especially with the economy tanking, most voters will unfortunately believe Obama is a Democrat and one who will live up to the economic legacy of Bill Clinton.

    All this disinformation out there is bad. After Edwards said Obama was in favor of “universal” health care I ran into several people who believed that lie. Why? Because the media allowed it to go unchecked.

  45. Then, it’s up to the movement to make it clear who Obama isn’t. We don’t who he isn’t but we know he isn’t a Democrat.

    We’re putting out flyers and cards–anywhere we go really–saying who Obama really is or how someone can about finding out.

    I feel I have an obligation to show the American people that all “democrats” aren’t Bill Clinton.

  46. Katiebird:

    Yes – Command experience in the military (“flag” officer level) is really executive in nature and involves lots of politics (real, not office)

  47. bostonboomer, on June 25th, 2008 at 9:02 am

    I want so much to believe that she can still be the nominee! Why do we have to be stuck with such inferior choices! Well, truthfully, I do believe she can still do it. But has she given up on the idea?

    That is the question I also need an answer to. I think she can still win this thing but does Hillary still want to fight? Does she still believe she can win? Does she still believe she would be the best president? Has the backstabbing caused her to loose faith in herself?

  48. Obama and JFK have nothing in common that I see.

  49. Regency
    Morning Joe is back & he said there’s an “Alpha Male”
    thing between Bill & Barack!
    My $$ & Faith is with “BILL ALL THE WAY”!!

  50. OT
    The clip of Murphy from this morning’s Fox and Friends is posted at blog.pumapac.org
    She was great!

  51. Davidson, McCain is ALL Over the TV with ads (so is Barack) and I think that based on the ads McCain sounds like a nice reasonable guy. Based on the ads, Barack does too.

    But Barack’s ads are all “I share your Kansas values” and McCains are all, I love Ecology….

    Which set of ads is more likely to be successfully attacked?

  52. Arabella, I am a big Ruth Rendell fan! Must have at least 20 of her books.

  53. OT but…
    For anyone wondering MessNBC and the Mighty Mouth aka Olbermann and his comic companion Tweety are doing in the ratings here’s the poop from mediabistro for Monday, June 23.

    @ 5p.m.: Hardball vs Ingraham
    Ingraham wins with 206 to Tweety’s anemic 141.

    @ 7p.m.: Shepard Smith vs Hardball
    Smith wins 285 to Tweety’s 203.
    Oh my Dobbs beats him too but just by 3. (206 to 203)

    @ 8p.m.: O’Reilly thumps Countdown
    Big Blowhard Bill 524 to Big Blowhard KO 454.
    Will KO’s ratings envy cause him to make Bill the Worst Person In Keith’s Little World once again?

    Hannity beats Abrams 475 to 315, which means in losing Abrams still did better than either of Tweety’s showings.

    @ 9p.m. Greta beats Hardball’s repeat performance with a 348 to KO’s 250.
    Will KO’s enormous head explode because he was whipped by a woman?

    Primetime totals: FNC: 449 | CNN: 337 | MSNBC: 340 | HLN: 216

  54. Wow, King Lear and the Essenes in one post. That’s pretty erudite.

    I get your point though. In King Lear, his vanity leads to his destruction and the destuction of everyone he loves. It’s not hard to see how this tragic story relates to the Obama campaign.

    And the essenes, authors of the Dead Sea Scrolls. Many interpreters of the Dead Sea Scrolls believe that Jesus himself relied on traditions that were frequently practiced by this sect (baptism being one example). So fast forwarding to today’s world, Move On would be playing the role of the Essenes and Obama plays the role of Messiah. How perfect!

    But there is one other thing to remember about the Essenes. It was a off shoot movement of this monastic sect that occupied fhe first century (CE) fortress of Masada. And while many of us may proudly revere the players in that story, it may be useful to remember how that story ended. Yes, that’s right, the good guys were all dead (by their own hands) and the bad guys took over the fort which they controlled for several hundred more years. We could easily speculate about what lessons that ancient story has for those supporting the Obama campaign today.

  55. steeveboy:

    After freeing jews from Ausschwitz, how long did Obama’s uncle stay in the attic?

    Just askin’.

    Start thinking about my 2nd question, which is how his parents managed to concede him because of Selma in 1964 after he was born in 1961.

    I have other questions coming.

  56. All you Mass people and others in the area, please consider going to Unity, NH Friday June 27th to protest the Obama campaign’s staged so-called “Unity” rally.

    I have put up a small web-page at http://pumaaction.com please forward the address to anyone you think might be interested.

  57. Katiebird–I was also an Edwards supporter for the very same reason. I was hoping there would be a real discussion about the “two Americas,” and not just those living in poverty, but those of us who live on the edges, like my family–mostly working class, blue-collar people–those of us who are one missed paycheck away from bankruptcy.

    When Edwards dropped out, I chose to support Clinton because of her health care plan. I thought her first failed attempt at universal health care had given her a much better idea of what could be done, given the current political climate. In the course of making that decision, I listened to both candidates, and discovered that Obama merely gave the same vague speech over and over. Clinton’s speeches were vastly different; full of information on various problems AND her proposed solutions. I don’t agree with all her positions, but I know where she stands and what she will do.

    I have no idea where Obama stands on any issue. Heck, I’m not even sure he’s a Democrat.

  58. MABlue,

    how about flip-flops on
    NAFTA,
    FISA,
    Public Financing,
    Needing experience to run for president,
    The Iraq war

    He has changed his position on all of the major issues.

    Obama is a liar and panderer.

  59. MA Blue you are wasting your breath. These trolls are totalling writing under the influence of the koolaid. Nothing we say or do will ever influence him. Truth is, at least she has been to Bosnia, Obama may think it is one of the 57 states.

  60. Sorry totally writing

  61. From a comment by Auntie Meme at corrente:

    Conventional wisdom that says PUMAs are just disappointed old broads who are sad that one of their own didn’t get selected. They’re not ready to get down to the nuts and bolts of governing, nor do they really have the stamina for it. It’s a battle of pie-in-the-sky vs. practicalities.

    At a deeper level, the profound rift comes from the clash between Democrats who have paid their dues through long-term political activism and those who are new to the process. I’m not speaking of the candidates, per se, but of their supporters. Clinton supporters are not owed the candidacy. They are, however, owed a voice that resonates through the policies of the nominee and his organization. The Obama campaign deserves an 18-million voice yowl of protest. Unless their campaign makes substantial changes of tone and substance and strives toward truly hearing and acting on the concerns of those 18 million, the PUMA protest will take the form of not only not supporting Prince Charming, but of actively working against him.

    To sum up:
    a) We’re harshing their mellow and that bums them out.
    b) We can outline our case for Clinton until we’re blue in the face, but we can’t make them hear us.PUMAS are perceived as bitter little ol ladies.The meme is propagated far and wide by both “progressive” bloggers and the SCMSM. And we know that women over 40 at some point become invisible. Proven fact—I can no longer see myself in the mirror.
    c) Worse yet, we can’t make them care.

    http://www.correntewire.com/petulant_pumas#new

    I think that encapsulates the story of many PUMAs.

  62. so who loves the netroots? hillary/cordelia stood up to the right-wing demogoguery on the moveon “general betrayus” censure vote; obama/goneril hid in the bathroom. she defended that boneheaded ad on freedom of expression grounds, at a significant political cost. he came out after the hard choices had been made, and talked about… i can’t tell exactly what he talked about.

    obama gave a flowery speech about why he skipped the vote because it was “silly”, and how much he LOOOOVES the netroots. now he’s doing the same thing with the FISA capitulation – he loves us so much it’s not necessary to actually vote in a manner consistent with our interests.

    guess whether the netroots are counting the actual votes or the flowery speeches. go ahead, guess.

    i’m not a romantic. if i want to know how much someone loves me, i look at their voting record.

  63. Steveeboy:

    Hillary never claimed she was actually shot at. She truthfully said there were concerns about sniperfire.

    As for lies, I bet your mom told you that you were smart and handsome.

  64. I am pretty sure that Bill and Chelsea are PUMA’S.

    President Hillary Rodham Clinton 2008

  65. Morning all!!

    I don’t comment that often (serious lack of time), but I do love this site. It is so comforting to know I am not alone. Got an email yesterday from our newly established O-office here in Jacksonville–they sent out a list of items they need (desks, office supplies,etc.). Good luck with that!

    This is hard to put in words (not as talented as others), but it struck me that a similarity between GWB and Obama is the ‘rush to seal the deal.” Remember during prior to Bush’s first term, he had various experts trotted out to the ranch to advise him–the foregone conclusion. Certainly short circuits the vetting, plus keeps the talking heads busy so they won’t wonder about his creds. Well, this feels the same to me–the media is fed daily, the endorsements, the crowds, the constant bs-the seal tackiness. But, why the need to do this if all is ok?

    I once had a pol. science prof. tell me that political parties were important for vetting candidates-and if we didn’t have them, we would have just Madison Avenue products. We would basically be sold a box of Wheaties.

  66. myiq2xu: That really bothers me, wouldn’t it seem to the Obama campaign that because we are older, we have been vetted, unlike the annointed one. Also, aren’t we the ones paying the tuition for most of his followers? We have been in the work force longer, probably have more available cash laying around and can, therefore contribute more?

    Does he court the youth vote to appear young and hip? Does he not realize that without us, they don’t have any money?

  67. WigWam, you are forgetting one other comparison between the Essenes and the Obama people.

    In the end, this more idosyncratic form of Judiaism died out and the more traditional form survives to this day. Let’s hope the same thing happens to the Democratic Party. I hope the interlopers fade away and the Democratic Party that believes in the rights of working people survives and flourishes again.

  68. Good point, Susan, I hadn’t thought of that connection!

  69. Kim:

    David Axelrod is a genius at marketing. He took an unknown Illinois legislator and turned him into a hot product.

    Unfortunately, the product was all sizzle, no steak.

  70. He did the same with Deval who turned out to be a bottle of ginger ale that sat in the sun too long.

  71. Riverdaughter- I’ve just started coming around here in the last couple of weeks and I have to tell you, this is one of your best posts, ever. I’m sure there were more that were equally great that I’ve missed.

    Everything you said was right on. I initially supported Edwards, but when I began to see his poor performances in the debates, and saw how incredibly smart and qualified Hillary was, I switched my support to her.

    I was always against Obama because I live in Illinois and I already knew that he was unqualified, dirty in his politics, and nothing more than a power hungry, spoiled brat who never worked for what he got–it was handed to him on a silver platter. When he announced his candidacy my heart sunk because I knew that the race game was about to begin.

    Thanks for this blog–it’s a real pleasure to read your posts and those who comment here.

    Just wanted to say that….

  72. If Obama has been marketed as a product, I suggest a recall.

  73. From fox news: U.S. Supreme Court Strikes Down Louisiana Law Allowing Execution for Child Rape If they’re not going to execute child rapists are they really going to outlaw roe v wade?

  74. Pat:

    I’m still angry because I was among the bamboozled here in MA. I really fell for that Deval product. What an incompetent boob!
    Remember that he beat a very good Democrat and committed progressive, former AG Tom Reilly.

  75. Just watched the murphy on the Fox video. She is fantastic! The perfect spokesperson for PUMA.

    Her blog is getting lots of hits and the responses/comments are from all over the USA! People are angry and restless and want so much to be heard.

    She deserves a huge thank you for her determination and the effort she is making to get this movement the recognition it deserves.

    I doubt we have heard the last from her and PUMA! We just need to all get onboard!

  76. MABlue: We cannot really beat ourselves up too much over it. After 4 years of Mitt we were ready for anything! But do you remember that great ad that the candidate Christ (cannot think of his last name) ran? Where they all had their heads up their butts? Great marketing on that one!

  77. Riverdaughter, I brought up the daily howler and the Cordelia reference yesterday in the comments but got to takers. I found it fascinating. You explaned the connection much better. Earlier, I was asking Taylor if she saw it but she would never answer me.

  78. Kim—recall, great idea!! Plus, I think (about your response to myiq2xu) Obama was not pushed on our age group because we wouldn’t fall for it. Perhaps, there was a market test done and people of our experience and critical thinking skills weren’t buying the product. It has also occurred to me that the stereotyping of Clinton supporters as old, uneducated, dumber than dirt, poor, etc.. (re: exit polling–people do lie, surprise, surprise) is a psychological manipulation.

  79. Davidson- There are 2 books due out this summer (most likely after the convention) about the anointed one. Both are by conservatives, one of the swift boat boys, the other by a ultra conservative. Even thought Obama says he is ready for the right wing slander, I have serious doubts. Nobody is as ruthless as the Republicans, I do not think Axelrod is that good and Obama, light weight…
    Hillary Clinton was our ace in the hole to get into the W.H. The right wing never got the better of the Clinton family, unfortunately, our own party was her down fall. sad.
    So do not give up yet…

  80. She didn’t get a hug or kiss? She had to pretend wipe sweat from her forhead??? SERIOUSLY???

    YUCK. Reason one million why I cannot stand McCaskill.

    It reminds me of Donna B. and her juvenile emails & gum-chewing, texting antics at the RBC meeting. His supporters are so maturity-challenged. “I voted for him because my grandchildren like him.” It’s frightening when you realize these are elected officials responsible for creating our laws. Thank God Hillary is in there fighting the good fight against these imbeciles.

  81. Gotta go do some work, but btw—-is this not the ‘dumbing down of the US?’ I am a retired teacher and I can tell you that requirements are not what they used to be. In fact, you have to jump through hoops just to fail or give someone a D–the onus is on the teacher not the student.

  82. Axelrod correctly calculated that Opossum could take the AA voters from Hillary (he was the only candidate who could) but that would only help him in states with large AA populations, which are mostly in the South (like SC)

    Hillary also had women and blue-collar voters locked up.

    They marketed The Precious through the internet to upscale liberals and college students.

    Give Axelrod credit, he did a great job. The AA’s gave them big wins in red southern states and the college demographic was key to winning the mountain-west red state caucuses which gave them their winning margin.

    Astroturfing events in Iowa (next-door to Illinois) gave them the big start, and they planned to use the momentum to win NH, NV and SC, and then roll into Super Tuesday 4-0. It almost worked.

    That’s why they freaked when Hillary won NH and NV, so they played the race card. Opossum had to be “viable” to win the AA vote, unless his opponent was a racist.

    If their strategy had worked, Opossum would have won the nomination in early February without ever being “vetted.”

  83. kc: What is wrong with a D-? You cannot put too much on these kids today, it might interfere with play dates, horseback riding lessons, soccer practice, T-ball, Little League, dance, gymnastics, football games, pottery and MTV!

    Let’s not overwhelm these kids too much with facts and learning. So what if he/she cannot name the 50 states, the branches of government, how to find Iraq on a map; they become stars on the Leno Show with their lack of knowledge.

    They can continue to get their updates from the Daily Show and the Colbert Report. No sweat. After all, this is still America.

  84. Riverdaughter, a beautiful essay — it is much more than a post. It is one to be copied and handed out personally to voters and I will do so in Los Angeles. Thank you for this one; I was afraid that once you had gone beyond angry and you turned part of your blog to book talks, the fire had left. No way, no how. Thanks for your wonderful mind.

    For those who are terrified of Axelrod’s ability to bamboozle us with his nothing candidates…….remember, whose money put Obamarxist on the map — the Republicans — their voters in caucuses and their corporate money, the latter first in BO’s HopeFund PAC. He would be nowhere if they — desperate down-and-outers that they are — weren’t involved in an anyone-but-Hillary campaign from early on. Obamarxist is Karl Rove’s wet dream of a Dem candidate. While Dean gamed the Dem Party, Rove gamed the Dem authoritarian leftists. (I am using Rove as a metaphor, not as a God.)

    I am as irritated as the next person at Hillary’s leaving the race and campaigning, but we shouldn’t do the “poor Hillary” bit. She knows exactly what she is doing; she does not pander; she keeps her word.

    Question: I think ActBlue is an Obamarxist front, even though it seems like a true Dem outfit. Any help in figuring out who they truly are?

  85. pat, 57, it’s 57 states..oops my bad, 58–I always forget the whole quote “we’ve been to 57 states, and we have one more to go”…..sorry about that halfdeliganistan!

  86. Marketing can get people to try a new product, but it won’t make them like it.

    The greatest chef in the world can’t make chicken soup out of chicken shit.

  87. gary: Did you guys connect with murphy?

  88. myiq2xu: That last sentence should be adopted as a motto. Your talents have been laying dormant for too long.

  89. pat, mawm is taking charge of the whole deal. I think he has talked to her though. Can you make it?

  90. Well, remember “new” coca cola? We said nope in numbers and it is not on the shelves anymore.

    That is why he did not sell himself to us, he knew we weren’t buying.

    So, instead of the “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”, they broke the dem party and know expect us to be the ones to fix it.

  91. (rolling on the floor laughing)

    edgeoforever, — NO! but how wonderful !!

  92. OK, so I get an email from the Hillary Clinton campaign asking me to join Her and Him in Unity, NH. YOu may have received the email. I’m seriously considering going but they’re making it hard to do anything but stand there and look devoted:
    Bussed into site (Unity Elementary School)
    No handbags
    Few personal belongings
    No signs
    No banners

    And to make it worse, when you click on the image in the email it throws you to His website:
    http://my.barackobama.com/page/s/unityrally?source=HRC_E

    Hand me a bucket.

  93. Kim, and Microsoft has announced that they’re extending the time they’ll support Windows XP. With people avoiding Vista in droves, they had to do that or risk totally losing their market.

    What WILL the Democrats do?

  94. Gary some one was asking about the Unity rally in NH, at Puma Pac, Puma Alley I think, she was going to attend, but wanted info.

  95. Kim, I put up a small web page at http://pumaaction.com to get people to go to Unity. All the details are kindof sketchy. I will be getting there early to be safe.

  96. Anyone going to the Unity NH rally? I was seriously thinking about it but it sounds like a pre packaged infomercial for Him. There will be no opportunity to show our support for Hillary. Any type of sign is banned but I’ll bet Aunt Martha’s pearls that they’ll be handing out Oppossum signs.

    I think we should encourage all Hillary supporters to NOT go to the rally in Unity, NH. If it’s just Obama supporters, they’ll boo Hillary and won’t they look like the fools they are? I hope this is televised, it’s going to be a good one!

  97. Kim, mawm put up a website at http://pumaaction.com …if you read anybody asking about it can you refer them there? They can contact us via email through that site. thanks

  98. kaiebird: “Is PUMA PAC murphy’s organization? I’m getting confused by all the groups….”

    Yes, PUMApac (People United Means Action)
    is Murphy’s organization.

    There are many PUMA organizations (PUMAparty, PUMA (People United My A**, etc.). Some of the Obots think “my a** changed their name to people united means action, etc. becaus ethey were getting flack. Not true. The original names remain. Personally, I’m leery of the newly formed “puma” groups, but I’m cautious (paranoid) that way.

    All, or at least most, of the established (older than 3 to 4 weeks, lol) PUMA groups are part of the Just Say No Deal coalition.

  99. elixir, see my last comment

  100. It is amazing that just two campaigns ago, we were the demographic that Gore was aiming for, remember soccer moms? Has eight years turned us into senile, demented old farts?

    When my son’s girlfriend moved in with us, (yeah she lives with me too), he told her some of my rules. The top two on shopping were: do not bring home anything other than Bounty paper towels and never, ever buy those fake bacon bits.

  101. Mawm et al,
    Do you think it’s wise to go to Unity? It’s just a side show for the Precious. You know they will make Hillary kiss his butt and beg us to support him. Do you really want to see that? I don’t. Not unless I can make some noise and wave my “I want a nominee who has the most votes” sign. Sorry to be a pisser but I think it’s a mistake to go.

  102. I tried to send her over there, but for some reason I cannot log on to the PumaPac site. I have joined twice and sent em’s and I cannot post or get in.

  103. If they won’t let you take signs, I suggest wearing a PUMA t-shirt under your regular shirt. Then you can take your shirt off and make a statement with your undershirt.

  104. gary: I can’t. I did look it up on Google map and it is about 200 miles from here. I am unable to sit that long (aging is a wonderful thing!).

  105. I will go to Unity only if I can make some noise and show my support for HRC. I have a feeling they’ll have lots of security and suppression planned. Thoughts?

  106. From the description of the rules for the Unity rally it sounds like Opossum plans to be another ‘bubble boy” just like G-Dub.

    We wouldn’t want him to think there were people who didn’t love him, would we?

  107. Elixir, I don’t WANT to do any of this. I feel compelled because I feel like what little Democracy we had is slipping down the drain, and no one is doing very much about it.

    This rally is a perect example of the fraud that is Obama. They stage the rally in a symbolic location (Unity), out in the middle of nowhere so he can flood the town with his supporters, turn the cameras on and say, “Look America! See how Unified we are!”

    I intend to put a dent into that facade on Friday (Always in a non-viloent if not respectful way).

  108. Very astute observations, RD. I confess that I thinks of Obama in pop culture. Sometimes he wants to be a traditional man who loves his family, provides a home, goes to church, etc. I think he also sees himself at the pinnacle of power, with all the accoutrement. But I think a big part still wants to be hip, have street cred.

    He always reminds me of Edina in the British series Absolutely Fabulous. When her kitchen catches on fire, she can’t decide how to decorate – cool, sparse modern or warm French Country or Primitive Antique, she says she wants to be all those things, all those people. She typifies that immature adult who can’t make choices because she doesn’t know who she really is.

    That’s how I always picture Obama when he is so vague or panders or goes back on his word: Edina sitting with decorating books, not knowing who she really is.

  109. BernieO-Your thoughtful post concluded:

    “It is frightening to see the extent to which this low level style of thinking now pervades our culture. We have been advertised and entertained into infantilization.”

    I have been thinking along these lines for awhile as well. I hope I don’t offend anyone by my next generalizations.

    I live in a large Southern city that has a huge population of younger people with a good amount of money to spend. From what I’ve experienced, they feel entitled to have their every desire immediately. Instant gratification is expected in the way demanded. Consequences are relatively unknown to them and should they be reminded, they are dismissive and disrespectful. And, yes, they are Obama supporters. They will tell you quickly that it doesn’t matter about his lack of experience. That is a good thing to them. They are electing one of their own! (And, I don’t mean color of skin.)

    Thanks for letting me write this! I’m discouraged.

  110. Elixir, I think one thing we had planned on doing was making a video journal of the event. talking to people from there, document the busloads they are undoubtedly trucking in for the dog and pony show, interviewing people, etc. I don’t know yet how they are admitting people to the event, but I’m sure it will be tightly controlled. Even if we can’t get too close, if there are enough of us the media can’t ignore it….

  111. I recall from a lawsuit against G-dub the discovered a handbook for rallies that said if protesters make it past the screening procedures, they should have a “rapid response” group ready that would surround and block them out from sight.

  112. Elixir, if they don’t let us into the rally. I would like to stage an alternate rally outside. There are going to be massive amounts of press there, and I wouldn’t be surprised if we were the belle of the ball, since we would make the media’s story about the event more interesting.

    Depending on how many of us show up. Some could go into the event and disrupt it one by one, while the ones with the signs and shirts stay out.

  113. I picture Edina falling out of her sports car right onto her face when she and Patsy went food shopping. Always makes me laugh. Could also be His Nibs as well.

  114. typo: not I thinks, but I think. Arrrgh.

  115. garychapelhill, on June 25th, 2008 at 11:02 am Said:
    pat, 57, it’s 57 states..oops my bad, 58–I always forget the whole quote “we’ve been to 57 states, and we have one more to go”…..sorry about that halfdeliganistan!
    ========

    Don’t forget MI and FL where they weren’t allowed to go. 60 states.

  116. But if there aren’t any Hillary supporters, how does the Obama campaign present the rally as a unifying moment? Do you think they’ll keep everyone generic – no signage – so you’ll think the whole rally is Obama and Clinton supporters holding hands? That’s the only way they could pull it off – no T shirts, no signs, no chanting, nothing. They’re not going to get that. It’s going to be full out battle.

  117. I would try to rent a plane flying a banner behind it that said “Lipstick on a pig!”

    But the Secret Service will probably have the area declared a no-fly zone for the day.

  118. This is classic. The mascot for the Unity school where the rally is is a panther aka puma

    http://knotweed.wordpress.com/2008/06/25/unity-nh-mascot-panther-aka-puma/

  119. Wow my unity protest email box is really starting to pick up.

  120. Elixer:

    They’ll have a few screened obots holding Hillary signs, but lots more holding Obama signs.

    They’ll bring the press in by bus and park them down front, surrounded by screened obots. The press will get pictures of Opossum and Hillary on stage, then they’ll be whisked away.

    Anyone identified as a protester will be diverted to a “free speech zone” off the travel route. The whole town will be a Potemkin village.

  121. @ Myiq

    So is this worth the effort? Can we make a difference, will there be change and hope??????? I guess it’s worth making some noise about.

  122. elixir, it will be better than nothing, right? plus mawm and I are getting a brand new video cam for the occasion. if nobody else covers it, we will and put it on every just say no deal website out there….we’re bound to get some attention

  123. Lovely post. I had the pleasure of listening to Cavell, Putnam, and Stanish, together, earlier in the year.

    Is the “educated” Obama crowd comprised of single-degree recipients? I find I encounter post-grads (and many assorted others) on the PUMA/ NObama sites.

  124. steven, many are in the “still working on the degree” demo….

  125. Hillary will need supporters at the Unity event if only to keep the whole crowd from being Obama supporters who will boo her. I dread that.

  126. I would videotape the efforts to suppress any protest.

    One person filming, another talking.

    That alone would be worth the trip.

  127. Elixir: LOL WIll there be change and hope? Hell, no but they will smile beatifically at you and chant the mantra.

  128. Let me add:

    I would go with signs, shirts, etc., but be prepared to be covert too.

    Get some Obama shirts and/or pins, wear the Hillary shirts underneath.

    If they let you in, great, then “expose” your true colors just as the rally actually starts.

    If they won’t let you in, pull out your signs and raise hell outside (as close as you can get)

    Record everything you can (do you have a cell phone that records?)

    Be prepared for as many possibilities as you can think of. They will be trying to stop you, you will be trying to beat them and make a protest that can be seen.

    If you feel creative, make a documentary of your expedition. Do interviews. Pretend to be Obots and interview real ones, then start asking tough questions, like Max Blumenthal did to the College Republicans (How do you feel about Obama’s flip-flop on FISA, campaign finance, etc?)

    Have fun and come back and tell us all about it.

  129. If she gets boos at the “unity” event, doesn’t that let her off the hook?

    Funny, his supporters don’t “get” the need to be nice about Hillary and grab up her loyal dem (vote -D no matter what) voters. I’m sure even those folks can be pushed too far.

  130. Sounds like a plan, I’m on it. With GCH, Mawm et al we’ll make Hillary proud.

  131. Mawm is famous, so probably would need to stay away from obot “interviews”.

  132. One more thing:

    Whatever procedures they use will probably be standard for all Obama rallies.

    Observe and report. Even if you are unsuccessful making a protest at this rally, what you learn can be used by others in the future.

    DISCLAIMER: We’re talking about lawful protest protected by the First Amendment. We do not advocate anything unlawful!

  133. Just read a couple of articles in our local rag.

    One was about Hillary’s return to the senate and held a meeting that was held afterwards with Reid and Schumer, afterwards Reid called it “one of the most emotional caucuses I’ve attended.” Yeah, ok.

    Also, has anyone read about the “gray wave”? According to the estimates, almost one-quarter of South Carolina is over 60 right now. Don’t know about other states, but wouldn’t this force a candidate to take a look at the older voter demographic?

  134. myiq2xu, on June 25th, 2008 at 9:00 am Said:

    myiq2xu–

    Eisenhower was the highest-ranking officer and supreme commander of the U.S. military during its greatest challenge in history. Additionally, he certainly understood Washington and knew the way bureaucracies operated, and his prestige was such that no one in the executive branch, Congress, or abroad would dare play games with him. He’s an anomaly, though. You might want to view him as in the cabinet secretary category.

    I fully agree with your view that a candidate needs to have been reelected, and I generally feel a statewide office is best. However, I do feel that certain members of the House, such as those who have served in the leadership or as chairs of the major committees, have the requisite experience and deserve consideration.

    Mayors and rich egomaniacs have no business running. The latter are especially pernicious, as their only commitment is to enhancing their status, not public service.

    Resumes certainly aren’t enough. That’s why we need to encounter candidates face-to-face, so to speak, in a manner analogous to a job interview. Richardson’s uninspiring blobby lameness and Dodd’s hectoring asshole manner would have gotten both of them bounced. Biden carries himself well, and his foreign-policy credentials are outstanding, but he’s got nothing to offer beyond the party line on domestic policy. Hillary was the strongest, most well-rounded candidate by far this time out.

    Bush the Elder was a candidate who, in a perfect world, would have gotten bounced in the interview process. His resume was a mile wide and an inch deep, and his lack of accomplishment in his various positions raises the question of why he couldn’t hold down a job. He was a nothing in Congress, he ran the CIA and the RNC only when no one else would (both operations were at their nadirs at the time), and both Nixon and Reagan regarded him as a barnacle on the bellies of their administrations. Nixon didn’t even bother to tell Bush (then his UN Ambassador) about the 180 on China policy; Bush found about it on the TV news. And Reagan couldn’t figure what the hell to do with him beyond sending him to foreign funerals. He was no by no means like Mondale or Gore (or even Cheney) as Veep.

    Thanks for the reply.

  135. If Mawm is too famous, let him hold the camera

  136. Thought provoking. Excellent Riverdaughter.

  137. What I can’t get out of my mind is that Hillary will be booed at the Unity Event. She doesn’t deserve that. She’s such an amazingly strong woman.

  138. From today’s Howler:

    As everyone knows, the “sexism” at issue in this discussion is that of the mainstream press corps. Pelosi’s reaction typifies the “who gives a flying fig” approach of Dem leaders toward the work of the press. You simply can’t make these people get mad, no matter what you do to Dem leaders. Nine years ago, they wouldn’t complain about the trashing of Gore. Today, Pelosi won’t complain about the trashing of Clinton. She isn’t even willing to say whose conduct is being discussed here.

    Two week ago, Howard Dean explained the leadership’s endless silence on such matters. I don’t watch that much cable, he said. Pelosi says the issue should be studied. Absolutely pathetic, both times. But extremely typical.

    Do you mind if we cite a thought that entered our heads long ago? These people don’t seem to care about who wins elections. If you actually care about outcomes, at some point you start getting mad about the trashing of your candidates. But quite plainly, nothing on earth makes these people mad. What’s the explanation?

    The explanation is Nancy is FITH (f**ked in the head)

  139. lonnette33:

    I’m sure Axelrod will put out the word that there should be no booing.

    The point is to convince Hillary supporters (us) that it’s time for make-up sex.

  140. RD,wonderful essay. This site is an oasis of sanity and insight, Thanks to all of you who contribute,I’m honored to be a part of the PUMA community.

  141. ah stevee do you never learn?

  142. Hey Gary!

    Don’t pick on Stevee, he has issues.

    His mother told the guy he calls “Dad'” she was a virgin.

  143. stevee is typical of all bullies, they like to pick a venue where they will have a loud, contrary voice but have no need to fear reprisal or repercussion. (I’m a teacher, I should know). I’m sure he has major self-esteem issues. but that’s for his therapist to deal with, not us.

  144. Received a snail mail letter from Barack Obama yesterday. Just wanted to pass it by here – FYI.

    There are 2 letters inside – one from the Rev. Joseph Lowery – having been described as a respected, electrifying reverend and who has been given many superior awards, one by NAACP naming him the Dean of the Civil Rights Movement. A good man, in other words. He walked with Rev. Martin Luther King from Selma to Montgomery. He praises BO – and all the change he’s going to bring to America.

    The other letter is from BO himsefl, praising the Rev. Lowery, and noting his standing with King, the change we need, etc., etc. Both letters are on two sides of paper and both letters ask for money.

    You all may already know about this particular BO campaign since I found mention of it at another Just Say No Deal blog; and, that was earlier in the month of June so the campaign started earlier and continues (this particular campaign I mean).

    So, I am not sure what ot think. I was bewildered when I opened it, out of curiosity of course. I just plain can’t believe this guy – the maneuvers that he tries to accomplish.

    Anyway – I am sure you all know about this – but I just got this yesterday so wanted to pass it by for those that don’t know about it.

  145. “ChumpedDemocrat, 11:00 am Said:

    Question: I think ActBlue is an Obamarxist front, even though it seems like a true Dem outfit. Any help in figuring out who they truly are?”

    No, chumped,

    you can select your own candidates and raise money for them by putting togethaer an ActBlue page of your choice.

    That way you can vet em first!

    Much better than just supporting who the DNC or CCCC or DSCC wants you too.

    for example I like this page of eco candidates put together by an environmental policy wonk I trust:

    http://www.actblue.com/page/energysmart

  146. I said it before — don’t worry about polls. Think about it.

    Obambi won because of proportional delegate awarding and caucuses.

    What are there none of in the general election?

    Proportional delegate awarding and caucuses.

    Using a GE rulebook, he cannot win.

  147. RD,

    I always love your insights, wish you kept an archived list at the side..:

    I also think Hillary is a bit tone deaf as wonks sometimes are about saying “lobbyists are people” – because of her beginnings with the Childrens Defense Fund –

    her experience of lobbying congress successfully to change laws to allow disabled kids to get an education..

    after all, she knows the ACLU lobbies, the Sierra Club lobbies…the NRDC,thats why she seemed tone deaf to kossacks? They are clueless in some ways.

    and that she is not beholden to the oil and gas money she gets, she just votes her damn conscience. Its kind of a nerdy innocence,coming from strong character.

  148. Weird polls out today.

    LATimes/Bloomberg: BO +12

    Gallup Daily: a tie 45-45

  149. Gallup: Election Enthusiasm Dips After Primaries

    Looks like the primary was the main event for a lot of people.

  150. Speaking of unalloyed BS … I just ran into something that I’d like to check out further.

    Some Obamabot dipsh*t in the Senate said the standard, “Yes, but 80% of his contributors are $100 or less!”

    That noun choice made me think — are 80% of his CONTRIBUTORS small-amount contributors or is 80% of his TOTAL MONEY TAKE in chunks of $100 or less?

    These are very, very, very different things. The latter is impressive — the former stinks to high heaven.

    BTW, Obamabot who may be reading this threa d– if you’re going to post and say I DON’T SEE THE DIFFERENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!! go study for your math test then come back. Oh, and a semantics class might stand you in good stead as well.

  151. Miriam, I’m not sure what you are asking… Hillary is “responsible” for her campaign debt, but obama wants her donor list since they aren’t maxed out for him. The exchange is this – he asks his donors to help her out and she forks over her big donors.

    I am no longer watching media – but my guess would be that they are making it out like she will campaign for him if he gives her money. He can’t actually do that, but it plays well on TV. They LOVE to talk about Hillary.

  152. […] might be terrifying—or at least troubling—if it was true. But according to FactCheck.org, a nonpartisan, nonprofit service provided by the University of […]

  153. What a wonderful post and site. I am so glad I found this place.

    Regarding the Unity event, the precautions remind me of the earlier days of GWB’s reign, when there were free-speech zones. You can speak, just so long as America doesn’t hear you.

  154. Cheri: I get the same mailer about once a week, as well as one from Edwards. I just write all over it, PUMA, HILLARY ’08, NOBAMA, etc., and then I return so they have to pay postage.

    Not much, but makes me feel better.

  155. Now you have linfar bashing alegre on taylormarsh.com. These people are amazing- judgemental hypocrites. I’m through with being civil.

  156. Miriam, on June 25th, 2008 at 1:32 pm Said:
    ———————-
    He is not doing any favor by asking his donors to give her money for her debt. He wants her donor list — learn a thing or two about how it works and then ask questions — We all can give money to each candidate up to $2300 and Obama wants Hillary supporters to contribute to him. He needs her more than she needs him because most of his supporters are tapped out. He cannot himself give her any lumpsum money to repay her debt. He is asking his donors to pay toward her debt in exchange for her donor list. his donors are reluctant because they don’t get any political favors in return (he gets it but they don’t ).

  157. Just got this from Robert Greenwald, did I miss the endorsement Lieberman gave McCain?

    http://liebermanmustgo.com/?utm_source=rgemail

  158. Miriam:

    Also consider how much Opossum would spend if Hillary had chosen to fight this all the way to the convention.

    Agreeing to help her pay off her campaign debts was probably part of the deal to get her endorsement.

    But that deal doesn’t bind us.

  159. She just sent out another em (second one in two days) asking for help to retire he debt. I sent $20 more, working mom, all I can handle is about $20 a week.

  160. Miriam:

    They both have maxed-out donors, so cooperating helps both of them.

    There is no limit to DNC donations, so exchanging lists isn’t as important.

  161. Kim: In other words, she does not want his fucking donors!

  162. I mean that in a non-hostile way of course. I could use a snark button.

    Thanks for donating anything you can, Kim

  163. She doesn’t want to give him her list

  164. Miriam, on June 25th, 2008 at 2:31 pm Said:

    His supporters don’t want to help her out because they hate Hillary. That is what his campaign was about – anti-Clinton.
    BO wants her donor list, he NEEDS money. Didn’t you read the article with Rendell about wanting the checks but not the people? That is all they think she is good for. Daschle said they will be happy to have her supporters donating to him. IT IS ABOUT MONEY

  165. #
    myiq2xu, on June 25th, 2008 at 2:21 pm Said:

    Miriam:

    Also consider how much Opossum would spend if Hillary had chosen to fight this all the way to the convention.

    Agreeing to help her pay off her campaign debts was probably part of the deal to get her endorsement.

    But that deal doesn’t bind us.

    Why does everyone think Hillary wants BO to help pay off her debt? Hillary didn’t want to suspend. She was forced to suspend her campaugn. Just because the MSM says it doesn’t mean it is true. If she did some fundraisers, she would pay off her bill. BTW, Hillary only wants help with the money she owes the vendors.

  166. I haven’t made it through the article yet, but the title alone is a great subliminal Fleetwood Mac reference.

    Clinton’s campaign song was “Don’t Stop (Thinking About Tomorrow).” It seems strangely fitting that Obama’s should be “Little Lies,” another big Mac hit.

  167. Miriam, on June 25th, 2008 at 4:20 pm Said:

    Have you actually been to BO’s site and read their posts about them not wanting to donate to Hillary. Haven’t you noticed the intense hatred they have for Hillary? Are we going to pretend that didn’t happen or that BO didn’t send out emails blaming Hillary for Rev. Wright. He led a hate filled campaign and most of his supporters don’t want to donate to Hillary because they believed his lies. When her name is mentioned they boo. Do you really expect these people to donate to her? The situation is BO said he was going to get 100 million and now he is short on cash and really needs Hillary’s donors. Why do you think it took him this long to ask his supporters to donate to Hillary. He doesn’t want to but he is forced because he needs her top donors to donate to him.

  168. Hillary is breaking my heart by stumping for this guy.

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