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Two more thoughts on RFK/1968

1. Those of us for whom the 1968 Presidential Primary is memory rather than hearsay will recall the doggedly self-righteous bitterness followers of the poet Gene McCarthy (who yearned passionately to end the war) held against the politician Robert F. Kennedy (who truly had the capacity to end it).

2. In this case, as in so many others, the lifeblood of BO08 is counterfeit history, which in turn relies on widespread ignorance of history — from MLK’s partnership with and dependence on LBJ, to the Clinton years’ record of working class progress and unparalleled levels of world peace.

Beyond the intrinsic merit of the piss they’re selling, beer commercials are aimed at younger audiences for cold, calculating reasons. Same for the New Kinda Politics.

175 Responses

  1. “New Kind of Politics”? You mean “uniting not dividing”? Because I’ve never heard that before.

  2. It’s truly amazing. As I get older, I have much more appreciation for how history gets twisted. When you actually lived through something, it’s hard to put up with it being twisted into something it wasn’t. I find the comparison between McCarthy/Obama vs RFK/HRC really interesting. There is a similar eerie resemblance between Obama and George McGovern in ’72. At the time, I loved him, but he was pushed on the party by the young and elites, just as they are trying to force us to accept Obama.

    I actually think Humphrey might have ended the war. He just couldn’t say so. It’s a shame what happened to him, because he was a good man. He was ruined by being VP. All the more reason for Hillary not to take the second spot to Obama no matter what.

  3. Throwing the Clintons under the bus for the sake of his political gain is beyond the pale for me. No way could I support a candidate OR a party that would allow for such.

  4. What I feel for Obama and his campoaign goes beyond hate….but to find the right word is difficult….what is beyond that?

  5. BB: Though I’m too young to have lived during his campaign (34), I’ve seen the footage of McGovern speaking to packed-out stadiums of young, enthusiastic activists. It does sound a tad familiar.

  6. Jeralyn has spoken and I love this:

    Making Mountains Out of Molehills

    This will be the final TalkLeft thread on the matter. I’m not going to spend the weekend on this. And I’m going to have a low threshold for accusatory comments. If you want a place to further your attacks on Hillary, go somewhere else.

  7. Nice analogy between McCarthy/Obama vs RFK/HRC. Also nice to see that other people who lived through the trauma and loss of that era (including RFK Jr.) understand rather than spin what Hillary was trying to say.

    NO WAY that Hillary would try to use RFK’s death for her gain. She was clearly talking about the length of the campaign process. The media interviewing her and RFK Jr. himself clearly see this. Only the immature, inexperienced and/or spiteful could see this as a call for or insinuation about the possibility of BO’s assissination.

  8. Sarah,

    Contempt? Disgust? It’s hard to find the words, I agree.

  9. You really have to “spin” her remarks to make something out of nothing. When I first heard a reference to this statement I thought it was something truly horrendous. As it is, it is nothing more than a reference to the primary season lasting into June as it did with Bill and RFK. Is this a preview of what can expected should this fraud get into the WH? A continuation of the Bush policy of damning anyone who disagrees as unpatriotic and Obama demanding apologies for real and imaginded slights? Beware. This is beneath contempt to make this into something it truly is not. I understand KO did one of his self righteous “special comments” again tonight.

  10. I have been lurking here now for a few weeks and finally got up my nerve to post here in the past few days. My outrage could no longer be contained and the rest of you have inspired me to finally express what I (and you, clearly) have been feeling for quite a while now. It’s comforting to know that there is a place where I am welcomed for supporting the one candidate that I know can truly bring our country back from the nightmare that has been the last 8 years.

    My voice is tiny in the scheme of things. So many of you have made such a difference so far. But I at least wanted to speak up to thank you for all you have done.

    Oh BTW I love my little icon next to my name in the recent comments section!!!

    A triangle is definitely appropriate.

    But it should be pink 😉

    Have a great Memorial Day weekend everyone.

  11. I was talking to a friend (Obama supporter) of mine, and we were having a “friendly” text message argument on this topic. I told her RFK, Jr had said this whole thing was, in so many words, stupid. Her reply was, “Yeah, and who is he supporting again?”

    I like her too much…if I didn’t, my reply would have been, “Yes, I’m sure RFK supports HRC waaaay more than he cares about his dead father.” I mean, really, people?

    But, I’m hoping this does just sizzle out with the media, what with the Memorial Day weekend, the gas prices, traveling, vacations, and remembering what Memorial Day is really about.

    OT, I know, but I remember going out with some Engineers at o’dark thirty one morning in northern Mosul, joining them for an IED patrol of a convoy route. I bumped into this one second lieutenant engineer. Nothing that remarkable about him at the time. Fast forward to a month later, when I go to his memorial ceremony, b/c an IED destroyed his HMMWV, killing him. This kid, who was maybe 3 or 4 years younger than me … yeah, that’s what this weekend is about. And it should NOT be a political weekend, but things like that are why we need a commander-in-chief who is ready…

    …~sigh~… (tries not to think about stuff)

  12. apinavl: All tiny little voices when put together eventually become a choir. Welcome.

  13. Welcome, apinavl. I’m glad you spoke up.

  14. captsfufp,

    That put it in perspective all right. Not OT at all. 1968, another pointless, horrible war, another tumultuous presidential campaign, history repeats itself. The man I loved in 1968, soon to be my husband, was in Vietnam in 1969 and his life and mine were forever changed.

    It’s important to remember that real people are suffering right now because of Bush’s war. Thanks for reminding us of what is really important.

  15. Frankly, does this really change anything? Both sides are just more locked in now. Hillary isn’t going anywhere. She’s been treated like this for months…non stop and she is still here. It’s going to be a beautiful weekend. People will be with their families. And I bet the beaches in Puerto Rico are beautiful.

  16. I won’t support Obama in a general election. I can not. When Democrats knife eachother and allow the media to slander one of their own for making an historical point about past lengthy primaries, one that was ended suddenly by tragedy of a Democratic hero, but otherwise was headed to convention, I have to wonder where has my Party gone? This is no longer a reality based Party, and I can’t support it. It’s just as that article suggested, modern day McCarthyism, fueled by sexism, and wielded by the Obama/Axelrod team. I just can not support it.

  17. Love your comments capt….glad you are here. Welcome apinavl….bostonboomer, glad you are here too, and really to all of you the same. You are my beacon of hope….

  18. What also gets me.. the “progressive” and “liberal” blogs have probably overlooked John McCain’s late Friday/holiday weekend dump of his medical records, several lobbyists on his staff, Pastor Hagee, and.. finances, I believe.

  19. Thanks for the kind words and warm welcome.

    And thank you Capt for reminding us of the real meaning of this holiday. We should continue to honor (and take care of) our service members and their families……not just on this Memorial Day, but every day.

  20. Everytime I think I can’t get more disgusted with Obama and his campaign I do. It’s amazing the llevel of disgust I now have for him. Do I have more? I guess we’ll see.

    After the bros before hos came out I now have a new motto:
    Don’t be a ho for O!

  21. Hillary in the White House will face this crap every three days. There will be a new ” Whatevergate” every week outrage . I don’t say this to be discouraging.
    ( even if it is! ) But this is what supporting this great woman means. There is no good press for a
    President Clinton . But she goes on thank goodness.
    Hill is made of sterner stuff than the rest of the Dem party!

  22. Re: the faux outrage about what Hillary said about RFK (in setting a timeframe for another famous primary), this commenter at TalkLeft nails it:

    by magisterludi on Fri May 23, 2008 at 08:57:19 PM EDT:

    I was reminded of a Goya plate that has the caption, “The Sleep of Reason Produces Nightmares.”
    I think that’s pretty apt for these times.

    RFK Jr adds:

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr., who has endorsed Mrs. Clinton, defended her remarks in a telephone interview Friday evening. “I’ve heard her make that argument before,” Mr. Kennedy said, speaking on his cell phone as he drove to the family compound in Hyannis for the holiday weekend. “It sounds like she was invoking a familiar historical circumstance in support of her argument for continuing her campaign.”


  23. My father started making the RFK comparison early on. And, you know, she wins his states…appalachia, indiana. He also lost Oregon. And there’s a very telling quote from him about his loss there. Something about “I attract voters with needs”.

  24. I was coming back from the golf course and heard the above song on the radio and it was so perfect for what is happening now. We are being torn apart.

  25. Latest Newsweek poll

    Obama 46
    McCain 46

    Clinton 48
    McCain 44

    The stronger Clinton looks, the creepier the O-freakoids get.

  26. Wow, that Newsweek poll brings a smile to my face. Students of history should know this is not going to be a blow out election. Look at Nixon/Humphrey? Ford/Carter? Clinton/Bush/Perot? Gore/Bush? This is looking more and more like the election of 68.

  27. Thank you, captsfufp, and thank you.

    I was tempted to emphasize a third point — that our failure to remember history (Vietnam) doomed us to repeat it (Iraq).

    It’s a time to remember those who gave their lives in good faith, for causes good and bad and indeterminate.

    Leadership matters, honor and decency do not go obsolete, and that’s “Why We Fight”.

  28. ben carlson, not if Hillary gets the nom. They give her 44% support among whites. I don’t think a Dem has scored that since LBJ.

  29. Melanie: This the type of discussion we should be having. I do think that if Obama is the nominee there will be a silent majority against him for many, many reasons and it won’t be because of his race but for how he has handled the issue of race. There’s a clever narrative floating around at there that he has made everything off limits and anything you say against him is racist. That is seeping in. And you just wonder how it all shows up in polls. But having him behind McCain at this point is nothing but net!!

  30. There’s a good post on history, LBJ, and the survival/power of the Democratic Power over at Heidi Li’s Potpourri – http://tinyurl.com/3xgokg

  31. I know this was posted on an earlier thread but, it makes me feel good to see it so I’ll repost it:

    Robert Kennedy Jr. issued the following statement this evening:

    “It is clear from the context that Hillary was invoking a familiar political circumstance in order to support her decision to stay in the race through June. I have heard her make this reference before, also citing her husband’s 1992 race, both of which were hard fought through June. I understand how highly charged the atmosphere is, but I think it is a mistake for people to take offense.”

  32. I’m so angry tonight, I’m not sure what to think. This is loathsome and I don’t use that word casually. First she’s a racist, not she’s someone who mocks the assassination of someone who in real life is probably one of her heroes.

    I think this is the Obama camp beating the drum FOR assassination. I think they’re ramping their crazies up hoping for an attack on her.

    That’s why I’m so offended. I didn’t know if I wanted to write that, but that’s what I think is transpiring here. I think they were looking for a way to discuss assassination and this served the purpose. Hillary would tell me I’m being silly, but I don’t think I am.

  33. ben carlson, agreed. But Hill isn’t winning that much of the white vote because of the terrible display of silencing all critics with charges of racism from BO. She’s winning this against McCain. I read something from a pollster a few months ago who commented that she was on track to win more of the white vote in a GE than any Dem since LBJ. I’m think maybe it’s women that are making the difference. Either way, given I feel she would perform well with african americans, latinos and other ethnic groups, it makes her a very strong candidate.

  34. I’m so angry tonight, I’m not sure what to think. This is loathsome and I don’t use that word casually. First she’s a racist, now she’s someone who mocks the assassination of someone who in real life is probably one of her heroes.

    I think this is the Obama camp beating the drum FOR assassination. I think they’re ramping their crazies up hoping for an attack on her.

    That’s why I’m so offended. I didn’t know if I wanted to write that, but that’s what I think is transpiring here. I think they were looking for a way to discuss assassination and this served the purpose. Hillary would tell me I’m being silly, but I don’t think I am.

  35. http://www.correntewire.com/what_is_to_be_done_0#comment-90913

    Lambert at Corrente wants to start a new media watchdog site which will highlight most outrageous MCM (mainstream corporate media) and blog outrages, such as this flaming of Hillary, this ridiculous use of a comment to attack her.

    He suggests using MediaWhoresOnLine.xxx, since the site has gone into retirement.

    I suggested something which references but does not so clearly “take” the name–and I can’t think of anything.

    Please get creative and leave a comment for Lambert. I’m just totally blank….

  36. katiebird – thanks! I missed it before and it makes me feel better now. I wonder it the MSM will cover it. They barely mentioned RFK’s childrens’ endorsement of Hillary in January though they were falling all over themselves about Ted and Caroline’s endorsement.

  37. katiebird – thanks! I missed it before and it makes me feel better now. I wonder it the MSM will cover it. They barely mentioned RFK’s childrens’ endorsement of Hillary in January though they were falling all over themselves about Ted and Caroline’s endorsement of OB.

  38. I don’t why people would assume that any reference to assasination should automatically be BO-centric, anyway. There’s only one candidate who has been threatened during this primary, and the threat was not aimed at Obama.

  39. katiebird – thanks! I missed it before and it makes me feel better now. I wonder it the MSM will cover it. They barely mentioned RFK’s childrens’ endorsement of Hillary in January though they were falling all over themselves about Ted and Caroline’s endorsement of Obama.

  40. I don’t why people would assume that any reference to assassination should automatically be BO-centric, anyway. There’s only one candidate who has been threatened during this primary, and the threat was not aimed at Obama.

  41. Hillary in the White House will face this crap every three days. There will be a new ” Whatevergate” every week outrage . I don’t say this to be discouraging.

    Maybe it’s time that people who are sick of the games and the manipulation should turn the television off.

    Maybe it’s time we reclaimed our democracy?

  42. First paragraph of newsweek –

    “NEWSWEEK Poll of registered voters, Obama trails presumptive Republican nominee Sen. John McCain 40 percent to 52 percent among whites. Sen. Hillary Clinton, Obama’s challenger for the Democratic nomination, also trails McCain among white voters but by a smaller margin, 44 percent to 48 percent. (For the complete results, click here).”


  43. SPEAKING OF RECLAIMING OUR DEMOCRACY..watch this video and get a good laugh after this ugly night of politics:

  44. katiebird…nice to see you back.

    Did you see where BTD is going to start going after Keith O. big time if Jeralyn will let him? If she doesn’t, I hope he starts his own blog so he can do it. I will never ever watch KO again. He should lose his job. (I quit watching him in February except I did watch his Hillary is David Duke special comment and his interview with Hillary. No more.

  45. Lori,
    Your comment landed in the approval que. But I’m a little nervous to post it.

    I think we have to be careful about how far we go with certain feelings & Ideas.

  46. Bobby Kennedy, Jr. has already come out and made a statement in which he says Senator Clinton was obviously making a historical reference about continuing her campaign until “June.” If he’s taken no offense to the comment then the BO supporters will merely shoot themselves in the foot if they continue with the utter nonsense, insisting Clinton was making a veiled threat [or whatever they’re claiming].

    But this is a scary preview of what to expect in the future, methinks. It just gets uglier and uglier. The Republicans must be laughing their fool heads off.

  47. Katie,

    Oh, I understand. That’s what I meant when i said I didn’t know if I could write it or not. But I’m think I’m right about this – this brouhaha is about ramping up the crazies. The Obama camp knew where calling her out on this would go and so it’s shocking to me that they did it. They are being immensely careless – not that I’m surprised by that. Obama’s association with Rezko is careless. With Wright is careless. He is careless.

    I am staggered by this development today. I’ve gone back and forth about voting for McCain. I’ve long said I wouldn’t do it. The other day I thought about doing it, but changed my mind. Now, I know I will. I won’t participate in saddling the Democratic party with Obama in the White House should he be the nominee. This is bigger than this election.

  48. Ben Carlson thanks for posting that Onion link.

  49. ben: I enjoyed watching it. Thanks for sharing.

    kbird: nice to see you are back.

  50. Charles – that is exactly how I feel !

  51. No, someone here said Humphrey (who won the pop vote) went on Gene McCarthy’s ticket as VP and it ruined him. She can’t do it.

  52. Oh, hey all, I forgot to say, needed a copy of my driver’s license today, so I re-registered as unaffiliated. It was quite liberating.

  53. What she be noted is how despite the continued onslaught against Hillary (which preceded this campaign, btw) hasn’t deterred her ability to make her case to the voters. Her negatives have gone down, because they’ve had the opportunity to see the woman as she truly is — and they like it, alot.

    Her opponent, on the other hand, has only had of modicum of scrutiny and what know what hit ’em with the ish really starts hitting the fan.

  54. Congrats, Melanie!

  55. I never thought there was any fury left, but I think that tonight, I feel more anger than I did at any point in this primary. I realize that there genuinely was a line crossed today, and now, I understand that not only will I not vote for or support Obama, I will actively campaign against him. I will donate to his opponents, I will knock on doors, I will canvass, I will write letters. Today, they made a motivated activist out of me.

    I don’t care if I’m “not a Democrat anymore.” I realized… I don’t really care anymore. I share no common cause with these people, the party establishment and the corporate media and the Obama fans.

    As of today, I am more definitively more opposed to Obama than I am to McCain.

  56. What she be noted

    “should” Pardon the typo.

  57. Melanie,

    Humphrey was LBJ’s VP. He was a very powerful politician before that and was a great liberal fighter. Gene McCarthy never had a chance to have a VP. Humphrey was the nominee in 1968 and lost to Richard Nixon.

  58. You are welcome. I love when the woman says about how much her vote would cost: “It depends on what state i’m living in at the time.”

    Ironically, the general public is comign around to Hillary. As for Barry, not so much.

  59. “I don’t care if I’m “not a Democrat anymore.” I realized… I don’t really care anymore.”

    Getting harder and harder to justify what the word means. And, moreover, just how the heck it applies to what we’re witnessing in this primary cycle, so far.

  60. hlr: I agree, and one of the big things that has backfired with me is the obviously phony drama about Obama being in danger. Ooooo, poor Obama! See? He’s just like the heroes who died, he’s larger than life, oooooo, don’t you feel bad for poor, magnificent Obama? Ugh. What are they, teenage groupies hanging outside the stage door? It’s a calculated marketing, branding ploy and it doesn’t work on me. All public figures have these problems and few people in this world have the secret service and endless protection funds at their disposal. Certainly not the lunchbucket low information commoners for which Team Obama has such contempt.

    That one really makes me see red. And it’s so obviously fake outrage — I imagine only a few Obama fans are such cultish nuts that they would ever believe that Senator Clinton really, actually meant anything by her words… and the rest are just the pearl-clutching dancing droids of the pied piper.

    Geez, I’m even angrier than I realized tonight.

  61. Lori and Alice,

    I too am stunned by how angered I am by this. I’m back to normal now, but earlier I was so enraged by the Obama supporters here, I had to shut off the computer. I will never understand how anyone could support this man. In the space of a few months, I have gone from thinking he might be an interesting choice and not wanting Hillary at all to Edwards supporter.

    In the process of watching the debates I grew to like and admire Hillary, and finally decided to vote for her on Feb. 5. Even then, I knew it would be very hard for me to vote for Obama if he won the nomination.

    But today, I’ve reached the point where I no longer care about the Democratic Party and where I would actually consider voting for McCain to prevent Obama from being president. If it weren’t for the rest of you, I’d wonder if I’d lost my mind. But I think my feelings are to some extent shared by at least half of the party.

    It’s really amazing that Obama has managed to create this much chaos. But that is what narcissists do best, and he is doing it on a national scale. It’s stunning.

  62. Axelrod should have watched this before speaking today…you just burned down the bridge, baby: . However, the strong and committed support for Clinton means that Obama is now entering the most perilous phase of his candidacy.

  63. Alice,

    It’s becoming clear the majority of the general public aren’t too keen on coddling their presidential candidates the way much of the media has for the Illinois senator. It’s getting old already. The public want to know they have someone who can take the hits and keep rolling without whining about every lil’ thing. Hillary’s demonstrating EXACTLY what they want in a president. Which is why she’s continued to earn greater support over the course of this primary.

  64. bostonboomer, LOL, I got that wrong. Who was McGovern’s VP?

  65. oops…sorry, at Rasmussen there is a video about how Obama needs to make nice with Clinton supporters. This is must see TV folks.

  66. As time goes on I just become less and less sorry that I do not have cable TV. The worst part about it is I am going to have to wait like another hour for a torrent to be up of the new BattleStar to be up. Seriously, that is the worst part. The best part is I never have to listen to any of the crap they say – that applies to all of them FOX, MSNBC, and CNN.

  67. Shriver was the VP for McGovern

  68. BB, I know exactly what you mean. I would never previously have even considered not voting. I won’t vote for him. McCain will win my state easily so it won’t matter anyway. It’s the only power we have left in this Party…the only way to show them our disgust with how this primary has been handled.

  69. Ben,

    McGovern’s VP was Thomas Eagleton. He was forced to withdraw when it came out that he had been treated for major depression with ECT. It was all over after that. Shriver was just filler.

  70. Tabbycat – please, reconsider your vote. Regarless of the outcome in your state, you’ll want the satisfaction of knowing you’ve participated in giving rise to the “disaffected” faction of the party. Let your voice be heard – loud and clear. Because if this continues to go the way the DNC’s hellbent on gaming it, we want there to be NO mistaking our sentiments.

  71. Hi everybody
    been reading for awhile, decided to check the water temperature.
    hmm, pretty good, not too warm not too cold

    I’ve a different perspective on this election. being born and raised in europe, i recognize the obama’s democratic party. it sounds and look as the european far left. yuck

  72. Melanie,

    No biggie. All those Democratic losers kind of fade meld together, don’t they? I wonder if this is what happened to the Whig party? I’m not a historian….Charles?

  73. boston, funny. Hehehe

  74. jawbone,
    that would be great if Lambert starts up a media critique. god knows we need it, and the need is not going to go away. If Obama wins (please god no) then orange satan and his minions will become mainstream and need to be critiqued much more seriously. If McCain wins then it’s more of what we’ve had the last 8 years (judy miller anyone?). If Hillary wins (please god yes) then it’s back to travelgate and all the media insanity of the 90’s.

    Maybe he could call it The Missing Media Critique — did he coin that phrase? Maybe too bland, but i hope he doesnt use the word “whores” in the name.

    Because These Idiots Aren’t Going to Slap Themselves?
    Hucksters and Harpies and Hacks, Oh My!
    The George Orwell Report

    Too tired for good ideas, but I do hope he follows through. He doesnt need to sleep or eat or sleep, right?

  75. Edwardian…I’m afraid my Dad and brother in heaven will send a bolt of lightning toward me! It is very tempting. I can’t express in words how angry I am. Every single member of my family and my late brother’s wife’s family, all 100% die-hard Democrats are sitting this one out or voting for McCain.

    I’m like Alice above, I can’t think of a word to describe my anger and disgust. I will consider your request but it will be hard for me. It wouldn’t be hard to vote no to Obama, it’s the yes to any Republican that bothers me. I’m trying to see if I can write Hillary in. That I can do.

  76. “I’m trying to see if I can write Hillary in. That I can do.”

    Or one of the “alternative” candidates on the ballot. Whatever works for you — and doesn’t somehow become a vote for “Mr. Unqualified for Hall Monitor”. 🙂

  77. Oh, tabbycat… I’m so sorry.

    I’m sure your family in heaven is totally on your side though — whatever you decide.

    This is a stressful time. But Hillary’s letting it roll off her back, she thinks it’s all a perverse sort of complement.

    We should too.

  78. And thank God for Robert Kennedy Jr.

    you know I never knew much about him, but I was poking around google – he sounds like a pretty awesome guy.

    this election is sure making me look at everyone anew. People I never thought twice about surprising me in good ways and winning my respect – while people I thought I admired, suddenly I have NO respect for – it’s like falling through a rabbit-hole.

  79. sorry for being ot.

    Kicking up all this muck just to try hurt Hillary is a travesty. It is so disrespectful of a great American family’s sacrifices for this country, and at a time when that family is facing yet another devastating loss.

    Obama’s callousness knows no bounds. This is how he treats a family who has almost unanimously rallied around his candidacy? He uses them and their pain to kneecap a worthy opponent.

    He makes a mockery of the Kennedy sacrifices and a mockery as well of the deep and lasting pain of Americans who were there and for whom it was a searingly painful event and time.

    The commenters here who have told their memories and what RFK’s life, campaign, and murder meant to them help expose how low it is for Obama to rake up muck for them.

    He’s already opened up many old wounds in the service of his vast personal ambition. Now he’s going to rub salt in those wounds.

    Shameful and cruel, it really is.

  80. Some of the blogs are alive with such rants that would make your hair stand on end. They are holding KO up as some kind of hero for “taking her on” and speaking the truth. The Obama campaign just threw out a trial balloon to judge the mood of the electorate with their righteous indignation. You would have to be brain dead to deconstruct any hint of violence in that statement. They are truly in the market to quiet any form of dissent. This frightens me should they attain the office of pres.

  81. I am with this guy:
    Memo to Hillary Clinton: Please don’t quit

    I have only two words to share with you about your valiant quest to become the 44th president of the United States and the first woman to hold the highest office in the land:

    Don’t quit.

    A ton of pundits and political operatives have asked you to give up. Ignore them.

    They have asked you to step aside for the good of the Democratic Party and let Sen. Barack Obama stand as the presumptive nominee. His rise to that post would be historic, too, making him the first African American to go that far.

    The pundits and political operatives repeatedly have professed that you would be doing more harm than good to the party if you don’t surrender now. But for all of your supporters, the country and our way of life, I say don’t quit.

    It doesn’t matter whether women in the United States have seen you in person, heard you in the debates or voted for you in the primaries or not. What matters is every woman who believes in America needs you to stay in the race all the way to the Democratic National Convention on Aug. 25-28 in Denver.

    Every girl needs you to go the distance. You have come too far to fold now. For every woman’s and girl’s sake, don’t quit.

    Men and boys need to witness your perseverance, too, and know that the force of your will is in the hearts and minds of every female. Such drive, determination, duty and character have helped to make this country a superpower.

    Even though no woman has been president up to now, every woman has given endless amounts of sweat, blood and true grit to make this nation what it is today. There would be no America if women had folded under the strain of childbirth or if women hadn’t endured the misery of scratching out a living from the land, traveling across the vastness of our countryside. Women have been treated like chattel and second-class citizens, working in sweat shops, remaining in the shadows endlessly serving others and maintaining the home front while their sons come home from the wars. Still, women make only 77 cents for every dollar that men earn. Don’t quit. Our men and boys need to see you go the distance.

    It’s a very heartfelt piece. The whole op-ed is worth reading.

  82. (nodding) murphy,

    And the people who will be most hurt (are the most hurt) – aside from possibly the Kennedy’s themselves – are the very people already most dissatisfied with his campaign.

    Now that I’ve calmed down, I can’t believe how upset I got. It’s like he stole a piece of my life– just scribbled over it with crayon or something.

    At the time, I thought it was all about Hillary. But I think there was a little more to it. He’s been so dismissive of the events of the 1960s. He’s got no right to interpret what those events meant to Hillary.

  83. Obamites, or kidneystones? Kidneystones, or Obamites? So hard to decide …

    Signing off for now.

  84. I was alive during the Bobby Kennedy period. Bobby took a lot of hits as well. When he went to NY and ran for senator he was called an “opportunistic carpetbagger”. He was called ruthless and untrustworthy if anyone else remembers.

    Bobby came into his own during that period of his life as senator. He took up the cry of the poor in particular. He was assassinated by a man from Jordan who openly disagreed with Bobby’s stand regarding the mideast.

    Hillary in now way disrespected either Bobby or Obama and to say otherwise is just sheer malice.

  85. RFK Jr. understood Hillary’s comment correctly. Does anyone seriously think that HE would tolerate it if she had sent “dog whistles” to potential assassins, as the progressives claim she has done?

    I’ve counted among my friends two people close to the case. One of them was shot non-fatally that night in the Ambassador. (He still has the jacket he wore; I’ve seen the bullet hole.)

    I’ve also spoken and corresponded at length with the late Phil Melanson, who wrote what I consider the best book on the assassination.

    I feel strongly about what happened that night. And I would not tolerate anyone who hinting that assassination was desirable.

    Hillary said not one word requiring apology. The progressives should apologize for their ludicrous misinterpretations.

    More than that. I am searching out instances in which progressives publish online threats against the life of Hillary Clinton — and I am bringing them to the attention of the Secret Service. I hope others will join me.

    One such instance appeared on Wonkette.

    On my own blog, I document another threat against her life on guess-which-site.

    Things really have gotten that bad. Obama supporters are literally threatening the life of Hillary Clinton — in public — explicitly, leaving no room for interpretation.

  86. The difference between Bobby and McCarthy in those days was defined for me by something that I’ve posted about before.

    I still have audio tapes somewhere (old-fashioned tape) of both their responses one Sunday to Meet the Press and probably Face the Nation.

    McCarthy said Vietnam was like a bad child you had beaten before to teach them a lesson but it didn’t do any good and so there’s no reason to waste any more time trying to punish them.

    RFK said if we see a photo of our own guys 11,000 miles away with a rifle to an old woman’s head and we are not bothered by it we have lost our something very important.

    That’s when I decided to work for his campaign, though I had been intrigued by McCarthy’s loftily poetic head.

  87. The British Press tells it like it is (an excerpt with link to article)

    Hating Hillary
    Andrew Stephen
    Published 22 May 2008


    Gloating, unshackled sexism of the ugliest kind has been shamelessly peddled by the US media, which – sooner rather than later, I fear – will have to account for their sins

    History, I suspect, will look back on the past six months as an example of America going through one of its collectively deranged episodes – rather like Prohibition from 1920-33, or McCarthyism some 30 years later. This time it is gloating, unshackled sexism of the ugliest kind. It has been shamelessly peddled by the US media, which – sooner rather than later, I fear – will have to account for their sins. The chief victim has been Senator Hillary Clinton, but the ramifications could be hugely harmful for America and the world.

    I am no particular fan of Clinton. Nor, I think, would friends and colleagues accuse me of being racist. But it is quite inconceivable that any leading male presidential candidate would be treated with such hatred and scorn as Clinton has been. What other senator and serious White House contender would be likened by National Public Radio’s political editor, Ken Rudin, to the demoniac, knife-wielding stalker played by Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction? Or described as “a fucking whore” by Randi Rhodes, one of the foremost personalities of the supposedly liberal Air America? Would Carl Bernstein (of Woodward and Bernstein fame) ever publicly declare his disgust about a male candidate’s “thick ankles”? Could anybody have envisaged that a website set up specifically to oppose any other candidate would be called Citizens United Not Timid? (We do not need an acronym for that.)

  88. Alice

    I saw the interview this morning and came away impressed with Hillary’s command of all subject matters, and once again saw what a formidable candidate she is, how she keeps getting better and better. Then I hear this nonsense and like many of you saw it for what it was: desperation of the Obama camp and the kiss ass media to help Obambi;
    They just want to shut her down because she keeps getting stronger and his weaknesses are highlighted. Well, the word police came out in full force; I have never seen a campaign cycle like this. The media is soooo in the tank it just leaves me trembling with rage. I went to Hillary’s site, contributed, and then walked away from the computer. Thankfully I no longer watch much TV but at NQ I saw how the MSNBC and CNN pond scum (Obama Networks) were trying to hype this nonsense.
    I made peace with voting for McCain a while back if Obama became the nominee, but now not only will I vote for him, I will actively campaign for McCain. I have become really frightened of Obama and his followers and to what extent they will go. This is a man who talks of “unity” and “reaching out”, what a joke! Just looking at how they have operated and behaved confirms what sexist race baiting monsters they are Hillary or McCain are they only alternatives. I hope Hillary takes this to the convention.

  89. katie, you’re so sweet. It’s been a while, so I’m okay. My mother and I have talked a lot about what my brother would think about this. He was Gore’s campaign manager in my area of TN and he lived for politics. He would be working hard for Hillary right now, I do know that. His wife, my dear sister-in-law would make sure of that!

    My precious dog’s platelet count dropped again today. Say a dog prayer for me. It’s been a horrible day all around. I haven’t even turned my TV on.

  90. This is actually true.

    Right now, I just pressed pause on Keith Obamaman’s special after 1:15 because I couldn’t stop laughing.

    He looks like a caricature of a comedian doing a bad impression of Keith Obamaman. It’s sooo over the top and so ludicrous you can’t help but guffaw.

    I don’t think I gonna watch the rest because I’m going to bed.

    For those who care to watch it. Which him surpass your most comical expectations.

    As I said, 1:15 were enough for me.

  91. Tabbycat — please hang in there.


  92. Joseph, I’ve seen horrible stuff left on Ezra Klein’s site. Take a look at Democrat’s comment on this post (at 2:12 pm)

    I emailed Ezra about it that day AND pointed it out in the thread. Yet it’s still there, all these months later.

  93. Denise, what happened to their be nice to Hillary so we can get her voters campaign. The screwed that up big time. Their hate is so strong they don’t care if they harm themselves as long as they are hurting her. I’ll bet Bill Clinton is about to explode.

  94. As a Democrat who might have voted for one liberal Republican in my life (I’m not sure), I will proudly vote for McCain. My entire family is doing the same if Obama is the nominee.

    I crossed the line from writing Hillary’s name in to voting against Obama a few weeks ago. I can’t even remember which putrid pile-on was the final straw. I live in a state that has lots of electoral votes and went for Hillary during the nomination. It could definitely go for McCain in the General Election against Obama. Just about every Hillary supporter I know is fed up with this whining narcissist with the thin resume and his Republican campaign tactics.

    The crescendo to tell Nancy P and the Pips that this is not our Democratic Party has reached a crescendo. NoBama ’08!

  95. Tabby – sending prayers and uplifting thoughts your way.

  96. whoa, J. Cannon and others. I was born after RFK was killed. Reading you guys’ deeply personal comments tonight has been moving. Seems like this incident is one of those “triggering” events that I’ve recently learned about. Hillary’s comments were perfectly commonplace and straightforward — they were basically talking points for goodness sake! The cynical outrage machine cranked up and bam! all sorts of good people found themselves back in their 40-years-younger selves. He and his campaign have compounded the dismay and anxiety that so many democrats have already been feeling by heartlessly turning it up another notch.

    My heart goes out to all the readers who are having personal painful memories brought to the surface by that creep and every last one of his supporters. This was a shameful day for Obama and his staff. They will pay for it though. He is going to lose on a monumental scale.

    So many people are permanently turning their backs on Obama. I wish him a long and healthy life. Not simply because he’s going to need a helluva lot of time to come to understand how devastatingly damaging his actions and inactions as a presidential candidate have been to the country and the party he claims to love.

  97. For the morning — (might be even worth a front page link) — get thee to Anglachel’s site. After praising this site for its stand today against the madness, she takes her impeccable aim at the blogger boyz/girlz past racist attacks on Obama.


    It helps to prove her theory that A-List Bloggers motivated by their hatred of Clintons more than love of Obama. It also underscores their own hypocrisy on the race issue.

    But I can’t do it justice. Go check it out at http://anglachelg.blogspot.com/2008/05/jackals.html#comments

  98. Cdaylgo & Edwardian, thank you. My little dog is my baby. I’m warped, I know, but he is.

    Katie, that’s a fine comment. That person needs to be talked to by the Secret Service. People are just sick. In all of our disgust, I’ve seen attacks on Obama’s character but not actual death threats.

  99. {{{Tabbycat}}} I am and will think of you — I wish there was something I could do… praying at least…


  100. Charles:

    I tried to internalize some comically outrageous things Obamaman may say and I tried to imagine the serious face he would be making.

    And yep, just as I expected. He didn’t disappoint me. After 1:15 I knew what the rest would be like.

  101. Tabby-
    I hope your dog feels better. Keep him away from the TV

  102. I thought I could not possibly dislike Obama more, until this.

    I will never vote for Obama, I will vote for McCain if that’s what’s necessary to ensure he is never President.

  103. thanks katie. One more drop and we try chemo. You would love this sweet dog. He’s taking all of my Hillary money!

    MABlue, was Keith spitting and foaming in his righteous anger? I just can’t watch it even if it’s funny it’s so bad. I despise him beyond description.

  104. I am Denise! I hold him while I read blogs. I don’t want to send him any negative vibes so the TV is off.

  105. (nodding) Yes, we’ve talked about this: keep him close to your heart. That way he’ll always be there.

    Chemo. poor little guy. (blinking fast)

  106. Tabby

    Thanks for lifting my spirits,I was cranky till you came along. Now I can go laughing – I’m pretty sure your dog is doing well in betwn your knees- enjoy!

  107. I was liberated for a short while today. I went to the opera with a friend. I’ve been home for about an hour and havebeen trying to catch up on the comments.
    I know just what you mean, bb, about turning some corner. I had no plans to vote for BO, but now I will actively do whatever I can to see him defeated.

    I am torn as my son and his wife and mom-in-law are all supporting BO. I can’t even begin to discuss this with them as they seem to either have forgotten history, or didn’t learn it. But it is now beyond my capacity to say even neutral things about BO any longer.

    I got married the day after RFK died. I spent the first day of my married life watching the news of RFK’s final train ride. It should have been a day of celebration for everyone. Winning the CA primary for the Kennedys and getting married for us. And though I was interested and invested in the political, this event made me more that focused. RFK was my hero. He was also human.

    Hillary is my hero. I never thought I’d be saying this about Hillary. But I am and she is a hero for her strength and her perseverance and her values. I can’t
    even begin to say how sad and angry I am today. The MCM will do anything and use anything – even the kitchen sink – to destroy her and our country along wiht her. In the past 15 minutes, the news radio station I have on has mentioned Hillary’s statement (without actually quoting her), as well as her apology. And then has followed up with their condemnation by the BO people.

    This is sickening.

  108. myiq2xu — Corrente is down. I emailed Lambert. Should anyone else be told?

  109. Is this why they have Soccer Hooligans in Britain?

    I’ve never undersood sports, but it seems today that we need an institution like that that these people could get into instead of this witch hunt.

    The rest of us could continue trying to positively influence policy.

  110. Katiebird: His next of kin?

    Seriously, it’s up for me.

  111. leslie, could you send your comment to the station as a letter? They may get their news off a feed without really paying attention. Maybe your letter could highlight the injustice.

  112. It’s back for me too. Maybe he reset something??

  113. Denise, lol, I need to change my user name. I don’t even have a cat!

    katie…thank you for being my friend. You are such a good person.

    leslie, I’d have to divorce my family. That would be so hard for me to deal with. I only know one Obama supporter in real life. And her husband is a big Hillary supporter!

  114. I was in 7th grade in 1968, and I was devastated when Kennedy was shot. Like Hillary, I will never forget that day, the California primary, or the time of year. Kennedy did not die right away, and I remember praying hard all day on the 5th of June that he would survive. And I’m an atheist.

    Obama is no Bobby Kennedy, and I’m sure I’m not the only one who finds it highly presumptuous of Obama to dream that Hillary’s comment had anything to do with him. It was clear to me in 1968 that RFK was running because he actually CARED about people, not to satisfy an overweening personal ambition. Kennedy would NEVER have campaigned like Obama does–he wasn’t passive aggressive, he wasn’t petty, he wasn’t puerile, and he was much, much more intelligent.

  115. Thank you {{tabbycat}}. I don’t know that I am such a good person — I spit on someone just this morning not in real life!

  116. MABlue, I started watching the special comment and got about 45 seconds in before I started laughing out loud. I can’t watch more than a few seconds at a time, it’s so over the top and insane.

    I can’t believe his handlers even let that go on the air?! And holy s#$* they let him bloviate for ten solid minutes? At least the crazy part of the Dean scream speech was maybe two minutes? This one’s going to be a youtube classic..

  117. Cdalygo, wow– Anglachel’s always two steps ahead….

  118. That’s ok katie. You’ve earned the right to spit. I’d like to slap them silly. We will teach them a lesson this fall. I have a long memory.

    My sister-in-law’s mom loved Theresa Kerry until now. She has switched to Hunts ketchup over this! I don’t even know if she still owns Heinz but they lost a customer over it. I thought of her yesterday and I bought Hunts too. Don’t tell me if Hunts is evil..I don’t want to know.

  119. His brother’s death barely four years earlier was still much too fresh in our minds when RFK entered the primary in March 1968 and we were afraid for him.

    It was just three weeks later that Dr. King was was shot and killed on that motel balcony in my home town. It was a horrifying spring. I remember watching the news, feeling stunned and thinking that now the world had gone completely crazy, that I no longer understood the people around me.

    I was just beginning to understand that the fight for civil rights was everybody’s fight. Robert Kennedy, in his memorial speech, quoted Aeschulus:

    Even in our sleep, pain which cannot forget
    Falls drop by drop upon the heart,
    Until, in our own despair,
    Against our will,
    Comes wisdom
    Through the awful grace of God.

    Then Robert Kennedy, fighting for all our lives, bearing his own grief, showing his great courage, in June, walked into that California ballroom.

    These memories are seared deeply into the mind of Hillary Clinton and are clearly part of what formed her sense of purpose when she chose a life of public service.

    We need that kind of wisdom, here, and I see much more of that in Clinton’s mention of June campaigns she has known than I do in the Obama campaign’s sophomoric accusations and gotcha games. Enough.

  120. I apologize if I’m being flip where it’s not appropriate, this all happened a decade before I was born so I don’t have the same sense of history. But then, I also get the feeling the people going completely off the rails with outrage don’t either, and weren’t around when any of this happened, so think it’s OK to use it as a political cheap shot (since we know nothing is off the table in that regard when it comes to the Clintons).

  121. katie; thanks for ths suggestion. I just called them, and the girl/intern(?) said she would pass the message on. At midnight, they have old time radio, so there will be nothing until after 1:00 a.m.
    They are running a brilliant abbot and costello right now. Thank goodness for abbott and costello.

    (and I saw very little today from work. but I saw you spit. i was proud.)

    tabby, i am sorry about your sweet dog. there is nothing odd about thinking of your pet as family. pet are family as far as i’m concerned.
    and i can’t divorce my family. we just don’t talk about the race, errrr, campaign. 😉

  122. That which is not resolved is projected.

    I am seeing their outrage at Clinton’s comment within the context of the violent rhetoric that the left has used against Clinton. The idea of “kneecapping” her, Olbermann’s comments about a Super Delegate taking her into a room and only “he” comes out, Democratic congressman Steve Cohen’s comparison of Clinton to the Glenn Close character in Fatal Attraction. Andrew Sullivan claiming she’s a sociopath. Wright’s allegory portraying the crucifixion as “rich, white men” persecuting a black man in the context of this campaign. Wil Wheaton referring to her as the “crazy, psycho ex-girlfriend of the Democratic party”. So all of these references that include violence against Clinton and/or references to violent characters vis a vis Clinton’s run against Obama, now culminates in these same people accusing Clinton of dog-whistling assassination against Obama. That’s the context I see this accusation in. And I am profounding uncomfortable with that development.

  123. leslie, I know you can’t divorce them but it must be hard for you. In 2004, my family was all over the place on who to be for in the primary. There wasn’t the least bit of this kind of anger going on (in the real world anyway, maybe the blogs). This is just unreal.

    I’ve never thought of voting for our nominee as holding my nose to do it. They were all fine with me. This time, it’s beyond holding my nose. I just can’t do it. It would be like giving my approval to how they’ve allowed this campaign to be run. I can’t let them think I got over it because I won’t.

  124. Anita: ???

    MLK was killed in April, right after my 8th birthday

    RFK was killed 2 months later, on the first Tuesday in June

    JFK was killed in 1963, 4 1/2 years earlier.

  125. tabbycat, i sat with them on mother’s day and heard them say how much they “hate” hillary. they can’t even be specific – or won’t – when i ask them what is it they don’t like. and these are truly decent, hard working people. i want them to watch the film “the hunting of the president:”. it is based on the book by joe conason and gene lyons. this meme ov evil clintons has been here since before he ran for governor.

    i think the republicans are jealous, angry and vindictive and have used the MCM to such an extent that BO is now finding an open and willing market for their lies and faux outrage.

    and it does make me ill.

  126. Anita:

    Sorry, I re-read it and you were correct. RFK entered the race in March, then MLK was killed 3 weeks later.

  127. I won’t get over it. I vacillate between terribly sad and terribly angry. There is almost nothing as sickening as watching a bunch of men screaming abuse at a woman along with a chorus of angry-faced girls getting in a few kicks for good measure and having the ring-leader standing looking smugly on.
    I won’t get over this campaign and we have a long way to repair the damage that has been with all of the fear and distrust stirred up by the BO campaign. How dare they accuse Hillary of all the nasty tactics that they have used. It’s disgusting.

  128. myiqi2xu,
    IIRC RFK was shot on june 5, the first wednesday in june 1968, early in the morning while he was addressing his supporters following the june 4 primary.

  129. I feel for you leslie. The only non-Hillary supporter in my family is a niece that loves McCain. I’m not even trying to talk to her about that anymore. It’s funny though, she started out thinking Hillary was evil but if she was running against anyone but McCain, she’d vote for Hillary. She’s a military wife and they all love McCain even though he votes against their interests sometimes.

    Good night all. I’m going to take the sick Puppy and try to scoot my husband and the other dog over so we can go to bed. Thanks for the good company. See you tomorrow for the latest episode of “how dare she run against Obama”.

  130. robin, that is a perfect description of what is happening.and it is disgusting.

    they are simply tearing this country apart. and they dont give a hoot, because to them it is all about beating someone. not simply winning but destroying whatever gets in their way.
    I was completely sickened by the front page on Slate this week entitled “Lady Get out of My Way”. The article is entitled “Lady you’re in my Way”. I wonder if the article name is different so as not to sound so misogynist.

  131. tabbycat, good luck with sick Puppy. and thanks for the empathic comments.

  132. i ought to have said good night myself. so I will. hillary is so fortunate to have the conflucians on her side.

    i am fortunate to have found you all.

  133. leslie: Tuesday night/Wednesday morning.

    California primaries used to be the first Tuesday in June. Actually, they still are, except for this year’s Presidential primary.

  134. Dotcommodity, soccer hooligans are actually a really interesting subject. I had an article for a class, “Spectator Violence at Football Matches: Towards a Sociological Explanation” by Dunning, Murphy, and Williams. It was a really interesting read. I could e-mail it to you if you are interested and do not have access to journal articles.

  135. Charles: I am a SF Giants fan. That means I hate the Dodgers.

    Any year that the Giants at least knock the Dodgers out of playoff contention is a good year. I have seen that happen, a year where the Giants finished in last, but won the last game of the year and prevented the Dodgers from winning the division. I have also seen them return the favor.

    But that is sports competition. I cheer for my team, but I don’t want to see Dodger players or fans injured. I don’t want my team to cheat either. I want them to win fair and square.

    If we lose, shake hands, and wait ’til next year!

    This political campaign is sickening. And not because of Hillary or her supporters.

  136. Re. Senator Clinton and the RFK debacle: I am wondering if anybody else is worried for Senator Clinton’s life. I haven’t had time to read all the foregoing comments so I apologize if the following concerns have been discussed. [xposted at TL]
    Who feels sick? By sick, I mean like irrevocable damage has been done, and it’s going to get worse. We have a long-weekend news cycle ahead for this monstrous thing to metastisize.

    Somebody deliberately unleashed this tsunami of hate on Senator Clinton today. I want to know who first twisted her simple RFK comment into a threat on Obama’s life. Who?

    Who could not foresee that we now have hundreds of thousands of enraged Obama supporters who think Senator Clinton is responsible for planting an idea about assassinating Obama? Could anybody not foresee that Senator Clinton would become the direct object of that rage?

    Does anybody doubt how at-risk Hillary must feel tonight? Not for her political future, but for her life itself.

    Where is the outrage about the threat that Senator Clinton will continue to face throughout this nomination process, on through the election, and beyond? Would any one of us want to be in her shoes at her next public rally? I think not.

    Somebody spun this unspeakable thing. We need to take a very long look here at who was the intended victim and who was the intended beneficiary. The question answers itself. Yet that answer will not be forthcoming from the likes of the Kos or TPM or the MSM pundits. No, they’ll put Hillary on the receiving end of an Orwellian, full-bore hate week.

    The only person who can put a stop to this madness is BARACK OBAMA and it needs to happen before the sun sets on another day.

  137. I really don’t think that Hillary is in danger of harm over this. There’s a lot of noise and people are saying some crazy things, but I haven’t seen anyone suggest bodily harm. And she’s got Secret Service protection so she’s in good hands.

    In political terms this may turn out awfully bad though.

  138. I won’t go to the O-blogs, but how long before they start attacking RFK junior for supporting Hillary?

    Another blog that I’m crossing off my favorites list this morning: The Left Coaster. Steve Soto is calling for Hillary to drop out, because of course she was suggesting that Obama could be killed and then she could be the nominee. Steve, you are sick. Please get treatment. In the meantime, you’ll never get another click from me.

  139. I saw that too, Soto is a moron.

    Eriposte is worth the visits though, but hasn’t been posting much lately.

  140. I’d like to keep reading eRiposte, but he needs to get his own blog. I can’t even read Turkana anymore.

  141. I can’t believe the OFB are still flogging this fauxrage.

    They don’t seem to realize how deranged they look.

    I hope they keep at it, they are only helping Hillary

  142. The derangement is in full bloom. Even Axelrod is trying to walk this one back. Too late. The party is done. Obama has done what the GOP could never succeed in doing.

  143. I was born December 12th, 1968.

    1967 had the Summer of Love.

    I used to say: I was born at the End of the Fall of Hate.

  144. Ga6thDem, What could Axelrod possibly say? Or Obama himself.

    It was a disgusting attack. And it had to come from them.

  145. Who? That’s the question I woke up with this morning? Where did this come from?

  146. Wow, I totally missed all the ugliness as I was on the road.

    My question is for Ella, Ryan and the other various Obama supporters who come here.

    Does it give you pause that Obama and company use the memory of RFK to try and score cheap politcal points?

    Does it bother you that Obama wants you to believe that Clinton was referring to a possible Obama assassination?

    Distortion and Lying? Sounds like Republicans to me. Sounds like Swiftboating.

    Is Swiftboating okay when it helps YOUR candidate?

  147. They have no sense or shame. Their reaction says more about them than it does about Hillary.

  148. yesterday on the thom hartman show the callers (not him he is very fair) were talking about assassination alot (before this stuff blew sky high) but in reference to her being VP would set that up. so they seem to be really pushing that meme that he is in danger and in danger from HRC supporters. absurd.

    the level of insanity that has been reached is unparalleled. I was so furious about the spin on the RFK comment that I couldn’t even sleep.
    I have felt that my anger at the Obama tactics would abate — but with the complete complicity of the media I get, for lack of a better word… furiouser and furiouser. WTH – this country is in a disaster. My little rural town is paying $3.90 a gallon for gas and EVERYONE is suffering and can barely afford the basics.

    please save us from ourselves ~

  149. I missed all the ugliness too because I fell asleep as soon as I got home from work. Like many people here, I remember 1968 all too well. (I was born in 1952.)

    As I read last night’s comments, I was nodding in agreement with those who found this latest obamanation a “tipping point.” Thank you all for saying what needed to be said.

    I’ll be back later with my broom and mop to clean up the mess some folks left here. Fret not. Today is a new day. Hillary is strong and so are we!

    Hillary 2008.

  150. Morning all. Sunny day, sunny day (at least in the Finger Lakes region). How am I going to spend the day? Fixing an old house. Oy….

    myiqu: OFB? Obama Fans Base?

  151. indigo: I like “furiouser”. Pretty much describes it.

  152. They tried to dial it down. Axelrod was on hardball “defending” Hillary. Too late. Enough is enough.

  153. Axelrod is the new Rove

  154. Hullaballoo and C&L have completely ignored the story.

    They lean towards Obama but they’re not kool-aid drinkers.

    Koppleman at Salon had a blurb, but mostly treated it as straight news.

    The OFB blogs are still in full panty-twist mode. It’s actually kinda funny.

  155. Don’t let this BS get us distracted from FL and MI.

    They want to divert attention away from that at all costs.

  156. Good morning again. It’s a glorious day in Chappaqua, NY! Good picnic and parade weather.

    Thanks for reposting RFK jr’s comments, katiebird. That’s the way to start our day.

  157. Good Morning dear Confluencians (how is that spelled? I’m lucky to spell Confluence correctly this early in the morning)

    I continue to see the brew-ha-ha in the context of Samantha Power’s, Hillary is a Monster comment.

    In the culture of the Obama Campaign they’ve made a monster out of Hillary — probably everyone from Obama himself on down. It might have started as a joke. But, I doubt it. The proof that they take it seriously?

    The proof is in the events of yesterday. ONLY people who think Hillary is a monster could IMMEDIATELY conflate her remarks with a threat on Obama.

    So we saw yesterday that a woman who’s entire life has been spent in public service is (having been lead to it by a would-be President) vilified by the very people who should admire her most.

    This election continues to be the weirdest election ever.

  158. C&L is totally part of the hive mind now.

    Do not give them a break. I was banned from that site criticizing Keith Olbermann.

  159. The Obamabots should relax and have a “let me eat my waffle” day.

  160. Mawm: They still aren’t touching the story. They are closet Obama supporters, but they seem to realize this faux-controversy is deranged.

  161. Thanks to RFK Jr. for his statement.

  162. Here’s a song for that I think describes Hillary supporters:

  163. I am copying a comment I just posted to Talk Left:

    It wasn’t 2 random presidential campaigns

    She mentioned the June Primaries of her husbands first presidential election AND the first election in which she could vote — the 1968 election was burned into the brains of everyone who lived through it.

    But if you were a 21 year old that year it would have been especially significant.

  164. Good morning everyone. Tried to read the traditional press this morning, but just couldn’t stomach it. My thoughts last night and this morning are with Hillary. She has done such brilliant work in this campaign, fighting against all the nastiness of the press, but this attack must really come as a punch in the gut to her. It’s all so deliberately overblown. I’m confident she’ll get through this with her usual grace and tenacity.

  165. Reading through these comments I am now remembering how difficult the split between the McCarthy Dems (I was an early one) and the RFK people (quite a few anti-war/peace people left the McCarthy camp)…how bitter…how it poisoned our politics for years.

    Remembering, too, sitting in an anteroom in a Seattle hotel with Gene McCarthy, waiting for ‘the call’ just the two of us with absolutely nothing to say to one another. That came back to me in recent years as I occasionally saw him on television, beyond strange in his political evolution from the 60s. I’ve always wondered if it was the Jesuitical which drove him over the edge. It would have me…

    I’ve been saying all year that this campaign was more and more like ’68, ’72,’76,’80…predicting that I can’t go through that again. Once was more than enough. I don’t think the party or the country can survive it either and I will never forgive Obama and the boyz who set him up only to take out the Clintons.

    Not acceptable. Sexism, racism…have set us back 50 years…and for what?

    Honestly, RonK…I think a compromise candidate is all that can save us now. Maybe (sigh…ugh…) Al. If not Al, who?

  166. Oldpro, I would almost agree with you — except that I think Hillary’s the only one who can stand up against these constant attacks. She IS impervious to them. And she’s thriving.

    Gore already said he doesn’t have the stomach for this. Would what he’s seen change his mind? And how can we trust a man who said he wasn’t up for it — to handle it well?

  167. (What would one say to Gene McCarthy?)

  168. oldpro: I was too young to really understand the tensions between the McCarthy and Kennedy camps. All I remember was that Kennedy took a tour of Appalachia. That memory is clear. And then his death during the campaign. But McCarthy was beyond me of too few years. I knew that there were many people against the war and that my mother told me that Humphrey would probably keep the war going. I think she was a Kennedy fan. Back then, she was a bleeding heart liberal.
    Anyway, my question is, what was McCarthy’s appeal and how much did his movement resemble Obama’s?

  169. good morning conflucians:

    todays electoral-vote.com predicts a Hillary WhiteHouse win at 315 electoral votes compared to McCain 206 – she is surging ahead in state by state polls assigned to electoralcollege votes.

    May of 2004 had Kerry losing to Bush at about the same rate that Obama is losing to McCain…


    of course Kerry, in May 2004, had not alienated 17 million Democrats who are getting furiouser and furiouser by the minute…

  170. riverdaughter,

    I read her book a few months ago: believe it was McCarthy she campaigned for

  171. As blogged elsewhere, I sent the following e-mail to MSNBC:

    The screed emanating from MSNBC is hate-filled, a non-stop atrocious vendetta against Senator Clinton and her supporters. I have joined in a boycott of your station.

    So far, three of your commentators have had to apologize to Mrs. Clinton, one for suggesting that Senator Clinton be taken to a back room and beaten to death (speaking of assassination-allusions). The propaganda rule book combines all the worst of misogyny, McCarthy-ism, and fascism. I envision Chris Matthews goose-stepping over the graves of soldiers in WV and KY, while applauding his own “superiority”. Your cable newsboys are completely lacking a moral compass and have ritualized polemics to the detriment of the country and to the detriment of their own credibility.

    My choice is to unplug, to boycott your station, and to hope and pray others can see through this constant barrage of venom.

  172. I view this as another blown up point of distraction cleverly pushed about through the media in a desperate effort to hide the fact that Senator Clinton is the best candidate.

    It’s smoke and mirrors to confuse voters. We know better and we’re not so easily distracted or fooled by the false accusations. Hillary is the best candidate and we all know it. Let’s not fret over the pathetic efforts of those who try to create controversy in an effort to hide that truth.

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