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Strike News (and Special Comment) for 2008-01-15 [UPDATE 1]

Alegre’s dailyKos Writers Strike has been noted by ABC, the NYT, Marc Ambinder at The Atlantic (producing over 200 frantic comments – you can guess the tone). Bring on your own sightings in comments, and I’ll update.

UPDATE: Alegre has a strike update up at MyDD, with additional coverage. Somebody please convey my encouragement. (I’ve spent a large chunk of my life on the internets, and MyDD is the only place I’ve ever been banned.)

Via Jake Tapper at ABC, Markos speaks:

His response: “First, these people should read up on the definition of ‘strike.’ What they’re doing is a ‘boycott.’ But whatever they call it, I think it’s great. It’s a big Internet, so I hope they find what they’re looking for.”

Well, first, kos’s cramped definition of ‘strike’ speaks to his lack of grounding in the traditions of protest and political activism. Many things can be struck — among them are class attendance, sexual relations, prison routine, rent, and provision of nonprofit services.

Second-first, dailykos diarists don’t get paid, but they do turn their own valuable hours and ideasand storehouses of knowledge into items of economic value to the site and its proprietor. Diarists are content providers. (That’s the Web 2.0 business model, right?) Their contributions — appreciated or otherwise — are essential to the site, compensated or not. (I’ve been on a “soft strike” for years now). [Tom Watson makes a similar misinterpretation.]

And third-first, kos’s “hope they find what they are looking for” translates as “don’t let the screen door hit ya”, indicative of his attitude toward openness of his community to robust controversy within the Democratic mainstream.

We should take Markos up on his kind invitation. Go find what we are looking for — or create it — and the world will beat a path to our portal.

92 Responses

  1. ronk: I am ready if you are. Can we take it the next level? Do we have the critical mass? And can we do it without the kind of advertising that will limit our ability to say what we want? What I mean to say is, must we be a slave to our audience?
    Should we adopt a community style blog or stay with this model a bit longer?
    Speak!, Oh Guru.

  2. Alegre was the bravest of the brave, fighting the good fight long after most of us got tired of darting into diaries to defend other commenters, and then running out before the Orcs emerged….

    Great that the strike/boycott/work slowdown is being covered in the media.

    And yeah, kos’s “don’t let the door hit you on the way out” is incredibly arrogant and short-sighted. I have a relatively low user id (28,068) and have been a trusted user for four years. I e-mailed kos last month and asked him to do something. I thought that perhaps he was distracted by getting his book finished and really didn’t see how bad it was. His response: “What would you have me do? It’ll get better after the primaries.” I replied: “I was thinking along the lines of you expressly discouraging the flame wars.” No reply.

    In other words, he sees how bad it is, and he likes it just fine.

    The door hasn’t hit me, but won’t he be surprised when it hits him.

  3. Dear mimc, I accidentally deleted your comment. There was absolutely nothing wrong with it. My finger just slipped on the mouse. Please accept my sincere apology. Would you mind posting your comment again?

  4. litigatormom,

    My UID is 18,934. I’ve been a TU for years too. The whole place is overun with UID’s up in the 150,000 now. I do think it is short-sighted of Kos, but he always has been arrogant and full of himself. I wonder what is going to happen to him when Hillary gets the nomination and becomes President? Actually, I don’t care what happens to him. I guess that’s mean of me.

  5. Thanks for the updates – I found this over at Susie’s .. best news I’ve read all day


    he was eight point over Hillary yesterday ..

    and I am going to post your ‘sexual relations’ information – in could not be more timely for me, as a place where I post a lot has now decided I am a man hater .. lol .. It is not a political site, all though they have political boards there . It’s the perfect last article to post there for me today ..

    You ladies are TeH best .. here is Susie’s link she has 6 great youtubes over there – the thread is called .



    her last you tube is hysterical ..and also timely .. See you tomorrow ..

  6. Just . . .Thanks for offering this space, and an alternative and wise voice!

  7. Boston Boomer:

    It is not mean. It is justice.

  8. I never for one minute felt like dKos was (or was even meant to be) a community. As userID 430, I’ve been around that site since forever. And I used it as my homepage for years. But, I always thought of it as Kos’s site — that he opened it to our diaries. But It’s not like he ever socialized. I can probably count the times he’s commented — and hardly ever in anyone else’s diaries.

    So, I have no doubt that we can do better than Kos. Ah, that “we” thing. I was reading somewhere about the danger. The inclusive “we” and the exclusive “we.”

    (drifting off in thought)

  9. lgm: I don’t think it has hit him yet that we are not going back after the primaries. When DailyKos started, it was a “first in class”, as we say in the pharmaceutical industry. But since it started and got to be successful, the format was adopted by many other blogging communities. What kept DailyKos viable for so long was the diversity of opinion, the freshness of the content and the tolerance of dissenting views. Once that is lost, it becomes like any other one-note blog that can be safely ignored. Ronk was there at the very beginning of DailyKos and it must be very distressing for him to see this happen. OTOH, we benefit from his insights.
    We can only sit and watch in helpless horror at what has become of our beautiful construct at DailyKos, I truly do think it has been infiltrated by GOP operatives who knew that the most effective way of splitting our coalition would be to drive the women away with aggressive, intimidating stalking from diary to diary. The women who still desired the kind of tribal approval quickly learned to adapt and those of us who didn’t need it to fill a chink in our self worth moved on.
    When I was trollstormed off of dailykos, I swear my sadness and grief lasted about 30 seconds. It was very liberating in a way that i hadn’t anticipated. But not everyone knows they can let go.

  10. Well, I spat on him a little while ago and I’m Proud of it. How’s THAT for mean?

  11. Katiebird– After the big fight over the pie ads, I never had one ounce of respect for Kos. I never used to read the front page when he was posting regularly. He’s a bore, and not very sophisticated about politics. I never bothered to read his book, because I honestly didn’t think he’d have a lot of insight. He’s goo at what he does–building and maintaining a website. I stayed around because of the diaries. But now most of the good diarists have either left dk or have turned into Obamatrons. I can’t believe how much better I feel not going there anymore. I hung on way too long as it was.

  12. Litigatormom, Thanks. I really have nothing but contempt for him at this point.

  13. Nothing would make me happier than for Kos to become irrelevant, if he isn’t already.

    rd, I don’t think it is Republican operatives, those are truly people that have seen the light that we just haven’t been able to see.

    I was a TU for almost four years and they can kiss my butt goodbye forever.

    Grow this blog as big as you can riverdaughter. You are a better writer than many who have successful blogs and you have a great group of posters so far. I like the format that EENR is using.

    Keep up the good work! I was lucky to find you in your first week or so and though I don’t comment often, I read everyday.


  14. BB, I agree — I stopped giving the Front page a glance a long time ago. And I never read his book, either. Wasn’t Armando involved in the Pie Fight somehow? It’s funny that I’ve spent so much time at his new site….

    I never really liked the Diary Police thing (THIS is not a valid diary — waste, waste, blah, blah, blah) Just because something’s a million miles long doesn’t make it interesting.

    (is this too negative — I don’t want to bring the party down)

  15. Diary police…I saw a pro Obama diary with FIVE words make the rec list. “this should go over well” followed by and anti-Hillary copy and paste. No complaints from the usual police patrol.

  16. Sexism at DK is nothing new. If I remember correctly, a few years ago, Kos himself generated some ire from women when he stated something to the effect that we, ladies, should not insist too much on women’s issues, like pro-choice items in the democratic platform. His point was, to wit, let’s get democrats elected, then, we’ll get around to the little ladies’ issues eventually; in the meantime, gals, STFU.

    Does anyone remember that as well?

  17. As it happens, rd, I have been mulling over the problem dynamics for about 15 years now. The problem isn’t new, and it isn’t blog-specific. Under certain very common conditions, communities cleave into opposing cliques, spend most of their energies undermining each other, and block opportunities for win-win cooperation

    I have a big important idea that’s becoming more timely by the day — one that would transform not just blogging communities, but politics as we know it … and a bunch of other major social institutions. An idea that might attract major investment/sponsorship, both profit and nonprofit. (And an idea to which “The Confluence” aptly fits.)

    But that’s for another day. The problem’s not going away.

    For now, stay humble, and defensive. We’ll need threaded discussion, and user registration … and we’ll need to keep our purpose narrow, short term. The Sanctuary must needs enforce our moderate standards rather strictly, or we’ll be overrun by disruptors.

  18. Hey guys!

    Just got back from dinner with the spousal unit and the little princess.

    Has the no good, terrible, service we has been blamed on Hillary Clinton yet?

  19. I have to apologize to RonK

    I was an overzealous Kerry supporter (after the nom) and RonK and I had a spat about a LA Times poll. Ron was right.

    I’ve been told by people I respect that RonK is the real deal.

    It is becoming evident…

  20. Kbird: No, I think it’s good to vent sometimes, It’s like a pensieve. You have to get it out in the open and look at it from a bunch of different angles. i will say this though: DailyKos made it easy for a lot of good people who were wandering in the wilderness to find each other. I met a lot of very fine people at YearlyKos06 and 07 including the campskunks (yes, I know who you are) and hekebolos and naniboujou and her husband from Minneapolis and even Kid Oakland who is always trying to make peace and who has the soul of a poet. But many on DKos did not know the wolves among them. Unlike a lot of you, I *do* think the Rovians were up to something. The thing they feared most was that we would find a united voice against the media juggernaut so just to make sure, they divided us from within. Oh, my droogs, it was all so well done that many of those who were misled did not even see it coming.
    But what is done is done. We can’t live in the past. For my part, I will only say that, by and large, my experience at DKos was a positive one, But I am having too much fun here these days to miss it much.

  21. Coldblue: I don’t know who ronk is but I am very flattered that he chose to post here. He is my Fred Astaire. He gives me class.

  22. MABlue: how old is your little princess? She must adore you. 🙂

  23. rd– I agree. I had a very positive experience at DK overall. That’s why it was so hard for me to let go and realize it was over. I have been addicted to politics since I was 12 years old and I supported JFK.

    As you said above, I found like-minded people at DK, whereas in my everyday life, I don’t know anyone else who is as nuts about politics as I am. The closest is my mom. We talk politics quite a bit.

    But now that I’ve really detached from DK, I see so many more possibilities. And it’s nice to be able to say out loud (virtually) that really like Hillary.

  24. riverdaughter: I’m glad he posts here too.

    And thank you for this blog.

    I’m reading it on a regular basis, although I’m not a frequent commenter.

  25. Boston Boomer, you were one of my favorites at Kos. I’m so glad to see you here and at TL. You toughed it out longer than I could and though I had quit posting, I saw you try to fight the losing battles and I thank you for it.

  26. riverdaughter:

    She is dong great and my fight for the proper treatment of Hillary Clinton is dedicated to her.

    Thanks for asking and I mean it.

  27. (gazing around) I think I’m happy.

  28. Ronk,

    Thanks! Alegre just has a followup on MYDD. There are tons of blogs and even MSM who have picked up on the strike, and the list keeps growing.


  29. sorry Riverdaughter .. you .. you .. you .. well, what should I call us , when I am trying to say something to all of us as in collectively ?

  30. Briana, “We are the ones….” (ducking)

  31. roger that, ronk. I think we are on the same wavelength and I will help as much as I can given my constraints.

  32. katiebird! You mean the light shined on us? I so wanted to be one of the “ones”.

  33. Briana: we are Conflucians. In Austin at Netroots Nation, we would come into the ballroom at dinner time from different directions and each of us would be holding a section of a long stream of blue silk. Imagine several different streams converging into one. That is who we are. We *will* be united again.

  34. riverdaughter, what about Netroots Nation this year? I almost signed up back when it was cheap. But, now — I wonder?

  35. Katiebird: We still have a couple of months to think about it. My room is booked. We’ll see.

  36. “We are the ones we’ve been blogging for”?

    “We are the Confluence. You will be assimilated.”?

    Steele — I don’t recall spatting with you (more than anybody else), but I do recall your above-average contributions back in the Old Country before the brownshirts sacked the place. Pleased to have you among us.

  37. My user id was around 5400. I found dk in october 2002, and it was a good place. Mostly, I was a lurker, until the treatment that Hillary supporters got moved me to start uprating them, and watching for them (that was just before yearlykos, so maybe June of last year?). Then I started commenting more and more.

    That place is now gone and dead to me. As I said to Radiowalla in her goodbye diary, we can’t reward this kind of behavior. Kos has been a shill and has actively enabled and encouraged bullying and smearing a candidate. He is trying a power grab. I am leaving and am never going back.

  38. His point was, to wit, let’s get democrats elected, then, we’ll get around to the little ladies’ issues eventually; in the meantime, gals, STFU.

    I remember that – it was part of his ranting about NARAL, wasn’t it? How all us “single issue special interest” types were traitors to the cause. Whose cause, I can’t imagine. Apparently I’m supposed to support the Democrats because I like the letter D, without bothering my pretty little head over whether they actually support any issues I care about.

    I should have left then, but I hung around until the Pie Fight. Then I left. I go back every few months to see if I’m missing anything. Used to be there’d be a couple of diaries each time worth reading, but not now.

    Wasn’t Armando involved in the Pie Fight somehow?

    Kinda sorta. After Kos stuck his foot in his mouth up to the knee, a bunch of people decamped to Booman Tribune. Armando charged over there demanding that we all explain ourselves, though to give him credit, he seemed to eventually realize he was being an ass and deleted that diary. The part I remember best was the excuse he offered for Kos – well, we all know he’s no good with women’s issues, so cut him a break. I was amazed that he didn’t seem to realize that that was the problem.

  39. I have a terrible memory. I went to the BT after the pie fight — most of my friends did. But, we mostly hung out in the Cafe. Now, I’m afraid to say anything there. I don’t want my old friends to hate me.

  40. Armando must have learned his lesson well. He was spoken up for us a great deal lately.

  41. I’m still afraid of him.

  42. ghost2: For a couple weeks there at the end of 2007, I sensed that Kos was struggling. Every once in awhile, I would catch him late at night writing some nasty thing about Clinton and confront him with the notion that she might win and he wouldn’t have any place in her world. I get the idea that the blogosphere is a risky place for Clinton, it’s like the MSM, it’s out of her control. So, she avoids getting too involved with it for fear of getting burned. But I don’t think that means she has no interest at all in it. So, I do think that Kos bet everything on Obama and didn’t carefully think things through. That’s what happens when you let the adulation of being the Big Blog go to your head. It’s his livelihood.
    For me, it is not. I LOVE my job and would never give it up and I know my limits. For Kos, there are no limits. Not very Greek.

  43. Or maybe I’m just drunk. I don’t know.

  44. Armando was in loyalty mode after the pie fight. I was right there with him.

    Both of us have different views today.

  45. It was probably something about the “women’s studies set” that did it, if I remember that episode correctly.. I kind of blew it off at the time because, well, I think it took the cult of Obama to show me that a lot of these folks will throw any progressive cause under the bus in the name of winning, although damned if I know what they want besides that.

    I hung around for a long time out of habit though. Seems like I have a pretty high tolerance for insanity before I decamp from one blog to another. I can’t tell you how depressing it is to see so-called liberal bloggers living in an alternative reality in which Hillary Clinton is to blame for everything. Even the Wright thing is Hillary’s fault according to Klein and JMM, I guess – if it’s not her fault that he said those things, and not her fault that the media picked up on it, it’s got to be her fault that.. the timing is what it is, apparently? Or it’s her fault that the media is interested? I just hope the superdelegates aren’t crazy.

  46. Ronk,

    Create a new blog, or a group of blogs, something to rival and better Kos. I will support you financially. Not an empty promise.

    I hate monopolies and there cannot be any monopolies in the progressive blogosphere.

    Let us show them what we are made of.

  47. I’m astonished to see Armando seem like a voice of reason lately. Maybe dKos atmosphere got to him? I had a few big arguments with him over there thought I forget about what.

    As for Kos himself.. it’s strange, he’s incredibly nice in person but hates DC and everything in it. Not surprised where he stands in this contest, I think it’s just the same old story of The Establishment of which he wants the Netroots to Crash the Gates. Actual values and issues don’t matter, it’s just the Us vs The Establishment including the Great Satan DLC and Terry Mac with which they connect Hillary.. And of course Obama is not beholden to The Establishment, no matter what he does or how much institutional support he gets.

  48. But, we mostly hung out in the Cafe. Now, I’m afraid to say anything there. I don’t want my old friends to hate me.

    This is the saddest part of this whole primary season for me. I’ve seen dozens of people I used to like and/or respect turn into ravening wolves at the slightest criticism of Obama. The response is so out of proportion that a couple of times I’ve actually been frightened of them. I feel like I should be looking behind the couch for giant pods.

  49. tabbycat,

    Thank you so much for saying that. I’m glad to be here and glad you are too.

    It’s funny, at first I couldn’t stand Armando, but after he got outed and came back as BTD, he seemed a lot more human and I got to like him. I think he does a really good job at Talk Left. And he has repeatedly spoken out against the terrible misogyny that has been directed at Hillary and by extension the rest of us women who dare to speak up for her.

    In some ways this whole thing has been a learning experience for me. Of course I was always aware of Markos’ insensitivity toward women’s issues. But if he hadn’t been so vicious toward Hillary and the whole Obamatron thing hadn’t gotten so out of control, I never would have taken a good look at Hillary and realized that not only is she smart and a fighter, but she is very likeable as a person.

    I’m ashamed to say that I had been somewhat brainwashed by the media narrative about the Clintons without being aware of it. I’m basically a nonconformist and don’t like to be told what to think and believe. So the unending pushing of Obama made me wake up to a candidate who is genuinely worth supporting–Hillary. And I’m convinced she will win the nomination in the end.

  50. Yeah, some of my friends in real life are like that. I’m still holding onto a draft email to a mailing list of ours saying, do you really think after all her years fighting the good fight Geraldine Ferraro is that evil and should be shunned, fired, and basically never appear in public again? and also that Hillary is responsible for everything her supporters say? and I wrote it before the Wright tapes came out. wonder what reply I’d get now.

  51. A couple of points:

    :: Armando has been simply great at TalkLeft. Really good, and calling bullshit when it’s due.

    :: I really like what Tom says, and was going to suggest it. I think a collective coalition of sane bloggers is in order. Under one banner, but each keeping their individuality. A one place when you come, and get linked to stories on The Confluence, Taylor Marsh, NoQuarter, Corrente, Tom Watson, and many other great bloggers. It would be a diversity of opinions and topics, and quality writing.

    :: I just noted Alegre’s answer to me when I told her that Goldberry likes to cross-post her original diary here:


    Tell her I’m honored that she wants to cross-post it. And thank her for helping to get the word out on this effort!


  52. Armando was in loyalty mode after the pie fight.

    Yeah, and look how that was returned. What tiny bit of respect I still had for Kos vanished into the ether after he chucked Armando off DK. That guy is a Grade A, gold-plated rat turd.

  53. “I’ve seen dozens of people I used to like and/or respect turn into ravening wolves at the slightest criticism of Obama. The response is so out of proportion that a couple of times I’ve actually been frightened of them. I feel like I should be looking behind the couch for giant pods.”


  54. Note to self: Read LOTR by morning.

  55. DK
    It’s about money. Really. He received some notoriety and some advertising and now just has to let all those people work for him.

    Funny. He’s turned into what he says he hates.

  56. ghost2, might work. What might be neat if there were a way to do it (I don’t really use Digg and similar services despite being a Web monkey @ my real job) is to have a common recommended list that was cross-blog, somehow. something to tie them together besides links you click. I really like those ‘most emailed/blogged/read’ items on news sites. whatever best lets the best pieces of content rise to the top. and good editorial eye or some way to have the Kos effect in which supporters of one candidate (I think started with the JRE people) rec diaries they agree with en masse, gaming the system and forcing otehrs to do the ‘diary rescue’ feature which is really just what the rec list should be if the primary wars hadn’t drowned everything out.

  57. and good editorial eye or some way to have the Kos effect
    I meant avoid the Kos effect. Sorry.. tired. 🙂

    You know, I didn’t like from the start that Obama built his candidacy as a movement based entirely on his persona and a bunch of fluffy white clouds, I saw the cult like behavior from the Deaniacs last time around and knew how ugly it got because people got wayyyy too wrapped up in it personally.

  58. River Daughter,

    I’ve always been quite certain that Brooklyn BadBoy was a Republican. He got his talking points wrong in the beginning. Made rookie mistakes that only GOP would make. Don’t remember the details, but you’ll never convince me he’s a Democrat. He was incredibly rude and crude from the get go with posters who were clearly female.

    There were a handful of others as well but he’s the only name that comes to mind.

    So, what is the deal with people trying to find personal information on Clinton supporters? What happened there? Does anyone know?

    I searched myself there the other day. I’ve been gone three months, and there’s been nearly 400 mentions of me in comments. Bizarre but true. It’s been proposed that I’m Lanny Davis. 🙂

  59. For me, it is not. I LOVE my job and would never give it up and I know my limits. For Kos, there are no limits. Not very Greek.


    Now why am I imagining Zeus with a thunderbolt looking down and going, “Hmm…”

  60. I could be wrong, but wasn’t it Geekesque who started the final Armando fight that led to him leaving? He, or someone, was whining to Kos about how mean BTD was being. LOL, just look at the crap they put up with and encourage now.

    katie, I’m a little scared of him too but I love him anyway.

    BB, I hope you are right about HC winning. I still have my doubts but things aren’t going so well for Obama right now. The media can try to cover for him, but the people I know are concerned about some of this stuff. The Hillary hatred combined with the debates won me over. What a loss to our country if she doesn’t win. I know she will fight for universal healthcare and I don’t think for a minute that Obama will.

    I’m a compromiser myself but I don’t want one as my President. At least not one who compromises before the battle has even started.

  61. It’s satisfying to hear everyone vent over here, but people should make a pact to vent for a few days, then just FORGET ‘EM.

    Forgetting they exist is the best revenge…

    Trust me, it’s completely doable. I had a bit of a tough time getting away from DailyKOS, from Olbermann, but then I realized that the Daily KOS and Olbermann that I really liked don’t exist anymore, it’s time to find something new.

    I’ve been outa KOS for over a month and haven’t watched Olbermann in 3 weeks. My life goes on! ;-).

    Has anyone seen SNL yet? Anything good? (I’m on the West coast)

  62. The only thing I ever saw about republicans infiltrating the blogs was a reference in the summer to a Rove plan to flood the blogosphere.

    Another commentator also once noted that many of the Ron Paul supporters had moved to Obama. A fair percentage were hysterics who were well versed in attacking individuals.

    But the deepest wounds come from the left’s personality. (I say this as someone who has hung on or near the left for most of my adult life.) Like any religious zealot hell bent on saving the world, political ideologues devalue individuals and their feelings. All can be – and often seemingly must be – sacrificed for the “greater good.”

    Of course the irony is that they cannot bring about the greater good or heaven because they lack the power to achieve it. Nor will they ever obtain that power because they can’t really hear or understand what’s going around them. Thus they rarely – unless they are standing on the right side of the gun (i.e. trigger) – achieve power.

    That’s part of the Clinton’s great appeal. Both can hear what’s going around them and know to adapt accordingly. It’s fun to watch how this ability has grown with their respective ages. But of course it leaves them open to the charges of panderer and liar. Sigh. (I would say it’s like being called ugly by a pig but that’s not fair to pigs.)

  63. I was posting less and less at Dkos and tonight after reading Alegre’s update at MyDD and the comments at other sites, I have deleted Dkos from my bookmarks. My UID at Dkos is18888, so I have been there quite awhile I was also had TU status. when litigatormom posted a diary that she was going hiatus from DKos, I commented that she should take a break but come back because she was a voice of reason. She did return but left again, along with many others. The candidate wars have escalated to the point that I think the site will collapse on itself if Obama is either not the nominee or is and loses the GE. I had left Dkos once before during the Mary Scott O’Connor spat and for a time migrated to her site. I looked for other political blogs but returned to Dkos because, at the time, it was the best of the political blogs.
    Dkos is not the only site I have eliminated from my bookmarks. Booman Tribune has been gone for weeks and I used to read him faithfully during the Valerie Plame/ Scooter Libby fiasco. Also gone are Americablog, TPM and Josh’s other sites & Huffington Post. My main sources of political commentary are MyDD (even though I cannot retrieve my password to comment), Talk Left, The Left Coaster, No Quarter and now here.
    I stopped watching Olberman several weeks ago when he started agreeing with Chris Matthews during the debates. I will miss Jonathan Turley’s comments on Countdown but I can read his web site to my hearts content. .And I have not tuned into NBC or MSNBC either. Mostly my TV has been off except for local news and last night Bill Moyers’ Journal.
    Alegre’s diaries were the reason I went from undecided to a Clinton supporter. I am not totally enamored of her but I feel she has a better agenda and better chance of defeating McCain in November. My biggest concern is the Supreme Court. It is crucial that we have a Democratic President in order to prevent the court from becoming even more destructive.
    The funny part of this whole primary affair for me is that in another 18 months I will be an outside observer of American politics as I will be retiring and living full time in Europe. The election will still have some impact, as the US has always been a major actor on the world stage. I will just be watching from the other side of the window with my fingers crossed for a positive outcome.

  64. From what I’ve heard, kos is happy right now because his daily hits count is way up.

    That will change after the election, if not sooner.

    That’s when he’ll start to miss us.

  65. comment on the strike discussing features of scoop (maybe useful for Riverdaughter, RonK, and others who are thinking about expanding this blog:)


  66. From the NYT “Caucus” blog:

    Markos Moulitsas, the founder of DailyKos, spoke to Jake Tapper of ABC News about the so-called strike, which he said was really more like a “boycott.”
    “But whatever they call it, I think it’s great,” Mr. Moulitsas said. “It’s a big Internet, so I hope they find what they’re looking for.”

    Yeah, kos. It’s a big Internet, I hope you find the ad revenues you’re looking for.

  67. I just finished listening to Washington Journal on C-SPAN. The minority leader from the FL Senate was a guest. He was really angry at Howard Dean and the DNC. He talked about the polls showing that up to 30% of FL voters would vote Republican if their delegates aren’t seated. Lots of callers who complained that Dean is biased in favor of Obama. A MI caller said that Hillary will easily win MI again. All-in-all, it sounds like things are going to get very nasty in Denver if Dean and Brazille don’t get off their asses and stop trying to game the system for THE ONE.

  68. Confluence indeed. It is rather comforting to know that so many have come to such similar conclusions at this time. I left DK and did not miss it at all because of this site and many others which have already been mentioned. I was a financial supporter of some of the biggies when they started up. No longer do I go to such warped little fiefdoms and one wanted to know why I wanted off of the email list, and I let the ass have it. Let us know what you may need and do not be shy about it. I write better checks than comments.

  69. riverdaughter…what got you banned from MyDD? (If you can tell us)?

  70. […] Posts Welcome Union Members!What goes around, comes aroundStrike News (and Special Comment) for 2008-01-15 [UPDATE 1]She’s a sticker, thank GodNightcap- New Old FriendsSaturday Morning in MarchAn Invitation to […]

  71. Shainzona: I think it was a secret death wish. I’d felt anger all day at the hostile Obamaphiles and I *knew* what they were up to. But it was futile to try to point it out to Kos or MissLaura or Meteor Blades. They were just all, “lalalalala. Whatever. They’re just having fun. it will get better after the primaries.” But *my* sense is that there was something disruptive going on. Either the Obamaphiles had adopted Rovian intimidation tactics or there were Rovians already there. In fact, I think there is a little bit of both going on. The Democrats have taken lessons from Rove and have employed them against their own party. It was always my sense that if we were going to be taken out, it would be by dividing us from within. Anyway, my snark button got triggered and I wrote a diary that equated Obamaphiles with Jihadis. What I meant to say was that they were behaving like we clintonistas were infidels and were out to purge the site of unbelievers. About 45 minutes later, it was over, My tip jar was overwhelmed with TRs. To be honest, they didn’t want me there and KagroX (who everyone is thinking is a really good guy) was one of the worst offenders. He repeatedly told me he didn’t like me, I was unwanted and I should just go away. My chances of ever making frontpage status was non-existent. It’s a popularity contest and Clintonistas are like untouchables. I wasn’t getting on the rec list anymore except for the Cocktail Party, which was the result of a direct challenge from Kos to the Clinton people who he taunted like we were the dweebs in a fourth grade classroom. In short, the site became a like a version of high school with the jocks running the show.
    After my privileges were suspended, I wrote an email to Kos telling him thanks for all the fish but it was time for me to go and no hard feelings. And I meant it. I don’t look back. He told me he would restore my privileges after the primaries but I don’t really want to go back. I’m my own frontpager here. Why should I want to compete with 150,000 other bloggers for recognition and lose out to them due to social promotion? I used to think the cream filtered to the top at DKos but that mechanism was subverted by mob rule. Kos can’t say he wasn’t warned. I said as much during open comment period during the last YK07 brunch after I witnessed the obnoxious frenzy for Edwards the day before at the candidate’s forum. But Kos said that it was OK because politics is suddenly *fun* again. They were just having *fun*! I thought they were letting their enthusiasm get the better of their brains. YK07 was sooo different in so many ways to YK06. But there you have it. markos made his own kool-ade and drank from it. And I was out. But que sera, sera.

  72. SocProf – I remember that episode at DKos.  I was a newbie about that time and assumed (oh,oh) that he was speaking for some great progressive poobah who knew how we must operate to win elections.  It must have been in 2004 or 2006 (you know, when people said Ned Lamont shouldn’t press the Iraq issue).

    It’s only been in the past 1 1/2 that I realize how stupid I was to fall for words from the grand master.

  73. RonK you’ve been on a “Soft Strike”? I asked Meteor Blades once if the admins got paid for policing diaries and producing content. His reply: “Paid? Hahahahahahaha n/t”. Jerome says he pays his writers (though he didn’t say how much.)

    Would love to hear more – did you guys ever ask kos for compensation?

  74. riverdaughter – were you also banned at MyDD?

  75. I stopped even clicking on DK to see what drivel was posted. I don’t want to give that ridiculous Obama-centric site revenue. Any dissent is usually met with four-letter words. It seems that high school boys who have “come to Obama” have been given the key. The “Yes we can” chanting is oppressive. (Even Obama thought this slogan was a bit silly when Axelrod arranged it for him. For the Patrick campaign it had been “Together we can.”)

    Brad Friedman has a blog entitled “Writers Strike at Daily Kos? Try Readers Strike”


  76. Shainzona: Not that I know of. I don’t think I was ever a member of MyDD.

  77. catfish: For my part, I never expected compensation. The Frontpagers have a right to expect it. But I see (or *used* to see) the rec list as a competition ground where merit would win out and that’s where a lot of the current frontpagers come from. But really, it isn’t that way at all. Many fine writers never make the rec list. It’s usually because there is a conditioning that is going on simultaneously. Those diaries that make the rec list are the ones that everyone agrees with regardless of merit.
    Anyway, I don’t mind that Markos makes money of DailyKos. It takes a lot of work to keep a blog that size running. My issue is with him chasing advertising dollars and clicks by actively courting first the Edwards and then the Obama camp and being overtly hostile to Clinton. I’m not saying there was ever a large contingent of Clinton supporters at DailyKos but they way we were harrassed by Kossacks and made fun of my Kos himself made us look a lot more unpopular that we actually were.
    Think about it this way: Clinton has won the big states and most swing states. She’s in a virtual tie with Obama in delegates. But the current representation at Kos is overwhelmingly Obama supporters. Instead of letting them propel the blogosphere for him, we ought to be asking why is it that they are so out of step with the general public. The risk to them is significant and this is why they become more, not less committed to Obama. If he loses, their credibility is shot. But they haven’t stepped outside of their own sphere to understand that they can’t win this thing by sheer willpower alone. It takes voters and they are increasingly going for Clinton. Pennsylvania will go for her hard. Then the Super Delegates are going to have to reevaluate whether they really want to hand this thing over to the guy who couldn’t close the sale.
    When that happens, it will be the end of DKos.

  78. Shainzona, I think that was RonK who said he was banned at MyDD. He wrote the original post we are replying to.

  79. Shainzona — I was banned once at MyDD for cmoparing one of the principal’s clueless analyses to “dogs watching tennis”. (Or was it television?) Matt Stoller claimed my disruptive tone would “destroy” MyDD (where I rarely posted anyway). There was a history of my finding error in Matt’s offerings elsewhere.

    Objection was raised by other members of the community, and I was resurrected.

    Not much later, I noted an empirical error (in a Bowers post, if I recall), and suggested he should have fact-checked his data before vaulting to an improbably conclusion — and I was cut off in mid-exchange, without notice to the community.

  80. Oh thank God for this blog. And TaylorMarsh.

    And actually, CrooksAndLiars..because although there are a ton of Obama supporters who simply make snide personal attacks, rather than addressing points raised, John Amato does a pretty good job at keeping an open forum, and keeping it fair.

    For people like myself who are all about Fairness, first and foremost, and can look at something without emotion for the facts, it hurts and disgusts me that many of Obama’s supporters are buying into the bush mentality of “if you don’t agree with me, you’re not a progressive”.


  81. I am a refugee from americablog. I could never figure out whether it was a swarm, or some paid move–they were always asking for money, or some adolescent explosion. There used to be a large, aware gay element, but the McClurkin thing came up and passed quickly. Misogyny was clearly more threatening. Blog owner is a cousin of Marko, so I thought maybe it was some Greek twist that I was missing.
    There were a few pro-hillary people who hung on for a long time, but gradually got fed up. The traffic has dropped by about half, but still anything remote pro-hillary is met with incredible irrational vulgarity. Anyone can do better! Thanks for getting this out there!!!!!

  82. and RonK…you have me sooo intrigued by this “great idea” to address the natural divides that form in people with opposing viewpoints.

    I know it’s a human trait, and natural to some degree, but there has to be a psychological manuever or communication trick to stop centrifugal forces from pulling us all apart (especially when we agree on most of the basic things that make us liberal/progressives.)

    Ok, not sure if that made any sense, but at least I know what I meant. heh

  83. Hah, the funniest part is as just a lowly individual occasional poster, after the DKos community started floating that “hillary darkened Obama’s skin video” crap, I sent a request asking to close my account because “they were no longer meeting my progressive needs.”

    This was a couple of weeks before the “strike” hit.

  84. Boston Boomer, on March 16th, 2008 at 8:36 am Said:

    I sympathize with the person from Florida. I doubt that my absentee ballot in California was ever counted. If people want to hold their primaries two years before the election, I can’t see how it hurts the dialogue or the party or even little piti-yanquis like howard dean. I used to be sorry he was torpedoed!!!
    I think the primery reason for not letting Florida or Michigan take part is that after the Jeremiah Wright revelations, Obamas having slept through a considerable amount of hate speech in the past twenty years, his exposing his own children to this drap, the long rants against zionists by Jeremiah, and Obama’s inability to leave this “church,” Hillary would win at least Florida and probably Michigan in an incredible landslide.

  85. Hey Ron, I never knew. I’ll just leave it at that. You’re user abilities are re-instated with an upgrade.

  86. and Armando is BTD? But…but…Armando used to use dirty words, and stuff. Are you sure??

    When Wes Clark went on Faux and Armando’s howls filled DK bigtime, I got drunk one night and let him have it –in my own puny and insignificant way, of course.

    Needless to say, the Kewl Kids trollrated me into oblivion, but I enjoyed every minute of it. Never posted much after that, and never wrote a diary, though I have a relatively low user ID, having joined in late 2003.

    BTD = Armando? I’m laughing so hard I think I just peed meself, though–truthfully–I’m still having a hard time believing it.

    And I deleted DK from my bookmarks weeks ago. Always thought Markos was a dick, but loved Hunter and Meteor Blades and of course, MSOC. I noticed she was gone, but assumed it was her choice. Life & all that, you know…so what happened there?

  87. Thanks, Jerome! Does that upgrade come with a couple free cocktails?

    ’cause here at The Confluence, we’re all about the cocktails.

  88. Like katiebird, who posted 8th, I have a low UID – 1787. I was a reader at Daily Kos before there was such a thing as signing up for a login. I share the same sentiments as katiebird expressed. It was a site that I read, that was Kos’ site, that I didn’t do much commenting or writing on, and that I read occasionally to this day. I’m surprised at the anger on this blog towards Kos. My thoughts are, if I don’t like what’s being written there and I don’t like the fact that it is an Obama friendly blog I’d stop reading until the time came where the site was writing posts that were interesting to me again. Maybe I don’t share the anger because I’m an Obama supporter or because I didn’t become an active part of the community. But if the site is currently a pro Obama site why be mad? Instead do what you’re doing now. Start your own site or join another one. Well, that’s it. I wish you the best of luck on your site. I hope it grows as big as Daily Kos. The “internets” need as many Democrats blogging as possible and it doesn’t all have to be done at one site. Though I agressively support Obama, if Hillary wins by gaining more delegates (without superdelegate support) I’ll certainly vote for her in November. 🙂 Feel free to stop by my blog and make your case for Clinton. http://beertap.wordpress.com

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  91. Nowadays, everyone is looking for something free, it is a good marketing technique but not always a successful one. Looks like someone got it not well on track here. The meaning of strike and boycott commonly related. In Internet world, this is not likely to happen because it is open market.

  92. I agree on you on that vintage this is gonna be never ending strike… “Diarists are content providers”- That an interesting thought.

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