
“PUMA” is an acronym dreamed up by Conflucian “SM” at The Confluence on June 1, 2008 at 3:39PM. SM is a woman with experience in advertising and public relations, and she’s really good at thinking up clever acronyms and slogans. This time she created one that went viral within days after she posted this comment [one typo edited].
SM, on June 1st, 2008 at 3:39 pm Said: Edit Comment
HURRAY FOR HILLARY!!Thank you Puerto Rico!
I am making an announcement. I am now a member of the PUMA party.
P arty
U nity
M y
A ssRico, give everybody a round of Barcadi & Coke on me!
The comment appears on this post by Riverdaughter. We had all spent the previous day, May 31, following the Rules and Bylaws Committee meeting of the Democratic National Committee, held in Washington DC. We were getting freqent updates from Garychapelhill and Mawm who attended the meeting and took turns live-blogging. Everyone was excited. We cheered Mawm when he famously (written up by Dana Millbank in the Washington Post) yelled out “Lipstick on a pig” at the point in the meeting where it became clear that Barack Obama would be forced on the party rank and file whether we wanted him or not.
The RBC had handed Obama votes from the Michigan Primary, even though he did not appear on the ballot. Even worse, they had given Obama 4 of Hillary Clinton’s votes in order to ensure that he would be ahead in pledged delegates going into the Convention. Later that night, Riverdaughter put up this post, giving credit to SM.
A couple of days ago, over at Liberal Rapture, someone named Tamerlane posted an essay in which he condescendingly lectures “PUMAs” about what the “PUMA movement” should be about. Tamerlane claims that
The [PUMA] acronym debuted on June 2, 2008, posted by a guy on a blog run by a woman, in response to DNC calls for unity following the travesty of the 5/31 RBC meeting. I saw the post and declared myself a PUMA that very day on my favorite blog. The name PUMA – and the concept – spread like wildfire across the blogosphere and the real world.
Tamerlane doesn’t name his “favorite blog,” so I have no idea what “blog run by a woman” or “guy on a blog” he is referring to. Whatever. The acronym PUMA was born here at The Confluence. Yes, it did go viral very quickly, and apparently one of the first places it spread to was Tamerlane’s “favorite blog.” SM dreamed up PUMA in response to the events that took place at the RBC meeting, but I think she was expressing pent up anger over many events that had taken place during the Democratic primaries, including the horrendous sexism and misogyny directed at Hillary Clinton by the media, the so-called “progressive blogosphere,” and the Obama campaign.
Now Tamerlane wants to explain to those of us who were here at the beginning of PUMA what the name really means and what the “PUMA movement” should be doing, but isn’t doing; or is doing very poorly, or something like that. The gist of the criticism seems to be that there is just too much talk about “women’s issues” by people who call themselves PUMAs or people whom Tamerlane labels as PUMAs (he is the expert on who and what PUMAs are, you see). Tamerlane says that
An enduring definition of a PUMA might be someone who:
- Holds generally moderate political views;
- Opposes the radicalization of the main political parties;
- Resists demagoguery, including sectarian appeals;
- Upholds free speech and the neutrality of the press;
- Supports fair and open elections.
Oh really? I’m in favor of free speech and fair and open elections. I don’t necessarily think everyone in the press needs to be “neutral.” I don’t hold moderate political views–my views are pretty far left. I don’t have anything in particular to say about “radicalization” of political parties. I’m not really sure what that means, but I think we could use some radicals on the left in this country and I’d like to see one of the parties represent what used to be liberal Democratic views. Tamerlane thinks PUMA should provide an “alternative to the revolution of the Democratic leftists and the coming GOP counter-revolution.” So I guess I’m not a PUMA, according to Tamerlane; since I think we need to actually locate some Democratic leftists.
You’ll notice there is nothing on Tamerlane’s list about equal rights for women or gays or about highlighting sexism and misogyny in the government or the media. That’s because Tamerlane doesn’t think PUMA should be doing things like that.
Sadly, key PUMA cadres have already cast (in their minds a least) the future form of PUMA. It is to be a radical feminist organization. Ironically, the very activists who once denied that PUMA was just a handful of bitter women are now intentionally limiting membership to bitter women. This metamorphosis started gradually after the election, but has picked up steam.
Darragh Murphy’s PUMApac, which originally did some good work combating the charade of the Denver convention, has openly morphed into a battered women’s support group. From a “[male chauvinist] Pig of the Week” award and a “woman-lynching” forum, to new-age mumbo-jumbo about the spirit of the tribe’s matriarchs, Murphy’s blog bears little resemblance today to its avowed goal of being “a voice for the 18 million Democrats who have been told our votes and our voices don’t matter.”
Oh really? Don’t you love the way Tamerlane uses the term “cadres” to refer to blog that he perceives as being too concerned with “women’s issues?” Elsewhere he actually refers to Pumapac as a “coven.”
And what about when Murphy and her “cadre” or “coven” or whatever other insulting name Tamerlane cares to dream up spent a couple of weeks combing through the Obama stimulus bill to find out what was really in there? I guess Tamerlane thought that was a petty exercise too? You see, Tamerlane has a bit of resentment against Darragh Murphy and Pumapac.
I’d joined PUMApac early on, believing its stated mission. A few months ago, after a running online debate with Murphy and her gang, during which I was variously:
*accused of perpetuating the oppressive patriarchy;
*told that lesbianism made my existence superfluous;
*advised I should be thankful I was allowed on a women’s blog, but must be a respectful guest;
I quit.
Uh huh. I see. The poor guy was traumatized by a bunch of mean old “bitter” “radical” women. Tamerlane also attacks our friend Donna Darko, calling her vision of PUMA “ranting.”
Donna Darko recently upped the volume by ranting:
PUMA is about two things:
1) the stolen nomination which was more shocking than 2000 because Democrats stole from Democrats
2) historic misogyny also shocking because it came from Democrats and progressivesRace and racism never entered the picture.
PUMA is a battered women’s support group. The DNc/RBC/Dean/Brazile/Pelosi/Reid were the rapists, Obama/his supporters/the MSM were the batterers. PUMAs/rape victims/battered women are not believed and are furthermore blamed for the abuse.
PUMA websites are meant to be safe spaces like POC blogs and feminist blogs where we can commiserate with one another and vent about the abusers.
PUMA is also a Democratic primary reform and feminist movement.
Tamerlane doesn’t care for Donna’s view of PUMA–too female oriented? I won’t post anymore of Tamerlane’s screed. You can read the whole thing if you want to. I’ll just highlight one of his comments in which he references The Confluence:
I was a regular reader of Confluence during the elections, but became turned off by its increasing women’s issues content. (And don’t tell me Confluence was always a women’s issues blog, or you belie your claim that it’s a big tent.) In particular, I found the endless “Betty Jean” stories inappropriate. The poor woman and her daughters were surely suffering, but it was not news fit to print. The heavy insinuations that all men were violent maniacs offended me. (Only about 4% of men display violent anti-social behavior. The other 96% of us are basically puppy dogs.)
Oh really? So the attempted murder of two sisters and the permanent disabling of one of them is “not news fit to print” according to Tamerlane? I beg to differ. That particular case, as well as the rampant violence against women in this country are news and deserve plenty of public attention. And I’d love to see the source of Tamerlane’s statistics on male violence vs “puppy dog”-ness. He’s not too good with that “linky goodness” thing.
All I can say is that after reading about Tamerlane’s vision of what PUMA is and should be instead, I have to say, “no thanks.” As for his views of The Confluence, I hardly think he is a regular reader if he thinks we are a “women’s issues” blog. What is the difference between “women’s issues” and “real issues” anyway? Since many Conflucians are women, some of us do write about the need for more women in government and politics and for equality for women in society and the workplace, but it’s hardly an obsession for us. To be honest, I don’t see The Confluence as a “PUMA blog” either. We are part of a coalition of blogs that objects to the way that Obama was elected–and that includes, but is not limited to, the use of misogyny to denigrate and diminish powerful women.
I’m very sorry that poor Tamerlane got his feelings hurt during some interactions with scary women at Pumapac. After reading what he has written in posts and comments at Liberal Rapture, I can only imagine that his description of these events is colored by his dislike and disrespect for women in general. As for PUMA, well maybe the term has really lost its original meaning. But that is another discussion.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that I’m really getting tired of being lectured by various people around the blogosphere about what and who we are or aren’t are and what we *should* be doing. If they want to attack us and call us names, they can go right ahead. There are even a bunch of silly “anti-PUMA” blogs where contributors pore over our posts and comments and obsess about what we are saying and doing. What is wrong with these people?
I say to Tamerlane and all the rest of the trolls who are so *concerned* about what *we* are doing, if you think the world needs changing, go do it yourself. If you want to change the Democratic Party or the Republican Party, go ahead and do it yourself. Don’t tell me to do it. I’ll decide my own goals, thank you very much. I really don’t respond well to being bullied and lectured and critiqued by people like you. So, go ahead, use the PUMA acronym–as you say, it’s in the public domain. Go do something valuable for society for a change and get the hell off my back.
UPDATE: In the comments, Myiq2xu writes:
I nominate Tamerlane as the PUMA candidate for President in 2012. Let’s see how many votes he gets doing things his way.
Filed under: Blogosphere, Democratic Party, General, Media, The unParty Tagged: | Liberal Rapture, PUMA, rules and bylaws committee, SM, Tamerlane







(cheering) Bravo, BostonBoomer!!! Well said.
Thank you Katiebird. Can you tell that I’m kind of fed up?
I nominate Tamerlane as the PUMA candidate for President in 2012.
Let’s see how many votes he gets doing things his way.
(He had to guest post at LR because his blog folded from lack of attention.)
I wondered if he had a blog, but I couldn’t find one that sounded like him. There were a few with the title “Tamerlane.” Either he’s a Poe fan or he admires 14th Century descendents of Mongols.
LOL-I looked too and kept on getting Poe!!!
Tamerlane has it all wrong. PUMAs should form a motorcycle gang roaming around the country tracking down Obots, dragging them away from their paid bullyblogging in their parents basements, and beating them up. Who’s with me.
LOL!!!
I think we should all move to California and form a hippie-style commune where we raise organic food and sell it to Whole Food for big bucks.
LOL-How about a million women march on Washington. (snark)
i like the idea of beating people up much better..
Yah, cat, I’m there!
yeah!
doncha know that you can count me in?
As long as the beating up is with our little old ladies purses
What I’m trying to say is that I’m really getting tired of being lectured by various people around the blogosphere about what and who we are or aren’t are and what we *should* be doing.
Specially when critiques are made on false premises.
I just don’t like being lectured. If Tamerlane wants to form a group and make some changes to the political system, he should do it. I’ll be watching and waiting…..
Have you ever noticed that the people who keep telling us we’re doing it wrong either don’t have blogs or have older but much smaller blogs?
This blog was started from scratch just over a year ago. PUMApac is even younger.
With 5.56 million hits I’d say we must be doing something right.
If you click on the link at LR to Tamerlane’s homepage it takes you to:
http://www.writehillaryin.com/
Which shows “page not found”
LOL!
You know, I was wondering if he was that guy. IIRC, I had tried to sign up to post on his blog but you had to give out your phone number in order to be “approved.” I replied to his email with a thanks but no thanks. I may be confusing him with someone else but it rings a bell.
If Tamerlane wants to form a group and make some changes to the political system, he should do it.
He doesn’t want to build his own group – he wants us to follow him.
He needs to work on his people skills first.
The real Tamerlane was a despot and a mass murderer. He was also the subject of a Handel opera “Tamerlano,” though history did not interest Handel.
great post!
Of concern to PUMAs and non off LAT: — (a MUST READ)!
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/washingtondc/la-na-obama-czars5-2009mar05,0,1528130.story?page=1
More PUMAhistory!
http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&channel=s&hl=en&q=kos+kill+the+puma&btnG=Google+Search
feminism in action!
http://vbonnaire.wordpress.com/2008/06/11/indypumas-growing-list-of-pumas-plus-what-the-biggest-female-press-in-the-blogosphere-now-says-hillary-in-for-2012/
http://vbonnaire.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/if-you-are-pro-hillary-clinton-come-and-join-the-pumas-cross-posted-from-the-confluence/
hahahahahaha! part of the secret funnel of the feminist underground…catstyle!
Why even ol’ Axelstein shivers before the power of the PUMAtribe…
It’s the power of the pen, and the brains….
C’est vrai!
hugs RD & Co.
Very well said, bb!
For a measured, effective way to express disagreement see djmm ( #51) says:
“Violet, when someone suggests killing all men, particularly on a blog where emotion on comments does not always come through, I cannot necessarily tell whether they are blowing off steam (a “Venting” in parentheses would be helpful) or whether they are truly so damaged that they really mean it. So I do appreciate you placing the comments in context and your reminder for civil discussion. But I feel I should throw in my two cents……….”
From The Reclusive Leftist
http://www.reclusiveleftist.com/2009/02/25/kim-gandy-defends-patriarchy-rejects-efforts-to-combat-violence-against-women/#comments
i like the idea of beating people up much better.
There is a sense of immediate cathartic release isn’t there?
It seems as though someone may just be trying to discredit the PUMA movement along with some of the blogs connected to PUMA.
This is o/t, but I thought I post a link about how the market is doing. Perhaps we would be better off if Obama would start to worry about it a little.
http://blogs.wsj.com/marketbeat/2009/03/05/pennies-far-from-heaven/
“Welcome to the Penny Zone.
That feel bad rally of yesterday is already a distant memory as stocks resume their downward march. As that takes place, the crowd of big-name stocks now trading below a buck or threatening to do so keeps getting bigger.
Citigroup has now joined AIG in the under-a-dollar-a-share club. And Bank of America, down 10%, is just a couple of dollars away from joining them. General Motors is staring bankruptcy in the eye and it soon may also drop below $1 a share.
All three of these companies have something in common: big government help. Looks like the government isn’t the shrewdest investor in the land, despite President Obama’s recent tip that stocks looked good for long-term investors.
What’s especially troubling is that other big names look like they might also cross the velvet rope into the sub-dollar club. Once formidable GE plunks still lower and traded at $6.66 (yikes!) at one point during the session. Ford is below $2 a share.”
I don’t even want to open my financial statements anymore.
It’s just jealousy and resentment. TC, Pumapac etc, have captured the mood more than any other political site, and it’s not showing any signs of fading. Must burn them to see such newcomers taking the lead.
Complaining about the content being too woman-biased is just plain bizarre too. But then, bizarre has been the word of this O-age.
For a measured, effective way to express disagreement
Based on my experience at PUMApac, what Tamerlane was complaining about is what is sometimes called “flaming a troll”
I don’t know if anyone has posted this here yet — This is actually a kind review!:
[link removed]
When you get to the bottom of Tommy’s review, there is this message:
“Order The Audacity of Democracy Starring Tommy Christopher”
NYCgirl
NYCgirl,
I’m going to remove the link from your comment. It’s not personal. It’s just that we don’t link to that person.
http://www.writeinhillaryclinton.com/
http://writeinhillary4prez.wordpress.com/
http://www.petitiononline.com/writehrc/petition.html
Above are 3 of the many sites that are still active to write Hill’s name in. The site ref’d by Tam as “homepage” is a ruse.
Tam is a loser poser. Aka – bot as puma.
You can do a post where you say:
or you can say:
The first method is a measured, effective way to express disagreement. The second method is a effective way to start a blogwar.
Tam is a loser poser. Aka – bot as puma.
The technical term is “ratf*cker”
Here’s what John, the LR blogowner says:
Huh? We didn’t know the money men and party regulars were pushing Obama? Since when?
It’s a waste of time to let the powers that be know you exist? Um….good luck electing Tamerlane in 2012 with that plan.
Gee, John, thanks for explaining things to little ol’ bitter us. ????
Actually John’s focus is off. The PUMA vote made a difference. Unfortunately millions of Bush voters did not leave their houses on November 4th. If Bush voters had voted for McCain, however reluctantly, those PUMAs for voted for McCain (however reluctantly) would have ensured a McCain win.
i haven’t checked out LR yet, but my hunch is what John means is that Obama is backed by – Oh no – “SOCIALISTS” – and left-wing liberals.
I think it’s important to know that there are right-wingers out there ready to exploit and coopt Puma Obama hatred for their own purposes, which is to bring us into their own corner. I think Tamerlane indicated this. And I think Puma began as more left of center part of Dem Party. But they’re hoping we’ll keep voting for Repubs.
Superb post, bb.
Funny. I don’t ever recall reading a post by “Tamerlane” here. Just another O-bot lurker with nothing intelligent to say.
I didn’t think Tamerlane’s essay was patronizing or nasty. I think open discussion is important and I understood what he was trying to say. I too found that there were certain PUMA-friendly blogs that I can no longer frequent because they espouse views on other issues that I find repugnant–so I just don’t go there, and keep quiet about why. But if I did choose to express those views on a PUMA blog, would there be anything wrong with that? Would it make me a flamebait troll? If so, I find that troubling. Many of us won’t go back to the Orange Cheeto because of its mob mentality and stifling of dissent. Do we want the same to happen here?
We may not be talking about the same thing, but I have seen an increase in comments on several PUMA and/or feminist sites that are anti-anti-violence or that attack an alleged “victim mentality.” It’s really seemed odd to me since there’s no good reason that an issue such as violence against women should be stricken from the “official” PUMA list of concerns. IMO, the PUMA umbrella can fit a lot of different people under it.
The persistence which the AAV commenters employ seems rather suspicious. And their outrage over “outrage” is just a little too overblown. JMHO of course.
Yeah, I noticed you mentioned that yesterday, and it is wierd.
DancingOpossum,
Nothing is wrong with it. What is wrong we me replying to Tamerlane’s essay and giving my point of view? John at LR said he welcomed responses.
And Tamerlane’s post was incredibly sexist. Are you saying you have no problem with his referring to Murphy’s blog as a “coven,” thus implying she is a witch? And do you agree with him that extreme violence against women is “not news fit to print” and no big deal because 96% of men are “puppy dogs?” Does that seem like serious discourse to you, inviting open discussion? If so, we just disagree.
More from John at LR:
Um….PUMA was “born” on May 31–after the primaries were over. Start a third party? Yeah, that’d work. Focus on state we might have swung to whom? We didn’t work for McCain. I don’t particularly support the idea of street protests–they don’t get much publicity anymore, but PUMA’s in Denver did stage some street protests, including one against Chris Matthews and MSNBC. I guess “John” was too busy blogging to join in?
Why don’t *you* start a third party, John?
Funny, the way they keep trying to throw our coalition into the waste-basket of history.
PUMAs did wonders- they were only formed after May 31.
It took Obama (with the help of Acorn) 20 years to work up his base.
Yeah, that was my earlier point, bb. I think LR is confusing us with McCain supporters. They’ve forgotten that Pumas were Hillary supporters, and seem to be jumping on the Obama hate bandwagon. They’re not bots. They’r Republicans. Not all trolls are Obots.
Thanks for picking this up, bb.
“Funny. I don’t ever recall reading a post by ‘Tamerlane’ here.”
Probably not–in part because when someone posts even a comment that seems to disagree with a PUMA post, the writer is quickly slammed as a troll, and then his/her comment is usually quickly deleted.
My question: Why do you care so much what other people think?
Site monitors would remember the person.
I’m a site monitor and I don’t recall seeing comments from Tamerlane here.
James,
I guess you didn’t bother to read my post. I couldn’t care less what this person “thinks” of me. I’m just not interestest in being lectured and bullied and told what to do by him or anyone else. There was also a great deal of false information in Tamerlane’s post. Responding to other bloggers and correcting their “mistakes” is just something bloggers do. If you don’t like it, that’s OK with me. Live and let live.
Well, this just isn’t true. I am to the right of alot of you and have expressed differing views and noone has ever deleted my comments. Although I don’t agree with everything I read on this blog, I feel very welcome here.
Celeste,
That’s because we aren’t about left or right here. Tamerlane just doesn’t get that, because he has some other agenda, which he should just get out there and push instead of trying to get us to do it for him.
I disagreed yesterday and none of my comments were deleted. I am avery new poster here and have always gotten a fair and respectful reception…except when Ang got me down and kicked sand in my face.
bostonboomer, on March 5th, 2009 at 1:27 pm Said:
“NYCgirl,
I’m going to remove the link from your comment. It’s not personal. It’s just that we don’t link to that person”
****************************
Sorry! I don’t often post here, although I read the blog entries. I wasn’t aware of the blackout policy. I thought his review might be of interest to PUMAs and Conflucians, although I understand if you don’t want to read any of his comments.
NYCgirl
That’s OK, don’t worrry about it! He is a nutty guy and we just don’t link to him. We don’t want him showing up here.
this guy is a major TOOL-BB sp is TS!
I think thias Tarm-a-line guy is an Obot…sent to co-op us into the Koolaid camp!He is never mentioning pampers in his rant leads me to this conclusion.
I didn’t think Tamerlane’s essay was patronizing or nasty.
Did you read the comments he made too?
The essay was incredibly conscending and nasty. And I gave specific examples.
and you did it very well too!!!! i too am tired of being defined by folks that never stop by and give us the time of day ! let alone read what we write and see what we’ve done …
evidently all of my economics posts are now radical feminist treatise! what a hoot!
Thank you, Dakinikat! Yes, all those essays about macroeconomics and the deficit and the stimulus package–all part of our radical feminist agenda. And then of course there are Myiq’s humorous posts. They are all about irrelevent “women’s issues.”
there would be wrong with that if they were, right? The confluence is an open blog with room for many differing opinions.
So equality is now a “radical feminist” agenda. Well shame on all of us for wanting equality for women and LGBTs. I guess we need to tone down on that equality thing otherwise it may catch on and really harsh that fool’s mellow.
OT to FLVoter,
Hi! I finally got my husband to write down his recipe. He doesn’t usually follow recipes so please excuse his shorthand writing style. This dish is absolutely delicious as well as simple and quick.
get and acorn squash; poke a buncha holes in it with a fork and nuke it for 12-14 minutes (ours will do it in 10.) cut the squash in half and scoop out the seeds and messy stuff. put fresh baby spinach and walnuts (i prefer pine nuts) and drizzle with extra virgin olive oil and season to taste with salt and pepper.
(he sometimes “wilts” the spinach first)
Thank you so much!
I have seen an increase in comments on several PUMA and/or feminist sites that are anti-anti-violence or that attack an alleged “victim mentality.”
I didn’t notice until you said something but I think you’re correct.
And many of the comments aren’t objecting to an over-the-top post or comment, they are objecting to the entire topic.
Like Tamerlane’s complaints.
I first noticed their comments on the beheading case that didn’t make the national news until after the NY NOW chapter and angry bloggers called attention to it. Their comments caught my eye and I’ve noticed that they have kept persisting and have moved on from TNA to other blogs and discussions.
Honestly, there’s something very “Rush”-like about their spiel. I’m wondering if they haven’t been employed to sow division amongst the resistance. (IMO, that’s what we are: the resistance.)
evidently all of my economics posts are now radical feminist treatise!
Naw, your posts are racist
oh, right, i forgot! silly me!
Oh look:
we’re we ever linked to LR?
Maybe for a day or two.
Someone-perhaps it was Fredster, started suggesting for a while that Confluence should link to LR, because John had such good posts there.
Well the link was made, and lo and behold, the next day there is this front-page anti-Puma post “Sexing the Puma” by someone who claimed he once was a Puma…
LOL- If you can’t run with the big dogs, stay on the porch.
You know what farm women do to big dogs on heat? Throw cold buckets of water …..
“What I will not tolerate are attempts to censor the range of the debate. That *is* fascism.”
Fascism?
What WE will not tolerate is being defined by a person unaffiliated with us and being told what to do by a stranger of minor consequence.
New Thread up: very wonky and not as fun as this one!
Something is up. The bots are out, in force, again… lecturing us all over the blogosphere. One of them popped in to my blog this morning, just long enough to imply I am a racist and tell me how ignorant I am for “supporting Rush Limbaugh.” (Which I do not, BTW.)
But, this is their M.O. Slander and innuendo. Innuendo and slander.
They get it “honest” at least. As it is right out of the Obama/ Axelrove playbook.
One more thing I’ll add…. if the bots are trying to redefine PUMA … then we must be one powerful movement! Cuz that is the same sh** they are trying to stir with the GOP. And, oh BTW…. it’s not working very well……
go check out the last post on the post about them … there’s evidence they’re being recruited on Craig’s list
It’s probably Axelrod getting bored to tears in the WH.
The First Amendment has nothing to do with whether or not a private blog allows someone to comment, post or link to another blog.
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
— The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution
It is a limitation on government ensuring its citizens certain rights. So alleging that a private blog is impinging on someone’s First Amendment rights is ridiculous.
Right. It is the government limiting speech the Constitution protects. Which is precisely what Obama is trying to do with Limbaugh. This blog can ban whoever it wants. It is neither censorship nor fascism. Get a clue, blogger-who-names-himself-after-a-mass-murdering-despot.
Beautifully stated, bostonboomer – let the hacks and trolls go DO their thing and see how far they get. They do not define me, my goals or efforts, period, end of subject.
In moderation at 2:38.
More:
Who does Fredster think is persona not grata? John can come here and comment anytime. Questions about the blogroll can be taken up with RD. I personally read Cannonfire every day. And I also read Liberal Rapture. But why claim that The Confluence focuses solely on women’s issues. That is a lie.
I think he’s referring to Lambert – who is a big boy and can speak for himself.
Lectures usually are boring because there is no dialog just a lot of hot air.
I do not waste my time with people who lecture me.
I am in damn good company among the PUMAs here at TC.
There is input from all walks of life and experience. I learn something every day. We teach each other, we stand by each other, we learn from each other.
The information gathered here about so many various things is amazing. It does seem that this gathering of people has been together for much longer that it has.
It is a welcoming group, a listening group, an active group.
It is making politicians take heed.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE, MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
I do find it interesting that there are a few TC posters bashing TC at another site.
ps
IT IS DRIVING THE OBOTS NUTS.
THAT IS ALWAYS FUN
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
this is way off topic, but I just had to share. Obama is a major embarrassment!!!
From The World News:
He (Britain Prime Minister Gordon Brown) had put clearly great thought into giving the U.S. President lavish gifts to signify Britain’s ‘special relationship’ with the U.S.
During his historic trip to Washington, Gordon Brown gave Barack Obama an ornamental pen holder made from the timbers of the Victorian anti-slave ship HMS Gannet – once called HMS President.
The unique present delighted Mr Obama because oak from the Gannet’s sister ship, HMS Resolute, was carved to make a desk that already takes place in the Oval Office in the White House, after being presented by Britain to the US in 1880.
The Prime Minister went to the trouble of hunting down the perfect gift after becoming the first world leader invited to the White House by the new Commander In Chief.
So it would be perfectly understandable if Mr Brown felt a little underwhelmed at the official gift he received in return.
For despite being leader of the world’s most bountiful nation, President Obama handed over nothing more thought-provoking than 25 classic American films on DVD.
It was the equivalent of receiving a pair of socks from an unfamiliar aunt at Christmas – and a less-than-glowing affirmation of the UK-US bond.
This gift took no thought at all, unlike the PM’s gift, which shows a lot of thought.
Wow, not like Brown couldn’t get those DVDs through NetFlix or the British equivalent. What a slap in the face!
Or, was this purposeful? Because apparently Obama’s meeting with Brown in London was one of the times the press reported that a world leader was less than impressed with Obama. just a thought…
That is hilarious! I wonder if they were at the very least Region 2/PAL DVDs so Brown can play them without having to get a region-free player.
Wow, BB. What a little cuss! He doesn’t get that the main reason Barky got elected was because of the misogyny, sexist comments, and race baiting. I thought the main purpose of PUMA was to protest the DNC for violating their own rules to give Obama delegates and then pressure them to have a roll call vote. I don’t understand what makes him believe that he has a right to dictate his preferences to anyone. Sure we can suggest, like we all do … but you all have control of the blog.
As far as TC being full of bitter victims who are moderates — this is why I put in more personal stuff, it is difficult to act like you are something you’re not, right? RD said something about most of us here not buying BObama’s bs because we grew up in fundamentalist religions. That certainly was my case and I’ve been the lone Liberal in my family ever since. Now I have male in-laws who feel free to call me “racist” because I didn’t support Obama but they did (so they feel exonerated now).
Anyway, I really appreciate The Confluence’s efforts and have always felt welcome here. Maybe because I’m a bitter man-hating racist? (~snark~)
& by the by, in all my years studying Women’s Studies I just thought it was a given that feminists were anti-racism … think Sojourner Truth, Bella Abzug, and other greats … T’s comments are particularly stupid given that this Women’s History Month!
No differing opinions allowed. If you differ you must be a troll or an Obot. I beginning to think “troll” is not an insult.
Have your comments been censored?
Joanie in Brooklyn
I have read many differing opinions on this blog.
Many times I have not agreed with something that was posted or comments.
Why are you so angry?
Civil discourse is always welcome. We learn from differing opinions and ideas.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
I am the queen of differing opinions here. I’ve disagreed in posts with RD, Dak, and angie. I’ve never had any of my stuff censored.
The only time I have seen censoring is when people come in here and expect to post propaganda and get away with it.
yup, cw and i go back and forth all the time on carbon fuels taxes and I don’t ever send her to the spam
Differing opinions are allowed. It is a lie to suggest otherwise.
That may be the policy now, but I offered several “differing opinions” before the election that were quickly deleted, despite the fact that I was never intentionally rude and used no bad language. That unwillingness to engage contradictory ideas was why I deleted the Confluence link from my own blog and haven’t bothered to comment for a long time until today.
What is the name of your blog? (just curious…)
It’s very imaginatively titled “James McPherson’s Media & Politics Blog”
You can see more, if interested, at http://jmcpherson.wordpress.com/. Thanks.
How did you present your differing opinion? I’ve been here for awhile and as I have stated upthread have had disagreements with RD and dak in their threads and have never been censored. I like it here because I know that when I post a differing opinion that I will have to use facts to back up my position and that pushes me to think about how to present my argument.
I do think because of the bombardment of propaganda by the bullies who wanted Obama to win that if you didn’t make a substantial effort to explain your positions factually( we saw alot of folk who wanted to revise reality (ie RBC and Michigan spring to mind)and engage in real substantiqal discussion then you risked removal. For the most part though I don’t see the site not allowing for differing opinions. I see them as not allowing blatant propaganda or attempting to hijack a discussion by attempting to reframe things(ie :if you vote for a mccain then you are a republican etc, etc)
James,
We delete comments that attempt to highjack a thread with Obama talking points. People came to this blog during the primaries for a specific reason. They wanted to get away from being attacked and stalked by Obama supporters who couldn’t accept any disagreement with their views. Even when we started our own blogs, they followed us and stalked us with repetitious talking points. They are still doing it. This blog isn’t a debating society. We have a point of view and we serve people who want to advance that point of view.
So the DYB comment that “Differing opinions are allowed. It is a lie to suggest otherwise” was obviously an error.
By the way, I was a Hillary supporter until Obama became the nominee, when I then favored him over McCain. And even if that weren’t the case, the concern that some random commenter can “hijack a thread” reflects exactly the fear of engagement that I noted.
Regardless, as you note: “This blog isn’t a debating society. We have a point of view and we serve people who want to advance that point of view.” Preaching to the choir definitely is your right–I was just making the point that there are instances in which debate is not welcome here. Thank you for confirming that.
So what’s your point Jim? This is your third or fourth consecutive comment claiming we don’t allow dissenting comments.
Did you just show up to keep arguing until someone gets tired of your repetitious blather and gives you the boot so you can go back home and say “I told you so?”
If that’s your goal just say so and we can both save a lot of time.
myiq2xu, I made the only point I wanted to make with my first comment–every other comment I’ve made here has been in direct response to someone else’s. All but one were answers to questions asked directly of me, and I thought the polite thing to do was to answer them (as I’m answering you now).
But you’re definitely correct in your suggestion that this issue has been exhausted and that we all have better things to do, so this will be my last comment on the issue. Thanks, all.
Based on the viperous content of your ad hominem attacks, I surmise I’ve struck a raw nerve by challenging your dogma. I’d love to engage in an actual debate, but it seems like you’re having far more fun hanging me in effigy. Enjoy!
Perhaps the truth is that we don’t enjoy someone who doesn’t know us but presumes to define us.
We might also find it odd that someone who finds us without value spends so much of his time and energy to chastise and castigate us.
Bashing is fun for you, is it?
i take it this is a hit and run rather than some attempt at a conversation?
What do you want to debate? I suggest we start with a rousing round of statistics on the number of battered women who exist since you take umbrage with PUMA attacking womens issues head on.
For the record, I think PUMA is large enough that it can engage on a multitude of issues. There is no reason to suggest that it can’t attack women’s issues AND reform.
Agreed. I’d really like to see a sensible argument, minus the sexist language, that articulates why women’s issues are a “turn off.” And why PUMA can’t embrace a myriad of reform issues.
As far as I’m concerned they aren’t a turn off. Furthermore “women’s issues” effect us all. For example by providing affordable birth control we get bang for our buck. By failing to include funding for low income women’s birth control we(meaning every single person, not just the women) may end up paying $4 for every $1 not spent(children are expensive). While reproduction may be considered a “womans issue” it effects society on the whole. It’s almost foolish to think that anything that effects over half our poulation isn’t going to effect our society as a whole and term it a “womans issue.”
I totally agree with you CWaltz. And for the reasons you’ve succinctly laid out, I don’t understand how anyone could lobby for exclusion of these important issues.
I tried to link to your site “writehillaryin.com for a real and actual debate, but all I got was nothing. If your site doesn’t exist don’t bother giving a fake address.
Dogma? Please be specific. What dogma are you referring to. I didn’t even express an opinion as to what PUMA is or should be.
OK – still reading this post — got as far as the “bitter woman” comments and had to come down here and S C R E A M!!!!!!!!!!!!! at the top of my voice.
Has anybody noticed a pattern where TC has been singled out by another blog and attacked? I wonder if it’s really just about these other web-sites angling for relevancy and web-traffic. Attack the more popular blog in hopes of raising awareness about themselves. In less primitive groups leaders are chosen by challenging the current leader and fighting to the death. This happens in some human cultures and in animal tribes. Can we be seeing something just as primitive at work here?
I think you are on to something there!
Tamerlane
I do not feel that I have attacked you. I have explained my position on what PUMA stands for.
I have never read any posts or comments here on TC with your name attached.
In trying to define me as a PUMA without knowing me is kind of insulting.
PUMAs are a political group and a women’s group and a group of all genders and races who want to help fix some of the problems with the government .
Those who want to help are welcome. Those who just want to carp at others are not.
If you are just looking for attention there are many better ways to get it.
WOMEN WITH INTELLIGENCE AND EXPERIENCE,MEN WHO SUPPORT THEM AND COUNTRY BEFORE PARTY ALWAYS
PUMAS,BUBBAS,EQUALISTS AND THOSE PEOPLE RULE
Based on the viperous content of your ad hominem attacks
Awww, should we have him a pity party?
To quote:
I’ve noticed several posters here, even regular ones, who interpret disagreement as an attack. It’s why afrocity left: she interpreted criticisms of Republicanism and conservatism as an attack on herself. She declared that she as a conservative didn’t feel welcome. Frankly there’s nothing anyone can do about that. If people disagreeing with someone is interpreted by that someone as an attack – too bad. They need to stop being babies and not run away screaming “Nobody loves me!”
That’s the first hard lesson of the blogosphere. Don’t take it personally. You can’t even take the ad hominem attacks personally. You just gotta let it roll off your back.
Actually, I’m wrong, that’s the second hard lesson. The first one is “think before you hit submit.”
When you offer an opinion – don’t be shocked and appalled when someone (even most people) disagree with you and don’t whine about feeling ganged-up on. If you can’t take someone disagreeing, don’t offer an opinion.
Agreed on both points. Even after I think, I’ve erred. Post and learn.
Afrocity was singled-out and attacked personally and she never got past that. That’s a very different thing than what you’re saying.
there are so many of us here that support her and listen to her … I wish she could see her way past to ignore them and stay here with the majority of us that love and support her
I wish she would too. I’ve always loved Afrocity and I really miss her.
Agree.
afrocity was singled out and attacked on this blog?
I was there when she made her final exit and it was after someone criticized Republicans in general.
That someone had singled out Afrocity as a Repub for 3 weeks or more -it was a running off and on slightly stalking thing.
Saying that this should be a Dem only blog stuff like that.
That someone seemed innocent but IMO wasn’t.
If people will go back to Jan 29-Dak’s thread on “When Will They Ever Learn”, they will find the whole argument between Afrocity and Speaktruth.
Final Rupture occurred Feb 14-RD’s post “The Blame starts at the Top.
I’ve noticed several posters here, even regular ones, who interpret disagreement as an attack.
Saying “You’re wrong” is not an attack.
Saying “you’re stupid” (racist, insane etc) is an attack.
New thread up
Write Hillary In was me, and I’m not Tamerlane. It was never a blog and doesn’t exist anymore for obvious reasons.
The phone verification measure was the result of meddlesome spamming of the site.
Thanks for the info.
Tamerlane is obviously a phoney.
Yes, thank you, and welcome to The Confluence
That’s right. It was a message board, not a blog. Wow. I’m amazed my memory is that good! And glad to know you’re not Tamerlying.
I can assure you that Tamerlane isn’t a phony, or a liar. We know each other through WHI. He’s as passionate about politics as anyone here, I’m sure, and mostly on the same page, issue by issue. And he was as PUMA as a PUMA could get, before PUMA became femi-centric.
I can assure you that he’s a liar, and PUMA has always been “femi-centric” because it’s always been a predominately female organization.
also, if you checked TC out recently you’d swear we were a finance/economics blog right now … RD, me, even BB are doing things related to that… but that’s the topic right now!… Does that make us econ-centric?
I’m trying to figure out where this ‘femi-centric’ thing comes from … I blog on economics and finance thing … and that’s femi-centric how?
Dakinikat,
I think the problem they have with us is that some of us *are* women. Women should be seen and not heard….or something.
Us wimnin’s got it into our heads that we matter and we care about what we care about, not what this dude tells us we should be caring about. We’ve let him down
Dayum. Now I’ve really impressed myself. My memory rocks.
You can assure me of nothing, because I don’t respect you.
and that matters to me why?
Oh really? Why are you here then? You have no idea what started PUMA, because you didn’t start it. Now run along.
I’m trying to figure out where this ‘femi-centric’ thing comes from … I blog on economics and finance thing … and that’s femi-centric how?
I thought he was referring to the fact that the majority of PUMAs have scary vajajays
well, that’s what I’d like to hear some one answer… this reminds me a lot of some kid that transferred to my school in high school because there were ‘black kids everywhere’ and I checked the number of black students in his high school and it was like 15%, hardly anything any one would call ‘every where’ unless you were a hard core r@cist or just plain freaked out by black people. (I voted for both for him and told him so in my government class when I pulled the numbers out on him) We go through streaks of posts where we all discuss something, we went through a string of things when the gropper was out there, when some of the family planning things came up, but sheesh, just because the mainstream press ignores them, doesn’t mean they’re EVERYwhere on Puma blogs…
Oh, dear. Talk about a distraction! These b-list sites are trying to get attention by attacking a more popular site like TC. Why are we wasting time arguing over what some blogger wrote on some blog? He can spew whatever he wants. It shouldn’t affect us and we shouldn’t be wasting our time arguing with them because there’s nobody to argue with.
Women should be seen and not heard
My grandpa said “Women should be obscene and not heard.”
Grandma slapped him upside the head after he said it.
These b-list sites are trying to get attention by attacking a more popular site like TC
We’re trying to help out our smaller brethern and cistern.
We go through streaks of posts where we all discuss something
If you have a group that is predominately musicians they’re gonna talk about a lot of musical stuff.
As I stated above though, it isn’t like the “feminist stuff” doesn’t effect us all in one way or another, whether you be male or otherwise.
How much the low woman on the totem pole makes affects even those higher up the totem pole. When a woman has a child that she isn’t ready and capable of taking care of it isn’t like they allow the male half of the contigency to opt out of “helping”cover the distance. “Womens issues” don’t exist in a vacuum. Anything that affects over half our population is going to have an affect on thw whole of it.
It’s absurd to think anyone serious about reforming things wouldn’t think that shouldn’t ba consideration or plank of reform.
But you know how it goes. They act like anything that affects half the population is a trivial fringe issue that should be pushed aside for something that may affect 2 percent, but the “right” 2 percent. The universal 2 percent