I am watching CNN and they are still hitting on Palin. There is just no stopping these people. They can’t put the cudgel down. They are recapping the chopped up interviews and the SNL skits. What is *wrong* with the media? Sarah was a good choice who rejuvenated the Republican ticket. She wasn’t stoopid and she wasn’t a liability until Obama’s campaign and the media pounced on her and equated a well liked governor into little more than a talkng vagina.
Come on, Obamaphiles, now is the time to stop the misogynism. Don’t ruin this day with something so ignoble as to making fun of on of the losers. Call off the dogs.
Filed under: Media | Tagged: Media, misogyny, Sarah Palin
you see RD-the price paid for the OBOT win
no cause to celebrate
They have to crush her. She’s still a threat to The One in 2012.
It’s started.
They will not lay off.
The Obots are vicious losers, and even worse winners.
Don’t expect ObamaNation to desert the tactics that won them the Presidency. They will continue to use them until they don’t work anymore.
We can help call out those tactics whenever we see them. And we will.
PUMA POWER!!!
sarah: The problem seems to be coming from the media still. But now is the time for Obama to tell them to step down.
Expect the Oborg to behave in victory exactly the same as they have behaved and that includes the now disgraced MSM.
Yup – women, especially strong, smart women – just cannot get a break in this country, can they?
And her own campaign staffers are anonymously sniping to FOX News about her, blaming her for Mac’s loss, criticising her for spending that $150 K on clothes (yeah, she did that shopping on her own), bungling her interviews (yeah, she edited them to make herself sound stoopid), etc. etc. etc.
Blame the woman for the failures. And eliminate them all!
Sarah Palin 2012 –> this is precisely why they need to crush her. She is a REAL THREAT to these 0bots who want Obamacrats to rule forever.
Ever consider that, perhaps, it’s not the media. That perhaps they’re CORRECT about her?
The simple fact that she rejuvenated the Republican base that wasn’t going to vote for Obama anyway and only succeeded in driving away moderates and independents.
RD
If Obama tells the media to leave Sarah alone I will eat my shorts.
He enjoys this stuff-that has been obvious for quite some time.
and can someone clean up at 10:20
lucky for this guy I can’t get at his jugular right now
RD, please don’t think victory will make the intolerant any more gracious. It just makes them bolder and more arrogant. (Remember Bush after his 2004 “mandate”?)
Interesting how the Obot shows up on the misogyny thread, huh?
Oh, no, it’s not. It’s utterly fucking predictable.
While I do not expect to live to see the day, I guess my best hope this morning is that my daughters will live to see the day that a woman will cheat, steal and lie her way into the Presidency . Then women can celebrate like AA’s are doing today. I miss democracy.
morescode it doens’t matter whether they are correct or not…. it doesn’t take away from the fact that the media never even pretended to evaluate her achievements as an elected official… they only covered the superficial crap like clothes
Now with an Obama presidency, misogyny and homophobia has been given open permission.
Any woman or gay person or ANYBODY for that matter who dissents Dear Leader will be crucified.
I for one, am not happy.
Liberalism is DEAD in the Democratic Party.
The Big Tent of Democrats – GONE.
Has anyone actually met this guy? He’s gonna tell them to stop? Why do that when he can sit idly by and benefit from it?
He is not a better man. What does he have to do to drill that in?
morsec0de: No, frankly, it never occured to me that the media was right. I still don’t think the media is right. And it just looks incredibly ungracious for the winner to allow the brutality to continue.
So, I suggest he knock it off.
Isn’t going to happen. They will not call off the dogs. Misogyny has been give a green light. I agree with the tr011 above in that, while the choice of Palin was a courageous one and did energize the base as well as PUMAs, it was also a serious miscalculation of the sexist attitudes that exist. I think that Palin helped McCain in one respect, but hurt him because of her gender.
Yeah, good luck with that. These are Obots. They’re as contemptible in victory as they are in the heat of battle; it’s the nature of the beast.
Go to ?www.teamsarah.org & show your support for her.
I also wrote to the Mccain camp.
What everyone “UNDER-Estimated” was how much woman DO NOT support other women.
Once he picked Sarah I heard them myself say:
“I was considering McCain; but now that he picked Sarah/
I’m INSULTED”!
Coming from LI/NY I thought it was only the e-lites in my area.
Well, I guess not.
Shame on the women that allowed us to be victimized on such a “LARGE SCALE”!
If anyone believes BO will say something to call off the dogs- well, I’ll have some of that stuff you’re smoking.
We can’t have any “uppity” women, now can we?
Regency: Well, my point is that there’s no benefit to him by keeping it up. He’s won. Time to knock it off. It doesn’t profit him a bit to keep on doing it.
mamab said:
They have no reason to stop the tactics, because they were rewarded handsomely for using them this time. They are using it as a mandate from the American people to continue, and continue they shall. Lord only knows how long it will take for them to no longer work. Misogyny is deeply ingrained in the human experience.
Am I surprised?…..Nope….Adolescents have seized the day….Sheeesh!
RD, I completely disagree with you. Obama should have addressed the sexist attacks a long time ago. If (and that’s a BIG if) he addresses it now, it’s too late IMO.
riverdaughter, on November 5th, 2008 at 10:28 am Said:
Regency: Well, my point is that there’s no benefit to him by keeping it up. He’s won. Time to knock it off. It doesn’t profit him a bit to keep on doing it.
____________________________________________________
maybe it’s just fun for him, contemptible prick that he is.
Has anyone forgotten his smirky comments about “Periodically, when Hillary gets blue…”
does anyone seriously think he’ll be nice now because he won??
Poor McCain;
He was so good to Hispanics on immigration but got fucked by them because of the meanness of the Republican party. He lost them by more by 1 to 2.
The electorate, the media, and the DNC have given the “Thumbs up” to misogyny and homophobia.
Sowing salt on the fields of your defeated enemy.
I can see the Chris Matthews and Kieth Obermanns of the media doing this because they have severe gender issues. I wouldn’t be too surprised to see either one involved in a spousal abuse scandal. The you have those women who will stab any one in the back to advance their own careers even it it sets gender equality back to the stone age.
Her campaign staffers, if it is really them and not the Kosholes, sound more like Democrats than diciplined republicans we come to expect.
Well, my 13 year old nephew told my brother that he hopes he can raise enough money to be president one day.
I am not getting out of bed today.
Today in CA I wake up and chickens have free rights (Prop 2) and humans do not (Prop 8).
RD – your last post — judged on character not skin —– I think in this election it was the other way around. I will not celebrate.
He’s already said he’ll run for a second term. Sarah Palin is potential competition. The next 4 years will be a referendum on her.
A republican on the radio today said the republicans did not support McCain until Sarah Palin was named. Then the base came alive, donated money, began phone banking and canvassing. Until then, many of their base just didn’t pitch in. He claimed they have only themselves to blame that Obama has won.
Because Sarah energized the republican base, is partly the reason the media is still attacking her. She’s a symbol of an up and coming republican. Also, she’s a woman who dared try to break the glass ceiling. So obviously, she must be destroyed completely for daring that feat. (Snark)
Misogyny is just one of the elements of the overall thuggery environment that we are seeing and feeling the most vividly. It is meant to bring down our female group.
There are so many more. I can’t fucking believe this day has come.
I’m very sad today. Obama and his Obots said they didn’t need us and it looks like he was right. Furthermore, Murtha was re-elected as was Wexler here in Florida. I don’t like to say it, but I think we need to be resigned to the fact that the American people are a lost cause. They are not worth the aggrevation and heart ache I just went through. You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink. I simply cannot handle the mysogny I have seen. I have lost respect for so many of the people at work with their sexist anti-palin blather. I am done.
Well, we have our work cut out for us. We’re going to need to figure out a way to fight the attacks on Palin on our own.
Regency, on November 5th, 2008 at 10:33 am Said:
He’s already said he’ll run for a second term. Sarah Palin is potential competition. The next 4 years will be a referendum on her.
Excellent point. They’re starting right now to destroy her potential future candidacy.
Misogyny wasn’t just a tactic.
The benefit of continuing these tactics is that the Republican Party is already expecting Sarah to run in 2012.
Check out the Patriot Room if you don’t believe me.
They will destroy her so she does not have the chance to do that. It is a calculated tactic, and it will work for a while.
We will see what happens when the mystery man actually has to start Presidenting.
SimoFish, I’m so saddened that you had to wake up to such depressing news.
{{{simo}}}
At this point I honestly see no difference between the msm & the Obama — and distinction to be drawn is a distinction without a difference. So, the misogyny will not stop — not from the msm & certainly not from the Obama camp.
Obots fear anything that pees sitting down.
{{SimoFish}}
Well, at least Happy Black Guy (formerly Angry) is happy with the last post… tres amusant!
I can’t even tell you how many of my long time ‘friends’ forwarded Gov. Palin insults to me, including some written by stupid women from other countries. It made me so mad I sent them scathing, profanity-laced rebuttals. I don’t even care to hear from them ever again.
And just where is the genuine birth certificate? I assume buried with the typical white lady.
Sad day when innocence is lost for good….
WTF is going on?
Prop 8 is winning in CA?
I’m so disappointed by my peeps who voted FOR it by 2 to 1. Obama as always stayed away from that fight (has this guy ever found a fight he couldn’t duck?)
I think I’m about to vomit.
McCain effectively handed her the Conservative mantle last night. She knows it and she’s willing.
You are quite right, myiq. It wasn’t just a tactic. Misogyny is a very real and very active undercurrent of hate that runs through our society. And it was used like a billy club during this election.
The last I saw on CNN, Prop 8 was being defeated. Did it really pass?
I guess we can thank Obama’s evangelical homophobes for that victory, if so.
I am getting really really depressed now. That CNN story was the only bit of good news I saw today…
{{{simofish}}}
Well, now that Obama has won, I’ll feel perfectly comfortable speaking my mind when it comes to Hillary or Sarah hate. No more silence.
Just think, if McCain and Palin had won last night, the sexist misogyny wouldn’t be happening. Thats right..
You would have had to declare Obama exactly what he is a thug and racist but you weren’t prepared to call him what he is…so please stop the complaining about misogyny. All the complaining and writing about it in the world isn’t going to make it go away.
The time to fight was for the last 18 mos.. that time has now passed.
gxm17, catarina — thanks — I am just so bummed today — I feel so helpless.
WTF is wrong with our world? I can’t believe people voted him in and take my rights away. Early indicators show that 58% of AA’s and 47% of Hispanics voted YES on Prop 8 — WTF ?? Especially AA’s — you want a black president — it’s time you say —- yet strip my rights? No guessing why I am bitter.
morsec0de, on November 5th, 2008 at 10:20 am Said:
Ever consider that, perhaps, it’s not the media. That perhaps they’re CORRECT about her?
Pray tell, what do you mean by that? That Sarah is in fact a CUNT?
madamab —- right now Prop 8 52% YES and 48% NO
RD
You are expecting honor from a dishonorable MSM which was enable by a dishonorable candidate. Now that their candidate has been legitimized they will feel that they are equally legitimized and will continue using the tactics that brought them and their candidate success.
I do not separate the MSM from Obama. They washed each others backs and will continue to do so.
It is now approved to bash women and it will continue.
The California proposition to ban gay marriage passed 58-42 because a huge chunk of Obots voted for it. As I recall, obama won California 60-40 which means the first action of the Obama contingent is to deny California gays and lesbians their civil rights. Liberals who voted to ban gay marriage, fortunately voted to protect farm animals against overcrowding, and voted down parental notification. Only on the issue of gay marriage, did they go to the right. Interesting huh? Starting here and now, there will be less equality under an Obama administration.
I got calls from Bill Clinton to vote against 8 but did not get any calls from Obama himself. In fact, the only time I saw him on the issue was on tv in a pro-8 commercial talking about how marriage should only be between a man and a woman. But the flp wouldn’t make a robocall opposing it. He needed the hate in order to win.
So, yeah, California gays have fewer rights because of Barack Obama supporters.
On Prop H8 -
Prop 8 Exit Polls
They show a narrow victory for marriage equality: 52 to 48. Every ethnic group supported marriage equality, except African-Americans, who voted overwhelmingly against extending to gay people the civil rights once denied them: a staggering 69 – 31 percent African-American margin against marriage equality.
I cried this morning and told this to my lesbian obot spouse who told me that I “should give those people a break after all they were slaves and had to overcome alot”.
Yes, let’s “celebrate”! To the end of any possible and reasonable discourse. To the continuation of the brutalization of women. To the continuation of homophobia. To the continuation of the suppression of votes. To the continuation of the ability to buy your way into office. To the continuation of reelecting total assholes back into office over and over and over again then demanding “change” when they fuck us up one more time. To the continuation of corporate America who decides who sits in the Oval. To the backstabbing and villifying of anyone who dares to dissent.
Celebrate! With so much on the table to choose from I am at a loss to know where to begin. By all means, let’s put on our party shoes and dance! At least we won’t have to give any concrete thoughts to what exactly we have won.
We have not moved my step forward.
He won’t call off his dogs because he likes them and supports them and to judge from comments he’s made, agrees with them.
This election has allowed sexism and misogyny to run wild. It’s out of the cage and not going back in. It’s allowable behaviour to openly hate on women. It really has set us back.
I see the point about being happy for AAs and for the country. But, I greatly resent that their happiness came on MY back, and with MY denigration.
As for my LGBT friends, I mourn and despair. I’m so sorry. When we wake up from our collective depression, let us stand firm together.
NEWS ALERT
from The Wall Street Journal
Nov. 5, 2008
California voters overturned same-sex marriage rights in a vote that stands to impact how the issue plays out elsewhere in the nation. Proposition 8, which would establish marriage as a union between a man and a woman, passed with 52.1% of the vote, against 47.9% opposed, with 94.6% of precincts reporting. The approval marks a stunning upset in a $70 million campaign that just weeks ago looked to be running in favor of preserving gay marriage rights.
madamab,
Thank you for moving that photo down the page. I don’t think the attacks on Sarah will end. I think attacks on Hillary will continue too. I think the Democrats will make every effort to get her out of the Senate. I think Hillary made a very big mistake. I hope I’m proven wrong.
gxm:
I wasn’t talking about society, but you are correct.
What I meant is that Obama IS a misogynist, and His supporters are created in His image.
Misogyny wasn’t just a tactic, it’s an inseparable part of the Obama Experience.
They were going to try to get rid of Hillary anyway. There was really no way to stop that.
Indigogrrl – that is what I saw.
That would mean a defeat for Prop 8.
It may be too early to say that it has passed. I am completely un-shocked to see that Obama’s Donnie McClurkin worshipers voted for it, though.
angienc, it’s likely that morsec0de is an atheist (click on his name) and he hates Sarah for her religion. Nothing to see here, just base human nature getting the upper hand, again.
I cried this morning and told this to my lesbian obot spouse who told me that I “should give those people a break after all they were slaves and had to overcome alot”.
So fortunate, isn’t it, that lesbians have never had to overcome anything. I look forward to the day when non-lesbians can finally hold public office in this country.
(That was snark, BTW. These days, it’s often hard to tell.)
You look very young, morse code. With more years behind you you may learn a thing or two about life. Best wishes.
RD – Obama has shown no leadership in this regard in the past
I predict he will say nothing to the media about denigrating Palin, or any woman for that matter.
Obama is an evil pig, period.
He has never called on his supporters OR the media to put an end to their sick and hateful sexist nonsense.
and myiq is right-it has been part of the “experience”
CUNT shirts, case in point.
Why would the misogyny stop now? It has been a great tool for the MSM and Obama. Get used to it, it is here to stay. With Obama winning this election, well, stealing this election, these horrendous tactics are now apart of our new world.
Riverdoughter,
Are you still celebrating the win of Obama that showed to women that they can’t go into politics with out being smeared and out right degrated. This is what the Obama election is all about. You can kick women all you want because it does not matter. People don’t care. So keep celebrating Obama’s victory as some great moment in this country. I have lost all respect for you.
To expect Obama to take a moral stand against this blaspemous treatment of Sarah Palin is naive! He has never stuck his neck out for anything. Risk taking is not party of his psyche as has been demonstrated by his past.
He will not speak out. It does not serve his purposes. This is a man who reveres hip hop music, Ludacris, Jay-Z, and the like. What would ever give anyone the idea that he is against this?
She will face villification until they crush her into dust. And if he does not squelch it now, when? Never. Women have lost big time. But yeah, let’s celebrate.
C.U.N.T. for me now means: See you in ‘10!
Simofish – Sorry, so very sorry. I wish our society was better. I wish that Obots weren’t such hateful, arrogant assholes. I wish so many things.
But wishing won’t make it so. ACTION will. And we will be the voices of dissent, just as we were during the election. We will grow and fortify our numbers. We have massive and magnificent potential as a movement. That is what we should celebrate.
No, you’re not wrong. Hillary had no choice, but her influence is over. I hope I’m wrong too.
madamab – prop h8 was a BAN so to pass meant that the previous law was repealed…
BTD really speaks for me on this one:
PS: On a personal note, as a Black man, I apologize profusely to the GLBT community. I am dreadfully sorry and feel totally ashamed that my own kind is massively voting FOR discrimination. Now excuse me while I go weep.
This is a great place to tell you what happened to me just half an hour ago. I woke up from my two hour “nap” and went to the Dean & Deluca to get a yogurt parfait (I have to eat when I take antibiotics). So, as I’m walking out there is a stereotypical Obot — mid 20s, white frat boy — heading to his mini-cooper with a “Georgetown” decal on the window & an Obama sticker on the bumper. Our eyes meet & he kind of smiles at me so I thrust my chin toward the Obama sticker, smile and say :
“Obama sticker, huh?”
He gushes & smiling “Yes!”
Me (still smiling): “Have you got one of those Sarah Palin is a C*nt t’shirts?”
He giggles nervously and says: “No, ha,ha, but I’ve seen ‘em”
Me (still smiling): “Well, f*ck you.”
I’m going to get myself killed before all this is said and done.
mablue – thank you for that … I know that my aa friends support me, I just wish this didn’t happer
Why would Sen. (now Pres-elect) Obama) lower himself to call for the end of woman-baiting? That would run counter to the shoe-scraping, shoulder flicking, fist-bumping culture that brought him to where he is today. I wonder if Ludacris will play at the Inaugural Ball?
I honestly don’t mean any offense, but are we sure this is really RD posting? I’ve been reading here every day since June and even have this as my homepage at work, but I feel like I’ve walked into a different reality this morning.
AngieNC – LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
I don’t care what happened last night. PUMAs ROCK!!!
I think Hillary and Bill are finished. Her whole argument was he couldn’t win. Looking at the electoral map it wasn’t close.
Welcome to the new Democratic Party. I for one am changing my status today to “independent”
Thugs behave like thugs.
Angie- LOL, you go girl!!!
[...] politics | Tags: election, politics, Sarah Palin | New Feminist’s uber-brief comment on this thread wasn’t seen fit to be posted, so now it turns out NF has a lot more to [...]
CindyTX – I met her last night. It’s her.
My take on this (and please forgive me RD if I am stepping out of line), but I believe she is a very forgiving and tolerant and optimistic person. This is where she’s coming from with these posts. It’s one reason why we love her.
we all saw this coming —
homophobia and misogyny are two sides of the same coin … its the railing against the feminine (homophobia rails against the feminization of men, masculinization of women)
it sucks and its systemic
That’s my girl!
I think HRC’s argument that he couldn’t win was before any of us and even her realized that the media was in total control of thsi election… of course he can win with the MSM in the tank and the fraudulent voting being ignored….
even she couldn’t see that democracy was dead
funny, angienc
good thing you needed the yogurt to take your meds or the kid might be wearing it on his head now.
They won’t stop until they come down from their kool aide induced high. Fortunately, the real world will inevitably slap some sense into them.
In other news, Biden was wrong about Obama being tested 6 months into his presidency. Russia only waited 6 hours to start the test. Here’s the headline from a UK paper (I can’t post the link for some reason)
“Russia welcomes Barack Obama with deployment of nuclear-capable missiles “
riverdaughter, on November 5th, 2008 at 10:26 am Said:
morsec0de: No, frankly, it never occured to me that the media was right. I still don’t think the media is right. And it just looks incredibly ungracious for the winner to allow the brutality to continue.
So, I suggest he knock it off.
_________________________________
But BO is a misogynist, so all woman-hating is good for him. The weaker women are the better it is for him. It reminds me of guys I’ve known at work that never say anything about conflicts between women because whatever tears the women down is good for them.
I expect BO to do absolutely nothing about the Palin bashing except enjoy it.
I for one count ACORN as one of the reasons this election “wasn’t close.”
I can do “tolerant” but I ain’t so hot on “forgiving” or “optimistic.”
“Grouchy pessimist who holds grudges” is more my style.
“Petulant clown” is okay too.
IndigoGrrl…
The Barack Obama we knew (and Hillary knew) was unelectable. But most people were never allowed to know him. The media did its job. The corporate elite has won and put a shiny black face on its fascism.
Goddess help us all.
From the previous thread:
“Sad. As I was saying, the party is already over. Putin just made his first move this morning. Missiles lanchers were moved close to and pointed to Baltic Nations.
To anybody who does not extrapolate American politics on the international scene, and therefore missing the fact that McCain was being the sworned enemy of Putin, here is a snapshot: With McCain out of the way, Putin is “testing the mettle of this guy”. I wants to reconstitute the old Soviet Union territory and he is not wasting a second. Georgia invasion in August was just a warning shot. ”
Yes, the missile launchers have been moved to the borders (Koenigsberg) of Lithuania and Russian submarines have been moved to the Baltic Sea. My family will be one of the many to suffer yet again.
It is the same old same old. Blame the woman that you have abused.
Makes me want to vomit!
AZ PUMA
Obama’s not going to call off the dogs. And of course there’s benefit to him in letting them continue to savage Palin and his other opponents.
They made his “win” possible. He owes them. And he has to feed them to keep them loyal for the time when he’ll need them again.
Please don’t blame Palin for any loss. She did wonders.
I can only speak from here in Italy, where Berlusconi won earlier this year
The fact is that a sitting Party can do very little to win an election once gas prices start rising.
Prodi’s government was really not bad on the economy- Italy was hit less than the UK by the latest international crisis, because Prodi&co had stabilized certain issues.
But once people were hit in their pocketbooks-that was it.
I’d say that “non-stop campaigning” a la Bush II is already her with a vengeance, given that BO couldn’t even make his acceptance speech without saying somethign along the lines of “I’ve got so much to do it won’t all get done in my FIRST term” or words to that effect.
As for Palin trashing, McCains loss means to my way of thinking that the far Right will rise up again, pointing out that the “moderate Conservative” McCain los tto the “far left” BO, and so only a far Right Rep has a chance and who is standing there…other than Palin.
I still say Obama is Bush’s final insult to the American people, because BUSH is the real reason BO won, with a huge assist from the compliant media of course.
I see one screwed up BO term, with Reid and Pelosi provign Dems jsus as obnoxious inpower as the Right, and then..alas..conservative Rep presidents for probably tje rest of MY life.
Yes, I”m depressed, why do you ask? (And that’s before I even allow myself to think of the lovely, gracious, First Whiner Michelle who MAYBE now thinks her country has done enough for her..maybe.)
About the Russian missile launchers…Pooty-Poot has been threatening to do this for a long time. This is a response to Obama’s election, no doubt…but Bush is still President.
I wonder what he will do about it?
was it christ that said forgive them they know not what they do?
I am surrounded by people who have no idea what they’ve done
catarina — have you tasted the Dean & Deluca yogurt parfait? I wouldn’t have wasted it on that bot!
When Hillary cried in NH I think she knew what was happening.
Big Brother has arrived…..The Media.
They have proven they can manipulate anything they want……..Big Brother has arrived. They are in power, how else could a totally unqualified person get elected president and qualified people get thrown in the garbage. And it was easy for them, when money, money, money comes before country.
I was glad to see Diane on the news, coming out against prop eight, did anyone see Nancy or Barbara take a position? I makes me think the langoliers will be out to get her.
Palin made all the difference on the R ticket, in spite of the MSM wishing it wasn’t so. No other VP pick would have given him a chance against the billion dollars (from foreign contributors) that Obama had at his disposal.
Would Romney have energized people the way Gov. Palin did? Would SNL have broken viewership records if Pawlenty had guest starred? Would Romney’s family have engendered such affection from the Republican base as Sarah’s did? Would any of the other potential VP picks brought superstar status to the ticket, as she did?
She is going to go back to AK, and will continue to make her mark, I have no doubt.
Hopefully, she’ll keep smiling sweetly at the O and Joe, as they go crazy trying to figure out how to deal with her candy coated granite approach (I borrowed candy coated granite from another post, it suits her so well).
Barbara Boxer opposed Prop H8
She’s a real liberal.
They will not lay off Palin; she is the front runner for 2012 and they have to do what they can to discredit her now. Romney and Obama will be gunning for her and will have teams to slime and smear her. She’s the new leader of the GOP and she’s a target; she’s tough and she can take it.
Rima -
Part of me agrees with this. But another part of me sees the incredible AA turnout for Obama as a harbinger of things to come. Just as it was a firewall in the primaries, it will remain a firewall in 2012.
Our only hope is if the media returns to type and begins post-vetting Obama after the inauguration. If they do so, it is possible that Rezko could get him indicted.
Otherwise, I think we’re stuck with him for the next eight years. JMHO.
myiq2xu, on November 5th, 2008 at 11:00 am Said:
That’s my girl!
I think I need to take a break. Since February I have looked forward to and felt myself in step with rd’s postings. They gave me hope and reassurance. Today I am not sure what I feel. Disappointment perhaps that asking us to celebrate a hollow victory that was won on the backs of the principles we uphold is unimaginable right now.
I am not that forgiving nor that tolerant in the face of what has occurred throughout this election. To enumerate the wrongs, I would have no idea where to begin. Sorry, but I do not see this as “historic” in traditional terms. I see it as corrupt and I could care less that an AA is grinning ear to ear over a counter. There are many of us out here whose voices will not be heard. Whose observations have been ridiculed and reduced. Who found ourselves tossed so casually under the bus.
What am I celebrating? What am I asked to take pride in? It eludes my sensibilities. We stood together once. We were firm in our resolve that no matter what, principle trumped ra*ce and gender when it came to electing a president. We proclaimed character and decency and this is sorely lacking in this so called victory.
I love the Confluence and the voices that emanate from this blog. But I need to back away for awhile as there is nothing at the moment that I see gives cause to overlook the sham that this election has produced. If those who support this win in any form are capable of overlooking the hypocrisy and deceit that brought us here, I am not one of them.
Sorry, but disappointment overrides any “feel good” sentiments at the moment.
The way I understand it, if Stevens won then they have to have a special election to replace him (since he’s going bye-bye)
Palin could run to replace him and would probably win. That means in 4 years she would have just as much DC experience as BO has now.
It would also keep her close to the spotlight.
Well,
There is no going back for me, I now know what alot of people that I admired and respected are and what they are willing to do to win.
As for MSM and Obama they can say what they wish, dig themselves a deep hole for all I care. It’ll make it easier in 2010 to bury them.
I think the way to see Putin’s move this morning (at least as it has been described here) is not so much that he’s “testing” Obama, but rather that he feels quite sure he knows Obama, and knows Obama won’t respond forcefully, as would McCain.
Why wait until the very day after the election? Because he absolutely did NOT want to do something that would tilt the election in favor of McCain, whom Putin regarded as a far more determined foe of his.
Thanks mylq2xu, I know she is. Where I live, I only saw Diane, against the most amazing bunch of garbage – and 2 hours of the 700 Club.
Pat:
Take a break if you must but please don’t stay away.
Captain Spaulding would miss you.
I love you RD, and I know you a wonderful person, even though I’ve never met you but only talked to you and read your words. But I disagree that Obama has nothing to gain by continuing his campaign of hate against women and gays and working class people. Most of all his win is a victory for the upper classes. He will continue to target groups like older people and baby boomers too–because it works. Every tyrant needs to target groups for the rest of society to project their rage on. Women and gays and the middle and lower classes are going to suffer greatly under Obama, take that to the bank.
myiq: There is always Klownhaus.
Pat J — stay! I don’t support this win in any shape or form! If you leave, who is going to keep me company?
Pat,
Would you mind if I e-mailed you privately? I have to leave for work right now, so I may not see your answer until tonight.
Ann/BB
madamab
Bush will do nothing. And Russia will do nothing until after the inauguration. This is their show of power and they can wait until the right moment. (I’ve been reading the Lithuanian media.)
On another note, I am dumbfounded by Prop 8, and how the vote was split. I am not well versed in Illinois state law on GLBT issues but will get more involved. California is considered a very liberal state and if this is a precedent for other states then along with working hard for womens issues we need to make add GLBT issues to our agenda.
angienc – LOL and good for you!!
PJ – I understand your feelings. My husband (who voted for McCain) reacted the same way as RD, so I can understand what she’s feeling without taking it personally.
Take your time, but please, please come back!
I work with two women who did not, and do not, like Sarah Palin. One of these women is a lesbian Democrat Hillary Clinton supporter, who loathes BO, and who thinks Sara Palin is stupid. The other is a Ph.D. mathematics professor who is an Independent, who likes Joe Lieberman, thoroughly dislikes BO, and who voted for McCain. She also thinks Sara Palin is stupid. Are these women misogynist? in my experience they are not. They are both very supportive of women in all aspects of their lives. They simply do not like or respect Sarah Palin.
I happen to think Sara Palin is quite smart, but naive about certain important things (such as “European socialists are not free, like Americans.”)
None of this, IMO, has to do with Sarah Palin being a woman.
Is there hatred toward Sarah Palin JUST BECAUSE she is a woman? You betcha! But are all women who dislike Sarah Palin misogynist. Doggone it, no!
Focus, folks, on getting a woman in the White House in 2012. Who’s it going to be? For me it shouldn’t be Sarah Palin, because I do not agree with her Republican views. But, like BO’s ascendancy, would there be something to celebrate if Sarah Palin were elected President. You betcha!
Do you want to work for 4 years to elect Sarah Palin. Darned if I do. Then who? Is Hillary going to come back? It’s looking hard to impossible. Then who? How can it be a Kool Aid drinking Democrat? It can’t. Then who?
Rupert Murdoch is a conservative, and too conservative for my political tastes. But he said something once that resonated very deeply with me. It is stuck to my door, and reads: “Do we want amiable incompetence or vision and discipline?” You know which answer Rupert chose, again and again.
We know what we want: a woman Democrat President, a woman with principles and integrity, with vision and discipline, in the White House in 2012. Are we going to beat our chests, moan and complain, writhe and squirm, or roll up our sleeves and get moving?
RD has shown how to go about it. Our character is not tested when the going is smooth, but when we experience our darkest hours. Dig deep folks, and regroup. The Republicans will be swallowing a bitter pill now. They will be hard-headed and re-group before long. We need to beat them, and beat BO in 2012. Impossible. I think not.
asking BO to call off the dogs now is like asking water not to be wet. as myiq stated — these aren’t tactics — this who is being sworn in as President of the USA!
I expect to be receiving my burka shortly there after.
bb: Sure. And angie, you always have myiq and that “thing”.
Pat, I completely agree with everything you just said. I am a pretty tolerant and forgiving person too, but I’m not going to sit back and be the woman who gets abused and then refuses to press charges.
Obama isn’t going to change. He isn’t going to tell his goons to stand down on Palin or any other woman. It’s who he is.
Pat J — that thing could never replace you. Just take a few days off — I think things will calm down here after a while.
Pat, please don’t go. Maybe lurk for a while, or take time out. But your voice is one the most passionate, clear and important, IMO, on this site. In this dark time we need you.
madamab, on November 5th, 2008 at 11:06 am Said:
“The corporate elite has won and put a shiny black face on its fascism.”
OMG, yes. He’s the perfectly disguised Whited Sepulchre.
Pat J — did you see how I told that Obot I met this morning “FU’ — didn’t that make you happy? aren’t more stories like that worth sticking around for — because if they are I promise to find a new and different Obot every single day & tell them “FU” & come back here & report it.
Pat:
Captain Spaulding wants to know if you want to double-date with me and Angie?
He’ll cook up his specialty – I’m not sure what it is but he serves it with fava beans and a nice chianti.
urgetocompute – You are a good person and I enjoy your posts very much.
But to say that women are not being sexist towards Sarah Palin is absolute lunacy. As a man, you do not understand that women are often our own worst enemies.
They believed all the lies about Sarah. They did not do the research that proved they were lies. Why? She is a woman.
They told me they did not support her because she had young children, because she was “inexperienced” (in penis years), because she was stupid. They wore “Sarah Palin is a cunt” t-shirts. What woman calls herself a cunt? A sadly deluded woman who thinks that she will be immune from misogyny if she sucks up to the patriarchy; if she is on the right “side.”
There was no party ideology here. There was no disagreement on positions. It was all about giving her the shaft because she doesn’t have a penis.
“He’s the perfectly disguised Whited Sepulchre.”
I got that once when I was in the army, but the penicilin shots took care of it.
I’m actually crying that Pat J’s leaving.
At least I can be glad they haven’t called North Carolina yet. Cold comfort.
urgetocompute
European Socialists are not free like Americans. After 13 years overseas I can tell you that this is a true statement. Combinations of national laws and EU directives which are often socialist in nature eroded some of the freedom we have as Americans.
Some of the EU laws to which nations had to submit negated or partially eroded or overrode some of the freedoms, and decision making rights these nations had on a national level.
Many of our states (I am not familiar with the laws of each state) have rights which some members of the EU had to give up in order to join the Union.
I lived in Europe during the time the EU was formed and I watched the sometimes very bitter debates on national levels and read all the materiials available. The European media was pretty fair and balanced on a national level in those days.
I don’t think we are as informed about all of that here, something I learned from my children being in school – very little is studied about Europe past WWII.
Thus Palin is right and very well informed.
yogi41, on November 5th, 2008 at 11:13 am Said:
They will not lay off Palin; she is the front runner for 2012 and they have to do what they can to discredit her now. Romney and Obama will be gunning for her and will have teams to slime and smear her. She’s the new leader of the GOP and she’s a target; she’s tough and she can take it.
*************
Well said. And we will call out the sexism used against her by any and all. As well as the silence against sexism by our “leaders.”
Madamab, you are so right. This time ‘New Coke’ was better marketed and the masses were convinced that it tasted wonderful before the cans were actually put on the shelf.
madamab – I agree with you. I didn’t say, or imply, that women are not being sexist towards Sarah Palin. – many, many of them are. But just because a women doesn’t like Sara Palin does not make that woman sexist. I detest BO, but not because of his r*ce or his gender.
LOL julies — what is the hold up I wonder? Not sure how much McCain actually won by, so they don’t know how make BO ballots to forge to overcome that gap?
* some of the freedoms they had, and we still have as americans. (sorry about the fragment)
Sarah is a threat. That’s the reason for the continued attacks. She demonstrated terrific composure as the press picked her apart. She brought out crowds comparable to Obama. She recovered from mistakes like a pro. She is a threat.
The left-wing wishes to destroy her, of course.
It won’t work. Nobody with half a brain believes that nonsense. This was the year of the Democrats. An idiot could have won this year. The fact that McCain, entirely too old in many eyes, even mounted a good fight was due entirely to Palin.
And “they” know it.
I think the attack on Palin is not about 2012. It is about Senator Stevens. He was re-elected last night.
Sooner or later he will be required to step down. The Governor of Alaska will appoint his replacement. Sarah can step down as Governor, the Lt. Governor will be elevated and he will appoint her to that U.S. Senate seat.
The Dems greatest fear – Sarah Palin working and living in the lower 48.
bostonboomer – you are prescient.
No matter how disastrous the next 4 years are, none of that will be Obamas responsibility, it will be laid upon scapegoats. Come on, we all know how that works. We all lived in the 20th century.
urge to compute — I haven’t heard a single, solitary argument against Sarah Palin that was substantive. She’s dumb & deliberate lies (i.e. she wants creationism taught in schools) I’ve heard. But not ONE substantive argument.
angie – probably closer to the truth than what they’re saying. Obama is only ahead by 11-12,000 votes and they have close to 50,000 provisional ballots to count. Not that it matters in terms of the election, but it reinforces my belief that there were a LOT more PUMA’s here than anyone gave credit for.
I agree with BB above:
The Obama campaign has been driven by, and has succeeded because of, hate in many segments of society toward others: hatred of the working class by the “professional” class; hatred of city people for country people; hatred of women; hatred of gays.
The crucial feature that Obama’s own race has added to this is that it has made that blatant hatred excusable because Obama, as an AA, could always be used to play the Greater Victim Card. It was always trumped every other card. (And why do AAs in California, who voted overwhelmingly against granting equal rights to gays, get a pass? Why are they not excoriated as would, say, any white evangelical group who espoused the same beliefs in the same numbers? Again, because they can play the Greater Victim Card, which forgives all).
The marvelous thing about identity politics as it’s played in America today is that it can enable and rationalize every bit as much virulent hate as it purports to be opposing: it just requires a careful adjustments of the targets of that hatred.
Does anybody imagine that the real driving force behind so many affluent whites supporting Obama is not anything to do with Obama on his merits, or due to their real concern for AAs, as much as it has to do with their ability to hate people like Sarah Palin and all she stands for, and their ability to declare their moral superiority in doing so?
Identity politics, as it is usually played, is really nothing more than a rearrangement of hatreds.
There seems to be a need today to try to impose rationality on an irrational situation. Electing Barack Obama is not a victory for African Americans, it is the illusion of a victory for African Americans. A man who calls women, “sweetie” and shows them his crotch on an airplane is not suddenly going to become sensitive toward the plight of a woman being mistreated. A nation delirious with joy at their ability to assuage their inherited racial guilt without addressing any real racial problems, simply by pushing a button, cannot be said to have progressed racially. America has not changed since last night, it simply has a new face to present. Unfortunately,what’s behind that face doesn’t quite measure up to what is needed. We all knew that. That shared PUMA knowledge is the only rational thing involved.
angienc bless you for socking it to that stupid Obot.
Madamb, when my mother called me last night to ‘comfort’ me (d8idn’t work much, we got into a big fight) she said that she really hated Palin because she reminded her of the church ladies that terrorized her when she was young.
After we hung up, and upon much reflection, I realized that my mother actually hates women. In our family, it was the women that kept h3r down, hurt her (her mother and grandmother), stopped her dreams, forced her into the classic strict religious role. Now, I know, and I think she knows intellectually, that those women were just as subjugated, just as held down, and probably could do nothing else. But my mother can’t, won’t let it go.
I have to thank her because she stopped the cycle, and did not do that or me. And so a huge mystery and a lot of frustration for me has been explained. Now I know why, whenever I bring up women’s rights, or the things women undergo, the injustices, she immediately points out that men suffer the same things and more or less negates the point I’m making.
She considers herself a feminist. I think she’d vehemently protest if I told her my thoughts about this. But, she hates women. I wonder how many other liberal ‘feminist’ women feel the same?
looking for integrity I, too, lived in Europe for many years. I can assure other readers that, from my perspective, many Europeans are quite free. They enjoy a freedom that is rarely seen in US society (but which is in abundance on the Confluence) – freedom of thought.
PJ
In spite of your feelings about RD’s post, this has been and hopefully will continue to be an open forum for various opinions that are fair and balanced (unlike most tr0ll posts), or even emotional but integer.
Please stay and continue to provide your view on things.
Besides – we need to add a little spice to myiq’s and angienc’s interplay
pat – if you do go…please let me know where…. you have been the most inspirational to me during this nightmare…
I will be very sad if I can’t find you and read your thoughts
Sarah in the Senate (heh, that’s a movie) would make my year.
John and Sarah would hook-up there and be a formidable team.
thank you perries — I need all the blessings I can get.
Well, the best part of this whole deal for me was that I got to meet all of you writers. And the NQ writers, so thank you RD.
I haven’t looked at the paper yet — but ? Somebody above said something about the prop in Ca on gay marriage and Obots?
Yeah, I told you yesterday at the polls what I saw. They were Repubs!
That is who the Obots are and that is why we don’t recognize their gig.
Ah well. Nice to be in the company of Dems in exile Rd.
I will still read you all everyday! Because I think you are the best bunch of people around. I was never a political blogger till this election, and only because it was such an important one.
I’m sorry about that passing in CA. We are the liberal state, or we used to be. I’m not going to be part of any political party anymore. The dems let me down on Hillary months ago.
When the glow fades, reality will set in and it will be really interesting to see what the Obots do once they aren’t happy with their pick. Right now old Jimmy Cliff songs keep running through my head…
I thought this ironic:
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=081105043838.2sechc97&show_article=1
but all the Confluence Pumas will too. Especially you MIQ2XU!
ya know, you just can’t fool a real California Dem, can you?
Nope.
I love you guys……
hugs.
Pat – very good post — I am with you 100% — I also agree with angienc that the people here do entertain me.
I am so sad today – feel so helpless.
Reg – I also think she and Hillary would hook-up to work on family, women and childrens issues.
“Part of me agrees with this. But another part of me sees the incredible AA turnout for Obama as a harbinger of things to come. Just as it was a firewall in the primaries, it will remain a firewall in 2012.”
Only time will tell but it asn’t enough here in SC to brign BO even close, despite an AA electorate of 25% or so. More of a difference in Northern states with large AA concentrations in their cities though.
I think “they” may become s disillusioned as well, and I’m still sitting her ethinking “He’s HALF black folks”..which seems to haev gotten lost along the way, sinc ehe has chosen to accept only his black heritage it seems.
My own take remains the same: I would take no pride in an incompetent women winning office, and I will not just automatically vote for a woman beucawe of her gender…that’s just a way to put underserving people into places where they will fail.
I jsut see BO as teh mirror image of Bush…an AA president instead of a “legacy” one,a nd absoltely certain he’s the right man at teh right time, and with supporters sayign “Oh, he will surround himself with the best and the brightest!”
How’d that work out for us all ast time?
simofish — please explain something to me — did the passage of Prop. 8 retroactively undo same-sex marriages that already occurred?
LOI:
If it gets any spicier Net Nanny will start blocking this site
angie:
That’s undecided as of yet.
I was sad last night as McCain came on and proceeded to give his concession speech. I left the room and couldn’t watch. I’m even more sad almost depressed waking up this more to see Prop 8 pass along with Prop 2. I’m in the midwest and had donated money hoping to see one day my rights and dreams as a gay american one day come true. I seriously am concerned about ENDA now and Obama’s reaction considering how things went down in CA.
Geesss . . . I think it’s five o’clock somewhere, isn’t? LOL
Dee: I agree, especially for special needs kids. They’d rock the Senate there.
Angienc — you are my hero. Thanks for risking yourself by standing up for what is right!
I hate to burst your bubble but, as much as I personally like her, I think Sarah Palin is toast. The media, with Obama’s encouragement, has destroyed her. It truly pains me to say this, but I’ll bet you don’t see another woman on a national ticket for 20 years. And you can blame Hillary Clinton for that, not Sarah Palin. BO would not have been elected if Hillary had not endorsed him and campaigned for him. She could have stopped this.
An article in today’s WSJ describes the fight for the soul of the Republican party. They say Palin represents the evangelicals and social conservatives while Romney represents the fiscal conservatives. With the coming financial debacle, I’m betting that Romney emerges as the party standard bearer after the dust settles.
myiq — well, I would think a law couldn’t undue a valid at the time it was entered into marriage — but what the hell do I know anymore.
Sima – That is fascinating.
My mother, Goddess rest her soul, thought that certain manifestations of “feminism” were actually harmful to women. She didn’t agree with demonstrations such as bra-burning (why should she go around unsupported to give men a free show?), thinking that that they benefited men more than women, and the same with the “free love” movement, which allowed men to have guilt-free sex with multiple partners. Oh, how empowering!
But the main thing she thought was a travesty was the idea of a woman “having it all.” She thought it was a huge bait-and-switch for women – having two full-time jobs, yet only getting paid for one! She would have preferred a bigger focus on women getting compensated for being stay-at-home moms.
Oh, how I miss her. I wonder what she would say about all of this?
I personally think Sarah has been handed a very important and big opportunity. We’ll see if she decides to go for it.
The memes against her were ill-founded and only grew “legs” because there wasn’t enough time, really, to combat them all. She now has 4 years.
She can establish herself, a solid record, and learn from this extremely wonderful opportunity. She can decide on how to go forward.
I was impressed, personally. She’s a whale of a compaigner. Now, I’ll be watching to see what she learned.
I’m so proud to have voted for John McCain. He absolutely set the stage for her to emerge as an important figure in the Republican Party. And, frankly, that party needs new life, someone who isn’t male and who isn’t over age 60.
Sarah can step up to this role, but it’s her choice. Big decision.
She also got a taste of what awaits. It’s not always fun.
Valhalla — don’t go exaggerating my accomplishments — I could have taken out that little snot nosed Obot with one Tia Bo round house kick! (and we were in the Dean & Deluca parking lo a 10 in the morning — I felt pretty safe).
Yep, it was Hillary’s fault. *shrug* Always is. Not the voters or the media or the Republicans. It’s Hillary’s fault.
Because she is God and we all listen to God.
Amen.
Good morning RD & Co.
I just left a comment — hope I am still here?
Anyway, the best part of this whole thing was meeting the great writers here, being a PUMA, and knowing other Dems were in exile like me.
I’ll still read you all every day.
Hillary brought 82% of her supporters to Obama. She could have refused to endorse him. She could have endorsed McCain and put her country first. She didn’t.
simofish — please explain something to me — did the passage of Prop. 8 retroactively undo same-sex marriages that already occurred?
_____________________
the jury is out right now — I am sure they will try to take my marriage certificate
Dave — you are wrong to blame Hillary — if she hadn’t campaigned for & endorsed him he just would have manufactured more votes. I do not believe nor will I ever believe he actually “won” that election.
Regency. Seriously. You are fucking awesome. Could not have said it any better.
Hillary didn’t bring anybody. They came by themselves. Why, because BO rode on Bill Clinton’s coattails. I didn’t come. She didn’t bring me.
At the end of the day, everyone had to use their best independent judgment to vote. 82% of her supporters didn’t learn anything and didn’t use good judgment. Blame them for that.
Ever consider that, perhaps, it’s not the media. That perhaps they’re CORRECT about her?
So what, do you snitch on people?
Dave — I hate to say this — but I put the blame on those individual Hillary supporters for not thinking for themselves — each and every one of them separate and apart from each other. Personal responsibility — don’t get used to seeing it.
And Dave – if your Party had fully backed McCain, you wouldn’t have needed us PUMAs.
Get over yourself.
Hillary supporters went to Obama 85-15.
I guess Hillary succeeded in getting her voters to back Obama though I believe in the end it was the economy that did it. Without the Wall Street collapse, the election would’ve been closer, possibly close enough that McCain would’ve at least won VA, FL, and OH.
I do not agree with Sarah’s political beliefs but I respect her greatly and thought it was so unfortunate that Clinton supporters who complained about the sexism from Obama in the primaries jumped on the misogyny bandwagon only because the woman is a Republican.
The media will continue to act this way because we allowed them to. They elected Bush and now they’ve elected Obama. Hopefully we won’t allow them to get away with this again in 2012.
I’m sorry this is a little off topic but as a christian I am majorly pissed that people voted to keep gays from getting married but didn’t care enough to vote for human life.
I mean, what the hell. I mean, if they’re christians they should care about life more than if “teh gays” get married.
I’m so pissed off right now. I guess you can count amongst your ranks a republican who’s pissed at the republican party. I know y’all disagree w/ me on life issues, but I’m sure you can see how irritating it is for me to see myh party care more about keeping people from getting married than actually caring about life.
What a depressing day.
I think it doesn’t help that my Mom is getting older, is very tired, and just has more or less given up the fight. She’s always been a rather dark soul and she doesn’t think women will ever be more than the dustrags of the nation. Hillary was her last hurrah at working for change, I think.
Mom is like yours, Madamb, in that she thinks part of the feminist movement is wrong. She resents that in the 70’s there was no focus on bettering the lives of mothers, of domestic workers etc. Or, not enough focus on it. Women were supposed to be like men to succeed.
I don’t see it that way, but she does and she lived it. I was just a teen then. Strangely enough, I think my father is the more staunch feminist of my family (outside of me, that is). As the strong male figure in my life, he taught me that women could do anything. He was against nothing I wanted to do.
It’s all very convoluted and confusing isn’t it? I think that is why it’s easier to ‘get rid of’ r@cism (not that I believe it’s gone at all) than sexism and misogyny. I think the latter two are hard wired into us, sometimes.
Regency — you are so right! LMAO — now it is Hillary’s fault that BO WON!!! Mother f*cker — I did NOT see that one coming!
The George Carlan YouTubes said it all…the borge has arrived.
“The California proposition to ban gay marriage passed 58-42 because a huge chunk of Obots voted for it. ”
Yup, AND the proponents of it used the Messiah’s own words to push for it! And Plastic Jesus never ONCE told them to stop doing it. So we have the Obots to thank for our new Preznit as well as Prop 8. Great going, guys.
Incidentally it really blows to be at work today. Everyone here is a crazed Obot, EVERYONE, and all morning I’ve been getting these cooing sicky-sweet e-mails about how wonderful it all is. Only one person here knows of my hatred for the Lightbringer and even she is sending them to me, like I’m supposed to be “all better” now…I have just been deleting them without comment but I’m really having a hard time controlling myself.
I love this job and don’t want to jeopardize it in the slightest. OTOH I am known for being very outspoken, especially about politics, so I am guessing that my silence speaks louder than any words.
urgetocompute – where did you live?
I understood SP’s comments to be directed at political rights rather than the right to think and express what one thinks publicly without repercussion. In the sense of political rights freedom is tempered by EU laws.
Regarding freedom of thought- or freedom of the expression of thought. Yes, to an extent. For example, during the Bosnian conflict a reporter tried unsuccessfully to have ZDF, ARD and other stations show the footage he had taken of the genocidal events that were taking place. Station after station refused to look at or show the footage. They would not print articles about this or how bad the situation was in Bosnia.
If my memory serves me right (I’d have to look at my files) he managed to get on camera at a press session and was able to state this. Finally the footage was shown which proved what people and refugees had been saying all along. I believe it took several months – how many people’s lives could have been saved in that time frame?
I find that a good measure for freedom of the expression of thought in Europe is what one can express and read in the media without repercussion. That varies from country to country.
I.e. In Italy socialists are allowed to express what they think as long as it’s along socialist lines and not critical of their faction. (Italy is splintered among many parties with different viewpoints ranging between tha far right and many variations and the far left and its many variations). If one steps out of that box too much then there is a lot of castigation.
RD’s post might not be popular (I very much disagree with it!!!), but it is one post. And though I was late to find this site, it has been a wonderful place to find support and voice our outrages and hurts, and it is thanks to RD. Someday we might not have this forum for sharing. Some day we might not be allowed to disagree and stand indignant in disbelief that someone disagreed with us. RD deserves at the very least the benefit of the doubt. There are great posters here, great commentators, and wonderful people. It would be a shame to tear apart a community based on one post. It isn’t like RD hasn’t lost her mind or quaffed down the kool-aid.
..just my opinion.
MT — George Carlin, may he rest in peace — the true prophet of our time. BO’s “win” was to make us feel so GOOD about ourselves so we will not notice when more of our rights get taken away.
Dave, I never have gotten the criticism. Hillary made him go through the entire primary, which obviously incurred the wrath of the insiders. She promised to campaign her “heart out.” She did. That was her promise to the party.
I think Hillary came out fine. She pushed the party insiders. She gave back.
She didn’t deliver my vote. I, in fact, found out that I rather like some Republicans, so this long-time Democratic straight-ticket voter now isn’t in the bag.
I like it. I’m now looking at records, real records. If it’s a moderate, they get my vote. If I can’t figure it out, then I’m not necessarily voting Democrat.
I’m done with all the labels. Puma, Right-wing, Left-wing, you name it.
It really isn’t rational. Look at CA……totally for Obama, but those latte-sippers don’t want their precious Janies and Jonnies knowing that there are same-sex marriages!
There are a ton of very confused people who imagine themselves liberal but think that their OWN private prejudices are OK.
Susan, from NQ, actually wrote to a reader protesting a story that was unverified and said, “If it’s bad for Obama, then it’s OK.”
Get my drift?
That’s crazy thinking.
A politician must deliver on promises. Hillary promised. She delivered.
Wow! Picking a fight with a random passer-by ! That was SO brave of you!!
This is who they are. This is who they’ve always been. This has been the M.O. from day one. BO sits back, pretends his dirty hands are clean, and happily reaps the benefits.
This says it well:
frankly0, on November 5th, 2008 at 11:37 am Said:
I agree with BB above:
The Obama campaign has been driven by, and has succeeded because of, hate in many segments of society toward others: hatred of the working class by the “professional” class; hatred of city people for country people; hatred of women; hatred of gays.
NEW POST UP!!!
Madamab
Agree. One of the young rep’s in my office came in to talk to me today and said that the reps onlly have themselves to blame. As an all life rep he fully expected the party to get behind McCain and they did not.
C’mon. Obama did not manufacture over 7 million votes. Even ACORN could not pull that off. I don’t know how you can rationalize Hillary’s actions. She had the power to stop this and she did not use it. As a consequence, her presidential aspirations are over. The best she can hope for now is a long senate career like Ted Kennedy.
Blame the Republicans? Yes, we paid the price for George W. Bush’s imbecility. And McCain’s campaign made some critical mistakes in the wake of the financial meltdown. But everyone knew we needed Hillary’s supporters to win. We got 18% of them.
I don’t know why people keep repeating this business about the Republicans not supporting McCain. They most certainly did.
DV — don’t kid yourself — McCain did win VA, FL & OH. Remember USSC waiving in 200,000 “votes” a few weeks back?
AnninCA: Nail meet head. Thank you for spelling that out. I’ve been saying that for months.
Whethere anyone likes it or not, Hillary kept her word. That’s it.
pop….I agree. There were just not enough of them. LOL*
Turn out in LA, guys…82%. *eye-popping!*
Then you should have gotten more.
That was John and Sarah’s jobs. It was not Hillary’s job to deliver votes to them. Her mission was to do the opposite. What is this shit about her doing everybody’s job for them? Take some responsibility, your side choked and our side went back to what was second nature: falling in line.
LP — FUCK YOU
What is *wrong* with the media?
And what frightens me is that it works. I have had so many “liberal” friends repeat the talking point that she is stupid. Propaganda works. That scares me most, because the majority of people do not seek out alternative sources or think analytically.
And Obama “should speak up?” Are you kidding? We’ve watched him stand by, enjoying the political advantage of the r*ce-baiting and misogyny, saying NOTHING. He is not a leader–he is an opportunist.
Dave – Hillary made sure that the Republican 527s never ran ads on Wright which would have helped McCain in a state like NY. Nothing about Rezko. Can you imagine the effect an ad with images of Rezko’s slums would have have had on people loosing their homes? I really wanted McCain to win but I don’t think everything is Hillary’s fault. She did help deliver Florida for BO but she isn’t to be entirely blamed for McCain’s loss.
Oh darn, we knew Hillary would be blamed if he lost. Now she’s blamed because he won. What a powerful woman. Still for Hill!
Dave — if McCain needed Hillary supporters to win then how in f*ck mountain did Bush win the last two times — ’cause he certainly didn’t do it with my vote.
I don’t know how you can rationalize Hillary’s actions. She had the power to stop this and she did not use it. As a consequence, her presidential aspirations are over. The best she can hope for now is a long senate career like Ted Kennedy.
Dave: exit polls show 2.7 million PUMA voters. That considerable. And yes, HRC does want a long Senate career, where she will focus on UHC, education etc. Her support helped, but to suggest she is solely responsible for BO’s win is ridiculous.
I wonder if the defeat of Prop 8 in California will change NJ’s Gov Corzine’s promise to pursue it after the election. I thought that was a good move on his part, to not let NJ get caught up in the same general election hysteria as CA and FL. But another kink in the armor is all this talk about a cabinet position for him.
It is my understanding that the NJ marriage law will be a legislative action and not a public referendum. I think that would be a first in the nation – the people speaking through their representatives.
The current Civil Union law in NJ which was set up to provide the same rights as marriage but has been found to be falling seriously short by an official State committee that held hearings.
Anyone know how the NJ approach is going to work? Did this election change the make up of the NJ houses with respect to support for equal marriage rights?
My nearest big city newspaper went orgiastic this morning and the area Repubs have put the word out to cancel subscriptions as it is a majority Repub area. I canceled also after 30 years. I also canceled the New Yorker. I had already canceled Time. I just blocked CNN, FOX news, MSNBC, NBC, CBS, and ABC. I have the local independent station unblocked. I have CSPAN, BBCAmerica, and the Weather channel and my local rinky dinky newspaper. All bookmarks for national media have been removed. I still take two financial papers because I really need to stay on top of it. I am going to take a media vacation so to speak for a few months to improve my mind and deprive them of revenue. If you want to get someone’s attention and show your displeasure hit them in the wallet.
AnninCA, 11:35 am Said:
“This was the year of the Democrats. An idiot could have won this year.”
Well it did. A cunning one.
Dave — were the hell were the 527s on Rezko & the slums? are you trying to tell me the GOP didn’t pay for those “swiftboatveterans” ads against Kerry & that those group of vets came up with the money on their own? What about the whole Kenay/Odinga campaign BO participated in on the taxpayer’s dime? Hannity had to cancel that Corosi inerview — where were the Republicans? I’ll tell you were — they were throwing McCain to the wolves with endorsements by DICK FUCKING CHENEY because he was “too liberal” while licking their chops at getting even MORE power in 2010 & 2012.
fif, on November 5th, 2008 at 12:02 pm Said:
And yes, HRC does want a long Senate career, where she will focus on UHC, education etc. .
***********
Yes, and she can help hold Obama’s feet to the fire with a little help from John McCain too, I hope.
fif….Sarah gave them the opening with the bad interviews.
My guess? She so learned!
That’ll never happen again.
PS — and yes, BO manufactured 7 million votes — and he would have manufactured 77 million if need be.
PPS — were were those f’ing “orange alerts” that ran all through the 2004 primary to remind us how much our national security was at risk? No orange alerts from the WH this year. Guess we must be safe.
Naturally, Republicans (not all but many) will blame us for this loss even though we worked way harder than they did for McPalin. They sat on the sidelines and let the PUMAs do it and when the PUMAs couldn’t deliver, they started with the heckling.
Such. Bullshit. Monday Morning Quarterbacks.
emma…I’m hoping he’s a case of “Still waters run deep.”
Isolde — I canceled The New Yorker during the primary.
The NYT is about to have their stock downgraded to junk. F*ck em all, the treasonous @ssholes.
angienc
They can lick their chops all they want because they won’t get anywhere near the WH. The campaign tactics BO used will serve him very well for the next , what did he say?, 8-12 years.
The Republicans are now and have always been a minority party. They cannot win without the “Reagan Democrats.” I agree that the Republicans never made the case for McCain. As you recall, we were all screaming about that for the last couple of months. I’ve seen the “Republican Machine” demonized on this blog time and again. The fact (of which I have first-hand knowledge) is that the Republican party has never been a well-organized political machine. I once called upon anyone here to give me a single, documented example of Republican voter fraud–because many here have stated that fraud is how Bush got elected. I did not get a single reply.
Yes, you are correct that most real Republicans were not enthusiastic about McCain. Why should we be? He screwed us time and again with McCain-Feingold (which, paradoxically, was a factor in his defeat), the Amnesty bill (which will guarantee millions of new Democratic voters), shafting Bill Frist, etc. He was not chosen by us any more than BO was chosen by you. But I gave money. I made calls. I voted. I did what I could. Not enough to overcome NBC, CBS, CNN, ABC, NYT, WaPo, AP and SNL.
Imagine what might have been had Hillary said, “No, BO is just not qualified to be President of the United States. McCain is and I’m backing him.”
Anyway, I don’t know what the PUMAs are going to do now that your party has been taken over by thugs who despise you. Best of luck with that. As for us, we’ll pick ourselves up and try to win Congress back in 2010 after Obama/Reid/Pelosi overestimate their mandate for socialist reforms.
I tuned in this am to get the bad news because I expected it and I knew there was no way I could live through it. Really sad. It is the worst case scenario. Not only for That One to win but for him to win so triumphantly.
PJ: I am with you. This is no triumph for the vision of MLK. It is anything but. It is a travesty of liberal Democratic principles. Maybe RD was trying to be magnanimous. Anything I would have said in that moment would have been wrong so I can forgive her.
We have to confront a very harsh reality. We were on the right but losin side of a bitter battle. Winners write the history so whatever leverage we may have dreamed for ourselves is obliterated. We have to think about how to come back and I can not see the way right now. We are not likely to be welcome in the Dem party anytime soon nor is our advice on leadership of the party or its processes likely to be sought. We need to study the election results and see what future promise there is for building a new and winning coalition. This election was perhaps ultimately a giant smack down of the Bush years fueled by the economic meltdown that may or may not have been engineered by Soros and company.
Angie,
The RNC did not pay for the Swift boat veterans’ 527. And they certainly did not “throw McCain to the wolves.” McCain was in charge of the party, for chrissakes. He even banned Bush and Cheney from the convention–unheard of for a sitting president (but not undeserved, IMHO).
Most Republicans did NOT vote for Obama. Most Hillary supporters–at Hillary’s urging–did.
Dave – what about Colin Powell not endorsing Obama. That would have helped him gain some AA votes. You can’t blame all this on Hillary when your own party failed to fully back MCain.
Actually, I’m half-way thinking of joining the Republican party. The DEMs are crap, not worth wasting any energy on.
Hey RD and company!
To me the very thought of Obama calling off the dogs unleashed on Sarah Palin is laughable. Let’s not forget that Palin managed to do the unthinkable in her convention speech — she actually poked fun at Obama the brand ™, actually pointed out the pomposity of his stagecraft and his lack of a record of accomplishments, actually questioned the Awesome One’s very Awesomeness. For that she had to be destroyed. Just the thought of Sarah Palin must make Obama reflexively scratch his face with his middle finger.
And let’s not forget that Sarah Palin has committed other sins that will render her permanently unpopular in the corporate media. For one thing, she successfully fought political corruption within her own party, and for another, she was able to wrok across the aisle to impose a tax on oil company profits in her state. These are the kinds of sins that cannot go unpunished by the powers that be.
Sexism was just one convenient cudgel used against Sarah. Classism, anti-rural bigotry, and religious bigotry were perhaps even more effective. I just now read that it looks like Al Franken is probably going to lose his bid for the MN Senate seat. I really did want to see him win, but whenever I think about the Palin-bashing SNL skit he co-wrote, with its crude Alaska incest joke, I can’t help thinking, “f*ck him, he deserves to lose.”
angieinnc: your dean & deluca story made my day! I’ll have to try the yogurt parfait.
Dave, on November 5th, 2008 at 12:21 pm Said:
Most Republicans did NOT vote for Obama. Most Hillary supporters–at Hillary’s urging–did.
**********
Dave, we’ll never know how much Hillary’s support helped Obama. But I believe that most Hillary supporters are not lemmings, and were quite capable of deciding for themselves for whom to vote.
Dave,
I assumed McCain/Palin were sacrificial victims because of the overriding factor of Bush-hatred at play in this election. Actually, the two of them softened the face of the Republican party to the point that Dems voted for them. That’s a significant achievement which the Repubs, I’m sure, will put to good use in the future.
Our entire electoral system is based on demonizing “the other”, be it other party, other race, other gender, or other sexual preference. O&Co exploited that heinous scapegoat instinct in every way.
I could care less what Dems think of PUMAs. PUMAs represent the death of blind allegiance and that’s the victory.
In the file room of our company, this morning they had a “black” radio station on, clearly Obama supporters thrilled with his “victory” yet all they could do was TRASH SARAH PALIN. I was amazed! I guess I am still naive. They did not translate the fact that they want respect yet fail to give it. It made me think about something. I want to trash Michelle Obama. Her hair, her clothes, her demeanor. I do not like her. I do not trust her. Yet at that moment I realized I cannot do so and stay true to the new vision of bi-partisanship I have found during this election. If I can be tolerant, even liking Republicans for the first time, I must be as tolerant of Michelle Obama, someone I do not immediately care for, due to a variety of reasons. Yet I cannot trash her like I might want to. That is what the DNC and this election has helped me to see in 2008. And for that alone I am greatful.
Sarah Palin at the Biltmore just before boarding plane in quick interview said that the press should let us all just work together to help keep America safe, and finished her soundbyte with a quick God bless Barack Obama, cheerfully and with great class.
Go Sarah!
The “trash Sarah” meme will die out. It’s just a bit of Democratic gloating.
I thought Sarah’s comments were about on par with Biden’s against McCain.
That’s the VP job……hit the opponent hard.
What’s neat to me, anyway, is that Sarah didn’t play the role of the “little woman.”
She hit hard, and she did it well.
Kudos to Sarah. She delivered on her promise to the party.
The other stuff? Beyond her control, frankly.
She was a true trooper. *haha
They can’t help themselves because it’s pathological. At one of my old haunts, Salon TT, they were still at it yesterday. The day when they should have been joyful they were still horrible crabs.
It started with a lie. One of the Obots said the crowd booed Palin when McCain mentioned her name. That was such an obvious lie that I had to say something. When I pointed out how ridiculous that blantant lie was and that, in fact, the crowd cheered louder for her than for McCain and that he was clearly handing her the reins, they went nuts. Especially when I pointed out that she has a bright future in the GOP if she wants it (especially considering the Stevens situation).
It is stunning, but not surprising, how irrational and unhinged their reaction is to her . It’s obvious they are intimidated by her and view her as a threat though they try and cover it with false bravado, scurrilous rumor mongering and empty mocking.
I just watched McCain’s concession speech online–I did not see it last night, and when he thanked her, and the camera focused on her face, the tears in here eyes made me break down all over again.
I am SO ANGRY about the way two strong women have been treated for working their hardest to serve this country. If you didn’t agree with her policies, fine, but it went so far beyond that into pure hate and violence. Seeing her sincerity, humility, desire to serve, and disappointment ripped my heart out. Obama, his surrogates, and supporters did not think they could win without destroying them. There is NO honor in that victory.
riverdaughter, on November 5th, 2008 at 10:18 am Said:
sarah: The problem seems to be coming from the media still. But now is the time for Obama to tell them to step down.
—————————-
Why would he?(when it is going to benefit him.)
fif, I don’t know about tears. I have heard others say it too but I didn’t see tears. She took a deep breath one time.
ma blue…BTD really speaks for me on this one:
History was made last night. But the historic night was marred by the passage of Prop 8 in California (a similar proposition was passed in Florida with overwhelming African American and Latino support). Particularly troubling was the voting of African Americans in California (and to a lesser extent Latinos) – who voted 70-30 in favor of stripping gay Californians of their state based constitutional right to marry the person they love.
There were a lot of signs last night that declared “We Have Overcome.” No, we have not.
=========================================
Was BTD not paying attention for the last 18 months? How many comments were made at TL that focused on Obama’s positions on social issues? His campaigning with homophobes? His actively seeking the evangelical vote? His statements about women’s issues? The values of Obama’s church? Just what did BTD think was going to happen with an electorate supporting a candidate that states he is personally pro-life? We kept making statements that Obama was not believable on Supreme Court selections. Apparently none of that got through to liberals.
Oy, very frustrating to say the least.
After eight years of bloody mayhem, God-hates-fags and God Save the Unitary Executive, there is surprise that someone like Palin “still” excites anger? The US has not miraculously entered a safe and sane place “after” the tragedy of Bush’s rule.
Palin’s constituency would replace the Bill of Rights with the Bible. She’d take Cheney’s criminal, secretive contempt of democracy as her starting point, because democracy and transparency limit God and greed. She eagerly espouses the neocon line, they were and are her most influential champions.
No one should fully or uncritically trust Obama. That would be contrary to the American political process and ignorant of the ancient tendencies of those seeking power.
But Sarah Palin has self-identified with the American version of the Taliban just as the American-Talibani Bush strains one last time to drag us into the mire. What respect is owed to someone like that, an unabashed authoritarian unrepentant in the face of the Bush disaster?
“But Sarah Palin has self-identified with the American version of the Taliban just as the American-Talibani Bush strains one last time to drag us into the mire.”
Obama is GWB 2.0 Shill somewhere else.
Wasn’t this post addressed to those voicing disrespect for Palin?
If people knew the real Obama he never would have been elected. But most people don’t pay attention, so the MSM has way too much power. I have friends who know nothing about any of the candidates, they just ‘felt’ Obama was good. The only thing they know about him is the glorification of him on the cover of US magazine. And the only thing they know about Palin is what they saw on the front of the Enquirer in the grocery line. Of course he won.
I hope Palin’s able to bounce back and be the one to knock BO off his throne.
Many PUMAs may not want to think about it, but this campaign has tainted HIllary’s brand in the same way that McCain’s brand was tainted by Bush. Before 2000, McCain was most Democrats’ favorite Republican. Party politics called for him to be a team player and play ball with the Bushies, in the same way Hillary has had to do with Obama.
Palin is probably PUMA’s best chance.
What evidence is there that Palin is an “unabashed authoritarian”?
Aww, poor Sarah Palin, a clueless, willfully ignorant harpy whose sole contribution to the national scene has been as the butt of well-deserved ridicule and derision.
Face it you gaggle of blithering nitwits, you backed the wrong horse for all of the wrong reasons and now you’re being shown for the horse’s asses you truly are. But please, don’t mind me, keep on with what you are doing. Between you and the Corner and Red State, we’re gonna need plenty to laugh about and you provide, ready-made, all of the parody needed.
“What evidence is there that Palin is an “unabashed authoritarian”?”
To choose to be a mainstream Republican politician at this point in history is a clear demonstration of support for Bush’s authoritarian excesses, barring conclusive evidence to the contrary. From what I understand, many PUMA folks view Obama as Bush 2.0 because he has supported positions to the right of Hillary and is less tested than Hillary. If he had been a Republican, I assume that this case would be stronger. If Palin had been troubled by the authoritarian crimes crassly celebrated by her party during Bush’s tenure, why did she not speak out against them or join/form a PUMA analog bravely vectoring off of the GOP?
Palin’s affiliation with Social Conservatism is also proof, as theirs is an authoritarian philosophy aimed at replacing democracy with theocracy. She apparently believes that heretical books should be banned, that religious mumbo-jumbo should be taught in public schools as a counter to science, and that God intercedes in American elections in a form of Divine Right.
From the California Secretary of State website
99.5% ( 25,318 of 25,423 ) precincts partially
or fully reporting as of Nov. 5, 2008, at 2:58 p.m.
State Ballot Measures
08 – Eliminates Right of Same-Sex Couples to Marry
YES: 5,359,110 52.5%
NO: 4,867,034 47.5%
Not quite as bad as 58 to 42, but sufficiently bad.
I’m ashamed of my fellow Californians.
Robin
I wish I could say that it’s cute that you Palin haters believe all that the MSM has told you about her. It has clearly shaped your opinion of her.
You actually still believe things that have been debunked as the lies they were all along. That she ever tried to ban any books. That she favors teaching creationism instead of science.
I don’t suppose getting the truth is actually going to change your mind any, though, will it?
She definitely had tears in her eyes and that broke my heart.
Kill the talking points, people loved Sarah Palin. Believe it or not, it was the combination of Sarah and Mac that didn’t work. Their dynamic was lovely but they couldn’t overcome the dual narrative that she was inexperienced and he was so old he was practically already in V-Fib.
“Come on, Obamaphiles, now is the time to stop the misogynism. …Call off the dogs.”
Asking these b**tards to stop is futile. It’s like asking the guy who just beat you to be nice. They and the entire American public just found out that misogyny pays, and it pays big time! They just re-inforced the idea that hating women, ridiculing women, insulting women and excluding women IS JUST FINE – IN FACT, IT’S THE COOL THING TO DO! IT PUTS YOU ON THE WINNING SIDE!
AND THEY’LL EVEN GET BETTER RATINGS IF THEY DO!! I despise the msm and even Tina Fey for their incessant abuse directed at Hillary and Palin.
For me, the exhilarating part of this election was embodied in both of these women. THANK GOD MCCAIN PICKED PALIN! I would have known nothing about her, had he not! Now I’ve been able to learn about her rise to governor, her spirit, her dedication, her commmitment to standing up for what she believes in and I saw her firsthand at a Rally. If she runs against Hillary in 2012 it may actually be a tough decision… As much as I am in awe of Hillary, I won’t call myself a democrat or vote very much like a dem unless that party CHANGES and is wrenched from the corrupt and stifling grasp of Pelosi, Dean, Brazil, Reid, etc. who have all just been rewarded for their corruption and deceipt!
note to Isolde: You are awesome!
The anger is killing you, isn’t it?
Delete dissent.
Bravely delete dissent.
Thank “GOD” McCain picked Palin!
Some of us that follow energy have known about governor Sarah Palin and the things she has been doing for more than the last couple of months. You know she is a expert on energy, do you know what the interstate Oil & Gas commerce compact is or does ? Wanna guess who is the present “chairman” ? here is the link to check it out for yourself http://www.iogcc.state.ok.us/officers while you are at the site you might check out some of the international affiliates, like the republic of Georgia. show this to your puma cubs and hold your head up high for strong smart executive women who are leading America, even if nobody knows it and the MSM doesnt want you to find out In all my discussions about “miss Sarah” you know how many people knew about this…0
to follow one of reiverdaughters earlier threads. today I have had a smile on my face and a friendly word or 2 for all the AA fellow americans I have run into around town. This is such a special day for them, and I rejoice and celebrate that fact with them, no matter what my other inner voices are saying
Palin’s statement on fruitfly research was a pander to the freedom fry crowd and a kick to the groin of scientists everywhere. And you ask the beating to stop? Palin is a symptom of the disease within the Republican party, and to make any comparisons between Palin and Hillary Clinton should be deeply insulting to any progressive who respects Clinton’s achievements.
Team Barky has practiced Machiavellian and fascistic tactics from the beginning of the primaries, right through the general election, and continues even now. They know their emperor has no clothes, they know they are propping up a giant Thanksgiving parade ballon (inflated by his own ego) and so they attack the strong, courageous, brilliant and capable women who challenge him. They enlist the aid of nazi-left “feminists” to do it — it is not uncommon for a member of an oppressed class to turn upon other members of that class in order to gain the approbation of the oppressor.
Barky will be his own downfall. The noxious supporters who now gang-rape every woman who challenges him will discover quickly enough that he hasn’t a clue. His “supporters” will then turn on him and savage him — and the Democratic party — into a bloody pulp. Wait. It will happen. It always does.
Processed cheese eating quagmire monkey (who is really, obviously, also koolaid-drinking) said:
“After eight years of bloody mayhem, God-hates-fags and God Save the Unitary Executive…”
And tell me, mr. monkey, just what the hell do you think you’ve just “elected” into office? Obama = Bush 2.0